Russia Investigation Heating Up

[time4fun]

Time to pierce this veil of privilege.



Then there's this. Akward!

Wow. I missed that. That's...not a good look for the RNC.

[time4fun]

Ya baby. That's our sleeper there. I have a lot of hope riding on SDNY



I almost miss Bannon now. Kind of like how I catch myself looking back fondly on W's presidency.



Ditto

Anyone watching MSNBC? Chis Mathews opened his show with these words:

"Today the FBI raided the offices of the personal attorney to the President of the United States of America"

That kind of impacted me. It's straight news, no spin, but a heavy heavy sentence.

Time4fun, What do you mean Trump knew before he was told?

CNN reported this: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/09/politics/michael-cohen-fbi/index.html)


A White House official said Trump had been watching TV reports of the FBI raiding Cohen's office, and that Trump knew about the raid before the news broke.

[Androidpk]

What you said was factually incorrect. I've included specifically why it was appointed. Don't be upset because you are a fool.

That's not slinging shit, that is stating a fact, based upon years of your political posts.

Sorry, you're wrong. As usual.

[Fortybox]

CNN reported this: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/09/politics/michael-cohen-fbi/index.html)

Zomg! It’s happening!!!!

Hillary 4 prez!!11one

[cwolff]

Thanks T4f.

One of the Fox "Judges" called this Seismic. He also did point out that the warrant was prepared or signed off by a Trump appointee. The guy who replaced Pareet Bahara.

I don't know if this a thing or not, but I'm flipping between Fox, MSNBC and CNN. Fox seems to be all commercials. It's frustrating. I wonder if either the other two bumped their commercials for the breaking news or Fox pumped it up to not highlight the breaking news. Or...I'm imagining things

Now Fox is all up in Syria news and slagging off on Obama. LMAO. Predictable.

[time4fun]

Thanks T4f.

One of the Fox "Judges" called this Seismic. He also did point out that the warrant was prepared or signed off by a Trump appointee. The guy who replaced Pareet Bahara.

I don't know if this a thing or not, but I'm flipping between Fox, MSNBC and CNN. Fox seems to be all commercials. It's frustrating. I wonder if either the other two bumped their commercials for the breaking news or Fox pumped it up to not highlight the breaking news. Or...I'm imagining things

It's a thing in the sense that I don't think that the sentence, "The personal lawyer to the President of the United States has been subjected to a series of no-knock warrants for potential bank fraud, wire fraud, and election violations" has ever been uttered before today.

Again- it was nothing short of brilliant of Mueller and Rosenstein to refer this to the FBI instead of expanding the scope of their investigation.

The people who made the decisions to apply for- and grant of course- the warrant were not associated with the Mueller investigation. Retaliating against Mueller will be very difficult.

[Androidpk]

Fox News is nothing but pro-Trump propaganda. It's no wonder they're rated the least trustworthy news organization these days.

[cwolff]

The Hoarse Whisperer

Best Infrastructure Week yet.

I agree with the Hoarse (https://twitter.com/HoarseWisperer/status/983469336185704449)

[cwolff]

It's a thing in the sense that...

I mean the commercial breaks. When bad news for trump is cycling do right wing stations run more commercials. When bad news for trump is breaking do news organization run less commercials. I know they'll run less when there's breaking news but do stations run more when they want to blunt the news cycle?

[time4fun]

I mean the commercial breaks. When bad news for trump is cycling do right wing stations run more commercials. When bad news for trump is breaking do news organization run less commercials. I know they'll run less when there's breaking news but do stations run more when they want to blunt the news cycle?

OH. I think the networks just all time their commercial breaks at the same time so people don't channel surf and find another channel.

CNN is reporting that these warrants were largely related to Stormy Daniels, but they grabbed communications between Cohen and the Trump campaign as well, of course, as between Cohen and Trump.

Trump is mostly lashing out at Rosenstein and Sessions tonight.

I suspect he's considering trying to force Sessions to fire Rosenstein, and- if not- will try to force Sessions to resign.

[Androidpk]

https://images.axios.com/dhTnFPJNH4e2pyBLQ-Welsrc2Qw=/2018/03/01/1519867892905.jpg

[cwolff]

OH. I think the networks just all time their commercial breaks at the same time so people don't channel surf and find another channel.

CNN is reporting that these warrants were largely related to Stormy Daniels, but they grabbed communications between Cohen and the Trump campaign as well, of course, as between Cohen and Trump.

Trump is mostly lashing out at Rosenstein and Sessions tonight.

I suspect he's considering trying to force Sessions to fire Rosenstein, and- if not- will try to force Sessions to resign.

His little speech today was crazy. "the other side" "witchhunt" and saying that it's mostly dems who worked for Obama and maybe a few republicans. The entire FBI is republican (generalizing but ya, they ain't liberals), and this all being done by his handpicked people.

[time4fun]

His little speech today was crazy. "the other side" "witchhunt" and saying that it's mostly dems who worked for Obama and maybe a few republicans. The entire FBI is republican (generalizing but ya, they ain't liberals), and this all being done by his handpicked people.

He's panicked and just dropping everything he can to try to distract.

I think we're really close right now to him jumping over the edge. It makes me very nervous. Sessions has no spine- I don't trust him to do the right thing for the country.

And Republicans apparently feel like it's a great idea to set a precedent that a US President can decide for himself whether or not he's guilty of something and can immunize himself from the law.

[Androidpk]

How soon until he tells Bolton to wage war on Iran?

[time4fun]

CNN is reporting that the raids were initiated by the FBI's Public Corruption division. Looks like likely Cohen lied to the bank about the purpose of the $130k loan he took out for Trump.

There are a lot of people who had to sign off on this- all basically Trump appointees.

[cwolff]

Avenatti just called Cohen a "purse puppy." hahaha. I choked on my dinner and Anderson Cooper did a double take. It was hilarious.

[Wrathbringer]

Hey, the Butthurt Brigade is all here tonight! Hey guys! IT"S FINALLY HAPPENING!!!!1111

[Androidpk]

all basically Trump appointees.

Vast left wing conspiracy!

[Wrathbringer]

He's panicked and just dropping everything he can to try to distract.

I think we're really close right now to him jumping over the edge. It makes me very nervous. Sessions has no spine- I don't trust him to do the right thing for the country.

And Republicans apparently feel like it's a great idea to set a precedent that a US President can decide for himself whether or not he's guilty of something and can immunize himself from the law.

You're so retarded. You're nervous? LOL cry more

[cwolff]

According to court documents, one of Manafort’s former employees led an FBI agent to a storage locker filled with paperwork on Manafort’s businesses and finances. The person’s name is redacted from the filings. But he’s now at the center of a fight over evidence that could play a significant role in the government’s case against Manafort.

The agent describes meeting with “a former employee of Davis Manafort Partners, and a current employee of Steam Mountain, LLC, which is a business currently operated by Paul Manafort.” The employee, whose name is redacted throughout the affidavit, told the FBI agent that he “performs a variety of functions for Manafort and his companies as directed by Manafort,” and was salaried.


That employee moved boxes of files from one storage unit to a second, larger storage unit in Alexandria. On May 26, 2017––just nine days after Rod Rosenstein named Bob Mueller special counsel––the person whose name was redacted led the FBI agent to the storage facility. The facility’s manager gave the FBI agent a copy of the lease for the storage unit.

Interesting timeline here.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/a-second-paul-manafort-associate-has-turned-on-him?via=twitter_page&__twitter_impression=true

[Parkbandit]

It makes me very nervous.

http://www.anabolic-pharma.biz/content/images/thumbs/0000585_alprazolam-05mg-xanax-tablets.jpeg

Don't do it for you.. do it for the people who have to be around you.

[Androidpk]

Cohen's name was removed from the GOP's website.. :lol:

[time4fun]

Cohen's name was removed from the GOP's website.. :lol:

Slow to protect Mueller but quick to protect themselves.

[cwolff]

Dershowitz is losing his mind. Is he trying to get hired by trump?

[cwolff]

Interesting theory from Bill Kristol:

1. It may be no big deal that Mueller had SDNY execute the search warrants, since it's not as if different parts of DOJ wouldn't share information, if it was helpful to another's investigation. But is it crazy to think one reason might have been this:

2. Mueller knew there was a chance Trump would try to fire him and close down the Special Counsel's investigation once he learned of the raid. Mueller couldn't be sure who'd then be able to safeguard or who would have access to the Special Counsel's office's files.

3. So perhaps Mueller thought it safer to have these very sensitive Cohen-Trump documents in the possession of another part of DOJ a couple of hundred miles away from Main Justice, where there'd be no easy way for Trump or his agents to get at them.

[Fortybox]

Hey, the Butthurt Brigade is all here tonight! Hey guys! IT"S FINALLY HAPPENING!!!!1111

https://media3.giphy.com/media/816QOYrqg1MME/giphy.gif

[Fortybox]

http://www.anabolic-pharma.biz/content/images/thumbs/0000585_alprazolam-05mg-xanax-tablets.jpeg

Don't do it for you.. do it for the people who have to be around you.

.5 isn't enough.

[time4fun]

Interesting theory from Bill Kristol:

1. It may be no big deal that Mueller had SDNY execute the search warrants, since it's not as if different parts of DOJ wouldn't share information, if it was helpful to another's investigation. But is it crazy to think one reason might have been this:

2. Mueller knew there was a chance Trump would try to fire him and close down the Special Counsel's investigation once he learned of the raid. Mueller couldn't be sure who'd then be able to safeguard or who would have access to the Special Counsel's office's files.

3. So perhaps Mueller thought it safer to have these very sensitive Cohen-Trump documents in the possession of another part of DOJ a couple of hundred miles away from Main Justice, where there'd be no easy way for Trump or his agents to get at them.

Seems extreme. I'd wager that Mueller thought that having another part of the DoJ request warrant, it would provide cover for him and Rosenstein.

I had thought that too, but it's starting to look like Trump isn't going to let that something trivial like "Mueller didn't authorize any of this" get in the way of obstruction.

Fun side note- referring the matter was actually exactly what they were supposed to do. You're not supposed to pretend a crime didn't happen just because it's not under your purview.

[Androidpk]

I wonder why they used no-knock raids though. Did they suspect someone would try to destroy evidence? And if so how did they know that? Is someone in Trump's inner circle wearing a wire? Certainly sounds like it.

[time4fun]

I wonder why they used no-knock raids though. Did they suspect someone would try to destroy evidence? And if so how did they know that? Is someone in Trump's inner circle wearing a wire? Certainly sounds like it.

I mean typically you would have to convince a judge that there was good reason to suspect Cohen would destroy evidence if given advance notice.

I'm guessing they found discrepancies in what he has submitted vs what other people have submitted.

[cwolff]

I wonder why they used no-knock raids though. Did they suspect someone would try to destroy evidence? And if so how did they know that? Is someone in Trump's inner circle wearing a wire? Certainly sounds like it.

They took everyone's cell phones, or at least said they were in what December? And they did that because of leaks but it could also have been for bugging devices. I remember some talking head or article that said it's stressful in the WH because people are assuming that someone is wearing a wire.

This tweet below is related to the difference between being appointed by trump (which this guy wasn't but it's being reported that way) and being put in the job by Sessions. Just linking it in case anyone on the thread's interested.
https://twitter.com/chrisgeidner/status/983522521063526400

[Androidpk]

Here's my risky bet. Trump has severe schizophrenia and he's wearing a wire and aiding Mueller and the FBI against his other self.

[Fortybox]

Here's my risky bet. Trump has severe schizophrenia and he's wearing a wire and aiding Mueller and the FBI against his other self.

Better logic than time4fun.

[Androidpk]

Alan Dershowitz on the Michael Cohen raid: “It’s a tactic generally used against organized crime, against very serious, very serious criminals and lawyers who are operating outside of the protections of the law.”

[cwolff]

Here's my risky bet. Trump has severe schizophrenia and he's wearing a wire and aiding Mueller and the FBI against his other self.

My risky bet is that Mueller goes for the jugular legally, t's crossed and i's dotted, and trump shuts it down through some method that we've not even considered. Something brazen that shocks the nation. Publishing dirt on his opponents, Folding FBI into ICE or some such thing. An action that's BOLD and nation changing. So bold it stuns, even shocks the country. His base cheers and goes nuts like they just won the superbowl. The enthusiasm from this crowd and strategic bashing of Mueller getting shut down push others to finally go to the trump side because he's a "winner". Then the investigation dies, Dept. of Justice people find themselves on trial and trump becomes President until he passes away. President for life. At this point, I think this could be more probable than Mueller putting him away.

I'm counting on an "October surprise" to change everything.

[time4fun]

My risky bet is that Mueller goes for the jugular legally, t's crossed and i's dotted, and trump shuts it down through some method that we've not even considered. Something brazen that shocks the nation. Publishing dirt on his opponents, Folding FBI into ICE or some such thing. An action that's BOLD and nation changing. So bold it stuns, even shocks the country. His base cheers and goes nuts like they just won the superbowl. The enthusiasm from this crowd and strategic bashing of Mueller getting shut down push others to finally go to the trump side because he's a "winner". Then the investigation dies, Dept. of Justice people find themselves on trial and trump becomes President until he passes away. President for life. At this point, I think this could be more probable than Mueller putting him away.

I'm counting on an "October surprise" to change everything.

Yeah we're getting closer and closer to some ham-fisted attempt to shut this down.

He won't go for Mueller directly (he actually can't). He'll pressure Sessions to either fire Rosenstein or resign. Session is going to have to decide if he has any patriotism left in him.

Technically I think Trump could rewrite the regulations to allow him to fire Mueller directly- or knowing him to allow someone else who will do as he says to fire Mueller directly. That would be the bold thing no one has thought of.

If Congress has any sense left in it- they'll pass legislation to protect Mueller ASAP. That won't stop Trump from trying to replace Sessions or Rosenstein (which would give a more subtle way to effectively kill the investigation), but it would send a message that Congress is taking this seriously.

Which, of course, is why it won't happen.

[Androidpk]

Firing Mueller isn't exactly black and white in regards to the grand jury. IIRC Preet Bharara has said the grand jury could continue the investigation on their own, a runaway jury. The only person who has the authority to disband the grand jury is the judge who started it in the first place.

[time4fun]

The thing I don't understand is why on earth Republicans would want to set a precedent that allows a sitting President to effectively kill any investigation into them or anyone they want to protect.

Even if you don't think Trump did anything wrong- what about the next President who's under investigation? What if they're not?

It's just so short-sighted and dangerous. And for what, exactly? What possible short-term gain is worth jeopardizing the democracy of the US?

[time4fun]

Firing Mueller isn't exactly black and white in regards to the grand jury. IIRC Preet Bharara has said the grand jury could continue the investigation on their own, a runaway jury. The only person who has the authority to disband the grand jury is the judge who started it in the first place.

Part of why I think he'll go for Rosenstein through Sessions. The only way to effectively kill this is to make sure DoJ leadership is in a position to quash it.

I literally can't believe I'm having to have this conversation in earnest right now. I used to think we were so resilient to this kind of corruption, but we're just really not.

[cwolff]

The thing I don't understand is why on earth Republicans would want to set a precedent that allows a sitting President to effectively kill any investigation into them or anyone they want to protect.

Even if you don't think Trump did anything wrong- what about the next President who's under investigation? What if they're not?

It's just so short-sighted and dangerous. And for what, exactly? What possible short-term gain is worth jeopardizing the democracy of the US?

This has been my conspiracy theory for a year. They act as if they will never be out of power. They're going scorched earth on the dems, or trying to. When I think of the way Russia interfered and the results I can believe that they literally changed votes in hacked machines, where it counted and the Government thinks it's such a bombshell they deny that. What's the word on this, "They hacked the machines, but they didn't do anything. Just hacked it" It's a comforting thought to think that even though we were penetrated by an enemy that same enemy chose not to press their advantage and we have time to fix it. What if they know they don't have to worry about honest elections? That would explain their short term self destructive behavior.

[time4fun]

I sincerely hope that's not it.

I think they've just tied themselves so heavily to Donald Trump that they're left with few choices. It's about to be full midterm season, and that means that every GOP House member and several GOP Senators are about to play "Who's more conservative/Who's the better friend to Trump?" with folks who will happily tack right on them. The only voters who matter are the ones who still cling to Donald Trump. Anger those voters, and the Republican is out of a job before the actual elections begin.

Trump is likewise up against a wall. He knows his exposure here is significant, and if he thinks that he and his family are barreling towards indictments or indictment-like reports- twisting the mechanisms of the Office to thwart the investigation will be the least risky thing he could do, in his mind.

That doesn't bode well for democracy and rule of law, unfortunately.

[cwolff]

I sincerely hope that's not it.

I think they've just tied themselves so heavily to Donald Trump that they're left with few choices. It's about to be full midterm season, and that means that every GOP House member and several GOP Senators are about to play "Who's more conservative/Who's the better friend to Trump?" with folks who will happily tack right on them. The only voters who matter are the ones who still cling to Donald Trump. Anger those voters, and the Republican is out of a job before the actual elections begin.

Trump is likewise up against a wall. He knows his exposure here is significant, and if he thinks that he and his family are barreling towards indictments or indictment-like reports- twisting the mechanisms of the Office to thwart the investigation will be the least risky thing he could do, in his mind.

That doesn't bode well for democracy and rule of law, unfortunately.

This was in Newsweek today:

“Things just go from bad to worse every day,” Jacobs, a successful New York architect who designed the Holocaust memorial at Buchenwald, tells Newsweek. “There’s a real problem growing.”
So much so that Jacobs thinks there’s a “direct parallel” with Germany between the two world wars.

Perhaps more alarming than the far-right getting braver is the seep into mainstream politics of their hate, their talking points, their rhetoric. “It feels like 1929 or 1930 Berlin,” Jacobs speculated, ahead of Holocaust Remembrance Day 2018 on Thursday.

FWIW: He was born in 1938 so this isn't an eye witness. The article makes you do the math and that's misleading.

[time4fun]

Well that's depressing.

Meanwhile, WaPo outlined (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/04/09/to-search-michael-cohens-home-and-office-the-fbi-had-to-clear-a-higher-than-normal-bar/?utm_term=.2b438d0f9a66) the specific requirements for the FBI to have been issued a warrant for the raid:


In short: The Cohen search warrant almost certainly included decision-making or approval on the part of the second-highest-ranking person at the Justice Department (Rosenstein), a federal judge and the U.S. attorney or an assistant attorney general. Before it was executed, the team would have needed to check a number of boxes meant to reduce the likelihood of improperly seizing privileged material and to make the case to a judge that evidence of criminal behavior would probably be found.

Specifically the six things they had to do were:



1) Before obtaining a search warrant, investigators had to try to obtain the evidence in another way, such as by subpoena.

2) The authorization for the warrant had to come from either the U.S. attorney or an assistant attorney general. (Rosenstein is deputy attorney general, a higher position than assistant attorney general.)

3) The prosecutor had to confer with the criminal division of the department before seeking the warrant.

4) The team conducting the search had to “employ adequate precautions” to ensure that they weren’t improperly viewing privileged communications between Cohen and his clients.

5) The search team would have included a “privilege team,” including lawyers and agents not working the case, which would work to ensure that investigators conducting the search didn’t see privileged communications.

6) The investigators had to develop a review process for the seized material.

Note- every decision maker in this chain was a Trump-appointee.

[Neveragain]

https://media.giphy.com/media/mryXttQFa6Gas/giphy.gif

[~Rocktar~]

That doesn't bode well for democracy and rule of law, unfortunately.

Yep, the unabashed attack on attorney client privilege is definitely a threat against democracy and the rule of law. So why are you and other so called champions of the law not up in arms about the FBI taking all the records and then handing them over to allow their dissemination without any unbiased determination of what is and isn't admissible evidence and what is protected under attorney client privileged? Alan Dershowitz seems to think that is a really big deal. Trump crime or not, the lack of any confidentiality of anything surely should disturb even the most rabid of Trump haters and so called bastions of law and freedom such as yourself.

Or are you just a raving hypocrite hiding behind the law only when it serves you and dismissing any and all true miscarriages of justice when they don't suit your political agenda?

[time4fun]

Yep, the unabashed attack on attorney client privilege is definitely a threat against democracy and the rule of law. So why are you and other so called champions of the law not up in arms about the FBI taking all the records and then handing them over to allow their dissemination without any unbiased determination of what is and isn't admissible evidence and what is protected under attorney client privileged? Alan Dershowitz seems to think that is a really big deal. Trump crime or not, the lack of any confidentiality of anything surely should disturb even the most rabid of Trump haters and so called bastions of law and freedom such as yourself.

Or are you just a raving hypocrite hiding behind the law only when it serves you and dismissing any and all true miscarriages of justice when they don't suit your political agenda?

ROFL

You might want to actually go read that article instead of demonstrating- yet again- that you rarely understand more than half of an issue. Then you can go take a High School Government class and learn all about subpoenas.

Eventually you can graduate to reading Clark v United States

And when you grow up, you'll understand.

[time4fun]

This more or less got buried in the Cohen news cycle, but it may help explain the raid today. The New York Times is reporting:
(https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/09/us/politics/trump-mueller-ukraine-victor-pinchuk.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=b-lede-package-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news)


The special counsel is investigating a payment made to President Trump’s foundation by a Ukrainian steel magnate for a talk during the campaign, according to three people briefed on the matter, as part of a broader examination of streams of foreign money to Mr. Trump and his associates in the years leading up to the election.

Investigators subpoenaed the Trump Organization this year for an array of records about business with foreign nationals. In response, the company handed over documents about a $150,000 donation that the Ukrainian billionaire, Victor Pinchuk, made in September 2015 to the Donald J. Trump Foundation in exchange for a 20-minute appearance by Mr. Trump that month through a video link to a conference in Kiev.

Michael D. Cohen, the president’s personal lawyer whose office and hotel room were raided on Monday in an apparently unrelated case, solicited the donation. The contribution from Mr. Pinchuk, who has sought closer ties for Ukraine to the West, was the largest the foundation received in 2015 from anyone besides Mr. Trump himself.

Somewhere out there Hillary Clinton is laughing hystarically, and she doesn't know why.

[Androidpk]

Yep, the unabashed attack on attorney client privilege is definitely a threat against democracy and the rule of law. So why are you and other so called champions of the law not up in arms about the FBI taking all the records and then handing them over to allow their dissemination without any unbiased determination of what is and isn't admissible evidence and what is protected under attorney client privileged? Alan Dershowitz seems to think that is a really big deal. Trump crime or not, the lack of any confidentiality of anything surely should disturb even the most rabid of Trump haters and so called bastions of law and freedom such as yourself.

Or are you just a raving hypocrite hiding behind the law only when it serves you and dismissing any and all true miscarriages of justice when they don't suit your political agenda?

:lol2:

[Androidpk]

Cohen is going to prison.

[time4fun]

Cohen is going to prison.

I don't think he is. He'll sing like a canary to Mueller in exchange for his freedom, or he'll possibly be Pardoned by Trump.

He will definitely be disbarred though.

[cwolff]

Yep, the unabashed attack on attorney client privilege is definitely a threat against democracy and the rule of law. So why are you and other so called champions of the law not up in arms about the FBI taking all the records and then handing them over to allow their dissemination without any unbiased determination of what is and isn't admissible evidence and what is protected under attorney client privileged? Alan Dershowitz seems to think that is a really big deal. Trump crime or not, the lack of any confidentiality of anything surely should disturb even the most rabid of Trump haters and so called bastions of law and freedom such as yourself.

Or are you just a raving hypocrite hiding behind the law only when it serves you and dismissing any and all true miscarriages of justice when they don't suit your political agenda?

Is this a joke? I can't tell if you're being sarcastic here or serious


I don't think he is. He'll sing like a canary to Mueller in exchange for his freedom, or he'll possibly be Pardoned by Trump.

He will definitely be disbarred though.

Go to the 2:00 minute mark and start there to learn about purse puppies like Michael Cohen


https://youtu.be/NU6qAAaseso?t=120

[Androidpk]

Rocktar is roleplaying as Alex Jones.

[Methais]

Look at all this time and effort she puts into formatting her PC posts.

Everyone but cwolff and pk when they see them:

http://www.netanimations.net/blue-girls-fingers-on-mouse.gif

Can't wait to see what sort of disappointment this lawyer raid brings them.


The "class", huh? You're retarded.

Being a condescending cunt that's convinced she's superior to everyone else is the only way she can sleep at night.

[cwolff]

Rocktar is roleplaying as Alex Jones.


https://youtu.be/BiikvUyCVo8

[Methais]

It makes me very nervous.


Well that's depressing.

Your poor little emotions. :lol:

[Androidpk]

Kellyanne Conway's husband, responding to Trump on Twitter.. :lol:

https://twitter.com/gtconway3d/status/983672662517075968

[Neveragain]

Somewhere out there Hillary Clinton is laughing hystarically, and she doesn't know why.

does it look like this?

https://media.giphy.com/media/isP4TLqhjm3zq/giphy.gif

[Methais]

does it look like this?

https://media.giphy.com/media/isP4TLqhjm3zq/giphy.gif

https://i.imgflip.com/23plvx.jpg

[Neveragain]

https://i.imgflip.com/23plvx.jpg

https://media.tenor.com/images/9460f571d97e4c49bf458a79cb230262/tenor.gif

[Ashliana]

What you said was factually incorrect. I've included specifically why it was appointed. Don't be upset because you are a fool.

That's not slinging shit, that is stating a fact, based upon years of your political posts.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_asNhzXq72w

Your inability to read Mueller's appointment reflects only on you, not PK. Try again.

[~Rocktar~]

ROFL

You might want to actually go read that article instead of demonstrating- yet again- that you rarely understand more than half of an issue. Then you can go take a High School Government class and learn all about subpoenas.

Eventually you can graduate to reading Clark v United States

And when you grow up, you'll understand.

Just going off the concerns voiced by Alan Dershowitz in this segment I got on youtube. Now I am not a lawyer and Alan is, a pretty respected one and likely he knows a metric and standard ton more than you ever will about the law. He seems pretty damn concerned about this kind of thing so I think I will take his word on it over yours.


https://youtu.be/TPGROJIKLv4

[Methais]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMLNDCiLbgM

I can't believe it took you this long to realize it, but better late than never.

[Androidpk]

Just going off the concerns voiced by Alan Dershowitz in this segment I got on youtube. Now I am not a lawyer and Alan is, a pretty respected one and likely he knows a metric and standard ton more than you ever will about the law. He seems pretty damn concerned about this kind of thing so I think I will take his word on it over yours.


https://youtu.be/TPGROJIKLv4

What happened to all your claims that you don't watch Fox News?

[Methais]

What happened to all your claims that you don't watch Fox News?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6UTDg87-dA

I don't watch the Home Shopping Network.

Let's see if time4pk can figure this one out all by himself.

[~Rocktar~]

What happened to all your claims that you don't watch Fox News?

Youtube dimwit. I use a news aggregator for headline news from around the world, It's over 40 major sources from print, online and TV news. This popped up on my youtube because it is relevant to current events. I don't own a TV, don't watch ANY news program and don't cruise just one website. If you took the time to use your brain for something other than absorbing THC or concussive blows then you would know that I have cited many different sources from across the media landscape including varied newspaper, TV and online sources. So please continue your dopamine addled ranting about nothing.

[RichardCranium]

Youtube dimwit. I use a news aggregator for headline news from around the world, It's over 40 major sources from print, online and TV news. This popped up on my youtube because it is relevant to current events. I don't own a TV, don't watch ANY news program and don't cruise just one website. If you took the time to use your brain for something other than absorbing THC or concussive blows then you would know that I have cited many different sources from across the media landscape including varied newspaper, TV and online sources. So please continue your dopamine addled ranting about nothing.


I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure Rocktar just opened the distance at 10 horts.

[Taernath]

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure Rocktar just opened the distance at 10 horts.

He sounds a little heated. Might need to chain him to a block of ice.

[Androidpk]

He sounds a little heated.

Doesn't he always?

[Taernath]

Doesn't he always?

Only when he ERPs Gorean slavemaster Lunn Windrider.

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?53390-7-a-gallon-gas&p=1123384#post1123384

[cwolff]

Just going off the concerns voiced by Alan Dershowitz in this segment I got on youtube. Now I am not a lawyer and Alan is, a pretty respected one and likely he knows a metric and standard ton more than you ever will about the law. He seems pretty damn concerned about this kind of thing so I think I will take his word on it over yours.


https://youtu.be/TPGROJIKLv4

I've seen this form of argument before. What is this: appeal to higher authority? Is that the fallacy? Its the same one as the climate change argument. "I'm not a scientist"
You also run into this a when you accuse someone of watching fox. They inevitably reply, "I get news from an aggregator" which usually means Drudge. Never heard youtube before. LOL

Dershowitz is an outlier. He's been on the trump train for a year. I wonder why trump doesn't just hire him? Yesterday Dershowitz even said something like, "I don't advise the President in an official capacity. I give advice here Whether he watches or not, I don't know." That seemed weird to me. Its like he's interviewing for the job he wants

[Wrathbringer]

I've seen this form of argument before. What is this: appeal to higher authority? Is that the fallacy? Its the same one as the climate change argument. "I'm not a scientist"
You also run into this a when you accuse someone of watching fox. They inevitably reply, "I get news from an aggregator" which usually means Drudge. Never heard youtube before. LOL

Dershowitz is an outlier. He's been on the trump train for a year. I wonder why trump doesn't just hire him? Yesterday Dershowitz even said something like, "I don't advise the President in an official capacity. I give advice here Whether he watches or not, I don't know." That seemed weird to me. Its like he's interviewing for the job he wants

You're retarded.

[cwolff]

Dear "conservatives",

Have you considered this? If so, what is your response?


Joe Scarborough pointed out that Monday's raid was orchestrated by U.S. Attorney Geoffrey Berman: "This was a Trump man, a Trump contributor, and a Giuliani man who executed this search warrant. This is his doing, it was not Robert Mueller's doing, and there's nothing Donald Trump can say and there's no lies that he can try to spread that will change that."

[time4fun]

Just going off the concerns voiced by Alan Dershowitz in this segment I got on youtube. Now I am not a lawyer and Alan is, a pretty respected one and likely he knows a metric and standard ton more than you ever will about the law. He seems pretty damn concerned about this kind of thing so I think I will take his word on it over yours.


https://youtu.be/TPGROJIKLv4

Yes- I saw the Hannity segment.

First, Dershowitz wasn't actually making a legal critique- he was making a social critique as a professional in the legal industry. He made one declaration about the attorney-client privilege element, and in it he actually acknowledged that the Public Corruption unit who executed the warrant had probable cause to search the premises.

After that- there was no discussion of case law or any insinuation that this was improperly conducted by existing DoJ or legal guidelines. Your assertion that this was an attack on attorney-client privilege had no actual backing. Literally your only evidence in this instance is that Dershowitz gave a one sentence opinion that this was a bad day for attorney-client privilege.

For the record, I actually agree with the 6th Circuit (and presumably Dershowitz, though I've never read anything by him expounding on this issue) on the issue of taint teams and would even take it one step further. I think a magistrate judge should always be appointed as a part of this process because the taint team system is too vulnerable to abuse. If the SDNY Attorney is smart- they'll actually appoint one in this situation. BUT the Courts have routinely held (ala Clark) that attorney-client privilege is not a shield to protect criminal conduct. To argue that it's always wrong to search an attorney's files is to grant unalterable criminal immunity to corrupt attorneys and clients. That would be a system that is even more prone to abuse than taint teams.

For the record, these kinds of raids are extremely rare- in part- because it's almost impossible to get a Federal judge to sign off on these warrants. But in this particular situation, the Federal judge would have had to have been presented with an extraordinary amount of evidence that Cohen likely committed a crime, that legitimate evidence of that crime would be found in his office; home; and hotel room, and that there was good reason to believe that any advance notice would have resulted in a high risk of evidence being destroyed.

Among other things, that means that the DoJ likely found evidence that Cohen had already been destroying or withholding critical evidence in ongoing investigations. It also means Cohen was already either a subject or a target of an ongoing investigation.

[time4fun]

He's been on the trump train for a year.

In fairness to Dershowitz, I don't think his arguments have anything to do with Trump. He has a legal theory on Executive power that he believes in firmly (but it's legitimately only a theory as it has no real case law to back it up), and he's willing to fight for that no matter what the consequences.

One thing that routinely bothers me about Dershowitz's recent arguments is the way he improperly invokes an allegory to Legislative and Judicial immunity. It's true that you can't imprison a Senator for passing a law, and you can't imprison a Judge for ruling on a law. But you can imprison a Senator for accepting a bribe to pass a law. Likewise, you can't imprison a judge for handing out a guilty verdict- even one handed out improperly. But you can imprison a Judge on racketeering charges for accepting bribes to render guilty verdicts against kids (https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2011/08/11/139536686/pa-judge-sentenced-to-28-years-in-massive-juvenile-justice-bribery-scandal).

In the same vein- the act of firing an FBI Director is not illegal when done by a sitting US President. But any action taken with intent to obstruct justice is still illegal. (Though I'm obviously glossing over the huge amount of discussion/debate over criminal indictment of a sitting US President)

[Methais]

Yes- I saw the Hannity segment.

First, Dershowitz wasn't actually making a legal critique- he was making a social critique as a professional in the legal industry. He made one declaration about the attorney-client privilege element, and in it he actually acknowledged that the Public Corruption unit who executed the warrant had probable cause to search the premises.

After that- there was no discussion of case law or any insinuation that this was improperly conducted by existing DoJ or legal guidelines. Your assertion that this was an attack on attorney-client privilege had no actual backing. Literally your only evidence in this instance is that Dershowitz gave a one sentence opinion that this was a bad day for attorney-client privilege.

For the record, I actually agree with the 6th Circuit (and presumably Dershowitz, though I've never read anything by him expounding on this issue) on the issue of taint teams and would even take it one step further. I think a magistrate judge should always be appointed as a part of this process because the taint team system is too vulnerable to abuse. If the SDNY Attorney is smart- they'll actually appoint one in this situation. BUT the Courts have routinely held (ala Clark) that attorney-client privilege is not a shield to protect criminal conduct. To argue that it's always wrong to search an attorney's files is to grant unalterable criminal immunity to corrupt attorneys and clients. That would be a system that is even more prone to abuse than taint teams.

For the record, these kinds of raids are extremely rare- in part- because it's almost impossible to get a Federal judge to sign off on these warrants. But in this particular situation, the Federal judge would have had to have been presented with an extraordinary amount of evidence that Cohen likely committed a crime, that legitimate evidence of that crime would be found in his office; home; and hotel room, and that there was good reason to believe that any advance notice would have resulted in a high risk of evidence being destroyed.

Among other things, that means that the DoJ likely found evidence that Cohen had already been destroying or withholding critical evidence in ongoing investigations. It also means Cohen was already either a subject or a target of an ongoing investigation.

http://www.netanimations.net/blue-girls-fingers-on-mouse.gif

[Parkbandit]

Dear "conservatives",

Have you considered this? If so, what is your response?

My hope is that Mueller has some pretty damning information to get that search warrant and he should release the information soon.

I hope this isn't just another FISA court type of auto-accept and auto-approve warrants.

[Androidpk]

My hope is that Mueller has some pretty damning information to get that search warrant and he should release the information soon.

I hope this isn't just another FISA court type of auto-accept and auto-approve warrants.

100+ posts in this thread and you finally post something reasonable. Kudos.

[Parkbandit]

100+ posts in this thread and you finally post something reasonable. Kudos.

Close to 500 posts in this thread and you've yet to post anything intelligent.

If history is a judge, only 1,328 more dumb posts from you until we get a glimmer of actual thought.

I, for one, can't wait to read it.

[Androidpk]

Well that didn't last long. Seriously, do you have anything in your bag of tricks besides ad hominem attacks? You and Rocktar should form a support group for all your political angst.

[Methais]

100+ posts in this thread and you finally post something reasonable. Kudos.


Close to 500 posts in this thread and you've yet to post anything intelligent.

If history is a judge, only 1,328 more dumb posts from you until we get a glimmer of actual thought.

I, for one, can't wait to read it.


Well that didn't last long. Seriously, do you have anything in your bag of tricks besides ad hominem attacks? You and Rocktar should form a support group for all your political angst.

https://i.imgur.com/PEkBoao.gif

[Ashliana]

My hope is that Mueller has some pretty damning information to get that search warrant and he should release the information soon.

I hope this isn't just another FISA court type of auto-accept and auto-approve warrants.

How inconvenient for you that every single FISA judge was appointed by a conservative Republican-appointee, and your horseshit, totally evidence-free notion that "the FISA court auto-accepts and approves warrants" is based solely on your wishful thinking and no evidence whatsoever. You are the perfect example of a low-information voter. You don't know anything, and parrot whatever Drudge, Alex Jones or Rush Limbaugh tells you.

[Parkbandit]

Well that didn't last long. Seriously, do you have anything in your bag of tricks besides ad hominem attacks? You and Rocktar should form a support group for all your political angst.

You and Warriorbird should get your own support victim group going. He was great at playing the "I'm the real victim here" card.. and glad to see you were able to step into his enormous void.

[Parkbandit]

How inconvenient for you that every single FISA judge was appointed by a conservative, and your horseshit, totally evidence-free notion that "the FISA court auto-accepts and approves warrants" is based solely on your wishful thinking and no evidence whatsoever. You are the perfect example of a low-information voter. You don't know anything, and parrot whatever Drudge, Alex Jones or Rush Limbaugh tells you.

Irony at it's finest.

You still mad at my avatar.. where you "claimed" you just forgot to change your login name.. that your real intention was to post something else and you "accidentally" posted in agreement with your other login?

Please tell me you realize you are as full of shit as the rest of us already know. There isn't a legitimate story you can come up with that explains that quoted post.. except for your pathetic need to have someone agree with you.. even if it's just yourself.

Pathetic as usual, It.

[Parkbandit]

3rd post in a row so I can enjoy the stupidity that is It.

[Ashliana]

Irony at it's finest.

You still mad at my avatar.. where you "claimed" you just forgot to change your login name.. that your real intention was to post something else and you "accidentally" posted in agreement with your other login?

Please tell me you realize you are as full of shit as the rest of us already know. There isn't a legitimate story you can come up with that explains that quoted post.. except for your pathetic need to have someone agree with you.. even if it's just yourself.

Pathetic as usual, It.

:rofl: Your inability to read only reflects on you, PB. Repeating yourself doesn't make you any less stupid.

Kudos, though, on being utterly incapable of addressing how you just embarrassed yourself RE: FISA judges with your total lack of knowledge on the subject, and any ability to critically reason whatsoever.

[Wrathbringer]

:rofl: Your inability to read only reflects on you, PB. Repeating yourself doesn't make you any less stupid.

Kudos, though, on being utterly incapable of addressing how you just embarrassed yourself RE: FISA judges with your total lack of knowledge on the subject, and any ability to critically reason whatsoever.

You're retarded.

[Ashliana]

You're retarded.

https://i.imgur.com/YtkY319.png

[Parkbandit]

:rofl: Your inability to read only reflects on you, PB. Repeating yourself doesn't make you any less stupid.

Kudos, though, on being utterly incapable of addressing how you just embarrassed yourself RE: FISA judges with your total lack of knowledge on the subject, and any ability to critically reason whatsoever.

I didn't embarrass myself.

At all.

It's simply above your level of understanding.

Stick to things you are good at:

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

[Ashliana]

I didn't embarrass myself.

At all.

It's simply above your level of understanding.

Stick to things you are good at:

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

Still based on your inability to comprehend basic English. Especially delicious considering you threw "catfishing" in there -- yet another new-fangled Millenial thing you don't understand as an octogenarian. Classic. Again, doubling, quadrupling, octupling down on embarrassing yourself doesn't magically erase it.

Learn to read, my hilariously deluded friend (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=colloquialism).

[Parkbandit]

Still based on your inability to comprehend basic English. Especially delicious considering you threw "catfishing" in there -- yet another new-fangled Millenial thing you don't understand as an octogenarian. Classic. Again, doubling, quadrupling, octupling down on embarrassing yourself doesn't magically erase it.

Learn to read, my hilariously deluded friend (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=colloquialism).

I'm not your friend, cockgobbler.

Sorry. I know you don't have any and you were really, really wishing I was.

But I'm not.

Also stop:

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

[Ashliana]

I'm not your friend, cockgobbler.

Sorry. I know you don't have any and you were really, really wishing I was.

But I'm not.

Also stop:

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

Aww. Look! Not only is Parkbandit too retarded to know what colloquial speech is, he doesn't know how to click links! What an adorable little old man, trying his best to use teh intarwebs! Best of luck eventually googling what "catfishing" is, though.

[Parkbandit]

Aww. Look! Not only is Parkbandit too retarded to know what colloquial speech is, he doesn't know how to click links! What an adorable little old man, trying his best to use teh intarwebs! Best of luck eventually googling what "catfishing" is, though.

Dear faggot:
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

[Ashliana]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/3a/3a725b14f1469e157b5e3263b7fe031a0853bad94247b928a8 4b6bf0b2045638.jpg

[time4fun]

My hope is that Mueller has some pretty damning information to get that search warrant and he should release the information soon.

I hope this isn't just another FISA court type of auto-accept and auto-approve warrants.

This was a totally reasonable and substantive post. I agree- the evidence needs to have been incontrovertible.

Clarification though remember that Mueller's team made a criminal referral- they played no part in the warrant request process. (Rosenstein did though, apparently)

But your point about having a lot of evidence is a totally reasonable thing to expect. In this instance, the sheer number of DoJ officials (SDNY State Attorney, Wrey, Rosenstein, etc) who had to sign off on this plus the fact that a Federal Judge had to sign off on it tells us that there was a lot of damning evidence.

Under the circumstances, none of these people would have taken such an extreme approach without a really good reason- they understand the political implications of what just happened. A lot of people risked decades-long careers yesterday.

Re: FISA- I think FISA Courts are a terrible idea. BUT Carter Page had been under strong suspicion of being a Russian asset for years. Remember he was recruited by Russian spies (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/04/us/politics/carter-page-trump-russia.html), notified of that fact by the FBI, and then shortly afterwards was meeting with Russian government officials and giving anti-US/pro-Russian speeches (https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/03/carter-page-nunes-memo-216934). If there were ever a justification for a FISA Court, Carter Page would be it.

But he was also a part of an active US Presidential campaign- so the standard for a FISA warrant (which IS a high standard) would have been much higher than would typically be true of someone heavily suspected of being a Russian spy. FISA warrants also have to be renewed every 90 days- and you have to provide evidence from the previous 90 days of wiretapping to demonstrate probable cause for a renewal. You can't just keep submitting the same original evidence over and over again. Page's FISA warrant was renewed at least twice (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/01/31/what-we-know-about-the-warrant-to-surveil-carter-page/?utm_term=.96e534628fab)- which means there was good reason to wiretap him.

[Parkbandit]

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/3a/3a725b14f1469e157b5e3263b7fe031a0853bad94247b928a8 4b6bf0b2045638.jpg

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

[Ashliana]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/3a/3a725b14f1469e157b5e3263b7fe031a0853bad94247b928a8 4b6bf0b2045638.jpg

[Parkbandit]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

[Ashliana]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/images/247f0aca1e1bf8beb407f1ba38ef8030/tenor.gif?itemid=4488533

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/3a/3a725b14f1469e157b5e3263b7fe031a0853bad94247b928a8 4b6bf0b2045638.jpg

[time4fun]

How inconvenient for you that every single FISA judge was appointed by a conservative Republican-appointee, and your horseshit, totally evidence-free notion that "the FISA court auto-accepts and approves warrants" is based solely on your wishful thinking and no evidence whatsoever. You are the perfect example of a low-information voter. You don't know anything, and parrot whatever Drudge, Alex Jones or Rush Limbaugh tells you.

In fairness to PB though- that doesn't mean those Judges take a particularly hard-line view on 4th Amendment rights. (Conservative Judges tend to give deference to the Executive Branch in these disputes)

[Ashliana]

In fairness to PB though- that doesn't mean those Judges take a particularly hard-line view on 4th Amendment rights. (Conservative Judges tend to give deference to the Executive Branch in these disputes)

Putting aside whether or not that's true, it shoots the "IT WAS A POLITICALLY-MOTIVATED WITCHHUNT" premise in the foot. Every single FISA judge in history was appointed by either arch-conservative William Rehnquist or current conservative John Roberts.

[time4fun]

Putting aside whether or not that's true, it shoots the "IT WAS A POLITICALLY-MOTIVATED WITCHHUNT" premise in the foot. Every single FISA judge in history was appointed by either arch-conservative William Rehnquist or current conservative John Roberts.

Yes, it does. It's actually interesting that the [Democratic] "Witch Hunt" argument has worked as well as it has. I don't believe there are any active Federal or Congressional investigations into Trump or his campaign right now being run by Democrats. It's possible there's a team out there within the DoJ or IRS who is looking into some element that intersects with Mueller's work that's run by a Democrat, but that would be the exception- not the rule.

Trump is very much being investigated by his own party (which is its own problem) and in many cases his own appointees. That's hardly your typical demographic for a witch hunt.

Also ironically- Nixon used to use the same "Witch Hunt" phrase. So it always made me chuckle that Trump would borrow anything from Nixon as that's the exact comparison he wants to avoid.

PS It also kills me how infrequently pundits point out that it's illegal to factor in someone's political affiliations in Federal hiring. And if you think about that for 2 minutes you can see why that's outlawed. The whole notion that hiring Democrats makes you suspect is rhetorically silly (So only Republicans can be trusted to investigate Republicans? Bad idea) but also legally impermissible.

[Candor]

Clarification though remember that Mueller's team made a criminal referral- they played no part in the warrant request process. (Rosenstein did though, apparently)

But your point about having a lot of evidence is a totally reasonable thing to expect. In this instance, the sheer number of DoJ officials (SDNY State Attorney, Wrey, Rosenstein, etc) who had to sign off on this plus the fact that a Federal Judge had to sign off on it tells us that there was a lot of damning evidence.

Under the circumstances, none of these people would have taken such an extreme approach without a really good reason- they understand the political implications of what just happened. A lot of people risked decades-long careers yesterday.



I have to agree - Mueller's team has to have collected significant evidence of serious crimes.

As to who allegedly committed these crimes however, that we don't know...yet. I realize you know this, but a few members of the media are celebrating a bit early.

[Methais]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41tCIesjwjL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

https://media.giphy.com/media/hxc32veg6tbqg/giphy.gif

[time4fun]

Uh oh.

White House today: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/donald-trump-robert-mueller-fire-fbi/index.html)


"He certainly believes he has the power to do so," the White House press secretary said of the President's ability to fire Mueller. "We've been advised that the President certainly has the power to make that decision."

That's not good. It's also kind of inaccurate. Rosenstein would have to do the firing, or Trump would have to re-write the regulations.

This is echoing the Saturday Night Massacre in unsettling ways.

[time4fun]

I have to agree - Mueller's team has to have collected significant evidence of serious crimes.

As to who allegedly committed these crimes however, that we don't know...yet. I realize you know this, but a few members of the media are celebrating a bit early.

I'm not sure anyone is celebrating at this point. If you're on the right and a Trump-backing publication- you're outraged. And if you're on the left and have an antagonistic relationship with Trump- you're afraid of what Trump is about to do to the investigation.

But I think at this point we all realize that no one would have requested this warrant, and certainly no Federal Judge would have approved this warrant if they hadn't presented very concrete evidence that there was/is, in fact, a jointly committed crime by Cohen and Trump. This only got approval because everyone involved was 100% sure that a crime was committed, that Cohen's office/hotel/home would absolutely have additional evidence of it, AND that there had already been situations where Cohen had recently either destroyed/tampered with/or illegally withheld evidence from investigators.

[Parkbandit]

I'm not sure anyone is celebrating at this point. If you're on the right and a Trump-backing publication- you're outraged. And if you're on the left and have an antagonistic relationship with Trump- you're afraid of what Trump is about to do to the investigation.

Very few people are "outraged" or "afraid".

Again, stop projecting your inability to control your emotions onto anyone else.

It does not affect my life at all.

Sorry.

I will laugh my ass off if Trump is impeached or resigns.. and we get President Pence. Then you'll be all like "Um.... wut did we do......"

[Androidpk]

Very few people are "outraged" or "afraid".

Again, stop projecting your inability to control your emotions onto anyone else.

It does not affect my life at all.

Sorry.

I will laugh my ass off if Trump is impeached or resigns.. and we get President Pence. Then you'll be all like "Um.... wut did we do......"

If Trump gets impeached or resigns everyone will be laughing their asses off at your stupidity too much to care about Pence or whomever.

[Parkbandit]

If Trump gets impeached or resigns everyone will be laughing their asses off at your stupidity too much to care about Pence or whomever.

Laughing their asses off at what precisely? For voting for Trump?

STILL a better candidate than Hillary.. I would vote exactly the same way today... if nothing more than to see your daily meltdown.

[time4fun]

New York Times reporting tonight (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/10/us/politics/trump-sought-to-fire-mueller-in-december.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=a-lede-package-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news):


In early December, President Trump, furious over news reports about a new round of subpoenas from the office of the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, told advisers in no uncertain terms that Mr. Mueller’s investigation had to be shut down.

The president’s anger was fueled by reports that the subpoenas were for obtaining information about his business dealings with Deutsche Bank, according to interviews with eight White House officials, people close to the president and others familiar with the episode. To Mr. Trump, the subpoenas suggested that Mr. Mueller had expanded the investigation in a way that crossed the “red line” he had set last year in an interview with The New York Times.

In the hours that followed Mr. Trump’s initial anger over the Deutsche Bank reports, his lawyers and advisers worked quickly to learn about the subpoenas, and ultimately were told by Mr. Mueller’s office that the reports were not accurate, leading the president to back down.

CNN also reporting: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/trump-rod-rosenstein-robert-mueller/index.html)


President Donald Trump is considering firing Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, multiple people familiar with the discussions tell CNN, a move that has gained urgency following the raid of the office of the President's personal lawyer.

Such an action could potentially further Trump's goal of trying to put greater limits on special counsel Robert Mueller.
This is one of several options -- including going so far as to fire Attorney General Jeff Sessions -- Trump is weighing in the aftermath of the FBI's decision Monday to raid the office of Michael Cohen, the President's personal lawyer and longtime confidant. Officials say if Trump acts, Rosenstein is his most likely target, but it's unclear whether even such a dramatic firing like this would be enough to satisfy the President.

[time4fun]

This follows on the heels of this reporting: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/michael-cohen-fbi-raid/index.html)


In his first comments since the FBI raid on his home and office, Michael Cohen said the FBI agents "were extremely professional, courteous and respectful."

The comments contrast with President Donald Trump who complained Monday that agents "broke into the office of one of my personal attorneys."
"I am unhappy to have my personal residence and office raided. But I will tell you that members of the FBI that conducted the search and seizure were all extremely professional, courteous and respectful. And I thanked them at the conclusion," Cohen said in a phone conversation on Tuesday with CNN.

He said that he is very loyal to Trump but after what happened on Monday, he'd rethink how he handled the payments to Daniels because of the impact on his family.

This is likely what has Trump so scared right now.

For those who don't follow Cohen- contrition is not historically in his portfolio of responses. He's terrified- either because he knows they found serious evidence of serious crimes, or he suspects they did.

[Androidpk]

Laughing their asses off at what precisely? For voting for Trump?

STILL a better candidate than Hillary.. I would vote exactly the same way today... if nothing more than to see your daily meltdown.

For calling this investigation a nothingburger/vast left wing conspiracy the entire time it unfolded.

[Fortybox]

For calling this investigation a nothingburger/vast left wing conspiracy the entire time it unfolded.

This is it!!! It’s reqlly happening nao!

[cwolff]

This follows on the heels of this reporting: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/michael-cohen-fbi-raid/index.html)



This is likely what has Trump so scared right now.

For those who don't follow Cohen- contrition is not historically in his portfolio of responses. He's terrified- either because he knows they found serious evidence of serious crimes, or he suspects they did.

Hes like Roger Stone, nunberg and even trump. All talk. Purse puppies

[Gelston]

nothingburger

I don't care who came up with that word, they need to be chemically castrated. People who continue to use it need a swift kick in the balls too.

[time4fun]

For calling this investigation a nothingburger/vast left wing conspiracy the entire time it unfolded.

It's fascinating though- the way his position has abruptly changed from "Impeachment will never happen" to "I will laugh if impeachment/resignation happens".

Is your sense that this shift is predominantly/entirely based on the recent raid? Or is your sense that this has been a gradual shift, and this raid was the "straw the broke the camel's back", so to speak?

And when I ask this- I'm not asking about PB in particular. Rather, I'm interested in him as a proxy for the pro-Trump body politic, as it were.

[Androidpk]

For those who don't follow Cohen- contrition is not historically in his portfolio of responses. He's terrified- either because he knows they found serious evidence of serious crimes, or he suspects they did.

On a side note, has this ever happened to a US President's lawyer before?

[Back]

I'll be immensely happier once Trump is gone. He never should have been president in the first place. He embodies the absolute worst about America. His presidency is a stain on American history.

[time4fun]

Hes like Roger Stone, nunberg and even trump. All talk. Purse puppies

Except he's not- he's got a long history of harassment.

BTW you were right about Dershowitz- I gave him too much credit (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/donald-trump-alan-dershowitz/index.html):


President Donald Trump is supposed to have dinner at the White House Tuesday evening with law professor and high-profile defender Alan Dershowitz, a source familiar with the matter told CNN.

Dershowitz has been a critic of special counsel Robert Mueller's investigation and appeared on Fox News broadcasts opposing the FBI raid on Trump's personal attorney Michael Cohen.

A source said Dershowitz is also there to talk about the Middle East, but it is likely the President is looking for legal input. Two sources said Dershowitz is not joining the legal team at this point and that he is very valuable on the outside making the President's case on television.

He really wants to test his legal theory.

[Androidpk]

I don't care who came up with that word, they need to be chemically castrated. People who continue to use it need a swift kick in the balls too.

Your threat is a big nothingburger.

[Wrathbringer]

I'll be immensely happier once Trump is gone. He never should have been president in the first place. He embodies the absolute worst about America. His presidency is a stain on American history.

:lol: cry harder your liberal tears!! It's great! Sooooooo butthurt!!! #4moreyears

[Androidpk]

Purse puppies

The funniest thing to come out of this massive shitstorm is the fact that a former pornstar actress has better legal representation than the president of the united states.

[time4fun]

On a side note, has this ever happened to a US President's lawyer before?

I looked briefly yesterday, but I couldn't find any record of this having happened- in modern politics, at least.

Honestly, it's difficult to emphasize enough how exceptionally rare it is for a raid on any attorney's office period. Let alone a President's lawyer.

[Androidpk]

I

Honestly, it's difficult to emphasize enough how exceptionally rare it is for a raid on any attorney's office period. Let alone a President's lawyer.

Very rare. One of the comments I came across was from a former FBI agent who said something along the lines of 30 years in the FBI and he's only seen it happen 6 times and all 6 lawyers ended up in prison.

[time4fun]

The funniest thing to come out of this massive shitstorm is the fact that a former pornstar actress has better legal representation than the president of the united states.

Honestly the two most likely forks in the road at this point are either 1) Cohen flips, and that turns into the final nail in the coffin or 2) Trump fires Sessions; tries to fire Rosenstein; or tries to fire Mueller, and that rapidly precipitates into his impeachment.

Either way- it would appear that Stormy Daniels may have effectively taken down the President of the United States.

[Fortybox]

Honestly the two most likely forks in the road at this point are either 1) Cohen flips, and that turns into the final nail in the coffin or 2) Trump fires Sessions; tries to fire Rosenstein; or tries to fire Mueller, and that rapidly precipitates into his impeachment.

Either way- it would appear that Stormy Daniels may have effectively taken down the President of the United States.

3) Nothing happens, Trump is still president and Time4fun is still emotionally over klempt.

[Androidpk]

notice me senpei!

You, pb, methais, and wrathbringer in a nutshell.

[Wrathbringer]

3) Nothing happens, Trump is still president and Time4fun is still emotionally over klempt.

This is correct.

[Wrathbringer]

Honestly the two most likely forks in the road at this point are either 1) Cohen flips, and that turns into the final nail in the coffin or 2) Trump fires Sessions; tries to fire Rosenstein; or tries to fire Mueller, and that rapidly precipitates into his impeachment.

Either way- it would appear that Stormy Daniels may have effectively taken down the President of the United States.

You're so retarded. Quoted for when trump gets re-elected in 2020.

[time4fun]

You're so retarded Quoted for when trump is still president in 6 years.

As is the case with most people here, I am continually embarrassed for you.

[Androidpk]

You're so retarded Quoted for when trump is still president in 6 years.

You forgot to put tacos in on a survey. You lose. Go directly to jail.

[Fortybox]

You, pb, methais, and wrathbringer in a nutshell.

In that order and do we fit in a nutshell? details plz

[Fortybox]

As is the case with most people here, I am continually embarrassed for you.

Why are you embarrassed? You sure like to convey so much emotion for anonymous people. PB is right about you (but wrong about the Xanax dosage).

[Neveragain]

I'll be immensely happier once Trump is gone. He never should have been president in the first place. He embodies the absolute worst about America. His presidency is a stain on American history.

How is it even possible to go through life being unhappy about who is president?

What is so terribly different about your life now than it was 4 years ago? For the average dick they are seeing maybe a little more money on their paycheck, absolutely nothing the president has done could possibly make you unhappy.

FFS Americans are such spoiled pussies.

[time4fun]

So the thing I can't quite figure out here- why now?

From the perspective of the Mueller investigation, it seems like now was a terrible time for this raid. Doing it after the interview would have made more sense.

There are three explanations that potentially come to mind:

1) They were genuinely worried that Cohen was about to destroy a bunch of evidence- meaning they just didn't have time to wait around

2) Trump was closer to firing Mueller or Rosenstein than has been publicly announced- meaning they needed to get part of this investigation disseminated to New York State and other parts of the DoJ

3) The other parts of the DoJ weren't willing to wait for the benefit of the Mueller investigation (seems very unlikely)

[cwolff]

How is it even possible to go through life being unhappy about who is president?

What is so terribly different about your life now than it was 4 years ago? For the average dick they are seeing maybe a little more money on their paycheck, absolutely nothing the president has done could possibly make you unhappy.

FFS Americans are such spoiled pussies.

A lot has changed already and the effects will get worse over time. Everything he has done has made me unhappy. Tax cuts? Fuck that, we're just racking up the credit cards. Corruption? why the hell's he using his presidency to market his business? First Amendment? He attacks it every day. If we call out a bad actor, they can say "fake news". We have lost our standing as any sort of moral authority. EPA is failing to do it's job. It's basically the opposite of a Protection agency now. State Dept. is in tatters. Believe it or not, Diplomacy is important.

For the average dick everything has changed. He lost. He just doesn't admit it yet.

[Latrinsorm]

Really getting hot now.Do you uh... not know what that little dragon turned into? It was a big dragon. That burned like a million people. This is a weird reference to make if you're dismissive of the investigation.
You and Warriorbird should get your own support victim group going. He was great at playing the "I'm the real victim here" card.. and glad to see you were able to step into his enormous void.You get how it's weird that you fixate on people that haven't posted here in ages, right? time comes back and you zero in on WB, if Warriorbird comes back are you going to start harping on Harmnone again?

[Fortybox]

Do you uh... not know what that little dragon turned into? It was a big dragon. That burned like a million people. This is a weird reference to make if you're dismissive of the investigation.You get how it's weird that you fixate on people that haven't posted here in ages, right? time comes back and you zero in on WB, if Warriorbird comes back are you going to start harping on Harmnone again?

What does Smaug have to do with this discussion?

[cwolff]

Why are you embarrassed? You sure like to convey so much emotion for anonymous people. PB is right about you (but wrong about the Xanax dosage).

T4F's avatar is fucking hot. Yours is killing my chub. I'm trying to have another kid and if this image pops in my head at a critical juncture we're gonna have an only child on our hands.

[Neveragain]

A lot has changed already and the effects will get worse over time. Everything he has done has made me unhappy. Tax cuts? Fuck that, we're just racking up the credit cards. Corruption? why the hell's he using his presidency to market his business? First Amendment? He attacks it every day. If we call out a bad actor, they can say "fake news". We have lost our standing as any sort of moral authority. EPA is failing to do it's job. It's basically the opposite of a Protection agency now. State Dept. is in tatters. Believe it or not, Diplomacy is important.

For the average dick everything has changed. He lost. He just doesn't admit it yet.

Because the government isn't stealing money from job providers I should be unhappy?

I haven't noticed any rise in the Trump business, it has caused me 0 losses.

He attacks the first amendment every day? Or do you mean he calls the media whores what they are?

Trump caused the loss in the US's moral authority, you got that back words bud, people chose Trump. The moral loss took place long before Trump was president.

EPA is what?

Diplomacy as long as it's not with Russia...........

I'm better off, but of course I have all but completely ignored politics/the news for the past almost year. 99% of my politics is reading what you idiots write and I just kind of make shit up as I go. I know it sounds stupid, but it goes really well with my morning coffee. I honestly don't really give a fuck, our country is a dumpster fire and has been for almost 20 years now, I honestly totally see Trump as just deserts. Both Hillary and Trump are poster children for our society, though it makes me sad , I'm doing my best to have fun as it all spins around the drain. You guys should probably do the same, it's much more fun.

[time4fun]

T4F's avatar is fucking hot. Yours is killing my chub. I'm trying to have another kid and if this image pops in my head at a critical juncture we're gonna have an only child on our hands.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to cwolff again.

[Fortybox]

T4F's avatar is fucking hot. Yours is killing my chub. I'm trying to have another kid and if this image pops in my head at a critical juncture we're gonna have an only child on our hands.

:(

[time4fun]

Because the government isn't stealing money from job providers I should be unhappy?

I haven't noticed any rise in the Trump business, it has caused me 0 losses.

He attacks the first amendment every day? Or do you mean he calls the media whores what they are?

Trump caused the loss in the US's moral authority, you got that back words bud, people chose Trump. The moral loss took place long before Trump was president.

EPA is what?

Diplomacy as long as it's not with Russia...........

I'm better off, but of course I have all but completely ignored politics/the news for the past almost year. 99% of my politics is reading what you idiots write and I just kind of make shit up as I go. I know it sounds stupid, but it goes really well with my morning coffee. I honestly don't really give a fuck, our country is a dumpster fire and has been for almost 20 years now, I honestly totally see Trump as just deserts. Both Hillary and Trump are poster children for our society, though it makes me sad , I'm doing my best to have fun as it all spins around the drain. You guys should probably do the same, it's much more fun.

It's astounding- how have you managed to maintain such an adolescent view of the political and social world around you for decades? You should volunteer yourself at the local University for study.

Oh- sorry. A University is a place where lots of people gather to learn things. I can help you find your nearest one if you'd like.

[Fortybox]

It's astounding- how have you managed to maintain such an adolescent view of the political and social world around you for decades? You should volunteer yourself at the local University for study.

Oh- sorry. A University is a place where lots of people gather to learn things. I can help you find your nearest one if you'd like.

I have 28463 PhDs. Have you even heard of a University?? I can help you find your nearest one if you'd like.

[time4fun]

CNN is reporting tonight: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/robert-mueller-donald-trump-white-house/index.html)


President Donald Trump and his aides have discussed firing special counsel Robert Mueller for months, and the prevailing wisdom inside the administration is that the President has the authority to do so, a source familiar with the matter says.

The legality of firing Mueller has been a topic of conversation inside the White House since the indictments of Paul Manafort and Rick Gates last fall, the source said.

"Their interpretation is that they can do that," the source said.

A separate source familiar with the matter agreed that the administration believes Trump likely has the authority to fire Mueller.

But Trump has discussed whether he should fire Mueller with members of Congress, a source said. The President has been counseled by lawmakers that such a move would be disastrous for the midterm election in the fall.

"He's getting level-headed advice not to do that," the source said.

And day after day, Congressional Republicans get up in front of the country to tell everyone that Trump has no intention of firing Mueller, and that there's no need to pass legislation to protect him.

Unbelievable.

[cwolff]

I'm better off, but of course I have all but completely ignored politics/the news for the past almost year. 99% of my politics is reading what you idiots write and I just kind of make shit up as I go. I know it sounds stupid, but it goes really well with my morning coffee. I honestly don't really give a fuck, our country is a dumpster fire and has been for almost 20 years now, I honestly totally see Trump as just deserts. Both Hillary and Trump are poster children for our society, though it makes me sad , I'm doing my best to have fun as it all spins around the drain. You guys should probably do the same, it's much more fun.

Make shit up as you go? HAHA that made me laugh. That's next level trolling dude. I approve. I'm getting all pissed off over here reading your posts and you're drinking coffee while throwing jumbles of words at the PC forum.

I do feel guilty for thinking this, but agree with that "chickens coming home to roost" type of idea. I still believe in the system though and have hope.

[Back]

:(

Those gifs are fucking stupid and are not memes.

[cwolff]

And day after day, Congressional Republicans get up in front of the country to tell everyone that Trump has no intention of firing Mueller, and that there's no need to pass legislation to protect him.

Unbelievable.

They're playing with fire and I'm hoping they all get burned. Knowing how trump operates they probably will.

[Androidpk]

Do you uh... not know what that little dragon turned into? It was a big dragon. That burned like a million people. This is a weird reference to make if you're dismissive of the investigation.You get how it's weird that you fixate on people that haven't posted here in ages, right? time comes back and you zero in on WB, if Warriorbird comes back are you going to start harping on Harmnone again?

way to pull out your victim card, latrin!

[Neveragain]

It's astounding- how have you managed to maintain such an adolescent view of the political and social world around you for decades? You should volunteer yourself at the local University for study.

Oh- sorry. A University is a place where lots of people gather to learn things. I can help you find your nearest one if you'd like.

This reminds me. I'm going to be in the SF area over memorial day, we should get together for coffee. I'm totally thinking haight and ashbury, or Chinatown.

~All joking aside, I did get involved and I experienced just how corrupt it all is. Anyone in any place of government power IS corrupt. It's like thinking you're going to fix the borg by joining the borg.

[Neveragain]

I just know fortyboxs avatar is pretty fucking epic.

[Androidpk]

I forgot about this one.

https://i.imgur.com/aqVgy47.jpg

[Jeril]

Make shit up as you go? HAHA that made me laugh. That's next level trolling dude. I approve. I'm getting all pissed off over here reading your posts and you're drinking coffee while throwing jumbles of words at the PC forum.

I do feel guilty for thinking this, but agree with that "chickens coming home to roost" type of idea. I still believe in the system though and have hope.

Sucker.

[Fortybox]

The Onion is reporting with: (https://politics.theonion.com/fbi-raids-michael-cohen-s-office-to-get-closer-look-at-1825151366)


NEW YORK—Admitting they could not deny themselves a chance to glimpse a genius in action, FBI officials confirmed they raided the office of President Trump’s longtime lawyer Michael Cohen Monday so they could develop a deeper appreciation of his masterful legal work. “Yesterday afternoon, federal agents confiscated thousands of documents from Mr. Cohen in order to develop a better understanding of this consummate authority on the law by witnessing firsthand his subtle interpretive powers as an attorney,” said agency spokesperson Laura Milford, who added that the FBI immediately pored over Cohen’s meticulous, well-reasoned legal briefs, hoping to observe how the mind of such a great and conscientious professional operates. “It has been stunning to witness how he handles the president’s legal matters with both a commanding knowledge of the justice system and a passionate respect for the philosophical intricacies of jurisprudence. We couldn’t help but obtain a warrant to remove these papers and see what might be learned from the endeavors of such a highly principled individual.” The raid follows a similar operation conducted last year at Paul Manafort’s home, where the FBI seized material they hoped would allow them to see how a profound champion of global democracy goes about his work.

This totally proves my point and shows how I am smarter than all of you combined.

Unbelievable.

[Androidpk]

Even Bob Loblaw is a smarter lawyer than Cohen :/

[Parkbandit]

Do you uh... not know what that little dragon turned into? It was a big dragon. That burned like a million people. This is a weird reference to make if you're dismissive of the investigation.You get how it's weird that you fixate on people that haven't posted here in ages, right? time comes back and you zero in on WB, if Warriorbird comes back are you going to start harping on Harmnone again?

I realize I'm going against my own imposed rule of not feeding the creepy little troll, but oh well.

I brought up Warriorbird as someone who constantly played the victim card. I don't recall Harmnone doing that.

Sorry you didn't understand it. Well, I'm not surprised.. and not really sorry. I guess I'm just saying fuck off in a polite way.

Back to not feeding the creepy little troll.

[Parkbandit]

The Onion is reporting with: (https://politics.theonion.com/fbi-raids-michael-cohen-s-office-to-get-closer-look-at-1825151366)

This totally proves my point and shows how I am smarter than all of you combined.

Unbelievable.

The Onion is as legitimate news source as Politifact... because it's a root vegetable.

Also, your avatar is amazing.

[Parkbandit]

T4F's avatar is fucking hot. Yours is killing my chub. I'm trying to have another kid and if this image pops in my head at a critical juncture we're gonna have an only child on our hands.

From the "guy" who also thought the avatar of Hillary in a bathingsuit was hot.

You have the worst taste in women.

[Candor]

So the thing I can't quite figure out here- why now?

From the perspective of the Mueller investigation, it seems like now was a terrible time for this raid. Doing it after the interview would have made more sense.

There are three explanations that potentially come to mind:

1) They were genuinely worried that Cohen was about to destroy a bunch of evidence- meaning they just didn't have time to wait around

2) Trump was closer to firing Mueller or Rosenstein than has been publicly announced- meaning they needed to get part of this investigation disseminated to New York State and other parts of the DoJ

3) The other parts of the DoJ weren't willing to wait for the benefit of the Mueller investigation (seems very unlikely)

I consider 2) and 3) to be very unlikely. As for 1), all I can say is that I hope it isn't true.

But I'm not convinced that the timing itself means anything beyond normal progression of the investigation.

[Fortybox]

The Onion is as legitimate news source as Politifact... because it's a root vegetable.

Also, your avatar is amazing.

The Onion is legitimate because if you remove part of the top of the O's you get U's. There are 2 O's in Onion and both Trump and Putin each have a U. THIS PROVES COLLUSION. Why can't you people see this?

Unbelievable.

[time4fun]

I consider 2) and 3) to be very unlikely. As for 1), all I can say is that I hope it isn't true.

But I'm not convinced that the timing itself means anything beyond normal progression of the investigation.

Given all of the reporting tonight- it sounds like 2 is actually very probable unfortunately.

[time4fun]

CNN is confirming (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/trump-mueller-interview-cohen-raid/index.html) that Trump is reconsidering an interview with Mueller:


A White House official said President Donald Trump and his legal team are reevaluating whether Trump should sit down for an interview with special counsel Robert Mueller's team in light of the raid aimed at the President's personal attorney, Michael Cohen.

"The President has made no decision regarding the interview but anybody with common sense will see the attack on his lawyer as cause to reevaluate," the official said.
The official added that the President's cooperation should be proportional to the courtesy he receives from the special counsel. The raid on Cohen's office is viewed by the White House as not showing the President that courtesy, the official said.

Additionally, a source close to the President said there have been ongoing negotiations between Mueller's team and the President's legal team for a potential interview, but the raid on the President's personal attorney has upended those discussions.

Given what Trump is purportedly about to do- Muller should request a subpoena from a Grand Jury to compel testimony.

Assuming the Grand Jury is willing to grant it, it should provide some additional layers of insulation for Mueller and Rosenstein.

Under the circumstances, the not-so-thinly-veiled threats that Trump has been issuing to Rosenstein and Mueller should provide enough justification for a Grand Jury to act even though Trump hasn't formally said no yet.

[Androidpk]

So it would seem that Boente's memos confirm Comey's memos. It's memos all the way down!

[cwolff]

8973

Poor Lou and Fox news. Even their viewers say no.

[cwolff]

CNN is confirming (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/trump-mueller-interview-cohen-raid/index.html) that Trump is reconsidering an interview with Mueller:



Given what Trump is purportedly about to do- Muller should request a subpoena from a Grand Jury to compel testimony.

Assuming the Grand Jury is willing to grant it, it should provide some additional layers of insulation for Mueller and Rosenstein.

Under the circumstances, the not-so-thinly-veiled threats that Trump has been issuing to Rosenstein and Mueller should provide enough justification for a Grand Jury to act even though Trump hasn't formally said no yet.

Dershowitz was at the white house last night. I'm thinking he got his job offer he wanted

[Parkbandit]

Dershowitz was at the white house last night. I'm thinking he got his job offer he wanted

This wouldn't be true. Androidpk said that there isn't a single lawyer that would take that job.

[time4fun]

So it would seem that Boente's memos confirm Comey's memos. It's memos all the way down!

Wait- didn't the conservative trolls spend last year calling him a liar and backing Trump's version of things?

How embarrassing.

[time4fun]

Paul Ryan is leaving Congress after this year

That is NOT good news for Trump. Republicans with nothing to fear from the electorate are the ones who are willing to hold him accountable.

If he fires Mueller, Sessions, or Rosenstein he's now at legitimate risk of impeachment.

[Gelston]

Paul Ryan is leaving Congress after this year

That is NOT good news for Trump. Republicans with nothing to fear from the electorate are the ones who are willing to hold him accountable.

If he fires Mueller, Sessions, or Rosenstein he's now at legitimate risk of impeachment.

No he isn't. You are always overboard on your reactions.

[Wrathbringer]

No he isn't. You are always overboard on your reactions.

Well, she is retarded. It is what tards do.

[Methais]

Well, she is retarded. It is what tards do.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/20/ba/e6/20bae6a5159295ee5986464d3281c960.jpg

[Parkbandit]

No he isn't. You are always overboard on your reactions.

It's the lack of emotional control.

Just pity her.. she can't afford the medication.

[Wrathbringer]

It's the lack of emotional control.

Just pity her.. she can't afford the medication.

It's just part of being a woman. Ask Assliana. He's a woman.

[Methais]

It's the lack of emotional control.

Just pity her.. she can't afford the medication.

That must be some pretty expensive medication, considering her claim that she makes more money than everyone else here combined.

Then again, considering the massive dose that must be required to have any effect on such a plethora of mental issues like hers, it's probably out of anyone's price range.

[Back]

Wow the shit talkers are in full force today. Who peed in all their Cheerios?

[time4fun]

Wow the shit talkers are in full force today. Who peed in all their Cheerios?

Bob Mueller and Paul Ryan ;)

[Wrathbringer]

Bob Mueller and Paul Ryan ;)

you're retarded.

[cwolff]

This isn't a good look. Tweet from Ana Navarro


Going a little further back into GOP Speakers: Paul Ryan’s retiring. John Boehner’s hawking marijuana. Dennis Hastert’s in a halfway house after being released from federal prison for charges related to sex crimes, and Newt Gimgrich is at the Vatican as his 3rd wife’s + 1. 🙈🙉🙊 https://t.co/RV3G1zeVpr

[time4fun]

No he isn't. You are always overboard on your reactions.

You understand that the ultimate decision on whether or not to proceed with impeachment goes to the Speaker of the House, correct?

Have you noticed what the few Republicans who speak out against the President all have in common? Hint: none of them are facing primary challenges because none of them are running next year.

So yes, this dramatically increases the odds that the House would respond if Trump does something aggregious.

Given the odds were approximately 0% yesterday, it's an increase of significance.

[time4fun]

This isn't a good look. Tweet from Ana Navarro

The Rule of Law party at its finest.

[Wrathbringer]

You understand that the ultimate decision on whether or not to proceed with impeachment goes to the Speaker of the House, correct?

Have you noticed what the few Republicans who speak out against the President all have in common? Hint: none of them are facing primary challenges because none of them are running next year.

So yes, this dramatically increases the odds that the House would respond if Trump does something aggregious.

Given the odds were approximately 0% yesterday, it's an increase of significance.

Damn you're stupid.

[time4fun]

Damn you're stupid.

Mwha

[Androidpk]

Interesting thread about Trump and Mueller.

https://twitter.com/EricColumbus/status/984101415374254080

[Androidpk]

This wouldn't be true. Androidpk said that there isn't a single lawyer that would take that job.

Let me know when Dershowitz joins Trump's legal team.

[Fortybox]

You understand that the ultimate decision on whether or not to proceed with impeachment goes to the Speaker of the House, correct?

Have you noticed what the few Republicans who speak out against the President all have in common? Hint: none of them are facing primary challenges because none of them are running next year.

So yes, this dramatically increases the odds that the House would respond if Trump does something aggregious.

Given the odds were approximately 0% yesterday, it's an increase of significance.

Perhaps they are not seeking election because they don’t have the support? Have you thought about that? That’s a positive thing for Trump. Ryan and McConnell need to be removed.

I think we will see the people backing up Trump and getting upset over the constant garbage the left and certain members of the right are giving. Ryan is smart to back out because the numbers show the support for Trump.

[Androidpk]

this gonna be good

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/video/paul-ryan-running-election-54389284

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NegativeWelloffFunnelweaverspider-size_restricted.gif

[cwolff]

Perhaps they are not seeking election because they don’t have the support? Have you thought about that? That’s a positive thing for Trump. Ryan and McConnell need to be removed.

I think we will see the people backing up Trump and getting upset over the constant garbage the left and certain members of the right are giving. Ryan is smart to back out because the numbers show the support for Trump.

Among GOP voters but not the public. Also Ryan and McConnell should,be good with their trump bona fides. They tried health insurance, and they got their tax cuts

[Androidpk]

Perhaps they are not seeking election because they don’t have the support? Have you thought about that? That’s a positive thing for Trump. Ryan and McConnell need to be removed.

I think we will see the people backing up Trump and getting upset over the constant garbage the left and certain members of the right are giving. Ryan is smart to back out because the numbers show the support for Trump.

Ryan's numbers aren't hurting and he's definitely not lacking financial support. This is just another rat abandoning the Trump ship.

[Fortybox]

Among GOP voters but not the public. Also Ryan and McConnell should,be good with their trump bona fides. They tried health insurance, and they got their tax cuts

Trump won because he had the support from areas of the country where GOP support was thought to not be represented. Ryan is not seeking re-election because the support for him is not there.

Do you realize that all this anti Trump garbage has a serious opportunity of blowing back on the left? The rights that were violated by doing the raid on Cohen may be the very thing that makes the people fed up with the dirty tactics of the left.

I think Ryan sees that and realizes he doesn’t have or will have the power he seeks, so he is bowing out.

[Fortybox]

Ryan's numbers aren't hurting and he's definitely not lacking financial support. This is just another rat abandoning the Trump ship.

I have 937262 PhDs in this...”sweetie.” So I’m super smart, play Gemstone and never post 3 times in a row. I’m so smart you can smell it through the internet.

If his numbers are up and he had the financial backing he’d still be in the game. He doesn’t and so he’s leaving. It’s a losing battle for him. He chose the wrong side and lost.

[time4fun]

Interesting thread about Trump and Mueller.

https://twitter.com/EricColumbus/status/984101415374254080

Yeah this analysis is exactly what I'm afraid is going to happen. And Benczkowski was absolutely nominated for a reason. The good news is he hasn't yet been confirmed, and it looks like McConnell has put Judicial confirmations ahead of the rest.

Trump would likely lose a vacancies act case based on corrupt intent, but the Courts have already shown reticence when it comes to granting preliminary injunctions in these cases (ala consumer affairs bureau). I'm not sure if they would be willing to grant one here given the scant existing case law, and that leaves a lot of time/room to do long-lasting damage to the investigation.

The only hope here is that the fact that Rosenstein just signed off on a warrant to raid Trump's lawyer's office/home makes it easier to present this as retaliation. Otherwise, the average Us household doesn't know who he is or why he matters, and they're just not going to get as up in arms about it.

[cwolff]

Trump won because he had the support from areas of the country where GOP support was thought to not be represented. Ryan is not seeking re-election because the support for him is not there.

Do you realize that all this anti Trump garbage has a serious opportunity of blowing back on the left? The rights that were violated by doing the raid on Cohen may be the very thing that makes the people fed up with the dirty tactics of the left.

I think Ryan sees that and realizes he doesn’t have or will have the power he seeks, so he is bowing out.

Theyre going,by the book on this investigation. No rights were harmed in the making of this case. That's conspiracy theory stuff

[Androidpk]

If his numbers are up and he had the financial backing he’d still be in the game. He doesn’t and so he’s leaving. It’s a losing battle for him. He chose the wrong side and lost.

He has like a 20 point lead over his opponent and the Koch brothers shower him with money. Try again though!

[Fortybox]

Theyre going,by the book on this investigation. No rights were harmed in the making of this case. That's conspiracy theory stuff

No they are not. You’re so blind and wanting Trump out that you’re willing to throw the 4th, 5th and 6th amendments out the door to do so.

If this happened to Hillary you’d have an epic fit. Time4fun would disassociate with reality, officially change her name to Vishra, buy blunt objects from a pawnshop, and go on a murderous rampage in downtown San Francisco thinking she was in OTF.

[Fortybox]

He has like a 20 point lead over his opponent and the Koch brothers shower him with money. Try again though!

It doesn’t matter if you don’t have clout.

[Androidpk]

It doesn’t matter if you don’t have clout.

You're trying too hard to come across as stupid.

[Androidpk]

No they are not. You’re so blind and wanting Trump out that you’re willing to throw the 4th, 5th and 6th amendments out the door to do so.

If this happened to Hillary you’d have an epic fit. Time4fun would disassociate with reality, officially change her name to Vishra, buy blunt objects from a pawnshop, and go on a murderous rampage in downtown San Francisco thinking she was in OTF.

This is wrathbringer level stupidity. So much fail from you conservative trolls.

[cwolff]

No they are not. You’re so blind and wanting Trump out that you’re willing to throw the 4th, 5th and 6th amendments out the door to do so.

If this happened to Hillary you’d have an epic fit. Time4fun would disassociate with reality, officially change her name to Vishra, buy blunt objects from a pawnshop, and go on a murderous rampage in downtown San Francisco thinking she was in OTF.

Its happened to Hillary. For 25 years they've been trying to nail her to the wall.

There may be a court case about the procedures, and maybe trump wins. I dont think so, but its possible. He has to follow the rules like everyone else. For him the rules are special because hes president, but he still must follow them.

And this isn't "happening" to him. He brought it on and dont you recall all the republicans being so Happy Mueller was appointed? That was less than a year ago and mueller got a conviction within two months.

[Androidpk]

Fox News used to kiss Mueller's ass and shower him with praise. War hero! Integrity! Character!

[Fortybox]

You're trying to hard to come across as stupid.

*too

[cwolff]

Fox News used to kiss Mueller's ass and shower him with praise. War hero! Integrity! Character!

They all did. Wasn't trump interviewing him just a year ago?

[Androidpk]

They all did. Wasn't trump interviewing him just a year ago?

I believe so, for FBI Director.

[time4fun]

Mueller protection Bill is advancing in the Senate: (https://www.politico.com/story/2018/04/11/senate-bill-protect-mueller-514494)


Grassley is seeking agreement from his committee's ranking Democrat, Sen. Dianne Feinstein of California, to add the combined Mueller legislation to the panel's agenda for a Thursday markup, according to a source briefed on his plans. Since Judiciary rules allow items to get held over by one week, that move would likely tee up the bill for a markup next week.

Grassley who declared Tuesday that a Mueller firing would amount to "suicide" by Trump, still has constitutional concerns about the special counsel protection legislation. But after pushing proponents of the special counsel bill to develop the compromise proposal, Grassley has decided to put the legislation before the committee.

The Iowan may introduce an amendment intended to strengthen the bill by adding additional reporting requirements, a provision that he hopes would survive any future constitutional challenge, the source told POLITICO.

This would have been more useful a few months ago. Unfortunately, it's highly unlikely at this point that Trump will go for Mueller directly. He's going to go for Rosenstein, and this Bill likely won't do anything for that.

Re: Constitutional concerns- though Congress has long-ceded the ability to fire appointees to the President- technically it's not actually outlined in the Constitution as such. There's probably extensive case law on this, and I'm curious as to whether the Courts have determined it's the sole right of the Executive to fire, or if it has been positioned as simply a right.

If it's the latter, there's a potential argument here that because the right to hire/appoint is a joint venture between the President and Congress (with Congress acting as a check in that process), the right to fire could likewise be construed as such. The Courts have long recognized that with the greater comes the lesser- that is to say that if the Constitution grants you a greater right- it is implied that you also have all lesser rights. Under that doctrine, if Congress has the right to stop an appointment- that could be construed to include the "lesser" right to stop a firing as well.

All purely speculative and way beyond my background in con law.

[Androidpk]

Better late than never.

[time4fun]

Better late than never.

If it doesn't protect Rosenstein- is it really any good?

Rosenstein is the easiest target right now- the most risk-free. It's also the one that allows him to do the most damage under the radar.

The one silver lining here, at least, is that with Ryan not running for re-election- he'll be far more likely to actually put this up to a vote. Every Dem will vote for it, and there will be enough Republicans in Clinton districts to vote for it and push it over majority without requiring any other GOP Reps to stick their necks out right before a primary.

I doubt Trump will veto it. Signing it would be a great way to provide cover for firing Rosenstein.

[Androidpk]

Firing Rosenstein would only add to the list of obstruction charges. I'm not particularly worried.

[cwolff]

Firing Rosenstein would only add to the list of obstruction charges. I'm not particularly worried.

Yes, because if/when he starts firing people like rosenstein he has to explain what they did wrong besides investigating him. Was Rosenstein late for work three times? Did he steal food from the company refrigerator in the break room? What reason is there to fire him except for attempting to obstruct justice

[Parkbandit]

Trump should just start pardoning people... watch the meltdown ensue.

[time4fun]

Yes, because if/when he starts firing people like rosenstein he has to explain what they did wrong besides investigating him. Was Rosenstein late for work three times? Did he steal food from the company refrigerator in the break room? What reason is there to fire him except for attempting to obstruct justice

Explain to whom?

If he puts someone in his place who is willing to do his bidding that person has a lot of power to suppress the investigation. There's a contingency in there that requires the AG or acting-AG to report any decisions to effectively overrule Mueller to the Majority and Minority members of both Congressional Judiciary Committees. But there are two sticking points here:

1) The report doesn't have to happen until after the investigation is completed (which is also something that can be delayed as long as it is politically expedient)

2) There's a provision in the statute that effectively allows an AG or acting-AG to put an indefinite hold on that disclosure.

Also Mueller is only allowed to give his final report to the AG/Acting AG- where it can easily be effectively quashed.

Technically Congressional subpoena power could compel the Executive Branch to submit all of Mueller's investigation files, but that won't happen unless the Democrats control at least one House of Congress. The minority party has no weight behind their requests because they have no power to enforce compliance.

Also, unfortunately, Trump could repeal the statute (or portions of it) at any time

[Ashliana]

Trump should just start pardoning people... watch the meltdown ensue.

It's funny how you didn't learn anything from the Nixon era, despite having personally lived through it. Oh well -- idiots live doomed to repeat their mistakes.

[Wrathbringer]

It's funny how you didn't learn anything from the Nixon era, despite having personally lived through it. Oh well -- idiots live doomed to repeat their mistakes.

says a gay. lol

[Androidpk]

It's funny how you didn't learn anything from the Nixon era, despite having personally lived through it. Oh well -- idiots live doomed to repeat their mistakes.

:lol:

[time4fun]

I would LOVE if Trump decided that his best route was to start issuing Pardons. (If his lawyers have even half a brain, they'll steer him away from that)

US v Nixon (both 418 US 683 and 487 US 654) had a lot to say about where the limits of Presidential power live:

418 US 683

Neither the doctrine of separation of powers nor the generalized need for confidentiality of high-level communications, without more, can sustain an absolute, unqualified Presidential privilege of immunity from judicial process under all circumstances.


"the twofold aim [of criminal justice] is that guilt shall not escape or innocence suffer.

SCOTUS plainly stated that a generalized assertion of need for a Presidential power loses against the specific needs of the criminal justice system (and also reaffirmed that no decision should ever be construed as placing the President completely above the law). So using them to interfere with the pursuit of justice is expressly unconstitutional. SCOTUS has also found- in several cases- that the President's authority meets its limits outside of their constitutional duty to "faithfully execute the law". Translation- actions taken by the President- even enumerated powers- are protected only in service to their duty, not in service to their own interests. There's another Executive Privilege case out there that I can't remember exactly that clearly states that the President can't invoke a power to avoid embarrassment because that has nothing to do with their Article II powers.

Translation: Those Pardons would be ruled invalid almost immediately

I looked over the following case again today- it had been a long time. There's a part of the decision I remembered from years ago, but I couldn't for the life of me remember where I had read it. And I finally found it!

487 US 654

Here, as in Accardi, it is theoretically possible for the Attorney General to amend or revoke the regulation defining the Special Prosecutor's authority. But he has not done so. So long as this regulation remains in force, the Executive Branch is bound by it, and indeed the United States, as the sovereign composed of the three branches, is bound to respect and to enforce it.

Translation- Trump literally cannot fire Mueller unless he first repeals the Special Prosecutor statute. (Which, unfortunately, he can totally do)

The more you know!

[Candor]

Translation- Trump literally cannot fire Mueller unless he first repeals the Special Prosecutor statute. (Which, unfortunately, he can totally do)

Well I have certainly been wrong before with my Trump predictions, but I don't think Trump is going to fire Mueller for the simple reason that it would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. But we'll see.

[time4fun]

Well I have certainly been wrong before with my Trump predictions, but I don't think Trump is going to fire Mueller for the simple reason that it would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. But we'll see.

If Trump believes he's innocent, then sure- it would be a stupid thing to do.

But if Trump believes he and his family are facing serious, inevitable criminal liability- then letting Mueller continue to work would be incredibly stupid.

Trump is both inherently selfish and lacking any regard for democratic norms or the integrity of our democratic system of law. So those don't factor into his calculus.

But candidly- he won't go for Mueller.

He'll go for Rosenstein or Sessions.

[Fortybox]

I would LOVE if Trump decided that his best route was to start issuing Pardons. (If his lawyers have even half a brain, they'll steer him away from that)

US v Nixon (both 418 US 683 and 487 US 654) had a lot to say about where the limits of Presidential power live:

418 US 683




SCOTUS plainly stated that a generalized assertion of need for a Presidential power loses against the specific needs of the criminal justice system (and also reaffirmed that no decision should ever be construed as placing the President completely above the law). So using them to interfere with the pursuit of justice is expressly unconstitutional. SCOTUS has also found- in several cases- that the President's authority meets its limits outside of their constitutional duty to "faithfully execute the law". Translation- actions taken by the President- even enumerated powers- are protected only in service to their duty, not in service to their own interests. There's another Executive Privilege case out there that I can't remember exactly that clearly states that the President can't invoke a power to avoid embarrassment because that has nothing to do with their Article II powers.

Translation: Those Pardons would be ruled invalid almost immediately

I looked over the following case again today- it had been a long time. There's a part of the decision I remembered from years ago, but I couldn't for the life of me remember where I had read it. And I finally found it!

487 US 654


Translation- Trump literally cannot fire Mueller unless he first repeals the Special Prosecutor statute. (Which, unfortunately, he can totally do)

The more you know!

https://media3.giphy.com/media/ha5EeXrfx3xxC/giphy.gif

[time4fun]

CNN Reporting tonight: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/11/politics/access-hollywood-trump-lawyer-communications/index.html)


FBI agents who raided the home, office and hotel of Donald Trump's personal lawyer sought communications that Trump had with attorney Michael Cohen and others regarding the infamous "Access Hollywood" tape that captured Trump making lewd remarks about women a month before the election, according to sources familiar with the matter.

The warrant's specific reference to Trump is the first known direct mention of the President in a search warrant, and sources said it appeared in connection with "Access Hollywood."

The search warrant also sought communications between then-candidate Trump and his associates regarding efforts to prevent disclosure of the tape, according to one of the sources. In addition, investigators wanted records and communications concerning other potential negative information about the candidate that the campaign would have wanted to contain ahead of the election.

The source said the warrant was not specific about what this additional information would be.

The warrant is the first indication that investigators suspect there was any effort to suppress the tape. It is not clear Cohen played any role in the Access Hollywood controversy.
Another source familiar with the matter confirmed to CNN that agents sought information regarding the Access Hollywood tape, as The New York Times first reported.

So it would appear that the taint team isn't going to be removing any communications between Trump and Cohen- they're going to be turning them over to the Public Corruption unit directly.

[Androidpk]

Well I have certainly been wrong before with my Trump predictions, but I don't think Trump is going to fire Mueller for the simple reason that it would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. But we'll see.

Why would it be stupid? What do you think the consequences would be?

[time4fun]

Why would it be stupid? What do you think the consequences would be?

Because it would be a flashpoint for most of the country, and it wouldn't actually make the investigation go away.

But targeting Rosenstein or Sessions would be a more ambiguous evil in peoples' eyes, and it would actually give him a chance to stop the investigation.

[cwolff]

Well I have certainly been wrong before with my Trump predictions, but I don't think Trump is going to fire Mueller for the simple reason that it would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. But we'll see.

Its stupid but I don't think he's ruled by his intellect. He'll get all fired up watching TV and drop a tweet. So far his advisors have kept him from dling it though

CNN Reporting tonight: (https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/11/politics/access-hollywood-trump-lawyer-communications/index.html)



So it would appear that the taint team isn't going to be removing any communications between Trump and Cohen- they're going to be turning them over to the Public Corruption unit directly.

That doesn't sound good,

[Androidpk]

Because it would be a flashpoint for most of the country, and it wouldn't actually make the investigation go away.

But targeting Rosenstein or Sessions would be a more ambiguous evil in peoples' eyes, and it would actually give him a chance to stop the investigation.

I already know why you think it would be stupid. I'm curious as to what a conservative thinks.

[time4fun]

I already know why you think it would be stupid. I'm curious as to what a conservative thinks.

hahaha fair enough.

[time4fun]

So I don't want- in any way- to have the following questions interpreted as me arguing this we're actually going to end up crossing this bridge, but:

There are two questions we've danced around for over a year now-

Can a sitting President be indicted?

If so, can Mueller indict a sitting President? (separate but related questions)

[Neveragain]

FBI agents who raided the home, office and hotel of Donald Trump's personal lawyer sought communications that Trump had with attorney Michael Cohen and others regarding the infamous "Access Hollywood" tape that captured Trump making lewd remarks about women a month before the election.

The FBI better have better reasons than this to raid a lawyers office, we're not even mentioning at the Presidential level. If this is all they got "Trump said bad things", the FBI is in deep shit.

[Fortybox]

So I don't want- in any way- to have the following questions interpreted as me arguing this we're actually going to end up crossing this bridge, but:

There are two questions we've danced around for over a year now-

Can a sitting President be indicted?

If so, can Mueller indict a sitting President? (separate but related questions)

https://media2.giphy.com/media/l4FGuhL4U2WyjdkaY/giphy.gif

[Parkbandit]

So.. are we didn't find any evidence of collusion and now turning the investigation on Trump's sex romps prior to being elected?

[Fortybox]

The FBI better have better reasons than this to raid a lawyers office, we're not even mentioning at the Presidential level. If this is all they got "Trump said bad things", the FBI is in deep shit.

They don't. That's the problem. It shows how much overreach this whole investigation is and how the left will literally dismantle the constitution to to get what they want.

[Fortybox]

So.. are we didn't find any evidence of collusion and now turning the investigation on Trump's sex romps prior to being elected?

Maybe they found evidence that Trump cheated at marbles in grade school.

[Fortybox]

3 posts because I am so angry.

[Neveragain]

So.. are we didn't find any evidence of collusion and now turning the investigation on Trump's sex romps prior to being elected?

I had no idea Donald J. Trump had sex with so many hot women, said nobody ever.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/tMPSeKEplOfK0/giphy.gif

[cwolff]

The FBI better have better reasons than this to raid a lawyers office, we're not even mentioning at the Presidential level. If this is all they got "Trump said bad things", the FBI is in deep shit.


They don't. That's the problem. It shows how much overreach this whole investigation is and how the left will literally dismantle the constitution to to get what they want.

In order for you to believe this you have to expand your conspiracy theory. That's the effect of cognitive dissonance. Or perhaps a symptom of it.

[Wrathbringer]

So.. are we didn't find any evidence of collusion and now turning the investigation on Trump's sex romps prior to being elected?

This is correct.

[Fortybox]

In order for you to believe this you have to expand your conspiracy theory. That's the effect of cognitive dissonance. Or perhaps a symptom of it.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/l4FGuhL4U2WyjdkaY/giphy.gif

[Latrinsorm]

I realize I'm going against my own imposed rule of not feeding the creepy little troll, but oh well.

I brought up Warriorbird as someone who constantly played the victim card. I don't recall Harmnone doing that.

Sorry you didn't understand it. Well, I'm not surprised.. and not really sorry. I guess I'm just saying fuck off in a polite way.

Back to not feeding the creepy little troll.Whoosh.

[Neveragain]

They don't. That's the problem. It shows how much overreach this whole investigation is and how the left will literally dismantle the constitution to to get what they want.

This is gestapo level shit if that's the case.

How anyone can support the Democrats at this point is beyond me.

[cwolff]

This is gestapo level shit if that's the case.

How anyone can support the Democrats at this point is beyond me.

See what I mean. You're proving my point. The theory keeps getting deeper. Its the only way you guys can avoid the pain or recognizing out loud your errors. Gestapo level deep state stuff? Come on.

[time4fun]

This is correct.

Except for the part where there is literally no evidence supporting that statement

[Neveragain]

See what I mean. You're proving my point. The theory keeps getting deeper. Its the only way you guys can avoid the pain or recognizing out loud your errors. Gestapo level deep state stuff? Come on.

If the FBI is raiding the presidents lawyers office because the president said naughty things, we have bigger issues than Trump.

[time4fun]

This is gestapo level shit if that's the case.

How anyone can support the Democrats at this point is beyond me.

At some point in time- you're going to have to come live on planet Earth and deal with actual facts and the reality of the world.

For example- can you please explain to us which Democrats made the raid happen?

[Neveragain]

Except for the part where there is literally no evidence supporting that statement

When has this ever stopped you?

[cwolff]

If the FBI is raiding the presidents lawyers office because the president said naughty things, we have bigger issues than Trump.

I've not seen this reported. Maybe it's a fox thing. That's why they raided his office? Because trump said bad things? Is that what you're saying?

[cwolff]

The Senate Judiciary Committee is poised to move forward with legislation to protect special counsel Robert Mueller, a significant shift that comes amid growing pressure from Democrats.
Some Republicans sought to hit the brakes on the bill, but the decision from committee Chairman Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) shows there is a growing appetite among some in the GOP for a legislative response to President Trump’s apparent willingness to fire the man leading the Justice Department’s investigation into Russia's election meddling.

Is Grassley a brown shirt? Is he a libtard? How does he fit into the deep state conspiracy theory thing? All the people going after trump are conservatives and he hired half of them. It is impossible to say there's nothing there at this point. And...if there is? Then double fuck trump for putting us through this. He could just have not fired Comey if there was nothing to this Russia thing and none of this would happen.

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/382781-in-major-shift-gop-controlled-panel-moves-to-protect-mueller

[Neveragain]

At some point in time- you're going to have to come live on planet Earth and deal with actual facts and the reality of the world.

For example- can you please explain to us which Democrats made the raid happen?

The same ones that stole billions from tax payers to bail out the too big to fail and then forced us to purchase a product for simply existing. Those Democrats.

[Fortybox]

Except for the part where there is literally no evidence supporting that statement

There is no evidence of Russian collusion.

[Fortybox]

I've not seen this reported. Maybe it's a fox thing. That's why they raided his office? Because trump said bad things? Is that what you're saying?

lrn2read

Here, let me help you:

Here you go. (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/04/11/michael-cohen-raid-sought-access-hollywood-tape-records.html)

[cwolff]

There is no evidence of Russian collusion.

of course there is. Don Jr, Manafort and Kushner met with an agent of the Russian government to get dirt on Hillary.

THAT is collusion

[Fortybox]

The same ones that stole billions from tax payers to bail out the too big to fail and then forced us to purchase a product for simply existing. Those Democrats.

This is correct.

[Neveragain]

Is Grassley a brown shirt? Is he a libtard? How does he fit into the deep state conspiracy theory thing? All the people going after trump are conservatives and he hired half of them. It is impossible to say there's nothing there at this point. And...if there is? Then double fuck trump for putting us through this. He could just have not fired Comey if there was nothing to this Russia thing and none of this would happen.

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/382781-in-major-shift-gop-controlled-panel-moves-to-protect-mueller

This Grassley?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_W5oEmkz9Y

[time4fun]

The same ones that stole billions from tax payers to bail out the too big to fail and then forced us to purchase a product for simply existing. Those Democrats.

Abjectly false. Nothing in that sentence was accurate.

I will repeat: which Democrats made that raid happen? Which Democrats are currently leading Federal investigations into Trump?

Be specific.

[cwolff]

lrn2read

Here, let me help you:

Here you go. (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/04/11/michael-cohen-raid-sought-access-hollywood-tape-records.html)

OH ya. I've seen that. You all missed the point.


The search Monday was aimed at obtaining evidence that Michael Cohen attempted to suppress harmful material about Trump ahead of the 2016 presidential election, multiple people briefed on the warrant reportedly claimed.

[Fortybox]

of course there is. Don Jr, Manafort and Kushner met with an agent of the Russian government to get dirt on Hillary.

THAT is collusion

There is no evidence that the President of the United States colluded with the Russians. The whole investigation is based on a false premise.

If I decide to investigate how retarded you are and then found out through my investigation that time4fun is...does that make you retarded?