Thread for things that blew your mind today.

[Warriorbird]

Not debating the rest of this... but they busted a number of 14 year olds with fake ids at the school I teach at this year.

[Taernath]

But that's why statutory/consent laws exist the way they do, there is no need to prove any of that happened.

Are you referring to Michigan laws specifically? Because that's not a universal standard.

[Androidpk]

Not debating the rest of this... but they busted a number of 14 year olds with fake ids at the school I teach at this year.

Easier than ever these days with the existing technology.

[Taernath]

There's a reason To Catch a Predator was always very clear about their actors being underage. How stupid would it have been for them to have someone pretending to be a 17/18 year old only for Chris Hansen to sit the guy down and say 'Well it turns out she lied about her age and she's really 14, now you're a sex offender. Ha! Gottem!"

[Tgo01]

Are you referring to Michigan laws specifically? Because that's not a universal standard.

Prisoners losing their ability to consent to sex might not be universal, but I'm pretty sure it exists in most states and federal prisons.

That is how age statutory rape laws work though. I'm not aware of any state where ignorance of the person's age is a valid defense, even if the minor lied about their age. There might be extenuating circumstances (such as the bar/fake ID thing) where the judge might impose a lighter sentence, but to my knowledge not knowing the victim's real age is not a legal defense in the sense that the defendant can walk away from the crime altogether.

This is another part of protecting vulnerable members of our society because if not knowing the real age was a valid defense then men/women would just never ask the age of anyone. "Hey that chick looks pretty young, I'm gonna play it safe and never find out her age."

[Tgo01]

There's a reason To Catch a Predator was always very clear about their actors being underage. How stupid would it have been for them to have someone pretending to be a 17/18 year old only for Chris Hansen to sit the guy down and say 'Well it turns out she lied about her age and she's really 14, now you're a sex offender. Ha! Gottem!"

To Catch a Predator isn't a good analogy in this situation because the people on the show never engaged in sex with anyone (you know what I mean.)

There is nothing at all illegal to agree to meet up with someone who says they are 18 with the intent to have sex with them. Nothing illegal has happened yet. If the man shows up at the girl's house and she looks 12 then the man has to start thinking with his big head and say "What the fuck? Bye."

The reason To Catch a Predator is different is because those men are agreeing to meet what they think are underage boys/girls with the intent to have sex with them. That is a whole different story.

[Androidpk]

There's a reason To Catch a Predator was always very clear about their actors being underage. How stupid would it have been for them to have someone pretending to be a 17/18 year old only for Chris Hansen to sit the guy down and say 'Well it turns out she lied about her age and she's really 14, now you're a sex offender. Ha! Gottem!"

Sprinkle some crack on the new sex offender and call it a day, Joe!

[Taernath]

Prisoners losing their ability to consent to sex might not be universal, but I'm pretty sure it exists in most states and federal prisons.

That is how age statutory rape laws work though. I'm not aware of any state where ignorance of the person's age is a valid defense, even if the minor lied about their age. There might be extenuating circumstances (such as the bar/fake ID thing) where the judge might impose a lighter sentence, but to my knowledge not knowing the victim's real age is not a legal defense in the sense that the defendant can walk away from the crime altogether.

There are actually several states where ignorance or claiming deception is a valid defense. I don't know if Michigan is one which is why I asked (and I don't care enough to look it up on my own). People have 'walked' or had their convictions overturned because of it.

This is another part of protecting vulnerable members of our society because if not knowing the real age was a valid defense then men/women would just never ask the age of anyone. "Hey that chick looks pretty young, I'm gonna play it safe and never find out her age."

I guess it just seems like in order to fully protect yourself from someone lying about their age you're going to need some kind of CAC reader and signed affidavits from the individual's parents.

[Tgo01]

There are actually several states where ignorance or claiming deception is a valid defense. I don't know if Michigan is one which is why I asked (and I don't care enough to look it up on my own). People have 'walked' or had their convictions overturned because of it.

I looked it up and there are some states that allow ignorance of age but only in limited circumstances. The states that allow this as a defense have a minimum age they allow this defense for, like if the girl is under 13 then no matter what the man can't use ignorance of age as a defense. Also the defendant has to prove he was deceived or had reason to believe she wasn't under age. He's probably not going to convince a jury that he honestly thought a very obviously 13 year old looking girl was really 23. Likewise if people told him the girl's real age, or he went around telling everyone about his hot 13 year old girlfriend, then he can't very well say "Well she lied about her age so I'm in the clear."

It is a defense in a few states, but it's still not as simple as just saying "But I really thought she was 18."

I guess it just seems like in order to fully protect yourself from someone lying about their age you're going to need some kind of CAC reader and signed affidavits from the individual's parents.

There are other ways.

True. If you meet someone then want to have sex with them 30 minutes later then you're probably screwed, but I suppose those are the risks you take when you want to jump in the sack with someone that soon after meeting them.

[Candor]

If you meet someone then want to have sex with them 30 minutes later then you're probably screwed, but I suppose those are the risks you take when you want to jump in the sack with someone that soon after meeting them.

Not to mention the STD risk. Condoms significantly reduce this risk, but they are not 100% protection.