FBI raid on Trump's home

[ClydeR]

It's not even the presidential records act. It's the espionage act that hes under investigation for.

It's entirely possible that Trump is not the target of the investigation. The warrant said it was issued based on probable cause to believe the Espionage Act, among other laws, had been violated. It did not say who violated those laws.

Trump's negligent, and probably illegal, storage of top secret documents in his office and in a hotel pool closet may have presented an opportunity for some other person, acting as an agent of a foreign government, to gain access to the documents. I'm sure you remember that there was reportedly an attempt by a foreign government to infiltrate Mar-a-Lago while Trump was still President. You also surely remember that Trump has a history of closely associating, perhaps without his knowledge, with people who were secretly unregistered agents of foreign governments. Three examples.. 1, 2, 3.

We may find out in a few months that the government is prosecuting someone we've never heard of for copying national secrets at Mar-a-Lago, without Trump's permission or knowledge.

[time4fun]

It's entirely possible that Trump is not the target of the investigation. The warrant said it was issued based on probable cause to believe the Espionage Act, among other laws, had been violated. It did not say who violated those laws.

Trump's negligent, and probably illegal, storage of top secret documents in his office and in a hotel pool closet may have presented an opportunity for some other person, acting as an agent of a foreign government, to gain access to the documents. I'm sure you remember that there was reportedly an attempt by a foreign government to infiltrate Mar-a-Lago while Trump was still President. You also surely remember that Trump has a history of closely associating, perhaps without his knowledge, with people who were secretly unregistered agents of foreign governments. Three examples.. 1, 2, 3.

We may find out in a few months that the government is prosecuting someone we've never heard of for copying national secrets at Mar-a-Lago, without Trump's permission or knowledge.

It was widely reported back in April/May that DoJ had opened a criminal investigation into Trump's mishandling of classified documents after a request from NARA.

It's also worth noting that there's a lot more going on here than just his post-Presidential actions. It's already been widely established that Trump routinely destroyed official Presidential documents during his time in office. That's presumably why they included statutes related to destroying Federal records on the warrant- it's a violation of Federal law for ANYONE to do it. In fact the Presidential Records Act was created specifically to make it illegal for sitting Presidents (and their Administration of course) to do exactly that.

So it's HIGHLY improbable that Trump isn't the target of the investigation here. Bordering on impossible.

[Tgo01]

Tgo saying they were "barely able to see it" is the equivalent of saying they weren't given the warrant.

Nice backpedaling.

[Tgo01]

Trump's lawyers put out a statement:

"Trump had a standing order that documents removed from the Oval Office taken to the residence were deemed to be declassified the moment he removed them."

So uh....if that's the case then it looks like this is all once again complete bullshit.

If Trump has the power to declassify anything he wants, and he indeed had a standing order that anything he removed from the Oval Office and taken to his home were to be declassified the moment he removed them, then there is literally no story here.

All we are left with now is Democrats trying to argue that either Trump doesn't have the power to declassify documents (he does), or that he never issued this order.

[Seran]

Nice that something that was never known by anyone but the former President happened a year and a half ago. Too bad it's meaningless since he is making it all up and never bothered to follow the actual declassification process. He'll have a lot to think about in prison.

[Gelston]

Nice that something that was never known by anyone but the former President happened a year and a half ago. Too bad it's meaningless since he is making it all up and never bothered to follow the actual declassification process. He'll have a lot to think about in prison.

He isn’t going to go to prison.

[Parkbandit]

Nice that something that was never known by anyone but the former President happened a year and a half ago. Too bad it's meaningless since he is making it all up and never bothered to follow the actual declassification process. He'll have a lot to think about in prison.

He's making it up because you didn't know about it?

Is he also making up numbers past 11?

[time4fun]

Trump's lawyers put out a statement:

"Trump had a standing order that documents removed from the Oval Office taken to the residence were deemed to be declassified the moment he removed them."

So uh....if that's the case then it looks like this is all once again complete bullshit.

If Trump has the power to declassify anything he wants, and he indeed had a standing order that anything he removed from the Oval Office and taken to his home were to be declassified the moment he removed them, then there is literally no story here.

All we are left with now is Democrats trying to argue that either Trump doesn't have the power to declassify documents (he does), or that he never issued this order.

Tgo, first you've completely careened in an entirely different direction. And I can't help but wonder if it's because you actually can't bring yourself to face the fact that you're instinctively choosing to believe an obvious lie from someone who has been lying through his teeth about this whole thing.

Secondly, they need to produce evidence of this magic "standing order" to declassify. Particularly since they never once mentioned this magical "standing order" when dealing with NARA and the DoJ. Remember that this has been going on for 15 months, and inspectors have had to remove classified documents from his home on several occasions at this point. Why would Trump wait until *now* to mention this magical "standing order"? Take a step back and look at this objectively. He has been lying through his teeth this whole time- so you should approach new "I'm innocent!" claims with a some healthy skepticism.

Third, the Biden Administration very clearly considers those files to be classified right now. The second Trump left office, he had zero authority to decide what is and isn't classified. If the Biden Administration has been telling him that the files he has are STILL classified, then Trump has been very literally sitting on classified material that he chose to keep from the Federal government. (Seriously- have you not bothered to even wonder why he keeps refusing to return documents marked as Top Secret/ISC?)

And finally Tgo, as has been pointed out NUMEROUS times already in this thread, the Statutes listed on the warrant don't specifically pertain to classified information. They were written long before our current system of classification. So it doesn't actually matter if they were classified or not. It matters that he had information that was literally marked as potentially causing grave harm to our national defense and refused to turn it over. And it matters that these were the property of the Federal government, and *no one* has the right to conceal or otherwise refuse to turn over Federal records of any kind.

Again- stop and think. Just because you're choosing to completely ignore all of this context to double down on statements that are almost assuredly false (and irrelevant) doesn't mean they don't matter.

[time4fun]

He isn’t going to go to prison.

The logistics of this alone would be impossible.

The worst thing that could happen to him is house arrest and being barred from running for Federal office

[Shaps]

Tgo saying they were "barely able to see it" is the equivalent of saying they weren't given the warrant. Because if they had been given the warrant, it would be impossible to say they didn't have time to see it. And Trump's lawyer had a full statement about the contents of the warrant based on a copy in their possession literally the next day.

And yes Tgo, you're right that it's theoretically possible the FBI planted evidence. But the fact that the entire thing was being watched by Trump and his family on CCTV makes it VERY unlikely. I'll also point out that Trump lied about this too, claiming that the FBI allowed NO witnesses while also hinting that there was somehow something unusual about his lawyer not being allowed to watch the raid. (There isn't)

And PS Christopher Wray, head of the FBI, is a Trump appointee.

You are falling into the same loop that I called you out on to begin with Tgo. You're not paying attention to the multitude of lies Trump has been spitting out in rapid fire since this happened. And you're also blatantly ignoring the fact that Trump hasn't presented a single bit of evidence that anything was planted. One might expect him to say something like "We went through those records thoroughly, and I can attest that there was no TS/ISC or other classified information in there when we searched". Instead he's going with a vague hypothetical. "They COULD HAVE planted evidence!" He loves to do that.

And my whole point here is that you have completely excised any and all common sense you have in this situation. You KNOW better.

1. If you don't get the sarcasm with the "treason" comment - that's on you.

2. You've been hiding away, quietly stalking this section of the forum - waiting for something you "think" is the end of Donald T. - and now you're posting all over as if you are some glorified Miss Cleo. You're going to be very upset when this disappoints you, as all the other times you've claimed "this is the time!" they get Donald T.

3. You are full of shit. I know exactly what's going on, how materials are supposed to be handled, and every other aspect of how such material is processed. Clinton with a "private server" was much more of a security breach, hazard, and willfully negligent than anything Trump has been accused of so far.

4. Planting evidence? You mean like the Russian Dossier? Or the doctored evidence to get FISA warrants to spy on a Presidential team? I could go on, but you get the picture - and if your dumbass came up out of your gopher hole and that's the best you've got? Just head on back.

5. It's not on him to present anything. The FBI and DOJ has also not "presented a single bit of evidence" with regards to the crazy allegations going on currently. But you believe them? You really think the FBI, DOJ, and Government Agencies would allow Trump to keep "nuclear codes OMG OMG OMG he's evil!!!" for over 18 months... and just now go get them? It's called - election time coming up, and they will do any and everything to distract, deter, and defeat. Imagine a political party just baselessly accusing someone of something, then telling them to prove they're not... you racist!

6. Literally every news story about this so far... is conjecture. They get dipshits like you all hyped up, then disappoint you like Daddy not coming home from picking up that pack of smokes. Read them - every single one uses "possible", "probable", "likely", "could contain", "suspects", "potentially", etc....

But... you're a pseudo intellectual that finally came out of their hole after nearly a year - because this time, is really the time, that they're going to get that Big, Bad, Orange Man that lives rent free in your head. It's like a Jordan Peele movie in your head.