Obama's Manhood Problem

[ClydeR]

David Brooks said on Sunday's Meet the Press that Obama has a manhood problem.


DAVID BROOKS:

And, let's face it, Obama, whether deservedly or not, does have a (I'll say it crudely) but a manhood problem in the Middle East: Is he tough enough to stand up to somebody like Assad, somebody like Putin? I think a lot of the rap is unfair. But certainly in the Middle East, there's an assumption he's not tough--

More... (http://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/meet-press-transcript-April-20-2014-n85161)

[Wrathbringer]

David Brooks said on Sunday's Meet the Press that Obama has a manhood problem.

He's a woman, no question about that, but going to war isn't going to fix it.

[Parkbandit]

http://photos.upi.com/story/t/4974dcc3344c151a90780ecbf5f0195b/Obama-to-throw-Nats-first-pitch.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_DawJTCHuL3c/THlqRtVQ1nI/AAAAAAAAG6g/5DkmP1OzPDw/girlyman_thumb13.jpg?imgmax=800

http://tomatobubble.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/Newsweek-Obama-Gay-President.jpg.w300h410.jpg

[kutter]

I do not think this is much of a surprise to anyone, a kinder, gentler, warmer, fuzzier president is what a lot people want, someone they can like, never mind that he cannot lead, they want to think he is a nice guy. The issue with that is that the job of the president is not to be a nice guy and the job of the President of the United States is to be the leader of the free world. All that lead from behind crap is such complete horseshit. Let your actions speak so loudly no one can hear your words.

[Atlanteax]

I do not think this is much of a surprise to anyone, a kinder, gentler, warmer, fuzzier president is what a lot people want, someone they can like, never mind that he cannot lead, they want to think he is a nice guy. The issue with that is that the job of the president is not to be a nice guy and the job of the President of the United States is to be the leader of the free world. All that lead from behind crap is such complete horseshit. Let your actions speak so loudly no one can hear your words.

Leading from behind via absenteeism has always been his MO in government positions.

[Methais]

http://photos.upi.com/story/t/4974dcc3344c151a90780ecbf5f0195b/Obama-to-throw-Nats-first-pitch.jpg

https://slanchreport.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/obama_pitch_fox_fringe_fail.gif?w=655

http://www.bryanallain.com/images/bushthrow2.jpg

[Ashliana]

Ah, the right's selective Romnesia rears its head again.

Obama didn't start World War 3 over Russia invading Ukraine? He's so weak!
George W. Bush not starting World War 3 when Russia invaded Georgia?

"Because Georgia is not part of NATO, there's really no danger the United States or Europe will get in involved in what is really a civil war almost between--within this small part of Georgia."
-Fox News' Charles Krauthammer

Benghazi (nonsensical conspiracy theories aside)--four Americans die, with little US response? An outrage! Obama's so weak! His foreign policy's failing!
Beirut--250 American soldiers killed by truck bombs set by extremist jihadis under Reagan's term? Our response? A full withdrawal of US and international forces. Reagan remain a conservative deity.

[cwolff]

Ah, the right's selective Romnesia rears its head again.

Obama didn't start World War 3 over Russia invading Ukraine? He's so weak!
George W. Bush not starting World War 3 when Russia invaded Georgia?

"Because Georgia is not part of NATO, there's really no danger the United States or Europe will get in involved in what is really a civil war almost between--within this small part of Georgia."
-Fox News' Charles Krauthammer

Benghazi (nonsensical conspiracy theories aside)--four Americans die, with little US response? An outrage! Obama's so weak! His foreign policy's failing!
Beirut--250 American soldiers killed by truck bombs set by extremist jihadis under Reagan's term? Our response? A full withdrawal of US and international forces. Reagan remain a conservative deity.

Good points Ash.

These guys don't have a leg to stand on in this argument. It's gotten so bad they have to attack the guy based on his blue jeans. As an observer, it is fascinating to see how propaganda operates in real time.

[Atlanteax]

These guys don't have a leg to stand on in this argument. It's gotten so bad they have to attack the guy based on his blue jeans. As an observer, it is fascinating to see how propaganda operates in real time.

Yes, you see it all the time about Obamacare/ACA "helping" change people's lives.

[cwolff]

Yes, you see it all the time about Obamacare/ACA "helping" change people's lives.

ACA has undoubtedly helped people even in face of all that FOX news right wing government shutdown hysterical propaganda. So ya, that's a good example.

[AnticorRifling]

Ah, the right's selective Romnesia rears its head again.

Obama didn't start World War 3 over Russia invading Ukraine? He's so weak!
George W. Bush not starting World War 3 when Russia invaded Georgia?

"Because Georgia is not part of NATO, there's really no danger the United States or Europe will get in involved in what is really a civil war almost between--within this small part of Georgia."
-Fox News' Charles Krauthammer

Benghazi (nonsensical conspiracy theories aside)--four Americans die, with little US response? An outrage! Obama's so weak! His foreign policy's failing!
Beirut--250 American soldiers killed by truck bombs set by extremist jihadis under Reagan's term? Our response? A full withdrawal of US and international forces. Reagan remain a conservative deity.

16inchers and the inram wasn't part of the response at all.

Also wouldn't it be better to compare the embassy bombing instead of the Marine Corps barracks bombing?

As much as you like to point out their love for Bush or the right or whoever you hate you certainly ignore, or at the very least pass it off as acceptable, your love for Obama.

[Methais]

Good points Ash.

These guys don't have a leg to stand on in this argument. It's gotten so bad they have to attack the guy based on his blue jeans. As an observer, it is fascinating to see how propaganda operates in real time.

You really think the baseball pics are about his pants?

[cwolff]

You really think the baseball pics are about his pants?

It's just about a whole lot of bullshit. I'm finding the right is lacking in substance. They have shit for policies, no health care ideas, they just have nothing positive going on for the American people. That's why you guys are talking about manhood and mom jeans. It's intellectually bankrupt.

[kutter]

Ah, the right's selective Romnesia rears its head again.

Obama didn't start World War 3 over Russia invading Ukraine? He's so weak!
George W. Bush not starting World War 3 when Russia invaded Georgia?

"Because Georgia is not part of NATO, there's really no danger the United States or Europe will get in involved in what is really a civil war almost between--within this small part of Georgia."
-Fox News' Charles Krauthammer

Benghazi (nonsensical conspiracy theories aside)--four Americans die, with little US response? An outrage! Obama's so weak! His foreign policy's failing!
Beirut--250 American soldiers killed by truck bombs set by extremist jihadis under Reagan's term? Our response? A full withdrawal of US and international forces. Reagan remain a conservative deity.

Pretty sure I at least did not mention anything about any specific circumstances, I was speaking about him in far more general terms. He is someone that needs to be liked, adulation is what he lives for, but as the leader of the free world, not everyone is going to love you, that is the reality of the circumstance, there is a certain percentage of the world population that wants to see this country and its ideals eradicated from the earth. You do not protect except by projecting strength. But he does not project strength because he is too worried about being liked.

Personally I do not want to see us involved in Ukraine, that is, troops on the ground, but I do think that we should be helping the Ukrainians to help themselves, intel, weapons, training. Personally I think a squadron of F-117's and one of F-22's forward deployed to Poland for 'training' would send a pretty clear message. Putin will not be content with just Ukraine, he wants to put the whole band back together again, so are you saying we should let the USSR be reborn?

As for Benghazi, well that is as much about what happened before as what happened after, but Hillary does not want to talk about it and she has all her peeps on a pretty tight leash.

[waywardgs]

Don't you understand how critical to the position of president the skill of throwing a baseball is??!

[kutter]

It's just about a whole lot of bullshit. I'm finding the right is lacking in substance. They have shit for policies, no health care ideas, they just have nothing positive going on for the American people. That's why you guys are talking about manhood and mom jeans. It's intellectually bankrupt.

That might be the singularly most disingenuous statement I have ever seen you make, lots of opposing viewpoints have been made, you just do not like them so you pretend that they do not exist. And for clarification, Obamacare is not about health care, it is about HEALTH INSURANCE. Having experienced socialized medicine in the military and VA and commercial medicine now that I am retired, I pick commercial. VA and military are hard working sincere people that are under payed, overworked, short staffed, underfunded and in general burnt out. And if we keep going down the path we are, that is what we will all end up with, thank God I do not have kids and will not live but another 50 years or so.

[Allereli]

Don't you understand how critical to the position of president the skill of throwing a baseball is??!

I'll wait to judge until I see them both hitting.

[Wrathbringer]

http://photos.upi.com/story/t/4974dcc3344c151a90780ecbf5f0195b/Obama-to-throw-Nats-first-pitch.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_DawJTCHuL3c/THlqRtVQ1nI/AAAAAAAAG6g/5DkmP1OzPDw/girlyman_thumb13.jpg?imgmax=800

http://tomatobubble.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/Newsweek-Obama-Gay-President.jpg.w300h410.jpg

I genuinely lol'd. Like a man.

[waywardgs]

Some people never get past the "oh yeah? Well you're a fag!!" school of debate they learned in second grade.

[cwolff]

That might be the singularly most disingenuous statement I have ever seen you make, lots of opposing viewpoints have been made, you just do not like them so you pretend that they do not exist. And for clarification, Obamacare is not about health care, it is about HEALTH INSURANCE. Having experienced socialized medicine in the military and VA and commercial medicine now that I am retired, I pick commercial. VA and military are hard working sincere people that are under payed, overworked, short staffed, underfunded and in general burnt out. And if we keep going down the path we are, that is what we will all end up with, thank God I do not have kids and will not live but another 50 years or so.

Don't believe me. That's fine. Would you believe Republican US House Rep Dennis Ross?


“I think one of the most unfortunate things my party did the last three years was not offer an alternative to health care…I wish we had an alternative. For the next six months, we’re going to go into an election, knowing that we’re not going to do anything to address health care. Because we’ve gone so far in the last few years saying No, that we don’t have an alternative to say Yes to. And I think that the American public, when they go to vote, are going to look at credibility before they look at substance.”

You guys can whine all you want about "We have ideas, it's just that no one will listen to us" but that doesn't make it true.

[Wrathbringer]

Some people never get past the "oh yeah? Well you're a fag!!" school of debate they learned in second grade.

lol'd again. You guys are awesome.

[Methais]

Don't believe me. That's fine. Would you believe Republican US House Rep Dennis Ross?



You guys can whine all you want about "We have ideas, it's just that no one will listen to us" but that doesn't make it true.

Why do you always act like just because people oppose the shit democrats come up with, that that automatically means they think that republicans are the pinnacle of brainstorming good ideas?

Pretty sure if you asked just about any republican or non-democrat on here, they'd tell you that they're just as fed up with republicans as they are with democrats.

Democrats are full of ideas that suck hairy asshole and make the problems worse.

Republicans are spineless and have pretty much no ideas.

What do you think is better? A bunch of bad ideas, or no ideas at all? Just answer that as a general question, instead of or at least before going on another Obama cheerleading spree and failing to answer anything.

They're all playing for the same team behind closed doors anyway.

[cwolff]

Why do you always act like just because people oppose the shit democrats come up with, that that automatically means they think that republicans are the pinnacle of brainstorming good ideas?

Pretty sure if you asked just about any republican or non-democrat on here, they'd tell you that they're just as fed up with republicans as they are with democrats.

Democrats are full of ideas that suck hairy asshole and make the problems worse.

Republicans are spineless and have pretty much no ideas.

What do you think is better? A bunch of bad ideas, or no ideas at all?

They're all playing for the same team behind closed doors anyway.

As much as you may be angry over the state of affairs in U.S. politics today the fact still remains that there are only two parties who can produce legislation.

If you want to talk about creating a third party that actually has a hope in hell of getting enough representation to do something then that's a different thread.

Beyond that you're still operating the "You're a fag" method of debate that WW mentioned earlier.

[kutter]

Don't believe me. That's fine. Would you believe Republican US House Rep Dennis Ross?



You guys can whine all you want about "We have ideas, it's just that no one will listen to us" but that doesn't make it true.

So one person encompasses the entire Republican party, of which I am not a member, just to clarify. So by your train of thought then I can paint all the Dems with that same brush with comments from Max Baucus. "I just tell you, I just see a huge train wreck coming down. You and I have discussed this many times and I don't see any results yet.

"What can you do to help all these people around the country going, ‘What in the world do I do and what -- how do I know what to do?’"

How is that any different, it is one persons opinion on either side, get real.

[Methais]

As much as you may be angry over the state of affairs in U.S. politics today the fact still remains that there are only two parties who can produce legislation.

If you want to talk about creating a third party that actually has a hope in hell of getting enough representation to do something then that's a different thread.

Beyond that you're still operating the "You're a fag" method of debate that WW mentioned earlier.

I see. The "You're a fag" argument is the temporary race card replacement, at least for this thread.

If I wasn't so lazy, or at least thought enough people would be unlazy enough to participate in it, I'd make a thread for people to record themselves throwing a baseball. Just because I'm curious now.

Nothing you said changes the fact that both parties suck more right now than they've ever sucked before either.

I figured you'd dodge my question though, so I'll ask again and see how you tapdance around it this time:

What do you think is better? A bunch of bad ideas, or no ideas at all?

[cwolff]

So one person encompasses the entire Republican party, of which I am not a member, just to clarify. So by your train of thought then I can paint all the Dems with that same brush with comments from Max Baucus. "I just tell you, I just see a huge train wreck coming down. You and I have discussed this many times and I don't see any results yet.

"What can you do to help all these people around the country going, ‘What in the world do I do and what -- how do I know what to do?’"

How is that any different, it is one persons opinion on either side, get real.

You didn't believe me. You don't believe Ross. Why don't we do this. Put up your proof of the ACA alternatives and we can discuss them one by one. We've done it another thread, guess we have to do it here too. Even then, I seriously doubt that you will listen. Let's just start with alternatives that actually were proposed as a law. We can get to the other ideas later.

[cwolff]

I see. The "You're a fag" argument is the temporary race card replacement, at least for this thread.

If I wasn't so lazy, or at least thought enough people would be unlazy enough to participate in it, I'd make a thread for people to record themselves throwing a baseball. Just because I'm curious now.

Nothing you said changes the fact that both parties suck more right now than they've ever sucked before either.

I figured you'd dodge my question though, so I'll ask again and see how you tapdance around it this time:

What do you think is better? A bunch of bad ideas, or no ideas at all?

I think your question is a bad idea. It shows lazy thought processes and requires the one being questioned to hold the same prejudices as the one asking. Try it in a non-douche bag format.

[waywardgs]

"He's a fag."
"Calling people fags is a dumb argument."
"Stop playing the fag card!!!11"

Stupid.

[Methais]

I think your question is a bad idea. It shows lazy thought processes and requires the one being questioned to hold the same prejudices as the one asking. Try it in a non-douche bag format.

It's a pretty simple question actually.

You just don't want to answer it because you'll end up making yourself look dumber than you already do.

http://c3e308.medialib.glogster.com/media/ee/ee94091aae164f90e30e489dbde668f99ebb672a7db30789f4 ae6d420d5c9907/borat-thumbs-up-jpg.jpg

[Methais]

Thread: Obama's Manhood Problem

(red)wouldn't it be hilarious if obamacare succeeded? why don't conservatives want the president, and thus the country, to succeed at anything?

If Obamacare magically became this great thing that fixed the whole system like the way they try to sell it to people, I'd see that as a good thing.

But anyone with a pulse should know that that's not going to be the case. It would still suck if it were implemented by Reagan, Bush, or whoever on the right that you hate. So trying to play it off as "You just want it to fail because Obama!" is a bullshit straw man argument.

[cwolff]

Thread: Obama's Manhood Problem

(red)wouldn't it be hilarious if obamacare succeeded? why don't conservatives want the president, and thus the country, to succeed at anything?

If Obamacare magically became this great thing that fixed the whole system like the way they try to sell it to people, I'd see that as a good thing.

But anyone with a pulse should know that that's not going to be the case. It would still suck if it were implemented by Reagan, Bush, or whoever on the right that you hate. So trying to play it off as "You just want it to fail because Obama!" is a bullshit straw man argument.

Why do you want it to fail?

[Allereli]

But anyone with a pulse should know that that's not going to be the case. It would still suck if it were implemented by Reagan, Bush, or whoever on the right that you hate. So trying to play it off as "You just want it to fail because Obama!" is a bullshit straw man argument.

"Making Obama A One-Term President Is My Single Most Important Political Goal" -Sen. Mitch McConnell, Senate Minority Leader, 2011

it's a very real situation. G.W. Bush was given a blank check and free reign by Democrats after 9/11, so you must mean George H.W. Bush, who dug his own grave by raising taxes (even though it was the right thing to do).

[Laviticas]

Thread: Obama's Manhood Problem

(red)wouldn't it be hilarious if obamacare succeeded? why don't conservatives want the president, and thus the country, to succeed at anything?

If Obamacare magically became this great thing that fixed the whole system like the way they try to sell it to people, I'd see that as a good thing.

But anyone with a pulse should know that that's not going to be the case. It would still suck if it were implemented by Reagan, Bush, or whoever on the right that you hate. So trying to play it off as "You just want it to fail because Obama!" is a bullshit straw man argument.

Personally, ACA could be the greatest thing since sliced bread and I would still be against it. Government in charge of my body is always a bad thing. I'm not making some wild accusation that Obama wants us all dead, I'm just a student of history and recognize that one day it WILL be used as a form of punishment.

I would agree that it would be cool to see Obama stand up to Moochelle for once.

[Methais]

Why do you want it to fail?

Because it took the system that we already had and made it worse for most people.


"Making Obama A One-Term President Is My Single Most Important Political Goal" -Sen. Mitch McConnell, Senate Minority Leader, 2011

it's a very real situation. G.W. Bush was given a blank check and free reign by Democrats after 9/11, so you must mean George H.W. Bush, who dug his own grave by raising taxes (even though it was the right thing to do).

So democrats didn't want to make GWB a one term president? Or any opposing party not wanting to make the incumbent a one term president? Clearly the fact that the opposite side runs someone against the president after his first term means they hate him and want him the country to fail. Otherwise they'd just give him a free second term, right?

[Allereli]

So democrats didn't want to make GWB a one term president? Or any opposing party not wanting to make the incumbent a one term president? Clearly the fact that the opposite side runs someone against the president after his first term means they hate him and want him the country to fail. Otherwise they'd just give him a free second term, right?

not at the point of hijacking the government

[cwolff]

Because it took the system that we already had and made it worse for most people.

How did ACA make it worse for most people? Can you provide some substance?

[Allereli]

How did ACA make it worse for most people? Can you provide some substance?

he probably means those "health" plans that were cancelled because they didn't meet minimum requirements for a real health plan

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

he probably means those "health" plans that were cancelled because they didn't meet minimum requirements for a real health plan

Could be. Or could be the millions who lost their employer healthcare (that met the always changing minimum requirements) and were driven to the exchanges where they were forced to pay more for programs they don't need or want?

[cwolff]

Could be. Or could be the millions who lost their employer healthcare (that met the always changing minimum requirements) and were driven to the exchanges where they were forced to pay more for programs they don't need or want?

Did millions of people lose employer healthcare because of ACA? How many millions? Is it currently millions or projected to be millions?

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Did millions of people lose employer healthcare because of ACA? How many millions? Is it currently millions or projected to be millions?

News says millions, says it's because of ACA. Try google, I hear they do neat stuff.

[cwolff]

News says millions, says it's because of ACA. Try google, I hear they do neat stuff.

I googled it. Went straight to a Heritage Foundation article from February. So far they don't have numbers on the millions who lost employer sponsored care. Just projections. Don't bogart the data. I'm interested to see the numbers.

[Methais]

How did ACA make it worse for most people? Can you provide some substance?

How did it make it better for most people? Can you provide some substance?

[Allereli]

How did it make it better for most people? Can you provide some substance?

two words: pre-existing conditions

[cwolff]

two words: pre-existing conditions

Wow. That was easy.

[Methais]

If only it were that simple, right? I'm sure the quality of care will be quite amazing.

Let's also not forget...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGAdrQ2RpdM

[Wrathbringer]

If only it were that simple, right? I'm sure the quality of care will be quite amazing.

Let's also not forget...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGAdrQ2RpdM

6417

[Tgo01]

two words: pre-existing conditions

Most people didn't have pre-existing conditions covered under their healthcare plan?

[Atlanteax]

How did ACA make it worse for most people? Can you provide some substance?

(1) canceled policies & (2) higher premiums across the board

So basically everyone who had insurance prior, were losers

[Atlanteax]

two words: pre-existing conditions

You mean like being a chronic smoker, being overweight from binge eating, and other such neglect of physical health ... that most likely contributed to their condition (which they whine about how it is not fair to be paying more to cover) ?

[Thondalar]

I do not think this is much of a surprise to anyone, a kinder, gentler, warmer, fuzzier president is what a lot people want, someone they can like, never mind that he cannot lead, they want to think he is a nice guy.

In a perfect world, this would be the perfect Chief...unfortunately we are far from a perfect world.


The issue with that is that the job of the president is not to be a nice guy and the job of the President of the United States is to be the leader of the free world. All that lead from behind crap is such complete horseshit. Let your actions speak so loudly no one can hear your words.

Amen.

[Allereli]

having minimum standards for healthcare plans is a good thing. Did Obama screw up with those promises? yes, he's screwed up about a lot of things, the implementation has been awful, especially the website debacle, but that doesn't mean healthcare reform is not needed. Any push toward reform is a good thing, and making it the law to have health insurance as well as making it illegal to deny insurance to those with pre-existing conditions is a huge step in the right direction. Instead of an alternate Republican plan, we have only had hundreds of attempts to repeal the law. Funny how Republican are so against "handouts" and also so against everyone paying their fair share, or protecting people from financial ruin from one trip to the hospital that might lead them to apply for such handouts.

[Thondalar]

Most people didn't have pre-existing conditions covered under their healthcare plan?

Well that's the thing of it...people who already had insurance and found out about a condition vs. people who had no insurance and then tried to get insurance after finding out they had something.

I hate to break it to you all, but insurance is a business. They stay in business by taking money from the majority of people who are healthy and paying for the minority who are unhealthy. It's a bad business model to take people who are already unhealthy and provide them with insurance, because you're going to pay out more than you take in.

No business, of any kind, can pay out more money than they make and stay in business. It's just not mathematically possible. To have legislation force a company to take on debt is just...ridiculous. Ignorant, no...they know what they're doing. Force the private sector out of business, the White Knight of government can swoop in and save the day.

Wake up, America!

[Thondalar]

having minimum standards for healthcare plans is a good thing. Did Obama screw up with those promises? yes, he's screwed up about a lot of things, the implementation has been awful, especially the website debacle, but that doesn't mean healthcare reform is not needed. Any push toward reform is a good thing, and making it the law to have health insurance as well as making it illegal to deny insurance to those with pre-existing conditions is a huge step in the right direction. Instead of an alternate Republican plan, we have only had hundreds of attempts to repeal the law. Funny how Republican are so against "handouts" and also so against everyone paying their fair share, or protecting people from financial ruin from one trip to the hospital that might lead them to apply for such handouts.

So...if you reform something, and it's a net loss...it's ultimately ok because you reformed it?

Does not compute.

[Allereli]

You mean like being a chronic smoker, being overweight from binge eating, and other such neglect of physical health ... that most likely contributed to their condition (which they whine about how it is not fair to be paying more to cover) ?

no I mean people like my mother who had breast cancer 15 years ago and would be refused. For every fat smoking slob is someone who has had an issue completely out of his/her control. Promotion of preventative health care has also been a big Obama initiative. I've heard people criticize Michelle Obama as trying to tell them what to eat, when all she's trying to do is promote a healthy lifestyle that if we all undertook as a civic responsibility, we wouldn't be in the deep pile of shit we are today.

[Wrathbringer]

having minimum standards for healthcare plans is a good thing. Did Obama screw up with those promises? yes, he's screwed up about a lot of things, the implementation has been awful, especially the website debacle, but that doesn't mean healthcare reform is not needed. Any push toward reform is a good thing, and making it the law to have health insurance as well as making it illegal to deny insurance to those with pre-existing conditions is a huge step in the right direction. Instead of an alternate Republican plan, we have only had hundreds of attempts to repeal the law. Funny how Republican are so against "handouts" and also so against everyone paying their fair share, or protecting people from financial ruin from one trip to the hospital that might lead them to apply for such handouts.

Ah, the "fair share" argument. Fair share according to who? You? Obummer? This is a fascist argument. Stalin would be proud. As for a Republican plan, I guess you people only remember Obama's assertion that the Affordable (lol) care act is based on Romneycare, who, btw, is a Republican, when it suits you. Government should not be involved in healthcare, so the lack of a plan and rather a push for repeal from the "conservative" (lol again) party only makes sense. Also, I agree with you about Obummer screwing up everything.

[waywardgs]

no I mean people like my mother who had breast cancer 15 years ago and would be refused. For every fat smoking slob is someone who has had an issue completely out of his/her control. Promotion of preventative health care has also been a big Obama initiative. I've heard people criticize Michelle Obama as trying to tell them what to eat, when all she's trying to do is promote a healthy lifestyle that if we all undertook as a civic responsibility, we wouldn't be in the deep pile of shit we are today.

HOW DARE YOU TRY TO TELL ME WHAT TO EAT!!! FUCKIN' COMMIE NAZI FASCIST BASTARD!

[Thondalar]

no I mean people like my mother who had breast cancer 15 years ago and would be refused. For every fat smoking slob is someone who has had an issue completely out of his/her control. Promotion of preventative health care has also been a big Obama initiative. I've heard people criticize Michelle Obama as trying to tell them what to eat, when all she's trying to do is promote a healthy lifestyle that if we all undertook as a civic responsibility, we wouldn't be in the deep pile of shit we are today.

How about you're responsible for your own actions? If you have an unhealthy lifestyle, you pay the consequences?

[Allereli]

So...if you reform something, and it's a net loss...it's ultimately ok because you reformed it?

Does not compute.

where are your numbers that it's been a net loss? It's way too early to say. If some numbers are negative, adjustments can be made while maintaining the areas of positive progress. Stripping the entire law like the Republican party wants to do is just fucking stupid, adjusting it as we go along is not.

[Wrathbringer]

where are your numbers that it's been a net loss? It's way too early to say. If some numbers are negative, adjustments can be made while maintaining the areas of positive progress. Stripping the entire law like the Republican party wants to do is just fucking stupid, adjusting it as we go along is not.

Two decades from now: Q: "Has Obummercare been a net loss?" A: "It's way too early to say..."

[cwolff]

(1) canceled policies & (2) higher premiums across the board

So basically everyone who had insurance prior, were losers

Source?

[cwolff]

If only it were that simple, right? I'm sure the quality of care will be quite amazing.

Let's also not forget...

At least we're seeing some improvement in your position. You've gone from bold declarative sentences to "I'm sure..."

[Allereli]

Ah, the "fair share" argument. Fair share according to who? You? Obummer? This is a fascist argument. Stalin would be proud. As for a Republican plan, I guess you people only remember Obama's assertion that the Affordable (lol) care act is based on Romneycare, who, btw, is a Republican, when it suits you. Government should not be involved in healthcare, so the lack of a plan and rather a push for repeal from the "conservative" (lol again) party only makes sense. Also, I agree with you about Obummer screwing up everything.

you should stick with the "faggot" argument. Obummer is less harsh

[Wrathbringer]

you should stick with the "faggot" argument. Obummer is less harsh

Excellent rebuttal. Well done.

[Allereli]

Two decades from now: Q: "Has Obummercare been a net loss?" A: "It's way too early to say..."

umm, no. Since the sign up period just started 6 months ago, I think another 3 years is a good amount of time to see how people and insurance companies adapt.

[waywardgs]

Two decades from now: Q: "Has Obummercare been a net loss?" A: "It's way too early to say..."

Holy shit, Wrathbringer's got a crystal ball. Quick, ask it what I'm going to eat for dinner tonight. The correct answer: WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT AND AS MUCH AS I WANT, GODDAMN NAZI FASCIST COMMIE FUCKS!

[Thondalar]

where are your numbers that it's been a net loss? It's way too early to say. If some numbers are negative, adjustments can be made while maintaining the areas of positive progress. Stripping the entire law like the Republican party wants to do is just fucking stupid, adjusting it as we go along is not.

Anecdotal? I lost my previous insurance and now have premiums so high I'm paying out the ass and can only hope to see some amount of refund if something actually catastrophic happens. I'm seriously at the point where I'll just take the penalty on my tax refund...I usually owe at the end of the year anyway, so fuck it.

Nation-wide, let's add it all up...roughly 6 million people lost their previous insurance (even though Obama said it wouldn't change) and barely 4 million have signed up to the new exchange...numbers are hard to track here, but on it's face that's a net loss of 2 million people. It's apples to oranges, and that actually makes it even worse...you have a lot of that 4 million who signed up who didn't have insurance to begin with, and you have a lot of that 6 million (like me) who haven't signed up because we'd lose money on the deal. To this let's add the "website debacle" as you put it, and the fact that it's another thousand pages of bullshit bureaucracy that does absolutely nothing to actually help healthcare in the US.

Progress without logic isn't progress at all. It's just mouth service.

[cwolff]

The illogical part of this debate is that the right is just anti-aca. That's it. No amount of talking about it can help with this. Take a look at this thread. People are calling the program a failure when it's barely even started. How the fuck do any of you know it's a failure? Bad website or not, they hit their targets, which weren't even a real target. The 7million signups estimate came from the CBO's estimate of people needed for the exchanges. Obama adopted that number as a goal. Then they hit 8 million and the monkeys start screeching about something different.

The more we talk about this the more I realize that the PC right wingers have no fucking idea what they're talking about. None. Just banging away at the keyboards to make noise.

[Wrathbringer]

Holy shit, Wrathbringer's got a crystal ball. Quick, ask it what I'm going to eat for dinner tonight. The correct answer: WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT AND AS MUCH AS I WANT, GODDAMN NAZI FASCIST COMMIE FUCKS!

It's all becoming clear....one moment....yes, yes, I see it now...for dinner, you'll be having more of the same equine feces that Obummer and the liberal media have been serving up for the last 6+ years...ah! and you'll be having guests! Back, cwolff, Allereli and Warriorbird! Good thing there's plenty to go around! :drink:

[Thondalar]

The illogical part of this debate is that the right is just anti-aca. That's it. No amount of talking about it can help with this. Take a look at this thread. People are calling the program a failure when it's barely even started. How the fuck do any of you know it's a failure? Bad website or not, they hit their targets, which weren't even a real target. The 7million signups estimate came from the CBO's estimate of people needed for the exchanges. Obama adopted that number as a goal. Then they hit 8 million and the monkeys start screeching about something different.

The more we talk about this the more I realize that the PC right wingers have no fucking idea what they're talking about. None. Just banging away at the keyboards to make noise.

I tend right on some issues, but I'm far from a right-winger, and I called this a piece of shit before it was passed, simply on it's merits as a bill. Since it's been passed, there has been nothing to sway my opinion. Nothing.

[cwolff]

I tend right on some issues, but I'm far from a right-winger, and I called this a piece of shit before it was passed, simply on it's merits as a bill. Since it's been passed, there has been nothing to sway my opinion. Nothing.

No you're not and though I disagree with you on ACA I think of you as a libertarian so that post wasn't really directed at you.

[Allereli]

It's all becoming clear....one moment....yes, yes, I see it now...for dinner, you'll be having more of the same equine feces that Obummer and the liberal media have been serving up for the last 6+ years...ah! and you'll be having guests! Back, cwolff, Allereli and Warriorbird! Good thing there's plenty to go around! :drink:

yeah, I bet you think the next Republican attempt to repeal with be the one that works. Grab a stick and beat that dead horse with them.

[Wrathbringer]

yeah, I bet you think the next Republican attempt to repeal with be the one that works. Grab a stick and beat that dead horse with them.

Nah, it'll collapse under its own weight. If you disagree, I'll say it's too early to say that it won't.

[Allereli]

Nah, it'll collapse under its own weight. If you disagree, I'll say it's too early to say that it won't.

so why do they keep spending time on trying to repeal it? maybe because the black man is president and they don't want him to be successful in anything, even implementing a fellow Republican Presidential nominee's health care plan.

[waywardgs]

It's all becoming clear....one moment....yes, yes, I see it now...for dinner, you'll be having more of the same equine feces that Obummer and the liberal media have been serving up for the last 6+ years...ah! and you'll be having guests! Back, cwolff, Allereli and Warriorbird! Good thing there's plenty to go around! :drink:

haha. We'll actually be using food stamps too, so it looks like you're buyin'. Thanks!

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

so why do they keep spending time on trying to repeal it? maybe because the black man is president and they don't want him to be successful in anything, even implementing a fellow Republican Presidential nominee's health care plan.

Wait, are you saying it's because he's black? Wouldn't that be akin to calling the entire republican congress racist?

[Methais]

having minimum standards for healthcare plans is a good thing. Did Obama screw up with those promises? yes, he's screwed up about a lot of things,

You're confusing the term "screwing up" with "lying through his teeth about everything".


I've heard people criticize Michelle Obama as trying to tell them what to eat, when all she's trying to do is promote a healthy lifestyle that if we all undertook as a civic responsibility, we wouldn't be in the deep pile of shit we are today.

I think people would probably be less critical of her food crusade telling people to eat healthy if she wasn't doing it with a cheeseburger in one hand and a chocolate shake in the other.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I googled it. Went straight to a Heritage Foundation article from February. So far they don't have numbers on the millions who lost employer sponsored care. Just projections. Don't bogart the data. I'm interested to see the numbers.

How many millions are enrolled and have paid for their exchange insurance again, that are confirmable? I'd say a projection is as concrete as that.

[Allereli]

I think people would probably be less critical of her food crusade telling people to eat healthy if she wasn't doing it with a cheeseburger in one hand and a chocolate shake in the other.

except she always says treats are fine in moderation. If that is all you see from her efforts, then you might want to give her more of a chance, she is far more effective than the President has been.

[Laviticas]

so why do they keep spending time on trying to repeal it? maybe because the black man is president and they don't want him to be successful in anything, even implementing a fellow Republican Presidential nominee's health care plan.

This has got to be the grandad of all race cards I have ever seen pulled.

[Wrathbringer]

haha. We'll actually be using food stamps too, so it looks like you're buyin'. Thanks!

Jokes on you! I don't pay taxes! Ha!

[cwolff]

How many millions are enrolled and have paid for their exchange insurance again, that are confirmable? I'd say a projection is as concrete as that.

You just have nothing to say. Finally you're admitting that all your statements about what is actually mean what might happen. I'm so sick of you guys just talking shit. At least back it up.

[Tgo01]

I've heard people criticize Michelle Obama as trying to tell them what to eat, when all she's trying to do is promote a healthy lifestyle that if we all undertook as a civic responsibility, we wouldn't be in the deep pile of shit we are today.

Michelle Obama declared a war on childhood obesity and as we learned in another thread whenever you declare a war on something you make it worse.

Thanks for all of our future fat children, Michelle!

[Wrathbringer]

so why do they keep spending time on trying to repeal it? maybe because the black man is president and they don't want him to be successful in anything, even implementing a fellow Republican Presidential nominee's health care plan.

Nonono, that's why I don't want him to be successful. I can't speak for the republicans.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

You just have nothing to say. Finally you're admitting that all your statements about what is actually mean what might happen. I'm so sick of you guys just talking shit. At least back it up.

You just ignore anything not in line with your POV. Why should I bother pointing out the numerous counter arguments when all you will say is it's partisan, racist or some other incredibly obtuse reason? There are many websites, polls, and surveys which document the millions who've lost insurance as a result of the ACA. There are lots of reasons why, but none of that matters, because you won't even acknowledge that it's occurred.

Back up your claims with concrete evidence, not made up fluff press releases from the Rose room. If the ACA is such a smashing success, why did we need to spend millions on PSAs, celebrities and pleas for enrollments? Wouldn't the results speak for themselves?

I'm not going to bother with showing other viewpoints than your own, because you are not willing to even look at them, so I'll save my time. Go back to swinging from Obama's balls like a monkey on a juggle gym.

[cwolff]

You just ignore anything not in line with your POV. Why should I bother pointing out the numerous counter arguments when all you will say is it's partisan, racist or some other incredibly obtuse reason? There are many websites, polls, and surveys which document the millions who've lost insurance as a result of the ACA. There are lots of reasons why, but none of that matters, because you won't even acknowledge that it's occurred.

Back up your claims with concrete evidence, not made up fluff press releases from the Rose room. If the ACA is such a smashing success, why did we need to spend millions on PSAs, celebrities and pleas for enrollments? Wouldn't the results speak for themselves?

I'm not going to bother with showing other viewpoints than your own, because you are not willing to even look at them, so I'll save my time. Go back to swinging from Obama's balls like a monkey on a juggle gym.

You're not showing them because you can't. You'll say all kinds of shit but when someone asks you to back it up you say "you won't believe me anyways".

Just quit talking shit for no reason and you won't put yourself in this position.

[Latrinsorm]

Pretty sure I at least did not mention anything about any specific circumstances, I was speaking about him in far more general terms. He is someone that needs to be liked, adulation is what he lives for, but as the leader of the free world, not everyone is going to love you, that is the reality of the circumstance, there is a certain percentage of the world population that wants to see this country and its ideals eradicated from the earth. You do not protect except by projecting strength. But he does not project strength because he is too worried about being liked.Some food (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_military_operations#2010 .E2.80.93present) for thought. Obama clearly projects strength, the question is why isn't he doing so against Russia when he is happy to against bin Laden, Libya, Somalia, Uganda? And I'm afraid when you put it that way the answer is obvious.

Racism.
Nation-wide, let's add it all up...roughly 6 million people lost their previous insurance (even though Obama said it wouldn't change) and barely 4 million have signed up to the new exchange...numbers are hard to track here, but on it's face that's a net loss of 2 million people.This is like saying that you spent $40 on gas to get to work and only found $0.50 in the vending machine all week, therefore going to work is a net loss.

[waywardgs]

Michelle Obama declared a war on childhood obesity and as we learned in another thread whenever you declare a war on something you make it worse.

Thanks for all of our future fat children, Michelle!

Shit, you're right...

[Wrathbringer]

Some food (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_military_operations#2010 .E2.80.93present) for thought. Obama clearly projects strength, the question is why isn't he doing so against Russia when he is happy to against bin Laden, Libya, Somalia, Uganda? And I'm afraid when you put it that way the answer is obvious.

Racism.This is like saying that you spent $40 on gas to get to work and only found $0.50 in the vending machine all week, therefore going to work is a net loss.

So Obama is racist against Russia... That explains all the sanctions. Thanks, I was wondering about that. And going to work is a net loss, as time is more valuable than $.

[Methais]

except she always says treats are fine in moderation. If that is all you see from her efforts, then you might want to give her more of a chance, she is far more effective than the President has been.

Let's be real, it's probably next to impossible to be less effective than him.


You just have nothing to say. Finally you're admitting that all your statements about what is actually mean what might happen. I'm so sick of you guys just talking shit. At least back it up.

Irony much?

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

You're not showing them because you can't. You'll say all kinds of shit but when someone asks you to back it up you say "you won't believe me anyways".

Just quit talking shit for no reason and you won't put yourself in this position.

I know you are, but what am I?

[Parkbandit]

so why do they keep spending time on trying to repeal it? maybe because the black man is president and they don't want him to be successful in anything, even implementing a fellow Republican Presidential nominee's health care plan.

We're going to have to have a "Godwin" type of rule so when the intellectually bankrupt throw out "RACIST" we can point to them and laugh.

We should call it the Allereli Rule on this forum.

[cwolff]

We're going to have to have a "Godwin" type of rule so when the intellectually bankrupt throw out "RACIST" we can point to them and laugh.

We should call it the Allereli Rule on this forum.

Let's just have the racist rule. Everytime a darker color is mentioned just type "Racism!" before PB has to comb the thread and find it.

[AnticorRifling]

Let's just have the racist rule. Everytime a darker color is mentioned just type "Racism!" before PB has to comb the thread and find it.

You don't read the responses from the last time you were active?

Dig your heels in all you want but you're kidding yourself if you're saying what Allereli wasn't race card as all get out.

[cwolff]

You don't read the responses from the last time you were active?

Dig your heels in all you want but you're kidding yourself if you're saying what Allereli wasn't race card as all get out.

You mean the Black man as President comment?

[AnticorRifling]

Yeah, it's from like 6p today so it's not like PB dug for it.

[cwolff]

Yeah, it's from like 6p today so it's not like PB dug for it.

He sniffs 'em out pretty good. That was an easy one for him.

[Back]

We're going to have to have a "Godwin" type of rule so when the intellectually bankrupt throw out "RACIST" we can point to them and laugh.

We should call it the Allereli Rule on this forum.

If the mere mention of an issue invalidated it there wouldn't be much to talk about.

http://quizzicalllama.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/how_convenient.gif

[Atlanteax]

Just quit talking shit for no reason and you won't put yourself in this position.

Please take your own advice

[Parkbandit]

If the mere mention of an issue invalidated it there wouldn't be much to talk about.



It's over used by people like you to shut down any discussion about anything.

Don't like the Affordable Care Act? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that we shouldn't just give blanket amnesty to all illegal aliens in this country? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that bailouts and handouts are the way to govern? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that whole wheat pancakes are better tasting that white flour pancakes? YOU MUST BE RACIST!

[Back]

It's over used by people like you to shut down any discussion about anything.

Don't like the Affordable Care Act? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that we shouldn't just give blanket amnesty to all illegal aliens in this country? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that bailouts and handouts are the way to govern? YOU MUST BE RACIST!
Don't agree that whole wheat pancakes are better tasting that white flour pancakes? YOU MUST BE RACIST!

You can't sweep an issue like racism under the rug no matter how hard you try. I don't like that it exists anymore than you do but it can't be ignored. Thats the problem right there. Ignoring it.

[AnticorRifling]

You can't sweep an issue like racism under the rug no matter how hard you try. I don't like that it exists anymore than you do but it can't be ignored. Thats the problem right there. Ignoring it.

You sure can't. You also can't solve it or do it any credit by using it as a blanket response when someone disagrees with someone else and they are of different races. Some people can actually disagree with the idea on its own and don't need to disagree just because the person looks different (that's called progress you should be for that right?)

[Jeril]

You sure can't. You also can't solve it or do it any credit by using it as a blanket response when someone disagrees with someone else and they are of different races. Some people can actually disagree with the idea on its own and don't need to disagree just because the person looks different (that's called progress you should be for that right?)

Most "progressives" are only for progress when it suits them.

[cwolff]

You sure can't. You also can't solve it or do it any credit by using it as a blanket response when someone disagrees with someone else and they are of different races. Some people can actually disagree with the idea on its own and don't need to disagree just because the person looks different (that's called progress you should be for that right?)

No of course you can't use it as a blanket response. It is very real though. It's not the figment of liberal imagination. It's all too common that when one raises a question of race there is an automatic knee-jerk response to belittle, diminish or otherwise avoid addressing the subject. We see that here every time race is mentioned. It eliminates the possibility of agree or disagree and goes straight to personal emotional bullshit. That my friend, is pretty racist.

[Atlanteax]

You can't sweep an issue like racism under the rug no matter how hard you try. I don't like that it exists anymore than you do but it can't be ignored. Thats the problem right there. Ignoring it.

Back must be unfamiliar with "the Boy who Cried Wolf" story.

[waywardgs]

Back must be unfamiliar with "the Boy who Cried Wolf" story.

It was probably a black wolf. Racist.

[Allereli]

"The demographics race we’re losing badly,” said Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (S.C.). “We’re not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term."


A new Post poll put the difference between the two parties’ perception of minority voters on stark display. Respondents were asked an open-ended question: Why do most black voters so consistently support Democrats?

Though “don’t know” was the top answer for members of both parties, a close second among Republicans was that black voters are dependent on government or seeking a government handout. Democrats more often said that their party addresses issues of poverty.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/as-republican-convention-emphasizes-diversity-racial-incidents-intrude/2012/08/29/b9023a52-f1ec-11e1-892d-bc92fee603a7_story.html


The Senate vote was technically tied, 20-20, until Lieutenant Governor Ralph Northam, elected in the same Democratic sweep of top state offices as McAuliffe, voted for repeal. (Northam’s opponent, E.W. Jackson, once said that Planned Parenthood was more harmful to African-Americans than the Klan.)

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/va-senate-votes-scrap-abortion-law

“Then you get the reward of success. People come back to you,” he continued. “They like the service they get, and they don’t ask me—they might try to Jew me down on a price, that’s fine. You know what? That’s free market as well.” -Oklahoma Republican House Majority Leader Dennis Johnson


"They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never learned how to pick cotton," Bundy said to reporters, according to The New York Times.

"And I've often wondered, are they better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things, or are they better off under government subsidy? They didn't get no more freedom. They got less freedom," he was quoted as saying.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/24/politics/bundy-and-race/


After the presidential election of 1964, they mutually agreed to embrace a southern, evangelical strategy that resulted in abandoning the minority voting bloc.


Retired Col. Lawrence Wilkerson made the following statement on MSNBC nightly program The Ed Show in October, “My party, unfortunately, is the bastion of those people — not all of them, but most of them — who are still basing their positions on race. Let me just be candid: My party is full of racists, and the real reason a considerable portion of my party wants President Obama out of the White House has nothing to do with the content of his character, nothing to do with his competence as commander-in-chief and president, and everything to do with the color of his skin, and that’s despicable.”

http://politic365.com/2013/01/18/the-gops-race-problem/

honestly none of the above is needed, the proof is in the Obama birth certificate issue.

If this is not the general feeling of the Republican party, what is being done to drive this element out? Why was the 2012 Republican National Convention so undiverse?

[Wrathbringer]

Meanwhile, back at the Bundy ranch...

You were at the Bundy ranch?

[waywardgs]

You were at the Bundy ranch?

Back switched threads on us. He's in the Nevada one now.

[Parkbandit]

No of course you can't use it as a blanket response. It is very real though. It's not the figment of liberal imagination.

Another tool from the liberal handbook... make shit up. Who has ever said that racism is a figment of liberal imagination? Just a couple of posts of anyone saying that should suffice.

I'll save you the trouble: No one thinks it is. No one has ever posted a serious post stating that.

We can go ahead and all agree there is racism, so in the future when you and Backlash want to make this point again, we can all have a good laugh at your expense.


It's all too common that when one raises a question of race there is an automatic knee-jerk response to belittle, diminish or otherwise avoid addressing the subject. We see that here every time race is mentioned. It eliminates the possibility of agree or disagree and goes straight to personal emotional bullshit. That my friend, is pretty racist.

Finally.. you understand why bringing in race for every problem does nothing for the discussion at hand.

I really believe we have had a breakthrough with you today. Congrats. You should go treat yourself to a cookie.

Job well done.

[cwolff]

Another tool from the liberal handbook... make shit up. Who has ever said that racism is a figment of liberal imagination? Just a couple of posts of anyone saying that should suffice.

I'll save you the trouble: No one thinks it is. No one has ever posted a serious post stating that.

We can go ahead and all agree there is racism, so in the future when you and Backlash want to make this point again, we can all have a good laugh at your expense.



Finally.. you understand why bringing in race for every problem does nothing for the discussion at hand.

I really believe we have had a breakthrough with you today. Congrats. You should go treat yourself to a cookie.

Job well done.

You're the worst Knee-jerker we've got. I don't even believe it's possible to have a discussion about racial impact without you automatically getting defensive. There's some deep seated issue with you and race that's probably not healthy. You should put some thought into that.

Your post is a great example. I didn't say anything that would send a reasonable person into a tantrum.

[Parkbandit]

honestly none of the above is needed, the proof is in the Obama birth certificate issue.

If this is not the general feeling of the Republican party, what is being done to drive this element out? Why was the 2012 Republican National Convention so undiverse?

The stupidity that comes from you is endless.

Know who else was accused of not being eligible for President because he wasn't born here? McCain.. a very angry white guy. You should also look up Herbert Hoover and the Democrats questioning his birth certificate... another angry white guy.

Protip: SOMETIMES when someone disagrees with someone else and one is black.. it's not because the white guy is a racist.

But seriously, keep on herpin' and derpin'.

[cwolff]

Protip: SOMETIMES when someone disagrees with someone else and one is black.. it's not because the white guy is a racist.

But seriously, keep on herpin' and derpin'.

Another fantastic example of what I just posted about. Look how defensive you get. Allerli didn't even call you out personally. Why do you have such a personal reaction? You got a problem dude.

[Parkbandit]

You're the worst Knee-jerker we've got.

Yes, yes.. when you are wrong, fall back to hyperbole.

Awesome.


I don't even believe it's possible to have a discussion about racial impact without you automatically getting defensive.

I don't even believe it's possible to have a discussion about anything without you automatically attributing it to racism.


There's some deep seated issue with you and race that's probably not healthy. You should put some thought into that.

You mean how I judge individuals based upon their actions and not about what color/sex/etc.. they are? I'm sure to you, that is a huge problem. It's an extremely foreign concept for you to understand. We get it.



Your post is a great example. I didn't say anything that would send a reasonable person into a tantrum.

There was no tantrum on my part... you really should stop projecting. I was merely highlighting your immense stupidity on the subject.

[Parkbandit]

Another fantastic example of what I just posted about. Look how defensive you get. Allerli didn't even call you out personally. Why do you have such a personal reaction? You got a problem dude.

I don't think you understand what defensive means.. or a personal reaction. I gave two perfect examples of non-blacks being questioned about their birth.. and obviously racism wasn't a part of that because they were white. So, maybe in Obama's case, not everyone is against him because of the color of his skin and you should seriously stop projecting your own prejudices onto other people.

[cwolff]

Then do this. Next time race is brought up on the PC political folders, don't automatically shout reverse-racism B.S. Slow down, take some deep breaths and discuss it like the open minded guy you aspire to be.

[Allereli]

lol at not knowing that the birther movement was racially motivated

[Parkbandit]

Then do this. Next time race is brought up on the PC political folders, don't automatically shout reverse-racism B.S. Slow down, take some deep breaths and discuss it like the open minded guy you aspire to be.

Show me where I said anything about reverse racism here?

I swear.. English must be your 2nd language, because you are reading posts that simply aren't there. It's either a problem in translation or just sheer stupidity.

[Tgo01]

lol at not knowing that the birther movement was racially motivated

Wasn't the birther movement started by Hilary supporters?

I guess that doesn't necessarily disprove it was racially motivated but it's pretty funny given the source.

[Parkbandit]

lol at not knowing that the birther movement was racially motivated

I didn't say it wasn't... given that Hillary Clinton initiated it. Those white people from Arkansas can't be trusted!

I'm just saying that it can't all be attributed to everyone questioning anything about Obama is because of racism.

[Parkbandit]

Wasn't the birther movement started by Hilary supporters?

I guess that doesn't necessarily disprove it was racially motivated but it's pretty funny given the source.

FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU!

Racist.

[Tgo01]

Then do this. Next time race is brought up on the PC political folders, don't automatically shout reverse-racism B.S. Slow down, take some deep breaths and discuss it like the open minded guy you aspire to be.

I don't think anyone has any problem discussing racism. What people have a problem with is someone blindly shouting racism when no evidence of racism exists.

And you want people to rationally discuss this when the whole basis of the argument is not rational at all?

[cwolff]

lol at not knowing that the birther movement was racially motivated

There's no absolute proof or the standard of proof required to decisively demonstrate this is not possible. This message is handled around the water cooler, dog-whistle words, and a kind of "you know what I mean" word of mouth since it was a propaganda campaign appealing to the irrational and sub-conscious. It's also a scary thing for the conservatives to admit racism. It means that they'll have to change and they're already flummoxed with demographic changes. It's kind of like Climate Change really. As long as you can pretend there is no problem, you don't actually have to do the heavy lifting to fix it. It'll change but slowly. Just like gay marriage. The rest of the country will have to either wait for the older generations to die off or fight so hard that they force change.

[Allereli]

I didn't say it wasn't... given that Hillary Clinton initiated it. Those white people from Arkansas can't be trusted!

I'm just saying that it can't all be attributed to everyone questioning anything about Obama is because of racism.

and who embraced it?

[Parkbandit]

and who embraced it?

People trying to get their candidate elected/nominated?

Oh yea, and definitely Obama himself.

[cwolff]

I don't think anyone has any problem discussing racism. What people have a problem with is someone blindly shouting racism when no evidence of racism exists.

And you want people to rationally discuss this when the whole basis of the argument is not rational at all?

I have yet to see an example of this. I got to the politics folder about when Zimmerman and Martin did. That was some racist shit. Even the possibility that Martin got profiled for being black, wearing a hoodie and/or in the wrong neighborhood was met with outrage by the folks (I'm sure I don't have to list them) defending Zimmerman. My rep also lit up with racist shit. One of you fucks even wrote "Die Nigger".

We've got racist issues here on the PC and I've not seen one example of a racially tinged political discussion that didn't almost immediately devolve into serious defensiveness from the usual suspects.

Let's pay attention and maybe the next time it comes up everyone can chill out and look at the issue without feeling attacked.

[Tgo01]

If this is not the general feeling of the Republican party, what is being done to drive this element out?

So everything any member of one party says is representative of the entire party unless the party as a whole tries to drive this member out?

Man oh man, are the Democrats ever going to be sorry they have Back in their ranks.

[Tgo01]

I have yet to see an example of this. I got to the politics folder about when Zimmerman and Martin did. That was some racist shit. Even the possibility that Martin got profiled for being black, wearing a hoodie and/or in the wrong neighborhood was met with outrage by the folks (I'm sure I don't have to list them) defending Zimmerman.

This is exactly what I mean. What evidence was there that Zimmerman racially profiled Martin? Zero. Did the federal government ever follow through with prosecuting Zimmerman because he racially profiled Martin? I don't think so, most likely due to lack of evidence.


We've got racist issues here on the PC and I've not seen one example of a racially tinged political discussion that didn't almost immediately devolve into serious defensiveness from the usual suspects.

Maybe because after years of the race baiters screaming "Racist!" at the drop of a hat you've all lost the chance for a civil discussion. This should be a lesson to you. You have failed the PC and all of mankind. I know you will do the honorable thing.


Let's pay attention and maybe the next time it comes up everyone can chill out and look at the issue without feeling attacked.

If the issue is a serious issue where racism was involved then sure. If not then no.

[Allereli]

So everything any member of one party says is representative of the entire party unless the party as a whole tries to drive this member out?

yes, all those examples I gave were from one person.

[cwolff]

So everything any member of one party says is representative of the entire party unless the party as a whole tries to drive this member out?

Man oh man, are the Democrats ever going to be sorry they have Back in their ranks.

Where are the moderate republicans to stand up to this shit? We've demanded action from moderate muslims to speak out against islamic fanatics. Time has come for moderate conservatives to speak up and take back their party!

At least they are pulling back from Bundy now. Overt racism is easy to deal with. Southern strategy style racism can only be addressed from within the rights centers of power.

Bill Hemmer: "Where Are The Moderate Muslim Leaders Who Are Coming Out And Saying This Is Wrong?" During a segment on the attack in Kenya, America's Newsroom co-host Bill Hemmer said, "We wonder where the outrage is, especially from the Muslim world." After playing a clip of Bill O'Reilly accusing Muslims of not condemning the attacks, Hemmer added, "The point is clear: Where are the moderate Muslim leaders who are coming out and saying this is wrong, we condemn it, we won't stand for it, we will not allow our religion to be defamed on behalf of these idiots?" [Fox News, America's Newsroom, 9/24/13]

Bill O'Reilly: "You Hear No Outcry From The Billion Muslims In The World About" Muslim Terrorism. On his Fox News show, Bill O'Reilly highlighted the Kenya attack and said the Muslim world is doing "nothing" to confront Muslim terrorism. He later added, "You hear no outcry from the billion Muslims in the world about this. They don't rise up and chase these guys out of town." [Fox News, The O'Reilly Factor, 9/23/13]

Bob Beckel: "The Time Has Come For" Moderate Muslims To "Stand Up And Say Something." The Five co-host Bob Beckel said that no more mosques should be built in America until moderate Muslims "denounce" the attacks in Kenya:

[Tgo01]

yes, all those examples I gave were from one person.

Do you think the birther movement even represented one half of one percent of all Republicans?

I know the media made it seem like the entire Republican party were all a bunch of red neck racists looking to get the black man out of office but it really was a small fringe group of people.

[Tgo01]

Where are the moderate republicans to stand up to this shit? We've demanded action from moderate muslims to speak out against islamic fanatics.

Exactly and it's always met with "But a small group of people don't represent an the entire group!" from Democrats.

This is what you get for not having our back during the Muslim terrorist talk! You reap what you sow. Now eat your anti American, apple pie hating tomatoes!

[Parkbandit]

I have yet to see an example of this. I got to the politics folder about when Zimmerman and Martin did. That was some racist shit. Even the possibility that Martin got profiled for being black, wearing a hoodie and/or in the wrong neighborhood was met with outrage by the folks (I'm sure I don't have to list them) defending Zimmerman. My rep also lit up with racist shit. One of you fucks even wrote "Die Nigger".

We've got racist issues here on the PC and I've not seen one example of a racially tinged political discussion that didn't almost immediately devolve into serious defensiveness from the usual suspects.

Let's pay attention and maybe the next time it comes up everyone can chill out and look at the issue without feeling attacked.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcuqn88ORg1rfu1kro1_500.gif

[cwolff]

This is exactly what I mean. What evidence was there that Zimmerman racially profiled Martin? Zero. Did the federal government ever follow through with prosecuting Zimmerman because he racially profiled Martin? I don't think so, most likely due to lack of evidence.



Maybe because after years of the race baiters screaming "Racist!" at the drop of a hat you've all lost the chance for a civil discussion. This should be a lesson to you. You have failed the PC and all of mankind. I know you will do the honorable thing.



If the issue is a serious issue where racism was involved then sure. If not then no.

Thanks for backing up everything I've just been writing from demanding a confession that Zman racially profiled in order to believe it's even a possibility to discuss, knee-jerk reacting to the feeling that people are accusing you of being a racist for years and then denying that we've ever had 1 conversation where race was a legitimate issue to discuss.

What's so threatening about discussing if race is a factor in peoples political positions?

[Tgo01]

You want to have a discussion about the possibility that Zimmerman racially profiled Martin simply because Zimmerman was a white Hispanic and Martin was black? No other evidence at all? One party was white therefore it's a strong possibility he was racist?

Get outta here!

[cwolff]

You want to have a discussion about the possibility that Zimmerman racially profiled Martin simply because Zimmerman was a white Hispanic and Martin was black? No other evidence at all? One party was white therefore it's a strong possibility he was racist?

Get outta here!

Didn't even call him a racist in that post. I'm talking about being able to discuss issues which may have a racial component. Can't really be done here. As soon as someone mentions it there's an automatic backlash. Racism is alive and well today. It's not gone because of a black president, it's just gone underground. We see it flare up here in the type of defensiveness with which people post about it.

[Latrinsorm]

Maybe because after years of the race baiters screaming "Racist!" at the drop of a hat you've all lost the chance for a civil discussion. This should be a lesson to you. You have failed the PC and all of mankind. I know you will do the honorable thing.Years, eh? It should be quite easy for you to produce examples, then. In fact, as a supporter of the Bush administration you should even be able to find examples of people calling me racist.
Do you think the birther movement even represented one half of one percent of all Republicans?You might be surprised (http://www.scribd.com/doc/120815791/Fairleigh-Dickinson-poll-on-conspiracy-theories).

[Tgo01]

Didn't even call him a racist in that post. I'm talking about being able to discuss issues which may have a racial component. Can't really be done here. As soon as someone mentions it there's an automatic backlash. Racism is alive and well today. It's not gone because of a black president, it's just gone underground. We see it flare up here in the type of defensiveness with which people post about it.

So wait, you want to discuss race because one party was white but you don't necessarily believe the white person was racist? You just want to have a discussion about race just because?

Are you even taking yourself seriously in this post?

[Parkbandit]

Are you even taking yourself seriously in this post?

He would be the only one.

Well, maybe three, there's always Backlash and Allereli....