"In God We Trust" on All Buildings

[ClydeR]

Republicans are going to put "In God We Trust" on all public buildings. A lot of Democrats will vote for it too. This should finally put an end of people saying that Republicans have not yet voted on any bills about jobs. Putting up all of those plaques will employ a lot of good people doing good work.


Rep Randy Forbes (R.-Va.) has spent four years fighting to have Congress officially support the right to have the national motto “In God We Trust” in government buildings and public schools.

Forbes won a big victory on Thursday when the House Judiciary Committee passed his In God We Trust Resolution, which reaffirms the national motto and supports and encourages the public display of the motto in all public buildings.

More... (http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=42376)


“We’re not forcing anybody to do anything,” said Forbes. “But at the same time, we want to stand there to protect people who want to say God in a public building. And we don’t want some government agency telling them that they can’t put the national motto in their buildings or classrooms.”


During the committee hearing on Thursday, Smith said the bill “provides Congress with the opportunity to renew its support of a principle that was venerated by the Founders of this country, and by its Presidents, on a bipartisan basis.”

Forbes has not spoken yet to House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R.-Va.) about the timing of the bill, but said that he “would expect it to be on the floor in two or three weeks.”

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Forbes is a fucking idiot for spending time, money and effort on this when there are certainly more important things to be done. Lets pass a fucking budget first.

[Deathravin]

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/17/house-panel-votes-on-in-god-we-trust/comment-page-1/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E_pluribus_unum

"E Pluribus Unum" (One out of Many) is the national motto.

Conservatives cling to this 1950's push to make America into a Christian nation and claim to be doing it in the name of the Founders of this nation. When the Founders themselves were very careful not to establish religion and as the 1st part of the 1st amendment clearly shows the Founders were very much opposed to doing such.

The SCOTUS has time and time again refused to hear cases involving the pledge and this abominable "motto". It's ridiculous. And don't get me started on the Religious tax-exempt status.

Any and all mention of "God" is in respect to superstition and religion. There is no way around this fact.

[Parkbandit]

In God We Trust was adopted as the official motto of the United States in 1956. It is also the motto of the U.S. state of Florida. The phrase has appeared on U.S. coins since 1864 and on paper currency since 1957.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_God_We_Trust

Personally, as an atheist, I think it's stupid. I believe it's even more dumb if we are wasting time on it right now instead of the gigantic fiscal crisis we are creating.

But it is the official motto of the United States of America.

[IorakeWarhammer]

as a believer in God, it's nice to recognize Him for His bounties.

but sticking His name on money is just unislamic. you see, the money could get dirty. Muslim belief is sensitive about putting God's name on paper or another object, then taking it into places like the bathroom (where it's forbidden to utter God's name)

ultimately, this is a secular country. the atheists and Muslims could really come together on this one. the Shariah-compliant thing to do would be to remove God's name from the money. atheists would have the satisfaction of removing the recognition of God for everything He does from another high-profile location. the Muslims would have the satisfaction of preserving the sanctity of God's name.

[Cephalopod]

In God We Trust was adopted as the official motto of the United States in 1956. It is also the motto of the U.S. state of Florida. The phrase has appeared on U.S. coins since 1864 and on paper currency since 1957.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_God_We_Trust

Personally, as an atheist, I think it's stupid. I believe it's even more dumb if we are wasting time on it right now instead of the gigantic fiscal crisis we are creating.

But it is the official motto of the United States of America.

Think of all the jobs this will create if it passes though! All those new engravings we can make on the outside AND inside of the buildings!

[Deathravin]

as a believer in God, it's nice to recognize Him for His bounties.

but sticking His name on money is just unislamic. you see, the money could get dirty. Muslim belief is sensitive about putting God's name on paper or another object, then taking it into places like the bathroom (where it's forbidden to utter God's name)

ultimately, this is a secular country. the atheists and Muslims could really come together on this one. the Shariah-compliant thing to do would be to remove God's name from the money. atheists would have the satisfaction of removing the recognition of God for everything He does from another high-profile location. the Muslims would have the satisfaction of preserving the sanctity of God's name.

Stop it. You're making me want to ditch my frustration about this issue and keep it on the coins, motto, and etched into every person's forehead just to make you uncomfortable.

http://jasonjeffrey.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/south-park-muhammad.jpg
^ Muhammad, The prophet of the Muslim Quran, as depicted and shown on television by South Park - July 4, 2001

[IorakeWarhammer]

i knew you'd be torn

let's partner up and make a better world.

[Gan]

As if we do not have enough things to work on in Congress. Things that actually need attention, say like the budget, Libya, Japan, etc.

[Stanley Burrell]

I'm the original G-O-D:

Making young ladies scream's my specialty.

When I go "DUN-DUN-DUN-DUH," girls get hype, from the funky fresh music that was stereotyped.

[Parkbandit]

Think of all the jobs this will create if it passes though! All those new engravings we can make on the outside AND inside of the buildings!

I don't believe in government created jobs... unless someone besides the US taxpayer is going to be footing the bill.

[IorakeWarhammer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ut-msBN_Zs&feature=fvwrel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdpPUyeHnuU&feature=fvwrel

Mobb Deep - G.O.D. Pt. 3 then Remix

original video!!!

[Ardwen]

This is as idiotic as the law requiring new street signs, lets cut NPR and then spend ten times that savings on signage, what are we doing playing a game of one step forward two steps back with the federal budget?

[Cephalopod]

I don't believe in government created jobs... unless someone besides the US taxpayer is going to be footing the bill.

Yes, that sentence was pretty much targeted at you (and most 'real' conservatives) who should be pissed off at the sort of conservative social activism like this that is going to result in MORE government jobs.

[Parkbandit]

Yes, that sentence was pretty much targeted at you (and most 'real' conservatives) who should be pissed off at the sort of conservative social activism like this that is going to result in MORE government jobs.

In case you haven't figured it out yet... I'm pretty much against all conservative social activism.

[Deathravin]

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US department of energy. I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the national weather service of the national oceanographic and atmospheric administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the national aeronautics and space administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US department of agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the food and drug administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US congress and kept accurate by the national institute of standards and technology and the US naval observatory, I get into my national highway traffic safety administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads build by the local, state, and federal departments of transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the environmental protection agency, using legal tender issed by the federal reserve bank. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US postal service and drop the kids off at the public school.

After spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the department of labor and the occupational safety and health administration, enjoying another two meals which again do not kill me because of the USDA, I drive my NHTSA car back home on the DOT roads, to ny house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and fire marshal’s inspection, and which has not been plundered of all it’s valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log on to the internet which was developed by the defense advanced research projects administration and post on GSPlayers forums about how I don't believe in government created jobs... unless someone besides the US taxpayer is going to be footing the bill.

ftfy

I could add that you also weren't taken over, blown up, or in much of any danger from outside governments due to the hard work by our Armed Forces, but that would hurt the integrity of the quote.

[Fallen]

lol.

[Tgo01]

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated, but not controlled or dispensed by the US department of energy. I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility which has always had a monopolist, ironclad grip on that whole sector.

After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels, the content of which is provided by private news firms, to see what the national weather service of the national oceanographic and atmospheric administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the national aeronautics and space administration as well as other private firms, such as Lockeed-Martin, Northop and Boeing just to name a few, without which the US space program and modern day NWS and NOAA would not exist.

I watched this while eating my breakfast of US department of agriculture inspected food which was grown and raised by private farms and coops, and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the food and drug administration, but made and dispensed by those evil drug companies.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US congress and kept accurate by the national institute of standards and technology and the US naval observatory, which uses the Atomic Clock, first manufactured by National Company of Malden and now maintained by HP, I get into my national highway traffic safety administration approved automobile which would fall apart within a mile if manufactured by them, and set out to work on the roads build by the private contractor firms which bid on contracts sent out by federal departments of transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the environmental protection agency yet still provided and dispensed by the evil oil companies, using legal tender issued by the federal reserve bank which would be worth as much as toilet paper if not for the private market.
On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US postal service, which is going under like the mighty Titanic due to their poor management and drop the kids off at the public school which is not nearly as good as a private school, but it’s free, right? After you pay for it with your taxes, that is.

After spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the regulations imposed by the department of labor and the occupational safety and health administration on my workplace which is most likely a private firm as well, enjoying another two meals which again do not kill me because of the USDA, plus the fact that living customers are a lot more useful to private food manufacturers then dead ones, I drive my ,NHTSA regulated but not built, car back home on the DOT roads built by private contractors, to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and fire marshal’s inspection and the fact that the private contractor firm that built it knew what they were doing, and which has not been plundered of all it’s valuables thanks to the local police department which heavily relies on cooperation with private security firms.

I then log on to the internet which was developed by the defense advanced research projects administration but brought to people like you and me by “hackers” from MIT and then “pipelined” by AT&T and post on GSPlayers forums about how government created jobs is not so bad because the government needs to wipe my nose for me, since I can’t do it myself and don’t know the difference between regulatory agencies versus manufacturers and providers of goods and services. "

.

[Deathravin]

.

So those regulatory agencies all employ robotic workers? Cool, I want a blue one.

[Parkbandit]

.

Far more accurate.

Thanks.

[Tgo01]

So those regulatory agencies all employ robotic workers? Cool, I want a blue one.

I don't know, I just found the first rebuttal to your copy and paste there and posted it. I thought it was funny.

[TheEschaton]

Are you implying all the things in Deathravin's post would be better sans regulation? That's delusional.

[Back]

Regulation is a necessity not because capitalism is evil but because there are dishonest people out there who will try cheat for profit at the consumer’s expense.

[Deathravin]

Regulation is a necessity not because capitalism is evil but because there are dishonest people out there who will try cheat for profit at the consumer’s expense.

Capitalism by definition means that the company that cheats will always beat out the company who doesn't.

[Deathravin]

This is all moot and widlly off topic.

Bottom line: 1950's are over. Can we get out of this Christian state bullshit and back to respecting the first amendment?

[Tgo01]

Are you implying all the things in Deathravin's post would be better sans regulation? That's delusional.

No I'm implying I think it's funny that what he copy and pasted didn't seem to make the distinction between private firms providing goods and services and those agencies that regulate them.

[Tgo01]

This is all moot and widlly off topic.

Bottom line: 1950's are over. Can we get out of this Christian state bullshit and back to respecting the first amendment?

How is this not respecting the first amendment?

[Parkbandit]

This is all moot and widlly off topic.

Can we just pretend I didn't start this fail off topic train?

ftfy

[Parkbandit]

This is all moot and widlly off topic.

Bottom line: 1950's are over. Can we get out of this Christian state bullshit and back to respecting the first amendment?

Are you making the claim that "In God We Trust" isn't the official motto of the United States of America?

Just because you don't agree with it (and by the way, neither do I) doesn't mean it's disrespecting the first amendment.

[EasternBrand]

Are you making the claim that "In God We Trust" isn't the official motto of the United States of America?

Just because you don't agree with it (and by the way, neither do I) doesn't mean it's disrespecting the first amendment.

I actually have to agree with PB here. Not every state-sanctioned reference to religion is necessarily violative of the First Amendment. The Supreme Court has images of Moses in the building. That doesn't mean they're using their institutional power to try to proselytize Judaism. There are a lot of people who get hyperbolic over this issue, but really... the better argument is that this bill is completely useless and acting as an emotional blinder to the more relevant issues of the day.

[Deathravin]

Rep. Randy Forbes is on a mission to pass a resolution affirming that the national motto "In God We Trust" and House Republicans are playing right along, so it is no surprise that Religious Right activists like the Family Research Council's Ken Klukowski are stepping up to make their contribution to this important effort as well:
Odds are good the Founding Fathers would be astounded by the religious controversies of this past week.
First, Rep. Randy Forbes, R-VA, introduced a resolution reaffirming “In God We Trust” as our national motto. He did so in part after President Obama wrongly claimed the national motto is “E Pluribus Unum.”
Forbes’s resolution failed last year when he introduced it under House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and her Democratic majority. Now under Republicans, the resolution is headed to a floor vote after being approved by the House Judiciary Committee.
Even so, Rep. Bobby Scott, D-VA, claimed the words “In God We Trust” are unconstitutional, an assertion that would likely stun James Madison and members of the first Congress who approved the First Amendment.
Can I just point out that "In God We Trust" did not become our national motto until the 1950s, as John Fea explained in "Was America Founded As a Christian Nation?: A Historical Introduction":
In 1954 Congress approved an act to add the words "under God" to the Pledge of Allegiance ... In 1955 this connection between God and the United States was further strengthened when Congress opted to put the words "In God We Trust" on all United States coins and currency. The following years it changed the national motto from "E Plurbius Unum" to "In God We Trust."
Allow me also to point out that in 1776, Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, and Benjamin Franklin were tasked with designing Great Seal of the United States, which they did - and it carried the phrase "E Pluribus Unum."
In fact, "E Pluribus Unum" was considered the de facto motto of the United States for nearly two hundred years ... until it was changed to "In God We Trust" in 1955.
So I am pretty sure that the Founding Fathers would be stunned to learn that the national motto is "In God We Trust," given that Congress adopted the Great Seal with its motto of "E Pluribus Unum" in 1782.
source (http://www.secularnewsdaily.com/2011/03/24/the-founding-fathers-had-a-national-motto-e-pluribus-unum-2/)


E Pluribus Unum represents everything great about America. It shows our foundation of inclusivity. You can be Black, White, Asian, Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, whatever, and still be 100% American. Whereas most countries are founded on nationalism, America instead has patriotism, which sheds the xenophobic and small-minded ideals of national identity for the loftier concepts of the good a country can do, such as equality and freedom. Losing sight of that in some silly religious territory-marking will be disastrous for America's future.

[Tgo01]

So I am pretty sure that the Founding Fathers would be stunned to learn that the national motto is "In God We Trust," given that Congress adopted the Great Seal with its motto of "E Pluribus Unum" in 1782.

I'm sure the founding fathers would be stunned we have cars and electricity but that doesn't mean they are unconstitutional.

[Deathravin]

I'm sure the founding fathers would be stunned we have cars and electricity but that doesn't mean they are unconstitutional.

I agree 'stunned' may have been the wrong word. However, the premise is the same and not difficult to understand. Through their actions during the formation and running of this country they were very clear that Religion should play no part in United States government. They were careful to keep their personal Religions off the official books.

For example the original Presidential oath of office didn't include 'So help me God' at the end and it certainly wasn't prompted from George Washington. He was prompted to recite the oath and then took it upon himself to add it when he was done, and it was thusly adopted as tradition. I find it personally infuriating that the Chief Justice prompts for it. If the president wants to add it to the end, that's his prerogative, it shouldn't be prompted by the oath giver.

This careful balance was fine, but when you start putting this on the money, in the pledge to the flag of the United States, and on public buildings, that's far more overt than the evidence of 175 years of lawmaking would point to.

It is (clearly) debatable whether this is outright unconstitutional. However, it is clearly against the ideals of the men who wrote the first amendment to begin with.

[Tgo01]

It is (clearly) debatable whether this is outright unconstitutional. However, it is clearly against the ideals of the men who wrote the first amendment to begin with.

This much I can agree with.

[EasternBrand]

neg "In God We... 03-24-2011 11:58 AM ya, you're wrong for the right reasons

Which part am I wrong about? The part about the Supreme Court not proselytizing? The part about how this is a resource sink? The part about people getting agitated (this rep was admittedly not hyperbolic, so maybe that's the part I was wrong about)?

[Latrinsorm]

I agree 'stunned' may have been the wrong word. However, the premise is the same and not difficult to understand. Through their actions during the formation and running of this country they were very clear that Religion should play no part in United States government. They were careful to keep their personal Religions off the official books.

For example the original Presidential oath of office didn't include 'So help me God' at the end and it certainly wasn't prompted from George Washington. He was prompted to recite the oath and then took it upon himself to add it when he was done, and it was thusly adopted as tradition. I find it personally infuriating that the Chief Justice prompts for it. If the president wants to add it to the end, that's his prerogative, it shouldn't be prompted by the oath giver.

This careful balance was fine, but when you start putting this on the money, in the pledge to the flag of the United States, and on public buildings, that's far more overt than the evidence of 175 years of lawmaking would point to.

It is (clearly) debatable whether this is outright unconstitutional. However, it is clearly against the ideals of the men who wrote the first amendment to begin with.All I got from this was that we need to elect Bobby Brown, or failing that Britney Spears.

[Deathravin]

source: http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=llac&fileName=001/llac001.db&recNum=16
http://memory.loc.gov/ll/llac/001/0000/00170027.gif


the foundations of our national policy will be laid in the pure and immutable principles of private morality.

[Parkbandit]

“It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible.”


“Let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.”.


“The propitious smiles of Heaven can never be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right which Heaven itself has ordained”

[EasternBrand]

Fact #1: Ben Franklin requested and won approval for a Christian chaplain to come and deliver a sermon and prayer during the Constitutional Convention, in an effort to defuse tensions near the end of the debates.

Fact #2: Ben Franklin was a serious badass.

Opinion #1: I don't think Fact #1 means that we are a "Christian country" in the way that the religious right thinks we are or should be, but that doesn't necessarily mean that any mention of God in public is unconstitutional ipso facto.

Opinion #2: You are a piece of shit if you disagree with Fact #2.

[pabstblueribbon]

Ben Franklin was knee-deep in pussy.

[4a6c1]

I wish George Washington really posted here.

[Delias]

The problem here is that you're trying to make a religious problem out of what is clearly a racial issue. Let me explain.

1. G.W. Bush believes in God. He talks to him, I assume, either through prayer or some sort of necromantic ritual.

2. The fact that this man became president is obviously proof of God's favor.

3. G.W. Bush doesn't care about black people.

4. ergo, God doesn't care about black people.

5. Racists.

P.S.- I am considering running for the House.

[Parkbandit]

Fact #1: Ben Franklin requested and won approval for a Christian chaplain to come and deliver a sermon and prayer during the Constitutional Convention, in an effort to defuse tensions near the end of the debates.

Fact #2: Ben Franklin was a serious badass.

Opinion #1: I don't think Fact #1 means that we are a "Christian country" in the way that the religious right thinks we are or should be, but that doesn't necessarily mean that any mention of God in public is unconstitutional ipso facto.

Opinion #2: You are a piece of shit if you disagree with Fact #2.

Can't disagree with anything, especially #2.

[Tgo01]

Neg "In God We... 03-26-2011 06:46 AM I genuinely don't know if you are intentionally being dense to make a point, or if you really are mildly retarded.-Delias

Sorry I didn't include pictures in my post. Reading all them words must have been hard without a visual aid.

[Delias]

Neg "In God We... 03-26-2011 06:46 AM I genuinely don't know if you are intentionally being dense to make a point, or if you really are mildly retarded.-Delias

Sorry I didn't include pictures in my post. Reading all them words must have been hard without a visual aid.

OH SNAP. You sure got me there. I'm just a country boy at heart 'thout no real citified ways to get me by in the big complex world, and that readin' thang sure is hard.

I could probably find my middle school standardized testing reading scores, if you want. They never improved... because they didn't have a higher score.

I am teh best reder and huked on fonics werks fer me.

[Tgo01]

I could probably find my middle school standardized testing reading scores, if you want. They never improved... because they didn't have a higher score.

Shouldn't be hard, I'm sure your mom still has it posted on her refrigerator.

[Delias]

Shouldn't be hard, I'm sure your mom still has it posted on her refrigerator.

I've written like six different responses and erased them all. You know why? You got me. Good job.

[Deathravin]

http://i.imgur.com/rN2F0.jpg