Atheism at Christmas

[crb]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091209/ap_on_re/us_rel_religion_today

This article had me laughing.

I think most atheists don't know what the hell they are. I say this as an atheist myself. I don't believe in any god or any mystical powers.

But...

1. You are not an atheist if you think christian music, messages, or prayer can harm you. If you believe in the mystical power of words, you are not an atheist.

2. You are not an atheist if you celebrate pagan holidays, you are a pagan, or wiccan, which is not athiesm.

Some choice bits



For one thing, it's a chance to share coping techniques during this most religious time of year. They range from the simple, like warning about certain stores that blare religious Christmas songs, to tougher tasks like how to avoid certain topics with certain family members.

Yes, if an atheist walks into a store blaring "What child is this?" (interesting use of the word blare there too... diction is how journalists slant stories). They will melt, turn into a pillar of salt, or both, beware!



Even as they chafe at the omnipresence of Christmas, many of the atheists here are quick to stress their belief in the pagan roots of a yearly celebration near the winter solstice.

How can an atheist have a belief in a pagan ritual?



"Food, we like. Presents, we like. Seeing family, we like," said Val Woelfel of St. Paul, an aspiring archaeologist. Woelfel, 47, and her boyfriend, Bjorn Larsen, 32, planned to erect a tree in their living room: "Sacred trees are an ancient custom. It's pretty, it smells nice and it's pagan," Woelfel said.

So,,, you're wiccan, pagan, or atheist?

I think too many people adopt atheism because they want to be anti-Christian. So it is no wonder that they get confused, they don't have a disbelief in the supernatural, just a dislike of christianity.

As an actual atheist I get as offended by a baby jesus display as I do a pink flamingo.

If you believe that words, symbols, or artifacts can have supernatural spiritual powers associated with them, you are not an atheist. And if you don't believe the above, there is no reason to be offended by or to avoid same.

[Androidpk]

I'd have to disagree. Just because one is an atheist doesn't mean they can't value a religious persons opinions and ideas.

[BriarFox]

They picked some incredibly dumb atheists for this article.

[Tisket]

I don't care if you're pagan, christian, or atheist...just give me gifts and we are cool.

[Cephalopod]

This article proves Christianity doesn't have a lock on the 'dumbass' gene.

[Kithus]

1. You are not an atheist if you think christian music, messages, or prayer can harm you. If you believe in the mystical power of words, you are not an atheist.



I also consider myself an atheist and the Christmas music at all the stores does bother me a little. Of course that has little to do with mystic powers of music. I simply find it irritating. Its all you hear in stores from Halloween until Christmas these days.




2. You are not an atheist if you celebrate pagan holidays, you are a pagan, or wiccan, which is not athiesm.



You can celebrate the solstice without it being a "pagan" holiday. At the same time I personally just stick with celebrating Christmas. I don't believe in the religious views behind it but I can enjoy it as a secular holiday much as I enjoy Halloween, Thanksgiving and New Years. The atheists in this article seem to be trying too hard.


My issue with the people discussed in this article is that they're trying so hard to be atheist that they seem to be pushing their non-religion on others. That or using it as an excuse to treat others poorly.



For one thing, it's a chance to share coping techniques during this most religious time of year.


Its a holiday celebrated all over the country. There is no tramatic event taking place here. You don't need coping mechanisms. These people are no better than some jewish parents who won't let their kids school have a Christmas tree. Just enjoy the season for what it is and pass on the trip to church with the family.



Some of the atheist attitudes toward Christmas seem the result of well-practiced defense mechanisms. Castle, for instance, gets just as irritated when people tell her "Merry Christmas" as some Christians do when people tell them "Happy Holidays." O'Neill, who declines to give her age, said she wished parents would tell their kids there is no God at the same time they pass along certain information about Santa Claus.


The atheists annoyed by Merry Christmas and the Christians annoyed by Happy Holidays are both idiots. Another human being, who may or may not share your beliefs, is wishing you well. There's nothing to get offended about there. Also, while I reserve the right to teach my kids what I believe (A right revoked by their mother), I also recognize other parents rights to share their beliefs with their children.

Note: Re-reading that it sounds like I'm angry with my girlfriend. She would prefer I not explicitly tell our children there is no god. They know daddy doesn't believe and they are welcome to make their own decision. Even if I wanted to push my beliefs upon them, I know she would be unhappy with it. My life is much easier when she's happy.



For some atheists, the proximity to believers is even closer. Jim Wright, a retired merchandiser, lives with his 92-year-old mother in St. Paul. She "believes all that crap," he said.

"She wants me to come back to God, but I can't because he never existed," Wright said. This Christmas, he said, "I told her if she wants lights on the side of the house that she needs to do it. She's long since given up on the tree."


This just makes me sick. Just because you don't believe the same thing as your 92 year old mother you aren't willing to help her hang some lights. You've outright forbid a tree? These Christmas trinkets offend you so deeply you will treat the woman that gave you life this poorly. Its assholes like this that make for the negative stereotypes for the rest of us.

[Fallen]

I'm an agnostic, and I like Christmas. Hell, just think of it as X-mas and enjoy it as much as all the rest of our commercialized holidays. Only commies hate Christmas. You aren't a communist...are YA?!!?

[Warriorbird]

I like to think of Christmas as a celebration of family and American commerce.

[Dwarven Empath]

It's the same shit that happens around this time of the year.

At my wife's work, if they want to say anything, they have been instructed to say Happy Holidays.

She works at a bank.

So typical in today's world.

I hate it.

Medi/Matt

[Tisket]

At my wife's work, if they want to say anything, they have been instructed to say Happy Holidays.


I had a job like that once. And after the request from management that we avoid any religious overtones in dealing with customers, I made it a point to loudly say "Merry Christmas" to everyone who came in. You know what management did to me? Jack shit.

Maybe because I made them a shitload of money that year, who knows. Anyway, I hated those micromanaging assholes, so that might have had something to do with my mini rebellion.

[EasternBrand]

I don't celebrate Christmas, and neither does my family. There are other holidays around this time of year, so when I'm interacting with a total stranger, I do prefer Happy Holidays over Merry Christmas. The latter sounds strange to me because I didn't really know a lot of people who celebrated Christmas until high school. I don't get upset no matter which they choose, though, because it would be incredibly stupid and thoughtless to take someone's graciousness and shit all over it. You have to take it for the feeling behind it, not the form it takes.

Of course, two or three years ago, I was working retail behind the counter, and wished some old dude Happy Holidays after he had paid and was walking out. He stopped, turned, glared at me, paused a few beats, and with a voice just dripping with venom, said "Merry Christmas" and walked out. It was by far the least merry delivery that greeting has ever had.

[Dwarven Empath]

I had a job like that once. And after the request from management that we avoid any religious overtones in dealing with customers, I made it a point to loudly say "Merry Christmas" to everyone who came in. You know what management did to me? Jack shit.

Maybe because I made them a shitload of money that year, who knows. Anyway, I hated those micromanaging assholes, so that might have had something to do with my mini rebellion.

I agree. Wish I had a job that I could do the same thing.

[Methais]

The atheists annoyed by Merry Christmas and the Christians annoyed by Happy Holidays are both idiots.

The only time "Happy Holidays" annoys me is when it's said purely out of political correctness, regardless of the person's beliefs.

[Fallen]

In all honesty, I don't really even pay attention enough to what people say to make a distinction. If someone got genuinely and visibly mad at it being said either way I would probably laugh, though.

[Methais]

I don't get mad about it or even say anything about it. I just think it's gay as hell when someone says "Happy Holidays" not because they don't believe in Christmas or whatever, but because they're worried that saying "Merry Christmas" will offend someone.

We need a politically incorrect holiday where everyone is obligated to offend people all day.

[Tisket]

We need a politically incorrect holiday where everyone is obligated to offend people all day.

It'd be like living in a live action internet.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I don't get mad about it or even say anything about it. I just think it's gay as hell when someone says "Happy Holidays" not because they don't believe in Christmas or whatever, but because they're worried that saying "Merry Christmas" will offend someone.

We need a politically incorrect holiday where everyone is obligated to offend people all day.

Happy Hope Your Sister Gets Raped in the Ass By Satanists Day!!

The article is pretty hilarious though. A lot of my family is agnostic and no one that I know of has been offended by anyone saying "Merry Christmas".

I don't get why people have to fuck with tradition to turn it into some huge political statement.

[Methais]

I don't get why people have to fuck with tradition to turn it into some huge political statement.

Because people like to QQ about everything so they can have their own reality show.

[Celephais]

Girls like swarms of lizards, right?

[Geshron]

It definitely has become just a commercialized holiday. As an atheist I don't feel I should be denied the right. Given that I only have one grandparent left, I more or less show up and celebrate it in honor of the tradition, not the specifics of the holiday. Those are some painfully stupid anti-Christian atheists though. For the most part I am an anti-theist and don't think religion is good for anyone or anything outside your own personal spiritual view.

[Gan]

Girls like swarms of lizards, right?

I was thinking a pearl necklace...

[Gan]

My uber-religious mother in law launched into a diatribe about the birthday of Jesus (Christmas).

I really pissed her off when I brought up the idea that December 25th was really not the estimated time of year of Jesus's birth and that December 25th was really a pagan holiday that the Roman Church adopted as Christmas in order to subvert the pagan celebration of winter solstice.

Good times, good times. :)

[Ashlander]

My uber-religious mother in law launched into a diatribe about the birthday of Jesus (Christmas).

I really pissed her off when I brought up the idea that December 25th was really not the estimated time of year of Jesus's birth and that December 25th was really a pagan holiday that the Roman Church adopted as Christmas in order to subvert the pagan celebration of winter solstice.

Good times, good times. :)

Gonna love to see what happens when you tell her the world wasn't really made in 6 days.

[Gan]

Gonna love to see what happens when you tell her the world wasn't really made in 6 days.

I'm saving that one for later. If I dont space these events out she's apt to stroke out and I'm not interested in having her move in with us.

[Androidpk]

Basically this is one of the reason why there is so much shit in the world. People can't accept other people's opinions. It's just human nature.

[Latrinsorm]

It's a hell of a thing that people can go out of their way to take offense at people going out of their way not to offend them.

[Methais]

It's a hell of a thing that people can go out of their way to take offense at people going out of their way not to offend them.

It's also a shame that so many people have a pipe up their ass all the time and insist on QQing how everything offends them to the point where now people go out of their way to not offend people about things that nobody would be offended about in the first place.

[Androidpk]

Baaaaah!

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

My uber-religious mother in law launched into a diatribe about the birthday of Jesus (Christmas).

I really pissed her off when I brought up the idea that December 25th was really not the estimated time of year of Jesus's birth and that December 25th was really a pagan holiday that the Roman Church adopted as Christmas in order to subvert the pagan celebration of winter solstice.

Good times, good times. :)

http://www.rsboards.com/runescape-forum/gallery/data/624/stormtrooper-hump.gif

Really though.

[Ker_Thwap]

What the hell is wrong with pink flamingos?

[Cephalopod]

What the hell is wrong with pink flamingos?

http://home.comcast.net/~flickhead/PF120507.jpg