Schumer's Proposal

[crb]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090514/ap_on_go_co/us_health_overhaul



Schumer's proposal would require the public plan to be financed by premiums, not tax dollars. It would have to follow the same solvency rules as private insurers, maintaining a reserve fund to cover liabilities. Doctors and hospitals would be free to participate in the plan, or opt out. And the public plan would have to operate under the same consumer protection rules as private insurers.

I don't get it, but I don't mind it. We already have nonprofit insurers like that, I use one, if the government wants to do it, let them. Doctor's aren't facistly forced to accept it, and my tax dollars don't fund it. Let them eat cake.

I don't see how it helps the uninsured, I don't see how people could afford it. But I like that Schumer is thinking about these things, very uncharacteristic for a Democrat.

Maybe after the Government gives a go at being an insurance company they'll realize how all the "consumer protection mandates" like requiring all insurance plans have coverage for weird things bought by special interests (chiropractor, accupuncture, etc etc) makes insurance unnecessarily expensive for people. Then maybe they'll pare those down so that people can actually afford health insurance that is an insurance plan, not a maintenance plan, as some states have done. Providing no frills catastrophic health insurance plans at less than $100 a month, that'll cover you if you get really sick or seriously injured. Not everyone needs to drive a Cadillac.

[Mabus]

I just hope we have a serious and prolonged debate about the direction of the health care system before they pass a bill that is costly, doesn't work and favors the insurance/pharmaceutical industries over the consumers.

If we are going to take the plunge into "universal" health care we should view all the world's existing plans, find what works (and what does not) and then meld the working parts with the expectations of our own citizenry.

I don't mind paying for a Porsche if I am getting a Porsche. I just don't want to pay for a Porsche and get a Gremlin.

[Parkbandit]

I just hope we have a serious and prolonged debate about the direction of the health care system before they pass a bill that is costly, doesn't work and favors the insurance/pharmaceutical industries over the consumers.

If we are going to take the plunge into "universal" health care we should view all the world's existing plans, find what works (and what does not) and then meld the working parts with the expectations of our own citizenry.

I don't mind paying for a Porsche if I am getting a Porsche. I just don't want to pay for a Porsche and get a Gremlin.

We won't. The Congress will come up with their socialized healthcare plan.. it will be rushed through Congress because they have the votes. They will push it through this summer when most people are on vacation or not watching the news like they do the other 3 seasons and we will wake up around October saying "WTF!? My taxes are going up for this trainwreck!?"

[TheRunt]

"a requirement that all must carry coverage."
"also require employers to offer coverage to their full-time workers, or pay a percentage of their payroll to the government."

Those 2 jumped out at me.

[Mabus]

"a requirement that all must carry coverage."
If we are required to carry health insurance then make the insurance companies non-profits with a nationalized pool.

Last thing we need is another "auto insurance" scam, where you are forced to have it but the companies can charge high rates to increase their profits.

[crb]

most states make it a law that you need auto insurance, I would be fine with a similar thing for health insurance.

The fact is, you can find affordable insurance, especially the young people who are most often without it. You just have to budget.

Most people go

rent, food, car, car insurance, sins (alcohol, tobacco), entertainment (cable, cell phone, internet), clothing/accessories, petty cash, oh shit I can't afford health insurance.

It should go.

rent, food, health insurance, car....

Better to ride the bus and be with health insurance than drive a car and be without it.

That could even attach it to car driving. Want to renew your license plates? Show proof of both CAR and Health insurance. You don't need gold plated health insurance, you just need something.

[Proxy]

see my sig pic, the Elder Party Agenda Moves Forward!!!!

[radamanthys]

Health insurance is socialized healthcare.

Everyone pays, some use more, some use less. That's the idea. And, it's also why healthcare prices are a billion times more than they should be. An aspirin at the hospital costs the same as the GDP of a small country- this is the reason. If people don't have to actually pay, suppliers can charge as much as they want.

Those stuck with the bill are the ones not needing the care. It's fundamentally unfair. Unequal, if you will.

See the VA/Walter Reed scandals for a good approximation of how a 'universal healthcare' system run by the government will work.

[crb]

Health insurance is socialized healthcare.

Everyone pays, some use more, some use less. That's the idea. And, it's also why healthcare prices are a billion times more than they should be. An aspirin at the hospital costs the same as the GDP of a small country- this is the reason. If people don't have to actually pay, suppliers can charge as much as they want.

Those stuck with the bill are the ones not needing the care. It's fundamentally unfair. Unequal, if you will.

See the VA/Walter Reed scandals for a good approximation of how a 'universal healthcare' system run by the government will work.
Not quite right.

Healthcare prices are a billion times higher than they should be because the purchasers of healthcare are not the consumers of healthcare, so the consumers of healthcare have no motive to shop around to force providers to compete on price.

In areas that insurance does not cover, so the purchaser is the consumer, healthcare costs drop, in real dollar terms, over time. See most cosmetic procedures. They've gotten both better, more technologically advanced, and cheaper. Why? Because the consumer is paying out of pocket so they make price an issue in their purchase decision. This incentivizes providers to look for cost efficiencies.

[Rocktar]

Not quite right.

Healthcare prices are a billion times higher than they should be because the purchasers of healthcare are not the consumers of healthcare, so the consumers of healthcare have no motive to shop around to force providers to compete on price.

Very true, however it ignores the influence that 40 years of retarded malpractice lawyers and idiot juries have played in the costs of medical care and in the execution of treatment. This has been a major influence in the rising cost of medical care and in the over ordering of disgnostic testing.

[crb]

also a cost contributor yes. There are lots of things.

1. onerous regulations increasing the administrative costs of providing healthcare.

2. consumer/purchaser disconnect resulting in price apathy on behalf of the consumer.

3. Malpractice run amok, causing both claims and insurance, but also the real cost sink, defensive medicine, where expensive ass-covering tests are ordered not because they're needed, but because not ordering them would open you up to legal liability.

4. Poor patient education, ERs in most states are not allowed to turn people away, so when people go there for stupid shit, they get seen. Instead someone should kick them in the head and say "This is an ER, don't come here for stupid shit." and either refer them to a free or paid primary care clinic in the area.

5. Lifestyle. We spend more on healthcare, and we need to, because our populace largely has an unhealthy lifestyle. Unhealthy people need more medical care than healthy people, obviously. Eat your veggies!