Legalization: Its a Good Time

[Back]

Isn’t about time we stopped pouring money into a worthless fight and just legalize a product that is as American as apple pie so the government can collect taxes on sales for more standard of life programs?

[Xaerve]

I am so glad you took the time to make this thread.

Idiot.

[Parkbandit]

Isn’t about time we stopped pouring money into a worthless fight and just legalize a product that is as American as apple pie so the government can collect taxes on sales for more standard of life programs?


That's exactly what this country needs... worthless, stoned lumps who have the munchies.

[SolitareConfinement]

a 13 year old child can get marijuana and other drugs easier than alcohol and tobacco...and yet those 2 things are legal. and why can children get these things easier than they other 2? because, prohibition never works as well as regulation and control. drug dealers don't ask may i see your id before one goes using said drug

[Jorddyn]

That's exactly what this country needs... worthless, stoned lumps who have the munchies.

I prefer them to the violent stupid drunks who decide to get on the roads.

[Back]

That's exactly what this country needs... worthless, stoned lumps who have the munchies.

But think about it... all those worthless lumps would be buying not just product but munchies. The government would be collecting taxes on it to pay for free healthcare for everyone and munchie makers would have to employ millions of new workers to keep up with the demand.

[Apotheosis]

I am totally in support of an increased risk of testicular cancer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090209/hl_nm/us_cancer_marijuana

yes, i'm aware it's not a "definitive study"

[Cephalopod]

But think about it... all those worthless lumps would be buying not just product but munchies. The government would be collecting taxes on it to pay for free healthcare for everyone and munchie makers would have to employ millions of new workers to keep up with the demand.

We can title it the 'Backlash Stimulus Package'.

[SolitareConfinement]

I am totally in support of an increased risk of testicular cancer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090209/hl_nm/us_cancer_marijuana

yes, i'm aware it's not a "definitive study"

rofl i love posts like this

edit: btw did you even read this article before you posted it? or just look at the title?

[Keller]

That's exactly what this country needs... worthless, stoned lumps who have the munchies.

Like I said in the Michael Phelps thread -- teach kids that being lazy is bad. Not drugs. There is no reason you have to sit, eat doritos, and watch tv while on drugs.

[Parkbandit]

I prefer them to the violent stupid drunks who decide to get on the roads.


Yes, because you never see people drive under the influence of pot. Ever.

[CrystalTears]

Yes, because you never see people drive under the influence of pot. Ever.
Paranoid, driving about 15 miles per hour because it feels like you're speeding.

[SolitareConfinement]

Yes, because you never see people drive under the influence of pot. Ever.

yes but how many people are killed each year as a direct result of alcohol use/abuse? and how many die from marijuana use/abuse?

[Cephalopod]

That's the problem in this country. People are never satisfied with stuff the way it is. You gotta make it bigger and better and stronger and faster. Same way with pot. For years pot was just joints, and then bongs came out and bongs were ok too, but then bongs weren't good enough for some people. "Neeehhhhhh!" Remember that friend in high school wanted to make bongs out of everything. Making bongs out of apples and oranges and shit? Come in one day and find your friend going, "Hey! Look man, I made a bong outta my head! Put the pot in this ear and take it outta this one! Good! Take a hit! *snort*" Then they got one of those big giant bongs that you gotta start up like a motorcycle. "Put the pot in!" *motor starting* Kids are driving their bongs down FDR Drive. "Pull the bong over man, I wanna do a hit. Pull it over!"

What was the problem with just smoking a joint, eating a couple of Twinkies, and going to sleep? Was that a problem? They say marijuana leads to other drugs. No it doesn't, it leads to fucking carpentry. That's the problem, folks. People getting high going, "Wow man, this box would make an excellent bong! *snort* This guy's head would make an excellent bong! *snort*" Relax! That's why I stopped doing drugs in the first place. Not because I didn't like 'em, but because I didn't want to build anything, ok?

Pot smokers could definitely contribute to a lot of those 'shovel-ready' projects with their enhanced building skills.

[Methais]

That's exactly what this country needs... worthless, stoned lumps who have the munchies.

With the amount of people in this country that smoke pot on a regular basis, it would stimulate the hell out of the economy and probably end the recession.

Crime rates would drop too, and if we can get all the world leaders smoking, it would end war too. Unlike alcohol, which causes war (especially Schnapps), as proven on South Park.


Yes, because you never see people drive under the influence of pot. Ever.

When was the last time you saw a headline that said something like "FAMILY OF FOUR KILLED BY STONED DRIVER"?

When was the last time you saw a headline that said something like "FAMILY OF FOUR KILLED BY DRUNK DRIVER"?

[Apotheosis]

rofl i love posts like this

edit: btw did you even read this article before you posted it? or just look at the title?

i read the article some time ago..

i just thought it would be funny to drop it in... .

i could care less about the legalization / decriminalization issue, but I'm not ignorant to think that marijuana is completely free of "health risks" or health risk potentials, there just haven't been many conclusive studies one way or another..


on a side note, it's funny that this took place in Seattle.

[Methais]

there just haven't been many conclusive studies one way or another..

The conclusive study is that nobody has ever overdosed on pot and died.

[Apotheosis]

The conclusive study is that nobody has ever overdosed on pot and died.

well.. yeah.

[Mtenda]

Also-

Our jails are crowded while real criminals have their sentences drastically reduced.

It's not physiologically addictive in any way.

The entire image of marijuana in this country is based on propaganda.

No one has ever died as a direct result of smoking pot.

http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/images/propaganda.jpg

[Ignot]

I would open up a pot store in a minute. So would everyone else in the U.S. but I don't think it would matter.

[Mtenda]

i read the article some time ago..

i just thought it would be funny to drop it in... .

i could care less about the legalization / decriminalization issue, but I'm not ignorant to think that marijuana is completely free of "health risks" or health risk potentials, there just haven't been many conclusive studies one way or another..


on a side note, it's funny that this took place in Seattle.

I suppose if you smoke enough of it for a long enough time you might be able to get lung cancer. But in comparison to cigarettes or junk food, marijuana looks awfully damn healthy.

[SolitareConfinement]

i read the article some time ago..

i just thought it would be funny to drop it in... .

i could care less about the legalization / decriminalization issue, but I'm not ignorant to think that marijuana is completely free of "health risks" or health risk potentials, there just haven't been many conclusive studies one way or another..


on a side note, it's funny that this took place in Seattle.

well the main reason i posted as such, was because well frankly




The risk appeared to be highest among men who had reported smoking marijuana for at least 10 years, used it more than once a week or started using it before age 18, the researchers wrote in the journal Cancer.


what guy hasn't smoked weed before he turned 18? for the most part, every casual and heavy smoker alive, started before 18 years old.



Experts are unsure about the causes of testicular cancer, which often strikes men in their 20s and 30s. The disease is seen more commonly in men who have had an undescended testicle or have a family history of testicular cancer.


^^^^^^ exact reason i asked if you even read the article...which honestly to me sounds like idiot scientists who've drawn absolutely nothing but a coincidental conclusion and nothing more

[Back]

I would open up a pot store in a minute. So would everyone else in the U.S. but I don't think it would matter.

There is another good reason right there. Small businesses help the economy.

What about the poor alfalfa farmer? If legalization happened do you think he would not tear up his busted crop for something more in demand?

Everyones happy.

[Jorddyn]

Yes, because you never see people drive under the influence of pot. Ever.

No, but the motivation to move from one's couch, much less one's house, is much less. Why do you think pizza delivery was invented??

[Methais]

No, but the motivation to move from one's couch, much less one's house, is much less. Why do you think pizza delivery was invented??

I love delivering to stoners. The smell hits you in the face the second they open the door. I hate being high at work cause it makes me just wanna go home and pwn noobs, otherwise I'd tell them to give me a hit, which I have no doubt they would. They usually tip decent too, but drunks still tip better.

One time these black dudes were like $3 short for their order, so they gave me a few buds for the rest. The best part was they didn't even ask if I smoked, they were just like "Here man I got a few buds you can have for the rest."


what guy hasn't smoked weed before he turned 18? for the most part, every casual and heavy smoker alive, started before 18 years old.

A friend of mine didn't start til he was 25. I tried to get him to smoke with me all through high school and he wouldn't. His parents took him to a Pink Floyd concert once and he got all pissed off that they wanted to bring some smoke with them.

Lost touch for a few years, ran into him, turns out he smokes, etc.

The problem is he's still in that 15-year-old pothead mindset, where his life revolves around weed.

He's basically the exact stereotype that anti-drug people base their campaigns around. Not because he smokes pot though, but because he's just a really dumb person that happens to smoke pot (he was always dumb).

[Jorddyn]

One time these black dudes were like $3 short for their order, so they gave me a few buds for the rest. The best part was they didn't even ask if I smoked, they were just like "Here man I got a few buds you can have for the rest."

Strangely enough, that never happens at my job.

[Methais]

Strangely enough, that never happens at my job.

Accountants typically don't deliver pizza, so I can understand why it never happens at your job.

[Jorddyn]

Accountants typically don't deliver pizza, so I can understand why it never happens at your job.

No, but I'm picturing one of our customers showing up offering to pay off their account in such a manner. Could be entertaining!

[CrystalTears]

Accountants typically don't deliver pizza, so I can understand why it never happens at your job.
You don't know many accountants.

[Back]

We could do away with the Fed if everyone accepted it as a barter.

[Jorddyn]

You don't know many accountants.

The pot happens a lot.

People paying with it? Notsomuch :)

[Apotheosis]

anyway.. im a former marijuana user, and quit a long time ago because, among other things, it really was interfering with my professional life.. I was a 15 year, moderate smoker ( 2 - 3 times / week).

once I quit, I found out that I was able to make decisions / solve problems on the job quicker.

clearly, my experience is / was unique to my situation, but my health has improved and I feel like a "fog" was lifted from my cognitive process....

Sometimes I "miss" it, much like former smokers miss smoking cigarettes, but I did not suffer any physical withdraws, although I do feel that I suffered psychological withdrawal.

I am not against decriminalization, but am honest enough to admit that it does effect cognitive process more than "pro-marijuana" advocates would like to admit....

[CrystalTears]

The pot happens a lot.So does the pizza! (Which is why I replied as I did, or I could have confused his response, to which I say.. I blame the drugs.)

[Back]

I am not against decriminalization, but am honest enough to admit that it does effect cognitive process more than "pro-marijuana" advocates would like to admit....

What? (http://www.sagmeister.com/index.html)

Also, I don’t think anyone here has been “pro” about the use of an illegal substance. Unless you count people in the medical profession who prescribe it for debilitating diseases.

I don’t think Miller Lite has cured anyone of anything.

[SolitareConfinement]

A friend of mine didn't start til he was 25. I tried to get him to smoke with me all through high school and he wouldn't. His parents took him to a Pink Floyd concert once and he got all pissed off that they wanted to bring some smoke with them.

Lost touch for a few years, ran into him, turns out he smokes, etc.

The problem is he's still in that 15-year-old pothead mindset, where his life revolves around weed.

He's basically the exact stereotype that anti-drug people base their campaigns around. Not because he smokes pot though, but because he's just a really dumb person that happens to smoke pot (he was always dumb).

unfortunately a select few always ruin it for the rest of us. its sad that America has this image of cheech and chong/dazed and confused/Jim Breuer (the pot head lookin guy from half baked). and that is apparently all "stoners"

when i'd say most of us instead of coming home and sitting down relaxing with a beer or 2 after a day of work. we sit down take a few hits off the peace pipe and call it a day.

[Jorddyn]

I am not against decriminalization, but am honest enough to admit that it does effect cognitive process more than "pro-marijuana" advocates would like to admit....

I'm not pro-marijuana anymore than pro-choice advocates are pro-abortion.

I'm anti-prohibition and pro-letting-people-make-their-own-choices.

[Mabus]

there just haven't been many conclusive studies one way or another..
There is a reason for that, and it deals with political expediency. It is in the self interest of politicians to appear "tough on crime", and marijuana provides an easy scapegoat to the issues underlying the use of psychoactive substances.

The few studies done (allowed) have shown that smoking marijuana produces carcinogens, impairs short term (and by effect, long term) memory and in subjects prone to psychological conditions it can aggravate the conditions.

Never addressed in any US study are ingestion (eating) nor vaporization.

The NIH (http://www.nih.gov/news/medmarijuana/MedicalMarijuana.htm) concluded (under the Clinton administration) that there could well be medicinal uses for marijuana, and that more studies should be allowed. The Clinton administration harped on the "produces carcinogens" line from the report, and skipped the calls for studies and possible medicinal uses.

Comparatively, marijuana carries a lot less potential harm then many widely accepted pharmaceuticals. It is also less harmful then alcohol.

On the change.gov website asking for public input for the new administration on the most important issues facing the country legalization of marijuana ranked fourth. Not that an internet polling of interests means much, but just to show that the attitude has shifted.

There have been over five federal raids of state-authorized medical marijuana dispensaries since Obama took office. This even though he has in the past (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQr9ezr8UeA&feature=related) called for decriminalization. Obama has even stated he "inhaled frequently" and "that was the point", and during his campaign stated (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUze-oYsswI&feature=related) that prosecuting medical marijuana users was a waste of federal resources.

I do not advocate the use of marijuana, but it is "high" time we take a serious look at decriminalization for responsible adult recreational usage and for medical purposes.

[Methais]

unfortunately a select few always ruin it for the rest of us. its sad that America has this image of cheech and chong/dazed and confused/Jim Breuer (the pot head lookin guy from half baked). and that is apparently all "stoners"

when i'd say most of us instead of coming home and sitting down relaxing with a beer or 2 after a day of work. we sit down take a few hits off the peace pipe and call it a day.

I was playing High Velocity Bowling on PS3 a while back, which uses the Sixaxis motion controls to bowl with, so you have to stand up to play it. He came over one day and I was showing it to him and he was like "YOU MEAN YOU GOTTA STAND UP!?!? FUCK THAT!!!" So eventually he tried to play the game sitting down and looked like the biggest retard in the universe. I told him he was the laziest bucket of guts sewn up in a sack of skin in the world, and his fat ugly girlfriend just smiled, as if she were proud of him for that or something (she's equally worthless).

All I could do was /facepalm.

Then a couple weeks ago he was over and I was showing him Crash Commando, another badass PS3 downloadable (think of Unreal Tournament in 2D, with jetpacks). Figuring he'd like it since he used to play UT on PC, I'm like "Here check it out." and his response is, "Uhhhh, nah I'm pretty baked right now."

His life is basically a double fail. He's too lazy to function when he's sober, and his excuse for being lazy is "I'm high" when he's stoned, despite the fact that everyone else in the room is just as baked as him, but are all doing things that require physical movement and thought processes, while he sits there staring at the wall in a daze, mouth agape in that stoner way, eyes barely open, and just worthless all around. Too lazy to play pool, too lazy to stand up, too lazy to do anything. He even started whining one day when I told him to move over on the couch to the next cushion. He moved about 2 inches so I'm like FUCKING MOVE GOD DAMMIT IT'S NOT LIKE I'M ASKING YOU TO BUILD THE EMPIRE STATE BUILDING!!!!11 His reponse? "It kind of is!"

Then eventually him and his fat girlfriend leave to go to Jack In the Box and stuff their fat macaroni faces.

He's also the only stoner I've ever known that got fat from smoking weed. He was a beanpole back in high school, and now he starts stuffing his face or at least talking about how hungry he is before the joint's even finished. It's pretty terrible. I'm guessing that's why he's fat now. He'd already been smoking for a year or 2 when I got back in touch with him and was already fat.

I'm going to slap the shit out of him one day for being that guy that gives stoners a bad name.

His myspace mood: High

http://bum.net/pics/facepalm2.jpg

[Mtenda]

unfortunately a select few always ruin it for the rest of us. its sad that America has this image of cheech and chong/dazed and confused/Jim Breuer (the pot head lookin guy from half baked). and that is apparently all "stoners"

when i'd say most of us instead of coming home and sitting down relaxing with a beer or 2 after a day of work. we sit down take a few hits off the peace pipe and call it a day.

The root of the problem comes from the government and our very own attorney general in the 50's and 60's that would make claims that pot made you rape and kill and all other sorts of nonsense. This type of stuff was put in "educational" movies and published in the most popular newspapers. What's even more fucked up is the motivation behind creating this propaganda. It was a concious decision, by the government, to do something to discriminate against minorities and to more or less keep young people on a leash. If you think about the fact that this was during a time in which people didn't really question the government much then it's easy to see the trickle down effect from what parents teach their kids and how the overblown ignorance surrounding marijuana got way out of hand.

[Methais]

The root of the problem comes from the government and our very own attorney general in the 50's and 60's that would make claims that pot made you rape and kill and all other sorts of nonsense. This type of stuff was put in "educational" movies and published in the most popular newspapers. What's even more fucked up is the motivation behind creating this propaganda. It was a concious decision, by the government, to do something to discriminate against minorities and to more or less keep young people on a leash. If you think about the fact that this was during a time in which people didn't really question the government much then it's easy to see the trickle down effect from what parents teach their kids and how the overblown ignorance surrounding marijuana got way out of hand.

:rofl: I have to see one of those educational videos where someone smokes a joint and then goes on a violent rape and murder rampage.

[Mtenda]

:rofl: I have to see one of those educational videos where someone smokes a joint and then goes on a violent rape and murder rampage.

Check out the movie Reefer Madness. It's full of ROFLcoptors. Oh yeah and I said 50's and 60's earlier but it was way before then that the propaganda parade started.


http://www.theharbinger.org/xvi/971111/reefer.gif

[Back]

The root of the problem comes from the government and our very own attorney general in the 50's and 60's that would make claims that pot made you rape and kill and all other sorts of nonsense. This type of stuff was put in "educational" movies and published in the most popular newspapers. What's even more fucked up is the motivation behind creating this propaganda. It was a concious decision, by the government, to do something to discriminate against minorities and to more or less keep young people on a leash. If you think about the fact that this was during a time in which people didn't really question the government much then it's easy to see the trickle down effect from what parents teach their kids and how the overblown ignorance surrounding marijuana got way out of hand.

It was a newspaper man who was worried about the cost of his paper.

Hearst propagated (propogandized) the evils of the crop because it could make cheaper paper than what he was buying. The only reason I can think of why he did not embrace the lower cost paper was because he was too happy getting fucked in the ass by his paper supplier.

[SolitareConfinement]

I was playing High Velocity Bowling on PS3 a while back, which uses the Sixaxis motion controls to bowl with, so you have to stand up to play it. He came over one day and I was showing it to him and he was like "YOU MEAN YOU GOTTA STAND UP!?!? FUCK THAT!!!" So eventually he tried to play the game sitting down and looked like the biggest retard in the universe. I told him he was the laziest bucket of guts sewn up in a sack of skin in the world, and his fat ugly girlfriend just smiled, as if she were proud of him for that or something (she's equally worthless).

All I could do was /facepalm.

Then a couple weeks ago he was over and I was showing him Crash Commando, another badass PS3 downloadable (think of Unreal Tournament in 2D, with jetpacks). Figuring he'd like it since he used to play UT on PC, I'm like "Here check it out." and his response is, "Uhhhh, nah I'm pretty baked right now."

His life is basically a double fail. He's too lazy to function when he's sober, and his excuse for being lazy is "I'm high" when he's stoned, despite the fact that everyone else in the room is just as baked as him, but are all doing things that require physical movement and thought processes, while he sits there staring at the wall in a daze, mouth agape in that stoner way, eyes barely open, and just worthless all around. Too lazy to play pool, too lazy to stand up, too lazy to do anything. He even started whining one day when I told him to move over on the couch to the next cushion. He moved about 2 inches so I'm like FUCKING MOVE GOD DAMMIT IT'S NOT LIKE I'M ASKING YOU TO BUILD THE EMPIRE STATE BUILDING!!!!11 His reponse? "It kind of is!"

Then eventually him and his fat girlfriend leave to go to Jack In the Box and stuff their fat macaroni faces.

He's also the only stoner I've ever known that got fat from smoking weed. He was a beanpole back in high school, and now he starts stuffing his face or at least talking about how hungry he is before the joint's even finished. It's pretty terrible. I'm guessing that's why he's fat now. He'd already been smoking for a year or 2 when I got back in touch with him and was already fat.

I'm going to slap the shit out of him one day for being that guy that gives stoners a bad name.

His myspace mood: High




wow his life is for sure a double fail face palm situation. i don't think i was EVER like that not even at 15. i suppose weed has done the opposite to me than it has others in the fact that i pretty much only smoke after work, or right before bed, OR if neither is a factor...when im home alone and bored. i smoke a bowl and end up going out and doing something with my life. not necessarily constructive, but i always leave the house and go do something. usually end up at a friends house playing cards/fooseball/pool with a doobie being passed around.

but your friend? seriously though man euthanasia is always an option

[Methais]

Check out the movie Reefer Madness. It's full of ROFLcoptors. Oh yeah and I said 50's and 60's earlier but it was way before then that the propaganda parade started.


http://www.theharbinger.org/xvi/971111/reefer.gif

I think I saw a clip from that once. Is that the one where a few people are smoking in a living room and then it just instantly turns into a huge orgy?

[SolitareConfinement]

there was the one from fear and loathing in las vegas

"his pants will be encrusted with semen from constantly jacking off when he can't find a rape victim!"

[Wesley]

Jim Breuer (the pot head lookin guy from half baked).

Point of order. Pretty much everyone in Half Baked was a "pot head lookin' guy". That was kinda the idea.

Also, I LOVE BUTTERNUTS.

And additionally also, watch the special features from Dazed and Confused. There are some really classic advertisements and school "informational" videos there.

And thirdly also, here are some dinosaurs that smoke pot. You will note that they are still quite functional, and have not moved on to harder drugs. I think we can put this controversy to rest.

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/2618/dinosaur4fl.jpg

[Mtenda]

It was a newspaper man who was worried about the cost of his paper.

Hearst propagated (propogandized) the evils of the crop because it could make cheaper paper than what he was buying. The only reason I can think of why he did not embrace the lower cost paper was because he was too happy getting fucked in the ass by his paper supplier.

I forgot about that whole William Randolph Hearst thing. And that raises another issue with marijuana legalization. Hemp is cheap and could replace materials for many things.

[SHAFT]

Please, if you're gonna smoke, use a quality product like:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x176/shaft4783/phire.jpg

Sold at your local headshop. Tell them Shaft sent you!

[Back]

People forget, or do not even know, it has a latin name.

[SolitareConfinement]

Point of order. Pretty much everyone in Half Baked was a "pot head lookin' guy". That was kinda the idea.


true but you have to admit he was the most text book stereotype of all...but to clearify a little harder he is the guy who no matter where you see him...movie, tv, real life, where the fuck ever you go he has the bug eyed stoner look to him

[Wesley]

true but you have to admit he was the most text book stereotype of all...but to clearify a little harder he is the guy who no matter where you see him...movie, tv, real life, where the fuck ever you go he has the bug eyed stoner look to him

Hehe, yeah I knew who you were talking about. I just needed a flimsy pretext to post a picture of a dinosaur.

[SolitareConfinement]

sorry Shaft but the only way to go is...



http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/xXerozXx/zigzag-white.jpg

[Mtenda]

I think I saw a clip from that once. Is that the one where a few people are smoking in a living room and then it just instantly turns into a huge orgy?

That's the one. Their eyes are hilarious. I think they also made a spoof of that movies somewhat recently?

[Wesley]

sorry Shaft but the only way to go is...



http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/xXerozXx/zigzag-white.jpg

I see this and raise you

http://www.smokersoutletonline.com/images/juicy%20jays.jpg

[SolitareConfinement]

i'll see your fruity papers and raise YOU the king sizers!!!!1!!one:


http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/xXerozXx/zig-zag-blue-kingsize-slim.jpg

[Androidpk]

Paranoid, driving about 15 miles per hour because it feels like you're speeding.

This is so true, haha.

[Stanley Burrell]

Isn’t about time we stopped pouring money into a worthless fight and just legalize a product that is as American as apple pie so the government can collect taxes on sales for more standard of life programs?

IT. IS. NEVER. GOING. TO. HAPPEN.

You wheel a chemo patient, clinging to life only because of a THC intravenous drip, in front of congress ... And that person is a terrorist. We used marijuana as a way of reducing Mexican immigration. Everything American about us is unfortunately why this ain't happening.

I'm for it, but holy hard fucking hornballs: Not happening.

Wishful thinking.

[ClydeR]

Isn’t about time we stopped pouring money into a worthless fight and just legalize a product that is as American as apple pie so the government can collect taxes on sales for more standard of life programs?

Just so we're all on the same page, what "product" are you talking about?

[Beguiler]

The product that makes otherwise sane individuals gorge on Fritos and bean dip....

~B

[Mtenda]

The product that makes otherwise sane individuals gorge on Fritos and bean dip....

~B

And the product that makes people invent things like bean dip. MMMM beans....mmmmm.....dip. FTW

[g++]

Isn’t about time we stopped pouring money into a worthless fight and just legalize a product that is as American as apple pie so the government can collect taxes on sales for more standard of life programs?

Im not a professional lobbyist or anything but I am pretty sure we can stop pouring money into the war and improve quality of life programs without legalizing marijuana. So if the whole lets get high thing does not work out for you, theres always a plan B.

[Androidpk]

On the first edition of "Open for Questions" on Change.gov the question voted to #1 was

"Will you consider legalizing marijuana so that the government can regulate it, tax it, put age limits on it, and create millions of new jobs and create a billion dollar industry right here in the U.S.?"

Something like 15 or 16 out of 50 questions were drug policy related, mostly MJ.


As far as hemp goes, that would be another boost for the economy seeing as how it can be used in so many different ways; fiber, paper, fuel, health products, plastics, ect.

[SHAFT]

sorry Shaft but the only way to go is...



http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/xXerozXx/zigzag-white.jpg

If you had any sense you'd be a bit more concerned about your health and get a waterpipe or a vaporizer. But do your thing.

[Back]

I'm for it, but holy hard fucking hornballs: Not happening.

Wishful thinking.

Stranger things have been done by the people.


Im not a professional lobbyist or anything but I am pretty sure we can stop pouring money into the war and improve quality of life programs without legalizing marijuana. So if the whole lets get high thing does not work out for you, theres always a plan B.

Granted. But where did anyone say lets get high? There is an easily growable crop in demand that is illegal that could provide for many industries. Or are you afraid that the rye growers will tear up their fields for something else more productive for more resources?

[Gan]

Reading through this stuipd thread has made me hungry...

[Back]

Reading through this stuipd thread has made me hungry...

Keep those Kellog elves employed and hiring to keep up with demand.

[Rocktar]

Yeah, this was about useful. Glad I read the beginning and skipped to the end.

Now watch my rep go down because some whanker disagrees with my political views. Hurahhhhhhh.

[Apotheosis]

marijuana as a gateway drug

My experience: clearly, everyone I knew associated with the "drug culture" in my days (90's raver years) started experimenting with pot & alcohol and it did lead to them being offered "harder drugs" which is why I agree with the statement that marijuana is a gateway drug....

when you realize it isn't as bad / dangerous as the grownups say, then how bad could LSD, heroin, other hallucinogens or heroin be?

it just goes with the territory of obtaining marijuana that you're going to mix with some shady people... hence a good argument for legalization.


re: sagmeister - Back

Clearly, Sagmeister is a genius designer... much like Phelps is an amazing athlete..... but I recall that the number of students in art school who were stoners + excellent designers were far and few between.. the best designer I know that was in my class was drug free... the dropouts were primarily stoners...

also, read a book titled "how to be a graphic designer without losing your soul"... there are plenty of resources & prominent players in the professional design + advertising arena who reason why drugs (including marijuana) are a liability to their careers.

Retail / pothead experiences

For some time I worked as a cashier while in college.. the majority of customers who came in stoned fit the "classic" stoner profile: hostess products and a vocabulary on par with Beavis or Butthead..... stereotypes exist for a reason.

at this point

I know more than a few people in their mid 20's - early 30's that still use pot heavily and are pretty much not going any farther in life than where they are.. and seem to be happy with it..... good for them, however, they're up for a rude awakening when they're 40 and circumstances in their life have changed.

end prohibition

clearly, the motivator to "prohibit" marijuana was the result of Hearst's campaign to outlaw hemp and save on his tree investment.. there are plenty of good uses for hemp, and it would be a benefit to the economy...

I drink hemp milk, because I cannot stand soy milk, and it actually has a lot of great natural health benefits... I am not a vegan or vegetarian by any means.. milk just makes me sick..



clearly, there will only be two ways that we can see a gradual move towards decriminalization in this country...

1 medical marijuana becomes more "accepted" by the states & general population.

2 better marketing on the pro-hemp / fiber / oils / foods, end of the thing... they need to take this to companies and show how their bottom line can improve by replacing their raw materials with hemp-based raw materials..


20 years from now, if we still have a functioning country, I am pretty confident that the majority of people will see marijuana decriminalization as a non-issue

[Back]

re: sagmeister - Back

Clearly, Sagmeister is a genius designer... much like Phelps is an amazing athlete..... but I recall that the number of students in art school who were stoners + excellent designers were far and few between.. the best designer I know that was in my class was drug free... the dropouts were primarily stoners...

also, read a book titled "how to be a graphic designer without losing your soul"... there are plenty of resources & prominent players in the professional design + advertising arena who reason why drugs (including marijuana) are a liability to their careers.

Who hasn't read it?



For some time I worked as a cashier while in college.. the majority of customers who came in stoned fit the "classic" stoner profile: hostess products and a vocabulary on par with Beavis or Butthead..... stereotypes exist for a reason.

at this point

I know more than a few people in their mid 20's - early 30's that still use pot heavily and are pretty much not going any farther in life than where they are.. and seem to be happy with it..... good for them, however, they're up for a rude awakening when they're 40 and circumstances in their life have changed.

end prohibition

clearly, the motivator to "prohibit" marijuana was the result of Hearst's campaign to outlaw hemp and save on his tree investment.. there are plenty of good uses for hemp, and it would be a benefit to the economy...

I drink hemp milk, because I cannot stand soy milk, and it actually has a lot of great natural health benefits... I am not a vegan or vegetarian by any means.. milk just makes me sick..



clearly, there will only be two ways that we can see a gradual move towards decriminalization in this country...

1 medical marijuana becomes more "accepted" by the states & general population.

2 better marketing on the pro-hemp / fiber / oils / foods, end of the thing... they need to take this to companies and show how their bottom line can improve by replacing their raw materials with hemp-based raw materials..


20 years from now, if we still have a functioning country, I am pretty confident that the majority of people will see marijuana decriminalization as a non-issue

You make some great points and I agree. Drug use is not good. In any form.

[TheRunt]

:rofl: I have to see one of those educational videos where someone smokes a joint and then goes on a violent rape and murder rampage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZdhcNegZgU&feature=related

My personal opinion is that it won't be legalized because of too many jobs would be lost if it was. Police/jail employees/lawyers/prosecutors/judges etc.

That and the alcohol industry would fight it. They see legalized mj as taking away there profits. People who are afraid of getting busted just drink.

And taxing it wouldn't bring in that much I don't believe. Its too easy to grow if it was legal every stoner would have a plot in there backyard/closet.

Although I wish it would be legalized.

[Apotheosis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZdhcNegZgU&feature=related

My personal opinion is that it won't be legalized because of too many jobs would be lost if it was. Police/jail employees/lawyers/prosecutors/judges etc.

Not sure about that.. it would free them up to deal with other crimes.. our system is already strained.



That and the alcohol industry would fight it. They see legalized mj as taking away there profits. People who are afraid of getting busted just drink.

maybe, but some would probably get involved... think about "marijuana - based alchol/beer"... they would just grow it & package it themselves.




And taxing it wouldn't bring in that much I don't believe. Its too easy to grow if it was legal every stoner would have a plot in there backyard/closet.


not true.. too tired to get into ALL the details..

MJ is a pain in the ass to grow & maintain... my prediction would be that the stoners would be too lazy to grow their own (for the most part)... you could also probably buy better shit from the local store..

in addition.. think of all the different ways hemp could be used in the economy..... no.. it would actually provide a great "stimulus" to our economy.. : /

[Gan]

http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1759736

http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1792449

http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1794315/

[Peanut Butter Jelly Time]

I don't, haven't, and likely wont smoke pot. With that said, I'm all for it being legalized.

I by no means condone its use, nor do I act against it, but there is just far too much to gain NOT to legalize it.

At any rate, as there's nothing I can say that others in this thread haven't already, I'm just going to end on a positive note.


Tommy Chong has great long-term memory.

[Kyra231]

The main reason I'm against it being legalized is usage in the workplace. It's already rampant without being legal..I can only imagine if it were.

Too many of the health care workers I've had to work beside were already fucking up big time without being high(like 'Here's some water to wash down your suppository with Mr. Smith), them coming in to work stoned would just make it that much worse imo.

I've seen someone who bragged about how high he was after his lunch break then went into work & dropped a 90 y/o woman on the floor, re-broke her hip sentencing her to a longer if not permanent stay in the nursing home.

It was total bullshit, whether the weed was 100% at fault no one can say but it surely didn't help his judgement on the matter of transferring her the proper way vs the fucked up way that he never had before.

If you work at McDonalds it might not make that much of a difference, but if you're caring for people it makes a huge difference in my book. :shrug:

[Mtenda]

The main reason I'm against it being legalized is usage in the workplace. It's already rampant without being legal..I can only imagine if it were.

Too many of the health care workers I've had to work beside were already fucking up big time without being high(like 'Here's some water to wash down your suppository with Mr. Smith), them coming in to work stoned would just make it that much worse imo.

I've seen someone who bragged about how high he was after his lunch break then went into work & dropped a 90 y/o woman on the floor, re-broke her hip sentencing her to a longer if not permanent stay in the nursing home.

It was total bullshit, whether the weed was 100% at fault no one can say but it surely didn't help his judgement on the matter of transferring her the proper way vs the fucked up way that he never had before.

If you work at McDonalds it might not make that much of a difference, but if you're caring for people it makes a huge difference in my book. :shrug:


How is it any different then alcohol though by that logic? Obviously you shouldn't do it at work. If you do, it's up to your employer to fire you. Sure some people are going to abuse it just like people abuse alcohol, cigarettes, food, etc. But I just don't think that's a good enough reason to keep us where we are with it when compared to all the pros.

[Peanut Butter Jelly Time]

So a natural substance shouldn't be legalized based on the potentially irresponsible use in the workplace?

Lets stop selling guns, energy drinks, computer-based gaming software, and pretty much anything else you can manipulate in a not-so-constructive-yet-still-somehow-appealing manner.

[Kyra231]

How is it any different then alcohol though by that logic? Obviously you shouldn't do it at work. If you do, it's up to your employer to fire you. Sure some people are going to abuse it just like people abuse alcohol, cigarettes, food, etc. But I just don't think that's a good enough reason to keep us where we are with it when compared to all the pros.

What would be your suggested method for testing to see if they were using in the workplace? Considering the long half-life mj has in your body, it would be near impossible to tell if they were using before or after work(unlike alcohol).

[CrystalTears]

What would be your suggested method for testing to see if they were using in the workplace? Considering the long half-life mj has in your body, it would be near impossible to tell if they were using before or after work(unlike alcohol).
Periodical urine testing.

[Kyra231]

Periodical urine testing.

Testing someone who causes an injury or death with a 7-10 day usage window for a positive is probably not going to work reliably at all.

I wouldn't want to fail a drug test for alcohol when I hadn't drank for a week.

[Fallen]

Periodical urine testing.

Who already gets piss tested for their job? Lord knows I do. BPRP FTL.

[CrystalTears]

Testing someone who causes an injury or death with a 7-10 day usage window for a positive is probably not going to work reliably at all.

I wouldn't want to fail a drug test for alcohol when I hadn't drank for a week.
Not if they don't test specifically for alcohol.

I guess I'm not understanding why you're so against marijuana when it would be the same, if not less damaging, than alcohol.

[Kyra231]

Not if they don't test specifically for alcohol.

I guess I'm not understanding why you're so against marijuana when it would be the same, if not less damaging, than alcohol.


Basically if it were legal I would want there to be a reliable way to hold employees accountable if an accident were to happen & they were under the influence at the time of the accident. Not a test that would nail them for smoking 3 days before hand.

[CrystalTears]

Basically if it were legal I would want there to be a reliable way to hold employees accountable if an accident were to happen & they were under the influence at the time of the accident. Not a test that would nail them for smoking 3 days before hand.
If they tested positive, they'd be fired. What more do you want?

[Mtenda]

Basically if it were legal I would want there to be a reliable way to hold employees accountable if an accident were to happen & they were under the influence at the time of the accident. Not a test that would nail them for smoking 3 days before hand.

Wouldn't they be fired for the accident?

[Fallen]

Wouldn't they be fired for the accident?

Sure could. Incompetence is grounds for termination.

[Kyra231]

Wouldn't they be fired for the accident?

Yes they'd be fired for the incident, I'd also want them prosecuted if they were actually under the influence. Not falsely prosecuted because of an inaccurate test.

Eta: I'm not against people smoking, one of my best friends does. However she never came to work high, unlike the ghetto bastards who would bring a blunt to smoke on their way in, pass out on a bed & their patient almost dies from diabetic shock because their aide was high & had to nap so the patient didn't get any food with their insulin.

[Fallen]

Yes they'd be fired for the incident, I'd also want them prosecuted if they were actually under the influence. Not falsely prosecuted because of an inaccurate test.

Isn't this the same thing as many over the counter drugs, like sleep aids? I am avoiding using perscription drugs because they actually require a perscription, but how do they test people for going to work on these things and fucking up versus them taking it as perscribed and fucking up? If this is the only major reason why it shouldn't be legalized, or atleast partially legalized, then it is a minor one in my opinion.

[CrystalTears]

Yes they'd be fired for the incident, I'd also want them prosecuted if they were actually under the influence. Not falsely prosecuted because of an inaccurate test.
Wait. How would it be an inaccurate test? If they cause an accident, they get a urine test and fired. If they test positive, they can possibly be prosecuted for it (considering the accident). The fact that it was because it was in their body for 3-4 days shouldn't change the fact that they've been under the influence at any given time while working and should suffer the consequences.

[Kyra231]

Wait. How would it be an inaccurate test? If they cause an accident, they get a urine test and fired. If they test positive, they can possibly be prosecuted for it (considering the accident). The fact that it was because it was in their body for 3-4 days shouldn't change the fact that they've been under the influence at any given time while working and should suffer the consequences.

Not really. When I worked 12 hour shifts I often had 5 or 6 days off at a time.

[CrystalTears]

Not really. When I worked 12 hour shifts I often had 5 or 6 days off at a time.
And if your job is subject to regular drug testing, you wouldn't do it on your days off either, is my point.

[Fallen]

Wouldn't the level of THC in your urine(blood, hair, etc) differ from how recently you've been smoking?

[CrystalTears]

Wouldn't the level of THC in your urine(blood, hair, etc) differ from how recently you've been smoking?
I imagine it has to be.

[SolitareConfinement]

Wouldn't the level of THC in your urine(blood, hair, etc) differ from how recently you've been smoking?

very much so. when a police officer suspects you of OUID (operating under the influence of drugs) and has reasonable amount of evidence they take you in for a blood test to confirm being physically high at that moment in time :)

so yes there is a reliable way to tell already. just employers haven't adopted it yet

[Bobmuhthol]

Think about the impact on the GDP!

[Mabus]

If this is the only major reason why it shouldn't be legalized, or atleast partially legalized, then it is a minor one in my opinion.
It is often termed the "potential harm" defense of keeping it illegal.

"People will rob people for drug money!"
-It is already illegal to rob people.
etc.

Hair retains cannabinoids for a year+, and they can be found in urine from 10-90 days (depending on the amount consumed, and many factors). As to instant testing there is the
oral/saliva testing (http://www.meditests.com/or4salmultes.html) available, that detects usage in the saliva for 14 hours.

[Fallen]

As to instant testing there is the
oral/saliva testing (http://www.meditests.com/or4salmultes.html) available, that detects usage in the saliva for 14 hours.

/Debate.

[TheRunt]

I've heard of some very bad results from saliva tests. My brother failed one for coke and hadn't touched the stuff for probably 10 yrs at least took a hair test 2 days later to fight it and passed with flying colors. Another guy he was on probation with was a 70 yrs old man who had never touched it and failed also.

Blood tests can be very accurate to determine whether your under the effects of mj though, depending on whether they are testing for active thc or thc metabolites. So a company can determine if your high or not on the job.

[ClydeR]

Far as I can tell, Back's plea to legalize illegal drugs is not limited to any particular drug. That makes it hard to debate. He could be talking about any or all of Mary Jane, Big C, Baby T, 69s, Aunt Hazel, Honey Oil, Chrome, Cotton, Red Phosphorus or many other "products." Some of them are too dangerous to even consider legalizing.

[radamanthys]

The idea of prohibition is ludicrous. If someone wants heroin, they're getting heroin, whether legal or not.

All we're doing is enforcing a black market trade for the stuff.

Shit, Cannabis is the country's biggest cash crop.

Just to add to the debate: http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/vis/975628171.html

[Androidpk]

The saliva test is a joke. You could smoke a couple hours before the test and come out clean.

[TheLastShamurai]

Legalizing Marijuana: YES WE CAN!

[Mabus]

The saliva test is a joke. You could smoke a couple hours before the test and come out clean.

85% of schwag smokers agree!
;)

[Back]

The War on Drugs Is a Failure

We should focus instead on reducing harm to users and on tackling organized crime.

By FERNANDO HENRIQUE CARDOSO, CéSAR GAVIRIA and ERNESTO ZEDILLO
(http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123535114271444981.html)


The war on drugs has failed. And it's high time to replace an ineffective strategy with more humane and efficient drug policies. This is the central message of the report by the Latin American Commission on Drugs and Democracy we presented to the public recently in Rio de Janeiro.

Prohibitionist policies based on eradication, interdiction and criminalization of consumption simply haven't worked. Violence and the organized crime associated with the narcotics trade remain critical problems in our countries. Latin America remains the world's largest exporter of cocaine and cannabis, and is fast becoming a major supplier of opium and heroin. Today, we are further than ever from the goal of eradicating drugs.

Over the last 30 years, Colombia implemented all conceivable measures to fight the drug trade in a massive effort where the benefits were not proportional to the resources invested. Despite the country's achievements in lowering levels of violence and crime, the areas of illegal cultivation are again expanding. In Mexico -- another epicenter of drug trafficking -- narcotics-related violence has claimed more than 5,000 lives in the past year alone.

The revision of U.S.-inspired drug policies is urgent in light of the rising levels of violence and corruption associated with narcotics. The alarming power of the drug cartels is leading to a criminalization of politics and a politicization of crime. And the corruption of the judicial and political system is undermining the foundations of democracy in several Latin American countries.

The first step in the search for alternative solutions is to acknowledge the disastrous consequences of current policies. Next, we must shatter the taboos that inhibit public debate about drugs in our societies. Antinarcotic policies are firmly rooted in prejudices and fears that sometimes bear little relation to reality. The association of drugs with crime segregates addicts in closed circles where they become even more exposed to organized crime.

In order to drastically reduce the harm caused by narcotics, the long-term solution is to reduce demand for drugs in the main consumer countries. To move in this direction, it is essential to differentiate among illicit substances according to the harm they inflict on people's health, and the harm drugs cause to the social fabric.

In this spirit, we propose a paradigm shift in drug policies based on three guiding principles: Reduce the harm caused by drugs, decrease drug consumption through education, and aggressively combat organized crime. To translate this new paradigm into action we must start by changing the status of addicts from drug buyers in the illegal market to patients cared for by the public-health system.

We also propose the careful evaluation, from a public-health standpoint, of the possibility of decriminalizing the possession of cannabis for personal use. Cannabis is by far the most widely used drug in Latin America, and we acknowledge that its consumption has an adverse impact on health. But the available empirical evidence shows that the hazards caused by cannabis are similar to the harm caused by alcohol or tobacco.

If we want to effectively curb drug use, we should look to the campaign against tobacco consumption. The success of this campaign illustrates the effectiveness of prevention campaigns based on clear language and arguments consistent with individual experience. Likewise, statements by former addicts about the dangers of drugs will be far more compelling to current users than threats of repression or virtuous exhortations against drug use.

Such educational campaigns must be targeted at youth, by far the largest contingent of users and of those killed in the drug wars. The campaigns should also stress each person's responsibility toward the rising violence and corruption associated with the narcotics trade. By treating consumption as a matter of public health, we will enable police to focus their efforts on the critical issue: the fight against organized crime.

A growing number of political, civic and cultural leaders, mindful of the failure of our current drug policy, have publicly called for a major policy shift. Creating alternative policies is the task of many: educators, health professionals, spiritual leaders and policy makers. Each country's search for new policies must be consistent with its history and culture. But to be effective, the new paradigm must focus on health and education -- not repression.

Drugs are a threat that cuts across borders, which is why Latin America must establish dialogue with the United States and the European Union to develop workable alternatives to the war on drugs. Both the U.S. and the EU share responsibility for the problems faced by our countries, since their domestic markets are the main consumers of the drugs produced in Latin America.

The inauguration of President Barack Obama presents a unique opportunity for Latin America and the U.S. to engage in a substantive dialogue on issues of common concern, such as the reduction of domestic consumption and the control of arms sales, especially across the U.S.-Mexico border. Latin America should also pursue dialogue with the EU, asking European countries to renew their commitment to the reduction of domestic consumption and learning from their experiences with reducing the health hazards caused by drugs.

The time to act is now, and the way forward lies in strengthening partnerships to deal with a global problem that affects us all.

. Cardoso is the former president of Brazil. Mr. Gaviria is a former president of Colombia. Mr. Zedillo is a former president of Mexico.

[ElanthianSiren]

and none of their former countries stand to gain ANYTHING from a decriminalization/legalization move by the US.

Come on, man. You know better. While I agree that the war on drugs is like pissing on a 5 alarmer, I don't believe you're going to get anywhere with people who are married to the RICO act and those kind of laws with those kind of sources.

[Parkbandit]

and none of their former countries stand to gain ANYTHING from a decriminalization/legalization move by the US.

Come on, man. You know better. While I agree that the war on drugs is like pissing on a 5 alarmer, I don't believe you're going to get anywhere with people who are married to the RICO act and those kind of laws with those kind of sources.


:rofl:

Oh my naive little ES....

[Back]

and none of their former countries stand to gain ANYTHING from a decriminalization/legalization move by the US.

Come on, man. You know better. While I agree that the war on drugs is like pissing on a 5 alarmer, I don't believe you're going to get anywhere with people who are married to the RICO act and those kind of laws with those kind of sources.

Sorry, ES, this post is coming off really cryptic. I get the sarcasm of the first line but not the insinuations of the second.

[ElanthianSiren]

Sorry, ES, this post is coming off really cryptic. I get the sarcasm of the first line but not the insinuations of the second.

When I read it, here's what I got: the former presidents of those countries (including regions in latin america, south america, and Mexico) are lobbying for the US to reverse its drug policies. Those same countries happen to be where many of these drugs are produced. If those same countries that make the items could also import them to the US legally, the result (to me) would seem a large trade surplus for them with the US. Doing it legally may assure cutting out much of the black market that exists within their own borders due to the stigma of being drug dealers. Thus, they stand to gain astronomically from the US adopting the policies they're advocating in the article.

[Back]

When I read it, here's what I got: the former presidents of those countries (including regions in latin america, south america, and Mexico) are lobbying for the US to reverse its drug policies. Those same countries happen to be where many of these drugs are produced. If those same countries that make the items could also import them to the US legally, the result (to me) would seem a large trade surplus for them with the US. Doing it legally may assure cutting out much of the black market that exists within their own borders due to the stigma of being drug dealers. Thus, they stand to gain astronomically from the US adopting the policies they're advocating in the article.

But does not the US also gain astronomically? Cut spending on a worthless fight, legalize not only a beneficial but in demand easy crop to collect taxes, and treat it the same in all regards as successfully as tobacco.

[ElanthianSiren]

But does not the US also gain astronomically? Cut spending on a worthless fight, legalize not only a beneficial but in demand easy crop to collect taxes, and treat it the same in all regards as successfully as tobacco.

I'm not anti-drugs for anyone but myself, so you're really preaching to the choir with this post. If you want to take it a step further, you can mention how many drugs are largely illegal due to the alcohol and tobacco lobby in the US. It makes no difference; the people who are so sure drugs like pot are the whole reason the country's going to hell aren't going to reverse their ideas based on the musings of the presidents of the countries who stand to gain the most from their decriminalization (ie your source is sure to be brought up and discounted). A better source would be to quote the former Canadian PM when the US tried to apply pressure there to criminalize pot and he said, "I don't think canada has enough axe murderers"

Other recreational drugs will only become legal in the US when the citizens of the US decide they've had enough with the prohibition against those substances and lobby harder than the lobbyists imo.

[Back]

Other recreational drugs will only become legal in the US when the citizens of the US decide they've had enough with the prohibition against those substances and lobby harder than the lobbyists imo.

Indeed. It might solve all of California’s budget problems.

[Fallen]

I think they should legalize pot but ban any weed that isn't grown in this country...because, you know, it isn't tested and regulated and what not. Tax the ever loving FUCK out of it and you have massive profits for the US, and Latin America can eat a dick.

[Tsa`ah]

California's looking to place a prohibitive tax on pot sales right off the bat. I believe I heard $50 per ounce.

Now depending on where you're from, a dime bag could mean a $10 dollar bag that weighs anywhere from less than a gram to a few grams, or a dime bag could mean a bag weighing 1/10 oz and the price varied depending on the quality and or dealer. So this means legal vendors of pot are going to get the cheapest available product and sell it for prices that you paid for premium illegal varieties.

Then from the word "go" they're doing almost nothing to curb illegal sales and everything to throw small time dealers in the clink for tax evasion. What you're left with is rich college kids and their parents providing the tax revenue to keep tax evaders and their customers incarcerated.

Then you run into all of the ancillary benefits and problems.

Bordering states filing legal action against California.
Rising food costs because farmers are switching to a crop that provides better profit.
Third world drug lords and their governments in open combat because the government now wants control of what the drug lords possess.
Regulation ... who does it? Because you know they're not going to hire "experts" to do it.

Sure the benefits are tax revenues, fines for unlicensed sales (before incarceration of course), booms in the junk food market, and whatever else you can think of .... but it's not the way to go.

Prohibitive taxation leads to poor families suffering because the user cuts out necessities for the addiction/recreation and it becomes an acceptable "rich only" recreational activity. Let's not even get into the havoc it will cause in third world countries.

The focus in "The War on Drugs" should mimic what was done in SE Asia ... specifically the golden triangle. Burning crops and tracking down trade routes doesn't accomplish anything. Education, infrastructure and economical alternative crops have to be introduced. The first two allow for the government to stabilize the last allows for economic growth. Burning a hemp field only ensures that you have to return in the near future, at a greater risk, to perform the same act with negligible impact.

[Fallen]

>>Prohibitive taxation leads to poor families suffering because the user cuts out necessities for the addiction/recreation and it becomes an acceptable "rich only" recreational activity. Let's not even get into the havoc it will cause in third world countries. >>

I don't see this as a problem for pot. Not too many people are going to skimp on food to get pot. That doesn't make any sense for a lot of reasons. No one is talking about legalizing "harder" drugs. If that were the case then I believe you would have a point.

You're also leaving out the increased production that would be involved in the major processing, packaging, ect of marijuana. It would be an industry that would come out of one where it didn't exist. Some cig companies might start putting out product, but you can be quite sure another companies would start specifically for this purpose.

The "War on Drugs" wouldn't stop. It wont ever stop because we aren't going to legalize cocaine or heroine. The money directed towards controlling the largest portion of the illegal drug trade would be shifted towards combating the harder drugs. I can't say if this is a good thing or a bad thing.

[AnticorRifling]

I'd rather see steroids legalized.

[Tsa`ah]

I don't see this as a problem for pot. Not too many people are going to skimp on food to get pot. That doesn't make any sense for a lot of reasons. No one is talking about legalizing "harder" drugs. If that were the case then I believe you would have a point.

I believe it was Gan who pointed out that people do the same with booze and smokes ... if you think it would be different with pot ... well that thought would be wrong.


You're also leaving out the increased production that would be involved in the major processing, packaging, ect of marijuana. It would be an industry that would come out of one where it didn't exist. Some cig companies might start putting out product, but you can be quite sure another companies would start specifically for this purpose.

No I covered that with the
Rising food costs because farmers are switching to a crop that provides better profit.

Granted that the US does three things far better than anyone else in the world (drug use, agriculture, and oil exploration/recovery) ... it has to be grown somewhere. You can bet your ass that tobacco farmers won't be switching crops anytime soon, so that leaves food and textile crops.

There is an apples to oranges situation that has escaped you. Legalizing pot and growing our own (while not only increases the cost of food) won't curb illegal sales BECAUSE of the prohibitive tax. The prohibitive taxes on tobacco work because of the existing institution ... tobacco has always been a part of the US ... pot has had a very long vacation.

You have 30 bucks in your back pocket for pot. Do you ..

A. Go to the pharmacy and buy a few grams of crap.
B. Go to the same guy you went to before legalization and get an eighth that came across the border illegally.


The "War on Drugs" wouldn't stop. It wont ever stop because we aren't going to legalize cocaine or heroine. The money directed towards controlling the largest portion of the illegal drug trade would be shifted towards combating the harder drugs. I can't say if this is a good thing or a bad thing.

I never said it would or should stop, I said we're going about it in the most incorrect and most ineffective fashion ... just like the "War on Terror".

[Fallen]

There is an apples to oranges situation that has escaped you. Legalizing pot and growing our own (while not only increases the cost of food) won't curb illegal sales BECAUSE of the prohibitive tax. The prohibitive taxes on tobacco work because of the existing institution ... tobacco has always been a part of the US ... pot has had a very long vacation.

You have 30 bucks in your back pocket for pot. Do you ..

A. Go to the pharmacy and buy a few grams of crap.
B. Go to the same guy you went to before legalization and get an eighth that came across the border illegally.

As it is likely that we WOULDN'T ban other countries from selling their pot in our country, wouldn't the argument of our farmers growing pot instead of food falter? They are the ones who already produce this crop in the largest amounts, so it is likely that they would be the ones supplying it. Also, isn't it more likely that farmers growing Tabacco switch to pot instead of food? Especially if you consider that it (pot and tobacco) wouldn't be subsidized like food is.

[Tsa`ah]

As it is likely that we WOULDN'T ban other countries from selling their pot in our country, wouldn't the argument of our farmers growing pot instead of food falter? They are the ones who already produce this crop in the largest amounts, so it is likely that they would be the ones supplying it. Also, isn't it more likely that farmers growing Tabacco switch to pot instead of food? Especially if you consider that it (pot and tobacco) wouldn't be subsidized like food is.

Well first you're going to have to provide a credible source that justifies your statement of our farmers being the largest supplier of pot.

The point of other countries selling their pot inside of our borders wasn't the point ... the havoc it creates was. Also was the point that illegal trafficking would only be marginally effected.

And no, it's not likely a tobacco farmer would switch crops ... tobacco smuggling is only an issue between states, not nations. You're not going to see any tobacco farmer switching to pot until illegal sales were no longer an issue and the prohibitive tax on pot didn't have a huge impact on profit.

[Fallen]

Well first you're going to have to provide a credible source that justifies your statement of our farmers being the largest supplier of pot.

The point of other countries selling their pot inside of our borders wasn't the point ... the havoc it creates was. Also was the point that illegal trafficking would only be marginally effected.

And no, it's not likely a tobacco farmer would switch crops ... tobacco smuggling is only an issue between states, not nations. You're not going to see any tobacco farmer switching to pot until illegal sales were no longer an issue and the prohibitive tax on pot didn't have a huge impact on profit.

I think we're getting our wires crossed. I said OTHER countries farmers produce the most pot. Mexico or wherever the fuck in Middle/South america that makes the most of it. If I am wrong on that so be it. They would be the ones growing it for our markets as they have a head start.

As to smuggling being marginally effected, isn't pot the number 1 thing being smuggled into the country? You're saying that to avoid the taxes it would still be smuggled into the country, right? If so, that makes sense.

I dont think Tabacco would start being smuggled into our country, I meant that tabacco growers HERE would switch to pot before food growers in our country. Why would you think food growers would switch before anyone else would? Taxes on pot likely wouldn't be any greater than taxes on Tabacco. Food growers would suddenly be receiving EXTRA taxes instead of EXTRA AID they were getting for growing food.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I'm personally in favor of legalizing herb, and prescription drugs for that matter (in other words letting anyone purchase a prescription drug if they want it). I think of it like alcohol.

[Fallen]

I'm personally in favor of legalizing herb, and prescription drugs for that matter (in other words letting anyone purchase a prescription drug if they want it). I think of it like alcohol.

Eh, prescription drugs? That sounds dangerous. I don't give a crap about addiction, i'm worried about unforseen drug complications and accidental overdose. If some heroine addict ODs who gives a shit, but if a sick person takes the wrong combination of things, or too much of one thing because he is already taking another that isn't cool.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Eh, prescription drugs? That sounds dangerous. I don't give a crap about addiction, i'm worried about unforseen drug complications and accidental overdose. If some heroine addict ODs who gives a shit, but if a sick person takes the wrong combination of things, or too much of one thing because he is already taking another that isn't cool.

People should still go to Doctors and not self medicate. I'm just saying if someone walks into a pharm, and wants to buy antibiotics without a prescription, let em.

[Ignot]

Who wants U.S. grown pot? I will pay a little extra for some overseas funk.

[Tsa`ah]

I think we're getting our wires crossed. I said OTHER countries farmers produce the most pot. Mexico or wherever the fuck in Middle/South america that makes the most of it. If I am wrong on that so be it. They would be the ones growing it for our markets as they have a head start.

Gotcha.


As to smuggling being marginally effected, isn't pot the number 1 thing being smuggled into the country? You're saying that to avoid the taxes it would still be smuggled into the country, right? If so, that makes sense.

It makes a world of sense because we don't have the infrastructure, oversight... nothing in place for pot sales. Sure, it will happen ... but when was the last time you paid a 30-50% consumption tax? It's not the same as tobacco simply because tobacco is an institution in the U.S. and most smokers are brand loyal ... or at least filter loyal and processed tobacco loyal.

Do you think that drug cartels are just going to be instantly legitimized by their governments?

So Don Ricardo, the Columbian pot lord, is suddenly going to accept a massive cut in his profits if the Columbian government happens to legalize him? No, he's going to split his business into legitimate shipments because he knows those will go through and he'll make some cash in the process ... but at the same time he's going to realize he can make more cash moving smaller quantities via smuggling.


I dont think Tabacco would start being smuggled into our country, I meant that tabacco growers HERE would switch to pot before food growers in our country.

Of course tobacco, of any significance, wouldn't be smuggled .... it's the establishment already. Again, it's profitability in reference to taxation.


Why would you think food growers would switch before anyone else would? Taxes on pot likely wouldn't be any greater than taxes on Tabacco.

The proposed tax in CA is $50 per ounce ... the last time I checked, a pack of cigarettes was taxed by a national average of 1.07 per pack.


Food growers would suddenly be receiving EXTRA taxes instead of EXTRA AID they were getting for growing food.

Umm .... not exactly.

Yes, ag farmers would lose subsidies on pot crops, but when corn is going for 5-7 a bushel (56 pounds) or 2100-3000 an acre and subsidies pretty much just pay for crop insurance ... what makes you think they're going to stick with a corn/soy rotation when pot could easily sell for 10-20 a lb and get a yield per acre that surpasses corn/soy?

The prohibitive tax extends to an established market such as tobacco because there is a buyer for every pound, every year ... with out fail. Even with the prohibitive tobacco tax, which pales in comparison to the proposed pot tax, the established system is there. Sure, a few tobacco farmers may switch ... but not for long ... simply because they're out numbered and they would (or should) know that domestic pot would be very volatile for them, while still remaining profitable for ag farmers.

[Fallen]

Some solid arguments. Good discussion.

[SolitareConfinement]

Umm .... not exactly.

Yes, ag farmers would lose subsidies on pot crops, but when corn is going for 5-7 a bushel (56 pounds) or 2100-3000 an acre and subsidies pretty much just pay for crop insurance ... what makes you think they're going to stick with a corn/soy rotation when pot could easily sell for 10-20 a lb and get a yield per acre that surpasses corn/soy?



you can have 1 plant for every 4 stalks of corn give or take if everything was 100% legalized the ag farmers could actually do both :) for just an extra kickback

hell I already know farmers who do this. not a plant per 4 stalks of corn but there are farmers in the countryside who farm 100+ acres of corn and in the summer time have anywhere from 2-400 plants depending on field size.

sometimes the OMNI choppers in the summer time bust a field and sometimes they don't. it's hit and miss for them really

[Tsa`ah]

My uncle has been growing it on his back 90 along the spill creek for the last 20 years.

It's not terribly uncommon.

[SolitareConfinement]

so my question to you is why would the ag farmers drop AG when they can produce both?

[Tsa`ah]

so my question to you is why would the ag farmers drop AG when they can produce both?

NAI cap (Non-ag income). The last farm bill lowered non ag based income standards for subsidies considerably (which was a very good thing).

Now the small time farmer could plant 1 in 10 rows with pot and make out like a bandit. Large scale and corporate farmers wouldn't bother. There just happen to be enough small scale farms that would cause a substantial price spike in food with the alternate non-ag crops (which is also why no one is bothering with switch grass).

[SolitareConfinement]

i just find it hard to believe it would cause that large of a spike that you are speaking of. even when subsidies came in huge for farmers for "field corn" growing for ethanol use, it wasn't nearly as big of a spike as was anticipated really.

[Androidpk]

It makes a world of sense because we don't have the infrastructure, oversight... nothing in place for pot sales.

This is a good point and I was thinking about it the other day. With all the talk that is going on these days for ending the prohibition on marijuana, and all the organizations that are rallying for it....not once have I heard or read of any plans following the proposed legalization.

[TheRunt]

And if your job is subject to regular drug testing, you wouldn't do it on your days off either, is my point.

Huh? Every job I've ever had that had random/reasonable cause had smokers.


California's looking to place a prohibitive tax on pot sales right off the bat. I believe I heard $50 per ounce.



The proposed tax in CA is $50 per ounce ... the last time I checked, a pack of cigarettes was taxed by a national average of 1.07 per pack.

Which depending on use would be perhaps a bit more to well less compared to cigarettes. I smoke right about a carton a week so with the national average I pay about 10.70 in taxes on them. When I was a moderately heavy smoker I went through about 1/2oz a week so a bit over double in taxes. But I do know people who smoke 2-3 and one guy who smokes 4-5 packs a day.


Yes, ag farmers would lose subsidies on pot crops, but when corn is going for 5-7 a bushel (56 pounds) or 2100-3000 an acre and subsidies pretty much just pay for crop insurance ... what makes you think they're going to stick with a corn/soy rotation when pot could easily sell for 10-20 a lb and get a yield per acre that surpasses corn/soy?

To grow and harvest decent quality smoking grade mj costs a good bit more than corn or soybeans. Do you know of any combines that can harvest a field of grass for smoking purposes? Along with sexing of the plants and removing the males? And for losing food and other crops to it well there's hemp oil, flour, raw and roasted seeds and hemp milk. Along with rope, cloth, industrial oils, paper, plastics etc.

101 uses for hemp
http://www.recipenet.org/health/articles/101_uses_hemp_chart.htm

Not including medical uses. Which include pain management, glaucoma, nausea from chemo etc, ms, fibromyalgia, diabetes and the list goes on.

http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=7002


People should still go to Doctors and not self medicate. I'm just saying if someone walks into a pharm, and wants to buy antibiotics without a prescription, let em.

I'm probably going to sound insane but I would rather opiates, amphetamines and psychotropic medications be able to be purchased without a script than antibiotics. Due to the various drug resistant strains of disease that we currently have. If everybody and their brother could go out and buy antibiotics anytime they wanted I feel that those would increase dramatically. You'd have Mothers who at the first sign of a sniffle would run and grab a bottle of pills, along with people who would take them just to attempt to avoid getting sick. And since most of them do not understand the need for rotating antibiotics to help avoid bacterial strains from developing resistance to them well........

[Stanley Burrell]

Huh? Every job I've ever had that had random/reasonable cause had smokers.






Which depending on use would be perhaps a bit more to well less compared to cigarettes. I smoke right about a carton a week so with the national average I pay about 10.70 in taxes on them. When I was a moderately heavy smoker I went through about 1/2oz a week so a bit over double in taxes. But I do know people who smoke 2-3 and one guy who smokes 4-5 packs a day.



To grow and harvest decent quality smoking grade mj costs a good bit more than corn or soybeans. Do you know of any combines that can harvest a field of grass for smoking purposes? Along with sexing of the plants and removing the males? And for losing food and other crops to it well there's hemp oil, flour, raw and roasted seeds and hemp milk. Along with rope, cloth, industrial oils, paper, plastics etc.

101 uses for hemp
http://www.recipenet.org/health/articles/101_uses_hemp_chart.htm

Not including medical uses. Which include pain management, glaucoma, nausea from chemo etc, ms, fibromyalgia, diabetes and the list goes on.

http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=7002



I'm probably going to sound insane but I would rather opiates, amphetamines and psychotropic medications be able to be purchased without a script than antibiotics. Due to the various drug resistant strains of disease that we currently have. If everybody and their brother could go out and buy antibiotics anytime they wanted I feel that those would increase dramatically. You'd have Mothers who at the first sign of a sniffle would run and grab a bottle of pills, along with people who would take them just to attempt to avoid getting sick. And since most of them do not understand the need for rotating antibiotics to help avoid bacterial strains from developing resistance to them well........

I'd be more worried about a pregnant mother popping opiates than I would giving her kid Cipro after it's born with an immunological defect from eating a bottle of codeine a day.

Medication should just be cheaper, in general. And people should not kill each other. And ninjas should train me to use radioactive nunchucks to battle demons.

But as we already know, radioactivity doesn't actually exist.

[Androidpk]

Medical marijuana in California is one thing but if they did end up legalizing and taxing it, how would the federal government respond? Also, i've seen tons of possible uses of hemp including concrete, but WTF is hemp milk? Hehe

[Clove]

Huh? Every job I've ever had that had random/reasonable cause had smokers.So... you had a lot of stupid coworkers?

[Clove]

i just find it hard to believe it would cause that large of a spike that you are speaking of. even when subsidies came in huge for farmers for "field corn" growing for ethanol use, it wasn't nearly as big of a spike as was anticipated really.Tsa'ah is just demonstrating where your reasoning goes if you sample your own product too much.

[Apotheosis]

Also, i've seen tons of possible uses of hemp including concrete, but WTF is hemp milk? Hehe

Kinda like soy milk, except tastier, and with more omega 3 and tons of other vitamins..

I actually drink this stuff and it's pretty good.

[Clove]

It makes great fucking rope. Nothing like a hemp line.

[Mabus]

It makes great fucking rope. Nothing like a hemp line.
The federal government agreed during WWII.
http://www.globalhemp.com/Archives/Government_Research/USDA/images/grow.gif

[Tsa`ah]

Which depending on use would be perhaps a bit more to well less compared to cigarettes. I smoke right about a carton a week so with the national average I pay about 10.70 in taxes on them. When I was a moderately heavy smoker I went through about 1/2oz a week so a bit over double in taxes. But I do know people who smoke 2-3 and one guy who smokes 4-5 packs a day.

Err ... a normal cigarette has about 2 grams of tobacco. 1 pack would be just over an ounce. The suggested tax for pot is roughly 46 times that of tobacco.


To grow and harvest decent quality smoking grade mj costs a good bit more than corn or soybeans.

Lol ... are you positive on this?


Do you know of any combines that can harvest a field of grass for smoking purposes?

Harvest would likely be similar to tobacco .... or at the very least bailing without actually packing into bails.


Along with sexing of the plants and removing the males?

This is done with seed corn every year ... largely by hand.


And for losing food and other crops to it well there's hemp oil, flour, raw and roasted seeds and hemp milk. Along with rope, cloth, industrial oils, paper, plastics etc.

Aside from the industrial uses, you're talking about cultural dietary habits and the infrastructure to handle the alternatives ... let alone a ready market and market ready products.


Tsa'ah is just demonstrating where your reasoning goes if you sample your own product too much.

Lol ... nice contribution leg humper. I guess you're forced to take your shots in the open when you can't take the snipe with a rep comment.

In any case, I haven't smoked pot in over 14 years. Additionally I've never sold it, let alone cultivated it. Care to try again?

[Androidpk]

Err ... a normal cigarette has about 2 grams of tobacco. 1 pack would be just over an ounce.

An average size cigarette has about 0.8 grams of tabacco in it.

[Tsa`ah]

An average size cigarette has about 0.8 grams of tabacco in it.

My bad ... so two packs of cigarettes is just over an ounce of tobacco making the proposed tax on pot roughly 23 times the current tax on cigarettes.

[Clove]

In any case, I haven't smoked pot in over 14 years. Additionally I've never sold it, let alone cultivated it. Care to try again?Boy you sure told me! Why do you like rubbing your leg against my balls anyway? Sounds kind of gay. How many times do you think we can get Tsa'ah to dream about leg humping this week? I can snipe in rep comments if you prefer. It doesn't make you any less retarded.

[Tsa`ah]

Boy you sure told me! Why do you like rubbing your leg against my balls anyway? Sounds kind of gay. How many times do you think we can get Tsa'ah to dream about leg humping this week? I can snipe in rep comments if you prefer. It doesn't make you any less retarded.

It's a bit ironic that you just can't refrain from responding or commenting in a manner completely irrelevant to the topic at hand whenever I participate in a debate or discussion. Instead you, and others, decide to snipe and insult ... pretty much just swinging from my nuts whenever I do post ... and rarely doing anything in the manner of discussion. Your desire for acceptance and the insatiable need for validation via something so erroneous as internet reputation makes you completely incapable of considering an opinion based on where that opinion originates ... instead you have to try and tear down the person.

Dan could post an opinion of evolution that would make Gould seem antiquated and you tards would line up to spew a fountain of bullshit in an effort to sooth your insecurities.

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.

You .... are so unjustifiably enamored with yourself ... and it's no longer amusing, but rather tiresome and sad.

[Parkbandit]

You .... are so unjustifiably enamored with yourself ... and it's no longer amusing, but rather tiresome and sad.

So what you are saying is that it took him FAR longer to get to a place you've been since day 1 here.

OMG I R HUMPIN' YER LEG!!

[Tsa`ah]

OMG I R HUMPIN' YER LEG!!

This is probably one of the most quote worthy posts you have ever made ... but yes, attempt to read my previous post and realize it wasn't solely directed at clove.


Legalization: Its a... 02-26-2009 10:26 AM I can rep you all day. Stop smoking your uncle's bumper crop. ~Clove

Actually PB, you can't.

[CrystalTears]

PB signs his own reps. He doesn't care who gets a sandy vagina from his commentary.

[Tsa`ah]

Again, I don't care about the rep ... but clove didn't rep me and PB doesn't sign all of his rep ... and I doubt that it's lack of caring on his part and more along the lines of his vag is already pretty sandy as it is.

[CrystalTears]

... but clove didn't rep me and PB doesn't sign all of his rep ... How do you know this for sure, Holmes?

[Tsa`ah]

Because I'm not retarded.

[CrystalTears]

Because I'm not retarded.
Yes you are because you're going on assumptions. You don't know for sure who is giving you the rep, unless you're asking a mod or admin.

[Tsa`ah]

Legalization: Its a... 02-26-2009 10:51 AM Fuck you, finally in the red where you belong. I wish you'd fucking just go away once and for all, fucking retard.

Oh noes ... negative rep with an anonymous comment ... whatever will I do?!

Grow some balls ... wait, that's probably beyond you. Instead, have someone read this to you and replace clove with your name ...

It's a bit ironic that you just can't refrain from responding or commenting in a manner completely irrelevant to the topic at hand whenever I participate in a debate or discussion. Instead you, and others, decide to snipe and insult ... pretty much just swinging from my nuts whenever I do post ... and rarely doing anything in the manner of discussion. Your desire for acceptance and the insatiable need for validation via something so erroneous as internet reputation makes you completely incapable of considering an opinion based on where that opinion originates ... instead you have to try and tear down the person.

Dan could post an opinion of evolution that would make Gould seem antiquated and you tards would line up to spew a fountain of bullshit in an effort to sooth your insecurities.

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.

You .... are so unjustifiably enamored with yourself ... and it's no longer amusing, but rather tiresome and sad.

[Xaerve]

I love watching your continual mental breakdowns on these boards :)

[Xaerve]

Oh noes ... negative rep with an anonymous comment ... whatever will I do?!

Grow some balls ... wait, that's probably beyond you. Instead, have someone read this to you and replace clove with your name ...

It's a bit ironic that you just can't refrain from responding or commenting in a manner completely irrelevant to the topic at hand whenever I participate in a debate or discussion. Instead you, and others, decide to snipe and insult ... pretty much just swinging from my nuts whenever I do post ... and rarely doing anything in the manner of discussion. Your desire for acceptance and the insatiable need for validation via something so erroneous as internet reputation makes you completely incapable of considering an opinion based on where that opinion originates ... instead you have to try and tear down the person.

Dan could post an opinion of evolution that would make Gould seem antiquated and you tards would line up to spew a fountain of bullshit in an effort to sooth your insecurities.

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.

You .... are so unjustifiably enamored with yourself ... and it's no longer amusing, but rather tiresome and sad.

Quoted for being pathetic; in case you decide to edit ;)

[Fallen]

Especially when they are over crap he repeatedly says he doesn't care about.

[Keller]

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego.

:wtf:

That's about the dumbest thing anyone has ever said about rep they've received.

It's private. Dipshit.

[Parkbandit]

Quoted for being pathetic; in case you decide to edit ;)


It's twice as funny if you include this quote from him.. made moments before his meltdown:


Again, I don't care about the rep ...

[TheRunt]

So... you had a lot of stupid coworkers?

Yep sure did, some of them were even tokers :rofl:

[Clove]

Grow some balls ... wait, that's probably beyond you. Instead, have someone read this to you and replace clove with your name ...How the hell did I get in this? Oh and Tsa'ah, people who are indifferent don't usually write 241 word tirades in response to random neg-rep. Just sayin'. Detatchment, UR doing it wrong!

[TheRunt]

Err ... a normal cigarette has about 2 grams of tobacco. 1 pack would be just over an ounce. The suggested tax for pot is roughly 46 times that of tobacco.

Yes the price per oz is much higher. But the per use cost of that tax is not as high which is what I was referring to in my previous post. I smoke approx 1.5 cigarettes and hour. Much more if I'm at a bar and drinking. There is no way I could smoke that much mj at least not for more than a couple hrs. I would be damn near comatose.




Lol ... are you positive on this?

Harvest would likely be similar to tobacco .... or at the very least bailing without actually packing into bails.

This is done with seed corn every year ... largely by hand.

Considering that the sexing and processing would have to be done mainly by hand which is not the case for most other crops I can be pretty sure of it. Unless they cloned which would add costs there.

Tobacco plants when harvested contain large easily removed leafs which are then processed mechanically. MJ would have to be processed by hand at least I know of no machinery that could do it.

And I think you mean that seed corn is detasseled not sexed. Which where I'm from is mostly done by middle school children. Minimum age in IN is 12 to do it. I would assume that the age restrictions on sexing and processing mj would be much higher probably the legal age of use.

And tobacco farmers are ideally set up for large scale production of mj since most of the tobacco is from transplants which is the best way to grow mj since you can clone and remove the need for sexing in the field also to ensure a consistent crop.

http://www.ipmcenters.org/cropprofiles/docs/nctobacco.html

That and for crop land being use for mj there is most likely enough land all ready in use for growing mj as is. Considering when I was smoking I next to never heard of shortages and also taking into account the amount seized.



Aside from the industrial uses, you're talking about cultural dietary habits and the infrastructure to handle the alternatives ... let alone a ready market and market ready products.

Well they currently sell all the food products I mentioned off the shelf right now so it seems like the infrastructure to handle it is in place. And it didn't take CA long to get distribution set up. Or Canada when they legalized the growing of hemp. And it doesn't sound like it but if your talking the infrastructure to handle the industrial uses quite a few of them can uses existing plants and technology paper, rope, cloth etc.(see canada) For turning hemp oil into plastics is a bit beyond my technical know how so I'm not sure what would be involved in that along with things such as concrete and concrete reinforcement.

[Tsa`ah]

...
...
...
...

All I got was ... http://www.davidandgoliathtees.com/shop/images/tees6/small/5605.jpg

... and then ...

http://img1.ifilmpro.com/resize/image/stills/films/resize/istd/2699579.jpg


Considering that the sexing and processing would have to be done mainly by hand which is not the case for most other crops I can be pretty sure of it. Unless they cloned which would add costs there.

Male pollen production/collection done off field, pollination done via arial dusting.


Tobacco plants when harvested contain large easily removed leafs which are then processed mechanically. MJ would have to be processed by hand at least I know of no machinery that could do it.

Just like bailing straw/hay ... less the compacting and binding. From there you take a page from the logging industry when it comes to removing branches from a log.


And I think you mean that seed corn is detasseled not sexed. Which where I'm from is mostly done by middle school children. Minimum age in IN is 12 to do it. I would assume that the age restrictions on sexing and processing mj would be much higher probably the legal age of use.

All corn for seed is is planted in a 1 in 5 row system. 1 male row (not to be detasseled) with 4 female rows (to be detasseled mechanically, by hand, or both) in between. Pollination is forced via heavy wind, helicopter, or if the field is massive ... via specialized machinery that shakes the mail rows and forces the pollen to tassel level via air curtains.

You're thinking of research plots which are completely detasseled and pollinated by hand ... then again, research plots are rarely larger than a few acres.


And tobacco farmers are ideally set up for large scale production of mj since most of the tobacco is from transplants which is the best way to grow mj since you can clone and remove the need for sexing in the field also to ensure a consistent crop.

Again, tobacco farmers are not likely to switch crops, let alone give up any portion of land for pot. They're farmers, not Wall Street brokers or bankers ... maybe down the road if such crops proved to be more profitable and less volatile than their current crops.


That and for crop land being use for mj there is most likely enough land all ready in use for growing mj as is. Considering when I was smoking I next to never heard of shortages and also taking into account the amount seized.

You're assuming anyone would be free to plant. Likely, just as in IL there are a limited number of licenses available for casinos, production will be limited just as sales would be.

In that event you're likely to see more seizures.

[Clove]

Boy Tsa'ah you're really battin' a 1.000

[Tsa`ah]

Boy Tsa'ah you're really battin' a 1.000

This message brought to you by

http://www.davidandgoliathtees.com/shop/images/tees6/small/5605.jpg

[Clove]

This message brought to you by

http://www.davidandgoliathtees.com/shop/images/tees6/small/5605.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/Jemah/funnies/missingthepoint.png

Detachment: UR doing it wrong.

[Tsa`ah]

I'll wait for the bible quotes and "focus" ... they're soon to follow I'm sure.

[Clove]

I'll wait for the bible quotes and "focus" ... they're soon to follow I'm sure.Inorite! Why would anyone use bible quotes in a thread about religion?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/Jemah/funnies/missingthepoint.png

Face it dude. You had a meltdown.

[Tsa`ah]

Inorite! Why would anyone use bible quotes in a thread about religion?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/Jemah/funnies/missingthepoint.png

Face it dude. You had a meltdown.

LOL ... you're just a sad sad creature.

I'm not sure if anyone has ever bothered to tell you this, or maybe you just refuse to believe it, saying something over and over again doesn't make it true. But do continue with your sad delusions ... they're always good for a chuckle, especially from a leg humper.

psst .... this is a thread about pot legalization ... then again, it explains much.

[Xaerve]

LOL ... you're just a sad sad creature.

I'm not sure if anyone has ever bothered to tell you this, or maybe you just refuse to believe it, saying something over and over again doesn't make it true. But do continue with your sad delusions ... they're always good for a chuckle, especially from a leg humper.

psst .... this is a thread about pot legalization ... then again, it explains much.

You're calling someone out for being repetitive after you've used the leg humping line over and over again in this thread (and others)....

:tool:

[Wesley]

Can't we all just get along?

http://static.flickr.com/46/139315577_9da8ef2810.jpg


You two should smoke some pot together. That would fix this situation.

[Keller]

Dear Tsa'ah,

You took what was a private comment directed towards only you and made it public.

In making it public, you criticized the person who gave it to you for "disrupting" the conversation.

This was wrong. The person who left you the comment disrupted nothing.

You disrupted the conversation by feeling the need to respond in this thread to their comment.

Stop being such a whiney ass bitch.

We all get negative rep, we just don't all feel the need to validate the idiots who leave us said rep by responding to it.

Best regards,
Keller

[Ignot]

Can't we all just get along?

http://static.flickr.com/46/139315577_9da8ef2810.jpg


You two should smoke some pot together. That would fix this situation.

You are just assuming they are holding hands out of love but maybe there is a Dilophosaurus chasing them and they are holding hands out of terror.

[Wesley]

You are just assuming they are holding hands out of love but maybe there is a Dilophosaurus chasing them and they are holding hands out of terror.

Dilophosauruses do not like football. They prefer cricket.

Could be a herd of angry gallamimuses stampeding after a loss though! You are right!

[Tsa`ah]

:wtf:

That's about the dumbest thing anyone has ever said about rep they've received.

It's private. Dipshit.


Dear Tsa'ah,

You took what was a private comment directed towards only you and made it public.

In making it public, you criticized the person who gave it to you for "disrupting" the conversation.

This was wrong. The person who left you the comment disrupted nothing.

You disrupted the conversation by feeling the need to respond in this thread to their comment.

Stop being such a whiney ass bitch.

We all get negative rep, we just don't all feel the need to validate the idiots who leave us said rep by responding to it.

Best regards,
Keller

I put both of these together and will direct you to start with post 135. Please take the time to note that you quoted the reprint ... not the original ... response to clove (the one that can be pretty universal to the lot of you).

Rep comments, as far as I'm concerned, are whiny bitch methods of douchebaggery. I'll post them up and respond to them whenever I feel like it.

Now had you bothered to follow along in a linear fashion, you'd have realized I responded to a person's bullshit well before you tards took it to the rep box.

If you can't take it ... piss off. Either way, get off of my fucking nuts if you can't keep up with the topic.

[Xaerve]

Rep comments, as far as I'm concerned, are whiny bitch methods of douchebaggery. I'll post them up and respond to them whenever I feel like it.

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f138/mariana196/Who-Fucking-Cares.jpg

[Stanley Burrell]

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f138/mariana196/Who-Fucking-Cares.jpg

http://www.nearwestsidesyracuse.org/images/gallery/WE%20CARE%20sign.jpg

People who recycle, you ignorant racist fishbelly.

[Tsa`ah]

Apparently you ... to name just one. It's pretty damned funny.

[Clove]

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.




Dear Tsa'ah,

You took what was a private comment directed towards only you and made it public.

In making it public, you criticized the person who gave it to you for "disrupting" the conversation.
Keller

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ngthepoint.png

[Keller]

I put both of these together and will direct you to start with post 135. Please take the time to note that you quoted the reprint ... not the original ... response to clove (the one that can be pretty universal to the lot of you).

Rep comments, as far as I'm concerned, are whiny bitch methods of douchebaggery. I'll post them up and respond to them whenever I feel like it.

Now had you bothered to follow along in a linear fashion, you'd have realized I responded to a person's bullshit well before you tards took it to the rep box.

If you can't take it ... piss off. Either way, get off of my fucking nuts if you can't keep up with the topic.


You'll post private comments to disrupt a public conversation? Check.

You'll engage in a side argument to disrupt a public conversation? Check.

Were either of those my point? No.

My point was that you criticized someone for disrupting the conversation. You are possibly the most defensive person I've ever known. I think you're reasonably intelligent, but your penchant for engaging in illogical and often silly defensive arguments makes you appear to be a drunk downs baby.

Stop feeling the need to constantly be right. Sometimes you're wrong.

[Clove]

But always retarded.

[Tsa`ah]

Let me know when you folks are done with my leg.

[BigWorm]

Let me know when you folks are done with my leg.

Dude. Get a new line already for fuck's sake.

[Keller]

Let me know when you folks are done with my leg.

I think that term has officially lost it's meaning.

Between you, Gan, Daniel, and the dipshit who every two days leaves me the same rep (SR?) -- no one on this forum can be critical of anything anyone says without being called a leg-humper.

Let's just put it out there -- you said something retarded. I called you on it. If that isolated event is me humping your leg, then the PC is one giant femoral orgy.

[CrystalTears]

I think that term has officially lost it's meaning.

Between you, Gan, Daniel, and the dipshit who every two days leaves me the same rep (SR?) -- no one on this forum can be critical of anything anyone says without being called a leg-humper.

Let's just put it out there -- you said something retarded. I called you on it. If that isolated event is me humping your leg, then the PC is one giant femoral orgy.
Holy motherfucking shit agreed.

I :heart: you in a rather unnatural way right now.

[Tsa`ah]

Let's just put it out there -- you said something retarded. I called you on it. If that isolated event is me humping your leg, then the PC is one giant femoral orgy.

What exactly did you call me on that was retarded? The quoting of a rep snip and reposting my response to clove? Did you not follow my advice of reading this thread in a linear fashion?

But let's be clear ... this was in no way an "isolated" event.

[Clove]

What exactly did you call me on that was retarded? The quoting of a rep snip and reposting my response to clove? Did you not follow my advice of reading this thread in a linear fashion?

But let's be clear ... this was in no way an "isolated" event.
So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.
Dear Tsa'ah,

You took what was a private comment directed towards only you and made it public.

In making it public, you criticized the person who gave it to you for "disrupting" the conversation.
Keller

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ngthepoint.png

[Keller]

What exactly did you call me on that was retarded? The quoting of a rep snip and reposting my response to clove? Did you not follow my advice of reading this thread in a linear fashion?

But let's be clear ... this was in no way an "isolated" event.

The only other time I recall being critical of you is when you assumed someone had given you a rep comment, conclusively claimed it was that person, and told THEM they had the burden of proof.

Then we'd have to go back a few years to a religious debate we were having.

Like I said above -- you're a generally intelligent person when you're not stretching the bounds of reasonable conclusions in order to be "right".

Stop being so damn defensive.

[Clove]

You spelled "stupid" wrong.

[Mabus]

After 6 (or so) medical marijuana raids since Obama has been in office, yesterday USAG Holder stated that the actions may change by implementing the position of Obama during the campaign.

Some Obama quotes dealing with medical marijuana:

During a town hall meeting in Laconia, New Hampshire, on June 2, 2007, Sen. Obama was asked if he would continue the federal raids on medical marijuana patients and their caregivers. Sen. Obama responded: "I don't think that should be a top priority of us, raiding people who are using ... medical marijuana. With all the things we've got to worry about, and our Justice Department should be doing, that probably shouldn't be a high priority."

On July 21, 2007 at a town hall meeting in Manchester, New Hampshire, a GSMM staffer asked Sen. Obama if he would end the raids. Sen. Obama replied: "The Justice Department going after sick individuals using this as a palliative instead of going after serious criminals makes no sense."

Less then a month later, on August 13, while at a town hall meeting in Nashua, New Hampshire, he was asked by GSMM staffers if he agreed with the 81% of New Hampshire Democrats who believe that the federal government should end the raids on medical marijuana patients and caregivers. Sen. Obama responded: "You know, it's really not a good use of Justice Department resources."


Obama on campaign trail (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUze-oYsswI&eurl=http://granitestaters.com/candidates/barack_obama.html&feature=player_embedded). On August 21, during a campaign event in Nashua, New Hampshire, Sen. Obama was asked by GSMM volunteer and seriously ill Nashua resident Scott Turner if he would end the federal raids on medical marijuana patients like him (See video linked).

Then Sen. Obama replied: "I would not have the Justice Department prosecuting and raiding medical marijuana users. It's not a good use of our resources."

USAG Holder yesterday on C-Span. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY6S5lZwQ6I)

So we may see a shift away from federal raids on state-sanctioned medical marijuana facilities.

[CrystalTears]

Obama is a smoker. We may have him on our side for this one. :D

[Parkbandit]

psst .... this is a thread about pot legalization ... then again, it explains much.

Oh.. you mean like this?


Oh noes ... negative rep with an anonymous comment ... whatever will I do?!

Grow some balls ... wait, that's probably beyond you. Instead, have someone read this to you and replace clove with your name ...

It's a bit ironic that you just can't refrain from responding or commenting in a manner completely irrelevant to the topic at hand whenever I participate in a debate or discussion. Instead you, and others, decide to snipe and insult ... pretty much just swinging from my nuts whenever I do post ... and rarely doing anything in the manner of discussion. Your desire for acceptance and the insatiable need for validation via something so erroneous as internet reputation makes you completely incapable of considering an opinion based on where that opinion originates ... instead you have to try and tear down the person.

Dan could post an opinion of evolution that would make Gould seem antiquated and you tards would line up to spew a fountain of bullshit in an effort to sooth your insecurities.

So here we are, you disrupting yet another discussion over this dumb ass infatuation or lame attempt to mend some bruise I caused to your fragile and over inflated ego .... and as usual, somehow it's me dreaming of you or some sort of mental deficiency on my part.

You .... are so unjustifiably enamored with yourself ... and it's no longer amusing, but rather tiresome and sad.

[Parkbandit]

You spelled "stupid" wrong.


That's under copywrite you son of a bitch.

My scumbag lawyer will be in touch with you very soon.

[TheRunt]

Male pollen production/collection done off field, pollination done via arial dusting.

If your talking about mj you don't want pollination. Hence sexing and removing the males.


Just like bailing straw/hay ... less the compacting and binding. From there you take a page from the logging industry when it comes to removing branches from a log.

Sounds great. Except you don't want the branches, you want the flowering tips.



All corn for seed is is planted in a 1 in 5 row system. 1 male row (not to be detasseled) with 4 female rows (to be detasseled mechanically, by hand, or both) in between. Pollination is forced via heavy wind, helicopter, or if the field is massive ... via specialized machinery that shakes the mail rows and forces the pollen to tassel level via air curtains.

You're thinking of research plots which are completely detasseled and pollinated by hand ... then again, research plots are rarely larger than a few acres.

Corn grown for "seed" purposes is not the same as corn grown for animal feed, consumption, industrial purposes which is the majority of the corn grown. And since only research and seed plots are destasseled that just increases the price difference to produce mj compared to corn.



You're assuming anyone would be free to plant. Likely, just as in IL there are a limited number of licenses available for casinos, production will be limited just as sales would be.

Actually your the one assuming anyone would be free to plant with your "OH NOOOO'SSS" No ones going to grow corn/beans/whatever ag crop you choose. And a better comparison than casinos would be tobacco there is a limited number of permits to grow for distribution in the U.S. so actually the tobacco industry would love to jump on board legalized mj so they could have another similar crop to increase their profit.

And it would take a while most likely for any large industrial operation to get the amount of seed/clones to farm mj on a large scale for distribution unless they bought every seed in Holland and every clone in CA, I think that would give them time to get the distribution/industrial infrastructure you think they need. And have you priced seeds from Holland lately? Check out the price online and tell me that it wouldn't cost more than corn or beans:rofl: One website on a quick check listed the price for 10 seeds from 25-90 euros. For that price how many acres of corn or beans would a farmer be able to plant?

Edit Damn I meant the Netherlands not Holland thats tulips.

[Clove]

Holland is part of the Netherlands you crazy Dutch bastard.

[Androidpk]

Obama is a smoker. We may have him on our side for this one. :D

After mentioning the hawaiing pizza I knew you were a pothead ;)

[Keller]

Holland is part of the Netherlands you crazy Dutch bastard.

Maybe he meant Holland, MI.

IDIOT, GOSH.

[Gan]

I think that term has officially lost it's meaning.

Between you, Gan, Daniel, and the dipshit who every two days leaves me the same rep (SR?) -- no one on this forum can be critical of anything anyone says without being called a leg-humper.

Let's just put it out there -- you said something retarded. I called you on it. If that isolated event is me humping your leg, then the PC is one giant femoral orgy.

leggo my leg-o

[Keller]

leggo my leg-o

Right on time. :tumble:

[Gan]

If you missed the humor in my troll, then you're beyond help.

[Keller]

If you missed the humor in my troll, then you're beyond help.

What do you think the :tumble: was for.

[Gan]

Ok, so you're not beyond help then.

That does not imply that you do not need any though.

[Back]

Time For Marijuana Legalization? (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/02/25/opinion/courtwatch/main4828659.shtml)


Apparently, it was nothing personal after all. Apparently, it was strictly business all along.

After generations of defending capital punishment and marijuana possession laws on moral, ethical and religious grounds, after years of declaring that the death penalty acted as a deterrent against violent crime and that pot smokers were more dangerous to society than, say, alcohol consumers, all of a sudden thanks to our economic crisis more and more mainstream powerbrokers are considering dramatic changes to our criminal justice system.

The New York Times today has a late-arriving piece by Ian Urbina which posits that lawmakers in several states are considering abandoning the death penalty because it’s just too expensive and cuts into other law enforcement priorities. State officials are beginning to acknowledge that they can more productively spend their budget funds on cracking unsolved cases or ensuring better police protection than on keeping pot smokers in prison or fighting for decades with capital defendants. This, Urbina writes, is forcing a sea-change around the nation:

“Last year, in an effort to cut costs, probation and parole agencies in Arizona, Kentucky, Mississippi, New Jersey and Vermont reduced or dropped prison time for thousands of offenders who violated conditions of their release. In some states, probation and parole violators account for up to two-thirds of prison admissions each year; typical violations are failing drug tests or missing meetings with parole officers.

As prison crowding has become acute, lawsuits have followed in states like California, and politicians find themselves having to choose among politically unattractive options: spend scarce tax dollars on expanding prisons, loosen laws to stem the flow of incarcerations, or release some nonviolent offenders.”



This trend toward releasing non-violent offenders naturally begs the question: what about legalizing marijuana possession and lowering the drinking age? A California lawmaker Monday introduced legislation that would legalize (and tax) pot there. In Colorado, as seen this past Sunday on 60 Minutes, the police chief in Boulder (which houses a raucous University of Colorado) made a compelling case for saving money by reducing the drinking age from 21. Better to have police officers tracking violent crime, the argument goes, than writing tickets for college kids who are going to drink no matter what.

These declarations, from the political and legal arena, are not just isolated voices shouting into the wilderness. Consider the late, great Milton Friedman, the Nobel Laureate, former Reagan advisor, and esteemed scholar associated with the very conservative Hoover Institution. He was among hundreds of important economists who argue that pot should be legalized and taxed - and that the income from such taxation could generate billions in new revenues and billions more in enforcement savings. If you live in California, what would you rather have? Pot smokers whose cases are tying up the legal system? Or better health care and roads thanks to a marijuana tax. I’m just asking the question-and others are too.

Friedman and his colleagues first made these arguments years ago - before the economy tanked. Is it time to take his view more seriously with states facing huge budget shortfalls that threaten to curtail vital projects and policies? It is such a great leap from releasing prisoners from prison early to save money and not sending them there at all to save more? I would suspect a survey of police officials and prosecutors, and a survey of state budget officials, would indicate that the matter is being taken more seriously today than it ever has been.

It’s not my place to advocate anything - so please don’t write and accuse me of being Cheech or Chong. All I am saying is that the economic case for legalizing marijuana, and for lower the drinking rate, is as compelling as it has ever been and that, in a time of great changes in the interaction between government and the governed, it would not be the worst thing in the world to have a serious national debate on the topic. If we are going to lower state and federal budgets for criminal justice, if we are going to be emptying our prisons anyway to save costs, let’s make sure we do it in a way that maximizes the opportunities available to us.

:whistle:

[Mabus]

There have been over five federal raids of state-authorized medical marijuana dispensaries since Obama took office. This even though he has in the past (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQr9ezr8UeA&feature=related) called for decriminalization. Obama has even stated he "inhaled frequently" and "that was the point", and during his campaign stated (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUze-oYsswI&feature=related) that prosecuting medical marijuana users was a waste of federal resources.

Just an update, with applause to the administration for keeping a campaign promise:

US authorities to end raids against medical marijuana providers - Attorney general said dispensers in states allowing use of the substance can supply patients without federal penalty, Guardian UK (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/mar/19/obama-administration-medical-marijuana-federal-raids)

In remarks to reporters yesterday, US attorney general Eric Holder said the federal government would end raids on medical marijuana dispensers that are otherwise in compliance with laws in the 13 states that permit it. He said the change was based on an assessment of how to allocate scarce law enforcement resources.

[Androidpk]

Looks like California's attempt at fully legalizing has gotten some other states thinking in the right direction.

A pair of bills — House Bill 2929 and Senate Bill 1801 — seeking to “tax and regulate the cannabis industry” have just been introduced in the Massachusetts legislature.

http://blog.norml.org/2009/03/23/norml-breaking-news-marijuana-legalization-bills-introduced-in-massachusetts/

[SHAFT]

Looks like California's attempt at fully legalizing has gotten some other states thinking in the right direction.

A pair of bills — House Bill 2929 and Senate Bill 1801 — seeking to “tax and regulate the cannabis industry” have just been introduced in the Massachusetts legislature.

http://blog.norml.org/2009/03/23/norml-breaking-news-marijuana-legalization-bills-introduced-in-massachusetts/

The times, they are a changin'

[SolitareConfinement]

The times, they are a changin'

its about fucking time

[Methais]

Looks like California's attempt at fully legalizing has gotten some other states thinking in the right direction.

A pair of bills — House Bill 2929 and Senate Bill 1801 — seeking to “tax and regulate the cannabis industry” have just been introduced in the Massachusetts legislature.

http://blog.norml.org/2009/03/23/norml-breaking-news-marijuana-legalization-bills-introduced-in-massachusetts/

http://www.mindcontroll.com/imagearchive/images/754.jpg

[Parkbandit]

Or.. maybe not:

WASHINGTON (AP) - President Barack Obama had some fun with at least one question at his online town hall, saying he doesn't think legalizing marijuana is a good strategy for turning around the economy.
Obama told the audience Thursday that one of the most popular questions was whether legalization of the illicit drug would help pull the nation out of the recession. The president jokingly said: "I don't know what this says about the online audience."

In a serious response, he said he didn't think that was a good economic policy.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D975QL000&show_article=1

[Fallen]

Looks like California's attempt at fully legalizing has gotten some other states thinking in the right direction.

A pair of bills — House Bill 2929 and Senate Bill 1801 — seeking to “tax and regulate the cannabis industry” have just been introduced in the Massachusetts legislature.

http://blog.norml.org/2009/03/23/norml-breaking-news-marijuana-legalization-bills-introduced-in-massachusetts/

Don't these bills always get killed in committee? They never allow them to go to the floor.

[Androidpk]

Don't these bills always get killed in committee? They never allow them to go to the floor.

Yes, but not by much usually. As far as a bill that supports full legalization and taxing I think this is the first time one will go to committe. I know the bill in California is getting voted on in committee next tuesday on the 31st.

I'm pretty disappointed with Obama's response to the questions. The first time he opened up questions in January there was an overwhelming support of questions for legalization, medicinal marijuana, decriminalizing, ect ect. Which he brushed off with a single statement. He opens up for questions online again, and again an overwhelming support for legalization and he shoots it down and makes a joke about the "online audience".

If you don't like what the American people have to say when you ask them, DON'T fucking ask them!

[Some Rogue]

I think that term has officially lost it's meaning.

Between you, Gan, Daniel, and the dipshit who every two days leaves me the same rep (SR?) -- no one on this forum can be critical of anything anyone says without being called a leg-humper.

Let's just put it out there -- you said something retarded. I called you on it. If that isolated event is me humping your leg, then the PC is one giant femoral orgy.


Just catching up on this tread but....

STOP HUMPING MY LEG.

I think I may have repped you once ever. :P

[Fallen]

Yeah, that leg-humping thing was just a defensive ploy that you really have to sell to have work to any degree. Hence the people leaning on it so hard.

I don't think pot will ever be legalized nation wide. Area by area, maybe. But never all over.

[Keller]

Yeah, that leg-humping thing was just a defensive ploy that you really have to sell to have work to any degree. Hence the people leaning on it so hard.

I don't think pot will ever be legalized nation wide. Area by area, maybe. But never all over.

I see Utah leading the way on this important initiative.

Long live freedom.

[Keller]

Just catching up on this tread but....

STOP HUMPING MY LEG.

I think I may have repped you once ever. :P

:rofl:

For a while there was someone who repped me like every 2 days anytime I responded to PB. It was pretty funny.

[Back]

Yeah, that leg-humping thing was just a defensive ploy that you really have to sell to have work to any degree. Hence the people leaning on it so hard.

I don't think pot will ever be legalized nation wide. Area by area, maybe. But never all over.

If you think it should go hump your congressperson’s leg.

[Fallen]

If you think it should go hump your congressperson’s leg.

I wouldn't mind if they legalized it, but at the same time it would just be one more thing I would waste money on. I don't really care either way. My job involves semi-regular testing, so it is a moot point for me.

[Asha]

Fallen a dope fiend!? My my.

[Mabus]

Just an update, with applause to the administration for keeping a campaign promise:

US authorities to end raids against medical marijuana providers - Attorney general said dispensers in states allowing use of the substance can supply patients without federal penalty, Guardian UK (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/mar/19/obama-administration-medical-marijuana-federal-raids)
Without knowing the particulars of this case it is hard to say (as they may have violated a state law). If no state laws were violated my applause for the new administration's stance on raiding medical marijuana facilities may have been premature.


DEA Raids Medical Marijuana Collective 03/26/2009 - Marijuana Policy Project (http://tv.mpp.org/uncategorized/dea-raids-medical-marijuana-collective-03262009/)

[Mabus]

Read a decent article today at the Huffington Post.

Taking the Pro-Pot Position (Because Somebody Has To) - Dan Sweeney (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dan-sweeney/taking-the-pro-pot-positi_b_179653.html)

Worth a read to those interested.

[crb]

Yes, but not by much usually. As far as a bill that supports full legalization and taxing I think this is the first time one will go to committe. I know the bill in California is getting voted on in committee next tuesday on the 31st.

I'm pretty disappointed with Obama's response to the questions. The first time he opened up questions in January there was an overwhelming support of questions for legalization, medicinal marijuana, decriminalizing, ect ect. Which he brushed off with a single statement. He opens up for questions online again, and again an overwhelming support for legalization and he shoots it down and makes a joke about the "online audience".

If you don't like what the American people have to say when you ask them, DON'T fucking ask them!
Ya, he is a fucking douche bag for not taking the question seriously.

By all means, lets continue to send billions of dollars to fund violent mexican drug cartels. That is good policy.

By all means, lets continue to spend billions of dollars fighting, processing, and incarcerating citizens who's only crime was to do something most people in this country have done.

By all means, lets let the prohibition of this common product continue to produce violence in our cities. Yes, let fund gang warfare! Good policy that.

By all means, lets deny our farmers a cash crop in both marijuana and industrial hemp.

By all means, lets waste police resources trying to stop a relatively harmless drug when they could be breaking up dangerous shit like meth labs.

And when the american people ask, lets have the president make a fucking joke.

[Tea & Strumpets]

BY ALL MEANS

[Rocktar]

Ahhh, but he is the Annointed One and has spoken, thus it is so.

Anyways, legalize what you want, tax the living fuck out of it and STILL undersell illegal suppliers, make it a crime to do it around kids like they are doing with smoking now, and damn fucking sure make it throw under the jail crime if you get caught driving while under the influence. JUST LIKE I think it should be for driving drunk.

[Mabus]

For those interested in decriminalization or legalization of marijuana this weekend (and in some cases, next weekend) marks a protest run by Cures Not Wars founder Dana Beal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dana_Beal).

It is called the "Global Marijuana March (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Marijuana_March)", and this year will take place in over 253 cities worldwide.

To find out if your city is having one you can check:
Cures Not Wars- Wordpress (http://www.cures-not-wars.org/wordpress/)
Global Marijuana March - Ning Site (http://globalmarijuanamarch.ning.com/)

If you believe that it is time to end the devastating "War on Drugs" fiasco consider coming out and making your voice heard.

Not that I expect much media coverage of a protest in 250+ cities around the world...

[Ignot]

Not one person who smokes Marijuana has been infected with Swine Flu. This is a fact but I have no sources. I just know.

[radamanthys]

"I'm talking about the end of all life
as we know it. For the past several
days I've been... noticing a steep rise
in the number of hippies coming to town.
At first I thought maybe it was just
a coincidence. Then I saw this...
Three new drum circles have sprouted
up here, here, and here. They're all
growing in diameter, at a rate of two
hippies per hour. What this means...
is that the hippies are conglomerating.
They'er thriving, if you will. I think
that they're setting up for a... . hippie
music festival."

http://media.southparkstudios.com/media/images/902/902_maybe_hippies.jpg

[Mabus]

Legalization: Its a... 04-30-2009 03:00 PM neg rep for shitty thread resurrection
I suppose I could have created a whole new thread for the same issue, but really...

If people are interested in being active about legalization the event is on May 2nd, and I can disregard the negativity for the millions that have suffered from this "War on Drugs".

[LMingrone]

I wish I could find the real quote and source. One of my favorite quotes. Something to do with starting war on a non-proper noun. Drugs, poverty, terrorism....

found it: "How do you wage war on an abstract noun?"

Edit: Full quote and source. Isn't in response to the drug war. But still applies.
"What really alarms me about President Bush's 'War on Terrorism' is the grammar. How do you wage war on an abstract noun? How is 'Terrorism' going to surrender? It's well known, in philological circles, that it's very hard for abstract nouns to surrender."
~Terry Jones

And I just posted the whole quote, It's not some Bush hating attempt.

[Androidpk]

For those interested the New Hampshire Senate voted in favor of medicinal marijuana. There were some slight revisions to the bill so it has to be reapproved by the house before being sent to the Governor.

[Androidpk]

Lawmakers Call For An End To Federal Marijuana Prosecutions

une 18, 2009

Washington, DC: Massachusetts Democrat Barney Frank, along with co-sponsors Ron Paul (R-TX); Maurice Hinchey (D-NY); Dana Rohrbacher (R-CA); and Tammy Baldwin (D-WI), will reintroduce legislation today to limit the federal government’s authority to arrest and prosecute minor marijuana offenders.


Continues on at http://norml.com/

Massachusetts leading the way again!

[Geshron]

How stupid and uneducated you have to be to make such an assumption.

If you think for half a second people don't smoke weed solely based on the legalities of it you must be an idiot.

Simply put - this country already has millions of stoners so again, PB, go pop pills with Rush Limbaugh and STFU. Legalize it, stop criminalizing people for a fucking plant, end of story.