U.S. plans $7 billion missile-defense sale to UAE

[Gan]

WASHINGTON, Sept 8 - The Bush administration is planning to sell the United Arab Emirates an advanced U.S. missile defense system valued at up to $7 billion that could be used to defend against Iran, people who have attended briefings on the matter said on Monday.

The Pentagon is set to notify the U.S. Congress of the proposed sale, which would be the first of the so-called Terminal High Altitude Area Defense, or THAAD, several people familiar with the matter said.

THAAD is built by Lockheed Martin Corp <LMT.N>. Raytheon Co <RTN.N> supplies the system's radar.

Once notified of such a proposed arms sale by the administration, Congress has 30 days to review it but almost never blocks.

In any case, deployment of the THAAD weapons system is "at least months away" and could take more than a year, said a congressional staff member familiar with the matter.

Kenneth Katzman, an expert on the Gulf at the Congressional Research Service, said the UAE has been eager for a "sophisticated antidote" to Iran's missile capabilities.

"The UAE has been concerned for many years about possible retaliation against it for U.S. or Israeli strike on Iran's nuclear facilities," he said.

For Iran, Katzman added, UAE could be an attractive target because of its billions of dollars of infrastructure investments.

Craig Vanbebber, a Lockheed Martin spokesman, said several countries had shown interest in buying the THAAD system, "with its significant coverage area and tremendous success in recent testing."

THAAD is the first missile defense system designed to defend against short- and intermediate-range ballistic missiles both inside and outside the Earth's atmosphere.

The potential $7 billion sale would include anti-missile interceptors, firing units, associated radar sites and training, among other things, a congressional staff member said.

http://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/20080909/tbs-usa-uae-missile-7318940.html
__________________________________________________ _

So is this the UAE saying they dont trust Iran in a polite way?
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[Bokertal]

Has nothing to do with what the UAE thinks. Has everything to do keeping the Straits of Hormuz open and protecting the Airport in Fuj and ports in Jeb and Dubai. Its all all about Us of course. That place is a shit hole anyway.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Totally non-political but this is what my boyfriend works on for a living. I don't know any specifics but I do know the technology and math and crap is pretty insane.

OKAY politics time.. I think this is a pretty clear message from the UAE that they don't trust Iran or likely some other countries (they just don't have as great of missile capability as Iran). The UAE's feelings are probably not what swayed the US though.. the US needs to protect the UAE to protect ourselves. The ports and all that.

[crb]

And this is one reason why investment in advanced weapons technology (what Obama wants to cut) is a good thing. We export it to our allies, helping our trade deficit and providing US jobs.

[Warriorbird]

Eh. There's a difference between cutting bullshit programs (which there are many of) and cutting innovative ones. Defense needs scrutiny just like education does. Of course a Republican would never want to hear that.

[sst]

Totally non-political but this is what my boyfriend works on for a living.


Not exactly somthing you should be putting out on the internet.

[sst]

Has nothing to do with what the UAE thinks. Has everything to do keeping the Straits of Hormuz open and protecting the Airport in Fuj and ports in Jeb and Dubai. Its all all about Us of course. That place is a shit hole anyway.

Do you really think anything a country does is not in its own self interest?

[Warriorbird]

Often.

[sst]

when and where.

[Warriorbird]

Countries do DUMB stuff. This has happened throughout history.

[ClydeR]

This issue is a reminder of the failed Dubai ports deal. In 2006, Bush wanted to turn over the management of serverl major ports in the United States to a Dubai company. There was a big bipartisan objection. Bush said he would veto any attempt to override his decision. The Dubai company eventually backed out because of the objections.

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubai_Ports_World_controversy), Obama opposed the Dubai ports deal, and McCain said we should trust Bush.

I can't find any video of Obama speaking on the issue, but I found this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iubAX4QsGsY) of McCain saying it was not a big deal because the UAE is freer than China. Never mind about geography or that Iran is also freer than China.

[sst]

? the intention at the time is in that countries self interest.

[Warriorbird]

Not really. Countries don't work as a collective will. Leaders often make very individual choices.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Not exactly somthing you should be putting out on the internet.

Um, yeah because it'd be really hard for people who wanted to find out to find out via other methods who works for those companies.. and now terrorists are totally going to come and ransack my house looking for the super secret plans of doom that he's totally allowed to take outside of their secure areas.

:wtf:

GD, Draper, Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, all other associated companies and the US Government have such amazing and high security on what their employees are actually doing that I'm not somehow endangering myself or country to say Oh yeah my boyfriend works on that for a living. Yeah, he does work with classified stuff but there isn't a gag order on saying what or where his job actually IS. The horror.

[Warriorbird]

U.S. = $407 billion deficit

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/09/news/economy/cbo_budget_update/index.htm?cnn=yes

We're raking in the dough!

[Gan]

U.S. = $407 billion deficit

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/09/news/economy/cbo_budget_update/index.htm?cnn=yes

We're raking in the dough!

Are you responding to Crb?

*Or is this some random data spewed in haste, not really having anything to do with the conversation?


And this is one reason why investment in advanced weapons technology (what Obama wants to cut) is a good thing. We export it to our allies, helping our trade deficit and providing US jobs.

[crb]

Eh. There's a difference between cutting bullshit programs (which there are many of) and cutting innovative ones. Defense needs scrutiny just like education does. Of course a Republican would never want to hear that.
Well... this was specifically missile defense, which is specifically what Obama said he'd cut. So how does that foot taste?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Well... this was specifically missile defense, which is specifically what Obama said he'd cut. So how does that foot taste?

I dunno about all of the other companies, but I do know that with General Dynamics there is something like a 30 year contract guaranteeing a set amount of work on various technologies.. so even if the missile defense does get cut back severely enough, it doesn't necessarily mean lost jobs but just a major headache as everyone is shifted to new departments and new projects to work on. Mind you, that's not "ideal" but they do have job security.

[Warriorbird]

What foot? There's been a large number of questionable missile defense programs. Just because your conservative ideals only extend as far as orgasming over ANY military technology, crb, doesn't mean that we shouldn't be pragmatic with every part of the budget.

Our deficit can now be a round 400 billion.

[Gan]

Are you responding to Crb?

*Or is this some random data spewed in haste, not really having anything to do with the conversation?

WB.
I'll repeat the question.

What? No response?

:nono:

[Parkbandit]

Eh. There's a difference between cutting bullshit programs (which there are many of) and cutting innovative ones. Defense needs scrutiny just like education does. Of course a Republican would never want to hear that.

I don't have any problem with that. There is just as much defense pork as there is any other pork in our Government.

http://passaicnews.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/no-pork.jpg

[crb]

What foot? There's been a large number of questionable missile defense programs. Just because your conservative ideals only extend as far as orgasming over ANY military technology, crb, doesn't mean that we shouldn't be pragmatic with every part of the budget.

Our deficit can now be a round 400 billion.
Like what?

So you're saying Obama doesn't want to squash the expensive and successful and now exportable missile defense program that shoots down missiles with other missiles? He wants to shut down the laser beam one from the finale of "Spies Like Us" that is fictional?

Actually, I bet you he flips on that like he has flipped on everything else. Sometime between now and Nov 4th someone will call him on it in an interview and he'll do his typical routine "No no, I've always supported missile defense, I've never said I've wanted to cut it. I think you'll find that all along I've been a supporter."

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Why would it be so terrible if sometime down the road, when he has more information, he changed his mind and made a different educated decision?

I don't get why being flexible makes you some sort of willy-nilly flip flopper who can't make decisions. That's more educated and responsible than someone who makes a single judgment and decision and then refuses to deviate even when data and information comes out that they probably SHOULD. At least someone who "flip flops" gives you the chance that it'll be corrected if they make a mistake.

There's so much to attack Obama about, but trying to turn a pretty positive point (the ability to be reasoned with and change your mind, something that people on the other side of the political spectrum should be rejoicing about quite frankly) into something that makes him look like a pussy or whatever else is just silly.

[Gan]

Why would it be so terrible if sometime down the road, when he has more information, he changed his mind and made a different educated decision?

I don't get why being flexible makes you some sort of willy-nilly flip flopper who can't make decisions. That's more educated and responsible than someone who makes a single judgment and decision and then refuses to deviate even when data and information comes out that they probably SHOULD. At least someone who "flip flops" gives you the chance that it'll be corrected if they make a mistake.

There's so much to attack Obama about, but trying to turn a pretty positive point (the ability to be reasoned with and change your mind, something that people on the other side of the political spectrum should be rejoicing about quite frankly) into something that makes him look like a pussy or whatever else is just silly.

Kind of like the bridge to nowhere that Obama is currently attacking Palin over right now. That kind of flip flop?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Kind of like the bridge to nowhere that Obama is currently attacking Palin over right now. That kind of flip flop?

I disagree with that line of attack, too. Same with attacking someone for supporting the war originally and then changing their mind later (like so many Americans).

You can't undo the past mistake but you can change what you do when it's apparent it IS a mistake. Yes, Palin made a mistake on the Bridge to Nowhere but she did come to her senses and stop supporting it. There's far more to nail Palin on IMO and things about her that I truly dislike (i.e. her social agenda) than the bridge fiasco. That's not to say that you shouldn't examine WHY mistakes happen. If a mistake is made because of gross neglect or willful ignorance, it doesn't really matter what's done to correct it, it's understandable people would bring it up.. but if the mistake was made even after the person used whatever resources and research they had to formulate their plan, and it turned out to go bust or not work as expected, then that to me is forgivable.

[crb]

Why would it be so terrible if sometime down the road, when he has more information, he changed his mind and made a different educated decision?

I don't get why being flexible makes you some sort of willy-nilly flip flopper who can't make decisions. That's more educated and responsible than someone who makes a single judgment and decision and then refuses to deviate even when data and information comes out that they probably SHOULD. At least someone who "flip flops" gives you the chance that it'll be corrected if they make a mistake.

There's so much to attack Obama about, but trying to turn a pretty positive point (the ability to be reasoned with and change your mind, something that people on the other side of the political spectrum should be rejoicing about quite frankly) into something that makes him look like a pussy or whatever else is just silly.
Which will shows up to govern if he wins? Pandering Primary Obama or Pandering General Election Obama?

I'd rather not elect someone with such wild mood swings. And considering his record is very very liberal, I don't think that this move to the center is genuine.

[Mabus]

Obama should cut all defense spending. Totally.
He could then concentrate on all the real issues, like gay marriage!

[sst]

Um, yeah because it'd be really hard for people who wanted to find out to find out via other methods who works for those companies.. and now terrorists are totally going to come and ransack my house looking for the super secret plans of doom that he's totally allowed to take outside of their secure areas.

:wtf:

GD, Draper, Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, all other associated companies and the US Government have such amazing and high security on what their employees are actually doing that I'm not somehow endangering myself or country to say Oh yeah my boyfriend works on that for a living. Yeah, he does work with classified stuff but there isn't a gag order on saying what or where his job actually IS. The horror.

Narcissiia, I’m trying to be helpful here. It’s not smart to put that type of stuff out on the internet. Just like your boyfriend is not supposed to walk around in public with his security badge from the company he works for on because that makes him a target for collection, you shouldn’t put stuff like that out on the internet for the same reasons.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Narcissiia, I’m trying to be helpful here. It’s not smart to put that type of stuff out on the internet. Just like your boyfriend is not supposed to walk around in public with his security badge from the company he works for on because that makes him a target for collection, you shouldn’t put stuff like that out on the internet for the same reasons.

No offense man, but you're not being helpful and you're assuming quite a bit. Being paranoid doesn't make it somehow more "secure". It's not a breach of security in any sense to admit he works for a company on a certain project.

Him and his group of coworkers go out for lunch nearly everyday and they all wear their badges that have their names and the company name in massive letters, including with his boss. Half the damn people that live in our town work there in some capacity. And you don't seriously think it's a matter of swiping a key card and maybe getting a code, and bam you can somehow get into the building let alone access to any part of it (let alone all of it) that has relevant data or information? They have top notch security and don't need to rely on a girlfriend not spilling the beans about the title of her boyfriend's job to prevent bad guys from busting in.

[sst]

No offense man, but you're not being helpful and you're assuming quite a bit. Being paranoid doesn't make it somehow more "secure". It's not a breach of security in any sense to admit he works for a company on a certain project.

Him and his group of coworkers go out for lunch nearly everyday and they all wear their badges that have their names and the company name in massive letters, including with his boss. Half the damn people that live in our town work there in some capacity. And you don't seriously think it's a matter of swiping a key card and maybe getting a code, and bam you can somehow get into the building let alone access to any part of it (let alone all of it) that has relevant data or information? They have top notch security and don't need to rely on a girlfriend not spilling the beans about the title of her boyfriend's job to prevent bad guys from busting in.

In todays enviorment its very easy to target people though the internet and email. Perhaps you should ask your boyfriend if he wants you talking about the classfied work he is doing and the company he works for on the internet.

[Nieninque]

Not exactly somthing you should be putting out on the internet.

WELL IF SHE WANTED TO RETRACT IT, ITS ALSO QUOTED IN YOUR POST NOW DUMBASS!

[Nieninque]

No offense man, but you're not being helpful and you're assuming quite a bit. Being paranoid doesn't make it somehow more "secure". It's not a breach of security in any sense to admit he works for a company on a certain project.

Him and his group of coworkers go out for lunch nearly everyday and they all wear their badges that have their names and the company name in massive letters, including with his boss. Half the damn people that live in our town work there in some capacity. And you don't seriously think it's a matter of swiping a key card and maybe getting a code, and bam you can somehow get into the building let alone access to any part of it (let alone all of it) that has relevant data or information? They have top notch security and don't need to rely on a girlfriend not spilling the beans about the title of her boyfriend's job to prevent bad guys from busting in.

Sssshhh...all teh KGBers R on teh PC

[Gan]

WB.
I'll repeat the question.

What? No response?

:nono:

bump

[Warriorbird]

It was to crb. I was being lazy like usual.

[Gan]

And this is one reason why investment in advanced weapons technology (what Obama wants to cut) is a good thing. We export it to our allies, helping our trade deficit and providing US jobs.


U.S. = $407 billion deficit

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/09/news/economy/cbo_budget_update/index.htm?cnn=yes

We're raking in the dough!


It was to crb. I was being lazy like usual.

Why did you use budget deficit numbers when Crb was talking about trade deficit in his previous post? The article you sourced discusses the budget deficit - not trade.

We actually show a 53 billion reduction in the trade deficit (mostly) due to enhanced trade from the weak dollar. Something that will carry through for most part of 2008.
http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/statistics/historical/gands.pdf

:(

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

In todays enviorment its very easy to target people though the internet and email. Perhaps you should ask your boyfriend if he wants you talking about the classfied work he is doing and the company he works for on the internet.

Actually when he got home I showed him this thread and all he had to say was "What a tool" before going to grab a beer. But then, as I stated before, there's nothing wrong with anyone including myself stating to a person or the fucking world what he does. It's not the same thing as posting a PDF of all the vector mathematics and insane data he processes in his job.

Oh and:


I do work in the army now relating to Technology Protection. I work directly with Cleared defense contractors, in regards to education and awareness training as well as red team work to test their security. I have a good general Idea what I’m talking about.

Putting stuff like that out is not smart. Especially when you talk about his working on a classified program that foreign intelligence services have collection requirements for. You may think it is trivial. I just suggest you think twice about doing it in the future.

Yeah I am so afraid, man. Next time try to refrain from sending me a PM to make yourself look like a bad-ass.

The only way I wouldn't be able to say what exactly my boyfriend is working on is if he was working in the R&D department, which he's not (obviously) on something that is top-secret classified. That would mean there wouldn't be any news thing about the project being sold, and I wouldn't even know he was working on the project since he'd be barred from even telling me.

You're a paranoid dipshit and should probably just shut the fuck up already. I imagine you may have had some experience with security clearances but you've made it quite apparent you know jack about this particular situation.

[Bokertal]

Originally Posted by sst
I do work in the army now relating to Technology Protection. I work directly with Cleared defense contractors, in regards to education and awareness training as well as red team work to test their security. I have a good general Idea what I’m talking about.

Putting stuff like that out is not smart. Especially when you talk about his working on a classified program that foreign intelligence services have collection requirements for. You may think it is trivial. I just suggest you think twice about doing it in the future.


What an ass. And a hypocrite.

[Warriorbird]

I dunno... maybe to show that we're still way in the hole? I find it intellectually bankrupt to go on and on about one when the other's so terrible. You wouldn't run a company that way.

[BigWorm]

I do work in the army now relating to Technology Protection. I work directly with Cleared defense contractors, in regards to education and awareness training as well as red team work to test their security. I have a good general Idea what I’m talking about.

Putting stuff like that out is not smart. Especially when you talk about his working on a classified program that foreign intelligence services have collection requirements for. You may think it is trivial. I just suggest you think twice about doing it in the future.

Damn dude you are so fucked. The terrorists are totally going to get your ass now.

[Kembal]

Kind of like the bridge to nowhere that Obama is currently attacking Palin over right now. That kind of flip flop?

Slightly different, from what I'm reading. I'll explain, and then you can disagree if you wish.

Congress killed the earmark for the Bridge to Nowhere in Nov. 2005. Ted Stevens was able to hold on to the money for Alaska, though not the specific earmark. (So $442 million sent to Alaska)

Palin ran as a supporter of the Bridge to Nowhere in the 2006 gubernatorial election. i.e. Congress has already killed the project's earmark, but she's still running and saying it should be built with federal tax dollars.

After the Democrats took over Congress in 2006 and basically ensured the earmark would not be resurrected, Palin killed the Bridge to Nowhere because it would have to be paid with state dollars. However, she did not return the $442 million and used it on other projects in Alaska.

The kicker? The access road to the nonexistent bridge on the island is still being built at the cost of $24m in federal tax dollars, because otherwise the money for the access road would have to be returned to the federal government.

Link: http://www.adn.com/sarahpalin/story/511471.html

We're paying $24m for an access road to a nonexistent bridge. And she's supposed to be a fiscal conservative of some sort?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Damn dude you are so fucked. The terrorists are totally going to get your ass now.

STOP TALKING ABOUT THIS SHIT BEFORE THE BLACK HELICOPTERS ARRIVE AND THE GOVERNMENT MEN ARRIVE TO MAKE YOU DISAPPEAR.

[Bokertal]

STOP TALKING ABOUT THIS SHIT BEFORE THE BLACK HELICOPTERS ARRIVE AND THE GOVERNMENT MEN ARRIVE TO MAKE YOU DISAPPEAR.


Silly Rabbit, "They" are already here!

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Silly Rabbit, "They" are already here!

I have foiled their plans by wearing an aluminum suit and hat.

:up:

[sst]

Actually when he got home I showed him this thread and all he had to say was "What a tool" before going to grab a beer. But then, as I stated before, there's nothing wrong with anyone including myself stating to a person or the fucking world what he does. It's not the same thing as posting a PDF of all the vector mathematics and insane data he processes in his job.
I find this doubtful. Your previous statement about them wearing their badges out in the open is already a violation of company policy, no matter which CDC he works for. It is a basic countermeasure in any security program. So i have a feeling you're blowing a lot of hot air





Yeah I am so afraid, man. Next time try to refrain from sending me a PM to make yourself look like a bad-ass.

The only way I wouldn't be able to say what exactly my boyfriend is working on is if he was working in the R&D department, which he's not (obviously) on something that is top-secret classified. That would mean there wouldn't be any news thing about the project being sold, and I wouldn't even know he was working on the project since he'd be barred from even telling me.

You're a paranoid dipshit and should probably just shut the fuck up already. I imagine you may have had some experience with security clearances but you've made it quite apparent you know jack about this particular situation.
I'm not trying to sound like a badass, I'll be the first to tell you the job is fairly lame. Trying to see how many people you can tailgate into a secure building in one day or picking though trash is not exactly my idea of excitement.

If you don’t want to listen that’s fine. I should have just PM'd you in the first place, an error on my part.

I still suggest you be more careful when talking about it over the internet. Things on the PC come up over search engines.

[crb]

I don't have anything to contribute to the "My Boyfriend is a GI Joe IRL Discussion"

But let me also say, because I'm libertarian and not republican, that THIS is why technological research into every field needs to be pursued. We are (or were) the most technologically advanced country on earth with the best universities and scientists. The fact that we've been on the forefront of every new technology for the last 100 years or so is a big big big big reason why we're so dominant today.

Both sides have dropped the ball though.

Democrats piss on (thus far unsuccessefully thank god) defense spending. But they also piss on things like nuclear plants. Meanwhile France has become the world leader in nuclear power generation, selling it to the chinese and all over the world, building nuclear plants. When we start building them again we'll likely be paying the French.

Republicans piss on things like alt energy, solar power etc. So now you got wind power from Denmark and Solar from Germany and Spain. Though, McCain is a fan of alternative energy, so this should change.

Republicans have also pissed on things like stem cell research. Biotechnology is big business and it pisses me off that we're letting places like South Korea beat us here. Though again, McCain is for it, so it should change.

Both sides need to realize that advanced technological research is rarely a bad thing, and that the single best way to maintain American economic dominance is through keeping us on the cutting edge of everything.

[Daniel]

We're paying $24m for an access road to a nonexistent bridge. And she's supposed to be a fiscal conservative of some sort?

So like a liberal to be against American jobs.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I find this doubtful. Your previous statement about them wearing their badges out in the open is already a violation of company policy, no matter which CDC he works for. It is a basic countermeasure in any security program. So i have a feeling you're blowing a lot of hot air



I'm not trying to sound like a badass, I'll be the first to tell you the job is fairly lame. Trying to see how many people you can tailgate into a secure building in one day or picking though trash is not exactly my idea of excitement.

If you don’t want to listen that’s fine. I should have just PM'd you in the first place, an error on my part.

I still suggest you be more careful when talking about it over the internet. Things on the PC come up over search engines.

Their badges are one type of ID-- they are required by law to be wearing them when they leave the company premises, and to either keep it in their house or worn on their person. There are other processes to get into buildings and access information-- their ID cards don't even have scanner bars in them, they use different, more secure methods to grant access. BTW, in saying all that I'm still not revealing classified/sensitive information.

I'm not "blowing hot air". I had to spend about 5 hours signing paperwork before I could officially change my address, since we live together and I am held to the same liability. I'm well aware of what I may hear and can't say-- this not being one of those instances.

I get you think you're being helpful and not necessarily trying to be an ass. Thank you for the suggestion, if I am ever in doubt as to whether I am about to illegally reveal classified information here on the PCs, I certainly won't post. This is simply not such a time.

[Daniel]

I find this doubtful. Your previous statement about them wearing their badges out in the open is already a violation of company policy, no matter which CDC he works for. It is a basic countermeasure in any security program. So i have a feeling you're blowing a lot of hot air



I'm about 100% certain this may be locality specific. In DC *everyone* walks around with their security badge and it's not exactly hard to point out someone who is walking out of the Department of State building as a Department of State employee.

[sst]

I don't have anything to contribute to the "My Boyfriend is a GI Joe IRL Discussion"

But let me also say, because I'm libertarian and not republican, that THIS is why technological research into every field needs to be pursued. We are (or were) the most technologically advanced country on earth with the best universities and scientists. The fact that we've been on the forefront of every new technology for the last 100 years or so is a big big big big reason why we're so dominant today.



Sadly though its starting to change. We're graduating less and less people with advanced degrees in the sciences out of our universities and are starting to have to import more and more intellectual power from other countries. Cause a lot of the initial research and development even done in DoD research facilities to be done by foreigners. Not to mention the research done at universities.

[Daniel]

Sadly though its starting to change. We're graduating less and less people with advanced degrees in the sciences out of our universities and are starting to have to import more and more intellectual power from other countries. Cause a lot of the initial research and development even done in DoD research facilities to be done by foreigners. Not to mention the research done at universities.

Republican don't believe in supporting education. It's up to the individual to provide for him\herself and not a matter of national security at all.

[Khariz]

Alright, Narcissiia, while you are not revealing any secret information, which one of the companies you listed does your boyfriend work for. I mean, since he wears his badge all over the place, no harm in being specific, right?

So which is it? Lockheed, Raytheon? Which? Just curious.

[sst]

Republican don't believe in supporting education. It's up to the individual to provide for him\herself and not a matter of national security at all.

Damn Daniel I didn’t know where I was supposed to stand thanks for telling me, let me change my opinion.

sarcasm aside, its a issue, I feel we need to completely revamp our education system and the style it is, how I don’t know, but it needs to be done and soon.

We used to have something like an average of 60% of graduate or higher degrees worldwide come from the US every year... Its dropped down to something like 30%.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Neither, actually. GD-- General Dynamics.

They aren't all the same business but do a lot of cross business with each other/collaborative efforts. Once things are completed they're sold to the relevant business to further streamline but rarely is a full project thought of, developed, tested and produced all at one company.

[sst]

Their badges are one type of ID-- they are required by law to be wearing them when they leave the company premises, and to either keep it in their house or worn on their person. There are other processes to get into buildings and access information-- their ID cards don't even have scanner bars in them, they use different, more secure methods to grant access. BTW, in saying all that I'm still not revealing classified/sensitive information.

Yes, i know how the badges work, the computer systems track times and location of access to different parts of the building and some contractors have RFID in them so they can track where they are within the facilities and which computer terminals or workstations they are at. I know how it all works. It all depends on which contractor and which system they use since they are all different.
But hey its not something that his company would want out in the open since security systems work best when people dont know what they are and therefore dont know how to get around them, So please tell us more specifics, Did i guess right or was there stuff I left out.

[Daniel]

Damn Daniel I didn’t know where I was supposed to stand thanks for telling me, let me change my opinion.

sarcasm aside, its a issue, I feel we need to completely revamp our education system and the style it is, how I don’t know, but it needs to be done and soon.

We used to have something like an average of 60% of graduate or higher degrees worldwide come from the US every year... Its dropped down to something like 30%.

I wasn't taking a dig at you, but CRB.

You're right. Education is a serious problem in the US and we need to do something about it. Fast.

[sst]

Alright, Narcissiia, while you are not revealing any secret information, which one of the companies you listed does your boyfriend work for. I mean, since he wears his badge all over the place, no harm in being specific, right?

So which is it? Lockheed, Raytheon? Which? Just curious.

she alrady pretty much said GD by talking about her knowledge of them.

[sst]

I'm about 100% certain this may be locality specific. In DC *everyone* walks around with their security badge and it's not exactly hard to point out someone who is walking out of the Department of State building as a Department of State employee.

I was refering to Cleared Defense Contractors.

[sst]

I wasn't taking a dig at you, but CRB.

You're right. Education is a serious problem in the US and we need to do something about it. Fast.

I guessed as much, i was feeling cheeky though.

[sst]

Neither, actually. GD-- General Dynamics.

They aren't all the same business but do a lot of cross business with each other/collaborative efforts. Once things are completed they're sold to the relevant business to further streamline but rarely is a full project thought of, developed, tested and produced all at one company.

:yeahthat:

[Daniel]

I was refering to Cleared Defense Contractors.

I work a lot with OSD and JCS and I've never seen this be an issue.

Then again, the beltway is an entirely different beast.

[sst]

I work a lot with OSD and JCS and I've never seen this be an issue.

Then again, the beltway is an entirely different beast.

True that, what they do and what they are "supposed" to do tend to be different. Out here things are pretty tight since a lot of the companies have been burned with the loss of a lot of proprietary info. You also have more of the talking heads and less of the people doing the work there, so the knowledge base and security awareness is different.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Yes, i know how the badges work, the computer systems track times and location of access to different parts of the building and some contractors have RFID in them so they can track where they are within the facilities and which computer terminals or workstations they are at. I know how it all works. It all depends on which contractor and which system they use since they are all different.
But hey its not something that his company would want out in the open since security systems work best when people dont know what they are and therefore dont know how to get around them, So please tell us more specifics, Did i guess right or was there stuff I left out.

Yeah you got it right, and frankly it's already out in the open.

Most of this shit is common sense, not uber top secret crap. Therefore, no, it's not classified. It's not specific, it's not "protected info" and it's not dangerous to talk about. It's also not something a bad group would need to hear from me or anyone else-- it's shit that, were they a real threat, they'd automatically assume.

Keeping hush hush about it creates an illusion of more security. That's it-- not actually more security.

[Daniel]

The illusion of security is just as good as real security.

The reputation of our intelligence services does more to prevent attacks and get assistance than almost anything else.

Not that I'm saying SST wasn't being a bit Anal, but he's a CI agent. They're all like that.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

In this case, I'd say their other illusions of security (which I admittedly know less about) are greater than what has been posted in this thread. It's like a sign that says ADT on a house-- knowing there's more than just a swipe of a single silly badge is probably better security then bad people thinking it IS just the badge.

I get it, sst doesn't want me spewing classified info. I don't either-- but I am highly aware of what I am allowed to say and reveal, and what I'm not, and I am not going to be anally paranoid over peanuts like this. Had sst just not sad jack half of what is now posted on here about GD security wouldn't be posted at all. *shrug*

I'm done discussing it, though.There's been nothing negligent that I've said and it's tiresome to be lectured on and on about something I understand pretty freaking well and have done nothing to violate.

So how about that college education system?

[sst]

sadly i didn't know what GD did with their badges, I made a guess and I got it right.
Each company is different in how they deal with things, each has their own way that they wish to spend as little money as possible on security.

[sst]

The illusion of security is just as good as real security.

The reputation of our intelligence services does more to prevent attacks and get assistance than almost anything else.

Not that I'm saying SST wasn't being a bit Anal, but he's a CI agent. They're all like that.

I prefer paranoid, and rightfully so, because THEY are always watching.

[crb]

Republican don't believe in supporting education. It's up to the individual to provide for him\herself and not a matter of national security at all.
Correction.

Republicans don't believe in supporting montessori and liberal arts education.


Which is sarcasm...

In truth Republicans don't believe in supporting teachers unions and public school monopolies. Republicans support charter schools, magnet schools, school of choice, and vouchers. To say they don't support education because they want to hold teachers accountable and bring more choice to parents is disingenouos. but that is classic Daniel for you.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

sadly i didn't know what GD did with their badges, I made a guess and I got it right.
Each company is different in how they deal with things, each has their own way that they wish to spend as little money as possible on security.

Part of it right. There's definitely more overall and probaby tons of stuff I don't even know about.

Security with them is just not something I'm worried about. Not like FEMA, heh.

[TheRunt]

In this case, I'd say their other illusions of security (which I admittedly know less about) are greater than what has been posted in this thread. It's like a sign that says ADT on a house-- knowing there's more than just a swipe of a single silly badge is probably better security then bad people thinking it IS just the badge.

I prefer the sign on my house that says my big ass dog can make it to the fence in 3.5 seconds can you?