Obama & Teacher's Unions

[crb]

Note: Newsweek is in-the-tank for Obama. Everyone knows this, he has been on their cover about 200 times and has constant love-fest gushing articles. Just to put this current article in context.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/145843

Basically saying what I've said in quite a few threads.

As long as teacher's unions put teacher's unions as their number 1 goal (like pretty much all unions. It goes Union then workers, then company, then product, workers are never first, and product is last), our education system cannot be reformed.

Some philanthropist wanted to donate like 200 million to detroit to start charter schools and the teacher's union blocked it. Fuckers.

[Warriorbird]

This'd ring less hollow if Republicans actually cared about public schools.

[Drew]

Unions, what a joke. Slowly strangling America.

[crb]

This'd ring less hollow if Republicans actually cared about public schools.
Right, Republicans hate education.... you don't think republicans have kids they want to be educated? Or maybe own businesses for which they want smart workers? Or maybe would rather educate someone than incarcerate at a higher cost to the taxpayer?

[Parkbandit]

Right, Republicans hate education.... you don't think republicans have kids they want to be educated? Or maybe own businesses for which they want smart workers? Or maybe would rather educate someone than incarcerate at a higher cost to the taxpayer?


Stop using logic with WB.. doesn't work. His next response is "Look at all the waste in Iraq" or "We're going to be too busy invading Iran to care about schools"

[Warriorbird]

I don't think Republicans hate education at all. I just think they don't really care about public schools. Teachers are going to cling to unions as long as Republicans continue not to evidence that care. Do something radical...raise salaries for those who refuse to take part in collective bargaining. Then you might get some serious leverage.

Republicans wouldn't do that though...because it'd cost money and spending money is only cool for war or on corporations.

[crb]

You're wrong WB.

Republicans don't dislike spending money.

Republicans just don't like wasting money. We want to see a return on our investment, and we just don't want to throw money at a problem. Not everything is fixed with more funding, and you can't tax your way out of problems either.

[Daniel]

You're wrong WB.

Republicans don't dislike spending money.

Republicans just don't like wasting money. We want to see a return on our investment, and we just don't want to throw money at a problem. Not everything is fixed with more funding, and you can't tax your way out of problems either.

Really? Iraq= Money well spent?

I can think of at least one republican who obviously doesn't like education.

[Parkbandit]

I can think of at least one republican who obviously doesn't like education.

Please elaborate. I'd love to see this source.

I just hope it doesn't come from the same source as my signature line from you...

[Daniel]

It's called a witty retort. I understand you have issues understanding the english language but I was implying that CRB did not have an education if he somehow thought the Iraq war was proof positive that republicans don't like wasting money.

[Sean of the Thread]

My younger brother is his schools union rep. Without the unions public schools would cease to exist. Crazy parents and administrators.

[crb]

It's called a witty retort. I understand you have issues understanding the english language but I was implying that CRB did not have an education if he somehow thought the Iraq war was proof positive that republicans don't like wasting money.
I wasn't talking about Iraq, you'll notice the thread title is "Obama & Teacher's Unions" not "Obama & Teacher's Unions and Iraq Funding."

Yes, not every political thread needs to involve Iraq.

Furthermore, if we don't use hindsight in consideration, Iraq really isn't a waste of money. When we went to Iraq we thought Saddam had WMDs and was working with terrorists. We were wrong, or we didn't have the complete story, but only what we knew at the time matters. Now, the fundamental truth of the war on terror is that we need to be right and successful 100% of the time, and the enemy only needs to be right or successful once.

When thinking about the economic costs to a WMD being unleashed in a major American city, juxtaposed against the as then estimated costs of the Iraq war, the war ends up cheaper. 9/11 was just 2 buildings and 3000 people and we're still feeling the economic affects of it. It hurt our economy to such a degree that, right or wrong, the fed lowered Interest rates to unheard of levels, and kept them low for a good deal of time, which then fueled an unheard of housing boom, the correction from which is the main cause of our current economic woes.

What if it was a whole city destroyed?

Then, today, the ongoing future costs of Iraq vs. the opportunity and consequential costs of pulling out early. What are the costs of a nuclear war in the middle east? What are the costs in blood & treasure of leaving Iraq, only to be forced to go back in 5 or 10 years? These things too must be considered.

Finally, not all money spent on the Iraq war evaporates. Traditionally wars help the economy by boosting defense spending and providing jobs in the defense industry. There is one local car company here that is hiring workers. It isn't GM, it isn't FORD, it isn't Chrysler, no, its a little company called Spartan Motors. What do they make? The chassis for those new IED resistant trucks. Thats a couple thousand jobs that would not exist if not for Iraq, in an area that sorely needs them.

As much as I want this thread to stay on topic about teacher's unions and the scourge on our education system that they are, I felt daniel deserved a proper education on how to more accurate calculate the cost of a war, and how just because something is expensive, doesn't mean it is a waste, nor how just because something turns out to be more expensive than anticipated, doesn't mean you're better off giving up rather than seeing it through.

[Warriorbird]

I find it really funny to see you giving your lecture to a former soldier of that war.

Do you really think that the reason we haven't been attacked has been our presence in Iraq? Do we really want to take that view to its ultimate extreme?

Do you really think it is benefiting our economy?

It's sort of up there with wailing against teachers unions yet not raising salaries and doing everything possible to undercut the public education system.

[Stanley Burrell]

It is wholly pathetic that our educators are so desperate that they're forced to seek refuge using these group of schmucks as a backbone for their voice.

More government money towards education with a tax increase.

[Parkbandit]

I find it really funny to see you giving your lecture to a former soldier of that war.

Do you really think that the reason we haven't been attacked has been our presence in Iraq? Do we really want to take that view to its ultimate extreme?

Do you really think it is benefiting our economy?

It's sort of up there with wailing against teachers unions yet not raising salaries and doing everything possible to undercut the public education system.



Stop using logic with WB.. doesn't work. His next response is "Look at all the waste in Iraq" or "We're going to be too busy invading Iran to care about schools"

It's like I'm clairvoyant.. Either that or WB has 2 talking points.. and that's it.

[Daniel]

Yea. It's not like Iraq is a perfect example of waste and abuse.

[Warriorbird]

No, PB. You're just an asshole. We've already broken down the same talking points for you. Only I have a benefit. My points are actually correct and don't usually involve :rofl:.

Cept this time.

:rofl:

[Parkbandit]

Yea. It's not like Iraq is a perfect example of waste and abuse.


Has nothing to do with Obama and Teacher's Unions.. yet I KNEW WB would use it.

[Stanley Burrell]

We should borrow money from China to fund this.

.

When the G.I. bill gives our militiamen its '09 benefits, maybe we'll have more decorated Americans back home to enjoy their mercenary income.

[Warriorbird]

I dunno. Kinda funny when other folks brought up Iraq first.

[Parkbandit]

No, PB. You're just an asshole. We've already broken down the same talking points for you. Only I have a benefit. My points are actually correct and don't usually involve :rofl:.

Cept this time.

:rofl:

Seriously? You have a benefit?

Clearly this is your opinion and not one shared by many on this board.

Now please use your 2nd talking point, you know, invading Iran. This way you get it all out of your system at once.

[Daniel]

We should borrow money from China to fund this.

.

When the G.I. bill gives our militiamen its '09 benefits, maybe we'll have more decorated Americans back home to enjoy their mercenary income.

I'm really looking forward to this actually. I can pocket about 33k a year if I go back to school in Fall 09 (tax free) in DC or I can go somewhere like Paris and make 6 grand a month.

Weeee

[Stanley Burrell]

I dunno. Kinda funny when other folks brought up Iraq first.

Honestly though, is it that surprising? If I'm Republican/conservative, that's the first off-topic agenda I'm going to spout when someone brings up home-based teacher unions.


I'm really looking forward to this actually. I can pocket about 33k a year if I go back to school in Fall 09 (tax free) in DC or I can go somewhere like Paris and make 6 grand a month.

Weeee

I hope this is how things turn out, at the very least. You can't exactly pawn merit badges.

This fucking administration. I swear to God.

[Warriorbird]

I dunno, Parkbandit. Funny how somebody else brought up Iran in this thread first.

I'm glad you're so dedicated to paying attention to me. Totally boosts my ego.

I think Republicans could do better on this issue if they focused their message more. Say what you will about it... No Child Left Behind was some of the most significant educational change in this country in a while.

[crb]

I find it really funny to see you giving your lecture to a former soldier of that war.

Do you really think that the reason we haven't been attacked has been our presence in Iraq? Do we really want to take that view to its ultimate extreme?

Do you really think it is benefiting our economy?

It's sort of up there with wailing against teachers unions yet not raising salaries and doing everything possible to undercut the public education system.
Why are you such a twit? Every time education has been discussed I said I was for providing more funding (attached to more accountability).

And yes, I think it would be more expensive in the long run to pull out, than to stay in.

[Parkbandit]

I dunno, Parkbandit. Funny how somebody else brought up Iran in this thread first.

I'm glad you're so dedicated to paying attention to me. Totally boosts my ego.

I think Republicans could do better on this issue if they focused their message more.


If you get an ego boost from a guy over the Internet.. buddy, you have some serious personal problems you should address. Lack of self esteem for starts.. but I could understand how someone like you would have a problem with that.

Seek help.

[Warriorbird]

1. You are, crb. Nobody in your party in Congress is.
2. Ha ha ha. Right. Get back to me when you disassociate Iraq with terrorism like everybody else rational.

::

Realizing that people as wacko as you actually exist makes me feel worse about the country, Parkbandit, but it always makes me feel better about myself.

[Daniel]

If you get an ego boost from a guy over the Internet.. buddy, you have some serious personal problems you should address. Lack of self esteem for starts.. but I could understand how someone like you would have a problem with that.

Seek help.

This from a guy who bookmarks threads that he thinks he won in order to make himself feel better at another time.

[Parkbandit]

This from a guy who bookmarks threads that he thinks he won in order to make himself feel better at another time.

I'm not looking for an ego stroking.. I bookmark things for sheer entertainment.

Most of your posts are also bookmarked. I like to show my kids what will happen to them if they don't learn in school. They will end up saying really retarded things.. like your quote in my sig.

60%... that's still fucking amazing. And the excuse you came up with afterwards was almost as retarded.

Comedy Gold, bro.