The True Conservative.

[Borismere]

I'am a self described conservative. This is what I want. I think this is representative of what most true conservatives want.

1.) I want to keep almost all of my money. No new taxes.

2.) I don't care what you do no matter how profane, as long as it doesn't affect me.Thats your business, not mine.

3.) I'll only support people who are desperately in need of money in this country due to factors they cannot control through a charitable fund and NOT through the government. So, people who are able-bodied and have a reasonable opportunity to get a job are not eligible. People who have 5 kids and their spouse was a drug addict and left the home I will support up to an extent, which means I'll match dollar for dollar whatever they earn.

4.) Government should only concern themselves about controlling crime and foreign or global affairs.

5.)Roads and other neccessary infrastructure should be in the realm of the local governments. Richer areas will naturally have better roads and bridges.

6.) All public schools should be dissolved and private schooling should be the norm. A yearly charitable fund should be developed for the exceptionally poor areas. Americans are incredibly giving especially for a good cause like education for the poor, I bet more conversatives will give into this fund and I also bet each school will recieve more, above and beyond what the government could possibly give them through taxation.

7.) Criminals should have a 3 strike rule, which is more then generous. Any high level crimes would count against these strikes, a violent crime will lead to just a second chance and no more. A calculated murder means immediate out. No death penalty, I personally don't believe in it. Instead, all offenders will be sent to a remote island. There will be some crude facilities built on the island, and ample space for farming for sustenance on the island. Patrol boats will constantly monitor anyone trying to exit the island. If a person does manage to escape they'll be shot on sight, no questions.

8.) Government and Business - All men for themselves rule. Free for all market economy with just the bare minimum rules. For instance, you can't sell drugs or use your clout to destroy any nascent company or industry or scam people using wierd financial "innovations". Otherwise, whatever goes.

9.) Illegal Immigration - Illegal immigrants. Businesses harboring or hiring confirmed illegal immigrants will be shut down, no questions asked. The Business owners will be sent off to "the island" for 1 full year, and the government will absolve themselves of any bodily injury done onto the owner during that time, including death. The immigrants' assets of U.S. origin will be seized and they will be prompty deported to their country of origin. This will end illegal immigration,no money means no illegal immigration. However, my thinking why the government hasn't already done this is because much of the illegal immigrant labour contributes to US economic growth. If they became legal all of a sudden then the labour pool ceases to become cheap since they don't have to "hide in the shadows" any longer.

[Sean]

ClydeR2?

[Khariz]

I'd label you a libertarian with objectivist outlook.

That's the way I am. I'm more of on objectivist than you are, but we both like hands-off capitalism and less government control and taxation.

[g++]

That's more like a Libertarian manifesto than a conservative list of beliefs, and #9 is just borderline insane.

[g++]

Jinx Khariz

[Khariz]

Jinx Khariz

At least we agree on the analysis, hehe.

[NocturnalRob]

7.) Criminals should have a 3 strike rule, which is more then generous. Any high level crimes would count against these strikes, a violent crime will lead to just a second chance and no more. A calculated murder means immediate out. No death penalty, I personally don't believe in it. Instead, all offenders will be sent to a remote island. There will be some crude facilities built on the island, and ample space for farming for sustenance on the island. Patrol boats will constantly monitor anyone trying to exit the island. If a person does manage to escape they'll be shot on sight, no questions.


i think i saw this movie...

[BigWorm]

Libertarians are conservatives.

8) Makes you more of an anarcho-capitalist than a libertarian, though the line between the two can be fine.

6) Is just plain retarded

Did you just read Atlas Shrugged or something? You're pretty into the whole social darwinism thing.

[Ashliana]

7.) Criminals should have a 3 strike rule, which is more then generous. Any high level crimes would count against these strikes, a violent crime will lead to just a second chance and no more. A calculated murder means immediate out. No death penalty, I personally don't believe in it. Instead, all offenders will be sent to a remote island. There will be some crude facilities built on the island, and ample space for farming for sustenance on the island. Patrol boats will constantly monitor anyone trying to exit the island. If a person does manage to escape they'll be shot on sight, no questions.

This, I really disagree with. If you sit down and look at the causes of crime to begin with, as well as the end-effects of three-strikes legislation, you'll see how bad an idea they are. The United States already has the most people imprisoned in both absolute AND relative terms on the planet. This is an enormous expense, which rather contradicts your "no new taxes" ideal.

Also, the way our criminal justice system is set up, the more visible (a.k.a., street/urban crime) is noticed and persecuted, while the far more economically damaging white-collar and blue-collar crime is neglected because those criminals are more discrete.

Three-strikes legislation is a glossing over of reality, is unproductive at addressing the source of crime because it assumes that crime is a result of free will and choice rather than desperation.


8.) Government and Business - All men for themselves rule. Free for all market economy with just the bare minimum rules. For instance, you can't sell drugs or use your clout to destroy any nascent company or industry or scam people using wierd financial "innovations". Otherwise, whatever goes.

Bare regulation of markets is disastrous. It's how we end up with enormous monopolies and financial markets which practice predatory loaning. Want someone to blame for the current financial situation? Blame the nearly unregulated financial/lending markets by the numerous regulatory bodies during the last eight years.


9.) Illegal Immigration - Illegal immigrants. Businesses harboring or hiring confirmed illegal immigrants will be shut down, no questions asked. The Business owners will be sent off to "the island" for 1 full year, and the government will absolve themselves of any bodily injury done onto the owner during that time, including death. The immigrants' assets of U.S. origin will be seized and they will be prompty deported to their country of origin. This will end illegal immigration,no money means no illegal immigration. However, my thinking why the government hasn't already done this is because much of the illegal immigrant labour contributes to US economic growth. If they became legal all of a sudden then the labour pool ceases to become cheap since they don't have to "hide in the shadows" any longer.

Again, this contradicts your "no new taxes" argument. Enforcing this idea would require a vast amount of intelligence work and police/immigration enforcement work, as well as more prison space, in addition to the economic losses we'd be facing from the sudden drop in productivity.

[Clove]

ClydeR2?That's exactly what I was thinking. Sounds more like a Libertarian. Bad policy it would widen the gap between the impoverished and wealthy.

[Clove]

Wow. I guess it's unaminous, Libertarian.

[Clove]

Libertarians are conservatives.Yes but all conservatives are not Libertarian. Libs are part of the conservative set.

[Jorddyn]

I'm a self described liberal.



1.) I want to keep almost all of my money. No new taxes.

I'll do you one better. It's time to completely revamp social security so that it truly only takes care of those in highly unfortunate circumstances, not so that it is a retirement fund for all senior citizens.



2.) I don't care what you do no matter how profane, as long as it doesn't affect me.Thats your business, not mine.

Yep.



3.) People who have 5 kids and their spouse was a drug addict and left the home I will support up to an extent, which means I'll match dollar for dollar whatever they earn.
How do you suggest they earn this money while attempting to take care of five children? I would much prefer to fully support and educate the person for two years while they get through trade school.


4.) Government should only concern themselves about controlling crime and foreign or global affairs.

Infrastructure? Trade? Monetary policy?


5.)Roads and other neccessary infrastructure should be in the realm of the local governments. Richer areas will naturally have better roads and bridges.

And interstates will fall apart. Imagine I-80 across Nebraksa being locally funded. It'd be a disaster 10 miles past Lincoln.



6.) All public schools should be dissolved and private schooling should be the norm.
Er, no. I prefer my society educated.



7.) Criminals should have a 3 strike rule, which is more then generous.


Have you read the studies suggesting that the three strike rule actually leads to more violent crimes? The island thing is just insane. Unless you're Australian.


8.) Government and Business - All men for themselves rule. Free for all market economy with just the bare minimum rules. For instance, you can't sell drugs or use your clout to destroy any nascent company or industry or scam people using wierd financial "innovations". Otherwise, whatever goes.

I'm all for less regulation than we currently have, but next-to-no regulation is dangerous.


9.) Illegal Immigration

Is this all business owners, even those with only one illegal immigrant? Will the government give the business owners a reliable way of judging the legality of their workers? As it stands, the best they can do is contact the SS Administration to match the SS# to the last name. If not, can you really hold a business owner liable when his or her worker has what appear to be legal documents (especially because said employer is not allowed to discriminate by race, and can't just say NO BROWN PEOPLE)?


However, my thinking why the government hasn't already done this is because much of the illegal immigrant labour contributes to US economic growth. If they became legal all of a sudden then the labour pool ceases to become cheap since they don't have to "hide in the shadows" any longer.
I completely agree.

[crb]

Libertarians are conservatives.

8) Makes you more of an anarcho-capitalist than a libertarian, though the line between the two can be fine.

6) Is just plain retarded

Did you just read Atlas Shrugged or something? You're pretty into the whole social darwinism thing.
Careful, I tried to claim the same thing once.

Someone will come tell you that conservatives are antifreedom and so couldn't possibly be libertarian.

[crb]

I'am a self described conservative. This is what I want. I think this is representative of what most true conservatives want.

1.) I want to keep almost all of my money. No new taxes.


Agreed, but also, I want to make more money, and I make more money when the economy is strong and consumers spend more money and more people have jobs, so it isn't just that I want my taxes to be low, I want my neighbor's taxes to be low too, and I want business taxes to be low. So my neighbor can buy more things I make, and so businesses can hire more people who can then buy more things I make.



2.) I don't care what you do no matter how profane, as long as it doesn't affect me.Thats your business, not mine.


Marginal agreement. I would never speak in absolutes, unless it is in the realm of mere speech. But like, cruelty to animals, it doesn't affect me, and yet, I do have a problem with you doing it.



3.) I'll only support people who are desperately in need of money in this country due to factors they cannot control through a charitable fund and NOT through the government. So, people who are able-bodied and have a reasonable opportunity to get a job are not eligible. People who have 5 kids and their spouse was a drug addict and left the home I will support up to an extent, which means I'll match dollar for dollar whatever they earn.


Marginal agreement again. The important thing is helping society and saving the government money, in many ways it is cheaper to educate, cheaper to help, than to incarcerate. So if left with the choice of helping a group of people, educating a group of people, or letting the problem fester and then incarcerating that group of people. The cheaper options are the first two.



4.) Government should only concern themselves about controlling crime and foreign or global affairs.


Primarily.



5.)Roads and other neccessary infrastructure should be in the realm of the local governments. Richer areas will naturally have better roads and bridges.


Largely they are already, though not fully. I have no problems with most of our current system. Except, New Orleans pisses me off. You're on the coast, you're below sea level, move. Kitrina wasn't even that strong, only a 3 when it made land fall, it was such a disaster not because it was abnormal, but because of where it hit. All those low lying areas of New Orleans should be turned into a wildlife preserve or parks or something. People have no business living in such tenuous locations.



6.) All public schools should be dissolved and private schooling should be the norm. A yearly charitable fund should be developed for the exceptionally poor areas. Americans are incredibly giving especially for a good cause like education for the poor, I bet more conversatives will give into this fund and I also bet each school will recieve more, above and beyond what the government could possibly give them through taxation.


Disagree. As much as I hate douche liberals trying to set school policy with stupid things like no dodgeball and grades are mean (montessori ftl), I've even heard that "timeout" is too harsh a punishment. I equally would hate rich bible thumpers dictating that my kid learn about how god created the world in 7 days. I don't necessarily like any system where the rich would dictate education for the rest, which is what you'd get here. Our current schools definitely aren't perfect, what with teacher unions driving non-eductional agendas, but I don't want to go down your road.



7.) Criminals should have a 3 strike rule, which is more then generous. Any high level crimes would count against these strikes, a violent crime will lead to just a second chance and no more. A calculated murder means immediate out. No death penalty, I personally don't believe in it. Instead, all offenders will be sent to a remote island. There will be some crude facilities built on the island, and ample space for farming for sustenance on the island. Patrol boats will constantly monitor anyone trying to exit the island. If a person does manage to escape they'll be shot on sight, no questions.


You've seen too many movies. In my opinion "three strikes" laws came about from public disgust of many repeat violent offenders being let back on the street. But they aren't perfect as they apply to many minor crimes. In the end, if possible I'd rather have a nonviolent offender rehabilitated, educated, and out working for society, than paying $50k a year to incarcerate him in a relatively posh (thank you liberals) prison.

So, no, can't agree with any law that doesn't allow some leeway to judges based on circumstances. That is kinda what judges are for, ya know?



8.) Government and Business - All men for themselves rule. Free for all market economy with just the bare minimum rules. For instance, you can't sell drugs or use your clout to destroy any nascent company or industry or scam people using wierd financial "innovations". Otherwise, whatever goes.


Regulation is fine. Regulation as a means to manipulate industries is not fine. I don't know if many people realize that most regulation is bought and paid for by one industry or another to protect their position or interest. Big corporations for instance love regulations that raise the barrier of entry for competitors. Professional groups love regulations that stipulate you must be a member of X professional group to work in a field (and I'm not talking doctors or lawyers or people who actually need more than a 6 week course to do the job).

Regulations are important, overregulation and regulations whose motives come out of greed of malfeasance are not. You need to separate the two.



9.) Illegal Immigration - Illegal immigrants. Businesses harboring or hiring confirmed illegal immigrants will be shut down, no questions asked. The Business owners will be sent off to "the island" for 1 full year, and the government will absolve themselves of any bodily injury done onto the owner during that time, including death. The immigrants' assets of U.S. origin will be seized and they will be prompty deported to their country of origin. This will end illegal immigration,no money means no illegal immigration. However, my thinking why the government hasn't already done this is because much of the illegal immigrant labour contributes to US economic growth. If they became legal all of a sudden then the labour pool ceases to become cheap since they don't have to "hide in the shadows" any longer.

Again with the Island. Any immigrant who is guilty of a crime needs to be deported, instantly, and I love the part about seizing assets. Some immigrant gets caught drunk driving in a car, take that car. We need a giant steel and concrete wall on the border and more border patrol agents. Bring the great wall of china over brick by brick, whatever it takes. Border security is a matter of national security.

But, you need to be realistic. People who haven't broken the law (other than immigration law) should be provided with a path to citizenship, and we need immigration reform to allow more of the right people into this country. By right people I mean having an obvious bias to people who are educated or accomplished, and why not? That will help our country the most, and I'm nothing if not patriotic.

A temporary worker program is also needed.

[radamanthys]

I say we just consider illegals as enemy combatants. Open season. To birth an american citizen, you have to be one yourself.

I argue with myself over population control, these days. In my opinion, we should set a limit, at the very least, on 'social benefits' given to those who are popping out kids faster than they can afford them. I'd subsidize abortion (gasp!). Where there may be a right to life here, there's no right to create it ad nauseum. Unfortunately, a free market approach to population control creates the opposite effect: the richer you are, the lesser the number of children you have... go figure.

[BigWorm]

I say we just consider illegals as enemy combatants. Open season. To birth an american citizen, you have to be one yourself.

I argue with myself over population control, these days. In my opinion, we should set a limit, at the very least, on 'social benefits' given to those who are popping out kids faster than they can afford them. I'd subsidize abortion (gasp!). Where there may be a right to life here, there's no right to create it ad nauseum. Unfortunately, a free market approach to population control creates the opposite effect: the richer you are, the lesser the number of children you have... go figure.

That totally wouldn't put Americans traveling abroad in immediate danger or anything.

[Gan]

My vote is libertarian.

#2 threw you off the conservative bandwagon.

[crb]

I say we just consider illegals as enemy combatants. Open season. To birth an american citizen, you have to be one yourself.

I argue with myself over population control, these days. In my opinion, we should set a limit, at the very least, on 'social benefits' given to those who are popping out kids faster than they can afford them. I'd subsidize abortion (gasp!). Where there may be a right to life here, there's no right to create it ad nauseum. Unfortunately, a free market approach to population control creates the opposite effect: the richer you are, the lesser the number of children you have... go figure.
Nah nah, not abortion, birth control, its cheaper.

IMO birth control should be paid for by the government, we'd get the money back, with interest.

[Apathy]

LOL Backlash is trolling all of you.