Student tasered at Kerry speech

[Parkbandit]

When I saw this story plug on the news this morning.. I was like "WTF!" First of all, I can't remember the last time I saw a Republican protester.. and 2nd.. why would it even make the news!?

So I just looked up the story.. It sounds like he was asking Kerry why Bush wasn't impeached.. and if they were both part of the Skull and Bones society as students in Yale.

And everything finally made sense.

Student Arrested, Tasered at Kerry Event
AP
Posted: 2007-09-18 10:12:19
Filed Under: Crime News, Nation News, Politics News
GAINESVILLE, Fla. (Sept. 18) - A University of Florida student was Tasered and arrested after trying to ask U.S. Senator John Kerry about the 2004 election and other subjects during a campus forum.

Videos of the incident posted on several Web sites show officers pulling Andrew Meyer, 21, away from the microphone after he asks Kerry about impeaching President Bush and whether he and Bush were both members of the secret society Skull and Bones at Yale University.

"He apparently asked several questions -- he went on for quite awhile -- then he was asked to stop," university spokesman Steve Orlando said. "He had used his allotted time. His microphone was cut off, then he became upset."

As two officers take Meyer by the arms, Kerry, D-Mass., is heard to say, "That's alright, let me answer his question." Audience members applaud, and Meyer struggles to escape for several seconds as up to four officers try to remove him from the room.

Meyer screams for help and asks "What did I do?" as he tries to break away from officers. He is forced to the ground and officers order him to stop resisting. Meyer says he will walk out if the officers let him go.

As Kerry tells the audience he will answer the student's "very important question," Meyer struggles on the ground and yells at the officers to release him, crying out, "Don't Tase me, bro," just before he is Tasered. He is then led from the room, screaming, "What did I do?"

http://news.aol.com/story/ar/_a/student-arrested-tasered-at-kerry-event/20070918063509990001

[Lianon]

Wow...I was expecting to see a total jackass. I didn't think the question was stated in an unacceptable manner. He did freak out when they grabbed him though. That probably didn't help...

Seems shady to me.

[Khariz]

Interesting.

[Nieninque]

I think this story shows that freedom of expression is alive and well in the US.

[Khariz]

I think this story shows that freedom of expression is alive and well in the US.

kee kee kee

[Meges]

I very much dislike Kerry on many levels, but in a public forum with rules, those rules need to be adhered to. Time and question allotment was a known factor to this guy, but he refused to abide by the guidelines. When asked to leave, he refused. Cops came in to enforce the rules and keep the peace, but the guy resisted. He got what he deserved.


Meges

PS Go Gators!

[Khariz]

I very much dislike Kerry on many levels, but in a public forum with rules, those rules need to be adhered to. Time and question allotment was a known factor to this guy, but he refused to abide by the guidelines. When asked to leave, he refused. Cops came in to enforce the rules and keep the peace, but the guy resisted. He got what he deserved.


Meges

PS Go Gators!

Please...

If you'd like me to go into great detail on how he got more than he deserved, I'll be glad to. That was more than enough police officers to just cuff and him and drag him out.

I'd rather not research and quote the law of the state and the police procedure, but I will if it's really necessary.

[Nieninque]

I very much dislike Kerry on many levels, but in a public forum with rules, those rules need to be adhered to. Time and question allotment was a known factor to this guy, but he refused to abide by the guidelines. When asked to leave, he refused. Cops came in to enforce the rules and keep the peace, but the guy resisted. He got what he deserved.


Meges

PS Go Gators!

I think this story shows that freedom of expression is alive and well in the US.

[Kranar]

I very much dislike Kerry on many levels, but in a public forum with rules, those rules need to be adhered to. Time and question allotment was a known factor to this guy, but he refused to abide by the guidelines. When asked to leave, he refused. Cops came in to enforce the rules and keep the peace, but the guy resisted. He got what he deserved.


I love it when cops swarm in en masse to enforce the law and keep the "peace" against what amounts to nothing more than a nuisance, all the while in areas of the city where there really are issues with crime, you hardly see a cop in sight.

[Some Rogue]

The best part was him screaming like a little bitch for help. And the crying when he got the Taser.

He knew damn well what he was doing. If he'd not have been swinging his arms around and struggling, he wouldn't have got shocked.

[TheEschaton]

It didn't even seem like Kerry was annoyed by the question or anything. It seems like an inappropriate response to a guy who inappropriately reacted to a forum limitation that "censored" him.

-TheE-

[Atlanteax]

Where's the ACLU's outcry of oppression?

[Clove]

The best part was him screaming like a little bitch for help. And the crying when he got the Taser.

He knew damn well what he was doing. If he'd not have been swinging his arms around and struggling, he wouldn't have got shocked.

Or if four trained officers had just restrained and cuffed him he wouldn't have gotten shocked.

[Khariz]

Or if four trained officers had just restrained and cuffed him he wouldn't have gotten shocked.

Exactly. That's what I was saying.

[Gan]

Or if four trained officers had just restrained and cuffed him he wouldn't have gotten shocked.

Ding ding ding.

Tazers are overused and abused, and have turned most law enforcement personnel who rely on them into a bunch of pussies, IMO. They are the ultimate non-lethal tool of the 'little man with a badge' style police officer.

Whatever happend to just grabbing the guy and escorting him outside?

Does this mean that anyone caught violating the rules gets tazered?

I'm not a fan of tazers... Why two or more police officers cant restrain a single normal sized individual without resorting to tazering just amazes me.

[Kuyuk]

http://www.break.com/index/student-tasered-at-john-kerry-speech.html

http://www.break.com/index/second-view-john-kerry-speech.html

[Kuyuk]

http://www.glumbert.com/media/ufpolicetaser

Still funny.

[Kuyuk]

I think it'd be funny if they beat the cops and tazed them for shits.


K.

[ElanthianSiren]

Whatever happend to just grabbing the guy and escorting him outside?


I was wondering too why such a display of force was necessary, especially since the guy was already on the ground. Maybe he's a kung fu master in disguise.

[Fallen]

ZAP

Suck it up.

[Atlanteax]

ACLU is mum on the taser-ing, but rushes to Senator Larry Craig's defense.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/09/17/aclu.craig/index.html

The ACLU, once again doing more harm than good.

[Numbers]

Tazing went way too far. Sure, the guy was a douche and a rabble-rouser, but some of those rent-a-cops were pretty large... they had the kid cuffed, they could have easily picked him up by the arms and legs and carried him out of the auditorium.

More than likely it will cost those cops their jobs, deservedly so.

[Keller]

ACLU is mum on the taser-ing, but rushes to Senator Larry Craig's defense.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/09/17/aclu.craig/index.html

The ACLU, once again doing more harm than good.

Why is it harmful?

[Tea & Strumpets]

Why is it harmful?

"If the police really wanted to stop people from having sex in public bathrooms, they "should put up a sign banning sex in the restroom and send in a uniformed officer to patrol periodically," Romero said." --ACLU guy

Also, please remember not to shit in the sink.

[Sean]

Probably because the ACLU has already taken a stance on tasers and police action: http://www.aclu.org/police/abuse/19977prs20051006.html . Sides I'd hardly consider them protecting your right to ask a girl at a bar to bone you without being arrested as harmful.

[Nieninque]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Possibility of Getting Tasered or Shot for Trying to Exercise the Previous two Rights..."

[Clove]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Possibility of Getting Tasered or Shot for Trying to Exercise the Previous two Rights..."

You're beginning to sound like a broken record.

Riot police attack Heathrow Airport protest
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/08/379441.html

Apparently freedom of expression is just as alive and well in the UK.

[Parkbandit]

:rofl:

You've been pwned by Clove.

[Nieninque]

:rofl:

You've been pwned by Clove.

Your definition of "pwned" sure is watery these days.

[Parkbandit]

Your definition of "pwned" sure is watery these days.


Much like your posts these days.

[Nieninque]

You're beginning to sound like a broken record.

Riot police attack Heathrow Airport protest
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/08/379441.html

Apparently freedom of expression is just as alive and well in the UK.

Hey, we shoot Brazilian tourists in the head because they look like terrorists.

And, I'm sure you can see the similarity between a mass demonstration at an airfield, and a student asking John Kerry a question, with regards to the threat to public security.

[Blazing247]

Taser's are proven (you know, with facts and statistics) to reduce injuries, not only to the Ofc., but to the suspect as well. Not all departments use them, but they are becoming much more commonplace and for good reason. If you want to make this an excessive force issue, do so, but do not bash the taser until you do a little research.

On the force continuum, a taser lies at the same level as O.C. and the baton. Trust me, being sprayed sucks and using the PR-24 on someone smarts a little longer. If you watch the video, the Ofc.'s exhaust both verbal intervention and also empty hand control and the subject is still resisting, and while you may not consider him a dangerous person, his flailing could easily seriously injure an Ofc. Keep in mind that the use of the taser is intended to prevent an incident from escalating higher up the force continuum and to avoid serious injury to all parties. Gan says "little man with a badge syndrome", and why didn't they just grab him. They did grab him, he resisted, at that point use of a taser is authorized if it is believed that attemping to subdue him at that point will injure someone, esp. the Ofc.

Anyhow, keep on debating. This guy was an idiot, was looking to make a spectacle, and ended up BEING the spectacle. To Kranar, it is likely they overstaffed that day and had more than enough manpower to patrol wherever it is you, in your infinite knowledge think they SHOULD have been.

[Ilvane]

Meyer had about a minute and a half at the microphone before police stepped in to haul him away. As he tried to escape their grip, Kerry protested, "That's all right, let me answer his question."

I got this quote of the AP article..so it wasn't Kerry, PB.:)

I do think they went a bit far with the tasering, for sure.

Free speech is great, but you don't need to act like an ass to get your point across.;)

Angela

[Parkbandit]

I got this quote of the AP article..so it wasn't Kerry, PB.:)


Angela

Leave it to you to dumb up a thread. Who the fuck said Kerry did the tasering?

[Ilvane]

OMFG..I would think you would know I wasn't saying it was Kerry who tasered him, but you do like to twist things, so whatever.

:shrug:

I meant=Kerry was asking the student be allowed to stay so he could answer his question. He did not request the kid to be removed, and or tasered, and actually was suggesting that he be allowed to stay and continue the debate.

That more clear for you?

Angela

[Parkbandit]

OMFG..I would think you would know I wasn't saying it was Kerry who tasered him, but you do like to twist things, so whatever.

:shrug:

I meant=Kerry was asking the student be allowed to stay so he could answer his question. He did not request the kid to be removed, and or tasered, and actually was suggesting that he be allowed to stay and continue the debate.

That more clear for you?

Angela

The only thing clear here is you are The Stupid. I never inferred that Kerry had anything to do with the incident.

Talk about twisting things.

[Clove]

Hey, we shoot Brazilian tourists in the head because they look like terrorists.

And, I'm sure you can see the similarity between a mass demonstration at an airfield, and a student asking John Kerry a question, with regards to the threat to public security.

Similarity? I thought the common connection was free speech?

[Nieninque]

Similarity? I thought the common connection was free speech?

Absolutely. I abhor the British Authorities using excessive force just as much as I do anyone else. It was argued by the Police at Heathrow that they were concerned about the security of the airports, and if you remember it was around the time that the foreign doctors had tried to bomb Glasgow airport, so they were a little twitchy about it. Doesn't justify their impairing of people's right to protest, and I will never support that.

In this case, it was some snot-nosed student being smart to a Politician. I'm sure Kerry expected someone to do the job, if he didnt, he needs to have a word with his tour manager, because that shit is text-book. There was no need to be so heavy handed and given the fact that there were cameras there from CNN amongst others, it was a pretty short-sighted way of dealing with an irritation, rather than a risk to anyone.

The point of interest, for me, is that Americans sing so loudly about their right to free speech and here is as good an example as any, that it just doesn't exist. Democracy and Free Speech is as dead in the US as it is here and anywhere else.

[Latrinsorm]

Freedom of speech has never been freedom of shouting, and it's certainly never been freedom of resisting arrest. The problem wasn't what the kid said, but you're of course free(!) to believe otherwise.

[Sean of the Thread]

I've said it before.. follow the fucking rules at these events or STFU.

[Good Karma]

I've said it before.. follow the fucking rules at these events or STFU.

Yes. If you are not allowed to speak your mind then STFU and behave like a bitch.

[Gan]

Yes. If you are not allowed to speak your mind then STFU and behave like a bitch.

There are rules that everyone must follow, even in politics. When Kerry said he would answer the question, the guys should have backed off.

And no, they still should not have tasered the guy.

PS.. Hi Backlash.

[Sean of the Thread]

Exactly. Rofl.

[Good Karma]

There are rules that everyone must follow, even in politics. When Kerry said he would answer the question, the guys should have backed off.

And no, they still should not have tasered the guy.

PS.. Hi Backlash.

Welcome to the fucking point.

It just shows how freedom of speech is alive and well in the US.

[Gan]

Welcome to the fucking point.

It just shows how freedom of speech is alive and well in the US.

Surely you're mistaking me for saying that I support the guy being able to make his 'speech' or ask his questions.

He was 'out of bounds' until Kerry said he would answer the question. Before that, he should have had his ass bounced outside, physically, not with tasers. However, since Kerry said he would answer the question, and since it was his event, they security goons should have backed down.

Yes, we have freedom of speech, but there are rules that must be followed none the less. Now if the guy wanted to stand outside and yell his questions out, he's free to do so.

[Good Karma]

Yes, we have freedom of speech, but there are rules that must be followed none the less.

Watch that. It sounds familiar. In a bad way.

[Skeeter]

I support random tasering

[Nieninque]

You either have freedom of speech, or you dont.

Do you give a platform to racists and other people that bring messages of hate? Or do you say that there are some things that are more important than freedom of speech, such as responsibility for our actions and language and being aware of the consequences of what we say upon other people?

I have said for a long time that we dont have freedom of speech in the UK, which, in the main is fine. I dont want to see people given the right to stir up racial hatred or homophobia etc. The trouble with that is, that it is a very fine line to walk and it takes some strict checks and balances to make sure that the censorships is justified.

I agree with Gan. The bloke was a dick and didnt ask in a way that was likely to get his audience to be particularly happy about responding. Nevertheless, Kerry did say he would reply and the Police were clumsy and overbearing and ultimately excessively violent. Pretty stupid thing to do really.

[DeV]

How the fuck do all those cops not know how to restrain and arrest one person. Pretty embarrassing, IMO.

[Sean of the Thread]

How the fuck do all those cops not know how to restrain and arrest one person. Pretty embarrassing, IMO.

University Police.. sums it up.


I'm still leaning towards staged at this point anyways.

[Meges]

It does not take much to resist a person or a few persons. Bringing resistance under control by most means creates a very ugly situation that people would be whining about even more so than the non-lethal and non-injurious shock. Gee, a knee in the back of the neck or forced joint manipulation that can create permanent injuries?

Once the guy engaged the cops and escalated the situation it's their duty and obligation to end it. I mean, what the hell? "Wait, wait, no take backs!!!!" The guy broke the law and the law came a callin'. He continued to break the law and he paid for it. I'm sure he could get hammered with disturbing the peace, disorderly conduct, resisting arrest, and assault; probably a few more.


Meges

[Skeeter]

I can tell you that me and anyone else trained in CPI could get 95% of the world under control in the matter of a couple seconds.

CPI is a pretty basic non-violent method of self defense and control.

[Blazing247]

I hope you aren't talking about Crisis Prevention Intervention? CPI is a class they send CNA's to. It's useful in dealing with almost nothing, certainly not self defense as you'd get yourself killed using any of those techniques. MOAB is significantly better than CPI, but you won't control "95% of the world" with either, especially not in a matter of seconds considering that the number one most important factor in deescalation (in my experience) is time.

Sorry, I've gotta call you on this. If you think that 2 hour course makes you a hostage negotiator you're pretty hilarious.

[Gan]

After reading the follow up article on CNN this morning (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/18/student.tasered/index.html), I have to agree that it was staged. Sadly the cops fell for it. And now the University looks bad.

Normally, before there was wide use of tasers, each of the big burly officers would have grabbed each arm, picked the dude up and hauled him outside, screaming his questions.

http://i.l.cnn.net/cnn/2007/US/09/18/student.tasered/art.taser.kid.ap.jpg

Freedom of speech with rules? Clear and present danger comes to mind. Defamation, advocation of illegal activity, and advocacy of illegal conduct.

Furthermore, it begs the question, where does freedom of speech exist? Of course one would say it exists in public. But what about private property?

Do you have freedom of speech inside someone's home? No.

Did the university have the right to put limits on how much podium time each student had to ask questions to the guest speaker? Sure.

Did the university have the right to remove the questioner when the time limit was up? Sure. They should have been smarter in how they removed the unruly questioner.

So yea, there are rules with freedom of speech.

[Skeeter]

I hope you aren't talking about Crisis Prevention Intervention? CPI is a class they send CNA's to. It's useful in dealing with almost nothing, certainly not self defense as you'd get yourself killed using any of those techniques. MOAB is significantly better than CPI, but you won't control "95% of the world" with either, especially not in a matter of seconds considering that the number one most important factor in deescalation (in my experience) is time.

Sorry, I've gotta call you on this. If you think that 2 hour course makes you a hostage negotiator you're pretty hilarious.

talk about blowing shit out of proportion. I'm saying in a situation like this I could control someone who doesn't look like arnold schwartzanegger back in his mr. universe days.

WTF you got hostage negotiator is a huge leap. blaze up another one oh master of hyperbole.

[Nieninque]

You could have controlled him by saying "OK sit down and listen to the answer".

[Gan]

How it should have been handled:

1. Student uses up his allotted time asking questions and refuses to leave the podium.

2. Moderator of event asks student to surrender the podium to other participants. Student refuses, keeps asking more questions.

3. Kerry intercedes on student's behalf and says he'll answer the additional questions.

4. Questions are answered, student surrenders the podium.

5. IF student still refuses to surrender the podium back to the moderator then security/officer steps up and asks student leave. (officer applies vulcan neck pinch, drops student to the ground and second officer steps up, grabs feet and officer duo carry student outside where he's thrown into the street)
6. Student refuses to leave, officer restrains arm of student and forcibly attempts to escort student from area.

7. Student resists restraint, officer either uses restraint technique (armlock, etc.) and forcibly moves student OR indicates to second officer to move in and restrain other arm (side) of student and forcibly removes student from area.

8. If student continues to resist, then third officer moves in to assist and student is removed from area.

9. Once student is removed from the area, he's either released or arrested and charged.

[Clove]

The point of interest, for me, is that Americans sing so loudly about their right to free speech and here is as good an example as any, that it just doesn't exist. Democracy and Free Speech is as dead in the US as it is here and anywhere else.

She says without any impediment.

[Clove]

You either have freedom of speech, or you dont.

Being British I'll give you a pass. Research "Freedom of speech does not give you the right to yell 'Fire' in a crowded theater." it also doesn't give you the right to make a public nuisance of yourself or to impair the rights of others (as the Heathrow group WASN'T doing). Freedom of speech IS alive and well in the United States, if you'd like to prove it to yourself come over the pond and I'll take you on a picket (minus the mounted police and clubs).

[Tea & Strumpets]

It does not take much to resist a person or a few persons. Bringing resistance under control by most means creates a very ugly situation that people would be whining about even more so than the non-lethal and non-injurious shock. Gee, a knee in the back of the neck or forced joint manipulation that can create permanent injuries?



With all this talk of trading blow for blow, taking it like a warrior and such, I'm curious how you all fight. It just sounds like you all stand toe-to-toe like boxers, circle each other, and just punch and that's it. Or you guys are acting like this is Fight Club where you beat each other up but have the honor of not disabling or crippling someone. If half those people simple broke the other guys arm or crushed their knee, they wouldn't be all bruised and black and blue as it would have been an easy fight, lol. Anyhow, does anyone wanna describe themselves in a simulated fight?

Well with me, there's no trading blow for blow. I don't fight like a boxer. I tend to rush in right away to disable the person's ability to throw punches since that's the most common way of fighting. If the person is lucky, they'll get one hit in when I rush but they usually don't since they react slow or I deflect the hit. I tend to rush in with my head tilted down (kind of like Cesaer Chavez) so the only way to hit me would be a hook as you would have to have lightning reflexes to get an uppercut off and any other type of hit would hurt like hell hitting my head and not my face. So that's mainly for protection.

And as I rush in, I have my hands moving around in a slapping motion (kind of like Steven Seagal does) as it's a defensive form for any oncoming blows which makes it even harder to get a hook off. You simply slap away the punch so they either miss big time and fly past or when it does hit, it's slides off like a boxer's vaselined up body. Also with the slapping and swiping motions, depending on the distance between the both of us, it gives me a chance to make a grab to grip the wrist of the hand that's throwing the punch in which case I lock up their wrist or whole arm and can then throw a few blows to their face or stomach for some one-armed fighting, force the guy down to the ground, break the arm if I hate the guy, or release and kick him in the butt to send him running forward head-first to the ground (to get a laugh, heh). Or if we're closer, I move in behind them and I lock up both their arms and wrap one of my legs around one of theirs to take them down so they fall face down, and then I go to town on them.

And then for a guy much bigger than me, I simply just kick them in the knee so it bends inwards and breaks. Or if they reacted to it, it won't break but it'll still hurt and make them come down in a half-buckle. And once they lower their body from the hit, I make a swiping, angled hook so my knuckle connects to their temple which will usually knock them out and if not, I do it again.

But of course, that's all just an example of what usually happens. Things are/can be different depending on various factors but that's how a fight usually is with me since most people tend to fight the same way.

So what's a fight normally like for everyone else? Do you mainly box like little homies and kick people once they're down, look for the nearest blunt/sharp object to use, do you rush in and wrestle or grapple, know an offensive/defensive discipline, go berserk and just start swinging madly, lol, or what? lol

[Clove]

Well with me, there's no trading blow for blow. I don't fight like a boxer. I tend to rush in right away to disable the person's ability to throw punches...

I'm curious what you do if your target doesn't try to punch, kick or stop your rush, but instead simply gets out of your way?

[Gan]

The head down hand slap techinque completely fails when the rushee grabs the back of your head and pulls your face down to his knee thrust.

Rarely have I ever had to charge anyone, usually if I do its with an arm bar to the neck if they're close enough to the wall to pin.

If I'm involved in a fight I dont box. I move to disable. Throat, knee, arm, zyphoid process, etc.

However, fighting isnt the point of what happened to the student. The objective of the officers was to disable and restrain. I would have concurred with the use of taser if the student was either twice as big as the officer on a one on one altercation or if the student went ninja. But as it stands, the student was mildly resistant at best and still outnumbered 3:1. Not to mention severely outsized by two of the officers. This would have been an easy takedown with or without technique and the matter would have been over in a few moments, without the sensationalism of being tasered.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Tea&Strumpets
With all this talk of trading blow for blow, taking it like a warrior and such, I'm curious how you all fight. It just sounds like you all stand toe-to-toe like boxers, circle each other, and just punch and that's it. Or you guys are acting like this is Fight Club where you beat each other up but have the honor of not disabling or crippling someone. If half those people simple broke the other guys arm or crushed their knee, they wouldn't be all bruised and black and blue as it would have been an easy fight, lol. Anyhow, does anyone wanna describe themselves in a simulated fight?

Well with me, there's no trading blow for blow. I don't fight like a boxer. I tend to rush in right away to disable the person's ability to throw punches since that's the most common way of fighting. If the person is lucky, they'll get one hit in when I rush but they usually don't since they react slow or I deflect the hit. I tend to rush in with my head tilted down (kind of like Cesaer Chavez) so the only way to hit me would be a hook as you would have to have lightning reflexes to get an uppercut off and any other type of hit would hurt like hell hitting my head and not my face. So that's mainly for protection.

And as I rush in, I have my hands moving around in a slapping motion (kind of like Steven Seagal does) as it's a defensive form for any oncoming blows which makes it even harder to get a hook off. You simply slap away the punch so they either miss big time and fly past or when it does hit, it's slides off like a boxer's vaselined up body. Also with the slapping and swiping motions, depending on the distance between the both of us, it gives me a chance to make a grab to grip the wrist of the hand that's throwing the punch in which case I lock up their wrist or whole arm and can then throw a few blows to their face or stomach for some one-armed fighting, force the guy down to the ground, break the arm if I hate the guy, or release and kick him in the butt to send him running forward head-first to the ground (to get a laugh, heh). Or if we're closer, I move in behind them and I lock up both their arms and wrap one of my legs around one of theirs to take them down so they fall face down, and then I go to town on them.

And then for a guy much bigger than me, I simply just kick them in the knee so it bends inwards and breaks. Or if they reacted to it, it won't break but it'll still hurt and make them come down in a half-buckle. And once they lower their body from the hit, I make a swiping, angled hook so my knuckle connects to their temple which will usually knock them out and if not, I do it again.

But of course, that's all just an example of what usually happens. Things are/can be different depending on various factors but that's how a fight usually is with me since most people tend to fight the same way.

So what's a fight normally like for everyone else? Do you mainly box like little homies and kick people once they're down, look for the nearest blunt/sharp object to use, do you rush in and wrestle or grapple, know an offensive/defensive discipline, go berserk and just start swinging madly, lol, or what? lol

See:


Originally Posted by Klaive
In response to your inquiry, I fight dirty. I've taken Universal Karate for virtually all my life and Ninpo since I was 8 years old. I have excellent technique and am confident that I could fairly decimate 98% of the global population if I went one on one with them. However, I don't fight fairly. When I fight, I fight to maim, mutilate, disable or kill. I will pick up nearby bricks and smash your skull in. I'll bite the hell out of you if you don't have AIDS or SARS. My favorite area to strike is the groin, and if I can find tools to help me out, I'll use them.

Don't fight me in your back yard. I'll sever your pride and joy with hedge clippers and introduce your face to my hoe. :P

But as for purely physical fighting style, Ninpo teaches me to evade and absorb what I can't evade. It's semi-acrobatic and very leverage vs. reach intensive. Tumbles and the occasional gymnastic maneuver is combined with holds, grapples or blocks to gain a better position. When being pummeled (bad enough to be unable to block well), Ninpo teaches to turtle up and exhale completely, causing the blows to do far less damage. When the opponent is winded, a firm knife hand to the throat followed by a swift strike to the temple should put them down at very least. And if it doesn't, the knife hand movement (step in, foot behind their ankle) puts you in optimal position to drop them anyway. Once they're down, it is best to coup de grace. One foot on the cheek and the other on their shoulder can be utilized to snap or fracture their neck. If they have strong necks or just extremely flexible neck tendons, you can kick them in the temple or leap onto their throat to crush it. The nose is also a good target for stomping.

But if I don't want to kill someone (usually the case as I've never had a fight serious enough to kill anyone), I'll just give them a firm nut kick or eye strike. I'm also fond of leaping onto their stomachs, this isn't as fun as the others, but it incapacitates them for a while (knocking the wind out of them). And gives you plenty of time to gloat, leave your business card behind for them and vanish without a trace.

- --[ Kage/Klaive/Darien ]-- -

[Gan]

LOL at the Klaive reference.

+1,000 points.

[Skeeter]

With all this talk of trading blow for blow, taking it like a warrior and such, I'm curious how you all fight. It just sounds like you all stand toe-to-toe like boxers, circle each other, and just punch and that's it. Or you guys are acting like this is Fight Club where you beat each other up but have the honor of not disabling or crippling someone. If half those people simple broke the other guys arm or crushed their knee, they wouldn't be all bruised and black and blue as it would have been an easy fight, lol. Anyhow, does anyone wanna describe themselves in a simulated fight?

Well with me, there's no trading blow for blow. I don't fight like a boxer. I tend to rush in right away to disable the person's ability to throw punches since that's the most common way of fighting. If the person is lucky, they'll get one hit in when I rush but they usually don't since they react slow or I deflect the hit. I tend to rush in with my head tilted down (kind of like Cesaer Chavez) so the only way to hit me would be a hook as you would have to have lightning reflexes to get an uppercut off and any other type of hit would hurt like hell hitting my head and not my face. So that's mainly for protection.

And as I rush in, I have my hands moving around in a slapping motion (kind of like Steven Seagal does) as it's a defensive form for any oncoming blows which makes it even harder to get a hook off. You simply slap away the punch so they either miss big time and fly past or when it does hit, it's slides off like a boxer's vaselined up body. Also with the slapping and swiping motions, depending on the distance between the both of us, it gives me a chance to make a grab to grip the wrist of the hand that's throwing the punch in which case I lock up their wrist or whole arm and can then throw a few blows to their face or stomach for some one-armed fighting, force the guy down to the ground, break the arm if I hate the guy, or release and kick him in the butt to send him running forward head-first to the ground (to get a laugh, heh). Or if we're closer, I move in behind them and I lock up both their arms and wrap one of my legs around one of theirs to take them down so they fall face down, and then I go to town on them.

And then for a guy much bigger than me, I simply just kick them in the knee so it bends inwards and breaks. Or if they reacted to it, it won't break but it'll still hurt and make them come down in a half-buckle. And once they lower their body from the hit, I make a swiping, angled hook so my knuckle connects to their temple which will usually knock them out and if not, I do it again.

But of course, that's all just an example of what usually happens. Things are/can be different depending on various factors but that's how a fight usually is with me since most people tend to fight the same way.

So what's a fight normally like for everyone else? Do you mainly box like little homies and kick people once they're down, look for the nearest blunt/sharp object to use, do you rush in and wrestle or grapple, know an offensive/defensive discipline, go berserk and just start swinging madly, lol, or what? lol




sure you do Hulkster. Do you finish them off with the big leg drop too? :punch: :forehead:

[DeV]

No offense, but for a second there it sounded like something SeanyDigital would write.

[Khariz]

Sudden Violence (http://www.amazon.com/Sudden-Violence-Art-San-Soo/dp/0873644654/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-4003064-5807044?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1190213600&sr=8-1)

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/51H5ZT2KAWL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-dp-500-arrow,TopRight,45,-64_OU01_AA240_SH20_.jpg


But in all Seriousness....Pretty good book. Author is a nutcase (in a good way), and is all about sudden explosions of violence to end a situation before it begins. The reading is highly amusing.

[Some Rogue]

sure you do Hulkster. Do you finish them off with the big leg drop too? :punch: :forehead:

THAT'S RIGHT BROTHER!!!! WHAT YOU GONNA DO WHEN THE T&SMANIA GOES RUNNING WILD ON YOU???

[Skeeter]

I always liked Krav Maga. Not because I know anything about it, but just because it's fun to say.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krav_Maga

[Tea & Strumpets]

No offense, but for a second there it sounded like something SeanyDigital would write.

Someone linked that thread where Edgeleaf wanted to fight someone a few weeks ago, and there were those posts by Neildo and Klaive. I just copied and pasted Neildo's post because it may be the funniest post ever. Klaive's response was awesome, too.

[Atlanteax]

I wanted to make a reference to Cobra in Karate Kid I ... but couldn't remember the details to make it work

[DeV]

it may be the funniest post ever.It is.

Excuse me for a second, :rofl:

[Latrinsorm]

You either have freedom of speech, or you dont.It's your definition of "speech" that I think is causing the confusion here. If you decide "speech" is any sound made vocally, I could see why you feel there is no freedom of speech. Conversely, if you were to decide that "speech" carries the implication of a communicative act, it's a bit harder to point out examples where that sort of thing is restricted. A weapon is not communicative, for instance.

[B2]

I got this email yesterday from UF's president:



To students, faculty, staff, alumni and friends:

I have received a great deal of communication and input last night and this morning regarding the incident that occurred Monday at the conclusion of a town hall forum being held by Sen. John Kerry. The incident resulted in a student being tasered.
We are interested in learning what happened and are taking the following immediate steps to ensure the university utilizes best practice protocols:

* University of Florida Police Chief Linda Stump has requested the Florida Department of Law Enforcement conduct a formal investigation into the arrest of UF student Andrew Meyer. An independent review such as this will make sure the results are objective and impartial. Chief Stump’s priority is to ensure that the public remains confident in the department’s ability to keep the campus safe.
* Two officers involved in the incident have been placed on paid administrative leave pending the outcome of the investigation.
* We plan to assemble a panel of faculty and students to review our police protocols, our management practices and the FDLE report to come up with a series of recommendations for the university.
* Administrators and police officials plan to analyze the incident and conduct an internal review and will consider changing protocols in response to this incident, if necessary.
* Finally, as is standard procedure, the State Attorney’s Office will review the charges brought against Mr. Meyer. We have communicated with the State Attorney and understand he plans to expedite his review.

I will talk about the incident and answer questions at a news conference scheduled for 2 p.m. in Emerson Alumni Hall.

J. Bernard Machen

[Meges]

With all this talk of trading blow for blow, taking it like a warrior and such, I'm curious how you all fight. It just sounds like you all stand toe-to-toe like boxers, circle each other, and just punch and that's it. Or you guys are acting like this is Fight Club where you beat each other up but have the honor of not disabling or crippling someone. If half those people simple broke the other guys arm or crushed their knee, they wouldn't be all bruised and black and blue as it would have been an easy fight, lol. Anyhow, does anyone wanna describe themselves in a simulated fight?

Well with me, there's no trading blow for blow. I don't fight like a boxer. I tend to rush in right away to disable the person's ability to throw punches since that's the most common way of fighting. If the person is lucky, they'll get one hit in when I rush but they usually don't since they react slow or I deflect the hit. I tend to rush in with my head tilted down (kind of like Cesaer Chavez) so the only way to hit me would be a hook as you would have to have lightning reflexes to get an uppercut off and any other type of hit would hurt like hell hitting my head and not my face. So that's mainly for protection.

And as I rush in, I have my hands moving around in a slapping motion (kind of like Steven Seagal does) as it's a defensive form for any oncoming blows which makes it even harder to get a hook off. You simply slap away the punch so they either miss big time and fly past or when it does hit, it's slides off like a boxer's vaselined up body. Also with the slapping and swiping motions, depending on the distance between the both of us, it gives me a chance to make a grab to grip the wrist of the hand that's throwing the punch in which case I lock up their wrist or whole arm and can then throw a few blows to their face or stomach for some one-armed fighting, force the guy down to the ground, break the arm if I hate the guy, or release and kick him in the butt to send him running forward head-first to the ground (to get a laugh, heh). Or if we're closer, I move in behind them and I lock up both their arms and wrap one of my legs around one of theirs to take them down so they fall face down, and then I go to town on them.

And then for a guy much bigger than me, I simply just kick them in the knee so it bends inwards and breaks. Or if they reacted to it, it won't break but it'll still hurt and make them come down in a half-buckle. And once they lower their body from the hit, I make a swiping, angled hook so my knuckle connects to their temple which will usually knock them out and if not, I do it again.

But of course, that's all just an example of what usually happens. Things are/can be different depending on various factors but that's how a fight usually is with me since most people tend to fight the same way.

So what's a fight normally like for everyone else? Do you mainly box like little homies and kick people once they're down, look for the nearest blunt/sharp object to use, do you rush in and wrestle or grapple, know an offensive/defensive discipline, go berserk and just start swinging madly, lol, or what? lol

I prefer the Vulcan nerve pinch, a hardy chuckle, then a "live long and prosper" before leaving the room.


Meges

[Tsa`ah]

500 points to Dar.

I'm kind of up in the air over which was funnier ... Jinsem, Klaive, Sean, and Edge describing their e-fighting skills ... or Dar pasting Jinsem's e-fighting technique and people taking it seriously.

[Some Rogue]

500 points to Dar.

I'm kind of up in the air over which was funnier ... Jinsem, Klaive, Sean, and Edge describing their e-fighting skills ... or Dar pasting Jinsem's e-fighting technique and people taking it seriously.

Hey, you never know, those leprechauns got mad skills from having to protect their pot of gold all the time.

[Tea & Strumpets]

Hey, you never know, those leprechauns got mad skills from having to protect their pot of gold all the time.


Say that to my face and this is what would happen ---> And as I rush in, I have my hands moving around in a slapping motion (kind of like Steven Seagal does) as it's a defensive form for any oncoming blows which makes it even harder to get a hook off.

[Warriorbird]

I thought that Neil was Pudgee/Jubuls not Jinsem/Lyght/the fucking army.

[Nieninque]

or Dar pasting Jinsem's e-fighting technique and people taking it seriously.

That would be my vote.

<3 T&S

[Jazuela]

Everyone's talking about how the student used up his allotted time...but there was an interview of a guy who was actually there and watched the entire thing while it was going on. He said, the video was seriously edited prior to being put on the internet, and that the guy didn't -have- any alotted time, because he stole the mic out of the hand of the guy whose turn it actually was. In fact, he rushed the crowd toward Kerry, and everyone being jostled thought something serious was going on (like an attempted assassination). The two cops - male and female- pulled him away from the guy whose mic he stole - and that's when the video started running. Everything people saw on the video, happened -after- this basket case had already created a nuisance and caused the Uni cops to think he was a serious security risk to the lives of people there.

He got tasered because he refused to back down when ordered to, and continued to struggle and scream and make noise, even after he was warned that he'd get tasered if he refused to chill out.

He was also known on campus for pulling practical jokes with a video camera.

[Daniel]

I thought it was hilarious. Don't taze me bro!!! ow!!! ow!! ow!!!

[Parkbandit]

The kid staged his behavior as to make a 'name' for himself. He was thinking he would get dragged out of the auditorium while screaming out his message and didn't count on getting 50,000 volts. He got what he deserved imo.

Stop making victims out of people trying to make a name for themselves.

[Sean of the Thread]

Yeah my thoughts from the moment I deduced it was staged exactly.

Fuck the punk.

[Jazuela]

Oh also PB, he isn't a Republican. He's a registered Libertarian.

[Some Rogue]

Oh also PB, he isn't a Republican. He's a registered Libertarian.

Well fuck, should have zapped him twice then.

:rofl:

[Parkbandit]

Oh also PB, he isn't a Republican. He's a registered Libertarian.

Did no one even read the OP? No shit. I said that I heard there was a protestor at a Kerry speech and thought WTF! Republican protesting on a workday? I thought only liberals did that. :P

[TheEschaton]

PB was actually quite clear on that point.

[Nieninque]

This is how they should have dealt with it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ou2mVnElp6c

[DeV]

"I can't hear you dude, but I can see your man-tits from here".

Hahaha

[Xcalibur]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc

hehehe

US's becoming more and more what they fought in the past. Hail Bush and his debt of 8,5 trillion. When is it going pass the point of no return?

[Stanley Burrell]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc

hehehe

US's becoming more and more what they fought in the past. Hail Bush and his debt of 8,5 trillion. When is it going pass the point of no return?

US's becoming more and more like...

An MC Hammer remix of a tasered person?

You make a concrete youtube.com argument as well, I'll give you that much.

[Xcalibur]

The youtube argument is nothing more than entertainment.

The debt you guys got is so huge now. The canadian dollar has almost got parity and, worse, will be worth more.

Your economy is falling. And the americain empire was build, is build and will be build on economical hegemony.

[Stanley Burrell]

The youtube argument is nothing more than entertainment.

The debt you guys got is so huge now. The canadian dollar has almost got parity and, worse, will be worth more.

Your economy is falling. And the americain empire was build, is build and will be build on economical hegemony.

It'll have been an eight year empire, not the Ottoman Empire.

Will the rebound be slow and tedious? Yes. Will the rebound be rebound from the sheer sake of not having GWB in office? Yes.

It's like Deltron said, "Simpleminded people always want to point the finger."

[Sean of the Thread]

The youtube argument is nothing more than entertainment.

The debt you guys got is so huge now. The canadian dollar has almost got parity and, worse, will be worth more.

Your economy is falling. And the americain empire was build, is build and will be build on economical hegemony.

One of my favorite t-shirts that I own.

http://www.kaboodle.com/hi/img/2/0/0/58/7/AAAAAiAEPcIAAAAAAFhzew.jpg

[Good Karma]

The youtube argument is nothing more than entertainment.

The debt you guys got is so huge now. The canadian dollar has almost got parity and, worse, will be worth more.

Your economy is falling. And the americain empire was build, is build and will be build on economical hegemony.

This is not the place to talk about the truth you poulain eater.

Don't you know Jack from shit?

[Sean of the Thread]

He knows shit from backrash I'm guessing.

[Good Karma]

He knows shit from backrash I'm guessing.

I have no guess that you are a brainiac. You need to can that shit and sell it for millions. In fact, you need to be in office. Or at least donate your brain to DC.

[Sean of the Thread]

Idiot.

[Clove]

The youtube argument is nothing more than entertainment.

The debt you guys got is so huge now. The canadian dollar has almost got parity and, worse, will be worth more.

Your economy is falling. And the americain empire was build, is build and will be build on economical hegemony.

All your base are belong to us!!!

[Parkbandit]

Watching Xcalibur and Stanley debate is like watching the Special Olympics. It's entertaining, you don't care who wins and in the end you feel bad for both of them.

[Parkbandit]

I have no guess that you are a brainiac. You need to can that shit and sell it for millions. In fact, you need to be in office. Or at least donate your brain to DC.


Speaking of Special Olympics.. I present the remains of Backlash. Someone really should bury this shit.

[Stanley Burrell]

Watching Xcalibur and Stanley debate is like watching the Special Olympics.

...'Least I'm not in no gosh darn Division I Bingo club.

[Warriorbird]

I got this from a young member of the family Falgrin.

http://www.realtorwilber.com/GAVINWEBCOPY4.jpg

[Parkbandit]

...'Least I'm not in no gosh darn Division I Bingo club.


I'll take age and intelligence over stupidity and youth everyday.

[TheEschaton]

The question is whether you're willing to accept age and stupidity over youth and stupidity...

[Parkbandit]

The stupid question of the day is whether you're willing to accept age and stupidity over youth and stupidity...

Corrected for accuracy.

Again.. let's stick to the real world and not some fantasy land of yours.

Thanks.

[Warriorbird]

Oh snap, Alok! Parkbandit called you stupid! I guess you're going to have to quit law school now.

[TheEschaton]

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAMN.


Things have gotten too personal on these boards. I think I need to step back and take a break, and possibly post under another name in a completely obvious and non-anonymous manner.

-NotTheEschaton-

[Parkbandit]

Oh snap, Alok! Parkbandit called you stupid! I guess you're going to have to quit law school now.

OMG! ALOK = SMART BECAUSE ALOK IS IN LAW SCHOOL!

I didn't get the memo that said everyone in law school automatically had to be intelligent. If you could get me a copy of that steadfast rule, I would appreciate it.

[Parkbandit]

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAMN.


Things have gotten too personal on these boards. I think I need to step back and take a break, and possibly post under another name in a completely obvious and non-anonymous manner.

-NotTheEschaton-

I think the only time you would have to do that if you are found to be banging a forum whore... and it was divulged that your manhood should really be renamed boyhood.

Oh, sorry Backlash :(

[Gan]

...
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i3/3strangedays/ganalon-olympics.jpg

Thats my contribution, my work here is done.

[Tea & Strumpets]

Oh snap, Alok! Parkbandit called you stupid! I guess you're going to have to quit law school now.

I find your avatar disturbing. That anime crap is so fucking wierd.

[Gan]

I love how this thread backlashed on Backlash.

:lol:

[Some Rogue]

OMG! ALOK = SMART BECAUSE ALOK IS IN LAW SCHOOL!

I didn't get the memo that said everyone in law school automatically had to be intelligent. If you could get me a copy of that steadfast rule, I would appreciate it.

No, but another fun fact is that 99% of them are assholes.

[Parkbandit]

:rofl:

I was on Jury Duty last week for some dumbass who thought that a fender bender with no damage, caused him to get TMJ. The biggest decision for me after 5 minutes of testimony was which lawyer was a bigger asshole.

[DeV]

The other fun thing is that the majority of lawyers can actually afford to be assholes. I doubt many of them find the label to be... insulting in the least.

I know I won't.

[Nieninque]

The other fun thing is that the majority of lawyers can actually afford to be assholes. I doubt many of them find the label to be... insulting in the least.

I know I won't.

It's a shame they can't channel that energy into something more productive.

[DeV]

It's a shame they can't channel that energy into something more productive.Oh, I'm sure the remaining 1% of them do.

[Sean of the Thread]

The other fun thing is that the majority of lawyers can actually afford to be assholes. I doubt many of them find the label to be... insulting in the least.

I know I won't.

Uhm actually the majority are broke assess.

[DeV]

Uhm actually the majority are broke assess.Sure, if you truly believe the "majority" of lawyers are those representing the corporate scoundrels who choose a field for the short end money and the high end lifestyle. It certainly won't pan out in the long run.

Afford is also not something I automatically equate to financial success alone, by any means, but that's just me. I have no doubt that the "majority" of the lawyers you believe end up broke asses are no different than the majority of any professional from a wide range of professions who end up broke. Nine times out of ten it's a result of their own accord. They certainly do not have to be; that's the kicker.

[Keller]

Sure, if you truly believe the "majority" of lawyers are those representing the corporate scoundrels who choose a field for the short end money and the high end lifestyle. It certainly won't pan out in the long run.

Afford is also not something I automatically equate to financial success alone, by any means, but that's just me. I have no doubt that the "majority" of the lawyers you believe end up broke asses are no different than the majority of any professional from a wide range of professions who end up broke. Nine times out of ten it's a result of their own accord. They certainly do not have to be; that's the kicker.

No, he's pretty much right.

There is a great editorial in today's WSJ about how law school's are bold-face lying to applicants about their job prospects. Basically, here is the skinny:

Top-20 school in the top 30%? 160k+bonuses first year, if you want it.
Top-20 to Top-50 school in the top 10%? Good chance at 160k+bonuses, if you work for it.
Lower than top-50? You're looking at a median salary of 60ish.
Lower-50% at a Tier-3 school? You'll be happy to have contract work at $20/hr w/o benefits.

While the market is saturated right now w/ lawyers, top students are feasting b/c BIGLAW is outbidding each other for the top students.

[Sean of the Thread]

I had just read that article today.

[Keller]

For anyone who wants to actually read the editorial:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119040786780835602-email.html

[DeV]

Although the article is a great read for the uninformed, I wasn't referring to law school students or even recent grads. If Sean2 was, our wires are crossed and that article doesn't lead me to believe that the majority of lawyers are broke.


Incoming students are "mesmerized by what's happening in big firms, but clueless about what's going on in the bottom half of the profession,"Ties right into my following sentiments...

Sure, if you truly believe the "majority" of lawyers are those representing the corporate scoundrels who choose a field for the short end money and the high end lifestyle. It certainly won't pan out in the long run.

[Warriorbird]

There'd be no reason to attend where I am if it wasn't a really good deal. With that said...if Alok wanted to? He could make a LOT.

[Sean of the Thread]

Bottom line is it's pipe dreams for the majority of you.

Enjoy being miserable and in debt.

[Warriorbird]

I'm coming out with no debt or I'd feel bad.

[Keller]

Bottom line is it's pipe dreams for the majority of you.

Enjoy being miserable and in debt.

I'll be fine. But thanks for your concern. =)

[Stanley Burrell]

The question is whether you're willing to accept age and stupidity over youth and stupidity...

Does it look like he's ready?

Let'm keep the systolic 250 over 2, says I: It'll be more amusing in the not-so-distant future.

I make myself laugh.

.

Anyyyyhoo, if PB can put on his own Snuggles for Seniors, there's no reason for us to question his intelligence any further. HE IS BIG BOY.

[DeV]

Bottom line is it's pipe dreams for the majority of you.

Enjoy being miserable and in debt.I already have a master's degree to fall back on in case I become one of those "broke ass lawyers" you speak so fondly of. In any case, I'll enjoy it either way, thanks.

[Sean of the Thread]

No thanks needed. Statistics are on my side concerning that the majority of you will not be in the top percentile. I'd suggest learning what the ass end of a ambulance looks like but I'm sure you already know.

However I know you'll come out on top!





Actually I feel confident about most of the PC law crowd. I truly suspect the majority of you to come out on top.

[Sean of the Thread]

I'm coming out with no debt or I'd feel bad.

That's fortunate for you. However the majority do not have that luxury.


(me included :( )

[Warriorbird]

Agreed. There's some folks I know who didn't do their homework. I feel bad for them...but not too bad.

[TheEschaton]

Luckily, I go to a top 30 law school, and never wanted the law firm job.

-TheE-

[Sean of the Thread]

http://tazeelo.ytmnd.com/