Immigration bill fails key test, is withdrawn.

[Seran]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/06/07/congress.immigration.ap/index.html

WASHINGTON (AP) -- A broad immigration bill to legalize millions of people unlawfully in the United States failed a crucial test vote in the Senate Thursday, a stunning setback that could spell its defeat for the year.

The vote was 45-50 against limiting debate on the bill, 15 short of the 60 that the bill's supporters needed to prevail. Most Republicans voted to block Democrats' efforts to bring the bill to a final vote.

The legislation, which had been endorsed by President Bush, would tighten borders, institute a new system to prevent employers from hiring undocumented workers and give as many as 12 million illegal immigrants a pathway to legal status.

Senate Majority Harry Reid, D-Nevada, who had made no secret of his distaste for parts of the bill, said he would withdraw it but keep working toward eventual passage.

"I, even though disappointed, look forward to passing this bill," Reid said. But he said he needs help from the White House.

"This is the president's bill," Reid said. "... We can't do it alone over here. We need some help."

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Kentucky, urged Reid not to give up on the legislation, but allow debate on amendments to continue in order to resolve the objections of conservative senators.

"This is a complicated bill, but the key to passage is not complicated," McConnell said.

McConnell said all that's needed is a "reasonable number of additional roll-call votes" on amendments.

"We're not that far away from being able to get cloture on the bill," he said.

Conceived by an improbable coalition that nicknamed the deal a "grand bargain," the measure exposed deep rifts within both parties and is loathed by most GOP conservatives.

Most Republicans voted against ending debate, saying they needed more time to make the bill tougher with tighter border security measures and a more arduous legalization process for unlawful immigrants.

All but a handful of Democrats supported the move, but they, too, were holding their noses at provisions of the bill. Many of them argued it makes second-class citizens of a new crop of temporary workers and rips apart families by prioritizing employability over blood ties in future immigration.

Still, they had argued that the measure, on balance, was worth advancing.

"We can all find different aspects of this legislation that we differ with," said Sen. Edward M. Kennedy of Massachusetts, the leading Democratic architect of the bill.

..the rest of the story is available at the above link.


America has rallied against the attempt by Congress to introduced bipartisan socialism to the United States and said loud and clear, "We don't want you."

[Parkbandit]

Good. It was a shitty bill that rewarded those of other countries to get away with breaking our laws with very little consequences.

Now.. do it the right way.

Secure our borders
Secure our borders

and

Secure our borders


THEN we can address the millions of illegal aliens in this country. Immigration reform can't be reformed until we reform the problem.. porous border control

[Ilvane]

I am glad it didn't pass. It was basically just an amnesty bill without saying it.

I'm all for bring me your tired and your poor, but do it legally. That's all.

You can't come here legally and do it the right way, then you get to go home, end of story. There are plenty of people who are waiting to do it the right way.

Angela

[Clove]

Personally I think if both Republicans AND Democrats are criticizing the bill it can't be that bad.

I get more nervous when either party thinks a bill is the best thing since sliced bread.

When it comes to our policies on border security and illegal residents I DO feel a comprehensive solution is necessary:

Option A

1) Increased northern and southern border security.
2) Stricter controls on hiring practices
3) Stricter penalties for employers that use illegal labor
4) More arduous legalization process for illegals caught here
5) A temporary amnesty for illegals prior to implementing stricter controls
6) A greater commitment to deporting illegals

Option B

Two REALLY big minefields supported by automated motion-targeting rifles.

I don't mind open immigration. I personally believe there is still plenty of room (and work) here; but immigration needs to be supervised and orderly- lawful. This bill leaves much to be desired but it does offer a better response to the problem than I've seen in a decade.

Moving on. Ilvane's sig. "A liberal is a man or a woman or a child who looks forward to a better day, a more tranquil night, and a bright, infinite future. ~Leonard Bernstein, The New York Times, 30 October 1988" reminded me of another quote:

http://home.earthlink.net/~sscutchen/Quotes/on_god_and_santa_claus.htm

[Back]

Its not popular, but I don’t care what you call it... I’d rather grant a “pardon” to all the Libbites already here.

[Sean of the Thread]

Indentured servants! Earn your pardon.

[Blazing247]

6) A greater commitment to deporting illegals



You would be sickened to know how many illegals are arrested (theft, usually), brought to the station, and released on a daily basis without the INS ever being contacted. They are "too busy" to come down for the daily illegals.

[TheEschaton]

Actually, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be sickened by that.

Today, in court, looking at the evidence photos of a stab victim from a 10 inch knife....that was *almost* sickening.

-TheE-

[Blazing247]

La di fucking da, you want a cookie? Talk to me when you see a close range shotgun fatality. Was there a point in saying you wouldn't be sickened by what I said, or did you just want to interject your stupid little story?

[TheEschaton]

I guess I don't measure up to your standards. :P I was merely saying, your "sickening" story wasn't sickening at all.

-theE-

[Seran]

Having started my career as a debt collector at a retail agency in southern California, the number of debts incurred by small business owners and hospitals by illegal immigrants is staggering. Worse yet, you cannot sue them as they don't have legal jobs or bank accounts so there is very little way for these businesses to recoup their money.

Amnesty was granted under Reagan and that spurred a huge surge in illegal immigration to todays levels, imagine what would happen if the 10-20 million here now there granted a free pass.

We need to deport, deport, deport. Citizenship should be a much easier and cheaper process.. only to those people with skills useful to the workforce. I'm tired of going to Home Depot and being mobbed by hordes of unemployed looking to do a bad job fixing my house.

[Sean of the Thread]

Having started my career as a debt collector at a retail agency in southern California, the number of debts incurred by small business owners and hospitals by illegal immigrants is staggering. Worse yet, you cannot sue them as they don't have legal jobs or bank accounts so there is very little way for these businesses to recoup their money.
.

Just an idea.. but don't be stupid enough to extend them credit in the first place.


Retards.

[Blazing247]

I agree. Also, they are a terrible burden on our hospitals as he said, and there is nothing that can be done as it's illegal to deny someone emergency room service whether insured or not. What ends up happening is that they come to the emergency room for things that a normal person would end up going to a primary care physician for (sniffles, toothache, pink eye). So next time you have to wait 8 hours in the E.R., you know who to blame.

Also, many of them steal personal identifier information (SSN etc) to gain employment. You may be employed somewhere, owe taxes, and not even realize you had that job!

[Parkbandit]

Why deport when all they have to do is freely cross over again?

Secure the borders and then talk about what we should do with the illegals we have.

[Sean of the Thread]

Under my plan every Tuesday all WoW players via EULA contract must man remote machine guns on our borders in order to receive a patch.

Every other day is up to the Idaho Militia.

[fiendwish]

You all may well have seen and discussed these. They're old stuff but pertinent.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTWKx0PerkE&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9pjZ39YtR8

The world's changing. We ain't what we were. I count myself as one who enjoyed life in the U.S at its peak - post WWII to mid 90's. Borders are all going to crumble soon enough, and those between us and our neighbors to the north and south will be some of the first to fall. And besides, someone's gotta harvest the onions before they rot in the field, and Americans are simply far too important for such menial tasks.

[Back]

I count myself as one who enjoyed life in the U.S at its peak - post WWII to mid 90's.

Sorry you gave up man. We are still moving forward. What are you going to do now?

[Warriorbird]

None of these bills will ever pass unscrewedover. Too many powerful lobbying groups that outright own Congresscreatures thrive off of illegal immigration.

[Seran]

Why deport when all they have to do is freely cross over again?

Secure the borders and then talk about what we should do with the illegals we have.

I agree that a major overhaul of border security is needed. From remote systems, to full surveillance and a mustering ability for border agents in less than five minutes. Then you do something to stop the arterial bleed that is illegal immigrants.

However, it only takes a handful of people to turn around progress toward anti-socialism. In California under ex-governor Pete Wilson, a proposition was past by over 55% of voters to deny all non emergent services to illegals. That meant food stamps, most dental work and education. It was a sweeping reform that would've saved billions of dollars a year...

It was challenged in court by a 'progressive' group, and one Democratic governor, Gray Davis decided to not allow it's challenge to goto court, not to defend the voters decision. Instead, a judges stay goes on to this day.

Countries that belong to people like Hugo Chavez, Kim Jong, Nguyen Triet, and Castro are the poor, starving countries they are because of their socialistic attitudes. What is funny is that even those states aren't socialism for the good of it's people, it's there to keep everyone poor, disorganized and uneducated enough to take it's rulers out of power.

The de-Americanization that was to take place under this mockery of a bill, under this mockery of a Congress and it's President want exactly that.

[Back]

Countries that belong to people like Hugo Chavez, Kim Jong, Nguyen Triet, and Castro are the poor, starving countries they are because of their socialistic attitudes. What is funny is that even those states aren't socialism for the good of it's people, it's there to keep everyone poor, disorganized and uneducated enough to take it's rulers out of power.

Interesting statement. Would you say the same about America since our taxes go to the police and fire forces plus public education? How about how our tax dollars go towards subsides for major corporations? I know corporations are not the same as welfare recipients... or are they?

What scares you so much? Is it just the word “socialism” or is it some kind of nationalist thing?

[Seran]

Interesting statement. Would you say the same about America since our taxes go to the police and fire forces plus public education? How about how our tax dollars go towards subsides for major corporations? I know corporations are not the same as welfare recipients... or are they?

What scares you so much? Is it just the word “socialism” or is it some kind of nationalist thing?

It's these major corporations and their owners, board members, CEOs, COOs, and every three letter combination beginning with a C that you can imagine that pay the majority of the taxes in our country.

Perhaps you didn't realize it, but it's the lack of these corporations, lack of the technological advancement and the drive they introduce into consumerism that have the countries the leaders of which I mentioned thirty years behind ours in terms of economic, social, and technological advancement.

The services you named are the benefit of us all, and with the economic ruin that hordes of uneducated and untrained masses eatting up our services, driving up inflation with the subsequent weakening of our nation, as well as bring in the levels of crime scene amongst the largest foreign gangs now on our soil.

Take a moment to learn about the evils of unchecked immigration, perhaps learn what checked capitalism can do for a nation and then come back at me when you learn that nearly every great nation began with, or supported by it's commerce and industry.

[Back]

The services you named are the benefit of us all, and with the economic ruin that hordes of uneducated and untrained masses eatting up our services, driving up inflation with the subsequent weakening of our nation, as well as bring in the levels of crime scene amongst the largest foreign gangs now on our soil.

Take a moment to learn about the evils of unchecked immigration, perhaps learn what checked capitalism can do for a nation and then come back at me when you learn that nearly every great nation began with, or supported by it's commerce and industry.

You are being facetious. Right?

Watch Lou Dobbs much?

Let me ask you this. And everyone else who cares to answer.

What are you more afraid of?

People who want to come here and work for a better life? Or the fact that you don’t want to get up off your own ass in your own country to make your life better?

[Seran]

People who want to come here and work for a better life? Or the fact that you don’t want to get up off your own ass in your own country to make your life better?


It's that these people who want to come here for a better life don't have the skills to earn that better life. What's worse is that they drive down the wages for those people already here that can and will fill those jobs. The arguments that they fill positions Americans don't want is shit, the unemployment rate is still under 5%.

How many economists have to point out the fact that the negative impact would be severe, even catrosphic for our healthcare, education, and social security system before you and your ultra left wing socialist buddies get that the rest of us dont' want it. Keep pandering, it won't do you any good.

[Parkbandit]

Interesting statement. Would you say the same about America since our taxes go to the police and fire forces plus public education? How about how our tax dollars go towards subsides for major corporations? I know corporations are not the same as welfare recipients... or are they?

What scares you so much? Is it just the word “socialism” or is it some kind of nationalist thing?


Probably the history of socialism and it's record of never ever actually being a government for the common people. It's like Seran stated.. it's not for the poor people, it's to keep the people poor.

Socialism has never worked and will never work simply due to the way humans are. Greedy.

[Parkbandit]

You are being facetious. Right?

Watch Lou Dobbs much?

Let me ask you this. And everyone else who cares to answer.

What are you more afraid of?

People who want to come here and work for a better life? Or the fact that you don’t want to get up off your own ass in your own country to make your life better?


Oh, here we go. If you are against illegal immigration, you must either be a xenophobe or a racist.

Here's my answer.

There is a legal way of entering this country. Use it. If you don't use it, then expect the country you illegally entered to find you and kick your ass back where it came from.

It is not the US's responsibility to house all the malcontents of the world.. we have plenty of our own.

[Ilvane]

I agree with PB again..:whines:

Wait, I think it's the same topic we agreed on before, so maybe that doesn't count?

Angela

[Gan]

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/immigration_the_human_cost

[Parkbandit]

Ding dong, this bitch is dead.

Now do your jobs and propose a real immigration bill that doesn't give amnesty to every illegal alien that snuck across the borders.

I love how the Democratic "leadership" has targetted Talk Radio as the problem.. and not that it was a really, really bad bill.

:lol:

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-immig29jun29,1,3774933.story?track=crosspromo&coll=la-headlines-nation&ctrack=1&cset=true

Immigration bill dead in Senate
By Nicole Gaouette, Times Staff Writer
8:43 AM PDT, June 28, 2007


WASHINGTON -- Lawmakers killed the Senate immigration bill today, voting 46 to 53 to move to a final vote on the controversial measure, 14 short of the 60 required.

The defeat is a setback for the bipartisan team of lawmakers who worked for months to craft a bill they hoped would draw enough support from both parties to pass. It represents a blow to President Bush, who threw his full support behind broad immigration reform and whose Cabinet played a key role in shaping the legislation. And it represented a victory for grassroots conservatives who, spurred by right-wing radio talk show hosts, overwhelmed Congress with phone calls and e-mails assailing the legislation.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

America has rallied against the attempt by Congress to introduced bipartisan socialism to the United States and said loud and clear, "We don't want you."

My how the times have changed.

[Tgo01]

I had no idea Seran was such a raging racist.

[Parkbandit]

I had no idea Seran was such a raging racist.

I did.

https://i.imgflip.com/gcsnc.gif

[~Rocktar~]

Just wow.

[Methais]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/06/07/congress.immigration.ap/index.html

WASHINGTON (AP) -- A broad immigration bill to legalize millions of people unlawfully in the United States failed a crucial test vote in the Senate Thursday, a stunning setback that could spell its defeat for the year.

The vote was 45-50 against limiting debate on the bill, 15 short of the 60 that the bill's supporters needed to prevail. Most Republicans voted to block Democrats' efforts to bring the bill to a final vote.

The legislation, which had been endorsed by President Bush, would tighten borders, institute a new system to prevent employers from hiring undocumented workers and give as many as 12 million illegal immigrants a pathway to legal status.

Senate Majority Harry Reid, D-Nevada, who had made no secret of his distaste for parts of the bill, said he would withdraw it but keep working toward eventual passage.

"I, even though disappointed, look forward to passing this bill," Reid said. But he said he needs help from the White House.

"This is the president's bill," Reid said. "... We can't do it alone over here. We need some help."

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Kentucky, urged Reid not to give up on the legislation, but allow debate on amendments to continue in order to resolve the objections of conservative senators.

"This is a complicated bill, but the key to passage is not complicated," McConnell said.

McConnell said all that's needed is a "reasonable number of additional roll-call votes" on amendments.

"We're not that far away from being able to get cloture on the bill," he said.

Conceived by an improbable coalition that nicknamed the deal a "grand bargain," the measure exposed deep rifts within both parties and is loathed by most GOP conservatives.

Most Republicans voted against ending debate, saying they needed more time to make the bill tougher with tighter border security measures and a more arduous legalization process for unlawful immigrants.

All but a handful of Democrats supported the move, but they, too, were holding their noses at provisions of the bill. Many of them argued it makes second-class citizens of a new crop of temporary workers and rips apart families by prioritizing employability over blood ties in future immigration.

Still, they had argued that the measure, on balance, was worth advancing.

"We can all find different aspects of this legislation that we differ with," said Sen. Edward M. Kennedy of Massachusetts, the leading Democratic architect of the bill.

..the rest of the story is available at the above link.


America has rallied against the attempt by Congress to introduced bipartisan socialism to the United States and said loud and clear, "We don't want you."




MEXICO CITY, Mexico (CNN) -- Mexico has announced plans to raise tariffs on almost 90 U.S. exports, Mexican and U.S. officials confirmed Monday.

The new trade measures are in retaliation for the cancellation earlier this year of a U.S. commercial trucking project and will target U.S. industrial and agricultural products delivered to Mexico, Mexico's state-run news agency said.


Mexico's Economic Secretary Gerardo Ruiz Mateos called the cancellation of the program a breach of the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA (http://topics.cnn.com/topics/NAFTA)), the agency said.


White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said the trucking project was killed in the 2009 omnibus appropriations bill, but President Barack Obama has asked his administration to create a new program.


"Congress has opposed the project in the past because of concerns about the process that led to the program's establishment and its operation," Gibbs said.


The project allowed a small number of Mexican trucks to enter the United States beyond the normal commercial zones, and allowed some U.S. trucks the same privilege in Mexico.


Sen. John McCain, R-Arizona, warned that the Mexican action would harm American businesses.


"Unfortunately, this is a predictable reaction by the Mexican government to a policy that now puts the United States in clear violation of the North American Free Trade Agreement and was inappropriately inserted into the omnibus appropriations bill," McCain said after learning of the Mexican government's plans.


McCain said Washington "must take steps to prevent escalation of further protectionist measures -- actions that only serve to harm American business during these tough economic times when these businesses need a worldwide marketplace to prosper."


"This is another reason why the president should have vetoed the omnibus spending bill," McCain (http://topics.cnn.com/topics/John_McCain) added.


Mexico's intentions to raise tariffs on U.S. (http://topics.cnn.com/topics/United_States) goods "is an absurd overreaction to the shutdown of the unsafe cross-border trucking pilot program," Teamsters President Jim Hoffa said.


"The right response from Mexico (http://topics.cnn.com/topics/Mexico) would be to make sure its drivers and trucks are safe enough to use our highways without endangering our drivers," Hoffa said in a statement issued by the union. "The border must stay closed until Mexico holds up its end of the bargain."

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/03/16/mexico.tariff/index.html

------

Two words; fuck Mexico.

A country which has literally been kept alive by the mercy of it's northern labor and the massive amounts of fund wired back to it's ailing economy. This country has for too long bit the hand that's fed it, and I'm sick and tired of the coddling that goes on between the Republican's babying them with the extremely uneven NAFTA, and the Democrats courting the Hispanic vote.

It's time for the United States to export all of it's illegal immigrants, secure it's cultural heritage and embrace the English language as the only Federally recognize language to be taught in it's halls.

Fuck Mexico.

Why do you hate Mexicans?