Justified, but Debated

[Mabus]

A man named Damon Wells had a concealed carry permit. We have those in Ohio. Two teenage boys tried to rob him at gunpoint on his own front porch. Wells pulled his gun and shot one. The 15 year old youth died.

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/117740407596600.xml&coll=2

Now they are going to have a candlelight vigil for the dead thief...

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2007/04/candlelight_vigil_tonight_for_1.html

To me the death was justified, as Wells was in danger of being killed himself. The local prosecutor sees it the same, for now. It is the first time since our concealed carry law was passed that a permit holder has shot and killed someone.

This to me is a clear case of why a law-abiding citizen should be allowed to carry a gun. I am sure some disagree and feel that the boys should have been able to rob and kill Wells and his family without any chance of harm coming to them.

[Keller]

Did the dude do anything wrong? No.

Is it ok for a grieving community to mourn the loss of a 15 year old boy, criminal or not? Yes.

These two conclusions are not mutually exclusive.

[Back]

I am sure some disagree and feel that the boys should have been able to rob and kill Wells and his family without any chance of harm coming to them.

Are you sure about that? If you do find someone like that they are either A) intentionally being facetious to cause an argument, B) completely divorced from reality, or C) sociopaths.

What a loaded post. (pun intended)

[Gan]

In Texas you do not need a CCP to use a firearm to protect yourself or your property while on your property.

Was the guy justified? you betcha

Its ok to mourn the loss of the boy as well, just dont turn him into a martyr. He comitted a crime and paid the ultimate price for it. Regardless of his known or perceived intentions.

I hope the other boy involved has a wake up call, considering it could have been him they are mourning in addition to or instead of the other.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Mabus
This to me is a clear case of why a law-abiding citizen should be allowed to carry a gun. I am sure some disagree and feel that the boys should have been able to rob and kill Wells and his family without any chance of harm coming to them.

While I've never felt the need to own a gun for protection or otherwise I'm also not some anti-gun nut. But I have to wonder... when did owning a gun become the only chance people have of preventing harm to themselves, their family, or their possessions?

[Landrion]

While I've never felt the need to own a gun for protection or otherwise I'm also not some anti-gun nut. But I have to wonder... when did owning a gun become the only chance people have of preventing harm to themselves, their family, or their possessions?


http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/117740407596600.xml&coll=2
Buford's accomplice disappeared after the shooting and had not been caught as of Monday night. Police found a .38-caliber handgun in the mail chute of a nearby house. They believe it belonged to Buford or the other suspect, Lt. Thomas Stacho said.

As Mr. Connery said, Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

[Parkbandit]

Gun supporters said the weapon saved Wells' life. Opponents said it took Buford's - that the 15-year-old might be alive if a citizen had not been armed.

Saved a law abiding citizen and took out a punk ass who thought he should just take from someone else.

Seems to me our gun laws worked like a clock in this situation.

[Davenshire]

His cousin, Tameka Foster, 21, questioned why police did not punish Buford's shooter.

"They let that man run out freely," Foster said. "My cousin is dead."

Maybe your cousin shoudn't be attempting armed robbery....? or maybe he should have paid the 2.50$ for pistol lessons at his local YMCA.

[ElanthianSiren]

As Mr. Connery said, Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

Unless you're the punisher. Bad movie, interesting scene.

You can mourn a life lost through its own ignorance and still support one of the most unique amendments in our constitution IMO. We've all had this discussion before. One person felt their life/property was in danger; they did what the other two didn't. Took out a gun to address a perceived threat and used it. That's just good gunmanship IMO. I doubt the guy is overjoyed he killed someone.

[TheSmooth1]

How disappointing.

I'd have shot them both.

[Nieninque]

As Mr. Connery said, Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

Indiana Jones would disagree.

[Nieninque]

Saved a law abiding citizen and took out a punk ass who thought he should just take from someone else.

Seems to me our gun laws worked like a clock in this situation.

Although, if neither of them were able to get guns in the first place...

...who knows?

[TheSmooth1]

This guy would have been shit out of luck, because he wouldn't have a gun and the kids would have some other weapon.

[Gan]

Although, if neither of them were able to get guns in the first place...

...who knows?

Then it probably would have been a knife fight. Thats notwithstanding the idea that criminals can obtain illegal weapons easier than law abiding citizens.

[Keller]

How disappointing.

I'd have shot them both.


This thread no longer needs to continue. We have the "Heinous Douchebag" award wrapped up!

Congratulations Smooth! You should be sterilized.

[Parkbandit]

Although, if neither of them were able to get guns in the first place...

...who knows?


And there is your flaw.. you think that if the Government bans all guns, that guns would be completely unavailable.

I disagree. Guns are about as unavailable as drugs, prostitution or internet music.

[Parkbandit]

This thread no longer needs to continue. We have the "Heinous Douchebag" award wrapped up!

Congratulations Smooth! You should be sterilized.

The parents of those two thugs should have been sterilized.

/agree with Smooth

Sorry.. you come to my home to steal my shit and do me harm.. you will get what is coming to you. Period.

[Keller]

Seriously, PB.

You wish both of the would-be thief's should have been killed?

Seriously?

What a fucking twisted ass opinion. There is nothing wrong with self-defense, but regret at having killed only one of two juvenile attempted thiefs is fucking repugnant.

[Keller]

And there is your flaw.. you think that if the Government bans all guns, that guns would be completely unavailable.

I disagree. Guns are about as unavailable as drugs, prostitution or internet music.


But I suppose you support a war on drugs?

[Parkbandit]

But I suppose you support a war on drugs?

I do.. but I'm not delusional enough to think that just because something is illegal, that it's unattainable.

[Parkbandit]

Seriously, PB.

You wish both of the would-be thief's should have been killed?

Seriously?

What a fucking twisted ass opinion. There is nothing wrong with self-defense, but regret at having killed only one of two juvenile attempted thiefs is fucking repugnant.


We've already had this discussion and we've already come to the same conclusion. I'm telling you right now, had this happened to me, I would have shot them both and not regretted it.

[Keller]

We've already had this discussion and we've already come to the same conclusion. I'm telling you right now, had this happened to me, I would have shot them both and not regretted it.

That's a totally different statement than "How dissapointing. I would have shot them both."

Unless "How dissapointing" was refering to the fact that anyone died. But I presume it's refering to the fact that only one person died.

My apologies if my assumption is wrong. In that case, I will take the "Heinous Douchebag" award.

[Skeeter]

next news story will be the kid and his buddies coming back for revenge.

[TheSmooth1]

Hey, people get what they deserve. Prime example.

[Keller]

Hey, people get what they deserve. Prime example.


You deserve a swift kick in the nuts leading to infertility.

[TheSmooth1]

So if you had a weapon on you, you wouldn't have shot them?

If only one of them had a gun, I'd have shot him. I think it said they were both armed, though.

[Keller]

So if you had a weapon on you, you wouldn't have shot them?

If only one of them had a gun, I'd have shot him. I think it said they were both armed, though.

I don't have a problem with you saying you would have shot them.

I have a problem with you saying it's unfortunate he didn't kill them both.

[Nieninque]

And there is your flaw.. you think that if the Government bans all guns, that guns would be completely unavailable.

I disagree. Guns are about as unavailable as drugs, prostitution or internet music.

Not in countries where guns are illegal.

[Davenshire]

Not in countries where guns are illegal.

I have to argue this point. The States are a little bit different to enforce this then say, some small island.

But I guess we could be some middle eastern country with a ak-47 in everyroom.

[Sean of the Thread]

Did the dude do anything wrong? No.

Is it ok for a grieving community to mourn the loss of a 15 year old boy, criminal or not? Yes.

These two conclusions are not mutually exclusive.

Agreed.

[Sean of the Thread]

I don't have a problem with you saying you would have shot them.

I have a problem with you saying it's unfortunate he didn't kill them both.

Agreed.

[Artha]

Not in countries where guns are illegal.
We've already had this discussion, it's certainly possible to get whatever you want as long as you have the money.

[Sean of the Thread]

Indiana Jones would disagree.

Agreed.

[Sean of the Thread]

I've added Keller and Nien to teh common sense club today.

That being said please keep in mind that PB is already an esteemed member of said club and you'll all need to learn to get along.
(or no pot luck dinner for you!)

[Sean of the Thread]

I have to argue this point. The States are a little bit different to enforce this then say, some small island.

But I guess we could be some middle eastern country with a ak-47 in everyroom.

<---Ak-47 in my bedroom. (right next to the pistol grip Mossberg 500)

[Sean of the Thread]

Not in countries where guns are illegal.

Disagreed.

I've several friends in Canada for example have more illegal firearms than anyone else that I personally know.

[Anailea]

when you outlaw guns
only outlaws have guns.

[Sean of the Thread]

when you outlaw guns
only outlaws have guns.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b236/Japgross/HESTON.jpg