Trump's Taxes

[BriarFox]

Well, not quite his, but his father's, and his hand in them. Not quite the "self-made" man he claims to be...

This is particularly special:


The most overt fraud was All County Building Supply & Maintenance, a company formed by the Trump family in 1992. All County’s ostensible purpose was to be the purchasing agent for Fred Trump’s buildings, buying everything from boilers to cleaning supplies. It did no such thing, records and interviews show. Instead All County siphoned millions of dollars from Fred Trump’s empire by simply marking up purchases already made by his employees. Those millions, effectively untaxed gifts, then flowed to All County’s owners — Donald Trump, his siblings and a cousin. Fred Trump then used the padded All County receipts to justify bigger rent increases for thousands of tenants.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes-fred-trump.html?emc=edit_ts_20181002&nl=&nlid=4925845820181002&te=1


Trump Engaged in Suspect Tax Schemes as He Reaped Riches From His Father
The president has long sold himself as a self-made billionaire, but a Times investigation found that he received at least $413 million in today’s dollars from his father’s real estate empire, much of it through tax dodges in the 1990s.

By DAVID BARSTOW, SUSANNE CRAIG and RUSS BUETTNER

Oct. 2, 2018
President Trump participated in dubious tax schemes during the 1990s, including instances of outright fraud, that greatly increased the fortune he received from his parents, an investigation by The New York Times has found.

Mr. Trump won the presidency proclaiming himself a self-made billionaire, and he has long insisted that his father, the legendary New York City builder Fred C. Trump, provided almost no financial help.

But The Times’s investigation, based on a vast trove of confidential tax returns and financial records, reveals that Mr. Trump received the equivalent today of at least $413 million from his father’s real estate empire, starting when he was a toddler and continuing to this day.

Much of this money came to Mr. Trump because he helped his parents dodge taxes. He and his siblings set up a sham corporation to disguise millions of dollars in gifts from their parents, records and interviews show. Records indicate that Mr. Trump helped his father take improper tax deductions worth millions more. He also helped formulate a strategy to undervalue his parents’ real estate holdings by hundreds of millions of dollars on tax returns, sharply reducing the tax bill when those properties were transferred to him and his siblings.

These maneuvers met with little resistance from the Internal Revenue Service, The Times found. The president’s parents, Fred and Mary Trump, transferred well over $1 billion in wealth to their children, which could have produced a tax bill of at least $550 million under the 55 percent tax rate then imposed on gifts and inheritances.

The Trumps paid a total of $52.2 million, or about 5 percent, tax records show.

The president declined repeated requests over several weeks to comment for this article. But a lawyer for Mr. Trump, Charles J. Harder, provided a written statement on Monday, one day after The Times sent a detailed description of its findings. “The New York Times’s allegations of fraud and tax evasion are 100 percent false, and highly defamatory,” Mr. Harder said. “There was no fraud or tax evasion by anyone. The facts upon which The Times bases its false allegations are extremely inaccurate.”

Mr. Harder sought to distance Mr. Trump from the tax strategies used by his family, saying the president had delegated those tasks to relatives and tax professionals. “President Trump had virtually no involvement whatsoever with these matters,” he said. “The affairs were handled by other Trump family members who were not experts themselves and therefore relied entirely upon the aforementioned licensed professionals to ensure full compliance with the law.”

[Read the full statement]

The president’s brother, Robert Trump, issued a statement on behalf of the Trump family:

“Our dear father, Fred C. Trump, passed away in June 1999. Our beloved mother, Mary Anne Trump, passed away in August 2000. All appropriate gift and estate tax returns were filed, and the required taxes were paid. Our father’s estate was closed in 2001 by both the Internal Revenue Service and the New York State tax authorities, and our mother’s estate was closed in 2004. Our family has no other comment on these matters that happened some 20 years ago, and would appreciate your respecting the privacy of our deceased parents, may God rest their souls.”

The Times’s findings raise new questions about Mr. Trump’s refusal to release his income tax returns, breaking with decades of practice by past presidents. According to tax experts, it is unlikely that Mr. Trump would be vulnerable to criminal prosecution for helping his parents evade taxes, because the acts happened too long ago and are past the statute of limitations. There is no time limit, however, on civil fines for tax fraud.

The findings are based on interviews with Fred Trump’s former employees and advisers and more than 100,000 pages of documents describing the inner workings and immense profitability of his empire. They include documents culled from public sources — mortgages and deeds, probate records, financial disclosure reports, regulatory records and civil court files.

The investigation also draws on tens of thousands of pages of confidential records — bank statements, financial audits, accounting ledgers, cash disbursement reports, invoices and canceled checks. Most notably, the documents include more than 200 tax returns from Fred Trump, his companies and various Trump partnerships and trusts. While the records do not include the president’s personal tax returns and reveal little about his recent business dealings at home and abroad, dozens of corporate, partnership and trust tax returns offer the first public accounting of the income he received for decades from various family enterprises.

[11 takeaways from The Times’s investigation]

What emerges from this body of evidence is a financial biography of the 45th president fundamentally at odds with the story Mr. Trump has sold in his books, his TV shows and his political life. In Mr. Trump’s version of how he got rich, he was the master dealmaker who broke free of his father’s “tiny” outer-borough operation and parlayed a single $1 million loan from his father (“I had to pay him back with interest!”) into a $10 billion empire that would slap the Trump name on hotels, high-rises, casinos, airlines and golf courses the world over. In Mr. Trump’s version, it was always his guts and gumption that overcame setbacks. Fred Trump was simply a cheerleader.

“I built what I built myself,” Mr. Trump has said, a narrative that was long amplified by often-credulous coverage from news organizations, including The Times.

Certainly a handful of journalists and biographers, notably Wayne Barrett, Gwenda Blair, David Cay Johnston and Timothy L. O’Brien, have challenged this story, especially the claim of being worth $10 billion. They described how Mr. Trump piggybacked off his father’s banking connections to gain a foothold in Manhattan real estate. They poked holes in his go-to talking point about the $1 million loan, citing evidence that he actually got $14 million. They told how Fred Trump once helped his son make a bond payment on an Atlantic City casino by buying $3.5 million in casino chips.

But The Times’s investigation of the Trump family’s finances is unprecedented in scope and precision, offering the first comprehensive look at the inherited fortune and tax dodges that guaranteed Donald J. Trump a gilded life. The reporting makes clear that in every era of Mr. Trump’s life, his finances were deeply intertwined with, and dependent on, his father’s wealth.


Donald J. Trump accumulated wealth throughout his childhood thanks to his father, Fred C. Trump.
By age 3, Mr. Trump was earning $200,000 a year in today’s dollars from his father’s empire. He was a millionaire by age 8. By the time he was 17, his father had given him part ownership of a 52-unit apartment building. Soon after Mr. Trump graduated from college, he was receiving the equivalent of $1 million a year from his father. The money increased with the years, to more than $5 million annually in his 40s and 50s.

Fred Trump’s real estate empire was not just scores of apartment buildings. It was also a mountain of cash, tens of millions of dollars in profits building up inside his businesses, banking records show. In one six-year span, from 1988 through 1993, Fred Trump reported $109.7 million in total income, now equivalent to $210.7 million. It was not unusual for tens of millions in Treasury bills and certificates of deposit to flow through his personal bank accounts each month.

Fred Trump was relentless and creative in finding ways to channel this wealth to his children. He made Donald not just his salaried employee but also his property manager, landlord, banker and consultant. He gave him loan after loan, many never repaid. He provided money for his car, money for his employees, money to buy stocks, money for his first Manhattan offices and money to renovate those offices. He gave him three trust funds. He gave him shares in multiple partnerships. He gave him $10,000 Christmas checks. He gave him laundry revenue from his buildings.

Much of his giving was structured to sidestep gift and inheritance taxes using methods tax experts described to The Times as improper or possibly illegal. Although Fred Trump became wealthy with help from federal housing subsidies, he insisted that it was manifestly unfair for the government to tax his fortune as it passed to his children. When he was in his 80s and beginning to slide into dementia, evading gift and estate taxes became a family affair, with Donald Trump playing a crucial role, interviews and newly obtained documents show.

The line between legal tax avoidance and illegal tax evasion is often murky, and it is constantly being stretched by inventive tax lawyers. There is no shortage of clever tax avoidance tricks that have been blessed by either the courts or the I.R.S. itself. The richest Americans almost never pay anything close to full freight. But tax experts briefed on The Times’s findings said the Trumps appeared to have done more than exploit legal loopholes. They said the conduct described here represented a pattern of deception and obfuscation, particularly about the value of Fred Trump’s real estate, that repeatedly prevented the I.R.S. from taxing large transfers of wealth to his children.

“The theme I see here through all of this is valuations: They play around with valuations in extreme ways,” said Lee-Ford Tritt, a University of Florida law professor and a leading expert in gift and estate tax law. “There are dramatic fluctuations depending on their purpose.”

The manipulation of values to evade taxes was central to one of the most important financial events in Donald Trump’s life. In an episode never before revealed, Mr. Trump and his siblings gained ownership of most of their father’s empire on Nov. 22, 1997, a year and a half before Fred Trump’s death. Critical to the complex transaction was the value put on the real estate. The lower its value, the lower the gift taxes. The Trumps dodged hundreds of millions in gift taxes by submitting tax returns that grossly undervalued the properties, claiming they were worth just $41.4 million.

[Story continues (https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes-fred-trump.html?emc=edit_ts_20181002&nl=&nlid=4925845820181002&te=1)]

[Androidpk]

Damn good reporting here.

https://i.imgur.com/oPlYUkJ.jpg

https://old.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/9ktloi/trump_engaged_in_suspect_tax_schemes_as_he_reaped/e71ntmq/

[cwolff]

What are the excuses going to be? Taxes suck anyway! He's a smart businessman to dodge his taxes like that and not get busted. No one should pay taxes because big Government. He frauded his taxes a long time ago and he's a different man today. We'll probably hear about some sort of IRS version of statute of limitations too.

[SHAFT]

When it comes to things like this article, who knows what to believe?

I do know Trump lies all day and every day, and he has no relationship to reality, so I can see all of this being true.

Trump is a conman at heart.

[Androidpk]

What are the excuses going to be? Taxes suck anyway! He's a smart businessman to dodge his taxes like that and not get busted. No one should pay taxes because big Government. He frauded his taxes a long time ago and he's a different man today. We'll probably hear about some sort of IRS version of statute of limitations too.

What about the Clinton's taxes? George Soros hides all his wealth overseas. This is just another partisan hack attack on Trump. Since when do liberals care about taxes anyways. You're just jealous of his success. This is just to deflect from Trump building up America's economy to levels never seen before. Something something about soy and liberal tears.

[Tgo01]

So not only was all of this illegal but the IRS knew about it and allowed it to happen? Sounds legit.

[Androidpk]

"The Tax Department is reviewing the allegations in the NYT article and is vigorously pursuing all appropriate avenues of investigation," a spokesman from New York State Department of Taxation and Finance said in an email to CNBC.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/02/new-york-state-tax-department-reviewing-fraud-allegations-involving-trump-in-nyt-article.html

You can bet the NYAG is going to be using this information in their case/s against the Trump Foundation.

[BriarFox]

So not only was all of this illegal but the IRS knew about it and allowed it to happen? Sounds legit.

Probably outright fraud, but mostly under the radar, with some luck and a lot of work. The statute of limitations on it as a criminal activity has expired, though it could be a civil case still.

Beyond the fraud, though, it's deeply amusing how thoroughly this article debunks Trump's projected image as a self-made man. Instead, he could barely stay wealthy with his dad funneling him over $400M.

[Androidpk]

Its also likely he's still committing similar tax evading schemes.

[SHAFT]

"The Tax Department is reviewing the allegations in the NYT article and is vigorously pursuing all appropriate avenues of investigation," a spokesman from New York State Department of Taxation and Finance said in an email to CNBC.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/02/new-york-state-tax-department-reviewing-fraud-allegations-involving-trump-in-nyt-article.html

You can bet the NYAG is going to be using this information in their case/s against the Trump Foundation.

Cohen is cooperating with SDNY AG, as well as Mueller. He probably has some things to say.

[Androidpk]

Cohen is cooperating with SDNY AG, as well as Mueller. He probably has some things to say.

Don't forget Manafort too, who has had business dealings with Trump for decades.

[Stumplicker]

Trump did some shady line-skirtingly grey area legality things to make money?! What are "Things we knew decades prior to his election?", Alex. I haven't read any of them, but I'd guess he probably bragged openly about some of this stuff in one of his books. This is only tangentially related to the reasoning, but it's one of the reasons it was a good thing to elect him. He's always very openly done some very shady stuff and then bragged about it, even if those things weren't technically all the way illegal.

He points out glaring holes in systems he touches that we can then repair. That's why I voted for him. He does his own thing, and never shuts up about it. The other available candidate would've only worked within the extensively corrupt system quietly, as most others before her had done. For example, one of the things politically that we've learned to fix for the future so far from Trump is that the President alone with no other oversight has far too much control over tariffs as a result of probably laws from when we were fighting pirates from North Africa in the early 1800s.

[Methais]

What about the Clinton's taxes? George Soros hides all his wealth overseas. This is just another partisan hack attack on Trump. Since when do liberals care about taxes anyways. You're just jealous of his success. This is just to deflect from Trump building up America's economy to levels never seen before. Something something about soy and liberal tears.

And speaking of soy, I've really been enjoying time4fun's new ultra life like soy squirting strap on. Of which I am the receiver of course.

And for a minute I thought you were actually going to hold both sides accountable for once. Glad you and time4fun are having a good time though.

[Androidpk]

LOL at you believing Trump is draining the swamp.

[Aluvius]

Most important of all, the Trump Organization CFO Allen Weisselberg has been given immunity by federal prosecutors. He was also Fred Trump's money guy ...

[Fortybox]

Sorry, people don't care about this. Just like they didn't care about grabbin by the pussy.

Johnson City, Tennessee - 92,000 tickets requested, 20,000 in attendance last night.

Polls are also tightening in several races with even the possibility of an increase in seats in the Senate. STFU with this already.

[cwolff]

The reporter who broke this story is on Maddow. Two interesting things, besides the actual investigative journalism, are 1) Apparently there's no statute of limitations on fines that can be levied and 2) The genesis of this article was Maddows report from a few years ago where she got a hold of a couple pages from trump's tax returns.

[Tgo01]

2) The genesis of this article was Maddows report from a few years ago where she got a hold of a couple pages from trump's tax returns.

Where she showed everyone that Trump pays a lot in taxes? That sure is interesting.

[BriarFox]

Where she showed everyone that Trump pays a lot in taxes? That sure is interesting.

Don't be disingenuous. One of the major points of the article above is that Trump has paid far less in taxes than he ought to have. Great citizen there.

[Tgo01]

Don't be disingenuous.

I'm not being disingenuous. The Rachel Maddow show they are referring to she just showed everyone that Trump pays a lot in taxes.

I'm not buying this latest "outrage" that the Trump family was breaking the law and the IRS knew about it and allowed it to happen.

[Androidpk]

Of course you aren't, just like the good little sycophant you are :)

[Tgo01]

Of course you aren't, just like the good little sycophant you are :)

So you really think the IRS knew the Trump's were engaging in illegal activity but allowed it to happen?

Let me guess, you also believe at least 2 women were aware of a gang of rapists drugging women at parties and yet they attended 10-20+ such parties?

Talk about a sycophant.

[Androidpk]

No need to deflect or spin this one.

[Tgo01]

No need to deflect or spin this one.

Androidpk now thinks talking about the so called "facts" of the story is spin.

There there, pk. Maybe if you humiliate yourself a bit more today time4fun will let you sleep on the big couch tonight!

[SHAFT]

So you really think the IRS knew the Trump's were engaging in illegal activity but allowed it to happen?

Let me guess, you also believe at least 2 women were aware of a gang of rapists drugging women at parties and yet they attended 10-20+ such parties?

Talk about a sycophant.

How do you know the IRS knew anything? When you submit taxes, the IRS looks for red flags. Not every tax return is audited.

Just because Trump's people say the IRS signed off on something doesn't mean it happened.

[Tgo01]

How do you know the IRS knew anything? When you submit taxes, the IRS looks for red flags. Not every tax return is audited.

Just because Trump's people say the IRS signed off on something doesn't mean it happened.

I'm going by the article itself.


These maneuvers met with little resistance from the Internal Revenue Service, The Times found.

This implies the IRS was aware but didn't care.

[Androidpk]

Androidpk now thinks talking about the so called "facts" of the story is spin.

There there, pk. Maybe if you humiliate yourself a bit more today time4fun will let you sleep on the big couch tonight!

What facts are you referring to? You tried to claim that people are saying the IRS allowed Trump to get away with this. Typical Tgo spin/straw man BS.

[Tgo01]

What facts are you referring to? You tried to claim that people are saying the IRS allowed Trump to get away with this. Typical Tgo spin/straw man BS.

I just quoted the part of the article where it suggests the IRS knew what was going on at the time and did nothing.

It's okay, pk. We all understand you didn't actually read the article and instead just got your talking points from far left wing radio pundits. Maybe someday you'll be a grown up and think for yourself.

[Androidpk]

I just quoted the part of the article where it suggests the IRS knew what was going on at the time and did nothing.

It's okay, pk. We all understand you didn't actually read the article and instead just got your talking points from far left wing radio pundits. Maybe someday you'll be a grown up and think for yourself.

Says the troll who parrots troll talking points. In before Tgo says I'm crashing on someone's couch.

[Wrathbringer]

The less Trump pays in taxes, the more I admire him. Starve the beast.

[Fortybox]

How do you know the IRS knew anything? When you submit taxes, the IRS looks for red flags. Not every tax return is audited.

Just because Trump's people say the IRS signed off on something doesn't mean it happened.

Oh, are we back to needing facts now? I thought the left abandoned that with Fords testimony.

Make up your mind.

[SHAFT]

I'm going by the article itself.



This implies the IRS was aware but didn't care.

It's just implying the IRS didn't resist. Whenever the Trump team filed there weren't red flags.

[Tgo01]

It's just implying the IRS didn't resist. Whenever the Trump team filed there weren't red flags.

Met with "little resistance" suggests the IRS knew about it but did nothing about it.

If someone were writing an article about me and said I afk script all the time in GS and was "met with little resistance" from the GMs you would conclude the GMs knew about the afk scripting but did little about it yes?

[Androidpk]

There's talk going around in Trumpet circles that the IRS let him get away with not paying taxes for so many years so he could help them expose the deep state.. :lol2:

[SHAFT]

Met with "little resistance" suggests the IRS knew about it but did nothing about it.

If someone were writing an article about me and said I afk script all the time in GS and was "met with little resistance" from the GMs you would conclude the GMs knew about the afk scripting but did little about it yes?

The IRS only investigates when they come across returns with red flags.

I know this because some of my companies have been audited and my business partner was audited years ago.

We weren't cheating or anything, but our accountant screwed up a couple of things that appeared as red flags.

If you submit a return that is illegal, but looks on the up and up with IRS, they move on.

[Tgo01]

The IRS only investigates when they come across returns with red flags.

I know this because some of my companies have been audited and my business partner was audited years ago.

We weren't cheating or anything, but our accountant screwed up a couple of things that appeared as red flags.

If you submit a return that is illegal, but looks on the up and up with IRS, they move on.

Wouldn't a better phrase be something like "The tax returns flew under the radar of the IRS" or something to that effect? Again saying they were "met with little resistance" suggests the IRS did know what was going on but did little about it.

[Androidpk]

Wouldn't a better phrase be something like "The tax returns flew under the radar of the IRS" or something to that effect? Again saying they were "met with little resistance" suggests the IRS did know what was going on but did little about it.

That is your interpretation and you're welcome to it but actual logic says they didn't see any red flags, not that they saw red flags and just decided for no reason to ignore them.

In other news the mayor of NYC says they're going to go after Trump for money owed. I say just seize Trump Tower. Grab him by the assets.

[Fortybox]

The IRS only investigates when they come across returns with red flags.

I know this because some of my companies have been audited and my business partner was audited years ago.

We weren't cheating or anything, but our accountant screwed up a couple of things that appeared as red flags.

If you submit a return that is illegal, but looks on the up and up with IRS, they move on.

Sure, blame the accountant.

Reported to Methais and the IRS.

[SHAFT]

Sure, blame the accountant.

Reported to Methais and the IRS.

We were fined. We also found a new accountant.

[SHAFT]

That is your interpretation and you're welcome to it but actual logic says they didn't see any red flags, not that they saw red flags and just decided for no reason to ignore them.

In other news the mayor of NYC says they're going to go after Trump for money owed. I say just seize Trump Tower. Grab him by the assets.

Hey, if something came out that the IRS was aware of these crimes by Trump and let him slide, then we have a whole new set of issues.

I'd bet the returns looked on the up and up and the IRS simply didn't investigate. The IRS has been understaffed for many years. Only 1% of returns are audited and only 10% of returns of those who make over 1m annually are audited.

It's completely possible the IRS just didn't thoroughly investigate the Trumps.

[Androidpk]

Hey, if something came out that the IRS was aware of these crimes by Trump and let him slide, then we have a whole new set of issues.


Agreed

[BriarFox]

Hey, if something came out that the IRS was aware of these crimes by Trump and let him slide, then we have a whole new set of issues.

I'd bet the returns looked on the up and up and the IRS simply didn't investigate. The IRS has been understaffed for many years. Only 1% of returns are audited and only 10% of returns of those who make over 1m annually are audited.

It's completely possible the IRS just didn't thoroughly investigate the Trumps.

The current scrutiny is falling heavily on Trump's sister, who was a federal judge and who may have helped her father and family skirt or cover up some illegal activities. A source on NPR got asked the same question about why the IRS didn't investigate the Trumps, and he responded that it wasn't so much an outright failure of the IRS as it seems to have been that the Trumps either did not report or massively under-reported -- and for whatever reason were not challenged on it.

[Fortybox]

The current scrutiny is falling heavily on Trump's sister, who was a federal judge and who may have helped her father and family skirt or cover up some illegal activities. A source on NPR got asked the same question about why the IRS didn't investigate the Trumps, and he responded that it wasn't so much an outright failure of the IRS as it seems to have been that the Trumps either did not report or massively under-reported -- and for whatever reason were not challenged on it.

OMG Briar - please don't turn into soywolf. The WH has already responded:


Fred Trump has been gone for nearly twenty years and it’s sad to witness this misleading attack against the Trump family by the failing New York Times. Many decades ago the IRS reviewed and signed off on these transactions. The New York Times’ and other media outlets‘ credibility with the American people is at an all time low because they are consumed with attacking the president and his family 24/7 instead of reporting the news. The truth is the market is at an all-time high, unemployment is at a fifty year low, taxes for families and businesses have been cut, wages are up, farmers and workers are empowered from better trade deals, and America’s military is stronger than ever, yet the New York Times can rarely find anything positive about the President and his tremendous record of success to report. Perhaps another apology from the New York Times, like the one they had to issue after they got the 2016 election so embarrassingly wrong, is in order.

Clearly if you believe Ford without any evidence or corroboration from any witness, the above statement should be enough for you.

The IRS reviewed and signed off. The end.

[Tgo01]

OMG Briar - please don't turn into soywolf. The WH has already responded:



Clearly if you believe Ford without any evidence or corroboration from any witness, the above statement should be enough for you.

The IRS reviewed and signed off. The end.

Much like the allegations against Keith Ellison I have a feeling video evidence of Fred Trump and the IRS is now required before they'll believe Trump.

[Fortybox]

Much like the allegations against Keith Ellison I have a feeling video evidence of Fred Trump and the IRS is now required before they'll believe Trump.

Oh of course. Everything they argued in favor of Ford does not apply to Trump of course.

There's some soyfox logic for you.

[BriarFox]

Well, folks can believe whatever they want. It's impossible to convince someone who's set on thinking about something in a certain way. I'm not immune to that either. No one is. I like to think I keep an open mind and weigh evidence, though.

What I see right now is a circle of problems tightening around Trump, from tax fraud to the negative effects of a trade war to the Mueller investigation to the alienation of allies to the sucking up to dictators to the corruption and cronyism that he's responsible for spreading through Washington with his office appointments and the long-term damage that's doing to the U.S.

It may not come today. It may not be the Kavanaugh nomination, or the trade war, or tax issue itself. But Trump will eventually implode and be remembered as the worst president in living memory, one who's caused lasting harm to American democracy, to our standing in the world, and to the laws and regulations that protect our people, our environment, and our way of life.

The great sadness is that he's being cheered on by a horde of people so blinded by rage, by hatred, by fear, and by self-interest that they can't see those problems for what they are.

[Androidpk]

Mueller has Trump's tax returns FWIW.

[cwolff]

Well, folks can believe whatever they want. It's impossible to convince someone who's set on thinking about something in a certain way. I'm not immune to that either. No one is. I like to think I keep an open mind and weigh evidence, though.

What I see right now is a circle of problems tightening around Trump, from tax fraud to the negative effects of a trade war to the Mueller investigation to the alienation of allies to the sucking up to dictators to the corruption and cronyism that he's responsible for spreading through Washington with his office appointments and the long-term damage that's doing to the U.S.

It may not come today. It may not be the Kavanaugh nomination, or the trade war, or tax issue itself. But Trump will eventually implode and be remembered as the worst president in living memory, one who's caused lasting harm to American democracy, to our standing in the world, and to the laws and regulations that protect our people, our environment, and our way of life.

The great sadness is that he's being cheered on by a horde of people so blinded by rage, by hatred, by fear, and by self-interest that they can't see those problems for what they are.

Well said.

[Fortybox]

Blah blah blah soyfox crying...

The great sadness is that he's being cheered on by a horde of people so blinded by rage, by hatred, by fear, and by self-interest that they can't see those problems for what they are.

Tell that to the liberal horde of cray cray getting ready to protest Kavanaugh being nominated.

https://pics.me.me/trump-weare-goingtomakeamerica-greatagain-liberal-horde-omgimpeachhim-tn-21680358.png


And.......

http://www.dredge-report.com/uploads/1/0/6/5/106574565/kathygriffin_orig.jpg

[BriarFox]

Tell that to the liberal horde of cray cray getting ready to protest Kavanaugh being nominated.

https://pics.me.me/trump-weare-goingtomakeamerica-greatagain-liberal-horde-omgimpeachhim-tn-21680358.png

I don't think you understand why people oppose Kavanaugh. He stands as an image of an overly entitled white male with no sympathy for women or for victims of sexual abuse and as an enraged partisan hack who threatens women's control of their own bodies. People are pissed off at him because he threatens to hold down the oppressed to benefit his own kind.

Kavanaugh, on the other hand, is pissed off for the same reason that many of Trump's supporters are: Just as Obama's presidency was, the backlash to his nomination is a dire warning that the America of Trumps and Kavanaughs is coming to an end.

The deep irony of Trump's supporters is that his policies hurt them, their environment, and their kids. The tax cuts screw the poor and the working class. The environmental policies will screw them. The tariffs will screw them. And yet they're cheering him on out of a misguided belief he's just like them. He's not. He's a con-man 10 ways from Sunday.

Also -- a well-reasoned position is not "crying." "Crying" is the sound of Manafort going to prison. Cohen going to prison. And a soft weeping coming from the Oval Office when no one is looking.

[Tgo01]

He's stands as an image of an overly entitled white male

Oh Jesus Christ.

[Stumplicker]

I don't think you understand why people oppose Kavanaugh. He's stands as an image of an overly entitled white male with no sympathy for women or for victims of sexual abuse and as an enraged partisan hack who threatens women's control of their own bodies. People are pissed off at him because he threatens to hold down the oppressed to benefit his own kind.

Kavanaugh, on the other hand, is pissed off for the same reason that many of Trump's supporters are: Just as Obama's presidency was, the backlash to his nomination is a dire warning that the America of Trumps and Kavanaughs is coming to an end.

The deep irony of Trump's supporters is that his policies hurt them, their environment, and their kids. The tax cuts screw the poor and the working class. The environmental policies will screw them. The tariffs will screw them. And yet they're cheering him on out of a misguided belief he's just like them. He's not. He's a con-man 10 ways from Sunday.

Also -- a well-reasoned position is not "crying." "Crying" is the sound of Manafort going to prison. Cohen going to prison. And a soft weeping coming from the Oval Office when no one is looking.

Know what hurts women's control of their own bodies? Co-opting a serious movement for use in unfounded claims in a petty political play in because you don't like someone's policies in an attempt to hurt them or perform some kind of appointment filibuster. I notice exactly nowhere have you mentioned that none of these issues are the issue that Kavanaugh has been attacked on in an attempt to stop his nomination. He was attacked from a completely different angle that set back the #metoo movement years because now every time an allegation is made it's got to be remembered that one time an entire political party used it as a smokescreen with absolutely zero evidence for reasons that they now claim "aren't the real reason people are mad at him".

I don't support Trump and dislike more of his policies than I like, but what has been done by his political opposition on the issue you're talking about is far beyond anything Trump has said or done when you're talking about things that are "bad for america". It is absolute, pure, unbridled evil.

[Androidpk]

Stumplicker, you are the spitting image of delusional if you think the opposition to Trump is evil.

[Stumplicker]

Stumplicker, you are the spitting image of delusional if you think the opposition to Trump is evil.

You are the spitting image of illiterate if you think I said that anywhere. Quote it. I'll wait.

[Parkbandit]

I like to think I keep an open mind and weigh evidence, though.

Oh yes.. you very much come across as someone who doesn't let emotions cloud his judgement and always keep an open mind...


The great sadness is that he's being cheered on by a horde of people so blinded by rage, by hatred, by fear, and by self-interest that they can't see those problems for what they are.

In the same post, mind you. Not like an hour or day or week apart.. in the same post.

So open minded............................................ .................................................. .......

You're trolling us right now.. aren't you...

[Fortybox]

Oh Jesus Christ.

Yeah, I stopped reading right there.

[Parkbandit]

I don't think you understand why people oppose Kavanaugh. He stands as an image of an overly entitled white male with no sympathy for women or for victims of sexual abuse and as an enraged partisan hack who threatens women's control of their own bodies. People are pissed off at him because he threatens to hold down the oppressed to benefit his own kind.

Kavanaugh, on the other hand, is pissed off for the same reason that many of Trump's supporters are: Just as Obama's presidency was, the backlash to his nomination is a dire warning that the America of Trumps and Kavanaughs is coming to an end.

The deep irony of Trump's supporters is that his policies hurt them, their environment, and their kids. The tax cuts screw the poor and the working class. The environmental policies will screw them. The tariffs will screw them. And yet they're cheering him on out of a misguided belief he's just like them. He's not. He's a con-man 10 ways from Sunday.

Also -- a well-reasoned position is not "crying." "Crying" is the sound of Manafort going to prison. Cohen going to prison. And a soft weeping coming from the Oval Office when no one is looking.

So.. if Kavanaugh was black and not "entitled", then he would have sailed right through?

Clarance Thomas just called you a hypocritical, entitled, white retarded male.

Also, thank you for being so open minded.. it's really, really refreshing........................................ .............................................

[Fortybox]

I don't think you understand why people oppose Kavanaugh. He stands as an image of an overly entitled white male [this is where I stopped reading]

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

Does time4fun have a gun to your head right now? The stupid level of your comment is pretty high...

[Fortybox]

So.. if Kavanaugh was black and not "entitled", then he would have sailed right through?

Clarance Thomas just called you a hypocritical, entitled, white retarded male.

Also, thank you for being so open minded.. it's really, really refreshing........................................ .............................................

The "well-reasoned" position would see that Ford has absolutely NOTHING substantial. Seeing that this thread is about the taxes, a well-reasoned mind would see that the story is misleading.

There is nothing well-reasoned from the left...at all.

[Androidpk]

And it's no surprise to anyone that the cadre of toxic trolls here are ardent Trump supporters.

[SHAFT]

So.. if Kavanaugh was black and not "entitled", then he would have sailed right through?

Clarance Thomas just called you a hypocritical, entitled, white retarded male.

Also, thank you for being so open minded.. it's really, really refreshing........................................ .............................................

One of these days I hope you come home from work or wherever, and you walk in on PK fucking your wife. Don’t put it past him.

[cwolff]

Know what hurts women's control of their own bodies? Co-opting a serious movement for use in unfounded claims in a petty political play in because you don't like someone's policies in an attempt to hurt them or perform some kind of appointment filibuster. I notice exactly nowhere have you mentioned that none of these issues are the issue that Kavanaugh has been attacked on in an attempt to stop his nomination. He was attacked from a completely different angle that set back the #metoo movement years because now every time an allegation is made it's got to be remembered that one time an entire political party used it as a smokescreen with absolutely zero evidence for reasons that they now claim "aren't the real reason people are mad at him".

I don't support Trump and dislike more of his policies than I like, but what has been done by his political opposition on the issue you're talking about is far beyond anything Trump has said or done when you're talking about things that are "bad for america". It is absolute, pure, unbridled evil.

Man that's WAY over the top. As for allegations without evidence then what the hell is Ford supposed to do? What are any victims to do if they don't have evidence? Since when is it the victims responsibility to provide evidence? She came forward with before Kavanaugh was the nominee.

Blame the dems for dirty political tricks. That's fair though I don't know that we know the whole story, but to call this "pure, unbridled evil" seems really extreme

[Tgo01]

One of these days I hope you come home from work or wherever, and you walk in on PK fucking your wife. Don’t put it past him.

I doubt that. I'm sure Parkbandit's wife has standards and a sexual deviant who couch surfs probably isn't her type.

[Stumplicker]

As for allegations without evidence then what the hell is Ford supposed to do?

Come forward literally anytime in a 35+ year period except the one very small window of time it was able to be turned into a political sideshow.



Blame the dems for dirty political tricks. That's fair though I don't know that we know the whole story, but to call this "pure, unbridled evil" seems really extreme

It is the exactly the same "end justifies the means" sort of move that we have condemned history's worst leaders for pulling.

[cwolff]

Come forward literally anytime in a 35+ year period except the one very small window of time it was able to be turned into a political sideshow.


She didn't want to for whatever reason. She did come forward when she heard he was on the short list for a lifetime SCOTUS appointment. Don't blame her for that.



It is the exactly the same "end justifies the means" sort of move that we have condemned history's worst leaders for pulling.

That's way too out of perspective. It's not even an ends justifies the means situation. It's a credible allegation that's led to Kavanaugh lying and freaking out in front of the Senate. That's all. The dude's fucked up. Just get another conservative less problematic judge. Candidates for SCOTUS have to withdraw from time to time. It's not a big deal.

[Androidpk]

One of these days I hope you come home from work or wherever, and you walk in on PK fucking your wife. Don’t put it past him.

Who's to say I haven't already.

[Stumplicker]

She didn't want to for whatever reason. She did come forward when she heard he was on the short list for a lifetime SCOTUS appointment. Don't blame her for that.]

And all it cost was the credibility of an important movement because it's now wrapped up in bullshit politics. But so long as the SCOTUS appointee her political party didn't like didn't get in, the ends justify the means.




It's a credible allegation that's led to Kavanaugh lying and freaking out in front of the Senate.

"credible" to me and the law and the real world means "literally any evidence", of which there is none. You can't scream "RAPE! RAPE! RAPE!" and then one week later claim "It's not about rape. Look at how bad this guy is!" without anyone calling foul. This was brought forward as a political play knowing in advance there was zero evidence in an attempt to delay an appointment until after elections. It is absolutely an end justifies the means scenario, and it is absolutely despicable.

[SHAFT]

Who's to say I haven't already.

Hahahaha! Cheers

[Androidpk]

I doubt that. I'm sure Parkbandit's wife has standards and a sexual deviant who couch surfs probably isn't her type.

For someone that flies into a rage when he perceives someone is telling lies about him it sure is strange how you have no problems making up lies about other people.. :lol:

[SHAFT]

I doubt that. I'm sure Parkbandit's wife has standards and a sexual deviant who couch surfs probably isn't her type.

Nah man, the woman who decided PB was her best option has no standards.

[cwolff]

]

And all it cost was the credibility of an important movement because it's now wrapped up in bullshit politics. But so long as the SCOTUS appointee her political party didn't like didn't get in, the ends justify the means.




"credible" to me and the law and the real world means "literally any evidence", of which there is none. You can't scream "RAPE! RAPE! RAPE!" and then one week later claim "It's not about rape. Look at how bad this guy is!" without anyone calling foul. This was brought forward as a political play knowing in advance there was zero evidence in an attempt to delay an appointment until after elections. It is absolutely an end justifies the means scenario, and it is absolutely despicable.

It didn't cost the credibility of the MeToo movement. The only people who would think that didn't like it anyway.

Kavanaugh is judged as a total package. This is the time to judge him. He handled the accusations against him horribly and should withdraw. It's not just me saying this either, his law school colleagues have said it, the ABA has concerns, the nations largest organization of protestant churches and about 1000 law professors have all come out against him because of his display and lingering questions.


I disagree with you but I understand why you think he got roughed up unfairly. He owns how he responded to that and he fucked it up.

[SHAFT]

It didn't cost the credibility of the MeToo movement. The only people who would think that didn't like it anyway.

Kavanaugh is judged as a total package. This is the time to judge him. He handled the accusations against him horribly and should withdraw. It's not just me saying this either, his law school colleagues have said it, the ABA has concerns, the nations largest organization of protestant churches and about 1000 law professors have all come out against him because of his display and lingering questions.


I disagree with you but I understand why you think he got roughed up unfairly. He owns how he responded to that and he fucked it up.

He’s not withdrawing. I bet he’s confirmed within 48 hours.

[Stumplicker]

It didn't cost the credibility of the MeToo movement. The only people who would think that didn't like it anyway.

Clearly that is the opposite of true, unless you're accusing me or anyone who dealt with this situation with kid gloves as not supporting the metoo movement. Every single time I've mentioned it I've mentioned that it's important.

There is no defense for how this was handled by the Democratic party. The ends did not justify the means.

I'm beginning to understand why the people here consider you so unintelligent. I'm not about to join in with the childish namecalling, but you make very little sense in terms of actual logical thought.

[cwolff]

Clearly that is the opposite of true, unless you're accusing me or anyone who dealt with this situation with kid gloves as not supporting the metoo movement. Every single time I've mentioned it I've mentioned that it's important.

There is no defense for how this was handled by the Democratic party. The ends did not justify the means.

I'm beginning to understand why the people here consider you so unintelligent. I'm not about to join in with the childish namecalling, but you make very little sense in terms of actual logical thought.

Appreciate the no name calling. You kind of fucked that up with all the insults LOL

I honestly can't see why you're so bent out of shape about this or why Kavanaugh gets a free pass because the dems did dirty tricks. I said it before but it bears repeating. His display in front of the Senate committee where he attacked the dems, senators, claimed it was revenge for the Clinton's and ranted like a crazy man make him disqualified in my book. He's told us that what goes around comes around and that doesn't belong on the bench.

[Tgo01]

Nah man, the woman who decided PB was her best option has no standards.

So in your mind Parkbandit is worse than Androidpk? You're a strange little man.

[Stumplicker]

Appreciate the no name calling. You kind of fucked that up with all the insults LOL

I honestly can't see why you're so bent out of shape about this or why Kavanaugh gets a free pass because the dems did dirty tricks. I said it before but it bears repeating. His display in front of the Senate committee where he attacked the dems, senators, claimed it was revenge for the Clinton's and ranted like a crazy man make him disqualified in my book. He's told us that what goes around comes around and that doesn't belong on the bench.

See now, there's your lack of logic again. You didn't actually read a single word I said. You just assumed I was bent out of shape about Kavanaugh getting a free pass. Go through my posts. I have said zero things in support of Kavanaugh. 100% of the posts I've made here have been about his political opposition using despicable tactics and not caring what they bulldozed to do so. Please quote otherwise if you think your logic is sound.

If you'd like me to say something about Kavanaugh, here, now I will:

I've read through a few summations of his history of decisions in various news stories but haven't dug through his record with a fine toothed comb. Of his decisions I read about, I'm about a 50/50 split on whether or not I agree with them or the stated reason he made them.

And lastly, if you believe your logic is sound, take this quote, from you, two posts ago:


It didn't cost the credibility of the MeToo movement. The only people who would think that didn't like it anyway.

Now, you're responding directly to me stating the opposite of that. By logic:

1. You're accusing me of not liking the MeToo movement despite all evidence to the contrary as shown by every post I've made where it is mentioned.
or
2. ?

Explain your logic if you believe it to be sound. Spoiler alert: It isn't, just like Androidpk's wasn't when he directed a comment at me and is now conspicuously absent from showing his logic.

[Androidpk]

Sorry, too busy laughing at how absurd your statements are.

[Stumplicker]

Sorry, too busy laughing at how absurd your statements are.

I guess that's your only option considering yours was flat out wrong.

[cwolff]

See now, there's your lack of logic again. You didn't actually read a single word I said. You just assumed I was bent out of shape about Kavanaugh getting a free pass. Go through my posts. I have said zero things in support of Kavanaugh. 100% of the posts I've made here have been about his political opposition using despicable tactics and not caring what they bulldozed to do so. Please quote otherwise if you think your logic is sound.

If you'd like me to say something about Kavanaugh, here, now I will:

I've read through a few summations of his history of decisions in various news stories but haven't dug through his record with a fine toothed comb. Of his decisions I read about, I'm about a 50/50 split on whether or not I agree with them or the stated reason he made them.

And lastly, if you believe your logic is sound, take this quote, from you, two posts ago:



Now, you're responding directly to me stating the opposite of that. By logic:

1. You're accusing me of not liking the MeToo movement despite all evidence to the contrary as shown by every post I've made where it is mentioned.
or
2. ?

Explain your logic if you believe it to be sound. Spoiler alert: It isn't, just like Androidpk's wasn't when he directed a comment at me and is now conspicuously absent from showing his logic.

Ya I was reading between the lines and maybe I had it wrong. I don't agree with you and I think you're being overly dramatic about it but that's your right and I get that you're upset with the dems. Your outrage seems outsized to me.

As for saying "the only people who would think that didn't like it anyway.", I recognize that I'm generalizing here and take for granted that you'd recognize it too.

[BriarFox]

http://www.theweeklygeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/pothead.jpg

[Methais]

I don't think you understand why people oppose Kavanaugh. He stands as an image of an overly entitled white male with no sympathy for women or for victims of sexual abuse and as an enraged partisan hack who threatens women's control of their own bodies. People are pissed off at him because he threatens to hold down the oppressed to benefit his own kind.

Kavanaugh, on the other hand, is pissed off for the same reason that many of Trump's supporters are: Just as Obama's presidency was, the backlash to his nomination is a dire warning that the America of Trumps and Kavanaughs is coming to an end.

The deep irony of Trump's supporters is that his policies hurt them, their environment, and their kids. The tax cuts screw the poor and the working class. The environmental policies will screw them. The tariffs will screw them. And yet they're cheering him on out of a misguided belief he's just like them. He's not. He's a con-man 10 ways from Sunday.

Also -- a well-reasoned position is not "crying." "Crying" is the sound of Manafort going to prison. Cohen going to prison. And a soft weeping coming from the Oval Office when no one is looking.

It's funny that you believe that when this was a thing before anyone knew who Trump was going to nominate:

https://i.imgur.com/1c7EWkn.jpg

[BriarFox]

Opposition to any Trump nominee doesn't disprove my analysis of why people don't like Kavanaugh, but it does show that opposition to Trump is, certainly, a contributing factor. That rather goes without saying, though.

[Wrathbringer]

Opposition to any Trump nominee doesn't disprove my analysis of why people don't like Kavanaugh, but it does show that opposition to Trump is, certainly, a contributing factor. That rather goes without saying, though.

You're an amazing libtard. Your posts sound like cnn. A couple of things:

1. You lost, get over it.
2. Try thinking instead of just regurgitating what you see on liberal media.

You're welcome.

[Methais]

Since when is it the victims responsibility to provide evidence?

http://weknowawesome.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Biden-This-Fucking-Guy.gif

[Stumplicker]

Since when is it the victims responsibility to provide evidence?

Wow, thanks Methais. I'd missed this little gem in the rest of the non-logic.

The answer to this question is - ALWAYS, since forever. It's one of the foundations of our legal system. You were expecting what? The accused to provide evidence of wrongdoing?

Innocent until proven guilty. If not by the accuser, then by whom?

[Methais]

Opposition to any Trump nominee doesn't disprove my analysis of why people don't like Kavanaugh, but it does show that opposition to Trump is, certainly, a contributing factor. That rather goes without saying, though.

Democrats: "We will oppose anyone who Trump nominates by any means necessary, we don't care who it is or what we have to do!"

Also democrats: "This investigation wasn't good enough, we need more investigating before we cast our "no" votes that we already decided on before this guy was nominated!"

You: "I see nothing wrong with this behavior."

[Methais]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwHKWyKIy8k

:lol:

https://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Burn+her+if+she+weighs+the+same+as+a+duck_31465e_3 422282.jpg

[cwolff]

Not surprising to anyone. Even his supporters can't be surprised that his charity is a scam.


*NEW* @NewYorkStateAG filing: "the Trump Foundation was a shell corporation that functioned as a checkbook," used to benefit Trump's business and political interests.

Here's the full filing, opposing Trump's motion to dismiss AG Underwood's lawsuit: https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2018_the_people_of_the_stat_v_the_people_of_the_st at_memorandum_9._.pdf …

https://twitter.com/amyspitalnick/status/1047937706016354305

[Jeril]

Stumplicker, you are the spitting image of delusional if you think the opposition to Trump is evil.

Voting in politics is called picking the lesser of two evils for a reason.

[cwolff]

Wow, thanks Methais. I'd missed this little gem in the rest of the non-logic.

The answer to this question is - ALWAYS, since forever. It's one of the foundations of our legal system. You were expecting what? The accused to provide evidence of wrongdoing?

Innocent until proven guilty. If not by the accuser, then by whom?

No innocent until proven guilty here. He's not on trial. He is being judged but not in criminal or even civil court.

Investigations provide evidence. Its not Ford's responsibility to investigate her alleged rapist just like it's no citizens responsibility to do that.

The Kavanaugh crowd wants to have it both ways. Either Ford's statements and eye witness account is evidence or it isn't. She's done her part and isn't responsible to investigate deeper. Don't get so twisted about this that you lose perspective.

[Wrathbringer]

No innocent until proven guilty here. He's not on trial. He is being judged but not in criminal or even civil court.

Investigations provide evidence. Its not Ford's responsibility to investigate her alleged rapist just like it's no citizens responsibility to do that.

The Kavanaugh crowd wants to have it both ways. Either Ford's statements and eye witness account is evidence or it isn't. She's done her part and isn't responsible to investigate deeper. Don't get so twisted about this that you lose perspective.

9185

[BriarFox]

Democrats: "We will oppose anyone who Trump nominates by any means necessary, we don't care who it is or what we have to do!"

Also democrats: "This investigation wasn't good enough, we need more investigating before we cast our "no" votes that we already decided on before this guy was nominated!"

You: "I see nothing wrong with this behavior."

I don't. Trump is a disaster shoving through a chaotic right-wing agenda and a partisan nominee. Expecting him to do that and planning to oppose it isn't wrong. Acting against it when he does do that isn't wrong. Finding huge problems with that nominee during the confirmation process and strengthening the opposition isn't wrong. Complaining that the White House cherry-picked witnesses and created a sham investigation isn't wrong.

What IS wrong is what the Republicans did under McConnell to Merrick Garland, who was a centrist pick designed to appease them with no hint of a taint, but who was opposed purely because Republicans wanted a partisan judge.

[Parkbandit]

One of these days I hope you come home from work or wherever, and you walk in on PK fucking your wife. Don’t put it past him.

Oh, I wouldn't put it past him. I trust my wife not to sleep with sociopathic hobos though.

I hope one of these days, you come home from wherever you have been hanging out all day, and you walk in on PK fucking your husband.

[Parkbandit]

Who's to say I haven't already.

Oh, I'm sure you've tried to dox me.. because that's what creepy little sociopaths do who spend 80% of their time inside the house they are currently staying at.

My wife wouldn't give you the time of day kid. Sorry :(

[Parkbandit]

Nah man, the woman who decided PB was her best option has no standards.

Your meltdown has been spectacular.

Thank you for entertaining us.

[Wrathbringer]

Oh, I wouldn't put it past him. I trust my wife not to sleep with sociopathic hobos though.

I hope one of these days, you come home from wherever you have been hanging out all day, and you walk in on PK fucking your husband.

lol

[Parkbandit]

I don't. Trump is a disaster shoving through a chaotic right-wing agenda and a partisan nominee. Expecting him to do that and planning to oppose it isn't wrong. Acting against it when he does do that isn't wrong. Finding huge problems with that nominee during the confirmation process and strengthening the opposition isn't wrong. Complaining that the White House cherry-picked witnesses and created a sham investigation isn't wrong.

What IS wrong is what the Republicans did under McConnell to Merrick Garland, who was a centrist pick designed to appease them with no hint of a taint, but who was opposed purely because Republicans wanted a partisan judge.

If it IS wrong.. you need to talk to Joe Biden since the rule was named after him.

See what happens when your side does stupid things to change the way the Senate works so they can take advantage of it? It comes back to bite you in the ass.

First Biden. Then Reid.

You reap what you sow.

Enjoy it.. your side caused your own troubles.

[Methais]

I don't. Trump is a disaster

Nah.


shoving through a chaotic right-wing agenda

Nah.


and a partisan nominee.

Based on his judicial history, nah.


Expecting him to do that and planning to oppose it isn't wrong. Acting against it when he does do that isn't wrong. Finding huge problems with that nominee during the confirmation process and strengthening the opposition isn't wrong. Complaining that the White House cherry-picked witnesses and created a sham investigation isn't wrong.

So what you're saying is being mad about losing an election and throwing tantrums isn't wrong. Which technically it isn't, until you start doing all this retarded crazy shit the democrats have been doing for the past two years. Fortunately it's only been working against them unless you live in make believe soyland like cwolff.


What IS wrong is what the Republicans did under McConnell to Merrick Garland, who was a centrist pick designed to appease them with no hint of a taint, but who was opposed purely because Republicans wanted a partisan judge.

Could you explain why what they did with Garland is called the Biden rule? I can't seem to remember. But you seem like you would know. Thank you in advance.

[Fortybox]

I don't. Trump is a disaster shoving through a chaotic right-wing agenda and a partisan nominee. Expecting him to do that and planning to oppose it isn't wrong. Acting against it when he does do that isn't wrong. Finding huge problems with that nominee during the confirmation process and strengthening the opposition isn't wrong. Complaining that the White House cherry-picked witnesses and created a sham investigation isn't wrong.

What IS wrong is what the Republicans did under McConnell to Merrick Garland, who was a centrist pick designed to appease them with no hint of a taint, but who was opposed purely because Republicans wanted a partisan judge.

Your sides rules allowed for that to happen.

You lost, get over it soyfox.

[Parkbandit]

Either Ford's statements and eye witness account is evidence or it isn't. She's done her part and isn't responsible to investigate deeper. Don't get so twisted about this that you lose perspective.

Her statements aren't evidence.. since all of her eye witnesses aren't eye witnesses at all.

The investigation is over.

Judge Kavanaugh will be confirmed.

Your delay tactics are now over.

Sorry (not sorry)

[Methais]

Her statements aren't evidence.. since all of her eye witnesses aren't eye witnesses at all.

The investigation is over.

Judge Kavanaugh will be confirmed.

Your delay tactics are now over.

Sorry (not sorry)

https://i.imgur.com/7sJaiRu.gif