Terrorists break into US Capitol Building

[Neveragain]

I care so much about slavery that I continue to vote for the party that separated from the nation to keep their slaves.

Sounds reasonable.

[Methais]

The primary difference between you an Flap is you think that slavery was a benefit to the people that were kidnapped or forcibly indentured from and want to pretend your party's idea of progress is removing any and all minimum wages to ensure debt slavery can resume.

I'm mystified that you think government doesn't have a duty to make sure no one is homeless, dying from untreated illness or hunger. How does making sure the most vulnerable, mostly children and elderly by the way, allow the government to RULE anyone. Some 35% of our population is on cash assistance and needs based social security, you obviously think they need to be allowed to figure it out themselves.

So with your hatred of children, poor people, apologist attitude for slave owners left without work, just who do you think should be held accountable? Why don't you let us know which ethnicities or cultures have a victimhood mentality? I'd like to know so we can develop your revolutionary program to ask people whether or not to be poor, which will magically make them successful without any basic cash assistance.

What are you doing to help besides being a bumbling retard on an obscure internet message board that almost nobody knows exists?

The first thing you can do to help is to stop being a retard.

[Shaps]

Agreed.

We have kids graduating $100k+ in debt with degrees that specialize in gender neutral sociology, and these same kids wonder why they can’t get a meaningful job in the real world. Our higher education system is long overdue for reform.

I personally don't care what a person studies in college... they make the choice to attend and pay the tuition... they can study whatever they want IMO. So long as the Government isn't "bailing them out", like they're trying to do now.

I think the Governments role in education, is in the primary school system. If we were teaching 5-18 year old's the above mentioned stuff - instead of all the "gender neutral sociology" in middle school... we would be a lot better off. I'm sure we see it similar, I just like making the distinction on what segment of education I was mainly referring.

[Seran]

I’m mystified that you don’t seem to think the primary person responsible for making sure they don’t end up homeless, broke, hungry, etc. is the individual and not their government. If you don’t accept personal accountability for your actions, nobody else will. Now I don’t think anyone should starve or freeze to death and we have the means in our society to help, but I fundamentally disagree with you that by right of birth you are just automatically entitled to a certain standard of living from the government. That’s not how our world works. You are responsible for you.

If the basis for survivability is shelter, food and medical care, but someone lacks the ability to obtain them, what is wrong with making sure basic needs are met? Richest nation on the planet with trillions of dollars made annually and you don't think we owe a duty to make sure no one starves to death or dies from exposure? You're essentially arguing that we treat our sick and infirm like they do in third world countries and simply let them die. If slavery as you champion in your earlier post provided opportunities to people from the third world they were kidnapped from (which is just fucked up btw), then how can you logically argue treating current day citizens like they didn't live in the wealthiest country on the planet.

Really you're just arguing to end welfare which will never happen. And using a really shity argument about tertiary benefits of slavery. You can qualify the perspective of a so-called historian and say simply because he's black that he knows what he's talking about. Not only why is your post full of ignorance but your perception of race is plain bigoted

[Suppressed Poet]

If the basis for survivability is shelter, food and medical care, but someone lacks the ability to obtain them, what is wrong with making sure basic needs are met? Richest nation on the planet with trillions of dollars made annually and you don't think we owe a duty to make sure no one starves to death or dies from exposure? You're essentially arguing that we treat our sick and infirm like they do in third world countries and simply let them die. If slavery as you champion in your earlier post provided opportunities to people from the third world they were kidnapped from (which is just fucked up btw), then how can you logically argue treating current day citizens like they didn't live in the wealthiest country on the planet.

Really you're just arguing to end welfare which will never happen. And using a really shity argument about tertiary benefits of slavery. You can qualify the perspective of a so-called historian and say simply because he's black that he knows what he's talking about. Not only why is your post full of ignorance but your perception of race is plain bigoted

Bro…do you just read something and than reinterpret in your head whatever you want to hear?

I never advocated for the end of all welfare programs. I stated to keep them appropriately minimal. If someone has fallen on hard times and needs help, than by all means I think it’s appropriate for the government to help where we have the resources to do so (not unconditionally mind you). If someone is starving, let’s get them food. If someone gets shot, a hospital shouldn’t and doesn’t today deny them medical care.

What I said was that it’s not the government’s responsibility to take care of you. If you want to better your life more than the most bare minimum essentials, it’s on you to do so. Sounds like you are advocating otherwise where you expect government to just give a person a place to live, a constant supply of food, money, the same quality healthcare as someone who by their own accomplishments works to achieve it, etc. You know what that is? Slavery. It’s leftists like you that want to keep people, especially poor black people, in their place.

[Methais]

Bro…do you just read something and than reinterpret in your head whatever you want to hear?

Seran is incapable of answering this honestly, so I'll help out: Yes.

[Flap]

First I’ll say once again that I’m not justifying slavery. I denounce it and recognize the harm it has done. So please stop accusing me of that. What I was trying to point out to you which you refuse to acknowledge is that it’s not as simple or accurate to say the evil white man enslaved a bunch of black people and our country was built upon this principle. Slavery was universally accepted practice on a global scale from the dawn of humanity until the 19th century. To imply that America’s founding is immoral because we had slaves…well if you have that mentality than every single people & society on earth was guilty of that in that time. You are trying to apply our present day rational and norms upon a different time, and it simply doesn’t work that way. That doesn’t make slavery in anyway less wrong and once again I’m not justifying it, but I think you need to look at reality of how the world was at the time & realize the USA was unique ONLY in the sense that we eradicated slavery.

This is mostly untrue. There were numerous other nations that abolished slavery before the USA. Starting in the 1300's. People knew it was wrong, there's no excuse.

On your question of how do we accomplish better standards of living without wealth redistribution…. Let’s take a look for a moment at cultures that do really well here. Asian Americans make on average a higher income than whites. So do Jews. So do Nigerian immigrants. Just a few rough examples for this simple exercise. You know what they have in common? Their cultures place a high emphasis & value on education, discipline, & personal accountability. They don’t have a victimhood mentality of entitlement. They bust their ass in school & work hard to make themselves valuable contributing members of society. Its not that I lack empathy for poor people. The difference between you & I is that I want to give poor people the opportunities and choice of not to be poor, where it seems you want to give the poor more money (which doesn’t really make them any less poor is the point I was trying to get across).

I'm not going to use the R word here. I'm just going to point out that you didn't suggest any solution. I disagree that any "culture" has a victimhood mentality. Even if they did, what are you going to do to change their culture without spending a lot of tax money on it?

Robbing Jeff Bezos isn’t going to help you usher in your utopian society. That’s all I’m going to say on that.

I don't want to rob anyone, but I DO think that people like Bezos should pay their fair share of taxes. I also think it's disingenuous of you to keep saying this or that isn't going to create a utopia. The lack of the existence of a perfect society is not an excuse to not try to improve our own. I'm just talking about trying harder to reduce things that shouldn't exist in a first world nation: starvation, homelessness, lack of medical care.

On what is the purpose of government? Well I say it’s a reflection of our own society’s values. We need government for national defense, to make & enforce laws, & many other things… but government DOES NOT exist to serve you with benefits. And if you let it happen, it will RULE you. Our founding fathers understood this very well.

I think it's more accurate to say that healthcare being tied to employment is what RULES people. There's a reason the term "wage slave" exists.

[Suppressed Poet]

Seran has a genius idea for Gemstone:

Every month all characters will be deducted 1 million silvers (or their total amount if they have less) from any and all bank accounts. The GMs will take those silvers and buy a single broadsword to distribute to every active Half Krolvin character. This is being done to balance years of society’s negative racial bias towards Half-Krolvins + their history of former slavery. Why only a single broadsword and where did the rest of the silvers go you might ask? Corruption and misappropriation of funds. Hey we gotta keep it as realistic as possible, right?

Sounds like a win-win for the whole player base.

[Methais]

Seran has a genius idea for Gemstone:

Every month all characters will be deducted 1 million silvers (or their total amount if they have less) from any and all bank accounts. The GMs will take those silvers and buy a single broadsword to distribute to every active Half Krolvin character. This is being done to balance years of society’s negative racial bias towards Half-Krolvins + their history of former slavery. Why only a single broadsword and where did the rest of the silvers go you might ask? Corruption and misappropriation of funds. Hey we gotta keep it as realistic as possible, right?

Sounds like a win-win for the whole player base.

Oh sure just leave dark elves completely out of their reparations. Racist.

Reported to the NAADE.

[Suppressed Poet]

Flap - gotta work so I don’t have time to write a full response right now, but what other nations are you referring to that abolished slavery as early as the 1300s? Also, yes it is wrong. Again I agree with you on the wrongness of slavery. More on that later.