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Thread: The Last Jedi *Warning: Possible Spoilers*

  1. #91
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    And he "immediately does it again" because she didn't tell him she had a fucking plan. For all intents and purposes she was acting like she had NO PLAN. I was in the military for 9 years. I've seen good leaders and bad leaders. She is incompetent to the extreme. You learn at the various NCO academies that your troops need to know EXACTLY what is going on unless there isn't time to explain it. She failed leadership 101.
    Last edited by Gelston; 01-21-2018 at 02:42 PM.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latrinsorm View Post
    Poe had a past pattern and practice of screwing up Republican plans by freelancing, and Admiral Holdo's judgment to this effect is borne out because he immediately does it again, doubling down by blabbing the secret plan on an unsecured channel. The casualties don't demonstrate how Poe was right all along, they demonstrate how Holdo was. What commander in chief tells every subordinate every facet of their plans, let alone a proven unreliable one? Give me a break here.
    She didn't need to tell him "every aspect" of her plan. The argument here is that she told him nothing, and was dismissive of him as well. The mutiny (and subsequent massacre) was entirely avoidable.
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  3. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gelston View Post
    Again, NEITHER ARE COMPARABLE. There is no recorded showings of a ship going into lightspeed into another ship and fucking it up to that magnitude.
    You mean like how a projectile from a revolver doesn't do as much damage as a projectile from a rail gun? Cool story.
    There IS a clip of a transport going into lightspeed and blowing the fuck up against Darth Vader's ISD in Rogue One though. If the hyperdrive thing was valid, I'd think that EVERY weapon they use would be lightspeed based. No, it was bullshit they created for this movie.
    We have two mutually consistent examples (Return of the Jedi and The Last Jedi) where ramming a ship does damage proportional to the rammer's velocity and mass, and we have another that's inconsistent (Rogue One). Why are you mad at one of the consistent ones? That does not. Make. Sense. If Chewbacca eats porgs but not ewoks you must acquit.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gelston View Post
    And he "immediately does it again" because she didn't tell him she had a fucking plan. For all intents and purposes she was acting like she had NO PLAN. I was in the military for 9 years. I've seen good leaders and bad leaders. She is incompetent to the extreme. You learn at the various NCO academies that your troops need to know EXACTLY what is going on unless there isn't time to explain it. She failed leadership 101.
    You have a lot to say about what's not comparable, but have no qualms equating the commander in chief to an NCO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Taernath View Post
    She didn't need to tell him "every aspect" of her plan. The argument here is that she told him nothing, and was dismissive of him as well. The mutiny (and subsequent massacre) was entirely avoidable.
    So she told him repeatedly how he should stop doing his own thing and be a team player, he does it anyway and it causes hundreds of deaths, including loudly lecturing everyone about the technical capabilities of transports while being totally oblivious to their cloaking devices, and it's all her fault. Cool story.
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  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latrinsorm View Post
    We have two mutually consistent examples (Return of the Jedi and The Last Jedi) where ramming a ship does damage proportional to the rammer's velocity and mass, and we have another that's inconsistent (Rogue One).
    No, we really don't In the RotJ, the SSD's shields are down. That is why it did the damage it did. In TLJ, Snoke's shield, and all the ships around it, would have been fully shielded, and ONE ship annihilates most of the fleet and wrecks Snoke's ship. If this were even a legit form of combat, then why isn't that the only form of combat? Why don't we have hyperdrive missiles? You still fail to answer that.

    You have a lot to say about what's not comparable, but have no qualms equating the commander in chief to an NCO.
    You're a complete idiot. Leadership principles are the same on every level. If you've ever been in charge of anything, you'd know that. You let those below you know the plan so that in the case of your incapacitation, they can continue the mission. You let people below you know the plan so they can act within the spirit of your orders. She didn't give ANY orders other than to "Just have hope" and then to belittle him. No, she was a horrible leader. And the disaster caused by this woman's incompetent leadership is plain to see. I mean, your argument is fucking retarded.

    I mean, I imagine incompetence is exactly what they were going for, which is why they killed her off.
    Last edited by Gelston; 01-21-2018 at 06:34 PM.

  5. #95

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    Quote Originally Posted by Latrinsorm View Post
    Of course a kamikaze cruiser did more damage than a kamikaze fighter. It's what, a thousand times bigger? going a thousand times faster? You might as well compare a revolver to a rail gun. And every battle isn't full of such attacks for the same reason that bad guys keep putting shield generators outside of the shields like bozos - because that's how the story works. The bad guys have to be massively better armed with no hope of conventional victory for the ragtag group of plucky good guys.Poe had a past pattern and practice of screwing up Republican plans by freelancing, and Admiral Holdo's judgment to this effect is borne out because he immediately does it again, doubling down by blabbing the secret plan on an unsecured channel. The casualties don't demonstrate how Poe was right all along, they demonstrate how Holdo was. What commander in chief tells every subordinate every facet of their plans, let alone a proven unreliable one? Give me a break here.
    Confirmed Latrin actually is a woman.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gelston View Post
    I mean, I imagine incompetence is exactly what they were going for, which is why they killed her off.
    But not before, "I'm not telling you shit because you're a male, and males are dumb and just want to explode things because they're dumb males. Girl power! Purple!"

    Someone should point out to the feminists involved that Admiral A-cup having purple hair makes her look like a penis. They'll probably scrap the whole movie from canon and start TLJ over from scratch.
    Last edited by Methais; 01-21-2018 at 07:32 PM.
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  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gelston View Post
    No, we really don't In the RotJ, the SSD's shields are down. That is why it did the damage it did. In TLJ, Snoke's shield, and all the ships around it, would have been fully shielded,
    Why? They weren't under any fire whatsoever.
    and ONE ship annihilates most of the fleet and wrecks Snoke's ship.
    ONE much, much, much, much bigger ship going much, much, much, much faster, yes. In the same way that a projectile from a revolver does absolutely nothing to a tank,
    yet a projectile from a rail gun annihilates it.
    If this were even a legit form of combat, then why isn't that the only form of combat? Why don't we have hyperdrive missiles? You still fail to answer that.
    I explicitly answered that: it's for the same reason the bad guys put their shield generators outside of their shields. Bad guys need to be massively OP but with a small yet crucial weakness, that's how the story goes. Nobody roots for the wall, they root for the egg.
    You're a complete idiot. Leadership principles are the same on every level. If you've ever been in charge of anything, you'd know that.
    lol
    You let those below you know the plan so that in the case of your incapacitation, they can continue the mission. You let people below you know the plan so they can act within the spirit of your orders.
    Except she did, just not to some random schmuck that we care about because he's a main character.

    You're mad, so I'll leave it here.
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  7. #97
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    Poe wasn't a "random schmuk", he was the third highest ranking person on that ship, and he was one of her troops. I don't know about you, but I've been on a ship at sea before. Anytime we were about to do something, we got a brief telling us exactly what we were doing and what the goal was. Again, leadership 101. There is a reason the Squadleader's Course and PLC are 60% creating 5 Paragraph Orders.

    This whole thing feels like explaining bio-nuclear-rocket-surgery to a retarded 3 year old.
    Last edited by Gelston; 01-21-2018 at 07:50 PM.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latrinsorm View Post
    So she told him repeatedly how he should stop doing his own thing and be a team player, he does it anyway and it causes hundreds of deaths, including loudly lecturing everyone about the technical capabilities of transports while being totally oblivious to their cloaking devices, and it's all her fault. Cool story.
    If she told Poe her plan, the B squad wouldn't have spent 45 minutes at the casino planet and wouldn't have picked up Del Toro's character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Latrinsorm View Post
    Except she did, just not to some random schmuck that we care about because he's a main character.
    Hey, I predicted this!

    Before you come back with 'but Poe was demoted!' ... know that a) she was still, as near as I can tell, his current commanding officer while Leia was unconscious ...
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  9. #99

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