Trump Bans Transgenders from the Military

[Jhynnifer]

You're totally right to point out that transitioning isn't easy, and there's often a post-op bout of depression that hits. But it's generally a result of how many years and sacrifices we make someone endure to get to the point of being allowed to transition. If we make that process easier, provide more support, we can eliminate that stage. Making sure the military as an employer is more supportive would be a big step for these folks.

I'm not talking about the emotional journey someone who choses to transition themselves goes through. I'm talking about the mental and emotional issues that arise by putting a human body, who biologically is not meant to have the kind of testosterone/estrogen pumped through their bodies for over a year. These are two different things.

Pulling out big picture though- every concern you listed for transitioning is also a concern for childbirth. But women aren't banned from entering the military (any more) because we may decide to have children one day. The military just makes allowances for early motherhood because that mother brings value to her job before and after childbirth that isn't erased by a few tough weeks that may or may not happen in between.

If a person originally wasn't planning on gender reassignment surgery changed their mind, I'd expect them to leave the military before starting their pre-op hormone therapy. Just as I would expect a woman who was starting fertility treatments to.

And, again, the military already decided to lift the ban almost a year ago. The people you're talking about DID get to make the call, and they said they wanted trans people to be able to serve in the miitary.

This decision to reinstate the ban didn't come from the military- it came from the President and the people around him.

And trans people should have that right... right up until they decide they want surgery. Then, for their health, and the health of every soldier in their unit, they should not be allowed into active combat.

[Methais]

You're totally right to point out that transitioning isn't easy, and there's often a post-op bout of depression that hits. But it's generally a result of how many years and sacrifices we make someone endure to get to the point of being allowed to transition. If we make that process easier, provide more support, we can eliminate that stage. Making sure the military as an employer is more supportive would be a big step for these folks.

RAND has one of the public studies that the Military commissioned. It's a great read if you can get the full copy. I linked their findings- which more or less get you to the same point but faster.

Pulling out big picture though- every concern you listed for transitioning is also a concern for childbirth. But women aren't banned from entering the military (any more) because we may decide to have children one day. The military just makes allowances for early motherhood because that mother brings value to her job before and after childbirth that isn't erased by a few tough weeks that may or may not happen in between.

And, again, the military already decided to lift the ban almost a year ago. The people you're talking about DID get to make the call, and they said they wanted trans people to be able to serve in the miitary.

This decision to reinstate the ban didn't come from the military- it came from the President and the people around him.

You forgot to address this part of her post:

and throughout all of it, if you're a woman (for example) who feels extremely uncomfortable being in a bathroom with someone who, biologically is a male... you have no recourse but to deal with it. Because your rights are trumped by the hot-button issue of the day.

Can't possibly imagine why...

[Jhynnifer]

It's only a matter of time before the left has to decide between feminism and trans-whatever as to who's more equal, and then they'll cannibalize each other while ISIS laughs at them both for doing their work for them.

ROFL. Somedays, I love you.

[Steve]

Also I get that he likes using Twitter to bypass the media and all of that, but if he insists on going down this path he really should have released the information in a more professional manner.

Just a thought, but couldn't he also bypass the media equally well with a facebook post, provided he has more than 140 characters of words to say?

[time4fun]

I'm not talking about the emotional journey someone who choses to transition themselves goes through. I'm talking about the mental and emotional issues that arise by putting a human body, who biologically is not meant to have the kind of testosterone/estrogen pumped through their bodies for over a year. These are two different things.




If a person originally wasn't planning on gender reassignment surgery changed their mind, I'd expect them to leave the military before starting their pre-op hormone therapy. Just as I would expect a woman who was starting fertility treatments to.



And trans people should have that right... right up until they decide they want surgery. Then, for their health, and the health of every soldier in their unit, they should not be allowed into active combat.

Ahh, you mean WHILE people are taking hormones. That's actually generally an exciting and positive time for people who are transitioning, at least among my friends who have transitioned. Mood swings can certainly be part of that, but that's also true of anyone who starts an anti-depressant, thyroid medication, hormone replacement for menopause, fertility drugs (as you noted), and honestly combat...and none of those require someone to leave the military. They're trained to keep themselves under control in incredibly stressful situations.

So on the list of groups we should be concerned about in regards to their ability to handle physical and emotional stress- I feel like this is the group is pretty close to the bottom.

And, if this were a real (rather than hypothetical) problem, they would have discovered that during the year long study they did on the subject or the last year-ish after we lifted the ban. Remember- all of this was carefully studied and reviewed. This isn't like desegregating the military or even allowing LGB people to serve openly- we don't have to speculate about what's going to happen.

We already know, and the answer is: nothing.

[Wrathbringer]

You're totally right to point out that transitioning isn't easy, and there's often a post-op bout of depression that hits. But it's generally a result of how many years and sacrifices we make someone endure to get to the point of being allowed to transition. If we make that process easier, provide more support, we can eliminate that stage. Making sure the military as an employer is more supportive would be a big step for these folks.

RAND has one of the public studies that the Military commissioned. It's a great read if you can get the full copy. I linked their findings- which more or less get you to the same point but faster.

Pulling out big picture though- every concern you listed for transitioning is also a concern for childbirth. But women aren't banned from entering the military (any more) because we may decide to have children one day. The military just makes allowances for early motherhood because that mother brings value to her job before and after childbirth that isn't erased by a few tough weeks that may or may not happen in between.

And, again, the military already decided to lift the ban almost a year ago. The people you're talking about DID get to make the call, and they said they wanted trans people to be able to serve in the miitary.

This decision to reinstate the ban didn't come from the military- it came from the President and the people around him.

Actually, it did come from the military. They weighed in, and Trump responded accordingly. Sorry that doesn't fit your retarded narrative though.

[Wrathbringer]

Ahh, you mean WHILE people are taking hormones. That's actually generally an exciting and positive time for people who are transitioning, at least among my friends who have transitioned. Mood swings can certainly be part of that, but that's also true of anyone who starts an anti-depressant, thyroid medication, hormone replacement for menopause, fertility drugs (as you noted), and honestly combat...and none of those require someone to leave the military. They're trained to keep themselves under control in incredibly stressful situations.

So on the list of groups we should be concerned about in regards to their ability to handle physical and emotional stress- I feel like this is the group is pretty close to the bottom.

And, if this were a real (rather than hypothetical) problem, they would have discovered that during the year long study they did on the subject or the last year-ish after we lifted the ban. Remember- all of this was carefully studied and reviewed. This isn't like desegregating the military or even allowing LGB people to serve openly- we don't have to speculate about what's going to happen.

We already know, and the answer is: nothing.

I see you're also an expert on transitioning sexes. I'm unsurprised.

[Steve]

I see you're also an expert on transitioning sexes. I'm unsurprised.

I'm not sure if you noticed, but everyone here is an expert on everything. I'm an expert on recognizing expertise.

[Astray]

I see you're also an expert on transitioning sexes. I'm unsurprised.

When you know like, two people, it's easy to become an expert because they tell you.

[Wrathbringer]

When you know like, two people, it's easy to become an expert because they tell you.

lol