You got a problem with celestial vuvuzelas, pal?
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You got a problem with celestial vuvuzelas, pal?
Not sure how true this is, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if it is.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.n...fc0bf155445d67
I've never seen animals tested in that manner before, but yeah. LD50 (Lethal dose 50%) studies are done all the time. That being said, I could never do research on dogs, especially stuff that burns through them like that.
Disturbing picture.
I really don't get how that shit is even legal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fallen
Can't they test this stuff on convicted pedophiles or something instead?
Unfortunately, we just don't have better ways of doing research than the use of animal models. There is such a thing as the Three R's of animal research, replace, reduce, and refine. One would hope they could achieve the same results by using less animals, less experiments, and with less "complex" animals than dogs.
I've heard people talk about doing research on prisoners all the time. I wonder how much support that would actually have if put to a popular vote.
LOTSQuote:
Originally Posted by Fallen
1) reduces existing criminal population
2) functions as an extra deterrent to committing crime
(vs a free meal and shelter every day, there is a chance you're selected to die from inhaling toxins ... might change your mind about knifing for a pair of sneakers)
Society is still a single step away from barbarism. I'm actually for the death penalty, in a thoughtful, non exhibitionist manner.Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanteax
Executing/torturing criminals in the colosseum however, no? Feeding the rape/snuff/violent fantasies of the masses for your entertainment as some sort of balm to your everyday boring life? No and hell no.
I think the mob would like to have upvote/downvote buttons on all web sites so they can personally weigh in on every crime committed, with public live feed executions based on their voting. It's one thing to express your disgust with a particular criminal, but that expression should not leak into the justice system.
My problem with such a setup is our justice system isn't flawless. We have people wrongfully imprisoned at a fairly frequent rate. Beyond that, we are moving from a society which claims to rehabilitate our prisoners, to one where we dehumanize them. Not in the hippy use of the word, but in the "you are now a shaved ape and we will experiment on you like one" sort of way. I'm not too big on that practice, either. At that point, we should just execute anyone who is going to be in prison over X amount of time, because if you are not attempting to rehabilitate them, you cannot expect them to return to society and not further fuck it up.
I'm not sure I would want to live in a country that subscribes to the above "justice" system.
It'd still be better than doing it to dogs that have done nothing wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fallen
Playing devil's advocate here, I would ask if you eat meat or have clothing from animal products. If so, you're fine for animals being raised for the specific purpose of being killed to our benefit. While I won't say random sourcing of animals doesn't happen, typically research animals are bred for the sole purpose of experimentation. You want to control for variables, so you don't want to just grab dogs from the pound and do research on them. The question then becomes, why is it ok to raise animals only to kill them for their body parts, but not for research? Is it simply the species? Would it be alright if they did this to cows? Is it an issue of the animal suffering? Would it be alright if they did this work while the animals were anesthetized?Quote:
Originally Posted by Methais
I'm not 100% on board with animal research, and I do it for a living. That being said, I eat meat, and I certainly don't do much research into where my meat comes from. I am 100% willing to bet that most of the animals I eat have a far worse life than the research animals do.