Things that made you Facepalm today (Political Version)

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Originally Posted by Keller

I try not to be an asshole.

I make exceptions when I'm dealing with assholes, but I do my best to avoid assholes so I don't have to be one myself.

I'm a utilitarian, which kinda means I'm libertarian lite. I think, in general, individuals and small communities can best decide how to regulate/provide for themselves. Between the two current political parties, I find myself siding with Democrats because while I value fiscal conservatism, there is no party that represents fiscal conservatism and I value individual liberty (the ability to love whomever you want, the autonomy to make medical decisions about your own body, etc) over [s]Sharia[/s] Abrahamic Law.

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We have similar thoughts. Like you mention, no one is a fiscal conservative anymore, and frankly that is my chief concern of all politicians at this time. My social philosophy is do whatever you want so long as it harms and affects no one else. I have opinions on the hot topics like abortion (for it), immigration (for vastly improved and significant increases to legal immigration, for a wall as well and harsher penalties for illegals), for healthier foods, better environment, etc, but not at the cost of innovation or the economy.

None of that means shit til we fire all of congress and put people in place that will work for the American people, balance the budget and work across the party lines. So long as the Trumps, Waters, Pelosi's, Schumers, cocaine Mitch, etc etc etc exist, that'll never happen.

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Originally Posted by Keller

Reap what you sow.

Same goes for these tornadoes ripping through the midwest.

Ignorance is bliss until it isn't I guess.

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See you lost me here. I don't think anyone deserves bad weather, regardless of how retarded their political standings are.

Did you cheer the fires in California as well?

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Originally Posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage

See you lost me here. I don't think anyone deserves bad weather, regardless of how retarded their political standings are.

Did you cheer the fires in California as well?

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He is just being a troll. He'll say retarded shit and vanish for months again.

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Originally Posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage

We have similar thoughts. Like you mention, no one is a fiscal conservative anymore, and frankly that is my chief concern of all politicians at this time. My social philosophy is do whatever you want so long as it harms and affects no one else. I have opinions on the hot topics like abortion (for it), immigration (for vastly improved and significant increases to legal immigration, for a wall as well and harsher penalties for illegals), for healthier foods, better environment, etc, but not at the cost of innovation or the economy.

None of that means shit til we fire all of congress and put people in place that will work for the American people, balance the budget and work across the party lines. So long as the Trumps, Waters, Pelosi's, Schumers, cocaine Mitch, etc etc etc exist, that'll never happen.

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We're pretty much the same.

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Originally Posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage

See you lost me here. I don't think anyone deserves bad weather, regardless of how retarded their political standings are.

Did you cheer the fires in California as well?

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I do not want any natural disasters to occur.

But if they do occur (and they have been occurring a lot more frequently over the last decade, weird), I'd like them to impact people who selfishly (or ignorantly) ignore our impact on the environment.

The problem with climate change is that no one directly bears the cost of climate change and so lots of people want to pretend they can get away with not paying for it. But that's inherently selfish (remember, I'm fine being an asshole TO assholes) and short sighted. It's a classic economic externality. If you'll remember back to like 2006 or 2007, I had a thread on here where I supported a carbon tax as a way to deal with the externality of climate change. I think I even suggested geoengineering as a utilitarian middle ground since we know we'll eventually need to eek out a few thousand extra years on Earth as the sun expands before it consumes us. I really supported geoengineering as a way to deal with the immediate thread of climate change, but selling it to mouth breathers as a solution to stave off eventually being swallowed by the sun was a hail mary.

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Originally Posted by Keller

I do not want any natural disasters to occur.

But if they do occur (and they have been occurring a lot more frequently over the last decade, weird), I'd like them to impact people who selfishly (or ignorantly) ignore our impact on the environment.

The problem with climate change is that no one directly bears the cost of climate change and so lots of people want to pretend they can get away with not paying for it. But that's inherently selfish (remember, I'm fine being an asshole TO assholes) and short sighted. It's a classic economic externality. If you'll remember back to like 2006 or 2007, I had a thread on here where I supported a carbon tax as a way to deal with the externality of climate change. I think I even suggested geoengineering as a utilitarian middle ground since we know we'll eventually need to eek out a few thousand extra years on Earth as the sun expands before it consumes us. I really supported geoengineering as a way to deal with the immediate thread of climate change, but selling it to mouth breathers as a solution to stave off eventually being swallowed by the sun was a hail mary.

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But you are defining mouth breathers as people in mid-America because...? Their political viewpoints? I live in mid-America and all kidding aside believe in climate change and we need to do more to address it (but laugh at people like AOC, Bernie and Booker). If anything, I think with your stance you'd hope for major environmental disasters in the major population centers of the world, because they far more greatly impact the climate than any podunk town in the fly over states.

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Originally Posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage

But you are defining mouth breathers as people in mid-America because...? Their political viewpoints? I live in mid-America and all kidding aside believe in climate change and we need to do more to address it (but laugh at people like AOC, Bernie and Booker). If anything, I think with your stance you'd hope for major environmental disasters in the major population centers of the world, because they far more greatly impact the climate than any podunk town in the fly over states.

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It was really just a flippant reference to ignorant (willfully or otherwise) people.

Do you think per capita carbon consumption is higher in a metro area than the midwest? I wouldn't think so, but honestly haven't looked. And my stance is not based on utilitarian grounds, but fairness. It's not fair to see a population of people willing to make personal sacrifices for public good suffer natural disasters.

I think the Green New Deal is a pretty great idea. I think Mayor Pete had the best articulation of my stance on it.

The timeline on climate change isn't set by Congress, it's set by nature. The good news is we can mobilize as a country to respond to this challenge to turbo charge the economy. A green economy is coming. It's just a matter of how much resistance there will be. Some good news: my biggest client owns a couple of the biggest refineries in North America. They are making huge investments in green tech, including electric vehicles. They've looked into disposing of the refineries, but the market is dying. Folks generally have accepted that 50 years from now they will all just be giant liabilities to own. So while it's still very profitable, no one wants to buy them.

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Originally Posted by Keller

It was really just a flippant reference to ignorant (willfully or otherwise) people.

Do you think per capita carbon consumption is higher in a metro area than the midwest? I wouldn't think so, but honestly haven't looked. And my stance is not based on utilitarian grounds, but fairness. It's not fair to see a population of people willing to make personal sacrifices for public good suffer natural disasters.

I think the Green New Deal is a pretty great idea. I think Mayor Pete had the best articulation of my stance on it.

The timeline on climate change isn't set by Congress, it's set by nature. The good news is we can mobilize as a country to respond to this challenge to turbo charge the economy. A green economy is coming. It's just a matter of how much resistance there will be. Some good news: my biggest client owns a couple of the biggest refineries in North America. They are making huge investments in green tech, including electric vehicles. They've looked into disposing of the refineries, but the market is dying. Folks generally have accepted that 50 years from now they will all just be giant liabilities to own. So while it's still very profitable, no one wants to buy them.

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I do think per capita carbon consumption is higher in densely populated areas than others. Anecdotal though, I haven't looked very hard to confirm or deny it.

I wrote a few responses and thoughts but ended up deleting them all. I am solidly in the camp where we cannot do jack shit regards the economy, healthcare, immigration, environment or anything else, until we address our spending and budget. I'm as close to a single issue voter on that than anything else. Rich nations can innovate, can be world leaders, can do the things we all wish and hope they will do. A broke nation can't even take care of it's own people.

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Originally Posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage

I do think per capita carbon consumption is higher in densely populated areas than others. Anecdotal though, I haven't looked very hard to confirm or deny it.

I wrote a few responses and thoughts but ended up deleting them all. I am solidly in the camp where we cannot do jack shit regards the economy, healthcare, immigration, environment or anything else, until we address our spending and budget. I'm as close to a single issue voter on that than anything else. Rich nations can innovate, can be world leaders, can do the things we all wish and hope they will do. A broke nation can't even take care of it's own people.

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Agree.

I think you have to be Keynesian to believe the Green New Deal would work. Maybe you're not there and the idea just reeks of more public spending without enough private growth. That's a reasonable belief, even if I don't share it. I respect it.

Put it this way - I'd rather invest in technology with a public good (Green New Deal) than technology without a public good (military industrial complex).

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Originally Posted by Keller

I think the Green New Deal is a pretty great idea.

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We get it, you’re woke.