Returning Paladin -Critique/Hunting advice

[Erous]

Hey all,

I've returned to Gemstone after about a 10 year hiatus and I'm sure things have changed. I think it's 10 year anyway, but I do know I left around the time Paladins became available and I swapped my warrior cleric to a Paladin. Anyway, here are my current stats:

29 Giant Paladin

Skills:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 162 62
Combat Maneuvers...................| 122 31
Two-Handed Weapons.................| 162 62
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 122 31
Physical Fitness...................| 122 31
Dodging............................| 122 31
Harness Power......................| 124 32
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 74 16
Spiritual Lore - Religion..........| 50 10
Perception.........................| 50 10
Climbing...........................| 40 8
Swimming...........................| 30 6

Stats: Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 94 (37) ... 94 (37)
Constitution (CON): 84 (27) ... 84 (27)
Dexterity (DEX): 78 (9) ... 78 (9)
Agility (AGL): 87 (13) ... 87 (13)
Discipline (DIS): 74 (12) ... 74 (12)
Aura (AUR): 67 (3) ... 67 (3)
Logic (LOG): 64 (2) ... 64 (2)
Intuition (INT): 53 (1) ... 53 (1)
Wisdom (WIS): 99 (24) ... 99 (24)
Influence (INF): 63 (11) ... 63 (11)

Where I am right now as I login I'm assuming I was hunting Troll Wraiths and Rock Troll Zombies in the Elven nations. I'm wielding a vultite maul and full vultite brigandine. I'm clearly at a loss as to what to do next or hunt next as I get myself situated so a couple of questions:

1. How do my stats and training placement look?
2. Where should I be hunting? Should I be overhunting as I am now in the Elven Nations or has time changed?

Appreciate the help. Been awhile, so I'm hoping there are others that have felt my pain :)

[Androidpk]

A lot has changed in the last 10 years and paladins just got a very nice spell overhaul. At that level range you have a bunch of options for hunting. If I recall correctly my paladin was hunting in Castle Varunar and Darkstone Castle over on the other side of the mountains.

Also check out this website too. https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page

[JackWhisper]

You're a paladin. Go to Landing, hunt storm/skeletal giants with a bonded weapon. You'll get 10 levels off them easily.

[Erous]

Awesome, thanks folks. Super excited getting back into the swing of things. My first warrior cleric permadeathed many moons ago, so trying to get this guy rolling again

[JackWhisper]

Your stats are abysmal, sadly. I don't suppose you have a 30day fixstat for being gone for 10 years?

[Erous]

Your stats are abysmal, sadly. I don't suppose you have a 30day fixstat for being gone for 10 years?

I should, otherwise I have one coming up. Any assistance you can provide Here?

[JackWhisper]

You don't get a fixstat every year. Only a fixskill.

Go into the game, check into the inn. See if you have the option to fix your stats, usually for 30 days.

[Erous]

Whelp, looks like I don't, this is all I got:

1. View your stats
2. View your skills and spells
3. Adjust Skill Goals
4. Done
21. Convert to the Monk profession.
86. Start again! (recreate your character)

[JackWhisper]

ROFL you can convert. That's just sad.

I sent you a PM with directions. I hope it helps somehow.

[Androidpk]

Unless you are planning on playing until cap and beyond your stats are fine. Besides, you can always buy a fixstat potion. Or convert to a monk, which comes with a fixstat and fixskill.

[JackWhisper]

Unless you are planning on playing until cap and beyond your stats are fine. Besides, you can always buy a fixstat potion. Or convert to a monk, which comes with a fixstat and fixskill.

DO NOT LISTEN TO HIM. MONKS ARE TERRIBLE. GOD.

[Androidpk]

DO NOT LISTEN TO HIM. MONKS ARE TERRIBLE. GOD.

Everything Jack says is a lie.

[Erous]

May need to look into the potion, or just reroll. assuming I keep my things, I wouldn't mind rerolling and starting fresh. Not sure if that's just a plain delete and recreate or how that works.

Don't think I'm interested in monk tbh but I'll read up on it.

[JackWhisper]

You can hand your items off to a F2P account mule you make. That's no big thing.

[Warriorbird]

Monks are awful. You totally might be able to push farther and get a fixstat.

[Wesley]

Your stats aren't -terrible-. They're not good by any means, but they're workable. That logic bonus on a giantman hurts me to look at, and you don't really have any stats that you designated as a sort of "growth stat", so your training points are probably going to be lacking on the whole (I tanked my CON and INF because they had good growth rates, and allowed me to allocate more for TPs overall), but unless you want to be a different race or have a different name, I wouldn't bother with remaking completely. As far as your training goes:

1. You're getting to the point where you're likely going to run into situations where you need more climb and swim. Best to get them up to 20 ranks each as you can.

2. Get yourself to 25 ranks of Spiritual Lore, religion ASAP, so you max the kneeldown effect on 1615. You're a little undertrained in lores it looks like, and as a two handed user with only 1x dodge capacity, you may be in for a rough road defense wise for a bit. You're going to want things on the ground, reliably, and fast.

3. Since you're almost there already, push yourself to 35 ranks of Multi Opponent combat, then stop training it completely for a while and dump all your points into lores for the above listed reason.

If you can manage to pull those three things off, you'll be in a much less squishy place for your run up to full plate. You've gotta be quick and reliable knocking things down before they hit you til then.

Edit:

Two more things. What is your spell situation like? Ranks and circle? Also, drop your Harness power down to 29 ranks (or don't train it anymore til 32). You're only getting 1 extra mana for each training above your level, and that's not worth it for you right now.

[Wrathbringer]

Everything Jack says is stupid, annoying and retarded.

I know!

[Erous]

Great, thanks Wesley that's what I was looking for. So I think what I'll do is reroll. I started a fresh f2p guy and figure I can do it right this time.

Suggestions on a reroll?

1. Give all my stuff to my f2p guy
2. Reroll
3. Race suggestion?
4. Stat placement for starting rolls?
5. Training
- since I have a good 2 hander I may need to skip trying to do pole arms unless I trade for one. Also throw in climbing/swinning as needed.

2x 2h
2x Armor
1x Dodge
1x CM
1x MOC
1x Paladin spells
1x harness power/Religion when needed
1x physical fitness

[Wesley]

I was able to dig up some of my old info for my Paladin at lower level. Closest I could get to yours was level 22. To be honest, it was long enough ago that I don't remember the exact reason behind everything, and it's also OHB/Board, so may not be fully applicable in your case, but in case it's helpful to you, here it is. You'll see I tanked my INF and CON stats in order for them to grow quickly and yield more training points overall by placing higher stats in slower growers. These stats are also not set for level 100. The Discipline I set is far too low, and cost me training points. Do not do that. I can't fathom why I did it, but it was years ago. I probably optimized for level 50 and figured I'd fixstat after that. I do remember that I specifically set the logic stat so it would hit a 20 bonus because I intended to forge. If you do not intend to forge, or are able to use enhancives, which weren't a thing when I made my guy I don't think, then you can go lower. You'd have to have a 100 roll to have a 20 bonus as a giantman anyway. Try to keep your bonus above 10 or so though as a rule of thumb, or you may end up kicking yourself down the line since you gain experience slowly.



Level 0 Stats for ******, Half-Elf Paladin

Strength (STR): 80
Constitution (CON): 31
Dexterity (DEX): 70
Agility (AGI): 70
Discipline (DIS): 23
Aura (AUR): 88
Logic (LOG): 93
Intuition (INT): 89
Wisdom (WIS): 91
Influence (INF): 25


Name: ****** Race: Half-Elf Profession: Paladin (shown as: Adventurer)
Gender: Male Age: 0 Expr: 566034 Level: 22
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 91 (20) ... 91 (20)
Constitution (CON): 52 (1) ... 52 (1)
Dexterity (DEX): 77 (18) ... 77 (18)
Agility (AGI): 77 (23) ... 77 (23)
Discipline (DIS): 45 (-7) ... 45 (-7)
Aura (AUR): 92 (21) ... 92 (21)
Logic (LOG): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Intuition (INT): 93 (21) ... 93 (21)
Wisdom (WIS): 98 (24) ... 98 (24)
Influence (INF): 46 (3) ... 46 (3)
Mana: 76 Silver: 52



****** (at level 22), your base skill bonuses, ranks and goals are:
Skill Name | Actual Actual
| Bonus Ranks Goals In-Game Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 148 48 48
Shield Use.........................| 148 48 48
Combat Maneuvers...................| 102 24 24
Blunt Weapons......................| 148 48 48
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 25 5 5 (30 ranks by 70)
Physical Fitness...................| 102 24 24
Harness Power......................| 96 22 22
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 102 24 24(25 bless, then religion for a bit)
Survival...........................| 102 24 24 (skin/forage)
Perception.........................| 78 17 17 (forage)
Climbing...........................| 50 10 10
Swimming...........................| 50 10 10
First Aid..........................| 78 17 17 (skin)

Spell Lists
Paladin............................| 21 21 (Pick up the next spell rank halfway through levels)

My training specifically is missing something yours needs, which is dodge. Since I went tower shield, I opted to skip dodge early on and just pump extra points into it down the line. It worked well enough for the slug up through 40 or so, and by then, you may start having some extra points to play with. My Paladin currently has no first aid or survival, and perception is set at 20 ranks. The end goal for Perception I believe should be around 30 ranks. That'll cover you for everything you'll need, but you can stay lower earlier. I don't recommend skinning/foraging. They eat up too many TPs, and you need every bit you can get early on.

You'll see I went blessings lore first rather than religion. I can't say 100% for sure why I was aiming for 25 ranks before starting religion, but I think it may have had something to do with the block breakpoint on 1609. As a non blocker, you wouldn't worry about that, so definitely pump up religion, but don't neglect blessings either. Blessings accounts for a lot of your straight DS/TD on spells, and can be very helpful. For starters, you might go with 2 religion, 1 blessing, and just continue that pattern until you hit 25 religion before catching up blessings.

Last bit...consider blunt/board early rather than two handed. Two handed is viable of course, but it's just so much easier with a shield early on. You won't have the mana to reliably use 1615/1630 until 40 or so during a hunt, and shield bash/strike are very nice, not to mention all the extra defense from using a shield.

[Wesley]

Actually, here's a more fleshed out version of where I went with training overall:



Level 0 Stats for ******, Half-Elf Paladin

Strength (STR): 80
Constitution (CON): 31
Dexterity (DEX): 70
Agility (AGI): 70
Discipline (DIS): 23
Aura (AUR): 88
Logic (LOG): 93
Intuition (INT): 89
Wisdom (WIS): 91
Influence (INF): 25


Name: ****** Race: Half-Elf Profession: Paladin (shown as: Adventurer)
Gender: Male Age: 105 Expr: 566034 Level: 37
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 98 (24) ... 98 (24)
Constitution (CON): 60 (5) ... 60 (5)
Dexterity (DEX): 82 (21) ... 82 (21)
Agility (AGI): 82 (26) ... 82 (26)
Discipline (DIS): 54 (-3) ... 54 (-3)
Aura (AUR): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Logic (LOG): 97 (23) ... 97 (23)
Intuition (INT): 96 (23) ... 96 (23)
Wisdom (WIS): 100 (25) ... 100 (25)
Influence (INF): 54 (7) ... 54 (7)
Mana: 121 Silver: 0



****** (at level 37), your base skill bonuses, ranks and goals are:
Skill Name | Actual Actual
| Bonus Ranks Goals In-Game Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 148 88 88
Shield Use.........................| 148 78 78
Combat Maneuvers...................| 102 45 45
Blunt Weapons......................| 148 78 78
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 25 30 30
Physical Fitness...................| 102 39 39
Harness Power......................| 96 37 37
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 102 27 27
Perception.........................| 78 10 10
Climbing...........................| 50 20 20
Swimming...........................| 50 20 20

Spell Lists
Paladin............................| 35 35 (Pick up the next spell rank halfway through levels)

I copied those in from my training spreadsheet since I don't have GS in front of me, so disregard the bonuses on the skill list. Didn't bother updating those. The ranks are correct though. Notable differences from above: No skinning/foraging. Overtrained Combat Maneuvers as I could. Go to 40 ranks in the Paladin spell circle, then get into Minor Spirit, aim for 30 or 35 ranks of Multi-opponent combat by 50. It'll help a lot. Overtrained in armor to get to 90 (Metal Breastplate), then going back to flat 2x. Now that shield maneuvers are a thing, I'd probably be dropping that overtrained combat maneuver back to 1x and putting extra points in blessings, spells, or getting to 35 MOC instead. CM is important, but not important enough to heavily overtrain at 40.

[Vusit]

here is my 30 dwarf paladins training, i havent had any major issues without lores.

Armor Use..........................| 190 90
Combat Maneuvers...................| 124 32
Two-Handed Weapons.................| 164 64
Physical Fitness...................| 124 32
Dodging............................| 124 32
Harness Power......................| 120 30
Perception.........................| 120 30
Climbing...........................| 50 10
Swimming...........................| 50 10

Spell Lists
Paladin............................| 29

[Androidpk]

I would personally recommend 0.5x in dodge and something close to that for CM and 2x PF. You won't have as many Cman points but one of the paladin spells gives a nice bonus to CM.

[Erous]

Okay, so looks like I have a one time fix skills. Here is the note I receive when attempting to use it

** Make sure your skills are set how you want them with GOALS before using FIXSKILLS CONFIRM **

I'm assuming I need to fire up the character manager and do a reset. What's the best use I can make of this?

[JackWhisper]

Reset your skills to what you want them to be, and then do the fixskills. It will auto-migrate.

And use it soon, because the fixskills reset happens in like a month. You get one per year.

[Erous]

Thanks. Also apparently I have a decent falchion in my locker, might be missing a shield. Is it worth it going ohe/shield?

[Androidpk]

OHE/OHB has always been incredibly viable but even more so now with shield CMs.

[Wesley]

A note - Don't forget to also set your CM goals before using your fixskills too, or you'll have to slow-migrate them.

[Erous]

Okay, here's where I'm at. Looking for feedback, as well as where I should hunt. I took a shot but may still reroll to get my bearings. Also picked up scharge and sbash as well.

Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 160 60
Shield Use.........................| 160 60
Combat Maneuvers...................| 122 31
Edged Weapons......................| 161 61
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 122 31
Physical Fitness...................| 122 31
Dodging............................| 122 31
Harness Power......................| 117 29
Spiritual Lore - Religion..........| 105 25
Perception.........................| 90 20
Climbing...........................| 90 20
Swimming...........................| 90 20

Spell Lists
Paladin............................| 25

I attempted Troll Wraiths and bats with paladin spells only and found them hitting me with some lower rolls, but my AS and spells seems to be on point. I didn't realize till I was in the car that I was missing all my council buffs. I did find though that my spell defense was horridly low with base paladin buffs, so I'll probably need to work around that

[Wesley]

Looks pretty good. Depending on the size of shield you use, you may opt to not take dodge, or 0.5x rather than 1x as Android suggested. I haven't done the exact math in years, but if you're using a tower shield, your dodge modifier is very low, and 31 ranks if taken to 0 will probably hurt your DS in offensive by something like 10. If you were to put those points taken from dodge into blessings lore and paladin spells though, you're probably going to come out at about a wash DS-wise for the time being, with the added bonus of being able to have more spells faster, high CS for hunting, and stronger spells for all those affected by lores. With that said, you DO want dodge eventually in that scenario, but personally, I think it's better to have the spells/lores first while it's not affecting you much to not have dodge, and then catch it up later.

This all assumes you're using a tower shield though. If you're using anything smaller, definitely keep the dodge.

Edit: As for hunting, at around 30 I went to Zul Lugoth and never looked back. It's spectacular for that 30-40 range or thereabouts. Few people, but quite rich, and pretty easy for a paladin.

[Erous]

Perfect. Thanks Wesley for all your help. Believe it or not I'm a partial citizen of Zul logoth so that's where I'll be.

[Lord Orbstar]

Ya...those stats will need a $130ish dollar fixstat in the later years or you can try a monk. Or just play as is for a bit!

[Erous]

Okay, following up on this. I started from scratch and got back into the swing of things. Finally titled (can't believe it's been 2 months) but things seem to be rolling along. I used a training calc to prep for lvl100 and tanked inf. There were a few paths I could go down for training, but I didn't want to sell myself short early on. I seem to be able to hunt like level or 2-3 above without issue. With full spells I can uphunt close to +8-9 critter trains up. Looking for feedback and post-title hunting advice.

Race: Dwarf
Profession: Paladin

-----
Gender: Male
Age: 0
Expr: 470281
Level: 20
-----
Norm.(Bon.) / Enh.(Bon.)
STR: 75 (22) / 75 (22)
CON: 80 (30) / 84 (32)
DEX: 83 (16) / 83 (16)
AGI: 86 (13) / 86 (13)
DIS: 68 (19) / 68 (19)
AUR: 86 (8) / 86 (8)
LOG: 82 (21) / 82 (21)
INT: 75 (12) / 75 (12)
WIS: 70 (10) / 70 (10)
INF: 38 (-16) / 38 (-16)

(at level 20), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 144 44
Shield Use.........................| 142 42
Combat Maneuvers...................| 93 21
Blunt Weapons......................| 142 42
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 93 21
Physical Fitness...................| 93 21
Harness Power......................| 82 18
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 50 10
Spiritual Lore - Religion..........| 20 4
Perception.........................| 35 7
Climbing...........................| 96 22
Swimming...........................| 96 22

Spell Lists
Paladin............................| 20

your Shield Specialization training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Tower Shield Focus tfocus 3
Shield Bash bash 2
Prop Up prop 1
Protective Wall pwall 2


Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 1
Feint feint 1
Specialization I wspec1 2
Surge of Strength surge 1

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 3

Questions:
1. Thoughts on next hunting area? Was hunting Vereri pretty solidly
2. When should I switch focus to minor spiritual?
3. Do lores look okay? I saw some back and forth discussion about blessings early on vs religion, so I went with that and focusing on religion
4. When does harness power stop providing adequate benefit to train?
5. When should I halt climbing and swimming?

[Shaps]

So looking at it - Would suggest the following:

What society are you in? These recommendations are based on GoS:

-Drop Blessings Lore
-Increase Perception to 1x
-Use points from Lores and go ahead and get to 103, then continue with Paladin circle to 1635
-Leave climb and swim at 20 ranks (will be plenty until level 40 or so) - nearing 60 I have only 30 ranks each and get around fine
-If you want lores, for an OHB/Shield use build 25 ranks Religion is best use of points for the forced kneel down

Shield ranks:
Drop Prop (you won't really need that till 45+ or so)
Flesh out your shield bash if you want another reliable disabler for mid range (it will be tougher since you are a Dwarf though)

CMANs:
Drop Focus
Drop Surge until later or only keep it at 1 rank
Try to get Feint to rank 4 or even rank 5 - best stance reducer/RT inducing maneuver available

Hunting with a Dwarf is feint, ambush leg (or 1615), ambush head. If and when you can fit in up to 40 ranks of ambush, you will notice an increased smoothness in your killing efficiency.

[Erous]

Thanks. I'm in Voln, more for RP and some other goodies than other purposes but I understand as I master it tends to come in handy. I added focus because my TD seems to be horridly low so without spirit spells I'm trying my best to ward

[Shaps]

Thanks. I'm in Voln, more for RP and some other goodies than other purposes but I understand as I master it tends to come in handy. I added focus because my TD seems to be horridly low so without spirit spells I'm trying my best to ward

Voln is a good choice to.

As for your TD, Dwarves have some of the best inherent TD defense. If at level 20 you are having issues with that, then look for outside spells. Also our TD issues get much easier when you get up to 120 and get into plate armors (-18 CvA for MBP, etc.)

[Erous]

Perfect, thanks Shaps. So I understand, maneuver and RT negation for MBP is at 70 armor use trains, correct? 90 is for spell hinderance?

[Shaps]

https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Armor_Use

70 - RT
80 - MAN
90 - Spells

[time4fun]

Your first big goal will be Hauberk. That got me by through my mid-50s, and frankly could have gotten me through my 70s and 80s easily. Some folks rush to plate, and some folks take their time. It's fine either way.

[Shaps]

If going to wear hauberk, might as well MBP though for the crit divisor and CvA. Though Hauberk does work also.

[time4fun]

If going to wear hauberk, might as well MBP though for the crit divisor and CvA. Though Hauberk does work also.

Keep in mind there are 20 armor ranks between MBP and Hauberk. That may not seem like much, but the character in question is only level 20. If they 2x in armor, that's a 10 level difference. If they 3x in armor, that's still a 7 level difference.

[Erous]

I have a set of 4x hauberk in my locker, with the above that means I'll be able to swap to Hauberk in 3 trains (50 ranks) then pickup MBP 10 trains later. That might be the route to go