Open archer vs. Whatever else

[GuildRat]

OK...here's my quandary....Right now I have a 25 train rogue that I want to be a pure picking rogue. I also want to be able to hunt him somewhat effectively. I've been thinking about just making him an open archer as opposed to an 2-hander (he hunts with my cleric).

The question I'll pose is: Will open archery offer an advantage, TP-wise, versus another build? I've taken a sword/board rogue to cap, but he's long gone.

Here is the training at 25:

Armor Use..........................| 105 25
Combat Maneuvers...................| 70 15
Two-Handed Weapons................154 54
Ambush.............................| 86 19
Physical Fitness...................| 114 28
Dodging............................| 99 23
Arcane Symbols.....................| 70 15
Harness Power......................| 15 3
Disarming Traps....................| 181 81
Picking Locks......................| 181 81
Perception.........................| 141 41
Climbing...........................| 78 17
Swimming...........................| 78 17


Thoughts on the matter are greatly appreciated.

[Cereal Killer]

Open archer will be cheaper than any other hunting route. Assuming you're not sniping, you don't need to train in cmans, hiding, or ambushing, and perception will be used towards picking boxes. The downside is maintaining ammo, your aiming ability won't be great at first, and your early armor/redux won't completely negate the nicks and scratches you're going to suffer fighting in the open.

[GuildRat]

Sounds pretty good. I'll have to look at getting a decent bow and I still have his original fixskill. The only problem is that I've never had an archer and will have to adapt to that.

All in all, it seems that if I want him to be 3x in pick and disarm, open archery is probably the best avenue.

[Palcron]

You could likely save yourself a decent number of TPs by going 2.5x in pick and disarm. You might not be able to get every box without lore, but you can always snag a 403/404 imbed to make up the difference. If you're determined to3x both, I'm sure you can make something work, but it's worth thinking about.

Or even 3x pick and 2x disarm and find fellow pickers to get any traps you can't handle.

[Jeril]

After training 3x in picking/disarm as an open archer there are still plenty of points left to pick up lores early then train in ambush for more AS, as ambush is a very cheap skill for a rogues.

[GuildRat]

Here's what I've come up with so far...............

AU- 1x until later
Ranged Weapons- 2x
Perception- 2x
C/M- 1x
Dodge- 1x
Ambush- 1x
PF- 1x will move to 2x eventually
Climbing- .75x to 50 ranks
Swimming- .75x to 50 ranks
AS- 15 ranks for now and will add more later
MIU- will add later
HP- 4 ranks
MnE- 4 spells for lores

This is the intended training path. Going on that, at the moment I have a surplus of 299 PTPs. I'm thinking I'll split them between PT and Armor unless someone has a better suggestion? I haven't used the fixskill yet because I'm trying to find a decent bow to purchase but I want to do this before the annual fixskills is available, in case I'm not happy with the build.


Name: XXXXXXX Race: Halfling Profession: Rogue (not shown)
Gender: Male Age: 0 Expr: 810669 Level: 26
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 86 (3) ... 86 (3)
Constitution (CON): 73 (21) ... 73 (21)
Dexterity (DEX): 92 (36) ... 92 (36)
Agility (AGI): 98 (34) ... 98 (34)
Discipline (DIS): 60 (0) ... 60 (0)
Aura (AUR): 85 (12) ... 85 (12)
Logic (LOG): 77 (18) ... 77 (18)
Intuition (INT): 63 (16) ... 63 (16)
Wisdom (WIS): 73 (11) ... 73 (11)
Influence (INF): 47 (-6) ... 47 (-6)


Those are the stats. I'm hoping with 509 and surge up, the low strength and him being a Halfling won't gimp him too bad.

[Whirlin]

You may want to consider bumping up to 2x Ambush, and potentially 2x dodge. CMAN can be reduced after you get Surge leveled... so that'll be more points to spend later on on more Armor/PF. So many things to train in!

Did you have lockpicking stuff trained in that build? Seems to be left off.

You can also wait on more climbing/swimming until your stats grow and you have more TP you can spend on em. I usually just grab like, 5-10 ranks at level stupid, and then pick up more ranks after stat growth post-50

[GuildRat]

You may want to consider bumping up to 2x Ambush, and potentially 2x dodge. CMAN can be reduced after you get Surge leveled... so that'll be more points to spend later on on more Armor/PF. So many things to train in!

Did you have lockpicking stuff trained in that build? Seems to be left off.

You can also wait on more climbing/swimming until your stats grow and you have more TP you can spend on em. I usually just grab like, 5-10 ranks at level stupid, and then pick up more ranks after stat growth
post-50

He's 3x in picking and disarm...kind of forgot to put that in the last post. So, I'll look at the Dodge and Ambush numbers once I find a bow and try to figure what combination is going to be the most beneficial.

[Xyl]

I know you wanna be a picker but 3x before your 50's really isnt worth it. 2x with lores you can self pick uphunting by 5 levels. It will let you get that 2x dodge or ambush maybe both.

Also 2x in armor and get into brig then let it settle to 1x or even keep it 2x until MBP. The added CVA is a must.

And if you find the points 101,102, and 103 are excellent spells to know as an archer. I dont remember but I think 102 does NOT effect ranged AS.

Also ambush before 40 is useless if your 1x.You need 40 ranks of ambush before you get +1 bonus to AS. Use the points elsewhere for now and then when your 40-50 get it to 1-2x

[GuildRat]

I know you wanna be a picker but 3x before your 50's really isnt worth it. 2x with lores you can self pick uphunting by 5 levels. It will let you get that 2x dodge or ambush maybe both.

Also 2x in armor and get into brig then let it settle to 1x or even keep it 2x until MBP. The added CVA is a must.

And if you find the points 101,102, and 103 are excellent spells to know as an archer. I dont remember but I think 102 does NOT effect ranged AS.

Also ambush before 40 is useless if your 1x.You need 40 ranks of ambush before you get +1 bonus to AS. Use the points elsewhere for now and then when your 40-50 get it to 1-2x

I use the little rogue to check boxes from Wyneb and Maaghara so my mage can pop them. He sees up to -400 traps. He hunts with a cleric binding when necessary for now and may well into the future. One day he may be self sufficient, but for now he's pretty much stuck in the role of "box checker". The reason I was looking at archery is the fact that ranged is 1/2 the TP cost of a 2-hander and uses perception, which doubles up for archery. This will free up a huge amount of TPs to use towards PT, Dodge or CM.

He hunts with a full wizard spell up and MnS. So for now, all is good in that arena.

[GuildRat]

After training 3x in picking/disarm as an open archer there are still plenty of points left to pick up lores early then train in ambush for more AS, as ambush is a very cheap skill for a rogues.

So, if I'm reading this correctly, Ambush will help with open archery AS?

[RichardCranium]

So, if I'm reading this correctly, Ambush will help with open archery AS?

It will help you aim for their eyes.

[GuildRat]

OK...cool. That's pretty much what I've read everywhere else.

[rolfard]

ambush gives +1 AS per 4 ranks AFTER 40 ranks (so 48 ranks would be +2 AS, 80 ranks is +10 AS)

[GuildRat]

Nice. I'll keep pecking away at Ambush...but still only gonna be 1-1.5x for a while.

PS...Where in the hell does one buy arrows in Illistim?

[GuildRat]

XXXXXXXX (at level 26), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 114 28
Combat Maneuvers...................| 114 28
Ranged Weapons.....................| 156 56
Ambush.............................| 142 42
Physical Fitness...................| 117 29
Dodging............................| 142 42
Arcane Symbols.....................| 70 15
Harness Power......................| 15 3
Disarming Traps....................| 184 84
Picking Locks......................| 184 84
Perception.........................| 156 56
Climbing...........................| 105 25
Swimming...........................| 105 25

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 4
Training Points: 66 Phy 0 Mnt (132 Phy converted to Mnt

So this is what I ended up with. Found a relatively cheap +22 bow, and will use e-bladed arrows until I take on the task of fletching. Have an IG friend that can probably supply master-fletched arrows at cost.

[Riltus]

Open aiming:


Aiming from the open relies solely on the Perception skill, while aiming from hiding relies on the Perception and Ambush skills.

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/The_Art_of_the_Bow_(guide)#Aiming

Ambush ranks add to both AS and DS. The DS bonus is fairly small. With 42 ranks you gain +3 DS in offensive stance and + 9 DS in defensive stance.

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/The_Art_of_the_Bow_(guide)#Bow.2FCrossbow_Parry_DS _Formula_.28vs_Melee_Attacks.29

Mark