UAF + Flaring handwraps/weapons

[SpiffyJr]

Seemed like I was getting reduced flares for holding UAC weapons so I wrote a script to test:

Grapple Flaring T1 gloves - no UAC weapons
[scalcflares: -- report]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: necrotic, swings: 100, procs: 25, percent: 25.00%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: grapple, swings: 100, procs: 20, percent: 20.00%]

Grapple Flaring T1 gloves - 1x razorpaw (regular 4x, right hand)
[scalcflares: -- report]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: grapple, swings: 100, procs: 13, percent: 13.00%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: necrotic, swings: 100, procs: 16, percent: 16.00%]

Grapple Flaring T1 gloves - 2x razorpaw (one fusion, in right hand)
[scalcflares: -- report]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: grapple, swings: 100, procs: 8, percent: 8.00%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: necrotic, swings: 100, procs: 8, percent: 8.00%]

Grapple Flaring T1 gloves - 2x razorpaw (both regular, non-fusion)
[scalcflares: -- report]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: necrotic, swings: 100, procs: 7, percent: 7.00%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: grapple, swings: 100, procs: 4, percent: 4.00%]

[Aluvius]

It was previously announced the reduced flare rate would occur with flaring UAC held weapons, but are you saying that non flaring held UAC weapons are also reducing the flare rates? I assumed you would have mentioned if the razorpaws had flares. That's messed up and shouldn't happen from my understanding of the system.

[SpiffyJr]

Yes, that's what I'm saying. It's annoying the shit out of me.

[Aluvius]

Jeez that sucks, good thing there aren't any cman's or inherent class skills like weapon bonding and such that require UAC users to hold a weap ... OH WAIT. :(

[SpiffyJr]

Erm hrm. I'm using parry mastery and razorpaws specifically to get a 1214 style parry from them.

./sadface

[Aluvius]

Well, use some with flares then if you're going to get the decreased flare chance you might as well get the flares from them. Although I don't think its supposed to work like this without flares, so maybe you can get someone to stealth fix them heh.

[Riltus]

Well, use some with flares then if you're going to get the decreased flare chance you might as well get the flares from them. Although I don't think its supposed to work like this without flares, so maybe you can get someone to stealth fix them heh.

UCS brawling weapons, when used with UCS attack commands, aren't classified as weapons. They are handheld pieces of equipment that may be enhanced with special properties (flares, weighting etc.). But the system (UNARMED COMBAT), as designed by Finros, discourages the use of weapons by balancing any bonuses added to these items with offsetting penalties. For example, e-bladed gloves will have a randomized flare rate of 20%. If you were to add two e-bladed flaring weapons, the overall flare rate remains at 20%. Each weapon flares randomly an average of 1 per 15 attacks.

The flare rate (R) for UCS attacks is (R1 + R2 + R3)/N where R1/R2/R3 represent the rates for each item and (N) is the number of pieces of equipment used. With 20% flaring handwraps and 2 non-flaring razorpaws the random flare rate is (20 + 0 + 0)/3 = 6.66%. From the first example the rate is (20 + 20 + 20)/3 = 20%

Per Finros:


For clarity, here are the full rules for unarmed equipment. These rules only consider equipment that is actually used in the attack -- if a held weapon isn't a part of the unarmed attack, it isn't considered in these rules.

AS/UAF: - Gloves and boots confer their full UAF bonus in all circumstances. - A single held piece of equipment contributes half of its AS bonus to UAF. - Two held pieces of equipment contribute half of the average of their AS bonus, to UAF.

Weighting: - Weighted gloves confer their full bonus when used alone. - Weighted gloves confer half their bonus when used with one or two held weapons. - A single weighted weapon confers half its bonus regardless of glove usage. - A single weighted weapon used in conjunction with a second weapon of any sort confers one quarter of its bonus regardless of glove usage (and this applies to each weapon individually -- so two weighted weapons will provide a quarter of their bonus each).

Flares and other scripted special abilities: - Each piece of equipment has a 1-in-N chance of activating on any given attack, where N is the number of pieces of equipment used in the attack. Some aspects (such as charge depletion of a blessed weapon) happen with every attack.


He never stated that only flaring items would be included in N.

Also, there is a conservation of charges with e-bladed items.

Example:

E-bladed handwraps: 100 swings
E-bladed razorpaw (2 ea.): 100 swings per

Total number of attacks before charge depletion will average 300, since each item will consume a charge an average of 1 per 3 attacks.

Mark

[SpiffyJr]

If he responds and that's the issue then I'll just cry a little but be okay with it. It's really unfortunate, though, because in order to activate parry as a non-monk I have to have weapons. Likewise, most combat maneuvers require the usage of weapons. It also means I have to ensorcell all my gear in order to get any sort of ensorcell benefit.

[Aluvius]

Yeah I just assumed that non flaring UAC weapons would not change the flare rate of handwraps. You're right, it was never explicitly stated that way, huh. That's even crappier than I had thought at first. :)

[SpiffyJr]

Here's my flare rate with two flaring pain grips and my 5x grapple gloves.



[scalcflares: -- report]
[scalcflares: -- item: vultite paingrip, flare: fire, swings: 377, procs: 31, percent: 8.22%]
[scalcflares: -- item: vultite paingrip, flare: vibe, swings: 377, procs: 32, percent: 8.49%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: necrotic, swings: 377, procs: 29, percent: 7.69%]
[scalcflares: -- item: myklian gloves, flare: grapple, swings: 377, procs: 22, percent: 5.84%]


So, out of 377 swings I've had (31 + 32 + 22) procs which is: 22.5% proc rate which is actually a bit higher than the flare proc rate I was getting from gloves alone. The downside, of course, is requiring three flaring UAC weapons (pretty much non-existent) and in order to get any use from my ensorcell I'd have to ensorcell three pieces of gear instead of one. I also have shitty vibe/fire flares instead of always having the badass grapple flares.

Utter bullshit. I hope my bitching will get it changed but I'm not going to hold my breath.

[SpiffyJr]

1/n was confirmed by Finros regardless of the properties of the weapon. A shitty situation that's unlikely to change. My only guess for him doing a blanket reduction like this is the potential technical difficulty in detecting weapon properties.

[SpiffyJr]

It is a design decision, not a technical issue. Weapons are intentionally discouraged in unarmed combat; barring a weapon of exceptional abilities, you should be better off mechanically when not using one. - Finros

[Aluvius]

Shitty vibe/fire flares? <splutters> :)

[SpiffyJr]

Heh, shitty compared to grapple!