Army Veteran, congressional candidate rejects GOP extremism, switches to Democrat

[4a6c1]

.

[kutter]

His feigned outrage at what are traditional political moves is hysterical. Did he rail against the Dems when they added pork to the CR giving hundreds of thousands of dollar's to the widow of one of the wealthiest senators amongst other things? He was just a RINO and is now showing his true colours.

He should be made to give back every penny he raised as a Repub and start over.

[Tgo01]

Everyone is wondering about the divide within the Republican party. Maybe a sign of things to come?

Everything is fine, calm down. People switch parties all the time.

[Taernath]

Everything is fine, calm down. People switch parties all the time.

It's totally different this time.

[zzentar]

Wait wut??? A party used super majority status to ramrod a law the public didn't want?

I see no correlation here at all.

~Zz

[Latrinsorm]

His feigned outrage at what are traditional political moves is hysterical. Did he rail against the Dems when they added pork to the CR giving hundreds of thousands of dollar's to the widow of one of the wealthiest senators amongst other things?...why would he? He didn't list Republican pork as an issue, and it didn't seem like he was holding back.

[cwolff]

And he's not the only one.

Tom Ridge just dissed the far right when speaking to Log Cabin republicans, Charlie Crist has switched to the Democratic party (he got shunned for hugging Obama at an event in Florida), Chris Christie was called RINO for working with Obama 1 year ago and even his victory in NJ was met with a tepid GOP congratulations and two other republican (Karl Rove and former congressman Tourette) have PAC's aimed squarely at the Tea Baggers.

Finally we might see some common sense come back to the GOP.

[cwolff]

This guy really hits the nail on the head when describing what we're up against. The far right has gone too far and hopefully they've had a wake up call. The 2014 elections should be very interesting in determining who's going to control that side of the aisle.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/10/inquiring-minds-jonathan-haidt-tea-party


As a self-described centrist, Haidt sometimes draws ire from the left for comments about how liberals don't understand their opponents, and about how conservatives have a broader range of moral emotions. But he certainly doesn't claim that when it comes to political animosity and the polarization that we now live under, both sides are equally to blame. "The rage on the Republican side is stronger, the Republicans have gotten much more extreme than the Democrats have," Haidt says.

The data on polarization are as clear as they are disturbing. Overall, feelings of warmth towards members of the opposite party are at terrifying lows, and Congress is perhaps more polarized than it has been in the entire period following the Civil War:


But this situation isn't the result of parallel changes on both sides of the aisle. "The Democrats, the number of centrists has shrunk a bit, the number of conservative Democrats has shrunk a bit, but it's not that dramatic, and the Democratic party, certainly in Congress, is a mix of centrists, moderately liberal and very liberal people," says Haidt. "Whereas the Republicans went from being overwhelmingly centrist in the '50s and '60s, to having almost no centrists," Haidt says.

And of course, the extremes are the most morally driven, the most intense.

From the centrist perspective, Haidt recently tweeted that "I hope the Republican party breaks up and a new party forms based on growth, not austerity or the past."

[Gelston]

Changing parties is nothing new, especially for people running for office. He is just trying to get free publicity.

[Latrinsorm]

Haidt? or... Hadit? al-Hadith???

[kutter]

While I'm not familiar with what you consider to be a "Real" republican (anti-abortion, anti-gay, anti-anything Obama?) Thigpen has written for greater institutional support of all things military, including national defense, he's fiscally conservative and heavy on family life and constitutional rights which are both traditionally under the purview of the Republican party. If conservatives like Thigpen are switching sides, consider for a moment that your statement about his "true colors" might be an example of the extremism he's concerned about.

If what you say about him being a true conservative on fiscal issues is true then he could never be a democrat, if he was sincere then he would have become a libertarian, but he is not sincere in his pursuits, he wants to be a politician, so as we see every day, he will say, and do anything and everything to get elected and keep getting re-elected.

The problem with most pundits on here is that you are still operating under the false premise that elected officials are honorable. Case in point, Mary Landrieu. she supported democare whole hog when it was being debated, went lock and step and forced it through never voicing an ounce of opposition, now she is running from it as fast as she can.

They are all pieces of shit and should be shot in the head and the bodies piled in the streets.

Bring on the unsigned neg reps you sheeple.

[Jarvan]

This guy really hits the nail on the head when describing what we're up against. The far right has gone too far and hopefully they've had a wake up call. The 2014 elections should be very interesting in determining who's going to control that side of the aisle.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/10/inquiring-minds-jonathan-haidt-tea-party

Question, is it possible for the Far Left to go to far?

[Latrinsorm]

The problem with most pundits on here is that you are still operating under the false premise that elected officials are honorable.Can you cite any person saying that?

[Gelston]

Can you cite any person saying that?

I can cite Kutter saying that.

[Latrinsorm]

Curses! Foiled again!

[Shaps]

What is essentially wrong with his argument is.... the Democrats shut the government down, not the Republicans.

Republicans offered to fund the whole Government, EXCEPT for Obamacare, because they knew what a shit piece of legislation it was for the American people. The Democrats said F U America, and the media bias placed the blame at the Republicans.

Funny now though, because Democrats are now calling for what the Republicans were fighting for in the first place... postponing Obamacare and changing it. Funny how politics work huh.

[Warriorbird]

What is essentially wrong with his argument is.... the Democrats shut the government down, not the Republicans.

Republicans offered to fund the whole Government, EXCEPT for Obamacare, because they knew what a shit piece of legislation it was for the American people. The Democrats said F U America, and the media bias placed the blame at the Republicans.

Funny now though, because Democrats are now calling for what the Republicans were fighting for in the first place... postponing Obamacare and changing it. Funny how politics work huh.

For some reason this line of argument didn't really catch on with America, given as Ted Cruz went on a little self promotion for the Presidency run and was pretty public about his plan to shut the government down.

[cwolff]

What is essentially wrong with his argument is.... the Democrats shut the government down, not the Republicans.

Republicans offered to fund the whole Government, EXCEPT for Obamacare, because they knew what a shit piece of legislation it was for the American people. The Democrats said F U America, and the media bias placed the blame at the Republicans.

Funny now though, because Democrats are now calling for what the Republicans were fighting for in the first place... postponing Obamacare and changing it. Funny how politics work huh.

These folks might not agree with you.


Rep. Tom Cole (R-OK): Asked on MSNBC on Monday if a shutdown was “going to hurt the Republicans,” Cole said, “I do, but more importantly I think it’s going to hurt the American people.”
Rep. Charlie Dent (R-PA): “I’m prepared to vote for a clean resolution tomorrow… It’s time to govern. I don’t intend to support a fool’s errand at this point.”
Rep. Rodney Frelinghuysen (R-NJ): “Obamacare is definitely not ready for prime time. But I do not want the government to shut down. I think after voting against it some 40 times, we have represented our constituents and made our point.”
Rep. Chris Gibson (R-NY): “From my perspective, the desired end state remains the same — a delay of the Affordable Care Act/Obamacare and a temporary lifting of the sequester — both to January 2015… However, we need a successful strategy to get that implemented, and this approach will not do it.”
Rep. Michael Grimm (R-NY): “The circus created the past few days isn’t reflective of mainstream Republicans — it projects an image of not being reasonable. The vast majority of Republicans are pretty level-headed and are here to govern.”
Rep. Richard Hanna (R-NY): “[A]s a lifelong and consistent supporter of women’s rights and health care, I do not support addressing divisive social issues such as access to birth control on a last-minute continuing resolution.’’
Rep. Peter King (R-NY): “We should not be closing down the government under any circumstances… That doesn’t work, it’s wrong, and, you know, Obamacare passed. We have to try to defund it, we have to try to find ways to repeal it. But the fact is, we shouldn’t be using it as a threat to shut down the government.”
Rep. Devin Nunes (R-CA): “We’re pretty much out of options at this point. They’re all giddy about it. You know who benefits the most here from a shutdown? The Democrats benefit and they know that.”
Rep. Tom Rooney (R-FL): “The shutdown doesn’t do anything to help our reputation as an incompetent Congress,.. People hire us not to get to this point in the first place.”
Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI): “We have to stay on the right side of public opinion… Shutting down the government puts us on the wrong side. The fight is on the debt limit.”
Rep. Frank Wolf (R-VA): Wolf warned that his party will be blamed in the case of a shutdown. “That’s the battle that’s going on in my party. There are some that are saying, ‘shut it down! … If we shut the government down, who’s going to fund the [Veteran Affairs] Hospital? Who’s going to fund the veteran who doesn’t have a leg? Who’s going to fund the FBI who’s working on a counter-terrorism case? Who’s going to fund cancer research?”
The Republican Senators
Sen. Kelly Ayotte (R-NH): “I think we should make every effort we can to make sure we stop this law but I don’t believe they should shut down the government to do so, and I don’t think that is a strategy that is good for America.”
Sen. John Boozman (R-AR): “I don’t think this is the battlefield where it needs to be fought”
Sen. Richard Burr (R-NC): “I think it’s the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard… as long as Barack Obama is president the Affordable Care Act is gonna be law. I think some of these guys need to understand that if you shut down the federal government, you better have a specific reason to do it that’s achievable.”
Sen. Saxby Chambliss (R-GA): ” I’d love to [defund Obamacare] too. But shutting down the government and playing into the hands of the president politically is not the right thing to do. Plus, it’s going to do great harm to the American people if we pursue that course. We’ve been there. It didn’t work.”
Sen. Dan Coats (R-IN): “Here’s the hard truth: President Obama will not overturn his signature legislation so long as he is president and the Democrats have control of the Senate. Along with these political realities, refusing to pass legislation to keep the government funded will not stop Obamacare from going into effect.”
Sen. Tom Coburn (R-OK): “It’s not an achievable strategy. It’s creating the false impression that you can do something when you can’t. And it’s dishonest.”
Sen. Susan Collins (R-ME): As the New York Times reported on Monday, “Senator Susan Collins of Maine became the latest Republican to criticize her House colleagues, saying on Sunday that an effort to link the health care amendments to the budget was ‘a strategy that cannot possibly work.’”
Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN): The Washington Post reports that Corker compared shutting down the government to a way that buffalo were slaughtered in the Old West: “I know when you get led into a box canyon what that means… Box canyon, here we come.”
Sen. John Cornyn (R-TX): “[W]e’re at the point now where we can’t shut down the government. It’s like burning down the house to get rid of the mice or rats… I don’t think very many think that a government shutdown is in the best interests of the economy and will actually accomplish the goal that’s set out.”
Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-UT): “My personal belief is the only way to get rid of Obamacare is to be intelligent and smart about it and gradually just work on it, work it through… to expect the government to shut down is not the way to do it.”
Sen. Mark Kirk (R-IL): “I am one of those who says, let’s not shut down the government just because you don’t get everything you want… That is an overwriting of our mandate. I think that our mandate was to not raise taxes, which we have succeeded in achieving.”
Sen. John McCain (R-AZ): “In the United States Senate, we will not repeal, or defund, Obamacare. We will not. And to think we can is not rational.”
Sen. Rob Portman (R-OH): “I do think we need to deal with the underlying problem of overspending and we have to deal with the problem of Obamacare, but those ought to be handled outside of the context of a government shutdown.”
Sen. Jim Risch (R-ID): “There isn’t anybody that thinks that Obamacare is going to get defunded. It cannot happen…. We were elected to govern – you don’t govern by shutting down the government.”
Sen. Richard Shelby (R-AL): “[I]t’s foolish.”
Sen. Pat Toomey (R-PA): “I’m totally in favor of the goal, but this vehicle isn’t going to achieve it.”
The Governors
Gov. Robert Bentley (R-AL): “I don’t believe we need to shut down government… I’m not being critical of our congressmen. I know they are trying to take a stand. But we don’t need to turn the tide of public opinion against us.”
Gov. Phil Bryant (R-MS): “Many of the members of this party do not want to fund Obamacare, but what we have to do as governors who work with our legislators is realize the reality of being able to get something passed.”
Gov. Chris Christie (R-NJ): “I think there’s got to be a solution other than that. And I don’t think that we should be doing that. I don’t think — and I quite frankly, be fair, I don’t think you hear responsible Republican leaders advocating a shutdown of the government.”
Gov. Jack Dalrymple (R-ND): “I’ve never felt that shutting down government function is a wise thing to do politically because I think, whoever is involved in it, it’s the Congress, regardless of what party they’re affiliated with, that will be blamed by the public… And so, to me, I don’t see what it accomplishes.”
Gov. Bob McDonnell (R-VA):”[A]t this point it is the law and we are going to implement it in a way that is least offensive and harmful to the state of Virginia… I don’t think we should shut government down over this. We need to keep fighting through the process.”
Gov. Scott Walker (R-WI): “I believe the Affordable Care Act is anything but affordable, and will have a negative impact on the economy of my state… But I don’t extend that to the point that we should shut down the government over it.”
The Old-School Conservatives
Former Sen. Bob Bennett (R-UT): Bennett penned an op-ed recounting his own experience with a shutdown back in the 90s. “There’s a lesson here for those who think that shutting down the government will force President Obama’s hand on Obamacare,” Bennett concluded. “The best way to help him put that aside and regain his stature as a leader would be to give him an opportunity similar to the one Gingrich gave Clinton… I’ve seen this movie before, and I know how it comes out.”
Sec. of Defense and former Sen. Chuck Hagel (R) “This is an astoundingly irresponsible way to govern.”
Former Utah Gov. John Huntsman (R): “Republicans know it is a loser for them.”
Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush: “So as we get closer to these deadlines, there needs to be an understanding of that, or politically it’s quite dicey for the Republican Party.”
Bruce Josten of the U.S. Chamber Of Commerce: “It is not in the best interest of the U.S. business community or the American people to risk even a brief government shutdown that might trigger disruptive consequences or raise new policy uncertainties washing over the U.S. economy.”
Former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney: “We’re more effective tactically not to use a shutdown of some kind to pursue the … anti-Obamacare objective. I don’t think that will be as effective.”
The Conservative Pundits
Matt Dowd: “Everybody is going to lose when the government shuts down. Nobody is going to think better about either party,” Dowd warned. “Republicans will lose more in the course of this if this continues over time.”
David Frum: “All in all, it’s hard to see any positive outcome emerging for Republicans from this confrontation. Yet the party is charging forward anyway…. Even when pressed to do something overwhelmingly likely to end in disaster, as this shutdown looks likely to do for Republicans, the party has no way to stop itself. It stumbles into fights it cannot win, gets mad, and then in its anger lurches into yet another fight that ends in yet another loss.”
Doug Holtz-Eakin: Holtz-Eakin says that Republicans have “put themselves in a corner” and that their strategy won’t work. “The public budget debate has been hijacked by a vociferous minority of activist conservatives aligned with a number of outside activist groups led by the likes of Sen. Ted Cruz and former Sen. Jim DeMint,” he wrote in an op-ed against the shutdown approach.
Charles Krauthammer: Krauthammer deemed his fellow GOPer’s approach to defunding Obamacare misguided, going so far as to call them the “suicide caucus.”
Matt Lewis: “[T]he defund scheme is (unfortunately) absurd,” Lewis wrote, arguing that it “cannot end well.”
Rich Lowry: “The strategy seems tantamount to believing that if Republican politicians clicked their wing tips together and wished it so, President Barack Obama would collapse in a heap and surrender on his party’s most cherished accomplishment.”
Bill O’Reilly: On his show on FOX, O’Reilly warned against anti-Obamacare “hysteria” and told Republicans not to shut down the government, or “Washington would become Detroit, a place completely out of control.”
Karl Rove: “It’s an iron law that Republicans get blamed for any government shutdown, no matter who controls the White House or Congress.”
Nicolle Wallace: A former spokesman for President Bush, Wallace compared the radical wing of the GOP that’s moving toward a shutdown to a two year old trying to run a red light on a scooter. “When Republicans run into the street despite the fact there’s a flashing red light,” she said on MSNBC’s Morning Joe, “they’re gonna get hit by the cars and killed.”
George Will: In a piece titled “Shutdown would hand president more excuses,” Will excoriated Republicans for drumming up drama that will win them no victories. ” Republicans should vote,” he wrote, “more in sorrow than in anger, to fund the government (at sequester levels, a significant victory) and to increase the debt ceiling. ”

[Latrinsorm]

Your mistake, cwolff, is assuming R stands for Republican. It actually stands for RINO (whenever doing so would be convenient for making a point).

[Shaps]

Ted Cruz did what he said he would do, and what his constituents wanted him to do. Defund Obamacare. All the others are only worried about their re-elections, and will say whatever.

Unfortunately the American people are such idiots they believe the rhetoric, instead of actually examining what occurs.

Sadly the only truth seems to be what the low information voter (I would call them stupid, but that might not be PC in today's culture) understands.

I've said it before.. there were some good parts to the ACA.. but to allow it to go into effect with all of it's shortcomings.. was pure political bullshit.. and now all of the citizentry pays the price. All because Obama didn't want to listen to anyone else.

Anyone find it ironic that Reid and Pelosi are suddenly no where to be found? They are f'in scam artists that have fooled their constituents for so long it's absurd.

[Shaps]

And if you actually read the comments from those that you posted.. most of them are politically based. No where do they really address what is best for all of us.

"We know this law is horrible.. we know it will hurt the populous.. we know it is not the right thing to do.. BUT, whatever.. it might hurt our re-election and the Republican party name.. so let's just let it happen"

Roll over and play dead and let the other group just ram something down your throat because they call you bad names. There is no integrity left whatsoever.

[cwolff]

There is no integrity left whatsoever.

Integrity is not shutting down the gov't on a fool's errand. The party of fiscal responsibility just put 20 (or more) billions dollars in a hole and lit it on fire and for what? NOTHING


Ted Cruz did what he said he would do, and what his constituents wanted him to do. Defund Obamacare. All the others are only worried about their re-elections, and will say whatever.

Unfortunately the American people are such idiots they believe the rhetoric, instead of actually examining what occurs.

Sadly the only truth seems to be what the low information voter (I would call them stupid, but that might not be PC in today's culture) understands.

I've said it before.. there were some good parts to the ACA.. but to allow it to go into effect with all of it's shortcomings.. was pure political bullshit.. and now all of the citizentry pays the price. All because Obama didn't want to listen to anyone else.

Anyone find it ironic that Reid and Pelosi are suddenly no where to be found? They are f'in scam artists that have fooled their constituents for so long it's absurd.

A) He did not defund ACA. He's just another one of those lying politicians!!
B) Now are you admitting the GOP caused the shutdown? Isn't that what they said they would do?

[Latrinsorm]

"Cruz even voted to advance the bill he was symbolically filibustering, joining a 100-to-0 vote to take up the spending bill." Source: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ted-cruz-filibuster-talks-21-hours-votes-house-bill-article-1.1467344#ixzz2kGTHEgUa

This is your guy? I don't know, bro.

[Tgo01]

"Cruz even voted to advance the bill he was symbolically filibustering, joining a 100-to-0 vote to take up the spending bill." Source: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ted-cruz-filibuster-talks-21-hours-votes-house-bill-article-1.1467344#ixzz2kGTHEgUa

This is your guy? I don't know, bro.

You just hate him because he's Cuban. You racist.

[Shaps]

Cwolff,
They did not shut it down.. they proposed a bill to fund the ENTIRE government, except for the ACA, because... the numerous problems of the ACA and how it would impact the people. "OBAMA said hell no!, I won't fund the whole government, unless you let my law pass". That is what happened. So Obama I guess is smoking $100's while he plays golf and let 20 (or more) billion go up in smoke... all to implement a sorely messed up law.

A) I was shorthanding it.. Ted Cruz ran on the platform of defunding/delaying Obamacare. He went to Washington and tried everything in his power to accomplish that. Did he succeed, of course not. Did he do what he said he would, and what his constituents wanted? Yes he did.

B) Where at all am I implying the GOP caused the shutdown? I said to allow the ACA to go into effect was pure political bullshit. I don't care what party you are, I care about what our representatives do.

There are a few indisputable facts though when it comes to this whole thing:
1. Not one Republican has voted for this law in over 4 years
2. Some Republicans did all they could to stop this law from going into effect
3. The President allowed the Government (actually only 17% of it-and they all got backpay) to be shutdown, all because he wanted his "signature law" to go into effect - EVEN THOUGH it's completely flawed right now and hurts the people.. that is you and I.

This is not about party lines or anything anymore... we have a President... who for politcal gain allowed a law to go into effect even though he knew it was not ready (the infrastructure to effectively or securely run it) for us all.

If you can't see that.. when the evidence is right in front of you.. /shrug.

Take away all party affiliation.. take away all the names.. take away all of the rhetoric and think of it from a business standpoint.

If you hired someone to create a product for your business. That product was:
1. Late
2. Full of bugs
3. Not secure
4. Overbudget

Now you the business owner had for the past year, spent tons of money on advertising this new wonderful product you were going to release, so on 1 DEC, you begin to sell it... KNOWING it still has all of the problems mentioned above:
1. You told people you would sell it for $100... now you are charging $300
2. It has all the bugs in it, but you tell people sorry, no refunds
3. It's not secure, so people that have put stuff in your product, are now susceptible to scam artists/fraud

Would this make sense on any level?? No it wouldn't. But for some reason people keep defending the ACA. I have no idea why, but from a purely practical standpoint, there is no way to defend how this was done what-so-ever.

We put people in prison for business practices like that. Just not our politicians.

[Thondalar]

Cwolff,
They did not shut it down.. they proposed a bill to fund the ENTIRE government, except for the ACA, because... the numerous problems of the ACA and how it would impact the people. "OBAMA said hell no!, I won't fund the whole government, unless you let my law pass". That is what happened. So Obama I guess is smoking $100's while he plays golf and let 20 (or more) billion go up in smoke... all to implement a sorely messed up law.

A) I was shorthanding it.. Ted Cruz ran on the platform of defunding/delaying Obamacare. He went to Washington and tried everything in his power to accomplish that. Did he succeed, of course not. Did he do what he said he would, and what his constituents wanted? Yes he did.

B) Where at all am I implying the GOP caused the shutdown? I said to allow the ACA to go into effect was pure political bullshit. I don't care what party you are, I care about what our representatives do.

There are a few indisputable facts though when it comes to this whole thing:
1. Not one Republican has voted for this law in over 4 years
2. Some Republicans did all they could to stop this law from going into effect
3. The President allowed the Government (actually only 17% of it-and they all got backpay) to be shutdown, all because he wanted his "signature law" to go into effect - EVEN THOUGH it's completely flawed right now and hurts the people.. that is you and I.

This is not about party lines or anything anymore... we have a President... who for politcal gain allowed a law to go into effect even though he knew it was not ready (the infrastructure to effectively or securely run it) for us all.

If you can't see that.. when the evidence is right in front of you.. /shrug.

Take away all party affiliation.. take away all the names.. take away all of the rhetoric and think of it from a business standpoint.

If you hired someone to create a product for your business. That product was:
1. Late
2. Full of bugs
3. Not secure
4. Overbudget

Now you the business owner had for the past year, spent tons of money on advertising this new wonderful product you were going to release, so on 1 DEC, you begin to sell it... KNOWING it still has all of the problems mentioned above:
1. You told people you would sell it for $100... now you are charging $300
2. It has all the bugs in it, but you tell people sorry, no refunds
3. It's not secure, so people that have put stuff in your product, are now susceptible to scam artists/fraud

Would this make sense on any level?? No it wouldn't. But for some reason people keep defending the ACA. I have no idea why, but from a purely practical standpoint, there is no way to defend how this was done what-so-ever.

We put people in prison for business practices like that. Just not our politicians.

The problem with this is we can't run the government like a business. It would totally not work or make any sense.

I'm really not sure why, but Latrin can probably tell you.

[Shaps]

"Cruz even voted to advance the bill he was symbolically filibustering, joining a 100-to-0 vote to take up the spending bill." Source: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ted-cruz-filibuster-talks-21-hours-votes-house-bill-article-1.1467344#ixzz2kGTHEgUa

This is your guy? I don't know, bro.

He voted to allow the bill to be VOTED ON. So he said, sure.. I've made my case. Others have proposed a bill. Let the bill be voted on.

That is much different than what Reid does... and simply shelves laws/amendments sent to him. Reid won't even allow the peoples representatives to VOTE on something. Whether that vote would go in his favor or not... He simply won't allow anyone to vote on it. (insert sarcasm) - That's real democracy there.

[Latrinsorm]

You just hate him because he's Cuban. You racist.Did I call him Cuban Pete, the king of the rumba beat? No! Boom chicky boom, boom chicky boom, boom chicky boom. I win.
"OBAMA said hell no!, I won't fund the whole government, unless you let my law pass".The law already passed. I don't know how you can blame Obama for the shutdown when the Republican Congresspersons blame themselves.
Would this make sense on any level??Have you played a video game in the past 10 years?
He voted to allow the bill to be VOTED ON.Then he didn't do everything in his power to stop it. The guy was transparently grandstanding, that's really all there is to it.
The problem with this is we can't run the government like a business. It would totally not work or make any sense.

I'm really not sure why, but Latrin can probably tell you.The government has a higher calling than profitability, and it is simply not profitable to be ethical. I am sure you are aware of the theory that the free market will reward businesses for doing so, and I am also sure you are aware of the "enormous amount of historical evidence" we can draw on to see how comically naïve that theory is.

[cwolff]

Well Shaps, I don't think the picture is nearly as grim as you've painted. I also don't expect laws to come out of congress and run perfectly. This one has been something of a clusterfuck with the technology and all, but the law itself is sound. If we need to make changes in the future we can. The only real problem with ACA is that it's become a very HOT topic for partisan politics.

Since it's been so partisan it's been very tough to work on this thing. Obama said he was going to do this before he was elected, then he did it. It's been the law for 3 years. In that time the right keeps trying to kill it with symbolic do-nothing votes (40+) to repeal it, ran against this in the most recent presidential election (and lost), refused to enact any of the measures in some GOP led states based on the idea that they would repeal it, challenged it in the Supreme Court and lost and then shut down the government to defund it. Ironically, the states that need this the most, are the ones who are fighting it the hardest. In any case, the time when the GOP should have been working on fixing it, they were more interested in ignoring it. It's the same reason why we have medical device tax. That industry didn't negotiate like pharma did. Maybe they thought it'd be repealed too.

The bottom line is this. Americans have voted, not with their checkbooks, but with their votes. We, the people, have asked for it. Not all of us, but that's the way the cookie crumbles in our republic. The GOP has been working against the will of the people in this matter and are doing everything they possibly can to tank it. The right is subverting the democratic process. Speaking of which...we'd not have had a shutdown if the GOP didn't fiddle fuck with the CR and say that only the Speaker or his designated rep. can call a vote on this matter.

Something needs to be done with healthcare in this country. Everyone who matters, agrees on that. ACA is the first step. Is it perfect, NO. So what. Nothing's perfect but we can work it out. If the republicans get their shit together they can win enough elections to make the changes they want.

It's high time to quit bitching about ACA and rooting against America. This issue is dead. ACA is law and it's going forward.