Bard renewal calculation data

[Tgo01]

We need your help! If you have a bard that is at least level 6 then please download and run the script bard-renewal-test and post the results in this thread, I'll be adding in all of the entries to this first post here.


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Version F
Number of songs: 5
Race: Elf
Level: 31
Bard spell ranks: 19
DIS stat: 93
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 65
LOG bonus: 7
Offset: 30
******************************


******************************
Version F
Number of songs: 7
Race: Halfling
Level: 62
Bard spell ranks: 59
DIS stat: 73
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 74
LOG bonus: 17
Offset: 52
******************************



******************************
Version G
Number of songs: 8
Race: Dark Elf
Level: 76
Bard spell ranks: 76
DIS stat: 96
DIS bonus: 13
LOG stat: 97
LOG bonus: 23
Offset: 64
******************************

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 8
Race: Dark Elf
Level: 77
Bard spell ranks: 76
DIS stat: 97
DIS bonus: 13
LOG stat: 97
LOG bonus: 23
Offset: 64
******************************


******************************
Version G
Number of songs: 9
Race: Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 101
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 102
LOG bonus: 26
Offset: 76
******************************



Entry 1
Version G
Number of songs: 8
Race: Half-Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 80
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 20
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 25
Offset: 68

Entry 2
Version G
Number of songs: 6
Race: Elf
Level: 43
Bard spell ranks: 44
DIS stat: 93
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 93
LOG bonus: 21
Offset: 45

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Elf
Level: 15
Bard spell ranks: 15
DIS stat: 89
DIS bonus: 4
LOG stat: 89
LOG bonus: 19
Offset: 30


******************************
Version G
Number of songs: 10
Race: Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 118
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 25
Offset: 84
******************************



Version G
Number of songs: 8
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 98
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 71

Your multisong renewal offset is higher than can be tested with your current known songs. Your renewal is at least 12
Version G
Number of songs: 3
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 6
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: At least 12

Version G
Number of songs: 4
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 9
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 23

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 11
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 27

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 13
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 28

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 14
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 29

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 16
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 30


******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Human
Level: 23
Bard spell ranks: 19
DIS stat: 62
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 42
LOG bonus: 1
Offset: 29
******************************


******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 6
Race: Giantman
Level: 34
Bard spell ranks: 34
DIS stat: 88
DIS bonus: 19
LOG stat: 92
LOG bonus: 16
Offset: 44
******************************

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 10
Race: Giantman
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 121
DIS stat: 91
DIS bonus: 20
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 20
Offset: 88
******************************


******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Aelotoi
Level: 20
Bard spell ranks: 20
DIS stat: 61
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 45
LOG bonus: 3
Offset: 31
******************************


******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Elf
Level: 54
Bard spell ranks: 25
DIS stat: 86
DIS bonus: 3
LOG stat: 86
LOG bonus: 18
Offset: 34
******************************


******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Half-Elf
Level: 32
Bard spell ranks: 20
DIS stat: 71
DIS bonus: 5
LOG stat: 48
LOG bonus: -1
Offset: 29
******************************

[Xaerve]

******************************
Version G
Number of songs: 9
Race: Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 101
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 102
LOG bonus: 26
Offset: 76
******************************

[MrMortimur]

No change from version A and G but posted anyhow to keep the results in the same format.


Entry 1
Version G
Number of songs: 8
Race: Half-Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 80
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 20
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 25
Offset: 68

Entry 2
Version G
Number of songs: 6
Race: Elf
Level: 43
Bard spell ranks: 44
DIS stat: 93
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 93
LOG bonus: 21
Offset: 45

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Elf
Level: 15
Bard spell ranks: 15
DIS stat: 89
DIS bonus: 4
LOG stat: 89
LOG bonus: 19
Offset: 30

[Buckwheet]

******************************
Version G
Number of songs: 10
Race: Elf
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 118
DIS stat: 100
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 25
Offset: 84
******************************

[Tgo01]

Version G
Number of songs: 8
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 98
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 71

Your multisong renewal offset is higher than can be tested with your current known songs. Your renewal is at least 12
Version G
Number of songs: 3
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 6
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: At least 12

Version G
Number of songs: 4
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 9
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 23

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 11
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 27

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 13
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 28

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 14
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 29

Version G
Number of songs: 5
Race: Giantman
Level: 47
Bard spell ranks: 16
DIS stat: 80
DIS bonus: 15
LOG stat: 51
LOG bonus: -5
Offset: 30

I even double checked the script's math for these entries, including the ones bolded. So it seems like you get 1 offset every 2 bard ranks but something seems to happen at rank 10 or 11 because the offset jumped 3 higher than it should have.

[Latrinsorm]

It would be funny if it turns out the penalty per song is 9 sometimes.

[Tgo01]

It would be funny if it turns out the penalty per song is 9 sometimes.

That would not be funny at all! :(

[Kalishar]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Human
Level: 23
Bard spell ranks: 19
DIS stat: 62
DIS bonus: 6
LOG stat: 42
LOG bonus: 1
Offset: 29
******************************

[Tgo01]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 8
Race: Dark Elf
Level: 77
Bard spell ranks: 76
DIS stat: 97
DIS bonus: 13
LOG stat: 97
LOG bonus: 23
Offset: 64
******************************

[Tenlaar]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 6
Race: Giantman
Level: 34
Bard spell ranks: 34
DIS stat: 88
DIS bonus: 19
LOG stat: 92
LOG bonus: 16
Offset: 44
******************************

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 10
Race: Giantman
Level: 100
Bard spell ranks: 121
DIS stat: 91
DIS bonus: 20
LOG stat: 100
LOG bonus: 20
Offset: 88
******************************

[Whirlin]

I feel like I'm CLOSE to the equation...

I'm using the average (Rounding up) of Seed 1 on the stat bonuses. But instead of normal seed 1, I'm starting at stat bonuses -40, because that's the theoretical minimum of a stat bonus.
In addition, I'm using Bard Songs /2, in addition to a Seed 3.

Its relatively accurate... but definitely needs to be tweaked a little bit... Lower level stuff doesn't come out right.

[Tgo01]

I'm wondering if there isn't a flat bonus that all bards receive then for some reason another flat bonus of 3 at bard rank 10 or 11, that might explain why lower level bards don't make much sense.

[Whirlin]

Urgh... I didn't like the way that those calculations were coming out.

but that strange 9-11 gain of +4 was why I was looking at alternatives.

It fits marginally better across all spectrums with:
1 Offset per rank up to rank 10
2/3 Offser per rank up to rank 43
.5 Offset per rank above 43

There's some variation, but the largest outlier with that equation is observed offset 4 greater than calculated.

[Tgo01]

Looking at my old data with my other bard the +3 bonus happens at rank 10.

9 spell ranks, offset 23
10 spell ranks, offset 27

Diminishing returns with bard spell ranks is an interesting way to go, didn't even think about that.

[Whirlin]

Perhaps it's a mishap with the assumed renewal cost assumptions of one of the bard songs?

Worth double-testing, cause I can't quite accomodate that

[Tgo01]

Here's what I had:



9 1003 (1), 1006 (3), 1007 (4), 1009 (4) 13 (1 point penalty) (offset 23)
10 1003 (1), 1006 (3), 1007 (5), 1009 (4), 1010 (3) 25 (9 point penalty) (offset 27)

1003 is always 1, 1007 is 2+1 every rank after 7 maxing out at 17 ranks, 1009 is always 4, 1010 should have just been 3 at that point.

You know what I'm wondering though? If 1006 is wrong. At 9 bard ranks 1006 should cost 6 mana to cast but renewal would only be 3 whereas at 10 bard ranks it would be 7 to cast but 3.5 renewal, it should round down but maybe it rounds up?

Even if that were the case we would still be off by 2 and this doesn't seem to be a problem at any other bard rank.

[Whirlin]

Hmm... There's an interesting variable I wasn't taking into account that fortunately, you gathered in your script... # of songs active.

I may be making stuff up off of the top of my head... but I vaguely remember some post saying that multi-song penalty is more difficult to offset as you keep more songs up... which would explain the gap between 4 and 5 songs... It may be an entirely different equation at that point.

That would also explain why at higher levels (like, 60+) the equation appears to be very flatlined at .5 per rank, with only some slight variation (which means my stat equations aren't quite right yet!)

So, when I get home today, I'll go back and rearrange the data based on # of songs active, rather than bard ranks, and work from there. I may also just go buy a fixskills potions, now that RtCF is over, and some unknown cleric outbid me on my 3 slot fusion longbow, which was pretty much the only thing I was saving up silvers for.

[Merala]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Aelotoi
Level: 20
Bard spell ranks: 20
DIS stat: 61
DIS bonus: 10
LOG stat: 45
LOG bonus: 3
Offset: 31
******************************

[Kazner]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Elf
Level: 54
Bard spell ranks: 25
DIS stat: 86
DIS bonus: 3
LOG stat: 86
LOG bonus: 18
Offset: 34
******************************

[kutter]

******************************
Version Whirlin's Bow
Number of songs: 5
Race: Half-Elf
Level: 32
Bard spell ranks: 20
DIS stat: 71
DIS bonus: 5
LOG stat: 48
LOG bonus: -1
Offset: 29
******************************