Switching my stance

[GSTamral]

After long and hard thought, myself and 15 college/work friends are switching our stance on politics. We will now be supporting Kerry for president.

Doing the math, at my salary and stock benefit level, the additional tax burden I would face with Kerry in office is approximately 2,944 dollars (assuming he went back to the Clinton numbers), and if he raises the above 250,000 rate even higher, it would only affect one of us, and then minimally, because he is only 20-30k a year over that limit.

Instead, the bonus check I receive every december, which amounts to roughly 4,600 pre tax and 3124 post tax, I will pocket during the administration. Every year at Christmas, we used to donate that check with company match to Habitat for Humanity, something the IS corporate offices had somewhat of a tradition of doing. By instead pocketing that money, I will realize a gain of about 200 dollars a year, and the conglomerated drop of this event, along with the no more matching from my company, will save the company over 9 million dollars. And since 15% of pre-tax profits (or about 1.3M) goes towards stock awards for employees, That will be an additional 80 dollars a year in my pocket.

Nevermind that HFH would have spent 94 cents on the dollar going to the actual cause and helping people, as opposed to the 65 cents on the dollar the government will give (in many cases far less) and to far less honorable causes, honestly, this decision is purely financial, and quite easy to make. By cancelling the event now, it will be easy to re-organize if Bush is elected, even if the participation level is less, and this way, everyone saves money.

This also satiates the social side, in which I actually do agree more with Kerry on specific social issues than Bush. I never realized I'd be able to get the cake and eat it too.

[Latrinsorm]

If you think you can trust math, then go for it. :smilegrin:

So, what was the point of this post besides some half assed attempt to feel important by showing us that you are rich. I can only speak for myself, but I really don't give a fuck if you net 200 bucks and lick your dick at the same time.

[Blazing247]

<I can only speak for myself, but I really don't give a fuck if you net 200 bucks and lick your dick at the same time. >

:rofl: That reminds me of the SNL episode where Will Ferrell is a Yoga instructor. Licking your own dick is quite a feat Ranger, but yeah who cares about 200 bucks.

[SpunGirl]

I identify as a republican.

However.

I am supporting Kerry because I'm sick to death of Bush and his administration's attacks on abortion. It scares me.

-K

[Back]

This just in...


HELL HATH FROZEN OVER!@

[Betheny]

Tamral, you are now officially welcome at my house anytime. :)

THE THREE AMIGOS RIDE AGAIN.

[DeV]

:eek:

[xtc]

Your decision is based on the fact that you believe that Kerry will do what he says he will do. His track record doesn't support this theory.

[DeV]

xtc will take your place and vote for Bush.

[xtc]

lol I never said I would vote for Bush, I was just pointing out that GS Tamral's decision is based on the fact that he is trusting that Kerry will do what he says he will do. This is something I wouldn't trust.

Regarding myself, I live in Canada but I have dual citizenhip actually 3 citizenships but don't tell Uncle Sam. I am eligible to vote in November but I don't know if I will. I hate Bush's arrogance, foreign policy and Patriot Act. I like his tax cuts and much of his domestic policy. As far as Kerry is concerned he scares me as well. He strikes me as an opportunist and I am afraid that he is the best the Democratic party could muster. I may abstain from voting. It has less effect on my life as I live in Canada.

[longshot]

I think I hear Tsa'ah laughing somewhere...

[DeV]

Originally posted by xtc
lol Regarding myself, I live in Canada but I have dual citizenhip actually 3 citizenships but don't tell Uncle Sam.
Oops, I forgot you live in Canada . :)

[Back]

Originally posted by xtc
He strikes me as an opportunist and I am afraid that he is the best the Democratic party could muster.

Two things.

Whats wrong with being an opportunist?

Kerry was off the radar before the Primarys. It seems the majority of the people voting in those Primarys liked him and what he had to say to them. So why are you afraid the most popular Democrat won the nomination?

Not even going to touch three. And really, this whole post is a waste... just that xtc seems to spew the same bullshit rhetoric I’ve been hearing for the past year. Call me a shit kicker. Shucks.

[xtc]

Originally posted by Backlash
[quote

Two things.

1. Whats wrong with being an opportunist?

2. Kerry was off the radar before the Primarys. It seems the majority of the people voting in those Primarys liked him and what he had to say to them. So why are you afraid the most popular Democrat won the nomination?

3. Not even going to touch three. And really, this whole post is a waste... just that xtc seems to spew the same bullshit rhetoric I’ve been hearing for the past year. Call me a shit kicker. Shucks.

1. A hell of alot they are in the game for their own adulation only. They can't be trusted. I think after the Iraq war trust is a major factor in this election

2.Because he is such a weak candidate. If this is the best the party could muster what depth do the democrats have?

3.Forgive me for being an independent thinker and not blindly following any party. Maybe there is substance to the rhetoric which is why you have been hearing it for a year.

Backlash you seem to be getting a little testy, are you afraid your beloved Kerry will lose in Nov? What a slap in the face that would be especially after Bush's massive failure in Iraq. WMD LMAO

[Edited on 8-27-2004 by xtc]

[Back]

Originally posted by xtc
Backlash you seem to be getting a little testy, are you afraid your beloved Kerry will lose in Nov? What a slap in the face that would be especially after Bush's massive failure in Iraq. WMD LMAO

[Edited on 8-27-2004 by xtc]

Yeah, I get a little testy when some moron screws up the country I was born and grew up in.

You know, the CIA should be torn apart. If I we’re President, and of course I am merely just a middle-class asshole trying to have a good time, I would fucking destroy the idiots who fucked things up.

I understand covering, but please. Lives are at stake.

[Latrinsorm]

Backlash, what's the deal with your apostrophes? :?:

:offtopic:

[SpunGirl]

I'm tired of having to vote for one of the generally mediocre candidates that are provided.

-K

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by longshot
I think I hear Tsa'ah laughing somewhere...

You probably did, but I'll get to that un momento.

I read his post as sarcasm, must be my pessimistic streak. I think his point was that by voting in Kerry, a democrat, social endeavors such as HFH will suffer because people that would normally contribute and receive a write off will likely not contribute. ::exhales::

I believe the point is that the wealthy will pocket money and not donate as they are so well known to do. /sarcasm.

Logic dictates that if Kerry is voted into office and reverts to a Pre and Post Bush taxation method, humanitarian efforts (funds received) will revert back as well. If those donations of cash and time were good then, suffering will be minimal to non-existent. Were such donations poor during the era, they are only destined to be poor.

As a HFH volunteer I can tell you that there is always a demand for time and money and I did not notice any change with the administration hand off. I have not volunteered time in roughly a year however.

Disregard if Tamral was serious.

You heard me laughing for one reason.

Air cannon, impact glass, a huge pink dildo and a headshot of Dubya for a target.

Imagine hearing Dubya condemn homosexuality.

They're all going to burn in hell, God himself told me. It's wrong, it's disgusting and they should never marry.

NOW GIVE ME THE COCK!

:Thooomp:

BAM!!!!

Ya, that's the stuff.

I have never laughed so hard in my life.

[Parkbandit]

I too took his post as sarcasm.

[GSTamral]

Yes, my post was quite sarcastic. And Ranger, why don't you shut the fuck up with your assumptions. There is a difference between being well off and being rich. Being it I still don't have my own house, I would hardly classify myself as rich, and that, just like anyone else starting out making upper middle class money, I like to earn and buy my own things. at the rate at which I can save money, after taxes, it will still take 4 full years to be able to put 20% down on a decent house.

92% of money going to not for profit and nonprofit organizations comes from the top 20% of incomes.

Under Bill Clinton, we averaged 2700 participants in the december bonus check event, peaking at 2815 in 1998. In Bush's first year, we had over 3300 participants. Think that doesn't make a difference?

:help:

I'm scared

[GSTamral]

Maybe if you went out and had a real job, you would be. I mean shit, you care enough to start things up here again and make derisive commentary. Maybe if you weren't so abrasive and actually had a job, you'd have the first clue what I'm talking about. Then again, you probably don't care.

Yes, because now I'm an unemployed low life. How fucking stupid are you.

[GSTamral]

stupid enough to understand the difference monetarily that the tax changes would bring. Which is basically anyone in the top 40% of incomes. As this is a group you do not belong to, it quite obviously baffles you to understand the issue at hand.

Tamral, just because I don't give a fuck about you doesn't mean I am unabale to understand tax laws and basic algebra.

You have the logical reasoning of a retarded chicken. Please stop.

[Wezas]

I was all ready to delete that photoshop of Tamral reading the title of this thread. Guess I'll hold on to it for now.

[Parkbandit]

If I was about to call someone a retarded chicken.. I certainly would spell unable correctly.

But then again.. I'm special.

[Ilvane]

It's okay, I will vote for Kerry and then your vote will be negated.:nods:

I wouldn't trust Bush, and I certainly don't agree with nearly everything he stands for. Thank goodness I know I voted for Gore in the last election, and even if Kerry loses, I have a clear conscience.

-A

:compcrash:

[Wezas]

Originally posted by Parkbandit
If I was about to call someone a retarded chicken.. I certainly would spell unable correctly.

But then again.. I'm special.

Yes you are. (see my sig for proof)

:oops:

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by GSTamral
Being it I still don't have my own house, I would hardly classify myself as rich, and that, just like anyone else starting out making upper middle class money, I like to earn and buy my own things. at the rate at which I can save money, after taxes, it will still take 4 full years to be able to put 20% down on a decent house.

I'm sorry, but if you are linking your savings to buy a home to taxation while being upper middle class, you have some serious displacement issues. You dictate what lifestyle you live, not a democratic or republican tax plan. If in 4 years you don't have a 20% down payment you are either shooting too high or mismanaging your cash. In 4 years, living like we only make 40-50k a year, the wife and I could walk out and buy a 250k home without a down payment.

This my friend is your problem and not a taxation issue. Your statement would hold water if your household made less than 60k a year.


92% of money going to not for profit and nonprofit organizations comes from the top 20% of incomes.

Not that I don't believe you, well I don't, but what are your sources for this figure.


Under Bill Clinton, we averaged 2700 participants in the december bonus check event, peaking at 2815 in 1998. In Bush's first year, we had over 3300 participants. Think that doesn't make a difference?

You seem to think that your company is a global model. Why don't you read the HFH annual reports. They are archived for the past 5 years.

I'm sorry you're upset over some heavier taxes coming your way, but claim humanitarian organizations are going to suffer because of it. That's just ignorant.

[GSTamral]

<<
Tamral, just because I don't give a fuck about you doesn't mean I am unabale to understand tax laws and basic algebra.

You have the logical reasoning of a retarded chicken. Please stop.
>>

If that were truly the case, you wouldn't be spending time reading my posts or responding to them. I mean, I can honestly say from the same perspective that I couldn't give a shit what happens to you, which is why I don't address any of the nonsense you spout unless you start making derisive commentary about myself. And if you truly had a clue, you would know the difference between algebra and arithmetic.

As for the comment about making 40-50k a year and having enough to buy a house, maybe if you live in a place where 250k can buy a decent house, it would be different. In NJ, even a small townhouse in a decent neighborhood runs upwards of 400,000. A decent house starts upwards of that.

[GSTamral]

Global Model? perhaps as close as one can get.

UPS is the largest private company employer in the United States, at 370,000 employees, with more than 40,000 in the corporate structure.

And if you truly had a clue, you would know the difference between algebra and arithmetic.

So its your contention that understanding taxes only requires basic arithmetic? Lol

[Wezas]

Originally posted by RangerD1

And if you truly had a clue, you would know the difference between algebra and arithmetic.

So its your contention that understanding taxes only requires basic arithmetic? Lol

Why do you think Bush is planning on getting rid of the IRS? He's trying to make them simple enough for him to understand.

P.s.


If that were truly the case, you wouldn't be spending time reading my posts or responding to them

If what were the case?

I wouldn't be resopnding to your post if I didn't understand taxes, and the implications of the two candidate's tax plans? Or I wouldn't be responding if you were retarded and\or a chicken?

[GSTamral]

Yes, actually, that is true. There is nothing more than addition, subtration, multiplication and division involved in any tax law. In instances where anything more complex is required, such is not stated in law, but rather implicitly implied and a chart is provided. I only know of one such instance, in a schedule D, and only if you are carrying maximum loss amounts for more than one instance for multiple years in which even more than one operand is involved in the formula.

[Latrinsorm]

Do I play too much GS if I see HFH and think "Hunt for History? What does that have to do with anything?" :(

[GSTamral]

wow, name calling. Retarded chicken? impressive. Is that the best that you've learned?

[Edited on 8-28-2004 by HarmNone]

Apparently, to you the only thing involved in taxes is what you personally pay. Way to go.

[Wezas]

Name calling = 1 thing.
Talking about someone else's mother = totally different thing.

[GSTamral]

yep, it sure is. I'm willing to stoop to his level to fight that type of argument. He can choose to ignore it, or he can choose to address it. Makes no difference to me.

He could have taken another route and not started name calling, and/or not making derisive statements, but he didn't. But if he wants to travel that road, who am I to stop him? I'll simply join the fun.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Wezas

Originally posted by Parkbandit
If I was about to call someone a retarded chicken.. I certainly would spell unable correctly.

But then again.. I'm special.

Yes you are. (see my sig for proof)

Oh Wezas.. you are nothing but a NinjaKlaivewannabe.. see your avatar as proof to your true ambition.

[Sean]

You can apply that arguement to anything.

He wouldn't have called you names if you hadn't posted a highly sarcastic post in a social folder either. See its not to find ways to point fingers. But what it really comes down to is that its both of your fault and you both should just drop it.

[GSTamral]

I don't see anyone else name calling here. A sarcastic statement is not automatic means for name calling, nor is it means for anything past civil discussion. I freely admit fault, if you want to call it that (which is rather dichotomous to begin with in a situation like this), and I don't care if anyone else admits fault or not. I'm simply stating my willingness to have that type of sludge match if that is what he desires.

[longshot]

Originally posted by GSTamral
I don't see anyone else name calling here. A sarcastic statement is not automatic means for name calling, nor is it means for anything past civil discussion.

You can't save up for a house because you spend all your money at the titty bar.

[Back]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm
Backlash, what's the deal with your apostrophes? :?:

:offtopic:

It’s work related. You see, sometimes I have to import text files into layouts. Microsoft Word loses the real “ ” s replaced with " " when I do that, so I have to go in and change them all.

Its a matter of getting into a good habit. To make the proper quotes on a Mac, I press option-[ or shift-option-[. Apostrophies use the ].

What do they look like on your end? Just curious. If they are coming out garbled I’ll stop.

[Latrinsorm]

They're just curvy is all. No big deal. :)

I'd wager that my mother is quite a bit more educated than you Tamral.

I guess its a shame that she didn't use her education to become rich and instead used it to help people. But then again, I'm sure that check you send to hfh makes you such a better person :lol2:

As for stooping down to my level? I doubt you want to get down to my level Tamral, afterall I'm the type of person that put your bitch little friend in ICU.

You keep crying about "name calling" but this was your post prior to all of that.


Maybe if you went out and had a real job, you would be. I mean shit, you care enough to start things up here again and make derisive commentary. Maybe if you weren't so abrasive and actually had a job, you'd have the first clue what I'm talking about. Then again, you probably don't care.


You can talk about "name calling" and your higher level all you want, its plainly obvious that your just an idiot caught up in his own self importance, with a mid level job at UPS.

Go back to trying to skew statistics to support your asinine arguments.

[Edited on 8-28-2004 by HarmNone]

[Back]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm
They're just curvy is all. No big deal. :)

Cool. I prefer the curvy ones actually. :pirate:

[GSTamral]

<<
I'd wager that my mother is quite a bit more educated than you Tamral.
>>

I would wager not.

<<
I guess its a shame that she didn't use her education to become rich and instead used it to help people. But then again, I'm sure that check you send to hfh makes you such a better person
>>

Again, you miss the point. Donation of time and money is something people do with part of the excess.

<<
As for stooping down to my level? I doubt you want to get down to my level Tamral, afterall I'm the type of person that put your bitch little friend in ICU.
>>

Wow, good one. Actually, I was talking about that level of words on the boards. And yes, as to the second statement, I have never accused you of being anything more than an uneducated thug who left the streets for the army. Thank you for the re-assertion.

<<
You keep crying about "name calling" but this was your post prior to all of that.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe if you went out and had a real job, you would be. I mean shit, you care enough to start things up here again and make derisive commentary. Maybe if you weren't so abrasive and actually had a job, you'd have the first clue what I'm talking about. Then again, you probably don't care.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>

Perhaps you miss the first post you made in this thread. Maybe you should go back and read it again. I didn't start anything with you, you started this little war of words.

<<
You can talk about "name calling" and your higher level all you want, its plainly obvious that your just an idiot caught up in his own self importance, with a mid level job at UPS.

Go back to trying to skew statistics to support your asinine arguments.
>>


Nice assumption once again. It's so sad then when my "mid" level job is so much more than you have ever acheived, yet you can still speak derisively of its impacts. Your assessments are about as intelligent as an 8 year olds, which is what I assume you left the streets with the brain of. Your mother indeed taught you well. Her education level preens through your words.

Back onto our original argument, I still would like to see how our tax code employs algebra.

[HarmNone]

Take this to U2U, you two. This is not the place for it. Period.

HarmNone

I would wager not.

Post your education and we'll see ;)


ou miss the point. Donation of time and money is something people do with part of the excess.

I got the point and I find it sad that the only reason you would support a cause is because it's economically justifiable.


Wow, good one. Actually, I was talking about that level of words on the boards. And yes, as to the second statement, I have never accused you of being anything more than an uneducated thug who left the streets for the army. Thank you for the re-assertion.

You so cool. :cold:


Nice assumption once again.

Tamral, every other post from you is about your "Job" and the money you make. The other half is with your political and social dribble that you like to pass off as the word of god.


It's so sad then when my "mid" level job is so much more than you have ever acheived, yet you can still speak derisively of its impacts

Not really, I know for a fact that I've done more in my life at the age of 21 than you did. Not everyone has the luxury of growing up with a silver spoon. Despite all that I have more than exceed the standard for my peers.

You can talk all the shit you want, but "saying how much of a dirtbaglowlifeshitbag" really doesn't mean alot to me because I know its not true. ;) You should take notes, its called having confidence without coming to forums and various other online venues without trying to prove myself to "insignificant" people.


I still would like to see how our tax code employs algebra.

Its amazing how you snap onto a bone when you think you've got a one up. But heres one, when calculating the tax owed through the different tax brackets, you would be easier to use algebra instead of standard arithmetic. That however is your choice, as it is with most forms of basic algebra and arithmetic.

If you think that someone with only a background in arithmetic is capable of doing and understand their taxes then you are stupider than I think.

[Betheny]

Just for the sake of arguement, I'm fairly uneducated. I don't think education has anything to do with it.

[GSTamral]

My education level includes the following:

Bachelors of Science, Duke University, Biomedical Engineering
M.S Industrial Engineering, Rutgers University
M.B.A. Finance with concentrations in deterministic and probabalistic modelling, Rutgers.

As for you having accomplished more at 21 than I have, I seriously doubt that, but it would depend entirely on your standards of accomplishment. I have never been arrested, so you've probably got me in that one, but if you want to talk about academics, sports, or such, I'd like to see your proof.


<<
But heres one, when calculating the tax owed through the different tax brackets, you would be easier to use algebra instead of standard arithmetic. That however is your choice, as it is with most forms of basic algebra and arithmetic.
>>

Uhhh, maybe if you had done your taxes before and actually knew what you were talking about, you'd know there is a dollar chart that you can just read.

<<
If you think that someone with only a background in arithmetic is capable of doing and understand their taxes then you are stupider than I think.
>>

Actually yes, this is entirely true. Unless they are trading stock options, anyone who understands how to use a calculator can do their own taxes.

Bachelors of Science, Duke University, Biomedical Engineering
M.S Industrial Engineering, Rutgers University
M.B.A. Finance with concentrations in deterministic and probabalistic modelling, Rutgers.


Not bad. However, my mother still has you beat, with 2 ba's from the University of Iowa and 2 masters + PHD from the University of Chicago. The Ba's are in statistics and Religious history. All the post graduate is from the school of divinity.

In any event, shes also not an assclown so + points for her.


As for you having accomplished more at 21 than I have, I seriously doubt that

If you say so ;) I guess it boils down a matter of opinion.


I have never been arrested, so you've probably got me in that one

Me neither ;)




Uhhh, maybe if you had done your taxes before and actually knew what you were talking about, you'd know there is a dollar chart that you can just read.

Which changes the math involved how?


Actually yes, this is entirely true. Unless they are trading stock options, anyone who understands how to use a calculator can do their own taxes.

Which is why the tax preperation market is such a successful one?

[Edaarin]

RangerD1's mother loses points in education for being a woman.

She gets + points for being able to school you in basketball

[Souzy]

LOL Vinh! I bet if you said that to her face, she'd beat your ass in the court, then literally beat yo' short ass!!!!!

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by GSTamral
As for the comment about making 40-50k a year and having enough to buy a house, maybe if you live in a place where 250k can buy a decent house, it would be different. In NJ, even a small townhouse in a decent neighborhood runs upwards of 400,000. A decent house starts upwards of that.

Actually, you misread ... completely. Here it is for you to read again. I'll even highlight the key words.


I'm sorry, but if you are linking your savings to buy a home to taxation while being upper middle class, you have some serious displacement issues. You dictate what lifestyle you live, not a democratic or republican tax plan. If in 4 years you don't have a 20% down payment you are either shooting too high or mismanaging your cash. In 4 years, living like we only make 40-50k a year, the wife and I could walk out and buy a 250k home without a down payment.

Meaning, we make well over the 40-50k mark. More than double actually. We live on a 40-50k budget. We dictate our style of living and in doing so we are financially able to drop a quarter mill on a quarter mill home and not have to worry about the finance.


This my friend is your problem and not a taxation issue. Your statement would hold water if your household made less than 60k a year.

Translation. IF your earnings were in the 40-50k range, you would have room to bitch.

You choose to live in NJ, you choose to work in NJ. You could work and live elsewhere. Are you following me?

You decide to live a lifestyle you can afford despite taxation. You live it in an area that is expensive to live in. Tax laws have not forced you save less, live expensive and save little. You could easily, very very easily, cut back on your life style and have well over the 20% down payment, but you chose to blame tax laws or potential changes to said tax laws instead of your own careless spending.

If a change in the tax law makes you throw a tantrum and not donate, that is you and your lack of conviction and sincerity when it comes to humanitarian efforts.

It is very evident that you are a greedy and wretched person, that is entirely your right to be so. Don't point at politics for your reasoning, point at your parents or the mirror.

P.S. Stop being such a politician and answer the questions posed to you instead of dancing around them. You weren't able to back up your claim of lies and propaganda with MM, and you have yet to back up your claim concerning charities and the rich.