Resistance: how much is x amount and what does it accomplish?

[Archigeek]

So lets say you take a rank 8 fire critical but have armor with 30 points of fire resistance. Where do you end up? The morgue or? What about 15 points? Where's the cut off at which point it's worth it/not worth it if you're routinely taking big hits you could be reducing with resistance?

[tyrant-201]

So lets say you take a rank 8 fire critical but have armor with 30 points of fire resistance. Where do you end up? The morgue or? What about 15 points? Where's the cut off at which point it's worth it/not worth it if you're routinely taking big hits you could be reducing with resistance?

Imagine there's some factors involved, but I'm interested in hearing about this too. I'm considering resistance, and wondering if splitting it up is wise - or if I should just stick with one 30 pt resistance.

[Jace Solo]

1)can you split it up? 2) sounds like a Q for the officials

[Suppressed Poet]

If it is randomized, I'd say split it. If not, I'd go lightning resist all the way.

[crb]

I believe its taken off the top. With really high end ranger resistance it lessens both damage and critical to practically nothing.

[Whirlin]

Very limited testing that I did with 1014's elemental resistance hinted exactly as Crb said. It appeared to be a flat, % reduction of the DF, before the phantom damage calculation.

Unlike Redux, which has a higher DF reduction than Critical Phantom DF reduction, I believe resistances effect both equally.

The relationship between x points and y %... I dunno. 1-1?

I'm more than happy to rapid fire fireball your face til you die, raise you, and do it again to do some tests.

[Archigeek]

Actually my current armor has void resistance, which ironically doesn't help much vs focused implosion since resolution of that spell often bypasses formula and goes straight to splat. It's nice for running around the rift though. My most common deaths these days are from lich major ewave though, and I am debating whether to switch to either 30 points of fire resistance or 15/15 fire/ice.

[eulogia]

Lightning (Ithzir, DC)

Impact (griffin drops, charge, other maneuvers, DC)

That's where resistances are at.

[Archigeek]

I get that certain places favor certain resistances, but that is not what I'm asking. That stuff is pretty well known, (you can add puncture resistance to Nelemar and Slash resistance to the rift). What I want to know is: is it effective if I split it up 15/15 or should I go full boat 30 points at one if I'm looking at two different resistances. As a rift hunter, I wear max slash resistance for the crawlers, and have void resistance for roaming flares, but if it isn't a crawler burrow killing me, it's usually a major ewave from a lich, and those are fire and ice. So I could go 15/15, or roll the dice and go 30 points to one and take my chances on the other. If a major ewave from a 110 level critter is going to fry/freeze me whether or not I have 15 points of resistance or not, then the answer is 30 points to one and skip the other. It's all about baby splitting! To split or not to split? That is the question.

[thefarmer]

Jinsem (original) testing put it as decreasing HP loss at the very end of ALL combat calculations. If I remember right, he also had a GM basically state during his testing that 'that was as far as he was going to get testing as a player and that his conclusions were as accurate as they were going to get.'

[droit]

My gut response is to go full 30% on one. Major ewave regularly crits up to 7-9 ranks, and I don't think 15% is gonna put much of a dent in that. 30% would have a better chance of keeping you alive or reducing the stun to something more manageable. That being said, I have no idea how resistance is actually applied to maneuver-type spells like 435.

[Archigeek]

Jinsem (original) testing put it as decreasing HP loss at the very end of ALL combat calculations. If I remember right, he also had a GM basically state during his testing that 'that was as far as he was going to get testing as a player and that his conclusions were as accurate as they were going to get.'

This makes no sense, as it obviously reduces more than just HP loss. It's possible that the reduction occurs right before crit's are calc'd, but not after.

[Riltus]

This makes no sense, as it obviously reduces more than just HP loss. It's possible that the reduction occurs right before crit's are calc'd, but not after.

Resistance reduces raw damage and the critical rank but once the critical has been determined the critical damage is not reduced. We can only speculate on the mechanics of the critical rank reduction. If the raw damage reduction occurs last, then the critical rank reduction is independent of that value which it appears to be. (see below)

Reduced raw damage is [raw damage - trunc((Resistance% * raw damage)]. With 9 raw damage and 10% resistance there is no reduction [9 - trunc((.10 * 9) = 9]. If the unreduced raw damage is sufficient to have caused a rank 1 critical then that is the minimum critical. It cannot be reduced to a rank 0 as seen in CRB's signature attack clip (4 total damage with a rank 1 critical).


You hurl a roaring ball of fire at Zinzimir!
AS: +603 vs DS: +409 with AvD: +44 + d100 roll: +42 = +280
... and hit for 4 points of damage!
Minor burns to left hand. Ouch.

DF: .270
ER-100: 180
Raw dmg: 49 (.270 * 180)
Crit dmg: 1
Reduced raw dmg: 3
Total dmg: 4
Resistance: ~95% (49 - trunc(.95 * 49)
-----------------------------------------------------

Example showing that the DF is not reduced:

You thrust with an estoc at Ladronus!
Some dark brigandine armor partially deflects the onslaught of the puncture attack.
AS: +268 vs DS: +96 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +52 = +253
... and hit for 35 points of damage!
Nice puncture to the abdomen, just missed vital organs!

ER-100: 153
DF: .200
Raw dmg: 31
Crit dmg: 10
Resistance: 20%
Reduced raw damage: 25 [31 - trunc(0.20 * 31)]
Crit damage: 10 (rank 2 puncture)
Total damage: 35 (25 reduced raw dmg + 10 unreduced critical dmg)

In this example if the DF was reduced by the resistance% then the raw damage would have been 24 (DF .160 * 153) and the total damage 34.
-----------------------------------------------------

Example showing that the critical rank outcome is not based on reduced raw damage:

You thrust with an estoc at Ladronus!
Some dark brigandine armor partially deflects the onslaught of the puncture attack.
AS: +268 vs DS: +96 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +40 = +241
... and hit for 28 points of damage!
Minor puncture to the right leg.

ER-100: 141
DF: .200 (estoc scale DF)
Raw dmg: 28 (.200 * 141)
Resistance: 20% puncture
Reduced raw dmg: 23 [28 - trunc(0.20 * 28)]
Critical: Rank 1 leg puncture
Critical damage: 5
Crit divisor: 7
Total damage: 28 (23 reduced raw damage + 5 unreduced critical damage)

If the critical rank outcome is based on reduced raw damage then the minimum critical rank would be 2.

Reduced raw dmg: 23
Crit divisor: 7
Max crit: Rank 3 (23/7)
Min crit: Rank 2 [round up(3/2)]

Mark

[droit]

That's all well and good for AS/DS resolutions, but does anyone have any clue how maneuver spells are reduced?

[senorgordoburro]

That's all well and good for AS/DS resolutions, but does anyone have any clue how maneuver spells are reduced?

no

[Archigeek]

Thanks for the mechanics work Mark. That is about the best explanation I have seen.

I had originally asked the question as I pondered purchasing some resistance, and was debating whether 15/15 fire/ice was the way to go, or just throwing it all into fire. The background for the question is that scatter liches come in hot and cold varieties, and both pack a pretty brutal major ewave. I went with 30 points of fire resistance, on the theory that 15 points of resistance wasn't enough to save me from a shot to a critical spot. Last night I survived one to the eyeball with a 10 round stun and am thinking I made the right call.