Help with a Cleric

[Wheelerm]

I haven't played a Cleric before and would appreciate some insight from those of you who have experience with them. Planning on a runestaff pure and wanted to know if this build is correct based on what I've read and studied. Character will be a Giantman.

PF: 1X
AS: 1X
MIU: 1X
HP: 1X
SA: 2X
SMC: 1X
MjS: 0.5X
MnS: 0.5X
Cleric: 1X
SL: Blessing: 10 ranks
SL: Religion: 20 ranks
SL: Summoning: 15 ranks

[Ryvicke]

The real question of playing a cleric early is whether you want to train Spell Aim or not. If you're a bane cleric it might come in handy for 306'ing undead or if you're smite it can help with using wands on the living, but a lot of people don't train it at all early and push cleric ranks to lvl+21 as fast as possible to max CS and get access to better raise/chrism at 25. You're going to be channeling 302 at stuff for a long time.

[Wheelerm]

Well, my primary motivation is to get the CS as high as possible, be able to make chrisms, raise the dead, and since I want to use a runestaff, SA is one of the magic skills that counts toward the necessary 8-skill minimum training. I know I implied that this is a new character, but honestly this one is already level 21 and the build is all screwed up. Since the fixskills came around last night, I thought I would try to salvage it.

Thanks for looking and helping.

[Ryvicke]

Well, my primary motivation is to get the CS as high as possible, be able to make chrisms, raise the dead, and since I want to use a runestaff, SA is one of the magic skills that counts toward the necessary 8-skill minimum training. I know I implied that this is a new character, but honestly this one is already level 21 and the build is all screwed up. Since the fixskills came around last night, I thought I would try to salvage it.

Thanks for looking and helping.

Although SA is nice for the runestaff DS and way cheaper than trying to triple spells it's not going to break your character's DS to only average 6.5 magic ranks a level. If you want to max CS I'd leave SA out, get to Cleric lvl+21 and 120, totally bork the 200's (stop at 202 I think?) and that gets you to like 39 cleric spells and 120 by 18 (or where you are now). Then you can push lores to get everything you need for chrism by 25. Then you can start filling out the 200's, but always keeping the cleric at lvl+21. I fixskilled a few times back and forth between having spell aim and not and it didn't make a huge difference either way I guess. If you go spell aim then you have to get up to 215 for the AS so it's a whole different build early.

[Jeril]

It is 204 that you want to stop at. 203 gives you mana bread, and having 204 gives you +1 CS as well as +1 mana per pulse from your mana bread. I also agree with shooting for 120 then working the 200s up more. There is also no reason to worry about how many magic ranks per level you have, just train in the skills you plan to use. If you want to read scrolls and use magic items train them, if not, don't. You'll get plenty of DS from your spells. I've got an empath up to 46 who still doesn't even use a runestaff, although I'd highly recommend you get a flaring one.

[Whirlin]

Damn... wish you had made the character a month ago!

I DO recommend spell aiming... but only as a crutch that'll work well for you for the first 30 levels or so, until you have the CS/mana pool to fry on your own. Mainly because there are so many more wizard wands than any other mana-extending stuff out there.

Now that we're past the annual fixskills though, unless you feel like dropping some cash or silvers on a potion, I can't recommend bothering with spell aiming.

[Jeril]

Actually new characters get a fixskills either when they are created or at the end of their 30 days now. Not sure when it started I just found out about it recently, although I tend to have stats/skills set at the end of 30 days and roll from there.

[Wheelerm]

Annual Fixskills were given today, so I have a fix skills. I haven't made anything permanent yet, so tweak away! If you think SA would help, then that's cool. I still have my fixskills available and won't use it until this character's build is salvanged. Thanks for the replies so far. Keep the advice coming.

So, generally, you guys recommend Cleric spell circle +21 (total of 42 ranks at level 21), getting up to 204, and up to 120. Assuming I can do this and still have plenty of points left over, then continue to build up the 200 spells?

I would appreciate more input on the SA vs. no-SA line.

Thanks.

[Aluvius]

I have a 26 cleric for raising/bless and I've struggled with sa/no sa as well. It just eats up so many dang points. I've had no problems hunting with a +21 bane build but it would be nice to holy bolt undead at times. I don't think it would work as well if I weren't a col dwarf though and I'd probably pick up sa with another race society combo.

I do like the idea of dropping miu and AS since I 2 hand channel mostly at this level and don't get rune staff flares much less any ds. Hmmm, I might be able to squeeze in chrisms ... Dang wish I had thought of that sooner and burned my old fix skills on it :)

[Whirlin]

Well, I had a unique situation with SA... Since I have Whirlin, who is soooo close to mastering Alchemy, I have about 50000 wands at my disposal... I joke that I rolled up a cleric just to get rid of my alchemy wands (not a joke).

If you train Spell Aiming, you want to go MjS first for the AS boosts from 211 and 215. If you're not going spell aiming, then I recommend MnS.

The decision is really based on what kind of resources you have available to you in forms of other characters, etc.

As much as I hate to say it... Alchemy may be a decent alternative to low mana problems at low levels... but I feel like punching myself in the face for even saying that.

[Jeril]

Some people like having spell aim, it can be useful if you group hunt or like to actually participate in invasions beyond just raising dead bodies. But for normal hunting you are better off just pumping your CS with cleric ranks. There isn't anything that you can't kill with CS spells as a cleric. Holy bolt does eat up some undead but I think overall they aren't numerous enough to make it worth it.

[Wheelerm]

Thanks a lot for the suggestions. Here is what I have for my build based on your feedback. Level 22 Giant:

PF: 1x (22 ranks)
AS: 1x (22 ranks)
MIU: 1x (22 ranks)
HP: 1x (22 ranks)
SMC: 1x (22 ranks)
MjS: 2 ranks (will work on raising this magic circle instead of MnS from here on out)
MnS: 20 ranks
Cleric: Level +21 (43 ranks right now)
SL:Blessing: 10 ranks
SL: Summoning: 15 ranks
SL Religion: don't have the points yet, but will work up to 20 ranks.

Climbing: 5 ranks
Swimming: 6 ranks
Perception: 7 ranks (stopping at 24 ranks)

Is there any use in training beyond 24 ranks of SMC? I suppose I could pick up MMC, but not sure how many Mental circles I'll share mana with anyway.

[Whirlin]

I'd at least hit 25 ranks for SMC, even if it's just for multi-cast. Kinda a 'why not' when it's just +1 rank.

I'm a fan of 1x mana shares for pures though. why? I dunno.

[Aluvius]

You might want to get the religion ranks first for a bit of extra damage bursts for 302 and more damage cycles with 312/317/319 and such, then work up the blessing/summoning.

[Ryvicke]

Do you still need 24 ranks of SMC to raise someone without failure? Might want to push up or not raise until then if so.

[Jeril]

Yes, you need 24 ranks to avoid the chance of death.

[Asrial]

I don't think you die anymore, I think you just get stunned.

[Jeril]

You get stunned if you do something like cast raise without having linked first. I haven't seen a cleric die from not having enough SMC because for most it is an easy enough thing, pretty sure the last person I saw die from it was a paladin. Probably more then a year ago now there was someone who posted on the officials that their cleric only has 10 ranks of SMC just to give them a 50/50 chance of death when raising as part of their RP.

[Necis]

All these folks will probably be better at answering your question than I am; however, I wanted to share my personal experience with you.

As someone who recently/actively has been going through this right now (34 Sylvan Cleric on Shattered), I did the following: 1x brawl/shield (disarms while scripting :/), 1x PF, 1x SMC, 1x religion, 1x perception, 20 ranks of climbing/swimming, level +21 ranks in cleric, up to 120, rest in 200s afterward (I think I just got Heroism at 34). Since we have chrism bots, I'm not dinking around with it, but I assume at my level you'd have enough lores to balance out the lack of spell aiming (which I have never used, though in theory I guess it'd be nice if I ever wanted to hunt undead).

Since there is literally not another soul in RR on Shattered, I am only self spelled. Currently, I'm hunting in moor witches/eagles/hounds and I fry in under 2 minutes without a problem. I rarely have to wrack unless I have to throw on an extra couple of hours of 120. If I can answer any questions for you, feel free to give me a shout! :)