Rand Paul filibuster about drone strikes on US Citizens

[Drew]

http://www.c-span.org/Live-Video/C-SPAN2/


I'm watching right now. Pretty cool that he is actually filibustering instead of what senators normally do when they say "I filibuster" and that's that. He's holding up Brennan's nomination, he says he knows he can't stop him from being nominated but he wants to draw attention to the fact that the White House has not said if drone strikes could be authorized on a US citizen inside US borders without judicial review and he would like the White House to take an official stance on extra-judicial assassinations.

[Androidpk]

Yeah, this is some good stuff. Been watching on and off for the past couple of hours. He's got a few other senators helping him out.

[4a6c1]

Anyone know his current location? - drone pilots union

[Fallen]

I wouldn't have a problem with the filibuster if it had to be used in this form. The silent filibuster is retarded.

[Androidpk]

#filiblizzard

[4a6c1]

Lol

[Bobmuhthol]

I've had it playing in the background and laughing when he fucks up pronouncing the words that he's reading. It sounds like he just ate something?

[Drew]

I've had it playing in the background and laughing when he fucks up pronouncing the words that he's reading. It sounds like he just ate something?

He is eating, yeah.

[Androidpk]

LOL @ Sen. Jerry Moran.

[Back]

In order to make his point Rand Paul has to drone on and on about it.

Thank you, thank you, you've been a great crowd. Have a great night!

[Jarvan]

In order to make his point Rand Paul has to drone on and on about it.

Thank you, thank you, you've been a great crowd. Have a great night!

Back tries for a Joke roll, he rolls a 1, Fumbled!

[Wrathbringer]

“I rise today to begin to filibuster John Brennan’s nomination for the C.I.A.,” Mr. Paul began. “I will speak until I can no longer speak. I will speak as long as it takes, until the alarm is sounded from coast to coast that our Constitution is important, that your rights to trial by jury are precious, that no American should be killed by a drone on American soil without first being charged with a crime, without first being found to be guilty by a court.” -Rand Paul

[Fallen]

Does anyone think Rand Paul is wrong in this instance?

[Androidpk]

Does anyone think Rand Paul is wrong in this instance?

Not even the slightest bit.

[Bobmuhthol]

No.

[Drew]

Guy is still going, you can tell he's getting tired, he's been talking for about 8 hours straight now.

[Tgo01]

Guy is still going, you can tell he's getting tired, he's been talking for about 8 hours straight now.

Is he actually staying on topic or is he reading names from a phone book?

[Bobmuhthol]

He's still on point.

[Tgo01]

He's still on point.

Damn that's pretty impressive.

[Tenlaar]

Does anyone think Rand Paul is wrong in this instance?

I don't. I also don't think it will change anything. The government will say what it wants to now and do what it wants to later.

The world is going to be a really, really fucking scary place in another decade or two.

[Androidpk]

Not that I particularly care about Twitter but #standwithrand is trending like crazy. Drone policy aside this is giving him a crazy amount of publicity.

[Fallen]

I don't. I also don't think it will change anything. The government will say what it wants to now and do what it wants to later.

The world is going to be a really, really fucking scary place in another decade or two.

I agree that laws should go on the books sooner rather than later in specifically in regard to drones and people's rights.

[ClydeR]

Does anyone think Rand Paul is wrong in this instance?

Does anybody think the issue of the constitutionality of using drone strikes on American soil is different is any way whatsoever from the issue of the constitutionality of using a bayonet to kill someone on American soil? The headline for this thread might just as well have been "small minds fear new technology."

[Fallen]

Does anybody think the issue of the constitutionality of using drone strikes on American soil is different is any way whatsoever from the issue of the constitutionality of using a bayonet to kill someone on American soil?

Yes.

[Latrinsorm]

Does anyone think Rand Paul is wrong in this instance?Americans can and have been killed by police without first being charged with a crime, thousands per year, in some cases when it turned out that they (the Americans) were 100% innocent. We have even had cases where death row prisoners were cleared. Excuse me if in this light I find it hard to give a fuck about what robot planes might someday hypothetically do.

He strikes me as knowingly wrong and pandering.
Drone policy aside this is giving him a crazy amount of publicity.What an entirely unforeseeable outcome!!!

How am I, I of all people being the only cynic in this thread?

[Androidpk]

Americans can and have been killed by police without first being charged with a crime, thousands per year, in some cases when it turned out that they (the Americans) were 100% innocent. We have even had cases where death row prisoners were cleared. Excuse me if in this light I find it hard to give a fuck about what robot planes might someday hypothetically do.

He strikes me as knowingly wrong and pandering.What an entirely unforeseeable outcome!!!

How am I, I of all people being the only cynic in this thread?


It isn't just about drone strikes. It's about the Constitution being skirted when the executive branch feels like it.

[Buckwheet]

Much respect for actually doing it Mr Smith style.

[Methais]

“I rise today to begin to filibuster John Brennan’s nomination for the C.I.A.,” Mr. Paul began. “I will speak until I can no longer speak. I will speak as long as it takes, until the alarm is sounded from coast to coast that our Constitution is important, that your rights to trial by jury are precious, that no American should be killed by a drone on American soil without first being charged with a crime, without first being found to be guilty by a court.” -Rand Paul

I think it would be awesome if drone strikes were used in place of lethal injection for the death penalty.

[4a6c1]

Damn that's pretty impressive.

Yeah it is.

[Jarvan]

Does anybody think the issue of the constitutionality of using drone strikes on American soil is different is any way whatsoever from the issue of the constitutionality of using a bayonet to kill someone on American soil? The headline for this thread might just as well have been "small minds fear new technology."

The President doesn't order the military to kill someone with a bayonet because they can't capture them.

[Latrinsorm]

It isn't just about drone strikes. It's about the Constitution being skirted when the executive branch feels like it.Oh, oh, the Constitution! And how many children has the Constitution buried? Zero? Well, that is definitely worth heroically grandstanding about and ignoring a city block of actual dead people with parents, kids, futures... strike that last one.

Jarvan sarcastically asked me once in another thread which population I would prefer as a tyrant, and this is it. The population that gets eagerly caught up in what these scary robots might do in an arbitrarily defined geography because, hey, some piece of paper might say that it's wrong. Meanwhile, my police force can break into your house and shoot you in the head without a warrant, without any serious repercussions. Bonus, I get you to argue about whether your rifles would prevent what already happened from happening.

[Jarvan]

Oh, oh, the Constitution! And how many children has the Constitution buried? Zero? Well, that is definitely worth heroically grandstanding about and ignoring a city block of actual dead people with parents, kids, futures... strike that last one.

Jarvan sarcastically asked me once in another thread which population I would prefer as a tyrant, and this is it. The population that gets eagerly caught up in what these scary robots might do in an arbitrarily defined geography because, hey, some piece of paper might say that it's wrong. Meanwhile, my police force can break into your house and shoot you in the head without a warrant, without any serious repercussions. Bonus, I get you to argue about whether your rifles would prevent what already happened from happening.

Just on a side note, would you be ok then if say a President Rubio used a drone strike against an eco-terrorist group that he felt poised a danger to the Keystone Pipeline?

[4a6c1]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-E_KSlkfJEvY/T9pxxdAvg2I/AAAAAAAADKI/ukA3IQIcsho/s1600/345fbdd4_Stephen-Colbert-Popcorn.gif

[Androidpk]

Oh, oh, the Constitution! And how many children has the Constitution buried? Zero? Well, that is definitely worth heroically grandstanding about and ignoring a city block of actual dead people with parents, kids, futures... strike that last one.

Jarvan sarcastically asked me once in another thread which population I would prefer as a tyrant, and this is it. The population that gets eagerly caught up in what these scary robots might do in an arbitrarily defined geography because, hey, some piece of paper might say that it's wrong. Meanwhile, my police force can break into your house and shoot you in the head without a warrant, without any serious repercussions. Bonus, I get you to argue about whether your rifles would prevent what already happened from happening.


Calm down, ClydeR.

[Latrinsorm]

Just on a side note, would you be ok then if say a President Rubio used a drone strike against an eco-terrorist group that he felt poised a danger to the Keystone Pipeline?You've got it all wrong, broski. I am on the side where the government killings are already, currently too much. I am not on the side where we accept the thousands of dead by government handgun but absolutely draw the line when some might someday be killed by government skyfall.

Put more succinctly, I'm not arguing drones are great. I'm arguing why the hell are you letting yourself be distracted by them when they have killed 0 and good old fashioned police work has killed more Americans than you have ever learned the name of.

Priorities.
Calm down, ClydeR.Okay.

One person tells me tens of thousands of people have been murdered with no recourse.
Another person tells me nobody has been killed, but if it ever does happen it will go against what our Brave and Noble Founders have envisioned.

You say another person is speaking "good stuff", and you tell me to hear one person's words with calmness. How am I to look at you except with incredulity? I am only human, Terrence's scurrilous accusations notwithstanding.

[Androidpk]

ClydeR is only human too.

[Latrinsorm]

It is a matter of public record that he is an Irish-Indianian, neither of which fit that bill.

[Androidpk]

I'm enjoying the comments by other people on other news websites.

Rand is crazy
Rand is a traitor
Rand loves terrorists
The GOP are traitors
The GOP are terrorists

Some of these people even make Back seem semi-intelligent. That scares me a lot.

[Jarvan]

I'm enjoying the comments by other people on other news websites.

Rand is crazy
Rand is a traitor
Rand loves terrorists
The GOP are traitors
The GOP are terrorists

Some of these people even make Back seem semi-intelligent. That scares me a lot.

The funniest part to me is the fact that a lot of the same people saying those kinds of things, are against drone strikes.

[Androidpk]

And to think he's doing all of this with no teleprompter.

[Methais]

And to think he's doing all of this with no teleprompter.

I hope he throws that out there at some point.

[Androidpk]

I hope he throws that out there at some point.

At one point Cruz was reading off a bunch of tweets that people were writing about, one of them said something about Paul giving a better speech on peace than Obama has ever given, and with no teleprompter involved too.

[4a6c1]

Anybody gotta link to the whole thing. I'm not a news junkie or anything. I can stop when I want to.

[Androidpk]

http://www.c-span.org/Live-Video/C-SPAN2/

[4a6c1]

thnx. at first it took me to a gun violence speech and i was like /pk is a meaniehead/

[Bobmuhthol]

That happened.

[4a6c1]

Say it in ebonics.

[Androidpk]

thnx. at first it took me to a gun violence speech and i was like /pk is a meaniehead/

I am.

[Methais]

Say it in ebonics.

Shit went down nigga! DAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMNNN!!!

[Parkbandit]

Seriously though.. who is for a President being able to use drones to kill Americans on American soil? Obama won't be President forever and I have a very difficult time believing this wouldn't be a concern in a Jeb Bush, Rand Paul or Marco Rubio Administration for those people supporting this decision now.

[Parkbandit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ym2b-nuZx0

[Fallen]

Yep, stewart has been a longtime critic of the drone program in general. Good bit.

[Parkbandit]

Yep, stewart has been a longtime critic of the drone program in general. Good bit.

To be fair.. I'm not against the drone program. Anything that can deal damage to our enemy while not putting our forces lives in danger I'm all for. But I am against a single individual having the power to be judge, jury and executioner.. no matter what party he belongs to. And that they come out with the policy that they 'probably won't use this power' is a bunch of bullshit.

[Gelston]

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2012/08/79_58158_0_JudgeDreddVol39I.jpg

[ClydeR]

The President doesn't order the military to kill someone with a bayonet because they can't capture them.

How can you be so sure? It's all secret, isn't it?

Paul is focusing on the constitutionality of using drones to kill Americans on American soil, as if the instrument of execution were relevant to its constitutionality. If we have to look at the Constitution each time somebody invents a new weapon to see if the Constitution restricts use of that weapon to kill people, then we're in trouble. I'll save you eye strain with this spoiler.. the Constitution never once mentions drones. Senator Paul must think it a terrible oversight by James Madison and the other founding fathers.

[Tenlaar]

Are drones considered arms? Do we have the right to bear drones?

OH GOD BEAR DRONES!

[Back]

So, a congressman brings everything to a halt just to ask a question he will not get an answer for and he is thought of as a hero or some radical champion of justice? How about not holding up our government for your political grandstanding and do the damn job you took no sequester pay cut for. Filibuster is obstructionism. Just what our congress needs more of.

[Tgo01]

So, a congressman brings everything to a halt just to ask a question he will not get an answer for and he is thought of as a hero or some radical champion of justice? How about not holding up our government for your political grandstanding and do the damn job you took no sequester pay cut for. Filibuster is obstructionism. Just what our congress needs more of.

Good point. If Rand Paul really wanted to be a hero he should have thrown people in jail who disagreed with him.

[Parkbandit]

How can you be so sure? It's all secret, isn't it?

Paul is focusing on the constitutionality of using drones to kill Americans on American soil, as if the instrument of execution were relevant to its constitutionality. If we have to look at the Constitution each time somebody invents a new weapon to see if the Constitution restricts use of that weapon to kill people, then we're in trouble. I'll save you eye strain with this spoiler.. the Constitution never once mentions drones. Senator Paul must think it a terrible oversight by James Madison and the other founding fathers.

By that shitty logic, each American should be allowed to have nuclear weapons and fighter jets.

I am glad to see you back to using the same arguments you used before creating "ClydeR". You should go ahead and quit posting under this login, create a new account and once again pretend to be something you aren't... a super right wing extremist.

At this point, you are just being too lazy to keep up your transparent facade..

[Parkbandit]

Good point. If Rand Paul really wanted to be a hero he should have thrown people in jail who disagreed with him.

lol

[Parkbandit]

Looks like McCain and Graham agree with Backlash:

Sen. Rand Paul’s filibuster didn’t thrill all of his colleagues.
Almost exactly 24 hours after the Kentucky freshman began his information-seeking filibuster against CIA nominee John O. Brennan, fellow Republican Sens. John McCain and Lindsey Graham took to the Senate floor to denounce his demands and say he was doing a “disservice” to the debate on drones.
“I don’t think what happened yesterday was helpful to the American people,” said Mr. McCain, Republicans’ presidential nominee in 2008 — who topped Mr. Paul’s father, former Rep. Ron Paul, in that year’s primary.
And where even Democrats praised Mr. Paul for using Senate rules properly to launch a filibuster, Mr. McCain said it was an abuse of rules that could hurt the GOP in the long run.
“What we saw yesterday is going to give ammunition to those who say the rules of the Senate are being abused,” the Arizona Republican said.
Mr. Paul said he was filibustering to get the administration to affirm it won’t kill non-combatant Americans in the U.S. — but Mr. Graham and Mr. McCain said that was a ludicrous question.
“I do not believe that question deserves an answer,” Mr. Graham said.
Mr. Graham and Mr. McCain led a Republican delegation that held a private dinner with President Obama on Wednesday, as Mr. Paul was holding the floor with help from other GOP colleagues.


Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2013/mar/7/graham-mccain-blast-paul-filibuster/#ixzz2MsLJxaiX
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter (http://ec.tynt.com/b/rw?id=ctd-fI3Dar4z1uacwqm_6r&u=washtimes)

[Tgo01]

Yeah, since when is asking someone who has the answer a good idea? Rand Paul should have just Googled the answer.

[Androidpk]

McCain is a dinosaur in the worst possible way. He needs to be voted out of office yesterday.

[Androidpk]

So, a congressman brings everything to a halt just to ask a question he will not get an answer for and he is thought of as a hero or some radical champion of justice? How about not holding up our government for your political grandstanding and do the damn job you took no sequester pay cut for. Filibuster is obstructionism. Just what our congress needs more of.

Congress itself is an obstruction. We should probably just get rid of it and hand complete control over to Obama. You'd probably love that idea.

[Parkbandit]

Congress itself is an obstruction.

Exactly.. this was the intention. Change shouldn't happen quickly.. just because some "special" group du jour wants {insert new right} TODAY!

[Ryvicke]

This was laughable, focus-grouped political "outrage." Rand Paul has already proven himself over and over again to be a vapid, soulless husk of disgusting ideas. Picking the easiest, most unanimously hideous target in recent memory (OMGRD DRONE KILLINGS OF YOUR AMERICAN FAMILY ON AMERICAN SOIL) to grandstand about for 12+ hours. Thank god dude had to pee and ended it.

[ClydeR]

Sen. Rand Paul's filibuster didn't thrill all of his colleagues. Almost exactly 24 hours after the Kentucky freshman began his information-seeking filibuster against CIA nominee John O. Brennan, fellow Republican Sens. John McCain and Lindsey Graham took to the Senate floor to denounce his demands and say he was doing a "disservice" to the debate on drones.

Congrats to McCain and Graham for seeing through the drone cloud!

[Bobmuhthol]

This was laughable, focus-grouped political "outrage." Rand Paul has already proven himself over and over again to be a vapid, soulless husk of disgusting ideas. Picking the easiest, most unanimously hideous target in recent memory (OMGRD DRONE KILLINGS OF YOUR AMERICAN FAMILY ON AMERICAN SOIL) to grandstand about for 12+ hours. Thank god dude had to pee and ended it.You say all that, which is great, but I'd still feel a lot better if my president walked onto a stage, said, "I will not kill American citizens with robots," and walked away.

[Ryvicke]

You say all that, which is great, but I'd still feel a lot better if my president walked onto a stage, said, "I will not kill American citizens with robots," and walked away.

It's clear that's not going to happen. We all must live in fear.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/03/obama-admin-says-it-can-use-lethal-force-against-americans-us-soil

[Tenlaar]

We've already started down a road here. We use them to kill unidentified targets outside the country. We use them for surveillance inside the country. It's not a very big step from there.

It's not fear so much as an educated guess based on the way everything has happened ever.

[Gelston]

It's clear that's not going to happen. We all must live in fear.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/03/obama-admin-says-it-can-use-lethal-force-against-americans-us-soil

As long as it stays in one of those extraordinary circumstances mentioned in your article there. I know slippery slope is an often used term, but it is getting greased up. I'm not saying that it will happen today, tomorrow, but what aobut 40 years from now? Original intent gets blurred pretty damn easily by time.

[Androidpk]

I would like to know what extraordinary circumstances made them target and blow up a 16 year old American kid in Yemen.

[4a6c1]

Israeli stockholme syndrome logic - kill the next generation before it can grow into terrorist. :[

[Ryvicke]

As long as it stays in one of those extraordinary circumstances mentioned in your article there. I know slippery slope is an often used term, but it is getting greased up. I'm not saying that it will happen today, tomorrow, but what aobut 40 years from now? Original intent gets blurred pretty damn easily by time.

I've just never understood how this is a gamechanger. Has anyone asked Obama to stand on a stage and say he won't scramble fighter jets to mangle a terrorist compound in the US?

If the US really goes down the Glenn Beck apocalypse batshit SOCIALIST tyrant route, I see no difference between a drone with an explosive missile and any other type of aircraft with an explosive missile. Both have pilots, unless the populace suddenly has access to advanced anti-aircraft ordnance both pilots can be thought to be relatively safe carrying out whatever civil war PATRIOT mission they've been assigned to.

Currently, if you're pulling some Waco-type-shit, the government is going to come and fuck up your compound, one way or another. I could give a fuck whether it's a remote control helicopter or a helicopter with someone in it.

As far as I know the oversight under which we wage war is the same for drones as it is for a fighter pilot or a SEAL team. It's not like Obama has a little drone station in the White House and he climbs in and starts pew-pew'ing people, they've spoke again and again about the review procedures--guidelines that in some cases are really fucking creepy--but they're no different from when we used actionable intelligence to bomb before drones. Drones are deployed by the same armed forces we trust to deploy all of our other armaments. It always seems a bit funny when someone misrepresents drones like Obama himself is masterminding their usage, and that they're "robots" that fly themselves. It's a tool that saves American lives, not science fiction.

I guess in the end to me it's a airplane without a pilot inside of it, not a robot. We've had airplanes drop bombs on people for as long as we've had airplanes and bombs, with review procedures in place for decades regarding when, where and why we do that. I don't see how the guy controlling the airplane and the bombs being somewhere else all the sudden changed the facts.

[Gelston]

I'm not particularly pointing at Obama. I'm point at follow on generations of Presidents.

[Ryvicke]

Gamechanger: warrantless wire-tapping and electronic surveillance of American citizens. Now that's fucking scary.

[Ryvicke]

I'm not particularly pointing at Obama. I'm point at follow on generations of Presidents.

Yeah I get you but if you're going to trust further presidents with our military, you're trusting them with the ability to fly over shit and bomb it, drones or not.

[Tenlaar]

and that they're "robots" that fly themselves.

Do you really not see how this is the groundwork for that exact thing? Yesterday we had manned aircraft. Today we have unmanned aircraft. Tomorrow we have automated aircraft.

[Androidpk]

The military is currently working on drones that fly themselves completely as well as determine when to use lethal force.

[4a6c1]

Murica! But what about jobs??

Northrup Grumman is hardcore recruiting for drone pilots. Requirements are engineering experience and MUST LOVE VIDEO GAMES. Calm down, calm down I made that up, you guys stopped caring about human rights for a minute though, didn't you??

[Androidpk]

Murica! But what about jobs??

Northrup Grumman is hardcore recruiting for drone pilots. Requirements are engineering experience and MUST LOVE VIDEO GAMES. Calm down, calm down I made that up, you guys stopped caring about civil rights for a minute though, didn't you??

The CIA still hasn't contacted me. I am disappoint.

[Parkbandit]

The military is currently working on drones that fly themselves completely as well as determine when to use lethal force.

http://aviewfromtheright.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/terminator-skynet-logo.jpg

[4a6c1]

The CIA still hasn't contacted me. I am disappoint.

rofl. But did you tell them you've seen the Bond movies like a zillion times????

[Tenlaar]

They'll be coming for us all, soon.

http://m.cdn.blog.hu/ol/olomuveg/image/design+/matrixsentinel.jpg

[4a6c1]

Hah. Here we go

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2013/01/11/drone-pilots-jobs/?utm_campaign=Hodes+Social+Accelerator-2013-02&utm_content=EV&utm_medium=Hodes+Social+Accelerator&utm_source=%25%25LinkedIn%25%25&utm_term=2013-02-28-17-42-43

"And aerospace giants General Dynamics (GD), Northrop Grumman (NOC), Boeing (BA), and Lockheed Martin (LMT) are hoping to replace their retiring rank and file with drone-trained grads."

[Ryvicke]

Do you really not see how this is the groundwork for that exact thing? Yesterday we had manned aircraft. Today we have unmanned aircraft. Tomorrow we have automated aircraft.


The military is currently working on drones that fly themselves completely as well as determine when to use lethal force.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/nobody_boy/dyson.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/nobody_boy/dyson2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/nobody_boy/dyson3.jpg

[4a6c1]

lol ryvicke is freaking the fuck out

[Kastrel]

Rand Paul has already proven himself over and over again to be a vapid, soulless husk of disgusting ideas.

Oh my.

[Tenlaar]

http://global3.memecdn.com/shit-thats-crazy_o_869011.jpg

[Ryvicke]

SHYEAH IF MY MILES DYSONS DO NOT APPEAR IN THE CORRECT ORDER IT WILL TRIGGER THE DRONE ALGORITHMS AND U KNO WHAT HAPPENS THEN

[Parkbandit]

Looks like Rand Paul got exactly what he wanted:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BExpU2dCYAA2vbD.jpg:large

Good job Rand Paul.

[Gelston]

Okay, but what about a non-weaponized one? You know how much it would hurt to have one of those giant drones crash into you while on your morning job? I see your loophole, Mr Holder.

[4a6c1]

in4 define combat!

[4a6c1]

Tomorrows news: Rand Paul initiates filibuster demanding Holder define combat

[Bobmuhthol]

Well, I'm satisfied.

[Fallen]

Works for me.

[4a6c1]

Nope. Ryvicke, Drones are watching you pee!

[Ryvicke]

Nope. Ryvicke, Drones are watching you pee!

I require a signed letter from Eric Holder assuring me this is not the case.

I have not yet seen a letter from Eric Holder assuring me he won't attack non-combat-engaged Americans with tanks. Or slingshots. I would also like a signed letter attesting to the certainty that American police officers will not engage in combat with non-combat-engaged Americans.

I was sure that with this new technology we were going to change our entire philosophy where it concerns killing Americans. This was IMPORTANT WORK done by the Senator from Kentucky.

[Tgo01]

It's funny reading this thread and the Chavez thread. The same people are making these arguments "Chavez was a great man and leader!", "Republicans suck because some guy 'wasted' a whole 12 hours of the Senate's time by filibustering."

[Warriorbird]

It's funny reading this thread and the Chavez thread. The same people are making these arguments "Chavez was a great man and leader!", "Republicans suck because some guy 'wasted' a whole 12 hours of the Senate's time by filibustering."

We're not all Backlash, no matter how you like to claim it. You're not all Daragonians.

[4a6c1]

I dislike simplified explanations of complex political situations. I never said Chavez was a great man. :[

[Tgo01]

We're not all Backlash, no matter how you like to claim it. You're not all Daragonians.

Come on man, I didn't even say Democrats! I just said the same people because it's true.

[Latrinsorm]

Do you really not see how this is the groundwork for that exact thing? Yesterday we had manned aircraft. Today we have unmanned aircraft. Tomorrow we have automated aircraft.Unmanned aircraft are no more indicators of automated aircraft than the telephone is. You're comparing signal transmission to computer programming.
Looks like Rand Paul got exactly what he wanted:He got what he wanted as soon as the cameras turned on.
I have not yet seen a letter from Eric Holder assuring me he won't attack non-combat-engaged Americans with tanks. Or slingshots.Noticeable for its omission: any reference to a board with a nail through it.

[Tenlaar]

Unmanned aircraft are no more indicators of automated aircraft than the telephone is. You're comparing signal transmission to computer programming.

It is the next logical step in the progress of the technology. I'm not saying there will be robots ruling the skies in a year, but ten years from now? Twenty? You tell your little drone what area it's in charge of and off it goes. I find it just plain foolish to think that it will never happen.

[Ryvicke]

This just hit:

http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in

Watch out! It's not from the Weekly Standard or Fox News. It has quotes from people involved on the record and looks like it took about two years of hounding for the story. Actual journalism, etc.

[4a6c1]

Cool story bro. Last year everybody was like HEY DO YOU KNOW CHINESE WE REALLY NEED CHINESE. So I'm like, chill bro, I'll learn chinese. So this year everybody is like HEY DOES ANYONE KNOW YEMENI ARABIC. No, nobody speaks yemeni arabic. Nobody fucking wants to know yemeni arabic because Fuck Yemen. Next year it will be fish language and we will learn how to blow bubbles at each other for free college money. GOD. This world.

Unrelated rant with no link and minimal intrinsic value.

[Ryvicke]

Last time I heard a story like that I was all, "damn girl you don't know yemeni arabic?" and straight up left the club.

READ MY LINK AND COMMENT ON IT. SERIOUS DISCUSSION STYLE.

[4a6c1]

To be completely honest I'm thankful for people like yourself. I'm sick of war. My whole life has been about this war and everytime I try to take a step away from it I only seem to get closer. These things don't bother me anymore and I don't understand why but whatever. I want them dead, all dead. Just say no to traitors. People like you need to exist to keep people like me in check because seriously dude, I would drone their faces....all their faces. Stay outraged my friends. Dos Equis.

[Ryvicke]

To be completely honest I'm thankful for people like yourself. I'm sick of war. My whole life has been about this war and everytime I try to take a step away from it I only seem to get closer. These things don't bother me anymore and I don't understand why but whatever. I want them dead, all dead. Just say no to traitors. People like you need to exist to keep people like me in check because seriously dude, I would drone their faces....all their faces. Stay outraged my friends. Dos Equis.

omg Rojo did you not study all my shitty longass posts in this thread. I'm pro-drone! Let's have a baby rambo and teach him how to end all wars through death. He (SHE!) will speak chinese arabic and drink blood.

[4a6c1]

I would SO have a baby rambo with you but my uterus is a vodka soaked husk. If you want to crawl in my cavergina and wiggle a little we might create a new SARS virus. I'm down!

Wait that article you posted was pretty negative......okay let me go read it again...

[Ryvicke]

I would SO have a baby rambo with you but my uterus is a vodka soaked husk. If you want to crawl in my cavergina and wiggle a little we might create a new SARS virus. I'm down!

Wait that article you posted was pretty negative......okay let me go read it again...

Like our future child I am sustained only through uteral blood with a PH <=3. GOLDEN.

I think it's more like "oh hey here's the story behind the first time since the Civil War that America consciously killed Americans," and "it's kind of a fucked up story."

EDIT: more interesting for the level of access the Times got to the actual people entrusted with the legality of the operation and the years of planning that went into it.

[Kastrel]

Am I reading Lovecraft and I don't realize it? This discussion has descended into the stuff of nightmares.

[Ryvicke]

Am I reading Lovecraft and I don't realize it? This discussion has descended into the stuff of nightmares.

You are reading Philip K and robots are coming to melt your face right. the fuck. now.

[Ryvicke]

Hey this forum got so much easier to post to from bars with Tapatalk. Cool stuff Kranar.

Let's not get off topic:

http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in
http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in
http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in
http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in
http://nyti.ms/Yjx0in

[4a6c1]

Okay im sorry. I was a skimming asshole at first. That piece is excellently written. So there is not only legal basis but precedent for us to kill traitorous americans. Also Im calling this an opsec alert. Journalist has really really good information. :-/

[4a6c1]

Am I reading Lovecraft and I don't realize it? This discussion has descended into the stuff of nightmares.

I...you're grossed out by my cavergina or my putrid uterus?? :cry: Don't you dare badmouth my bastard SARS hatechild with Ryvicke!

[Kastrel]

I...you're grossed out by my cavergina or my putrid uterus?? :cry: Don't you dare badmouth my bastard SARS hatechild with Ryvicke!

I am more curious as to why you preserved your bodily organs with vodka. What was it doing down there?

[Latrinsorm]

Bats like to party too. Just look at SHAFT's avatar.

[subzero]

But I am against a single individual having the power to be judge, jury and executioner.. no matter what party he belongs to. And that they come out with the policy that they 'probably won't use this power' is a bunch of bullshit.

Meh, don't worry. The Joint Chiefs of Staff weren't seriously considering implementing Operation Northwoods in the 60s, either. It was just one of those things, ya know? Gotta have plans. Yeah; plans. Just in case.

[Androidpk]

Meh, don't worry. The Joint Chiefs of Staff weren't seriously considering implementing Operation Northwoods in the 60s, either. It was just one of those things, ya know? Gotta have plans. Yeah; plans. Just in case.

Just like the military would never expose American towns and cities to chemical weapons unknowingly. For research. ;)

[subzero]

You say all that, which is great, but I'd still feel a lot better if my president walked onto a stage, said, "I will not kill American citizens with robots," and walked away.

Does it really matter if they lie to your face? He can walk up and say that on camera, turn around and shit all over it, and they'll have cover stories and excuses coming out of their ass to smooth things over. The sheeple will be riled up for a bit, but eventually they'll settle down and everything will keep on a'movin.

We don't even have to look that far back in history to see that it doesn't matter in the end. Clinton, while not killing people getting Oval Office oral, flat out lied several times to the country. Bush fed us all a pile of steaming WMD bullshit, though, and how many have died thanks to that debacle? Nothing was done to those guys. People still think Clinton was the fucking man and Bush, well, I don't think his lying changed anyone's mind about him one way or another let alone did either suffer any actual consequences.

I'm sure if the government decides to label someone a terrorist and they blast the dude out of his boots, they can spin it so the sheeple believe the right thing was done to protect them. Afterall, as long as those drones aren't harassing us, who cares? They're keeping us safe, America!


Gamechanger: warrantless wire-tapping and electronic surveillance of American citizens. Now that's fucking scary.

The scary thing with shit like the Patriot Act is there is not a clear definition of a terrorist. People like to bend rules and the people of the government are no damn exception. Who's to say what someone may decide constitutes terrorism in the future?


Well, I'm satisfied.


Works for me.

See, this is what makes it so easy for them to get away with shit and they know it. They will lie to you whenever it suits them. Robert Gibbs, Obama's former Press Secretary, was told not to even acknowledge the drone program (http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/gibbs-drones-obama-talk-fight-club-174044860--politics.html). If we had some secret program that people didn't know about, why would he be informed not to acknowledge the existence of such a program? Well, it wasn't as secret as they would have liked... people knew about it and were asking questions. His job was to be Baghdad Bob and tell you suckers that you've got it all wrong, there are no drones, no drone program, your intelligence sucks, we wouldn't do that.

Since we like official documents, you might want to peruse the declassified Operation Northwoods docs: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/

They will lie to you and kill whoever they want if they feel it puts them in a better position for whatever their goals. Just ask Kennedy.

[Allereli]

“If someone comes out of a liquor store with a weapon and $50 in cash, I don’t care if a drone kills him or a policeman kills him,” he added later.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/23/rand-paul-faces-blowback-after-new-drone-comments/?hpt=hp_t3

wow

[Tgo01]

Yeah that was a bit over the top. 100 dollars in cash I can understand, but 50 dollars? Come on, we're Americans, we have standards.