Monk training post level 70

[Androidpk]

I've never had a character this high level before so I'd like to get some tips on where I should be
putting my TPs as I get ready for the higher level hunting areas.


In spell research I have up to 1220. Nothing in the 100 circle yet.





http://i47.tinypic.com/2vshiq0.jpg

[Kastrel]

Depending on where you are going:

MIU/AS ranks for Spell Burst if you are spell tanking to any degree
Perception for ambush/maneuver defense

[Lord Orbstar]

That is a LOT of MoC. If you can get better Lore for higher armor base, that would be good. This is me at Cap (+)

Liannonuel (at level 100), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Two Weapon Combat..................| 201 101
Combat Maneuvers...................| 302 202
Ranged Weapons.....................| 0 0
Brawling...........................| 302 202
Ambush.............................| 230 130
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 105 25
Physical Fitness...................| 403 303
Dodging............................| 403 303
Magic Item Use.....................| 0 0
Harness Power......................| 150 50
Mental Mana Control................| 102 24
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 175 75
Stalking and Hiding................| 299 199
Perception.........................| 182 82
Climbing...........................| 138 39
Swimming...........................| 176 76

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 30

Spell Lists
Minor Mental.......................| 20



Obviously i am just playing with ambush and hide with extra points.

[Androidpk]

Until recently I had 40 ranks of MoC. I changed some skills around, bumped that along with bringing rolling krynch from 2 ranks to 3 ranks and I've noticed a HUGE difference in how often krynch will proc when I carry over on to a new target. I love it.

[Androidpk]

Where do you hunt, Orbastar? Any difficulties?

[Kastrel]

Definitely a good point on the MOC. You could drop 20 ranks and get back 200/80 TPs. That would be enough to knock you up to the next AsG through Transformation lore, which would up you from Brig to Chain, keeping in mind of course that in 4 levels, you will also increase 1 AsG, bringing you to Double Chain. You can then single MOC and bring it back up to 90 slowly.

[Lord Orbstar]

I hunt Nelemar. I am using normal 5x robes with no padding or resistances and 4x hand/foot wraps. I dropped Krynch stance as useless in the Temple. Slippery mind is all I run. It is CS that murders or when a Triton Radical casts some nasty spell. I can hide and jump out of them pretty well, but I am dropping hide/ambush for a second weapon style and maybe some MIU. Stance dancing is not very important, since my DS even in Offense is just fine. Again, the no padding and resistances on the robe are what cost me my life on occasion.

Liannonuel, your Combat Maneuver training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 1
Feint feint 5
Combat Mobility mobility 1
Surge of Strength surge 3
Evade Mastery emastery 3
Burst of Swiftness burst 3
Perfect Self perfectself 5
Punch Mastery punchmastery 3
Kick Mastery kmastery 2
Grapple Mastery gmastery 2
Slippery Mind slipperymind 3
Flurry of Blows flurry 3


I will use feint sometimes and spells just for flavor to mix it up.

[Androidpk]

Definitely a good point on the MOC. You could drop 20 ranks and get back 200/80 TPs. That would be enough to knock you up to the next AsG through Transformation lore, which would up you from Brig to Chain, keeping in mind of course that in 4 levels, you will also increase 1 AsG, bringing you to Double Chain. You can then single MOC and bring it back up to 90 slowly.

I had 30 ranks at one point, giving me chain equivalent. I'm still hunting on the plateau, though, and inside the labyrinth. Critters there were doing more damage to me with chain over scale so I dropped back down. I'm not too concerned about it at the moment, especially since iron skin doesn't add CvA coverage.

[SpiffyJr]

I'm 60 and train in real armor (currently using double chain, goal is augmented). I'm converting mental TPs so it would cost me 1200 TPs to do what 600 TPs are currently doing. I'm also 1x MoC so I'm somewhat similar to your build. Iron Skin is cool and all but without the CvA it's essentially useless. Warding spells will ruin your day in a hurry without the CvA boost.

[Androidpk]

Does sonic armor have CvA?

[subzero]

Getting 120 isn't going to hurt. You could probably free up some points by dropping some HP, too. At 89 I've got 33 ranks.

[Androidpk]

I think getting to 120 will be my first order of business.

[neimanz1]

I don't think you need the 3x dodge when you 3x in pf already. Thats more like a post capped goal. eats up way too much tps.

[Androidpk]

That's not a bad idea. If I drop MoC to 60 ranks, HP to 40, and dodge to 2x.. that would give me enough TPs to get up to 120.

[Aluvius]

I think most of the increase with Krynch carrying over is from going from 2 to 3 ranks. MOC is supposed to only help mitigate the penalty for Krynch from up-hunting. Unless you are up-hunting which I guess I should haved asked first. :)

Going up to 120 is definitely your best bet. Are you mstriking with that build? If not maybe drop down to .5x TWC if you need more points.

Spiffyjr, how's the spell hinderance? I have to setup with 1207 on most critters. Well, maybe I don't HAVE to but it makes UAC seem a bit less slow anyway.

[Androidpk]

I'm always up-hunting for the most part.

[Zelas]

For 80 trains of armor use you get MBP and +33 CvA in your favor. If a monk is not casting in the field is that a viable path? What say ye of the Senate?

Zelas

[Lord Orbstar]

I may change my training and switch to plate armor instead of using iron skin. i have some 7x HCP breastplate I can wear. So much for evasion though...

[Zelas]

Yeah i'm considering it since warding seems to be what kills monks the most and MBP can be padded. Though trippling in dodge still gives you a good awful good chance to evade despite being in plate, but with high monk ds who cares? Especially if you have hcp. If they change Iron Skin to have better CvA then I think it's viable but at cap warding spells will murder you.

[SpiffyJr]

I think most of the increase with Krynch carrying over is from going from 2 to 3 ranks. MOC is supposed to only help mitigate the penalty for Krynch from up-hunting. Unless you are up-hunting which I guess I should haved asked first. :)

Going up to 120 is definitely your best bet. Are you mstriking with that build? If not maybe drop down to .5x TWC if you need more points.

Spiffyjr, how's the spell hinderance? I have to setup with 1207 on most critters. Well, maybe I don't HAVE to but it makes UAC seem a bit less slow anyway.

I prefer the hinderance over CS pwn shots.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

i dont think he needs to worry much about miu or as unless he wants scrolls or to use maybe something that needs miu to activate(minimal training). I have a haste ring that requires 11 ranks. Also with the spell burst my monk can have 23 or so mana at 87 trains so he uses 401 406 503 and 911 at 21. With that setup he has 460 offensive ds and around 680 defensive(not shabby in otf hunting aqueducts and even into initiates).

As for perception I agree he needs to get some work done getting that singled.

OP'er you could drop ambush to around 30-35 ranks and be fine at aiming. Anything higher will increase the chance but by a small amount. At that high of a lvl with cmans almost doulbed thatll give you great aim. You honestly should add the points from ambush to double cmans. With those points you could get perfect self or evade to max(I recommend both prolly evade first).

I would also suggest dropping two weapon down to 1 rank til post cap. You do get defensive bonus from the training but points would be more viable in transformation to boost your armors asg. At 1 rank I see a bonus of 9 im pretty sure(spacey) to def id have to double check about off. Also with one rank you do see a lot more parrying than with none.

Your harness power is really high I understand if you cast a lot that you may want that but with my monk and GoS I never run out of mana. I used to cast more in the bowels(1207) but in otf I mainly feint critters so I dont use much mana, but on the other hand hunting in otf I pop sigil of major protection often(for the crit padding). I use it whenever my character hears faint footstep to counter act the gremlocks garrote manuever. At 22 ranks I have 76 mana I couldnt imagine how much you have at 55. I do understand it boosts spell burst mana, but if you refer to what I poster higher up you may not need these ranks til post cap.

I do like singling in MoC for krynch as it helps with maintaining a high advantage when switching critters.

You could prolly also drop pt to 2-2.5x(im at about 2.25). I know redux and cmans and stuff are boosted by this but you can get it back up at cap and get your spell training up to atleast 107 for a few helpful spells. Which is also nice since your spells dont effect spell burst.

One other thing that is debateable is the combat focus I wouldnt go any higher than 3 ranks. Its cost vs bonus are to high(2 per rank). I can say monks have crap cva and the td helps but 4 for 15+ points is a lot. I really hope that monks will one day ::cross fingers:: get the boost from their asg that iron skin provides.

Sorry, im kinda of tired and I hope I didn't sound too special anywhere. Anywho have fun with your monk I sure have had a great time punching faces in with mine! Master of the Steel Fist -BUBBAcHEWY

[Androidpk]

I don't know if I mentioned it already but I did have him up to 30 ranks of transformation lores for chain equiv but I'm still hunting on the plateau and with chain equiv I was actually taking more damage and wounds so I dropped it back down. All of your other information sounds solid though, I'll check it out. Thanks.

I'm at 178 mana.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Hmm thats interesting. I'm not sure why that is ill research a bit(minos swing axes if im right that should do slash and crush dmg so thats a little weird theyd do more dgm exp with the higher asg). I really think that a monk should have a minimum of 75 ranks for iron skin, dragon claw, and brace(up to 78 for dragon claw is up to you since it only adds one more AS for the cost of 3 ranks. Past that is a bit much unless they decide to let monks get up to plate). :: prays:: :)

[Androidpk]

Well so far Finros has not, to my knowledge, commented on adding CvA to ironskin. Even with all the people harping on the officials for it.

Could also just dump points into armor and go for MBP. The ability to dodge is going to take a hit but you'll get a huge boost to CvA.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Thats a bummer about the cva. Would make the most sense to boost it accordingly. I think monks should be monks. It's kind of weird that any monk would even have to think about training in armor to boost their cva(iron skin with boost to avg but with no boost to cva is maybe a bad mechanic or is it balancing in some way?). Monks should be in cloth their bodies are what make them what they are. Not pots and pans warriors :) nothing against warriors by the way :( I do miss my warrior.

Yea the cva would be nice from mbp, but that one is highly debateable. I really hope monks dont have to train in armor to be viable vs casters.

+15(robes) vs -9(hauberk) cva = 24 point difference. 3/4-2/3 of the robes to hauberk bonus would even be nice.

Hopefully Finros will change his mind and see that us monks could atleast get a partial bonus of some sort.

[Androidpk]

I may change my training and switch to plate armor instead of using iron skin. i have some 7x HCP breastplate I can wear. So much for evasion though...

Let me know how this works out for you. I just played around with my points and came up with this


armor: 80
brawling: 150
twc: 1
CM: 150
MOC: 45
ambush: 30
PF: 225
dodging: 74
hp: 40
minor spiritual spells: 20
minor mental spells: 20
climb: 40
swim: 40
perception: 74

This would be fun to try out but I don't have a fixskills. I'm going to assume my DS would probably drop quit a lot.

I don't like the hide of being in metal armor either but near cap and at cap especially warding spells seem to be the biggest threat.


Hmm, I could also just suck it up and go 2x hide/ambush as well. I wouldn't be able to get up to 120 though immediately if I went that route though. Decisions, decisions.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Hiding as a monk is hard unless you can double. I was at 1.25-1.5 and I couldnt hide at all. Id cast the 100's fog spell and could barely hide. So id say maybe post cap that.

I really dont want to advise you to go into armor. Id say post cap train it up.

Right now you should be(in my opinion) 3x: dodge 2x: cman, brawl, pt 1x transformation to 75, MoC and perception. 30 ranks of climb and swim(you get 10 bonus to each for sigil of resolve) 107 and 1220 for spells 22-25 harness power 30-35 ranks of ambush 1 rank of twc.

[Androidpk]

I'm not too concerned about lores for ironskin mainly because of my DS. The only time I ever die is if I get hit by a manuever attack or I fail a warding roll.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Right now taints in the aqueducts are the only thing that give me a problem and thats because the can stun you with a spell that can last which seems up to 10 rnds. They have only killed me once from their disease manuever and a gremlock has killed me once from garrote(sigil of major protection will solve this), but if you switch up a few cmans you could get feint up to 5 ranks and just put then into rt and offensive stance and punch away.

1203 is also a good spell to make critters cast slower and 1218 will remove their spell can drain their mana and can damage/stun them.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Ok, definantly move around your cmans and get feint.

Besides that let me know how it goes when you are able to fixskill(5/20?) and try it out.

I am very interested because if cva doesnt change I may consider training in some armor myself.

[Androidpk]

Yeah, sometime in May unless some benevolent soul wants let lend me a fixskill potion.

[BUBBAcHEWY]

Monks are an awesome class and I have ideas for some changes and additions to their abilities and skills.

Ill start a new thread soon so we can put our ideas out there.

I hope to have some thought provoking discussions with others on my ideas and any of theirs that could make the monk a better(not broken or op) profession.

[Geijon Khyree]

You guys have capped Monks in prime? Christ.

[FlayedAngel]

You guys have capped Monks in prime? Christ.

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050817111315/uncyclopedia/images/f/f7/Zoidberg_jesus.jpg

MONKS.

[Androidpk]

You guys have capped Monks in prime? Christ.

Yeah but none that are fresh from 0. Ratboner is probably the highest non-convert at 50 or so but he doesn't count since he's a brown nosing douchebag.

[Aluvius]

Don't base any future plans on monks getting any additional dev attention. I've fought the good fight on the officials for months now asking for minor reasonable tweaks and all its elicited has been anger and pushback. There just aren't enough monks using open UAC and posting there to generate enough attention. And as usual half of the posters there seem to think that any criticism of a game system is a personal attack on the game and I guess by extension themselves.

Its frustrating. When the armor/shield penalties were reduced and the attack masteries opened up to rogues/warriors it was because there were a lot of people complaining. Unfortunately those changes also moved monks down to a mid or bottom tier when it comes to effective use of UAC from the open. I guess the bright side is that monks can now spend 10/0 a rank to train up Armor Use, too. Lol. :)

[Methais]

Does Transformation Lore let monks transform into pandas?

[Lord Orbstar]

no. it does not.

[Buckwheet]

So I took the plunge with my new build. I really have no idea what it will lead to, but fixskills are cheap enough that I don't really care.



Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 180 80
Combat Maneuvers...................| 302 202
Brawling...........................| 302 202
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 145 45
Physical Fitness...................| 403 303
Dodging............................| 403 303
Arcane Symbols.....................| 201 101
Magic Item Use.....................| 162 62
Harness Power......................| 150 50
Mental Mana Control................| 102 24
Spirit Mana Control................| 102 24
Perception.........................| 201 101
Climbing...........................| 150 50
Swimming...........................| 150 50

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 20

Spell Lists
Minor Mental.......................| 80


I use burst calc which is fairly accurate which tells me I can wear 74.5 mana so lets just call it 65 mana and be good. So That would mean 401, 406, 414, 911, 503, 618, 601, 202, 509 without bursting. This will be perma hasted with flaring gloves and weapon doing 1 second jab spam with flurry of blows wearing either HCP Aug chain or metal breastplate. I have not decided on either, but trained for both. No plans to cast anything other than provoke in combat.

The biggest issue I had was with being warded, and the heavier armor really will make a difference I think.

It was a really hard toss up going to 80 mental ranks because I just don't know how much the bonus to CM defense it will give me. The .5 DS per rank is the same as 120 and you would have the benefit of going to 140 if you really needed that extra DS boost. So you would add 10 more DS for an unknown amount of CM protection loss. Guess I will find out.

[Aluvius]

Do you mean the maneuver defense from 1220 when you're talking about CM defense for training the mental list instead of spirit? I wasn't aware it scaled up with spell training along with the DS bonus ... if so, neat!

That build sounds like a chainsaw, all yer missing is bubble flares on the gloves heh.

I stuck some on a 4x pair of uac boots (didn't have the money to do my 6x gloves, sad I know lol). Figure when I play my monk again he'll occasionally kick to keep up the bubble. :)

[Buckwheet]

The caster gets a defensive bonus against maneuver attacks that can be evaded and +20 Defensive Strength (DS) +1 DS for every 2 Minor Mental spell ranks beyond 20.

It doesn't really say. So thats what I wanted to find out. Since you get the same increase in pure DS between the two spells, if it does give you added CM defense its better to have the mental.

[Aluvius]

Yeah plus you're getting progression from 1208 which will give you more td, definitely agree. I took the maneuver part to be the smr type instead of cm though maybe its both?