Simu Bug

[OriginalPranksta]

There is a major bug in GS that when you check into an inn, you are able to max out any and all stats you want. Here is a demo on how one would access this bug.

**Note.. this can warrant a 30 day ban if you are not careful about the use, but this is basically an idea where if 200 people use it, Simu will realize they suck and actually FIX something instead of blaming their problems on us.

Okay, back to the bug:

Let's say you are a cleric that wants to max out Edged Weapons, Combat Maneuvers, and Dodging.. here is the key for skills in the inn

4 = edged 33 = MjS
11 = CM 34 = MnS
15 = dodge 35 = Cleric

this particular cleric has 40 major spirit, 40 minor spirit, and 60 cleric spells and is 50th training
*Dramatization*
Check in
33 -40
34 -40
35 -60
4 +52
11 +52
15 +52
Check out
Check in
4 -52
11 -52
15 -52
33 +40
34 +40
35+60
Check out

[OriginalPranksta]

Now... the explination.. you lower stats that you already have to 0. You then raise 3 or 4 skills of your choice to thier max, and check out of the inn. Check back into the in right away and lower those 3 or 4 skills you just raised back to 0, and raise the skills you took away to their original position

[OriginalPranksta]

Note: this will NOT automatically raise all the skills you raise to their max, sometimes it will raise 1 point, sometimes 100... it changes. If it does not work a few times in a row, try changing inns, seems to work better. Also, spells are more difficult to raise than skills. If certain combos arent working, play around, mix edged, brawling and CM, if that doesnt work, do thrown, mana control and lores... any combo has potential to work, and there is no limit to its use

[Trinitis]

...

and so after all that, you are back where you started..

[MrFeature]

No, it raises the skills randomly. I tried it earlier today. I dropped CM to 0 (from 50), and raise thrown and brawling to max, then dropped it. It raised thrown to 30 ranks, and brawling to max, then returned and swapped skills, those skills remained and the original CM was back at 50. (Note, all of these skills are migrating, so they are not technically at the max all the time, so 50 would be 49.990)

[Artha]

So that's how Emislity does it.

[OriginalPranksta]

no... it increases those 3-4 skills and maxes them eventually, slowly (VERY SLOWLY) migrating them back to 0...the process of migrating those skills back to 0 would take a year, hence, it being a bug to max all skills

[Edaarin]

So that's how Dyanne did it I guess?

Yikes. Bitter much?

[Straight-up]

Seems like a good way to get locked out to me. You guys go ahead and push it...I think I will keep playing..;)



Straight

[MrFeature]

If they lock out everyone, who will pay their bills?

[Hulkein]

I'm guessing now that it is being posted on somewhat popular forums a GM will notice it.

Let us know if you hear of anyone like Emislity being locked out.

[Hulkein]

Heh, word spreads fast.

[MrFeature]

Its not really a bug, its an construct feature. The engine isnt doing anything it shouldnt be. It would be rather hard to change it...

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by MrFeature
If they lock out everyone, who will pay their bills? DR saps.

[OriginalPranksta]

all 10 of them?

[Edaarin]

Why create a new handle to post this anyway?

[MrFeature]

Im guessing to protect himself.

[OriginalPranksta]

new? i didnt have an old

[MrFeature]

If they still had instant migration, this wouldnt be an issue, but then people could swap skills constantly... Seems this whole "Migrator" was a huge mistake. But then again, what isnt a mistake in gemstone?

[Artha]

I think they should make migration instant again for a week or two.

[MrFeature]

Or rather, have migration be instant, but have a number of migration points (bonus = migration points), and this number would rollover from the previous month (Say you used 500 points out of 1000 for that month, next month you'd have 1500 points to use.)

[Artha]

Or have it count total time instead of just in game time.

[Edaarin]

Or find a training plan that you like and stick to it...

[Soulpieced]

The main problem is with skills like trading in which people could just up it to 2x after a hunt. Sell off their gems, then raise it. Similar things can be done with other non-necessary skills in order to raise more hunting (or other exp gaining) stuff.

[MrFeature]

Exactly, and once your migration points have been used up, yer SOL.

[Brauden]

Greetings,

Yes it is true that a bug exists that allows the average player to max all of their skills. This isn't a revelation to myself or to my colleagues. A number of good-natured people brought this to my attention quite some time ago, for which I am grateful. I also applaud their morality. I've been tracking its existence for quite some time.

It's inevitable that problems creep into game systems, and it's inevitable that paths of easy advancement will beckon. I hope that those of you who are considering exploiting this bug will seriously consider the ramifications it will have on the Gemstone community.

Regards,
Brauden

[Bobmuhthol]

Seriously? Shit, I wish I didn't call that assist to have the ranks I gained from it removed.

[Blazing247]

I'm gonna call shenanigans on the Brauden post. Brauden would never be so polite in his posts. I enjoy Brauden's posts because he is blunt to the point of being a prick. I admire that.

<I hope that those of you who are considering exploiting this bug will seriously consider the ramifications it will have on the Gemstone community. >

a.k.a. we have no way of stopping this, so please don't screw us.

[Kitsun]

Maybe one of the kind mods here can tell us which of our neighborhood pranksters pulled that one up.

Almost feels like baiting for a nice big batch of bannings to me.

[imported_Kranar]

Impersonating Simu staff is an immediately bannable offense.

No such offense has occured.

[Hulkein]

Dear Brauden,

I miss you.

~Hulkein.

[Blazing247]

Hey, we should have a whole thread concerning Simu bugs- you know, to give Simu a heads up. :lol: Here's one- if you think the game is getting laggy and is gonna crash, go to your locker with a note and keep transferring items/notes to and from your locker. If you're lucky and time it just right, your items will dupe.

I think they fixed the bug where you stride into your locker, but I'm not sure.

[Artha]

There was one where you could crawl into your locker, even if you didn't have one in that town and crawl out to avoid paying. Not sure what'd happen if you didn't close it before you left. That definitely got fixed though.

[Anebriated]

there was one with old style arrows where you could eblade them before you converted them and then once they were converted they retained the properties of the eblade, so 4x flaring arrows that never faded...

[SpunGirl]

There used to be a bug where if you went into the deed shrine in Solhaven and logged out, you'd log back in outside the gates of the Landing. They fixed that one.

-K

[SpunGirl]

Also, it's no secret that GMs read this board, even if they don't post. So like... this isn't exactly a way to hand out clandestine information or whatever.

-K

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Brauden
Greetings,

Yes it is true that a bug exists that allows the average player to max all of their skills. This isn't a revelation to myself or to my colleagues. A number of good-natured people brought this to my attention quite some time ago, for which I am grateful. I also applaud their morality. I've been tracking its existence for quite some time.

It's inevitable that problems creep into game systems, and it's inevitable that paths of easy advancement will beckon. I hope that those of you who are considering exploiting this bug will seriously consider the ramifications it will have on the Gemstone community.

Regards,
Brauden

Thanks for the posted response, Brauden. I hope people will take it to heart. :)

HarmNone

[Jonty]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Seriously? Shit, I wish I didn't call that assist to have the ranks I gained from it removed.

If you plan on training anytime soon, you should because the skills that you want to increase for the train will be stuck at ASAP untill those extra ranks you gained are migrated away.... Unless exploiting the bug again gets you those skill ranks you want, but that'd be risky.

This happened tp my empath, though not purposely. I was going to switch lores, then saw the insane amount of time I had to wait, so I switched back and ended up with 11 extra ranks lores. Though, when I trained, a weapon ranks and two spell ranks were stuck at ASAP.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by SpunGirl
So like... this isn't exactly a way to hand out clandestine information or whatever.Someone should change the title to "Nothing to See Here" or "Doin' Fine" or "Not Methods for Taking Advantage of Bugs". Then we'd be golden!!

[Wezas]

I enjoyed the bug that let you trudge (and other verbs) out of a major sanct - still leaving anyone who was in your group when you cast in the major sanct.

Good for anyone who was afk.

>Hold XX
>Incant 220
>trudge out

[Drew2]

Originally posted by Wezas
I enjoyed the bug that let you trudge (and other verbs) out of a major sanct - still leaving anyone who was in your group when you cast in the major sanct.

Good for anyone who was afk.

>Hold XX
>Incant 220
>trudge out

That also worked for crawl. Jamus and I did it to a few people before they fixed it. It was teh funny.

My favorite time was when I took Solescape's corpse in one and crawled out and it took him 10 minutes to figure out he could just log off and log back in.

[Miss X]

Not sure if its even a bug but when I was hunting Maaghara tower and the Shrickhen would fear me then stun me for 10 rounds with their screaming spells. The fear would drop in one round and regardless of the length of the original stun, it would drop with the fear too! Saved my life a few times! :)

[Jonty]

Fear has always worked like that. Guess it's a bug not worth fixing?

The only bug that I know about really is when the archery range opens in ebon's gate, you can hurl the orange bows and then drag them away and pick them back up. It got me in the troubl0rz.

That and if you have too much free time you could set a script to go to a shop in town (i.e. the Gold paviliion in the Merchanting District I BUGed [I think they got rid of it]) which leaves empty containers from free drinks that can be sold at the pawnshop and then start running back and forth like some 100 silver crazy crackfiend to and fro.

[Caiylania]

Dateline 8/4/2004: SKILL MIGRATION

A long existing bug that allows the average player to max all of their skills has recently received an alarming increase in player attention over recent days. A number of good-natured people brought forward details of this some time ago, for which we are grateful.

It's inevitable that problems creep into game systems, and it's inevitable that paths of easy advancement will beckon. We sincerely hope that those of you who are considering exploiting this bug will seriously consider the ramifications it will have on the GemStone community.

We consider the exploitation of bugs to be a very serious offense. We will exercise zero tolerance for anyone participating in the exploitation of this bug and consider such activity grounds for immediate lock-out from GemStone IV.

Click next to read the next unread article.

[Nieninque]

Originally posted by Tayre
My favorite time was when I took Solescape's corpse in one and crawled out and it took him 10 minutes to figure out he could just log off and log back in.

Well he used that technique in lots of other situations afterwards

[Artha]

That and if you have too much free time you could set a script to go to a shop in town (i.e. the Gold paviliion in the Merchanting District I BUGed [I think they got rid of it]) which leaves empty containers from free drinks that can be sold at the pawnshop and then start running back and forth like some 100 silver crazy crackfiend to and fro.

Two people did that with wine at the landing festival. 4.2k a bottle, and apparently one of them made over 3 million before a GM said 'WTF'.

[Artha]

Apparently the only way to successfully do this bug is to fixskills down to 0, then do it like that. You also can't reset skills, and if you train you won't be able to get new skills. So you'll be extremely amazing for a while, then you'll suck hardcore for a long, long time.

[OriginalPranksta]

no, that isnt true at all... You CANT use fixskills.. fixskills is the only way to fix this bug in the first place. And yes, once you train you wont get the skills that you trained for legitimatly... so ya know what that means? Ya walk to the inn and use the bug again and viola, you're back at max skills...

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by OriginalPranksta
no, that isnt true at all... You CANT use fixskills.. fixskills is the only way to fix this bug in the first place. And yes, once you train you wont get the skills that you trained for legitimatly... so ya know what that means? Ya walk to the inn and use the bug again and viola, you're back at max skills...

Untill Brauden, Khaladon, Warden, etc etc Busts your chops and slaps you around. Sure.

Hey, by all means, go at it! I'll watch :D

Two people did that with wine at the landing festival. 4.2k a bottle, and apparently one of them made over 3 million before a GM said 'WTF'.

There were empty drink holders worth 4k?! Damn, and to think all this time I could have increased my budget by 4000%! (joshin' of course.)

P.S. Did the "WTF" GM get a mouthrinsing?

[Bobmuhthol]

Me after "abusing this bug":

Armor Use..........................| 45 9 9
Shield Use.........................| 45 9 9
Combat Maneuvers...................| 45 9.999 9 13 in-game hours
Edged Weapons......................| 74 16 16
Brawling...........................| 40 8.990 0 22 in-game hours
Physical Fitness...................| 45 9 9
Dodging............................| 45 9 9
Harness Power......................| 45 9 9
Elemental Mana Control.............| 45 9 9
Perception.........................| 40 8 8
Climbing...........................| 35 7 7
Swimming...........................| 35 7 7
Trading............................| 58 12.993 8 14 in-game hours

It feeds off your free TPs. It's not even worth doing.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<There were empty drink holders worth 4k?!>>

I recently sold my ale bottle to the gemshop for 25k.

[Apathy]

I hope this bug is exploited by the people who need to be banned in the first place.

[Bobmuhthol]

1. It's not a bug. The system is doing just what it should.
2. It therefore can not be exploited.
3. Nobody's been banned for it, and at the current rate of banning, nobody will.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
1. It's not a bug. The system is doing just what it should.
2. It therefore can not be exploited.
3. Nobody's been banned for it, and at the current rate of banning, nobody will.



Originally posted by Brauden
Greetings,

Yes it is true that a bug exists that allows the average player to max all of their skills. This isn't a revelation to myself or to my colleagues. A number of good-natured people brought this to my attention quite some time ago, for which I am grateful. I also applaud their morality. I've been tracking its existence for quite some time.

It's inevitable that problems creep into game systems, and it's inevitable that paths of easy advancement will beckon. I hope that those of you who are considering exploiting this bug will seriously consider the ramifications it will have on the Gemstone community.

Regards,
Brauden

Seems to me that one of you are incorrect. My money's on Bob being wrong.

[Bobmuhthol]

People get banned for bug abuse. People aren't getting banned for this.

HMM.


btw it doesn't work. See Artha's post and mine.

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Bobmuhthol]

[Parkbandit]

I didn't realize you know of all bans in the game now Bob. I was wondering if I also could get on that mailing list.

Thanks!!

[Weedmage Princess]

Someone cut/pasted me a post Brauden did on the Official boards that was basically word for word like the post he did in this thread.

Thing is there was THIRD paragraph that did state people abusing this bug WOULD see some sort of punishment. (I forget if it was a ban or locked out.) So..if someone wants to have a gander at the Official Boards to see (I won't go to that God forsaken place) ...you can see for yourself. ;)

I wouldn't screw around with it much.

[Kitsun]

Caily did post the updated message back on page 2, Weedmage Princess.

The relevant paragraph is as follows:



We consider the exploitation of bugs to be a very serious offense. We will exercise zero tolerance for anyone participating in the exploitation of this bug and consider such activity grounds for immediate lock-out from GemStone IV.


Brauden's post here lacked the above part which is why I didn't think it was real. It sounds much more official in this version.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol

It feeds off your free TPs. It's not even worth doing. Exactly. It really isn't worth it, now or in the long run.

I also wouldn't consider it a bug. It has been doing this since GS changed the way skills migrate. Someone just came up with a way to use it to their advantage.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by DarkelfVoldI also wouldn't consider it a bug. It has been doing this since GS changed the way skills migrate. Someone just came up with a way to use it to their advantage.

Actually, it's the exact definition of a bug.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by DarkelfVoldI also wouldn't consider it a bug. It has been doing this since GS changed the way skills migrate. Someone just came up with a way to use it to their advantage.

Actually, it's the exact definition of a bug. I believe you. I figured at the time since it was something obviously incorporated into the game with no plans on correction it wasn't a bug. I assumed that when someone came up with a way to take advantage of it and abuse repeatedly, it then became a bug. :shrug:

[Bobmuhthol]

*** PsiNet client version beta 11 build 30 running.
*** PsiNet client has intercepted connection. Attempting to contact Simutronics...

Please wait for connection to game server.
PsiNet Rest Mode engaged. PsiNet will send EXP to the game window every ten minutes.
Type RESTMODE OFF to turn it off.

Your mind extends outward and links with the PsiNet.
The PsiNet embraces you, Bobmuhthol.
You don't sense any messages on the PsiNet directed to you.
You are able to sense the psychic activity on the following channels:
Outside2261
Outside7009
Outside8181
OOC [Default]
(Your Default channel is the one you will CHAT to by default.)


Welcome to GemStone IV (R) v5.10
Copyright 2004 Simutronics Corp.
All Rights Reserved

You have unread news articles. Type NEWS NEXT to view the first new article.

[Caiylania's Outfitting]
Beneath a vaulted ceiling, a trio-bladed mounted vellum fan hangs on one of the smooth granite walls. A glass-topped mistwood counter and a gilded maple cabinet sit in opposite corners while a worn rug rests on a dark-stained oak floor. You also see an engraved modwir sign.
Obvious exits: out
* Bobmuhthol joins the adventure.
> * Kaseopea joins the adventure.
You feel yourself being pulled away...
[Training Correction]
You are here because a problem with your training has been discovered, which appears to have been caused by a character manager bug. This has been recorded with your character and account name, so senior staff may determine if further action should be taken. This does not mean you have done anything wrong, but you must use FIXSKILLS in this room now to synchronize your training before you can exit. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. Please refer to NEWS 1 6 for further information.
Obvious exits: out


At this point, you need to adjust your skill goals so your intended skill set is within the boundaries of your earned TPs. If you spend fewer TPs than you have earned, you will have the remainder free to spend as you choose.

If you are unable to use the web-based character manager, please REPORT so that a GameMaster may assist you in using the in-game version, but be aware that there may be a slight delay before they can get to you.

The use of FIXSKILLS in this room will not detract from any options you may have remaining to use the verb normally, but the effects will be just as permanent as a normal use would be. Please be sure that your skill goals are set to your satisfaction before using it.



Whatever, free fixskills for me.

[Artha]

...Can I get pulled up into that room too plz????

[Bobmuhthol]

It's a TP check when you log in as far as I can tell. Basically, if the amount of TPs you've used for the skills you currently have is greater than the actual amount of TPs you spent on them, you get pulled and have to fixskills.

[Tsoran]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
It's a TP check when you log in as far as I can tell. Basically, if the amount of TPs you've used for the skills you currently have is greater than the actual amount of TPs you spent on them, you get pulled and have to fixskills.

Yeah, as soon as I saw the announcement about the bug, I wondered why they weren't doing something like that.

The part about 'logged to be reviewed by senior staff' should worry people, especially anyone who has posted here about it saying they've done it intentionally.

In essence:

They've said they'll lock out anyone (after one warning) that abuses this.

They're automatically detecting who has done it.

They're recording and reviewing that information.

They're reading THIS thread.

Unless they're not going to follow up on their 'threat' (I can't think of a better word, sorry), they really have to go after anyone who posts here about having used this. Otherwise, it undermines their authority when it comes to bug abuse.

At least they put the 'after one warning' thing in there. So I guess you get 1 'get out of jail fre' card.

I'm honestly surprised they didn't fix this long ago, since they appear to have known about it for a while.

Oh, by the way... thanks guys for all the information. I was really curious about what the bug was.

[Artha]

GMs reading this thread: I may or may not be abusing this bug. Please give me a Fixskills anyway.

[Blazing247]

<Unless they're not going to follow up on their 'threat' (I can't think of a better word, sorry), they really have to go after anyone who posts here about having used this. Otherwise, it undermines their authority when it comes to bug abuse. >

I have abused this bug on every single character I play. I have also hacked my friends accounts, and done it to all of their characters as well. Truth be told, I've probably done it to about seventy characters. Come get some! Happy hunting.

:smirk:

I never understood it. To me it's like a cheat code and I hated them things since Doom II.

Guess I'm the only weirdo that thinks there is no reason to play if you can't get up there yourself.

- Arkans

[Amberlei]

No, you're not the only one. I think the vast majority of people who heard of the bug didn't use it. None of my girls did, though all could benefit from having more points to toss around. The one thing that kind of bugs me though is that the folks who did use it are basically getting a free FIXSKILLS out of it. I think their skills should be reset to when they first started using it and they should lose anything gained since then if Simu really wants to punish them for it.

[Bobmuhthol]

More people got pulled for training normally than abusing it. Punishing everyone that used the migration system is pretty stupid.

[Blazing247]

I am willing to bet nearly every person has encountered a bug in Gemstone at one time or another. The problem with punishing people who exploit bugs is PROVING that they exploited it. It is incredibly difficult to prove that someone knowingly and purposefully abused this bug.

As an example, you used to be able to clear all round time by logging out of the game and then back in. Stump used to LOVE to get people on this bug, and one day he decided he would give me a verbal warning for it. I fought the warning and got it reversed because hell, prove to me that I logged out for that reason. They couldn't- much like they can't prove purpose in this instance unless you make a pattern of the behavior.

[Faent]

You were stupid. You exploited a bug. Now you've been logged as an offender. Enjoy. Kthx.

-Scott

[Bobmuhthol]

You don't get logged as an offender, you get logged as a possible bug abuser and said log only needs to be read in investigating the need for further action for this bug.

OH NO I HOPE I DON'T GET CAUGHT.

[Caiylania]

[Caiylania's Outfitting]
Beneath a vaulted ceiling, a trio-bladed mounted vellum fan hangs on one of the smooth granite walls. A glass-topped mistwood counter and a gilded maple cabinet sit in opposite corners while a worn rug rests on a dark-stained oak floor. You also see an engraved modwir sign.
Obvious exits: out
* Bobmuhthol joins the adventure.
> * Kaseopea joins the adventure.
You feel yourself being pulled away...
[Training Correction]

-------------------

Great! My store sells fixskills now! Where's my money????

[Mistomeer]

Free FIXSKILLS huh? Damn, I think I need to go to the Inn, make my characters badass until they get a free Fixskills out of it. Win/win.

[AnticorRifling]

Using psinet skills (target) to look at people's skills and I see this:

Hectomaner's Last Recorded Skills (Level 13):

Skill Name | Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 70 15
Physical Fitness...................| 70 15
Harness Power......................| 74 16
Perception.........................| 66 14
Dodging............................| 62 13
Combat Maneuvers...................| 35 7
Polearm Weapons....................| 120 30
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 35 7
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 10 2
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 58 12

Spell Circles:
Major Elemental....................| 9
Wizard.............................| 6
Ranger.............................| 4
Bard...............................| 15

WTF?! Talked to him and he said he sees the same thing when looking at his own skills so it's not a psinet bug. If he has self cast haste as a bard that's sweet but it's alittle unfair heh.

[AnticorRifling]

In ref to above post:

[OOC]-You: "Can you actually cast those?"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "yeah"
[OOC]-You: "You're a lucky ass bard"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "i only got 15 in bard circle"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "all the other circles are fucked"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "dont know why"
[OOC]-Brynn: "maybe cause the concept of you training in all those circles is fuct to begin with"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "i was a sorcerer in gs3, then in feb went to wizard till 10, then ranger a few, now i'm a bard"
[OOC]-Hectomaner: "dont know why its showin up still"

[Edited on 8-9-2004 by AnticorRifling]

[Edaarin]

The hell? I'm migrating away a few ranks of scroll use, and I log in to find this.

At this point, you need to adjust your skill goals so your intended skill set is within the boundaries of your earned TPs. If you spend fewer TPs than you have earned, you will have the remainder free to spend as you choose. To see how many training points you are out of sync by, just try to go OUT without fixing anything.

>out

I'm sorry, you appear to still be out of sync. Your skills and available training points total up to 4717 physical and 3636 mental training points, while you appear to have earned a total of 4660 physical and 3584 mental points.

It's a problem to have points you're NOT USING?

[Latrinsorm]

Uh, new math from Edaarin. (I hope at least one of you went to the same high school as I did, otherwise no one's going to get that kickass jibe.)

[Edaarin]

Nevermind, thought it through and apparently I have like the points back from migrating those scroll use down, PLUS the points from the 1.935 ranks of scroll use that are still there.

Does this mean that anyone who tries to migrate down gets pulled...? Because this is horseshit.

[Edaarin]

Okay, something is fucked up here.

After fixskilling my Arcane Symbols went down to what I wanted it to (okay), then available TP's went from 4/64 to 0/50 (4/14 is a big deal, but who knows maybe something was messed up). I didn't notice anything further, but then I realized I lost two spells.

WTF is going on?

EDIT: According to Tsoran's spreadsheet...

Once I hit my next level (in 600 experience), I should not only have enough to what my training was changed to including the two missing spells, but I should have 24/87 EXTRA TP's at the beginning of the level as well.

[Edited on 8-9-2004 by Edaarin]

[Edaarin]

One level later, I WAS RIGHT.

Before leveling, I was reduced to 0/51 TP's.

Then I leveled, and now...24/215 TP's.

Which gave me back what they took away. Now I can get my fucking locklore and disarm lore back.

[Edaarin]

A log of the assist I placed. Nice guy, but it took awhile for me to get across what I was trying to say. Maybe my fault, I wasn't being too clear I guess.

You say, "Okay."
>
Mangried asks, "Did you work out your problem with training?"
>
You say, "Actually it worked itself out, but I kept the assist."
>
Mangried nods.
>
You say, "Because I thought there was something that should be looked into."
>
Mangried asks, "Care to tell me what happened?"
>
You say, "Before I checked in and leveled."
>
The scintillating light fades from your hands.
>
You say, "I had lost 2 spells, along with 4/14 TP's."
>
Mangried asks, "Did you change your stats?"
>
You say, "For some reason, when I was trying to migrate away like 3 or 4 ranks of arcane symbols."
>
You say, "No."
>
You say, "I had to do the fixskills thing in the training room."
>
You say, "Anyway, since I was so close to level I figured I'd see if that fixed it."
>
You say, "And lo and behold, after leveling I went from 0/51 to 24/215."
>
You say, "Which, when you take away the amount training costs decreased for level, was the exact amount I had gotten for interlevel training."
>
* Meshach just bit the dust!
>
Mangried says, "Well that could have been from your TPs being recalculated."
>
* Khadari just bit the dust!
>
You ask, "But 24/164 in one level?"
>
Mangried says, "That happens to me all the time when I level now."
>
You ask, "Isn't that excessive?"
>
* Kethlanna just bit the dust!
>
Mangried rubs his chin thoughtfully.
>
Mangried says, "I have a bunch of converted PT to MT...I think I get around 150 back each time I train."
>
You shake your head.
>
You say, "I don't get close to that much usually, I get about 50-60 back."
>exp
Level: 84 Deeds: 0
Experience: 5832770 Deaths this level: 0
Exp. until next: 104730 Death Recovery: 0
Mental TPs: 1 Fame: 38153192
Physical TPs: 0 Mana: 22/25 max
(46 Mnt converted to Phy)

Your mind is as clear as a bell.
>
Mangried nods.
>
Mangried says, "Well..one thing, you don't need to check into the CM to gain your level now."
>
You say, "I know, but the web based one is slooooow for me."
>
Mangried says, "If you just hang around for another pulse, it will do it itself in-game."
>
Mangried nods.
>
You say, "The thing is."
>
You say, "I lost all the points I had obtained from about 104.5k of exp."
>
Mangried says, "All I can think of is it was messed up..which does happen...and when you leveled, everything was recalcutalted and set correct."
>
You say, "That should not have happened."
>
You say, "And were it to happen again, and I were say 50k from leveling."
>
You say, "I'd be back to missing some important skills."
>
* Luth just bit the dust!
>
You say, "Like disarm and pick lore."
>
You say, "I don't want to go through half a level like that."
>
You feel at full magical power again.
>
Mangried asks, "I guess I'm still a little unclear on what happened...you were using GOALS to adjust your training?"
>
* Liquidfyre just bit the dust!
>
Mangried asks, "Or you were using the CM to adjust your training?"
>
You say, "No...I checked in to migrate away some ranks of AS."
>
You say, "I logged out for a sec, then logged back in."
>
The dim aura fades from around you.
>
You say, "When I logged back in, I got sent to some sort of Training Lounge."
>
You say, "Because of news 1 6."
>
Mangried says, "Ok..so you checked in to the CM to adjust your training."
>
Mangried says, "Ahh."
>
You say, "When I got there, I was forced to lose two spells."
>
>
You say, "As well as 4/14 TP's."
>
Mangried says, "So you had too much skills somehow due to the bug."
>
You shake your head.
>
You say, "That's what I thought."
>
You say, "But I got ALL the poinst back when I leveled."
>
You say, "All those points were the points I had gotten from the 100k+ exp I had gotten that level up to that point where I got pulled."
>
You say, "Do you see what I mean? When the points I had earned were calculated compared to the skills I currently had."
>
Mangried says, "Nope..I'm lost."
>
Mangried grins.
>
You say, "They left out interlevel training as part of the calculation."
>
Mangried asks, "Are you missing anything right now?"
>
>
You shake your head.
>
You say, "EVerything's normal, but I just don't want this to happen again."
>
You say, "I'm just glad I was close to level."
>
Mangried says, "Then I would harzard a guess that it was due to that bug and the GMs working to correct it."
>
You say, "When I first reported, I got a SEND from a GM that everything looked normal."
>
* Elronae just bit the dust!
>
Mangried nods.
>
You say, "While I was still missing those skills."
>
Mangried says, "Well that's the important thing that everything is OK now."
>
You say, "But evidently since I got those points back, everything wasn't normal."
>
You say, "And the problem is on their end."
>
* Entress just bit the dust!
>
* Coinner just bit the dust!
>
Mangried says, "Well here is what you should do..."
>
Mangried asks, "Do you ming BUGging it for me?"
>
You say, "I guess the most important thing I'm trying to say is, there's a serious bug in the recalculatio nroom that causes you to lose interlevel training."
>
You nod.
>
Mangried says, "Just submit a BUG report explaining everthing that happened."
>
You say, "Alright."
>
Mangried says, "Ah..now I get what you are talking about."
>
* Dainslef just bit the dust!
>
You ask, "It's annoying for me, but what if it happened to a capped person?"
>
You say, "They can't level again to fix it."
>
Mangried says, "When you are sent to the Training Room to fix your skills (due to the exploit of the bug..intenitional or not) it does not give you back your interlevel TPs."
>
Mangried says, "But when you level, everything is recalculated, and you get them back."
>
You ask, "What happens if you're capped and that happens?"
>
Mangried says, "You ASSIST and ask for a REFER."
>
Mangried grins.
>
You chuckle.
>
Mangried says, "But the GMs would be able to look and see that there is a problem."
>
Mangried says, "You have to remember, that this Training Room is new."
>
You ask, "So it's intended that interlevel TP's aren't given back?"
>
Mangried says, "I would GUESS that it is not."
>
Mangried says, "They may not know about it."
>
You ask, "May I have a referral to let them know? Or can you tell them?"
>
You grin.
>
Mangried asks, "Did you log out of the game and log back in after you got out of the Training ROom?"
>
* Barjin just bit the dust!
>
You say, "I'll BUG it, but that is notoriously a bad way of getting things fixed for me usually."
>
Mangried says, "They will read my report on the ASSIST, and your BUG report."
>
You say, "Yeah, right before I leveled I logged out on the advice of a friend."
>
You say, "Didn't get fixed till I actually leveled though."
>
Mangried says, "Things are usually recalucluated at login also."
>
Mangried says, "Well the BUG report and my report of this ASSIST should do the trick."
>
You nod.
>
You say, "Okay."
>
Mangried asks, "Is there anything else that I Can help you with tonight?"
>
You say, "I guess that's everything then. Thanks for your help."
>
Mangried says, "You are most welcome."
>
Mangried grins.
>
You say, "That was a frustrating half hour."
>
Mangried waves.
>
You wave.
>
Mangried says, "I can imagine."
>
Mangried waves.
>
Mangried vanishes in a puff of smoke!

[SpunGirl]

Count yourself lucky you didn't get Quabu.

-K

[Tsoran]

For those of you saying the FIXSKILLS room was FUBAR, you were right.

A couple of days ago I found the bug. About an hour later, Taelrand fixed it.

A character of mine which I knew was absolutely at the correct training and TPs got sucked into the fixskills room. Aaron popped in and in about 5 minutes we figured it out: the formula used to detect a TP discrepancy was not taking your inter-level TPs into account. So, if you had a lot of inter-level TPs, combined with a few other factors, you were likely to get sucked into the FIXSKILLS room even if your numbers were correct.

That bug is fixed.

[Jonty]

Yeah, I noticed.... I was trying to get a fixskills and it wasn't working! :(

[Edaarin]

Nice. I found that bug 10 days ago, and was told by Mangried it would be looked into. You see it, and an hour later it's fixed.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Edaarin
Nice. I found that bug 10 days ago, and was told by Mangried it would be looked into. You see it, and an hour later it's fixed.

He's Tsoran.. and you are only Edaarin. What's your point?

PS-I'm just kidding, please don't kick Falgrin in the groin. The lasses of Elanthia would be very unhappy :)

[Soulpieced]

That's Simu for ya.

[Artha]

It's probably got something to do with who you both talk to, too. You got a (I think) new GM. He got Taelrand, who pwns.

[Tsoran]

Originally posted by Artha
It's probably got something to do with who you both talk to, too. You got a (I think) new GM. He got Taelrand, who pwns.

It's a little of both. It was incredibly good luck that Aaron was around at that time. I couldn't ask for a better person.

But it's also sometimes just good to be me.

Consider this. We all went through a painful learning curve with the GS4 TPs and interlevel training, and everyone was going around screaming that it was broken, right? I got hundreds of people telling my the spreadsheet was busted, and still do, even now.

So players saying that the TPs in the game are busted has got to be something they hear a hundred times a day, even 9 months after GS4 launched.

So I can understand their reluctance to believe Joe Player when he says it's wrong.

But they know I know how that stuff works, both because the spreadsheet is so widely used, and because I've had lots of positive interactions with a lot of GMs over the years. So when I'm saying it's busted, yeah, it does carry a bit more weight.

Even so, Taelrand didn't believe me either, but he did give me a chance to prove what I was saying. Whether that has more to do with who the player was or who the GM was is an interesting, but probably unanswerable question.

[Soulpieced]

Tsoran, I contacted Khaladon immediately when Edaarin showed me the numbers. He used your spreadsheet and upon training got the exact amount of correct TP's back which mysteriously "disappeared" with the forced fixskill. Granted he isn't the coder or game mech freak Aaron is, he definitely could have notified someone else. I'd imagine if any GM hears Soulpieced say something is wrong, there probably is.

<-- He who has fixed and ruined more bard spells than anyone else ever.

[Edited on 8-19-2004 by Soulpieced]

Originally posted by SoulpiecedI'd imagine if any GM hears Soulpieced say something is wrong, there probably is.

<-- He who has fixed and ruined more bard spells than anyone else ever.

[Edited on 8-19-2004 by Soulpieced]

I doubt that... you went through a few whining phases, especially regarding OTF.

[Soulpieced]

And there was something wrong with the area considering I still could get killed easily at level 159 (couldn't learn from *any* creature). And believe me, song of noise and lullabye didn't get changed because some GM randomly felt like tweaking them.

[TheRoseLady]

Originally posted by Tea & Strumpets

Originally posted by SoulpiecedI'd imagine if any GM hears Soulpieced say something is wrong, there probably is.

<-- He who has fixed and ruined more bard spells than anyone else ever.

[Edited on 8-19-2004 by Soulpieced]

I doubt that... you went through a few whining phases, especially regarding OTF.


Tsoran has gone through a few temper tantrums, including a few big ugly scenes on the boards and a time or two that he quit playing. What's your point?

They are both somewhat arrogant if you ask me.

Just ask them both, they'll tell you how wonderful they are :lol:

-TRL

[Soulpieced]

They are both somewhat arrogant if you ask me.

.

Only somewhat? I've failed.

Soupie is a douche bag

[xShadowMerchantx]

*** Host Kaeori is here to answer your assist. ***

J>
Kaeori smiles at you.
J>'Hello
You say, "Hello."
J>
Kaeori says, "Good evening."
J>l kae
You see Senior GameHost Kaeori Aineen.
She appears to be a Human.
She appears to be in the prime of life and shorter than average. She has bleary pale grey eyes and ruddy skin. She has very short, unkempt jet black hair streaked with silver. She has a haggard face, a freckled nose and stooped shoulders.
She is in good shape.
She is wearing a pair of worn brown leather workboots, a pair of stained white coveralls with drawstrings at the ankles and wrists, a faded brown oilcloth satchel, a pair of thick white canvas workgloves with reinforced leather palms, a gold star, a gold star, a warped platinum star, and a heavy square-veiled rigid hat with a drawstring at the neck.
J>
J>
Kaeori says, "Though I can appreciate while you feel like that.. that's not a request that can be granted."
J>'Why not?
You ask, "Why not?"
J>
J>'I have to abuse a bug to get a free fixskills? Might as well go check in.
Kaeori says, "Because forced fixskills wasn't a reward."
J>
You say, "I have to abuse a bug to get a free fixskills? Might as well go check in."
J>
Kaeori says, "I believe it's been fixed. And, deliberate abuse is grounds for warnings and lockouts."
J>'There were multiple people who deliberately abused it
You say, "There were multiple people who deliberately abused it."
J>'And they're not locked out
You say, "And they're not locked out."
J>'Why would I get locked out?
You ask, "Why would I get locked out?"
J>'Thats not fair
You say, "Thats not fair."
J>
Kaeori says, "If you'd like to make your opinion known, please write feedback@simutronics.com."
J>'Can I have a referral?
You ask, "Can I have a referral?"
J>
Kaeori says, "However, there is not going to be a mass fixskill grant for doing the right thing."
J>'Right, just a mass fixskill for doing the WRONG thing.
You say, "Right, just a mass fixskill for doing the WRONG thing."
J>
Kaeori says, "No."
J>'Why not?
You ask, "Why not?"
J>
Kaeori says, "You may not. There's nothing a GM can do for you in this situation."
J>
Kaeori says, "The correct mechanism for appeal is feedback."
J>'They may have a different opinion
You say, "They may have a different opinion."
J>
J>'I'd like a referral, feedback never responds.
You say, "I'd like a referral, feedback never responds."
J>
Kaeori says, "I'm not going to refer you for this."
J>
Kaeori asks, "Is there anything else you need this evening?"
J>
J>'Yes, a free fixskills
You say, "Yes, a free fixskills."
J>
Kaeori says, "Have a good evening."
J>
Kaeori curtsies to you.
J>
Kaeori vanishes in a puff of smoke!

[Edited on 8-20-2004 by xShadowMerchantx]

[Bobmuhthol]

I don't know of anyone that abused the bug to get fixskills, so I'm interested in where you get your information.

[xShadowMerchantx]

You abused the bug.

[Bobmuhthol]

Yes, before the Training Correction room was put into effect. So how did I do it to get fixskills?

[Tsoran]

Originally posted by Soulpieced
Tsoran, I contacted Khaladon immediately when Edaarin showed me the numbers. [Edited on 8-19-2004 by Soulpieced]

Khaladon is CE. Taelrand is on-site dev. Wrong GM for this kind of problem. Like I said, I had the indredible good luck to have this happen when Taelrand was around. I might be wrong, but I think anything related to CMGR can only be touched by on-site. Certainly everyone I'm aware of (except Warden) who has ever worked on it is on-site. In any event, this certainly is not the pervue of the CE team.

Khaladon's a great SGM, but this isn't his area. There's only 4 or 5 GM's I'd bother talking to about this, and the only one who isn't on-site is Warden. There's probably others who are familiar with it, but being an outsider, I don't know who they are.

Way to cry like a bitch shadowmerchant. I would have bolted your ass for doing that.

[Artha]

Take it like a man, ShadowMerchant. It's really not that bad once you're able to hunt.

[Bobmuhthol]

Just so I'm clear...

He called an assist... to ask for a mass fixskills... because other people got them... and then wanted to abuse the bug... which results in immediate warning or lockout... but he wanted to do it so he could get a free fixskills... AND CALLED AN ASSIST FOR THIS?

NO OF COURSE HE'S NOT RETARDED.

[Edited on 8-20-2004 by Bobmuhthol]

[Mistomeer]

He has a point though. Everyone that I know of that abused the bug, got a Fixskills and that was the end of it.

So if you abuse the bug, you get uber skills followed up by a Fixskills to undo it.

[Artha]

If you abused the bug and didn't have a fixskills, you'd be great for awhile, then you'd suck horribly for a long time afterwards.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Artha
If you abused the bug and didn't have a fixskills, you'd be great for awhile, then you'd suck horribly for a long time afterwards.

Which is exactly what should have been allowed to happen, in my opinion. ;)

HarmNone would have paid to see that

[Bobmuhthol]

Believe me, if you abused the bug to the fullest, you'd be set for at least a year, and by that time you'd have a fixskills anyway.

[HarmNone]

Oh, had it been my call the coming of doom would have been much sooner, and the depth of that doom much deeper and longer-lasting. :D

HarmNone

[Gigantuous]

This blows...I didn't abuse the bug (hell, I even reported/assisted when I noticed I somehow had more skills than I should) and I been stuck in the Training Room for 2 days...and after using the mandatory fixskills, I lost 25 swim ranks and 1 climb.

This is not the way to start playing again after being gone for 3 weeks. :no:

Edited to add: Easy enough to fix the loss of the skills...take away 11 perception ranks, pick up 25 swim and 1 climb. Might as well make use of this Training Room while I'm here....still.

[Edited on 8-21-2005 by Gigantuous]

[Terminator X]

I ended up in that room twice in the same week. I swear, both times, when I had decreased any of my skills in the character manager, the next time I tried logging back into GemStone, I would automatically appear in that training room thing.

After I fixed my skills in that training room thing, I lost like 80 MTPs... And I *still* don't understand why, even after having read all of this.

[hectomaner]

its cus you were migrating, and there was issues again with migrating giving too many TPs. so bad that you could drop 1 rank of something, wait for 1 migration pulse, log out, log back in, and you are in the correction room, and get a free fixskill

[Terminator X]

Really? That just happened all of a sudden?

[hectomaner]

yeah, it happened last year some time for a bit, and it just came back up recently. sucked, cus i had 7 characters migrating, so i had to fixskill them all. couldnt have looked good

[Tsoran]

I'm fairly certain that this system is broken. It's computing TPs incorrectly. I personally told Ildran about my concerns, as well as passing along to him the relevant documentation.

Feel free to BUG this loud and often ;) .