Spikethorn/Runestaff ranger?

[Tgo01]

Is it possible to reach cap by relying mostly on 616? Is a runestaff wielding ranger viable?

Does anything other than ranger ranks/summoning lore help spikethorn? Should I even bother with summoning lore or should I go with religion? I know it seems like an odd question but summoning lore for spikethorn seems pretty darn useless until you get 60ish ranks. Summoning lore looks pretty nice for Nature's Fury though.

Speaking purely about mechanics, which race do you think would be the best for a spikethorning ranger? Which stat(s) would be least useful?

Assuming I went sword and board which race would be the best and which stat(s) would be least useful?

[NinjasLeadTheWay]

Thats a lot of mana to use per cast. I don't know about runestaff wielding Rangers, I do really well as an Archer/Ranger. I do focus on summoning lore and there is a noticeable difference in my Spikethorn both with and without, I used a fixskills after realizing I messed up his original training. My ranger is human and generally kills everything he spikethorns in two casts at most.

[BriarFox]

No and no, basically. You can do a pure build using 616 near or post-cap, but before that you won't have enough mana. You *can* use a runestaff, but you'd be better off, with lower training costs and higher defense, using a bow for defense and to finish off things.

Spikethorn success is based on ranger ranks and level comparison. Summoning lore can add a cycle, but it doesn't affect the overall success. If you want to be a real thornmage, you need to keep ranger ranks at or above level, and that's basically impossible pre-cap without major sacrifices. That said, you could make the build work if you underhunted by 5+ levels consistently. Spikethorn would always be effective and you'd still get steady experience. Race is irrelevant as far as I know.

Best build for a thornmage IMO is ranged for defense (no ambush, just 2x ranged and perception), 1-1.5x Harness Power, 2x PF for stamina, stamina enhancives, GoS to convert stamina to mana and for Sigil of Concentration to boost mana regen, and probably doubles (for no hindrance) or brig (for 6% hindrance). You could do double chain (8%) or augmented chain (9%) if you really needed the higher armor class. LBP or cuirbouilli would be an interesting and probably very doable compromise.

[Kastrel]

616 Rangers (after a certain level) are very viable. Being a runestaff ranger would probably not be such a good idea though, not because you CAN'T but because its so easy to just have a weapon skill on the side, even if you have no real secondary combat skills (Ambush, hiding, etc).

You would probably want to go normal style until you were high enough for it, then dump into Ranger ranks and Summoning lore, and probably Harness Power as well.

For Races? Well, if you are relying on Spike Thorn, then CS stats won't matter much, nor will combat stats. You could cover your weaknesses (elemental TD) with being a Halfling, or try to tank as a Giant, plus carry tons of stuff.

[Tgo01]

Thanks for the input everyone, I may just go with sword and board. I haven't done a sword and board character in a long while.

Which stats are the least useful for a ranger?

[BriarFox]

Influence and Discipline.

[BriarFox]

By the way, if you do a sword and board ranger, make sure you train an ambushing build. It's boring as hell and relatively ineffective otherwise.

[Androidpk]

Or at least be able to aim from the open.

[Tgo01]

So more ranger ranks increases success chance and damage done, right? I know I said I was going to do sword and board but I'm really tempted to do a halfling spike thorn ranger who will use a sword and shield for defense mostly. I know mana is going to suck but I figure if I do a halfling in CoL his spirit regen might not make mana too much of an issue.

Is there much of a point in getting minor spirit spells at lower levels as a ranger? I'm sure I can get 101 and 107 from others so that's not a problem, 102 might be useful if I'm not going to be swinging much, I don't care about locating people. Other than 120 they all seem mostly useless compared to pumping more ranks in ranger base.

[BriarFox]

Halfling thornmage is a good idea. If you trained just 2x edged/1x shield, you could squeak by with 14/3 TPs as a sword and boarder, while you'd be doing 9/9 as an archer with 2x ranged/2x perception. That saves you a lot of mental points for use elsewhere. Your DS would be lower than with a bow in most cases, though. I'm not sure about CoL. When you drop below 75% spirit, it significantly impacts your AS and DS, so you might convert those spirit points to mana and then get your ass handed to you if you get hit.

[Tgo01]

What the heck, I'm gonna go for it. I might end up doing GoS though, not sure yet.

As far as stats I can either shoot for 100 in all stats except 84 in discipline at cap, 100 in all stats except 80 in influence or 100 in all stats with 90 discipline and 93 influence. Are both discipline and influence equally as useless for rangers?

[BriarFox]

Do the 100s with the 80 in INF. Discipline is the mental TD stat. Influence does ... almost nothing for a ranger.

[Kastrel]

One of these days, they are going to realize what a poor design it is to make Influence so incredibly useless, and then they will make it factor into a crapton of game systems. And everyone is going to be screwed except Savants.

[Tgo01]

One of these days, they are going to realize what a poor design it is to make Influence so incredibly useless, and then they will make it factor into a crapton of game systems. And everyone is going to be screwed except Savants.

Think of the 10's of extra silvers you could be earning per hunt though!

[Kastrel]

Influence is the only stat where the most important thing it does has virtually no impact on hunting and combat.

If you aren't an Empath, Warcrying Warrior, or Bard, it may as well be called "Free Stat Dump". Its just kind of sad that they let it get to that point, but I guess I can't really think of anything better. It should probably have more impact on selling/buying value though. Instead of InfBonus/12 = Discount %, it should probably be something like InfBonus-10 . . . that way the people who tanked it don't really get anything, but those who didn't get a serious discount.

[Ryku]

Ryku (at level 82), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 170 70
Combat Maneuvers...................| 185 85
Ranged Weapons.....................| 268 168
Physical Fitness...................| 190 90
Dodging............................| 184 84
Harness Power......................| 182 82
Spirit Mana Control................| 102 24
Survival...........................| 90 20
Perception.........................| 140 40
Climbing...........................| 145 45
Swimming...........................| 145 45

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 20

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 113
Training Points: 9 Phy 0 Mnt (1232 Phy converted to Mnt)


Name: Ryku Rakari Race: Elf Profession: Ranger (shown as: Forest Warden)
Gender: Male Age: 134 Expr: 5643151 Level: 82
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 94 (22) ... 94 (22)
Constitution (CON): 76 (13) ... 76 (13)
Dexterity (DEX): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Agility (AGI): 95 (37) ... 95 (37)
Discipline (DIS): 97 (8) ... 97 (8)
Aura (AUR): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Logic (LOG): 97 (23) ... 97 (23)
Intuition (INT): 100 (25) ... 100 (25)
Wisdom (WIS): 99 (24) ... 103 (26)
Influence (INF): 55 (12) ... 55 (12)
Mana: 76 Silver: 1964


I am COL and go through 2-3 mana pools per hunt. I'm hunting gremlocks, beings, and taints in OTF with just spikethorn and its a cakewalk now that I have 5 ranks of garrote for defense against the gremlocks. We'll see how it goes when I get closer to cap though. Oh and I never fire my bow it's just for defense.

[Tgo01]

Nice. I really gotta get around to rolling up my ranger now so I can do that :/

[Ryku]

Here's a question. So since I don't actually use my bow for offensive purposes, only DS, how much DS would I really lose if I went from 168 ranks of ranged weapon training, to about 130 or 140 ranks? That's a pretty legit amount of training points being used up there and from my calculations using the Krakiipedia formula for DS with ranged weapons, it doesn't seem like I'd be losing all that much DS at all in guarded stance really. Like less than 20 total DS. Does that sound completely right or wrong to anyone? Would love to see someone else do the math and confirm before i blow a fixskills.

[Whirlin]

Ranged DS = TRUNC((ranged SKILL + perception RANKS) * stance modifier)

OFFENSIVE BOW = .15
ADVANCE BOW = .21
FORWARD BOW = .27
NEUTRAL BOW = .33
GUARDED BOW = .39
DEFENSIVE BOW = .45

So, skill *.39... -38 skill = 14.82 DS. So, you'd lose about 15 DS from guarded...

Entirely up to you I guess... To get a permanent +15 DS would cost something like... a bajillion silvers. Maybe more.

Plus, it's less about DS while standing in guarded, and more about DS while on the ground stunned in offensive.

[Ryku]

Ya you're exactly right about the laying on the ground in offensive. I'd pretty much be dropping those points in ranged skill (essentially top end DS) and putting them into areas that would help me from ending up on the ground in offensive. Maybe I'll try it and see how it goes. Thanks for crunching those numbers.

[BriarFox]

Perception adds significantly to ranged DS, btw. You're shafting yourself a bit by keeping it at 40 ranks.

[Ryku]

So I've read! This is what I'm at now. Getting rid of SMC cuz I haven't used it in years and I'm probably going to drop some Ranged Weapon now too. Will probably get PF up to 2x or maybe dabble more with the Perception yeah.

Ryku (at level 83), your base skill bonuses, ranks and goals are:
Skill Name | Actual Actual
| Bonus Ranks Goals In-Game Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 200 100 100
Combat Maneuvers...................| 183 83 83
Ranged Weapons.....................| 264 164 164
Physical Fitness...................| 187 87 87
Dodging............................| 184 84 84
Spell Aiming.......................| 0 0 0
Harness Power......................| 184 84 84
Spirit Mana Control................| 99 23.973 0 24 days, 13 hours, 3 minutes
Survival...........................| 90 20 20
Perception.........................| 185 85 85
Climbing...........................| 140 40 40
Swimming...........................| 140 40 40
Pickpocketing......................| 0 0 0

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 20 20

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 113 113

[Whirlin]

Ranged DS = TRUNC((ranged SKILL + perception RANKS) * stance modifier)

OFFENSIVE BOW = .15
ADVANCE BOW = .21
FORWARD BOW = .27
NEUTRAL BOW = .33
GUARDED BOW = .39
DEFENSIVE BOW = .45

LETS MATHS

The SMC is assisting mana recovery though... Although, it's a marginally much more substantial return at lower level... +2 per pulse when you have a 240+ pool isn't so much compared to only having a 60 pool. Lets assume you go 0 ranks into this from the 24 you had before, at 5 MTP per rank, 120 newly freed MTPs

You're already 1x in perception, so each rank is gonna cost you 4 MTPs, so that's a nice 30 ranks worth.

+4.5 DS in offensive
+11.7 in Guarded

So, the cost of a 2nd spell rank is 34 mental. Lets play for a second and lose 2 spell ranks, that'll be 68 more MTPs freed. 17 more Perception ranks.
613 gives +.5 DS per rank
618 gives +1 Dodge per rank... Of course, since you have so much armor training, assume this wouldn't be a full +1 DS.
DS from Dodge = (Dodge Ranks (2) * Armor penalty (brig .94) * Stance Mod (.75 for offensive, 1 for defensive)
So, you're looking at:

+2 DS in offensive
+2 (maybe 3, depending on rounding) DS in defensive

Versus

+2.55 DS in Offensive
+6.63 in Guarded

Arguably, this would remain true for however many spells you wish to convert out of.

We've found 47 ranks of perception so far... So we have potential for another 35 or so... (I'm mathsy enough to maths the DS bonuses, not not enough to do actual ranks versus potential ranks... whataloser)

Ranged is costing you 6/2 for your second rank. Perception will cost 0/4 for the second rank.
2 ranks of ranged = 2.5 ranks of perception. The gains are minimal, but still beneficial to keep perception capped before Ranged.


Since that's barely a gain... I guess 4 more spell ranks to max out perception? total of 6 spells deferred into Perception? Honestly, may be best just to make a heavy push for perception training in the upcoming levels and cap it out by 87 or so... Reallocating those skills would take forever.

[Ryku]

Here's the thing about dropping spells though, they are the only way to increase the potency of my main form of attack, 616. They also add to the strength of my secondary attack 635 by way of increasing my CS, and they increase my TD as well which is one of my weaknesses. Perception also has the bonus of adding to my creature maneuver defense, something Ranged Weapon training doesn't do. The more I think about the points being dumped into Ranged Weapon training, the more I'm realizing there are a lot of training points tied up there for a very basic gain, straight DS. At least with these other skills they do more than just boost DS. The question is how much can I afford to lose. Laying down on the ground prone in offensive is no freakin bueno.

[Whirlin]

Entirely up to you... 6 spells would only be 3 CS from 635, since you're already over 20 ranks over 1x... and then an unknown reduction to 616...

If you're looking for 616 or 635 potency, shouldn't you also be training in Spirit Lore: Summoning for the extra damage cycles?

The other area that could be reduced would be CMANs... Now that PF is king of maneuver defense, I don't know how 1 rank of CMAN would fare against 1.75 ranks in perception.

[Ryku]

Ok I made some changes and used my fixskill. Thought I'd post it up and just let you all know what I did since you guys were good enough to help me figure it all out. This build is working really freaking well in the OTF aqueducts. The key is being COL though. Need to wrack once to fry my mind, can do it again if I need to but I like to get out of there asap to avoid insta-kills by the freaking gremlocks and their stupid garrote. I use a couple AURA orbs to boost my spirit up to 11 at all times which allows me to have both Sign of Shields and Sign of Dissipation up when hunting and not run into any spirit issues. Before I pop my first wrack, I assume owl to bring my spirit up to 13. I use WIS orbs to boost my TD a little bit too.

For CMANs I have 5 ranks of garrote to have the best defense against gremlocks as I can, will switch it to disarm when I start hunting the other crap in the OTF. The rest of the CMAN points I use for other high value, low cost defensive stuff as you can see in the list below.

I am dumping all my new points as I level up into PF in order to get it to 2x for maneuver avoidance. I 2x'd in perception to get as many defensive benefits out of it as I could, since it's so cheap. I only 1x in ranged weapons because 2x is expensive and the extra amount of DS I get from it in guarded isn't much, and even less in offensive. I have 100 ranks in armor use because I use Aug chain and wanted to drop the first rank of Action Penalty off of it. I will try and have 130 ranger spell ranks by cap.

As for attacking, I 616 everything. Never use my bow, ever. If I run into more than 2 creatures at once, I 635 once or even twice to really screw them up, then clean up with 616. It's very simple but very effective. The only issues are having enough defenses and this build is keeping me alive so much better than my previous attempts. Hopefully it works as I get closer to cap. Once I do cap I will round out my defensive skills, get my ranger ranks to at least 150, then start training in lores to increase my spike cycles. That's the idea at least.


Name: Ryku Rakari Race: Elf Profession: Ranger (shown as: Forest Warden)
Gender: Male Age: 134 Expr: 5918453 Level: 84
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Constitution (CON): 76 (13) ... 76 (13)
Dexterity (DEX): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Agility (AGI): 96 (38) ... 96 (38)
Discipline (DIS): 98 (9) ... 98 (9)
Aura (AUR): 100 (30) ... 108 (34)
Logic (LOG): 98 (24) ... 99 (24)
Intuition (INT): 100 (25) ... 100 (25)
Wisdom (WIS): 100 (25) ... 110 (30)
Influence (INF): 56 (13) ... 56 (13)
Mana: 178 Silver: 0


Ryku (at level 84), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 200 100
Combat Maneuvers...................| 186 86
Ranged Weapons.....................| 186 86
Physical Fitness...................| 203 103
Dodging............................| 186 86
Harness Power......................| 200 100
Survival...........................| 90 20
Perception.........................| 272 172
Climbing...........................| 150 50
Swimming...........................| 150 50

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 20

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 117
Training Points: 7 Phy 0 Mnt (1522 Phy converted to Mnt)
(Use SKILLS BASE to display unmodified ranks and goals)



Ryku, your Combat Maneuver training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 4
Disarm Weapon disarm 1
Garrote garrote 5
Cunning Defense cdefense 2

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 1

[BriarFox]

Sounds great to me, and glad it's working. I'm not sure, btw, that cman garrote is helping you at all against the gremlocks. I think they use a SMR roll. 2x PF, 2x perception, and the armor action penalty reduction from the overtrained armor are helping you a lot more with that, as will being unencumbered and in defensive stance.

Do you use any mana regen enhancives?

[Ryku]

Hmm well thats something to look into. As for mana regen, no i dont use any. I max my mind in 2-3 minutes so i feel like getting more mana per pulse would be wasted since i dont experience very many pulses out there in the hunt. I did get a +14 harness power orb because it was a good deal but if i find some more wisdom orbs ill probably replace it with that. Right now, mana isnt even close to an issue since everything dies in one or two 616 casts.

[Ryku]

I've seen Droit state that cman garrote doesn't defend against the Gremlock version like you mentioned, but the krakiipedia says that it does. I can't find any evidence that states either way though. =/

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Gremlock

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Garrote

[Tgo01]

Okay so I finally got around to making this character, got him to 24 and today is my last day to get his skills the way I want them. He's been swinging the whole time but I've tried out spikethorn from time to time just to see how it would go and I don't think it will be too bad for him, might be a bit slow going until he gets some more mana and whatnot.

I got a question though, are there diminishing returns for ranger ranks when it comes to spikethorn effectiveness? I'm just wondering how many spells I should invest in the minor spiritual circle because it seems with the exception of 120 there isn't much between 103 and 120 that seem worth it because I can just get those spells from other people. If overtraining in the ranger circle doesn't do much good though I might as well pick those spells up.

[Tgo01]

Got another question; does training in spirit mana control provide any benefit for rangers other than the mana regen and the obvious sharing of mana?

[BriarFox]

Ranger ranks matter a lot for spikethorn. Try to keep them at level for best effect. SMC is mostly useless.

[Tgo01]

Ranger ranks matter a lot for spikethorn.

Any idea if over training in ranger ranks provides less benefit?

[thefarmer]

Most spells you don't need to be able to cast the spell (due to not having enough levels) to have it satisfy the 'more ranks the better' requirement.

[BriarFox]

Any idea if over training in ranger ranks provides less benefit?
It's level and rank-based, so overtraining is most important if you're uphunting.

[Ryku]

Im level 100 and have 140 ranks in ranger, 40 in spirit, no lores yet, and its insanely awesome. The benefits of over training in the ranger circle are huge, even beyond your level. If I wasnt COL and have the use of wracking it wouldnt be as awesome I dont think. Anyway overtraining in ranger makes spikethorn hit harder, gives you more dodge, fury CS, TD, and DS.

[Jace Solo]

You did 84-100 in two months. That's pretty freakin boss man. You must have been playing non-stop.

[Ryku]

I love this build. It's all about killing and killing fast.

[Tgo01]

I love this build. It's all about killing and killing fast.

I'm liking it so far, it was a pain in the ass until I hit level 25 because I was very limited as to which critters I could hunt but after that it's going pretty smoothly. I fucked up and forgot to do my skills the way I wanted to before my 30 days is up but it was pretty close to how I wanted it so it wasn't too bad, thankfully got a fixskills coming up soon anyway.

But yeah, mana at the moment is obviously a problem but he can kill things pretty fast, usually 1-2 casts and 3 casts at most 99% of the time.

[BriarFox]

Did you already use your other fixskills? Every character has one on creation, separate from the 30-day migration period.

[Tgo01]

Did you already use your other fixskills? Every character has one on creation, separate from the 30-day migration period.

Well I'll be damned, I never knew about that. Thank ya! I can kick even more ass now.

[Parkbandit]

Thanks for the input everyone, I may just go with sword and board. I haven't done a sword and board character in a long while.

Which stats are the least useful for a ranger?

Sword and board is so warrior.

Go bow. BO KNOWS!

[Tgo01]

Sword and board is so warrior.

Go bow. BO KNOWS!

One of these days I'll make a ranger character, but I'd do something odd like a ranged cleric or something.

[loxe]

After reading through this thread i realized that i have never really used 616, except in emergencies, and it got me thinking. I went to the trainer and played around and came up with a couple ideas i wanted to toss out for criticism.

level 63.
2x armor (wearing augmented chain), 2x ranged, 2x PF, 1x dodge, .5x climb/swim, 2x perception, 1x survival, 1x HP, spells (20 minor spirit, 66 ranger.)
or
70 armor, 2x ranged, 2x PF, 1x dodge, .5x climb/swim, 2x perception, 1x survival, 1x HP, spells (20 minor, 64 ranger), .75x summon lore
or
same as above with 1x PF, and 1x summon lore.
or
same as above with no lore and 85 ranger ranks.

do any of these builds seem viable? or even practical?

thanks
john

[Ryku]

or
same as above with no lore and 85 ranger ranks.


This is what I would do and is actually very close to what I did at that level. Your spikes should be strong enough to be your main form of attack if you can regen enough mana (I used wracking). With that much ranged training and perc you could still use your bow I'd assume, though won't it be slightly gimped without ambush? I'm no archery expert.

If you are planning on just being a pure spikethorn hunter you could even crunch the numbers and see what your DS would be with just 1x in ranged and have enough points to boost your ranger spell ranks even more. I was surprised how little my DS dropped when I went from 2x ranged weapon training to 1x. Opened up a ton of points. Worth looking into if you don't mind kissing your archery days goodbye.

[Coleridge]

all very interesting thoughts . . . . rangers as a more spellcasting Druid build . . . . who'd a thunk?
question---> MOC affect ranger spells like it does with other professions? i don't think so but thought i would ask

[Tgo01]

all very interesting thoughts . . . . rangers as a more spellcasting Druid build . . . . who'd a thunk?
question---> MOC affect ranger spells like it does with other professions? i don't think so but thought i would ask

I wish, 10 critters hit with one spikethorn? YES PLEASE!

[Coleridge]

No shoot-- ranger buck nasty :)

[cwolff]

level 63.
2x armor (wearing augmented chain), 2x ranged, 2x PF, 1x dodge, .5x climb/swim, 2x perception, 1x survival, 1x HP, spells (20 minor spirit, 66 ranger.)
or
70 armor, 2x ranged, 2x PF, 1x dodge, .5x climb/swim, 2x perception, 1x survival, 1x HP, spells (20 minor, 64 ranger), .75x summon lore
or
same as above with 1x PF, and 1x summon lore.
or
same as above with no lore and 85 ranger ranks.

do any of these builds seem viable? or even practical?

thanks
john

I bet 1x PF will be good for you and if you are going as a "pure" type of ranger get the spritual lore summoning. At your level you'll have some really nice effect with 616 and 635.

What did you decide to do with the armor? 6% hindrance in brig can be a real pain. I'd imagine the 9% from aug chain will be tough on someone who relies so heavily on spells.

[Ryku]

I capped easily without any lore, but now that I am playing with extra training points, the lore is cool to have. The 9% sucks but getting killed by spells sucks even more. With wracking there shouldnt be any mana issues at least past level 65 or 70.

[Coleridge]

why use sword and shield for defense?-- i know its cheap but git a big ass sword--or a staff--go THW-- (course new shield stuff just got added)--depending on race and costs train dodge-- kick back defend and cast-- from what i read above the issue seems to be mana-- so the questions becomes CoL vs GoS . . . I never have enough mana but i will say mid range its getting a lot better-- i can fry with mana to spare now (I am GoS), but it did take enhancives and I am a giant in order to convert stamina to mana somewhat more effectively-- kastrel summed up the issue pretty well-- but i have hunted in ducts with spikethorning rangers and they don't git the job done-- you really need enough juice to hit the fury-- hands down-- gotta have it with vine going--and option to spike-- so yer looking at a long term project either way-- toss in the thorn once the rest of the spells are going .. . . juice permitting :) rangers . . . its a juice thing--

i think the build is possible but not an easy going path to be sure--certainly not something a ranger could do early on--but who knows a ranger with 200 ranks in summoning lore? i mean where are the reference points? what in the heck would a spikethorn do with thet much power behind it? or Fury? a staff wielding ranger focusing on thet versus the easy sword/shield or bow/ ambushing options at later levels could be devastating . . . time will tell

[cwolff]

--but who knows a ranger with 200 ranks in summoning lore? i mean where are the reference points? what in the heck would a spikethorn do with that much power behind it? or Fury?

What is the progression with ranks vs. bonus. I know 20 ranks = 90 bonus and 100 ranks = 200 bonus from Krak 635 article and that is scales down from 5,4,3 etc... but not sure at what rank it changes.

In any case, this character would get 2-3 cycles of 635 with an OK chance at a second 618 at 1x spiritual lore summoning. That is going to be mana intensive, especially with a 9% chance of failure in aug. chain.

[BriarFox]

Rangers can only 1x summoning lore.

[neimanz1]

We should be able to 2x lore or at least have another type of useful lore like the other semis!!

[Coleridge]

hmmm . . . animal lore where we can summon multiple companions . . . or make our current one more powerful . . . that would be fun

[Tgo01]

Now that my ranger is level 30 (34) I figured it was about time to think about getting him a companion. Once I choose a companion is that the companion forever or can I change companions? What exactly do I have to do to get the companion to like me and stay liking me? Just feed it and pet it and stuff? Is this a constant upkeep type of thing or just like a once every few hours type of thing? Companions for the most part are just fluff since none of them really help that much during combat, right?

[Nieninque]

For life. Feed pet and generally be nice until your affinity is maxed then you can ignore it.
Mostly fluff, but sometimes do something good (I was saved a couple of times by mine which kill the bad thing I was fighting when I was stunned and about to die). Not reliable though

[Androidpk]

Now that my ranger is level 30 (34) I figured it was about time to think about getting him a companion. Once I choose a companion is that the companion forever or can I change companions? What exactly do I have to do to get the companion to like me and stay liking me? Just feed it and pet it and stuff? Is this a constant upkeep type of thing or just like a once every few hours type of thing? Companions for the most part are just fluff since none of them really help that much during combat, right?

You should look into eHarmony.

[Leigo]

So I rolled up a halfling ranger for the thornmage concept. Coming up on the end of my 30 days and getting ready to set stats for 100th, at what point does thorns become a viable hunting method? I assume 20's is probably going to be a bit mana starved for a 16 point spell. Should I be considering a leveling build until the mana pool is heftier?

[Ryku]

Ya I cant imagine it would work before at least level 50. In my opinion.

[Tgo01]

My ranger has been using spikethorn since level 25ish, he's now level 36. He's a halfling in COL so he has a lot of mana to burn though but from just straight hunting it can be difficult for him to fry. If he gets some good bounties then he usually has no problem once he hits saturated.

So far though I'd say he's leveling just about as fast as any other character I've ever rolled up.

I agree with Ryku though, if you're looking to be able to fry in a quick hunt you're probably better off waiting until level 50 to use spikethorn as your sole hunting method.

[Ryku]

Ya I would have a much harder time making it work even at cap without sign of wracking and to sneak myself 2 spirit back in the field with Aspect of the Owl which obviously requires you to be level 50. I was a two handed ranger until level 50ish.

[Sherlock]

I just wanted to slightly revive this. My ranger is 43 and is full weed mage. I trained him to be primarily focused on hunting. He's incredibly effective and fully capable of frying off of 1 set of mana or at most 2. I typically go out to hunt at muddled/bec numb. I do ignore bandit bounties since I try to hunt solo (figuring out what I want to drop training wise in order to go full 1x perception).

He hunts using Brig(35 armor ranks). 1x shield 2x edged (went this route since I already had equipment for him) 1x PT, FA, HP, Survival, SMC (contender to stop at 45 ranks). 27 ranks of SLS, 3 MnS, 64 Ranger. I'm trying to keep him at +20 ranks in Ranger to level.

I have a wizard that keeps him spelled up plus his additional spells. One thing to note is that I do use 102 since I never found the need to swing. I did considering going brawling instead but I liked having that extra ptp. Wasn't sure the difference in DS between 2x edged with a dagger out versus 2x brawling and open hand so I went the "safe" route.

I just wanted to get feedback on ways to improve his training. I'm sure I'm doing something out of whack. Should I keep SMC where it's at now and let it drop to .5x? I have a 6x bow now so would the defense for the 6x bow outweigh having a 6x shield + 5x dagger?

Lastly, I wasn't sure if there was a script that anyone already has where it interacts with their companion to help speed up the affinity levels. Hoping there is one out there that I can just tweak. If not, does anyone know if the interaction done with the companion has a hidden timer? For example if I scratch my companion any interaction I do to her won't affect affinity for another minute or two.

Thanks in advance.

[Whirlin]

Dodge training at all in that Sherlock? What about perception? And what size shield are you currently using?

Rangers are so dodge heavy from training + 618 that my general rule of thumb for them is to avoid shield use, but I can crunch the numbers pretty quick if you let me know the other factors.

[Sherlock]

I did 0 dodge and 0 perception. My initial thought was to get at least +20 ranks in ranger to help with 616. I only use spikethorn to hunt so I wanted to make sure that was as effective as it could be based on my level. I'm using a medium size shield. I contemplated going 1x ranged 2x perception with 1x dodge but that didn't allow for much room for extra spells.

[Methais]

Think of the 10's of extra silvers you could be earning per hunt though!

I have binders full of silvers thanks to influence stat!

[Sherlock]

Below is my current training for reference.


(at level 43), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 130 35
Shield Use.........................| 145 45
Edged Weapons......................| 190 90
Physical Fitness...................| 145 45
Harness Power......................| 145 45
Spirit Mana Control................| 145 45
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 111 27
Survival...........................| 145 45
Climbing...........................| 96 22
Swimming...........................| 96 22
First Aid..........................| 145 45

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 3

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 64

[Methais]

I haven't seen Droit's spike thorn in a while. If I remember right doesn't it scroll the screen for like 10 pages worth?

[Shaps]

Since you don't swing at all, and I'm not one of the math guys, but wouldn't it be more beneficial to 2xShield and 1xOHE? Since I assume you're hunting in guarded stance?

[Nephelem]

If you dont' swing at all and aren't training dodge then 2x shield, switch to a tower, drop OHE completely and carry an ensorcelled runestaff. Your DS in guarded will be about the same but you will free up some training points and get flares on your casts.

[Sherlock]

Since you don't swing at all, and I'm not one of the math guys, but wouldn't it be more beneficial to 2xShield and 1xOHE? Since I assume you're hunting in guarded stance?

If you dont' swing at all and aren't training dodge then 2x shield, switch to a tower, drop OHE completely and carry an ensorcelled runestaff. Your DS in guarded will be about the same but you will free up some training points and get flares on your casts.

I've thought about both of your ideas. I was leaning more towards what Nephelem suggested. I looked at TP's for 1x shield 1x dodge but it didn't look feasible. I think 2x shield with a runestaff might be my best bet. That does free up a significant amount of TP's which I could use to bring up perception to 1x. And until I decide on my next steps I could bank those TP's until later.

I'd like to keep if not increase my hunting effectiveness. I'm a bit wishy washy about summoning lore. I get that there's a chance for an extra strike but I don't see much of a benefit yet. I'm looking at banking my TP's until I hit 60 and just pour it all into summoning lore to get that chance up to 50%.

I know people say they hate being a weedmage because it's a 1 trick pony that's boring. Personally, I love being able to kill things quickly in order to get back to town to perform a bit of RP.

Sidenote: It shouldn't take as long as I feel it's taking to get your affinity level up higher.

[spraggeth]

Read through all of this and unless I missed something, no one posted any combat logs. Bummer.