Does open handed still provide DS?

[Tgo01]

Just curious, since Monks and unarmed combat have arrived does open handed/shield still work for DS for casters? Or does brawling no longer provide a DS boost?

[Aluvius]

I assume it works the same as before, heck it might even get a small boost from wearing enchanted UAC handwraps.

[Roblar]

You need a minimum of 1 brawling rank to gain any enchant bonus DS from UCS items.

The 10 DS gained from wearing the +20 handwraps comes from two sources: One-hand parry (+7) and TWC (+3). You need to be at least .5x trained in TWC to gain the second bonus.

Simplified one-hand weapon enchant bonus DS formula

[(Weapon enchant bonus/2) * stance modifier)]

Stance modifiers:
OFF: 0.20
ADV: 0.30
FOR: 0.40
NEU: 0.50
GUA: 0.60
DEF: 0.70

For the TWC DS enchant bonus replace (weapon enchant bonus/2) with (weapon enchant bonus/4)

4x handwraps (+20 enchant) in stance DEF will add [(20/2) * 0.7] = +7 DS from one-hand parry

and

[(20/4) * (0.7)] = +3 DS from TWC off-hand

Total DS bonus: 7 + 3 = +10

When wearing enchanted handgear and holding an enchanted UCS compatible brawling weapon the enchant bonuses are averaged. When I wear 6x (+30) handwraps and then hold a 4x cestus my DS drops -3 because the average of the two items (+25) is less than the handwraps alone. If you wear 4x handgear and then hold a 4x cestus there is no DS change.

Mark

Copied post from officials, yes if you are trained in brawling and use enchanted gloves/gauntlets/handwraps you should get more open handed DS. You'll get more if also trained in TWC.

[Tgo01]

Are those gloves/gauntlets/handwraps special UAC weapons or are those weapons like paingrips and stuff? Can bards use sonic weapon to make these gloves? Can these weapons be disarmed?

[Roblar]

Are those gloves/gauntlets/handwraps special UAC weapons or are those weapons like paingrips and stuff? Can bards use sonic weapon to make these gloves? Can these weapons be disarmed?

The gloves/gauntlets etc are not held weapons but worn clothing that serves as a enchanting/flaring/weighting/blessable platform for UAC. As such, the enchantments provide half the enchant towards DS. Since they are worn on your inventory, they cannot be disarmed but paingrips and UAC compatible held weapons can.

Edit:
Btw, per Finros, the enchant parry DS works only on gloves/gauntlets/handwraps. High enchant UAC compatible boots will not add to DS since they are not factored into parry. They will only aid in the UCS part of the unarmed forumula when kicking, plus any special attributes (like flares).

Here's additional info (unarmed parry DS for brawlers works like the below one handed formula):
Calculating One-Handed Parry DS

Training in one-handed weapons provides a bonus to one's overall defensive strength. There are two steps to calculate this value.

Step 1: Calculate the Base Value
Base Value = Weapon Ranks + trunc(STR bonus ÷ 4) + trunc(DEX bonus ÷ 4) + (Weapon enchant ÷ 2)
Step 2: Calculate Parry DS
Parry DS = (Base Value * Stance modifier) + Stance Bonus

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Unarmed_combat_(saved_post)

[Roblar]

Oh, and I doubt bards can make sonic gloves as they are not weapons.

[Aluvius]

Yeah bards can't sing up gloves/boots but they can make nice UAC compatible sonic flaring brawlers that can't be disarmed.

[SpiffyJr]

Hrm, I wonder if 1x shield 0x brawling or 1x brawling 0x shield produces more DS.

[Asrial]

As a cleric with 1x shield and 0x brawling I toyed with 0x shield and 1x brawling.. and hated my huge loss in elemental DS. I started to get knocked around by seers in OTF.

[Drakefang]

As a cleric with 1x shield and 0x brawling I toyed with 0x shield and 1x brawling.. and hated my huge loss in elemental DS. I started to get knocked around by seers in OTF.

I suspect things change a great deal at cap. I can only say my cleric at level 45 notices only a small drop off in DS from a runestaff with 1x brawling and 4x gloves/boots. I have to wonder, though, if the offensive ability drops so significantly as to make it pointless to use UAC towards cap. If the boost to spell DF isn't big enough with double open-handed casting, then why bother. If it is worth it, I wonder if going .5x in TWC generates enough DS at cap to trade on other skills?

[Middian]

If you trained in 1x brawling and ranged could you get the DS from the gloves with archery or would it only be applied if you got disarmed?