Lisu Log

[SpunGirl]

It's un-dissapeared, someone sent me the link yesterday and I remembered that it was mentioned here.

It's effing hilarious. Womanly globes!!!

-K

[imported_Kranar]

Next time just paste the entire log here.

[SpunGirl]

I don't know if it would violate board standards or not.

-K

[GS4Gurl]

Wellll......whats the link?

[Betheny]

Where where where!

[Artha]

We want link, we want link.

[end chanting]

[Adhara]

Found it.

http://www.angelfire.com/games/lod/gs3/huka.html

[peam]

Hilarious. Sack of seed had me rolling. Do they really use phrases like that in erotic novels?

[GS4Gurl]

oh thats hilarious! bwahahahaha! Huka is a moron! lol!

[Betheny]

oh my god

my guts hurt from laughing.

[Adhara]

Ok I am very surprised. Adhara could feel nothing but contempt and disdain towards Lisu but me... oh my god I have nothing but praise and respect for the player behind Lisu.

She IS good at what she does. She does put in time and effort and I am convinced that her services are personalized. It is not up to me to decide if her advertizing on the net meets the policy when it comes to the whole family game type thing but what she does behind locked doors is definitely roleplayed. She seems to be able to adapt to any style and in a snap of the fingers too. Thumbs up lady, if you're reading this.

[Back]

I was very impressed with her roleplay actually. Top notch stuff.

Not my taste in women though. A little too matter of fact, not enough playfulness. Her posting that can't be good for business either.

[Halfsilver]

>Huka whispers, "you've been had, for FREE"

That...was worth the 10 minutes of my time it took to read this log. :lol::lol:

-grays

[Pallon]

Rod of love. LOL. If I were Huka I would have killed myself by now.

[GS4Gurl]

...been had for FREE."


Which brings me to a question. Um don't call girls collect money before the party?

[Betheny]

I can't help but wonder if he only did it so he could make her look stupid, or if he was actually serious about the whole thing.

[Taernath]

Holy crap, that would have been a 3 million session if he had paid?

[Betheny]

You pay me 3 million silvers... to do my laundry.

That's hot.

[Warriorbird]

Seems like advertising to me.

[Praefection]

I don't know who looks like the bigger idiot in that log. Lisu or Huka for playing along.. But I think this is the proof that she really is a *whore* But 3 million silvers just to be bossed around AND to do laundry? Riiiight.

[theotherjohn]

Originally posted by GS4Gurl
...been had for FREE."


Which brings me to a question. Um don't call girls collect money before the party?

No the P-I-M-P gets the money.

Thats what Lisu needs. A strong handed PIMP

[Drew2]

>You quietly whisper to Huka, "Also, while I realize you are possibly 'one hand typing', the occasional reaction that has an action of your own allows me to sense if you are enjoying a particular action or not. Your reaction to each event was the same. Moan groan whimper. I did not know you didn't like it."


Hmmm... she's met Klaive, I see.

I'd also like to mention that Lisu is damn good.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Tayre]

[Edaarin]

For what it's worth, I've never seen her out of character. And that's more than I can say for a lot of people, including myself.

[Weedmage Princess]

lmao.

[AnticorRifling]

1. That's damn funny.

2. That's damn sad on both parts.

3. That was IC on her part.

4. That's damn funny.

5. That's damn sad on both parts.

[GS4Gurl]

1. wtf

2. are

3. you

4. talking

5. about?

[Bobmuhthol]

The Lisu Log (see name of this thread), stupid.

[Halfsilver]

1. boobs

2. as

3. your

4. avatar

5. umm...yeah.

-grays

[SpunGirl]

If there has to be a "loser" in this little escapade, it's definitely Huka. Though I don't think I could type terms like "rod of love, womanly globes" and "seed sack" without spitting water/soda/beer all over my computer in laughter. I almost did just that READING the damn thing.

-K

[HappyGuyJr]

I'm sorry, but ANYONE who would actually consider text based 'RP' exciting or sexually arrousing SERIOUSLY needs to get out and start meeting people. I thought the whole log was just sad.

It came off to me as what someone with very little actual sexual experience THINKS would be sexy, or reads too many of those damn 'Harliquin' things.

In any case, the sex, romance, love, "Marriage", and all the rest of the crap being brought into GS is just plain pathetic.

[SpunGirl]

Originally posted by HappyGuyJr
I'm sorry, but ANYONE who would actually consider text based 'RP' exciting or sexually arrousing SERIOUSLY needs to get out and start meeting people. I thought the whole log was just sad.

It came off to me as what someone with very little actual sexual experience THINKS would be sexy, or reads too many of those damn 'Harliquin' things.

In any case, the sex, romance, love, "Marriage", and all the rest of the crap being brought into GS is just plain pathetic.

You're missing the point of her "services." People don't generally want to fantasize about real sex. When was the last time you saw a good R-rated movie or even a porno that had a shred of "real" sexual element in it? Things don't happen in real life the way they do in books, movies or in GS, but that doesn't stop people from craving the experience through reading/watching/cybering.

Also, I don't know where you get the idea that love, sex, et cetera don't belong in GS. Love and even sexual encounters are totally valid roleplaying choices when you're talking about a character who falls in love, or whatever. If you want to roleplay someone totally adverse to love, fine, but don't slam other people for doing it.

-K

[GS4Gurl]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
The Lisu Log (see name of this thread), stupid.

I KNOW DOOFUS I WAS WONDERING Y HE HAD 2 NUMBER IT

[Artha]

I think Huka could've done it better...getting stranger and stranger as he went along and such. Definately funny though. Rod of love...seed sack...womanly globes...

[HappyGuyJr]

No... YOUR the one missing the point. Sitting behind a keyboard and 'playing' at romance is just sad. The REAL thing is out there just waiting for you to get off your ass and go AFTER it. The problem is, people sit there staring at the screen feeling safe, so they can muster up the courage and say and do whatever they feel, finally expressing themselve.

Why not do it for REAL? Its just a waste of spirit and time to "play it safe".

Sex is not the end-all be-all of the attempt. Why play any game if there is no chance of failure? Why make any attempt at anything if there is no chance of rejection?

THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT!! IT'S CALLED RISK!!

For something to be worthwhile, you have to be willing to risk for it. THAT is what romance is. THAT is what love is.

It's NOTHING like sitting behind a keyboard safely in another state or even country, ready to flick that 'off switch' any time things get weird or stupid.


Originally posted by SpunGirl

You're missing the point of her "services." People don't generally want to fantasize about real sex. When was the last time you saw a good R-rated movie or even a porno that had a shred of "real" sexual element in it? Things don't happen in real life the way they do in books, movies or in GS, but that doesn't stop people from craving the experience through reading/watching/cybering.

Also, I don't know where you get the idea that love, sex, et cetera don't belong in GS. Love and even sexual encounters are totally valid roleplaying choices when you're talking about a character who falls in love, or whatever. If you want to roleplay someone totally adverse to love, fine, but don't slam other people for doing it.

-K

If you havn't got the guts to go out and live a real live, then you deserve to be pittied and ridiculed, until such time as you finally get up and actually make the attempt. Using a text based game as an excuse and substitute for romance or a life (which I hate to inform you is happening FAR more then your willing to admit... it's NOT RP... it's hiding) simply facilitates the problem to ever greater depths. :(

Normally I don't go off on folks as a general responce, as I would much rather focus on the stupidity of a single individual at one time. But on this occasion, I feel the need to inform you that romance and sex 'RP'ed in any form online is sad.

Not only that, but given the stagering lack of maturity so often exibited by people who play the game, gives the entire subject a very creepy vibe.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by HappyGuyJr]

[Bestatte]

And then there are those people who have satisfactory REAL life experiences, and -also- enjoy a good fantasy every now and again. In fact, I'll suggest to you Happy Guy Jr, that anyone who -doesn't- enjoy the occasional kick with imaginary sexual partners is the sad one. Fantasizing is normal human behavior. Masturbating is normal human behavior. Masturbating to fantasy is normal human behavior. If you think otherwise, you're the deviant, not everyone else.

[Bestatte]

And if she writes erotic novels, I'll bet dollars to donuts that none of them are published. First of all, it's called "erotica," not "writing erotic novels." Any half-assed writer would know that and use the correct term. Second of all, any writer who's managed to graduate high school would know the difference between its and it's, and never mistake one for the other. Her prose was so filled with grammatical errors and misspellings that if it was a guy, trying to "get me hot," I'd laugh at him and show him the door after the second emote.

[Artha]

I wonder if I could get an oleani themed staff altered into a rod of love (that still cracks me up!).

[GS4Gurl]

However, I think while roleplaying in a text based game one should overlook misspellings and minor grammical errors, because technically she's doing/acting those things and not spelling them.

[Bobmuhthol]

She's also doing them incorrectly if she can't spell for shit. The word is grammatical, not grammical.

[GS4Gurl]

Thanks Bob. Its late/early and I sleepies.

[Edaarin]

And she also misspelled erotic...

[CrystalTears]

Heh, obviously my bud HappyGuyJr didn't read the cybersex thread in the Off Topic folder. :D

Just going to sum up by saying, it's fantasy. Not all fantasy can be fulfilled so you satisfy it in any means you can that you feel safe doing. Don't assume that people who enjoy typing/reading/hearing/seeing sex scenarios are not in their own satisfying real life relaitonships (yours truly included).

Why don't you stop playing games and just go out and kill people if that's what you like, enjoy THAT risk. C'mon man, just because you don't approve of it doesn't make it wrong or "sad". I normally agree with you hon, but this time you are generalizing and assuming way too much.

[Artha]

Their session looks like it went better than this (http://sickjokes.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.elsop.com%2Fwrc% 2Fhumor%2Fcybersex.htm) one. (Not much naughty language, amazingly funny though).

[Bobmuhthol]

Gotta love how she called him the loser. Am I the only person who gets the sudden, undying urge to pull out a gun and shoot some people in the face without thinking twice?

[Terrorize]

Wow, I am in awe. Maybe I should go into selling sex business on GS. Anyways. I find it funny that people pay that much for such a sorry job. I had quite a few girls for free which were way better. You know your a loser when you have to pay.

[CrystalTears]

I'm still getting over the "sacks of seed", her "globes", her "feminine wiles" and his rod. OMG. I thought those tacky romance novels were bad. This really took the cake. And what's the deal with showing off the log? Who are we trying to embarrass here?

3 million silvers to do laundry. Gawd.

[Terrorize]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
I'm still getting over the "sacks of seed", her "globes", her "feminine wiles" and his rod. OMG. I thought those tacky romance novels were bad. This really took the cake. And what's the deal with showing off the log? Who are we trying to embarrass here?

3 million silvers to do laundry. Gawd.

heh for 3 million silvers I could afford a real life hooker if I sold the silvers. I think however, this could be a great way for the GMs to introduce STDs in the world of Gemstone. Think of how many people would get something by being touched by this woman. Specially if Klaive had her.:rolleyes:

[Bobmuhthol]

Lisu [subdued]: "that's like paying 1 silver for a one in a million chance of winning one million silver. The odds are 1:1"
Xanthur [subdued]: "Shut up Lisu"
Labean [subdued]: "Yeah Lisu, shut up"
Vaykor [subdued]: "yeah, shut up Lisu"

You focus your mind on Xanthur and think:
"Thank you."
Roundtime 5 seconds.
>

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I personally think she's an excellent roleplayer. Or he, whoever. If folk want to pay for it, more power to them. Hell, I'd rather see people pay for THAT, than mystery items...

[Terrorize]

Originally posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage
I personally think she's an excellent roleplayer. Or he, whoever. If folk want to pay for it, more power to them. Hell, I'd rather see people pay for THAT, than mystery items...

Hehe sounds like you are trying to make excuses for yourself. So you had a lil piece of Lisu's pie huh?

[Edaarin]

This has been bugging me for like a month.

What the hell is your avatar Tayvin?

[CrystalTears]

Cherry it ain't. :D

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage
I personally think she's an excellent roleplayer. Or he, whoever. If folk want to pay for it, more power to them. Hell, I'd rather see people pay for THAT, than mystery items...

I've never interacted with her in game, but from the log she seems to be able to stay in character.

Great.. folks don't like whores... understandable. But, from a roleplaying standpoint.. I think the encounter was pretty good.

hell.. I felt movement.

And I am SO going to use the "Sack of seeds" term. That's classic.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Edaarin
This has been bugging me for like a month.

What the hell is your avatar Tayvin?

Yea... what the hell is that? It looks like 2 losers trying to either dance with a big light stick.. or recreating a battle scene with Darth Vader and Luke Skywalker.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Parkbandit]

[Bobmuhthol]

That's what it is. Only they're Demi Gods for doing it, because it's $\/\/337.

[Artha]

it's star wars kid. Google it, it's funny.

[Ilvane]

Good roleplayer, sure.

Good taste, not so sure.:grin:

I don't have anything against people like her, and if people are dumb enough to spend that amount on something..then it's thier choice. As long as I don't have to see it..heh.

-A

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Originally posted by Terrorize

Originally posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage
I personally think she's an excellent roleplayer. Or he, whoever. If folk want to pay for it, more power to them. Hell, I'd rather see people pay for THAT, than mystery items...

Hehe sounds like you are trying to make excuses for yourself. So you had a lil piece of Lisu's pie huh?

Naw, but I do think it's cool what she/he does. It is definately original!

http://people.hnl.bcm.tmc.edu/jking/swk/star_wars_kid.wmv

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Suppa Hobbit Mage]

[CrystalTears]

Actually I think it's a rehearsal scene (looks like the guy who played Darth Maul) for Star Wars 1.

Anyhoo, whatever floats her boat. If that's the kind of roleplaying she enjoys and people take her up on her services, more power to them. As long as she doesn't shove it in people's faces. That type of roleplaying is not the generally accepted kind when done in public.

And there's nothing original about playing a slut and cybering. She may do it well but that doesn't make it original. She didn't create the profession ya know. :D

[Edited on 8/20/2003 by CrystalTears]

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Not created sure, but who else has advertised on the net like that?

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
Actually I think it's a rehearsal scene (looks like the guy who played Darth Maul) for Star Wars 1.

Anyhoo, whatever floats her boat. If that's the kind of roleplaying she enjoys and people take her up on her services, more power to them. As long as she doesn't shove it in people's faces. That type of roleplaying is not the generally accepted kind when done in public.

And there's nothing original about playing a slut and cybering. She may do it well but that doesn't make it original. She didn't create the profession ya know. :D

[Edited on 8/20/2003 by CrystalTears]

umm..Crystal? The guy that played Darth Maul was a martial arts expert..he did not look like a fool like this start wars kid, trust me.

-Adredrin

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Suppa Hobbit Mage
Not created sure, but who else has advertised on the net like that?

She's not the first, she certainly won't be the last.

And the only reason I said it looked like a rehearsal was because it actually had the laser light and in the star wars kid thing I've seen it just had an idiot with a stick. :P

[Terrorize]

I think I narrowed her down to being the same person that plays Xolean so far. Could still be Klaive tho. Anyways, here is a problem I have with her, she kills people alot. And when you turn around to return the favor you get reported. This seems to happen alot from what I understand. Sounds more of a turnip farmer then a tasteful roleplayer to me.

[Artha]

I'm almost positive she's just someone's extra, getting money for them.

[Terrorize]

Hehe all I know is if I see her kill someone else for no good reason I will put her to sleep, stun her, and spell up the creatures in the room and leave. Simple as that.

[HappyGuyJr]

If you guys must know... its an 18 year old kid who was playing with a prop and living out a little 'RP fantasy' of his. It was just a self made "2 bladed light saber". It was supposed to be something jsut for his own personal memories.

I have no idea how, but SOMEONE got ahold of the file, went through and added special effects, sound effects, and music. The file was then uploaded and word got circulated. The kid had to be totally and completely humiliated when it happened, as I SERIOUSLY doubt he ever wanted the file out there. Let alone "spiffed up".

I have no desire to ridicule that kid. He actually tried to live out his little fantasy. That takes some SERIOUS guts. I DO enjoy dealing with the people who torment him. The kid didnt deserve to be humiliated like that.


Originally posted by LordAdredrin

Originally posted by CrystalTears
Actually I think it's a rehearsal scene (looks like the guy who played Darth Maul) for Star Wars 1.

Anyhoo, whatever floats her boat. If that's the kind of roleplaying she enjoys and people take her up on her services, more power to them. As long as she doesn't shove it in people's faces. That type of roleplaying is not the generally accepted kind when done in public.

And there's nothing original about playing a slut and cybering. She may do it well but that doesn't make it original. She didn't create the profession ya know. :D

[Edited on 8/20/2003 by CrystalTears]

umm..Crystal? The guy that played Darth Maul was a martial arts expert..he did not look like a fool like this start wars kid, trust me.

-Adredrin

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by HappyGuyJr]

[Artha]

its an 18 year old kid who was playing with a prop and living out a little 'RP fantasy' of his.

He's actually a sophomore from Quebec. His name's Ghyslain Raza.


I have no idea how, but SOMEONE got ahold of the file, went through and added special effects, sound effects, and music.

He taped it with a school camera, and left the tape in the camera. Two kids from the AV department found it, digitized it, and uploaded it to KaZaA. It got amazingly popular, and there are a few versions out now.


The kid didnt deserve to be humiliated like that.

Totally agree. His parents are suing the two kids who put it online, and he's dropping out of school, and possibly going through therapy. Has to suck to have the whole world laughing at you. When it started, there was a collection by the first site to put it up (waxy.org) to buy him an iPod and other stuff, not sure if he got it. There's also an online petition to have him in a walk-on role for the next Star Wars movie.

[imported_Kranar]

<< Lisu [subdued]: "that's like paying 1 silver for a one in a million chance of winning one million silver. The odds are 1:1"
Xanthur [subdued]: "Shut up Lisu"
Labean [subdued]: "Yeah Lisu, shut up"
Vaykor [subdued]: "yeah, shut up Lisu" >>

Looks like she's a slut with no brain either, just lets whatever exists below the belt do the thinking for her.

If the chances of winning are one in a million, THEN THE ODDS OF WINNING aren't 1:1, they're 1:999999. The lottery could be free for all I care, the odds of winning have nothing to do with how much the game costs!

Okay... sorry, but when some dumb slut tries to do math, well, as you can see it ticks me off.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

[peam]

He got the iPod.

[HappyGuyJr]

Ahhh... but what if it's 1 million chances, EACH to win one silver? :lol:


Originally posted by Kranar
<< Lisu [subdued]: "that's like paying 1 silver for a one in a million chance of winning one million silver. The odds are 1:1"
Xanthur [subdued]: "Shut up Lisu"
Labean [subdued]: "Yeah Lisu, shut up"
Vaykor [subdued]: "yeah, shut up Lisu" >>

Looks like she's a slut with no brain either, just lets whatever exists below the belt do the thinking for her.

If the chances of winning are one in a million, THEN THE ODDS OF WINNING aren't 1:1, they're 1:999999. The lottery could be free for all I care, the odds of winning have nothing to do with how much the game costs!

Okay... sorry, but when some dumb slut tries to do math, well, as you can see it ticks me off.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

[imported_Kranar]

<< Ahhh... but what if it's 1 million chances, EACH to win one silver? >>

Heh... your odds of winning would have nothing to do with that. Are you flipping a coin 1 million times for 1 silver each? Rolling a 6 sided die 1 million times?

Anyhow, the point of my post was that if she wants to rampantly roleplay a whore, she should stick to doing that and not go anywhere near anything that requires some form of logical reasoning. No wonder she was told by everyone to shutup.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

[imported_Kranar]

<< Hell, I'd rather see people pay for THAT, than mystery items... >>

Would you really though? If the number of mystery sellers vanished one night and were replaced with a bunch of sluts whoring themselves, you would be happy with it?

[Adhara]

I think what Lisu meant was not odds but expected return ratio. To evaluate a game and determine if it's worth playing, you take the following ratio:

amount won on one successful roll
--------------------------------------------------
number of possibilities x cost for 1 play

For example, take a 6-sided die. It costs 1 silver to roll and upon rolling a 6, you win 6 silvers.

You can expect that for every 6 rolls, you will win once. The expected return ratio is then:

6 silvers (for one successful roll)
---------------------------------------------------------------
6 possible outcomes x 1 silver per play = 6 silvers

If the expected return ratio is 1 (like above) or greater than one, then the game is worth playing (meaning in the long run, the player should win).

Needless to say, no casino game ever offers an expected return superior or equal to one.

Then again, maybe she is not very smart and did mean odds. But I doubt it.

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Adhara]

[imported_Kranar]

<< Needless to say, no casino game ever offers an expected return superior or equal to one. >>

Good ol' war. The expected value is exactly what you put into the game.

Not too sure on this, but I also think it's possible to get an expected value greater than what you put in blackjack if you're skilled.

Regardless, what she meant isn't a defense since she made a clear and precise statement. She even used the proper mathematical notation for describing odds.

According to her logic, if the game were free, just some festival lottery for everyone in Elanthia who wanted to participate for no cost, then the odds of winning would be 1:0, or INFINITE!

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

[Adhara]

If the game costs 0 to play then the odds of winning are not infinite, they depend on what sort of game you play. However the expected return yields an infinite result because you simply cannot lose money. It's an infinite that's just over the edge of a huge amount divided by a very small amount.

[imported_Kranar]

<< If the game costs 0 to play then the odds of winning are not infinite, they depend on what sort of game you play. >>

Re-read what Lisu said.

According to her logic, if the game cost 0 silvers, then you would have a 1:0 chance of winning, which can only be interpreted as a +INF chance of winning, which means you'd win infinitely many times, and therefore an infinite amount of silvers.

[Adhara]

Oh I thought you were talking about me

[imported_Kranar]

Oh no, what you said is absolutely correct.

[Scott]

Lisu is such a good roleplayer. She got played by Huka and instead of handling it in game, she made a website and published the log. EXCELLENT ROLEPLAYER! :rolleyes:

A decent roleplayer learns to handle conflicts in game, apperently she couldn't....

[SpunGirl]

Originally posted by Gemstone101
Lisu is such a good roleplayer. She got played by Huka and instead of handling it in game, she made a website and published the log. EXCELLENT ROLEPLAYER! :rolleyes:

A decent roleplayer learns to handle conflicts in game, apperently she couldn't....

Good point.

And Jr. McHappy Meal, you're coming off as a total idiot here, I'm sorry to say. According you YOUR logic and the things YOU say people should do, you shouldn't even be playing Gemstone - much less sitting on your ass behind a computer and arguing about it on an unofficial BBS. I know I'm doing it, but I appreciate the place fantasy can take in some people's lives. And it doesn't have to be sexual or replace something someone isn't getting. More than anything, for most of the people I know, GS is an outlet for creativity.

You look like an ass for sitting there bagging on people for not "getting of their asses" when you're sitting on your ass ARGUING about it.

-K

[Artha]

There's a difference between playing a game and using said game to get your jollies off.

[SpunGirl]

Originally posted by Artha
There's a difference between playing a game and using said game to get your jollies off.

I totally agree, Artha. Unfortunately, Happy's statement was something to the effect that "love, sex, romance and marriage have NO place in GemStone." All of the above are valid roleplaying choices, just like murder, mayhem, sweetness, and hugs are.

-K

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Gemstone101
Lisu is such a good roleplayer. She got played by Huka and instead of handling it in game, she made a website and published the log. EXCELLENT ROLEPLAYER! :rolleyes:

A decent roleplayer learns to handle conflicts in game, apperently she couldn't....

How does her making a website and putting that log on it make her a bad roleplayer again? I don't see the correlation.

Looking at the log, it looks like she is a very capable roleplayer.

[Scott]

Why couldn't she handle her conflicts in game, instead of sending a log out to get her revenge? She's a whore, she got played, and instead of handling it in game, she made a website. Then she spread the website around IN GAME. She reports constantly when she gets killed, not to mention she kills other people as well. SHE'S A WRORE! Whore's get beat!

So lets round this down again.

She makes a website to spread around in game because she can't handle her own conflicts and has to handle it out of game. She kills people and poaches, fine, however when retalited against, she reports. She's a whore, learn to roleplay like an actually whore. Whore's get beat, played, and sometimes killed for who they are. If it is so hard for her to handle the concequences of being a whore, then maybe she shouldn't.

[Pax]

Originally posted by Gemstone101
Lisu is such a good roleplayer. She got played by Huka and instead of handling it in game, she made a website and published the log. EXCELLENT ROLEPLAYER! :rolleyes:

A decent roleplayer learns to handle conflicts in game, apperently she couldn't....

She roleplayed well and stayed in character in my opinion. Putting that on the web doesn't make her a bad roleplayer.

If you want a bad roleplayer, let's talk about Huka. One can say with a rather high certainty that his character would not have done that. Why would he go out of his way to familiarize himself with the prostitute, complain about her service, etc. and at the end just say he was playing her. It's obvious he, as a player, was trying to make fun of/humilitiate her character and/or her as a player.

It can be difficult to deal with an OOC twit while trying to stay in character. Definitely not her fault.

[Pax]

Originally posted by Gemstone101

She makes a website to spread around in game because she can't handle her own conflicts and has to handle it out of game. She kills people and poaches, fine, however when retalited against, she reports. She's a whore, learn to roleplay like an actually whore. Whore's get beat, played, and sometimes killed for who they are. If it is so hard for her to handle the concequences of being a whore, then maybe she shouldn't.

People get raped and murdered. So if they get raped or murdered in Gemstone, they shouldn't worry about it. They don't know how to roleplay people! Victimized prostitutes seek help in real life too. Your stupid generalizations form a convoluted argument at best, it seems more like you just have something against Lisu.

[CrystalTears]

You know a good roleplayer is usually decided with how they perform both in public and behind closed doors. Just because she plays a good whore in private doesn't mean that her behavior otherwise is in character. Her publishing her "efforts" on the web and telling people this in the game is just bad form. This rather discredits her abilities to keep things in game. If she wants to sit and tell the story that's one thing. But to send people to a website to see how she performs or whatever is really sad.

[Artha]

People get raped and murdered. So if they get raped or murdered in Gemstone, they shouldn't worry about it. They don't know how to roleplay people! Victimized prostitutes seek help in real life too. Your stupid generalizations form a convoluted argument at best, it seems more like you just have something against Lisu.

You're assuming that GMs are an IC thing. They're not. She should go tell her story to the constable.

[SpunGirl]

I think the publication of the encounter on the website was sort of a retaliation for his refusal to pay. I agree that IS taking things out of character.

-K

[Pax]

But does she take it into the game like that, Crystal?

If she as a player is sending other players to the website to see the services her character offers, I think that's perfectly acceptable. It's different if her character is showing their character/player. I've never interacted with her though.

[Bobmuhthol]

Honest question: Why the hell is 100% of this thread about whether or not Lisu is roleplaying? She's a fucking whore, should be shot in the face, does stupid things for money, and all you can talk about is, "Well.. I think she's a pretty good roleplayer because she says she'll have sex with you.. and then she does it."

[Pax]

Originally posted by Artha


You're assuming that GMs are an IC thing. They're not. She should go tell her story to the constable.

That's an excellent point, but I don't think it's fair to deem someone a bad roleplayer because they don't want to tolerate harassment from others (even if it is warranted in some cases, but people not being able to take it is another thread.)

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Pax
People get raped and murdered. So if they get raped or murdered in Gemstone, they shouldn't worry about it. They don't know how to roleplay people! Victimized prostitutes seek help in real life too. Your stupid generalizations form a convoluted argument at best, it seems more like you just have something against Lisu.

Yo! They go and get revenge! Remember that this is a game, not real life. They don't post it on the web and say "look what they did to me!" Besides murder in Gemstone is a totally different matter than real life, and raped, if consented it is no longer rape, it was just sex. If someone manages to "rape" your character and you just sat there, you're a moron.

[Artha]

I died in solhaven during the sheruvian invasion, and a lunatic raped my corpse...

[Pax]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Honest question: Why the hell is 100% of this thread about whether or not Lisu is roleplaying? She's a fucking whore, should be shot in the face, does stupid things for money, and all you can talk about is, "Well.. I think she's a pretty good roleplayer because she says she'll have sex with you.. and then she does it."

I don't understand what your problem is here. She provides a service for money. Some people want the service. They get the service, she gets money, both parties are happy. Where were you done wrong? It's a little crazy to say someone should be shot in the face because they cyber in a text-based game.

And I don't really remember why we started talking about her roleplaying, I jumped into the thread a bit late.

[Artha]

That's an excellent point, but I don't think it's fair to deem someone a bad roleplayer because they don't want to tolerate harassment from others (even if it is warranted in some cases, but people not being able to take it is another thread.)

When she poaches and kills them, then that is consent to CvC. Nobody should get in trouble for killing her after she has killed them, unless they do it with their other account or have a friend do it.

[Pax]

Originally posted by Artha

When she poaches and kills them, then that is consent to CvC. Nobody should get in trouble for killing her after she has killed them, unless they do it with their other account or have a friend do it.

Has anyone? If so, I agree, that's stupid.

[Artha]

I think Dargius got banned for 30 days for doing it (though, from the log he posted, he deserved it)...also, people seem to know she reports others, and I doubt she's told them...so something's got to be happening.

[Scott]

Originally posted by Pax
People get raped and murdered. So if they get raped or murdered in Gemstone, they shouldn't worry about it. They don't know how to roleplay people! Victimized prostitutes seek help in real life too. Your stupid generalizations form a convoluted argument at best, it seems more like you just have something against Lisu.

Your argument has no point, but I will try to answer whatever you ment even though I'm not sure what it is......

ANYONE, not just whores, need to accept resposibility for their actions. If you roleplay an asshole, accept the problems that come with being an asshole. Moxxa and Candor seem to do a really good job handling that.

If you want to roleplay a slut, then accept the problems that come with being a slut. How hard is that to grasp? I'm not limiting this to whores, I mean anyone in gemstone and real life need to accept responsibilties for their actions. If you want to roleplay an asshole, but not expect people to kill you and cry to GM's when someone does, then YES you are a bad roleplayer. If you want to roleplay a slut that sleeps with married people and kills other people but don't want to deal with getting beat and possibly killed then YES you are a bad roleplayer.

I have no problem with Lisu being a whore. I don't particularly like her advertising on the net about it, but that isn't my call to say whether it's acceptable or not. I have a problem with ANYONE that can't accept the responsibilties for their actions.

[Pax]

Originally posted by Gemstone101
[quote]

I have a problem with ANYONE that can't accept the responsibilties for their actions.

I strongly apologize. I guess I misunderstood your previous posts, but that's a line worth quoting. It's very true, and I agree.

[imported_Kranar]

<< "Well.. I think she's a pretty good roleplayer because she says she'll have sex with you.. and then she does it." >>

That's what I'm wondering. It seems people just like her roleplaying ability because of how good she is at having sex. I certainly hope that this standard isn't coming from Elizabethan England or any fantasy novel.

Whores are historically known as incredibly poor and desperate women and the last thing they would do is try and boss their way around their customers. They were treated like dirty beggars, they were raped, abused, they were just honestly garbage and sometimes they managed to find a drunkard whom they could successfully get money from.

So I have yet to see how Lisu is somehow some good roleplayer. I mean it's pretty out of genre to have prostitutes in the game period, but since it seems like Lisu fits some high standard of roleplaying I fear what may be next...

Anyone up to playing a charismatic drug dealer?

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

[Drew2]

You see Tayre Blupath the Apothecary.

Apothecary = Drug Dealer.
How can I help you?

[Artha]

Working on the outfit right now.

[/waiting in line for 'a sweat stained black cotton shirt' and 'White sploched blue pants']

[imported_Kranar]

<< You see Tayre Blupath the Apothecary. >>

I must admit that's actually hilarious!

[Bobby]

[quote]Originally posted by Kranar
<< Needless to say, no casino game ever offers an expected return superior or equal to one. >>

>Not too sure on this, but I also think it's possible to get an expected value greater than what you put in blackjack if you're skilled.<

Yes sir, Kranar is right on the money.

If you carefully play Blackjack, you can get an expected return of 1.42 for every 1 dollar bet (maximum) based on a 4 deck shoe.

The trouble is, finding a casino that still uses a 4 deck shoe. :lol:

[GS4Gurl]

I just want to take a little moment to apologize for a link I posted in this thread yesterday. If I had paid better attention to certain details of it I most certainly would not have put it here. Besides it had nothing to do with the topic anyways. Some things about it were brought to my attention and I was horrified and felt I should apologize to those I offended. That is so not me. Anyway if you dont know what Im talking about then disregard this post.

[GS4Gurl]

However, callgirls can't really be compared to drugdealers cus they aren't hurting anyone unless they have some STD. What would be funny is if Huka RPd he caught crabs from Lisu and went around scratching himself all the time. :lol:

[Taernath]

Originally posted by Kranar
So I have yet to see how Lisu is somehow some good roleplayer. I mean it's pretty out of genre to have prostitutes in the game period, but since it seems like Lisu fits some high standard of roleplaying I fear what may be next...


Why is prostitution out of genre for a medieval fantasy setting? Heck, we have brothels in place already - just look at Cholgar's Bathhouse. It's descriptions do everything but say "people have sex here".

[Edited on 8/20/03 by Taernath]

[SpunGirl]

Prostitution isn't OOG. There's a reason it's called "The oldest profession."

-K

[Edaarin]

Red rot anyone?

[SpunGirl]

Yeah, all the dwarves in Elanthia got that from screwing around with Kadesha.

-K

[Warriorbird]

"Whores are historically known as incredibly poor and desperate women and the last thing they would do is try and boss their way around their customers. They were treated like dirty beggars, they were raped, abused, they were just honestly garbage and sometimes they managed to find a drunkard whom they could successfully get money from. "

Southern and Eastern Europe as well as the Middle East are included in the scope of Elanthia's world too, Kranar. Arguably Asia soon as well. This doesn't mean I think she's a good roleplayer or somehow exceptional though.

[Pax]

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Yeah, all the dwarves in Elanthia got that from screwing around with Kadesha.

-K

Funny you bring that up. I just mentioned my race on the net the other day, and having just restarted didn't know anything about the rot, when outta no where Kadesha fogs in and gives me an antidote. I thought it was a kind gesture, kinda peculiar though.

[Betheny]

I simply think that because she RP's a whore doesn't mean she's a bad roleplayer.

Whether she's good or bad, I honestly don't know. I used to think she was good, then I tagged along on a group hunt where indiscriminate killing (poaching) was 'okay' by her. I ended up leaving. I think she was upset since they didn't have 307/310 anymore, but whatever.

In any case, she seems to like to stir up trouble.

[Edited on 8-21-2003 by Maimara]

[Edaarin]

It's funny to steal from her when she's in the tower and then watch her spazz.

[CrystalTears]

I'm still trying to get around the 3 million silvers part for her "abilities". That was worth more like 10 silvers. (Get it? Dime novel? Ten cents? <sighs> I'm losing my humorous touch.)

With all the people who cyber in the game, seems kinda silly to pay for it. :D

[Betheny]

But it's GOOD cyber, the kind that makes you want to whip it out and.. you know.

I'd rather watch Event Horizon again and again and again and again and again.

[Bobmuhthol]

That's preety cool. You'd watch it agian and agian and agian and agian and agian??

[Betheny]

Hey, Bob, your title may say 'noble' but you're a jackass in my heart.

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Maimara
But it's GOOD cyber, the kind that makes you want to whip it out and.. you know.


Nah, it's not even that good. For 3 million silvers, I wanted something nastier and more involved. That didn't do anything for me. But to say globes, feminine wiles, love rod and sacks of seeds, I was laughing the whole time. For 3 million silvers, you better excite me so much that my mother hears it from Florida. :D

[Scott]

Oh god. Crystaltears is scaring me.

---Opinionated Wench

[Betheny]

I was being facetious.

What does a mil go for, 13 bucks? So 3 mil would be something like 40 bucks?

For 40 bucks, you could probably get an ACTUAL blowjob, from an ACTUAL hooker -- complete with thrill of the burning sensation while urinating, the exciting prospect of jail time or at least a hefty fine if you get busted, and the absolute overloading joy of knowing you're doing something GOOD and helping someone. Yourself!

Come on, don't be a loser -- Buy It Real! The hookers will THANK you!

Brought to you by the Save the Whores foundation.

I'm joking, by the way.

[HappyGuyJr]

Oh oh... so, your saying I WASN'T supposed to go out and solicit that 68 year old prostitute w/ the lazy eye & the false teeth??

Why didn't you tell me that BEFORE last night?? :barf:


Originally posted by Maimara

For 40 bucks, you could probably get an ACTUAL blowjob, from an ACTUAL hooker...

...Come on, don't be a loser -- Buy It Real! The hookers will THANK you!

Brought to you by the Save the Whores foundation.

I'm joking, by the way.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by HappyGuyJr
Oh oh... so, your saying I WASN'T supposed to go out and solicit that 68 year old prostitute w/ the lazy eye & the false teeth??

Why didn't you tell me that BEFORE last night?? :barf:


Originally posted by Maimara

For 40 bucks, you could probably get an ACTUAL blowjob, from an ACTUAL hooker...

...Come on, don't be a loser -- Buy It Real! The hookers will THANK you!

Brought to you by the Save the Whores foundation.

I'm joking, by the way.

Nothing wrong with false teeth on a hooker.

or so I've heard. :spin:

[CrystalTears]

As long as they remove them. And if they have a flat head, even better. :D

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Kranar
Whores are historically known as incredibly poor and desperate women and the last thing they would do is try and boss their way around their customers. They were treated like dirty beggars, they were raped, abused, they were just honestly garbage and sometimes they managed to find a drunkard whom they could successfully get money from.

So I have yet to see how Lisu is somehow some good roleplayer. I mean it's pretty out of genre to have prostitutes in the game period, but since it seems like Lisu fits some high standard of roleplaying I fear what may be next...

Anyone up to playing a charismatic drug dealer?

[Edited on 8-20-2003 by Kranar]

You are stereotyping. How do you know there wasn't one well to do Lady of the Evening that was clean, well spoken and treated like royalty back then?

If we use today as an example, we see some hookers who would do basically anything for $10. We also see some very high priced ones that charge over $1000.

I think it's safe to say that those high priced call girls existed 'back in the day'.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
As long as they remove them. And if they have a flat head, even better. :D

Stop reading the same topics at the same time!:smilegrin:

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Parkbandit
I think it's safe to say that those high priced call girls existed 'back in the day'.

Right. They were called courtesans.

[Ulg]

Whores are historically known as incredibly poor and desperate women and the last thing they would do is try and boss their way around their customers. They were treated like dirty beggars, they were raped, abused, they were just honestly garbage and sometimes they managed to find a drunkard whom they could successfully get money from.

Prostitution is called one of the oldest professions. Your comments may be true by today's standards, and it may be based on what you see on the street corner, but I would point you to an historical documentaion of what it meant to be a prostitue as detailed in the Kama Sutra. There is a list of skills a prostitue should know that I'd defy nearly anyone to achieve. Even today, those types of high quality prostitues exist.

In the middle ages I'd imagine prostitues were pretty disgusting, but I don't see why there couldn't be a high class courtesan even if few and far between.


So I have yet to see how Lisu is somehow some good roleplayer. I mean it's pretty out of genre to have prostitutes in the game period, but since it seems like Lisu fits some high standard of roleplaying I fear what may be next...

Good roleplay technique with acts is why I feel she is good.

Ulg

[Terrorize]

Originally posted by Maimara
I was being facetious.

What does a mil go for, 13 bucks? So 3 mil would be something like 40 bucks?

For 40 bucks, you could probably get an ACTUAL blowjob, from an ACTUAL hooker -- complete with thrill of the burning sensation while urinating, the exciting prospect of jail time or at least a hefty fine if you get busted, and the absolute overloading joy of knowing you're doing something GOOD and helping someone. Yourself!

Come on, don't be a loser -- Buy It Real! The hookers will THANK you!

Brought to you by the Save the Whores foundation.

I'm joking, by the way.

Here in Florida alot of the strippers sell a blowjob for $10, and sex for $40, hehe I know cause we got one of my friends one for his Bachelor's party. Anyways, from what I have seen, no Lisu is not a good roleplayer. She is one of the biggest snerts I seen, only reason she doesn't get in trouble? Quite Possibly she is banging Mahegh and it seems he runs the show when it comes to customer service. And yes Mahegh is a dirty old man. But if she kills you, better not kill her in return cause she will report you.

[Terrorize]

Originally posted by Ulg

Prostitution is called one of the oldest professions. Your comments may be true by today's standards, and it may be based on what you see on the street corner, but I would point you to an historical documentaion of what it meant to be a prostitue as detailed in the Kama Sutra. There is a list of skills a prostitue should know that I'd defy nearly anyone to achieve. Even today, those types of high quality prostitues exist.

In the middle ages I'd imagine prostitues were pretty disgusting, but I don't see why there couldn't be a high class courtesan even if few and far between.

Good roleplay technique with acts is why I feel she is good.

Ulg

Even if she is a Courtesan, why would she be with lower class groady people like Huka? Sorry, but she is a dirty whore and bad at roleplaying it.

[CrystalTears]

I'm was wondering. We're basically advertising her. Shouldn't we be getting a cut of her business? :D

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Terrorize

Even if she is a Courtesan, why would she be with lower class groady people like Huka? Sorry, but she is a dirty whore and bad at roleplaying it.

Exactly where in that log did she go out of character again? I read it briefly once, and I didn't see anything.

Don't confuse your disgust for what she is doing with her ability to roleplay.

I think prostituting yourself on the net is annoying as all hell... but as far as I have seen, she has been able to roleplay it.

[Bobmuhthol]

You want out of character? I'll give you out of character. She defined the word 'noob' in a paragraph, compared it to beginner, and compared it to newbie.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
You want out of character? I'll give you out of character. She defined the word 'noob' in a paragraph, compared it to beginner, and compared it to newbie.

I didn't see that in the log anywhere. Was it a whisper to him or outloud?

[CrystalTears]

It was something she said on the net once.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
It was something she said on the net once.

Ah...

It's strange, because I've been in the landing for a couple weeks now and haven't really paid much attention to her.

She was in Falgrin's Grove though.. but she was clean.

People who come there should at least carry some coins. :sniffle:

[Valthissa]

Originally posted by Bobby
[quote]Originally posted by Kranar
<< Needless to say, no casino game ever offers an expected return superior or equal to one. >>

>Not too sure on this, but I also think it's possible to get an expected value greater than what you put in blackjack if you're skilled.<

Yes sir, Kranar is right on the money.

If you carefully play Blackjack, you can get an expected return of 1.42 for every 1 dollar bet (maximum) based on a 4 deck shoe.

The trouble is, finding a casino that still uses a 4 deck shoe. :lol:

can you post some calculations to support this? When Atlantic City opened and they had the surrender rule in place we were making about 7% by filling the table and counting 10's. Even playing single deck to the last card $1.42 on a $1 seems like a huge number.

Val

[SpunGirl]

"Here in Florida alot of the strippers sell a blowjob for $10, and sex for $40, hehe I know cause we got one of my friends one for his Bachelor's party."

This is just my opinion, and I realize I've let a sensitive nerve get poked here, but that is FUCKING DISGUSTING. The friends who did that and the bachelor who agreed to it should be fucking ashamed of themselves.

-K

Originally posted by SpunGirl
"Here in Florida alot of the strippers sell a blowjob for $10, and sex for $40, hehe I know cause we got one of my friends one for his Bachelor's party."

This is just my opinion, and I realize I've let a sensitive nerve get poked here, but that is FUCKING DISGUSTING. The friends who did that and the bachelor who agreed to it should be fucking ashamed of themselves.

-K

Agreed. Kill them.

Bachelors are NOT single. They have already made a commitment. Sex at a bachelor party is cheating. And infidelity should be punished by death. Period.

- --[ Klaive ]-- -

[Vesi]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
I'm was wondering. We're basically advertising her. Shouldn't we be getting a cut of her business? :D

I swear I was thinking the same thing!

Vesi

[Skirmisher]

Originally posted by Demon Lord Kage

Agreed. Kill them.

Bachelors are NOT single. They have already made a commitment. Sex at a bachelor party is cheating. And infidelity should be punished by death. Period.

- --[ Klaive ]-- -

Please return to whatever hole you hid in for a while.

[GS4Gurl]

Originally posted by Skirmisher

Originally posted by Demon Lord Kage

Agreed. Kill them.

Bachelors are NOT single. They have already made a commitment. Sex at a bachelor party is cheating. And infidelity should be punished by death. Period.

- --[ Klaive ]-- -

Please return to whatever hole you hid in for a while.

Agreed. He's just cranky cuz he can't use both hands cuz one is typing.:smug:

[Edaarin]

I really have to agree with Klaive on this one.

Although marriage is the last thing on my mind till I finish school, heh.

[Skirmisher]

Originally posted by Edaarin
I really have to agree with Klaive on this one.

Although marriage is the last thing on my mind till I finish school, heh.

Ermm....no not really.

See, if Klaivey were just exagerating I would say sure.

Problem is that Senor Klaive is one of those young men with a little bit of knowledge who think they know how to solve all these problems. If he were to simply say that infidelity is wrong because it is hurtful to one or all parties most of the time I think I and most here would agree.

What instead he does is, as he is prone to do, to go way overboard and think he really means it. Yeah...lets kill the bastards! And afterwards we can order some human flesh from that website like he claimed to have done on yet another occasion when he tried to be over the top.

He is always set to eleven that one is.

[Edaarin]

I didn't mean about the killing part, heh, guess I just kinda glossed over that.

[Lisu]

It is time for me to speak up.

First off, I wish to address the issue with how I handled the situation with Huka. My reasons for posting the log were purely economical. I adhere strictly to my confidentiality agreement with all clients. When Huka refused to pay, he was no longer considered a 'client' and I was able to gain quite a bit of publicity through publishing the log. And judging by the ammount of controversy it has caused (and subsequent free publicity), the embarassment to Huka (a nice perk), and the displaying of my abilities, I feel it was worth it. And for reference, a GM did call myself and Huka into a room to sort this out. However, since Huka was unable to stop calling me a whore or show any respect to the GM, he has been ordered to leave me alone in game.

Second, many have said I should have handled the situation with Huka 'in game'. What would you suggest? Whine about it on the amunet? Beg him to pay me? Complain to the constable (not actually an option)? Simply put, this was me making a statement of his actions. If you consider posting a log of someone's actions to be 'ooc', then so be it. I stand by my actions. I find that many of those claiming that all conflicts should be resolved 'in character' are those who like to abuse the system. All I did was post a log of events. Also for reference, I never posted the link on the amunet. I said "I will make the documentation of the event available for those who wish to learn the details. TTM if you wish to be informed." I only sent the link to six people. Gosh, that new web virus has nothing over how fast MY link spreads.

Third, I reject all claims that I am a whore. I am a hostess. I choose whom I will accept as clientele. I have turned down dozens of 'offers' by those who were rude or brutish. Huka behaved himself only because he had friends watching who were hiding in the room. It seems that many of those making these accusations feel any woman is either 'frigid' if she will not 'put out', and 'a whore' if she will. When these individuals pass the maturity of a fourteen year old boy, perhaps they will gain a bit more of an understanding about the opposite sex.

Fourth. My roleplaying. Why have the GMs allowed me to continue offering my services? Because I am a roleplayer. My character has caused a lot of controversy and a lot of discussion. I must be doing something right. I have found a unique character and enjoy playing this role. It seems that many feel the idea of 'roleplaying' is 'playing a role'. Thus to them, 'asshole', 'idiot warrior' and 'player killer' are all 'roles' that make them 'roleplayers'. I chose this role specifically for the controversy. Yes, there are 'consequences' to this role, and I have borne them with dignity. My 'profession' has let me meet a lot of roleplayers and interesting people through Gemstone. Perhaps they are threatened that I make my living in a way other than : 1. Hunting. 2. Amunet trading. 3. Tips (healing, raising, lockpicking, etc). I am something new, and many are threatened by this.

Fifth. If you think the game should be 'family friendly', let's remove all PVP capacity since that's violence. Let's remove pickpocketing because that's stealing and stealing is not family friendly. Let's remove monsters because the violent descriptions of combat are not suitable for children. Now why do we play gemstone instead of other MUDs? I play gemstone because of the GHs and GMs. Without these individuals, nobody would be in gemstone because anyone who set foot outside of town would be instantly killed by some 50+ level lord who is 'newbie hunting'. Also, what do you think the average age of a gemstone player is? Surely four years ago maybe they were as young as twelve, but how many 'new' players has the game really gained in the past four years? With broadband connections to play Halflife, massive multiplayer RPGs like the new Star Wars game and "Rubies of evantide", who would in their right mind sign up for gemstone? Most of the 'New' players from my experiences have been players who left years ago and are now returning.

Sixth. Why I continue to play. Would you want to play gemstone if it was nothing but "Go hunt/heal/pick, deposit loot, get healed and rest, repeat"? My oppinion is that any game where a program could 'play' for you is not worth playing. This is why I don't bother hunting alone, it is boring and repetitious unless you have an ally or allies. My actions have been quite a stir on the forums and amunet, and I am glad that I have been able to benefit the gemstone community in this way. Let's face it, the amunet conversation choices are usually either debating the value of Lisu's existance, or a long flame war about someone whining about getting PKed.

Seventh. The poaching references. Wichurana, I know that is you, since you are the only one to accuse me of poaching. Let me clarify the 'hunting rules' for you. If you are in a room with multiple monsters, and one runs away, you do not have 'chase' on both the monster still in the room with you, and the monster that ran away, especially if you never even touched the one that ran away. Also, 'chase' implies you have some sort of claim against that monster. For those who don't know, here is what happened. I was hunting in manticores and thraks along the mine road. Wichurana was in the main 'junction' room, and I was in a side room. Manticores and Thraks spawn like rabbits, so there was no shortage of using my multistrike ability. Occasionally, Wichurana would run into the room after I killed a monster, and whine about my 'poaching' her kill. Nevermind that by the time I had skinned and searched it another had spawned in the room. Now, there were several instances when a monster ran in and I did not attack it, because it was limping and I let wichurana get it. However when I would chase something into the room Wichurana was in, she would again accuse me of being a poacher, even if I had already lobbed it's arms off. About ten minutes into hunting, she accused me of poaching again and attacked me. I defended myself, and two crit weighted weapon swings later wichurana stops breathing. Here's where the policy violation begins. Wichurana then calls in Sinerot and Dargius to come to Manticores, and kill me. These individuals were whisked away by a GM after bragging about killing me, and I simply went about hunting after I was ressurected. In conclusion, I'm not a poacher. The argument 'I saw it first' doesn't hold for chase, especially if you claim to have 'seen it first' on every monster that passes through your room.

Eighth. Yes at one time I defined the difference between a 'newbie', also known as 'noob', and a beginner. Let's face it, this is an online game, and some people are going to break character sometimes on the amunet. Also, the GMs aren't going to get off their ass just because someone used the term 'noob', so you have two choices. 1. Get offended and stress out about people who sometimes make a MINOR slip up (it's not like they were talking about the superbowl or electronics). 2. Adapt, incorporate the term as a 'slang' word in the lands, and go about your daily life with far less stress. Pardon me, but I'll pick option #2. And for reference, at the time of the 'noob' discussion on the amunet, it was 3am pacific standard time with about 250 people online total.

Ninth (and final). This is a game. I enjoy playing this role. Remember, your stats are not your character. Your equipment is not your character. Anything on screen is at most ten kilobytes of data on a server somewhere in the middle of nowhere on a server you don't even own. All that you really have for your character is the personality and creativity you invest in it. In the end when we all eventually leave gemstone (Nobody plays forever), all you take with you are the memories and experiences from the game.

------ Lisu, Hostess of the Landing

[Betheny]

I'm sorry, but sex for money is prostitution, not hostessing. I'm not saying I have a problem with it, but a spade is a spade.

Second, having seen your hunting habits (albeit just once) I found your behaviors in the hunting grounds appalling and disgusting. If you'd been in my hunting ground, you'd have found yourself dead for blatantly killing anything that moves -- crit weighted weapons or no.

Play your character as you will, I have no problem with it. I must say, I admire how you take all the crap people fling at you in stride, and are able to deal with it. I sure couldn't. But just because you can roleplay, and are good at it, doesn't mean that everything you do is peachy keen. Sure -- Everything can be explained in an IC manner. However, what needs to be realized is that there are real people, with real feelings, sitting behind the computer screen, and when you (kill the creature they're working on, or rip them off for hard-earned money [i.e., Huka]) or whatever you do, I think this should be taken into account: We're human, we're fallible, and we get angry.

[SpunGirl]

I still find "womanly globes" and "seed sack" hilarious, but that was very articulate and well thought-out.

You're welcome for the free advertising!

-K

[Edaarin]

I thought it was funny whenever you spelled it Haku. Guess Huka wasn't the only one typing with one hand, heheh.

[Edited on 8-22-2003 by Edaarin]

[SpunGirl]

I think that was part of her "breaking" him. I don't know, I don't have much experience with dominatrix-ing.

-K

[SpunGirl]

"or rip them off for hard-earned money [i.e., Huka]...."

I'm not sure how she was ripping him off. I can't guess what went through either of their heads, but what did he expect for 1-3mil? I didn't see any price discussion, so it wouldn't be fair to say she was ripping him off.

-K

[Betheny]

I meant he ripped her off.

[SpunGirl]

Originally posted by Maimara
I meant he ripped her off.

Gotcha.

-K

[Lisu]

I realize a lot of people will be 'offended' by my actions. However, if you never want to be offended, the last thing you want to do is anything related to the internet. My actions have caused controversy, which have caused discussion, that a lot of people seem to enjoy discussing (even if they're arguing against me). As such, I'm doing something right.

Also for reference, the agreement between myself and Huka for price was arranged over the amunet before I came to meet him. I can provide that log as well, however I would have to sort it out from the pages of text between amunet posts (I was hunting at the time).

[Betheny]

The Internet isn't an excuse to be an asshole.

[Lisu]

Ah, pardon me. Perhaps we should enforce the Hicklin rule of obscenity on all the internet. Anything that would have a corrupting influence on the most susceptable mind is considered obscene. That of course means that everything on the internet should be acceptable for children to read. So combat should be removed from Gemstone, since it's violent. Pickpocketing should be removed from Gemstone because stealing is 'morally wrong'. Buying and selling should be removed because it offends comunists. Oh and let's remove all the races because of some bigotry, and all classes because of the prejudice... okay presenting Gemstone 5, the politically correct chatroom. And so irc.play.net was born.

The internet isn't an excuse to be an asshole. It's also not an excuse to call people assholes that you disagree with. The internet might not be the 'real world', but it has one thing in common with it. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it will change to fit your whim. You have three options. 1. Live with it. 2. Leave it. 3. Whine about it until you are blue in the face and everyone stops listening to you, then pick #1 or #2.

[Artha]

Is it an excuse to have virtual sex for virtual money?

[Betheny]

Okay, would you prefer I say, the Internet is not a valid excuse for making people angry, or for offending them?

Just because you can get away with it, and because you can rationalize it, doesn't mean you should do it. There's a responsibility involved with interacting with others. If you, as the player of an online multiplayer game, can't handle accepting the generally accepted code of conduct for something as simple as hunting, then you shouldn't play.

[Lisu]

Please provide any logs you have of me 'breaking policy' on hunting. I have always tried my best to obey the behavioral guidelines for hunting etiquite. Wichurana accuses me of poaching because she believes she has 'chase' on any monster she sees, even if someone else is already chasing it. The only other incident I can think of is when I was leading a group of seven people in mountain ogres, and there was one other person in the area whose monsters occasionally ran into the room the uber-group was in and killed it before he finished his RT and chased it. So unless you're saying that on EVERY monster that runs into your room that isn't limping you should yell to see if anyone is chasing it, then wait ten seconds so anyone who is chasing can clear roundtime and come in, please come hunt krolvins with me while you have a low DS so I can see you get repeatedly violated by them. And just to point it out, with seven people there in the group, the ogres were spawning like rabbits and you couldn't go two rooms without finding one.

[Betheny]

There isn't a log, I checked.

It was a group hunt you brought, and I went with. I play Maimara, in case you haven't noticed. At any rate, you were all in mountain ogres, and I believe an excursion was made to the Krolvin mines as well. I saw you walk into some fellow's room, kill the ogre that was there, search it, and walk out without so much as a word. As for whether that man was angry or not, I don't know.

I don't even know Witchurana, and I don't have a problem with you at all. I wasn't calling you an asshole, I was merely making a point: That the behavior I witnessed, and only witnessed once, was unacceptable. Perhaps my perception of the event was somewhat skewed, as I recall having connection problems and fluctuating in and out of the game due to it. I ended up leaving because I got fed up with seeing the Blue Screen of Death and just went to sleep.

But the point being, regardless of whether you did it or not, is that that sort of behavior is unacceptable. That's not directed AT you. That's a simple statement, and I've been known to make simple statements, if only for the utter joy of making them.

I play a character that goes outside of many of the boundaries 'set' in Gemstone society. But there are some boundaries that are there, that should not be twisted or broken. Hunting etiquette comes in many forms -- but the basics of it stay the same, and I think they SHOULD stay the same. You don't see many people that violate them, because those people generally end up quitting out of frustration, and wondering why no one liked them or helped them.

None of it is official policy, so I guess you and Joe Schmoe or whoever can do whatever they damn well please and not worry about the rest of us playing.

I guess I think that there are some things in the game that are always going to be out of character. Sure -- maybe you want to roleplay someone that just walks in and blindly kills. It'd be in character for a berserker-type. However, that's not going to be good enough to explain away why you're doing it. Because hunting is one of those things that tends to remain out of character. The mechanics of it are out of character, and contribute to such a mentality.

Maybe I'm too tired to say what I'm trying to say, but at any rate, I'm not saying any of this to offend you or put you on the defensive. Any of you.

[Betheny]

Note: The opinions stated herein are not the opinions of the owner of this account. The owner is posting for the author because the author doesn’t want to create an account for one post.




Since you started with the situation between Huka and yourself, so will I. First, I’ll give my opinion, which happens to be that of Simutronics’ official documented policy, and then I’ll validate it.

I disagree with your rationalization as to why you posted the log. Anything written or said outside GemStone is considered ‘out of character.’ There are exceptions to this rule, as there are most rules (I.E. Historical documentation that is relatively sparse inside GemStone. Usually, players are forced to find it elsewhere, such as Play.net.), but this citation is not one of them. Of course you are allowed to post anything on the Internet as long as it resides within federal law, but as it relates to GemStone, you are unfortunately incorrect in your justification.

Now, about how you roleplay your character, I applaud anyone who stringently adheres to their view of their character, and plays the game as it was meant to be played. I don’t let anyone tell me how I should play my character, and neither should you. You have chosen a perfectly viable personality to play, and I have no problem with that. I hope you don’t misinterpret my post in that way.

I do have one concern with the way you play your character, though. There are many minors who enjoy this game, and I hope you take that into careful consideration when acting out these fantasies with people. I realize that there is no way of telling whether or not someone is lying about his or her age, but your better judgment should prevail in that case. It sounds like you’ve already thought all this out, but I bring it up because of your “fourteen year old” comment. This decision is one that has the potential to get you into a lot of trouble.

As far as the hunting problem is concerned, I suggest you simply let it go. It’s not worth anyone’s time, including your own. This is a diminutive subject that has been beaten with a stick over and over again, and I, for one have had more than my fair share of it. Things like this shouldn’t even be an issue.

That said, I think what you did (post the log) would have been a viable option for many in such an exasperated situation and I also think the majority of the population would have done the same thing, were they faced with your situation. I have been known to do irrational things when I’m angry. I have a pretty bad temper when pushed far enough.

Brian, the player of Sepher

[CrystalTears]

I have never had a problem with you playing a "hostess" (yeah okay, call it whatever you want, you're still a prostitite selling sex for money), and I applaud you for putting up with the heat I'm sure you're getting for it. No one call tell you how to roleplay unless you're violating policy, which essentially you're not, so you're doing fine.

Being as how you ARE a prostitute, you need to accept the fact that people will take advantage of you and not always be forthcoming with what you want. If you want to post the log of what happened on the net, that's your right, however you can't use that as an IC medium because the internet isn't. This is why people have been saying to keep the conflcts in game.

Prostitution may be the oldest profession but it's never really been a legal and/or accepted profession. I'm sorry that you feel that you were wronged, but you will stay wrong unless you have a pimp to settle your affairs. You would NEVER see these women go to authorities or post their tragedies for the public to see because their actions are already looked down upon. You would sooner be arrested for your ways than applauded.

Play any character any way you want, however if you're going to play a woman of the night doing things that are frowned upon by many people, accept the consequences and deal with the fact that you're playing a "profession" that people would sooner stone you for than stand behind you to defend your "honor".

[Edited on 8/22/2003 by CrystalTears]

[Weedmage Princess]

I don't see why you just don't get the silver from them first. I mean, waiting til it's all said and done is just ASKING for a jerk like Huka to come along and do what he did.

You don't even need a pimp, though. Everyone's vulnerable at some point. Kill him. *shrug* In lots of fantasy books I've read, prostitutes have been known to be very lethal (not just for diseases..heh)..they've been hired by rulers of kingdoms as spies and assassins. The poor little hooker thing doesn't have to be the case.

[Edited on 8-22-2003 by Weedmage Princess]

[Ulg]

In lots of fantasy books I've read, prostitutes have been known to be very lethal (not just for diseases..heh)..they've been hired by rulers of kingdoms as spies and assassins. The poor little hooker thing doesn't have to be the case.

This reminded me of one of my favorite recent movies, Brotherhood of the Wolf. Set in the Victorian era, a French historian/adventurer and his American Indian friend investigate rumors of a great beast killing off people in a colony.

At one point they go to a brothel and the French guy hooks up with this amazing courtesan. Well educated, mysterious, georgeous and very very dangerous. Great character. The same actress, Monica Bellucci, was also Persephone in Matrix Reloaded. Woof!

[Artha]

There's a reason they're called fantasy books...and movies aren't real. In fact, have any of you seen a real prostitute? I looked around, but couldn't find the site that had links to a whole bunch of them...needless to say, they're nothing I'd want to touch, let alone sleep with.

[Weedmage Princess]

Actually yes, I've seen prostitutes...different types of them, too.

Not all prostitutes are the $10 crackwhores you see surrounding your local ghetto. There are some rather expensive ones. Ever heard of Heidi Fleiss?

Back in medievil times, it wasn't unusual for high ranking nobles (maybe in some cases the kings) to visit a courtesan. And I highly doubt they'd be hopping in the sack with some toothless drunken gutter wench.

[Ulg]

There's a reason they're called fantasy books...and movies aren't real. In fact, have any of you seen a real prostitute? I looked around, but couldn't find the site that had links to a whole bunch of them...needless to say, they're nothing I'd want to touch, let alone sleep with.

Not sure what your point is... GS is a fantasy world also, and we are talking about fantasy here.

[Bestatte]

The whole issue of poaching is juvenile so I won't touch it except for that one remark.

Now on to the prostitution thing:

Lisu, your character (not you) -is- a whore. It's what she does for a living. In a world such as the fantasy world of Elanthia, there's no shame in it, and anyone who thinks they're insulting you by using that term should be laughed at. It isn't an insult, it's a fact, and it's THEIR ignorance, not YOUR behavior, that should be called into question.

Next - whores get ripped off from time to time. If you're charging (and receiving) a million or more silvers for each session, then you can probably take the loss of one customer without batting one of your pretty eyelashes, so don't kwibble - just get over it and move on to your next customer.

Next - as to legalized prostitution - hasn't anyone ever heard of geisha? These women are highly trained pleasure companions, who offer services ranging from sex to conversation to card games and tea service at a very high price. They are considered to be one of the most honored citizens of their country and it's considered an enormoous honor to have the privilege of their company. Their profession is also protected by the country and revered as one of the last bastions of the tradition of their culture.

Now granted, Lisu (the character) is hardly a geisha, by any stretch of the imagination. Geisha are subtle, they don't need to advertise. But the point remains: there is absolutely nothing wrong with roleplaying a whore. Especially if she's successful with it. That means she's doing something right, no?

Lastly, my criticism is of the quality of your RP in reference to the actual log, compared with the money you're charging, and your mention of being a writer of erotic novels during the IC "session." I've done a bit of the cyber-thing in my day, and I must say I can do a better job of it when I have PMS, a raging headache, and gut-wrenching cramps than you did during that one session. If you're getting three million for THAT - then I should probably get back into the game and give your character a serious run for her money. And I'm not even the best out there. I've had "sessions" with people who've knocked my virtual socks off.

It's kinda sad what people will let their characters pay for these days, but it just reinforces my belief that a lot of GS players have no idea what "good" roleplaying looks like.

[Artha]

I've always wanted to cyber someone, and then sigh and say I was flaccid before the the uh...act.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Bestatte

I've done a bit of the cyber-thing in my day, and I must say I can do a better job of it when I have PMS, a raging headache, and gut-wrenching cramps than you did during that one session. If you're getting three million for THAT - then I should probably get back into the game and give your character a serious run for her money. And I'm not even the best out there. I've had "sessions" with people who've knocked my virtual socks off.


Damn.. you're getting me hot again Bestatte. :spin:

And as far as her roleplay goes.. I find nothing wrong with it from that log's standpoint. Is it the best roleplaying session I have ever seen? Hardly.. but there's nothing wrong with it. It's not bad roleplaying... and thus I'll defend her.

[Artha]

I dunno...it had 'rod of love' in there...come on Lisu, rod of love? That sounds like something an Oleani priest would wave.

[Edited on 8-22-2003 by Artha]

[Bestatte]

Heh Parkbandit..

It just irks me when people of mediocre talent proclaim themselves to be "IT" when it comes to RP, even though I - a mere amateur who hasn't ever published a single page of erotica, can run circles around them. It irks me even more to see that her "talents" impress people. She really isn't all that impressive. Yes, she WAS roleplaying, and no, her roleplaying wasn't "bad" at all. It just wasn't "all that and then some" and hardly worth a million silvers.

It's just sad what people will consider "good" roleplaying, because it points to the fact that they don't really know what "good" roleplaying is anymore.

And yes Parkbandit, I wrote all that just to make you hot <smooch>.

[Edaarin]

"If I was an ice cream cone, how would you eat me?"
"I would eat you really fast before I got flaccid."

Classic Family Guy...

[Hips]

Originally posted by Bestatte
Next - as to legalized prostitution - hasn't anyone ever heard of geisha?


Geisha weren't specifically whores, though. They had a variety of other trades... unlike Lisu.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Lisu
And judging by the ammount of controversy it has caused (and subsequent free publicity), the embarassment to Huka (a nice perk), and the displaying of my abilities, I feel it was worth it.

Normally, I would choose not to comment on such as this; however, I must point out that:
1) any courtesan worth her salt need not advertise in such a crass manner as this.
2) any adult, courtesan or not, would find no joy in the embarrassment of another.
3) your abilities are not so stellar as to warrant publication on the web, or otherwise. Erotic novels? Yes, of course.


Originally posted by Lisu
Second, many have said I should have handled the situation with Huka 'in game'. What would you suggest?

I would suggest you learn more about being a courtesan, or a high-class prostitute, for that matter. One achieves one's payment, whatever that might be, before one "gives away the store", so to speak.


Originally posted by Lisu
When these individuals pass the maturity of a fourteen year old boy, perhaps they will gain a bit more of an understanding about the opposite sex.

Unfortunately, most of your clients are probably little more than fourteen, and some may be younger. Many players, I know, take no responsibility for the harm they may do to others, choosing to blame the children for becoming involved, rather than themselves for allowing children to be involved. Since, on the internet, we are often unable to ascertain the age of those with whom we consort, it falls upon us, as conscientious adults, to think through our actions with a mind to the good of all, not only the good of ourselves.

Now, am I sure you are adult? Hardly. You may well not be much beyond puberty yourself, if your writing prowess is used as an indicator.


Originally posted by Lisu
My character has caused a lot of controversy and a lot of discussion. I must be doing something right. I have found a unique character and enjoy playing this role.

Serial killers cause a great deal of controversy, as do child molesters, embezzlers, and those who mistreat animals, when caught. Does that mean they are doing something right? Your logic escapes me, I fear.

I hate to burst your bubble, but your character is in no way unique. Prostitutes existed in Elanthia before you arrived, and will exist after you have faded into oblivion. Some were far more adept at plying their trade in the virtual world than you are. They did not, however, advertise on the amunet. That, I am afraid, is your only true innovation.

Personally, I care not what you do. My only concern is for the young people who might be victimized by someone like you.

I must admit, I find it annoyingly difficult to maintain my silence when I see such blatant, self-serving blather as was contained in your post. You are not an amazing roleplayer, your character is not unique, and the player of that character strikes me as irresponsible and ill-equipped to deal with the trouble she/he causes to self and to others.

HarmNone, she who could not stand quiet

[Artha]

Harmnone kicks butt...but in a non-harmful way.

[imported_Kranar]

Harmnone said it better than I ever could.

[Edaarin]

I'm just curious, how much money have you made doing this Lisu?

[HarmNone]

Sadly, HarmNone regrets the need to have said it at all, Kranar. Like most of the controversy that arises within Elanthia, this could have been avoided through the use of simple, common sense (a commodity that is decidedly uncommon, I fear).

If the joy in one's life comes through the exploitation or devaluation of another, one could benefit from a long, quiet session of self-examination. If one is adult, and is indulging in such behaviors, the result should be a heavy dose of shame and, hopefully, a concerted effort to reform one's thinking. If one is not capable of adult thinking, one is out of one's league in Elanthia, unless the lands have fallen to the level of a backyard sandbox. If that is true, I am saddened.

HarmNone

[Terrorize]

Well don't worry Lisu, I am usually with my friends hunting Invisible, and I will make sure that I log the entire thing so when you do start your shit and kill my friends again, I can Call Wind, stun, and sleep you without getting in much trouble, plus I am sure the creatures will have a field day with you. And I will post the log on this site when it does happen. I hate dirty poaching murdering hoes.

[Terrorize]

Or tell my friends to instead pull a Lisu and REPORT her. With enough reports I am sure something will happen.

[Artha]

Well...depends on how many. Poaching isn't against policy. Being a crybaby is.

Policy 20.

[Soulpieced]

I can Call Wind, stun, and sleep you without getting in much trouble, plus I am sure the creatures will have a field day with you.

.

If any GM is watching, you'll get slapped with a warning for casting dangerous spells in a hunting area at someone purposely with intent of creatures killing them.

[Kyle]

Wow, all of you people really need to shut the fuck up and stop telling people how to play their characters.

Lisu, you roleplay. Congrats. You do well at it, a lot better than most others, and I applaud you for it.

For the rest of you, until you have the balls to post a log of you cybering, don't tell her if she's write or wrong, or that her abilities aren't up to par.

[Weedmage Princess]

Originally posted by Kyle
..For the rest of you, until you have the balls to post a log of you cybering, don't tell her if she's write or wrong, or that her abilities aren't up to par.

Dear God PLEASE don't let this start a trend

[Artha]

$5.00 says Kyle is either Lisu, or a friend of Lisu!

[Halfsilver]

Originally posted by Artha
$5.00 says Kyle is either Lisu, or a friend of Lisu!

5 more dollars says that you couldn't be anymore obvious. lol.

-grays

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Kyle
For the rest of you, until you have the balls to post a log of you cybering, don't tell her if she's write or wrong, or that her abilities aren't up to par.

Firstly, for many of us, no such log would exist. Not everyone is prone to indulge in that particular form of entertainment.

Secondly, it takes no courage to post such a log. It requires only a lack of good taste.

Thirdly, most would not have said anything had she not claimed "abilities" that were not made evident by the log in question. There are a few here who know something about writing for publication. :D

Fourthly, I have no balls, and am not in the least disconcerted by the lack thereof.

Lastly, Lisu herself asked for suggestions. Aptly, several have been forthcoming.

HarmNone, writing a wrong, or something. :rolleyes:

[Artha]

5 more dollars says that you couldn't be anymore obvious. lol.

*sigh* what's your paypal? I'll have it there soon...

[Betheny]

Maybe that's part of the contract he signed with her. I wonder if you get a discount for verbally defending her on a message board outside of the game.

[Kyle]

No, not really. In fact, I haven't even recieved her services. It seems to me that most of you are either morally uptight, jealous or want to just find something to criticize.

I still stand by my typo-ed statement. None of you who claim better skills have any right to criticize her services until I see a log of you, or a story of yours.

Oh, and Harmnone, I applaud you for using semantics as an arguement.

[Betheny]

So far as I know, no one's claimed to be better than her.

I'm incredibly jealous. Let me tell you. So jealous. Green with it.

Wait... no... I wouldn't enjoy the shit she has to take for doing what she does. So... I guess that doesn't make me jealous. Annoyed, maybe...

[imported_Kranar]

<< None of you who claim better skills have any right to criticize her services until I see a log of you, or a story of yours. >>

Oh man I'm so jealous of her, I mean I TOO want to get ripped off of 3 million silvers and cry about it by posting a log.

Heck, we all know how wonderful it is to be known as a whore, and the fact that she has that wonderful and noble title just fills me with an infinity of jealousy.

Lisu! Teach me! I beg to be a cyberslut so everyone can think I'm a good roleplayer!

[GS4Gurl]

LOL its funny that this "Kyle" appears out of nowhere to defend Lisu. Which is another reason some may think it is Lisu herself. And its funny that they chose such a random name as Kyle... Now what? I'm just waiting for Joe Luttiano to chime in too.


Eeesh I've been around a long time.

[Kyle]

Originally posted by Maimara
So far as I know, no one's claimed to be better than her.

I'm incredibly jealous. Let me tell you. So jealous. Green with it.

Wait... no... I wouldn't enjoy the shit she has to take for doing what she does. So... I guess that doesn't make me jealous. Annoyed, maybe...


Originally posted by Bestatte
And if she writes erotic novels, I'll bet dollars to donuts that none of them are published. First of all, it's called "erotica," not "writing erotic novels." Any half-assed writer would know that and use the correct term. Second of all, any writer who's managed to graduate high school would know the difference between its and it's, and never mistake one for the other. Her prose was so filled with grammatical errors and misspellings that if it was a guy, trying to "get me hot," I'd laugh at him and show him the door after the second emote.


Originally posted by Terrorize
Wow, I am in awe. Maybe I should go into selling sex business on GS. Anyways. I find it funny that people pay that much for such a sorry job. I had quite a few girls for free which were way better. You know your a loser when you have to pay.


Originally posted by CrystalTears
I'm still getting over the "sacks of seed", her "globes", her "feminine wiles" and his rod. OMG. I thought those tacky romance novels were bad. This really took the cake. And what's the deal with showing off the log? Who are we trying to embarrass here?

3 million silvers to do laundry. Gawd.


Originally posted by CrystalTears
I'm still trying to get around the 3 million silvers part for her "abilities". That was worth more like 10 silvers. (Get it? Dime novel? Ten cents? <sighs> I'm losing my humorous touch.)

With all the people who cyber in the game, seems kinda silly to pay for it. :D


Originally posted by CrystalTears

Originally posted by Maimara
But it's GOOD cyber, the kind that makes you want to whip it out and.. you know.


Nah, it's not even that good. For 3 million silvers, I wanted something nastier and more involved. That didn't do anything for me. But to say globes, feminine wiles, love rod and sacks of seeds, I was laughing the whole time. For 3 million silvers, you better excite me so much that my mother hears it from Florida. :D

[Kyle]

Excuse me, I had to recreate my username because I no longer have access to my old email account and I misplaced my password. If one of the admins would like to confirm this, the old email was kbundy1@earthlink.net registered under Skaster.

Secondly, Kranar, you've lost a hell of a lot of respect from me lately. Crystaltears too.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Kyle
Oh, and Harmnone, I applaud you for using semantics as an arguement.

While normally I would revel in applause, in this case I must first ask...........

Huh?

HarmNone the bewildered

[Ilvane]

Okay guys..lets not get into just insulting each other again.:snicker:

Sometimes all this reminds me of a bad Jerry Springer show. :grin:

Really, who cares if she is a prostitute, who cares if she's really bad, or good, or a excellent roleplayer or horrible. It's her business. Everyone has something in the game. You can be a thief, and I don't see anyone going off for a while on why it is immoral.

Just let her have her (Fun?) heh.

-A

[Kyle]

Originally posted by HarmNone

Fourthly, I have no balls, and am not in the least disconcerted by the lack thereof.

HarmNone, writing a wrong, or something. :rolleyes:

If you'd like for me to explain, the word balls can be used a harsher term for the word courage. I believe that Lisu has a great deal of courage to have posted her 'work' on a public forum, not a lack of taste.

I'm pretty sure you were aware of this, and thus, were making an argument on semantics and word usage. Just your post signing, which noted my typo.

[imported_Kranar]

<< Really, who cares if she is a prostitute, who cares if she's really bad, or good, or a excellent roleplayer or horrible. It's her business. >>

Re-read the thread and you'll understand who's business it is.

We care because we're sick of her starting trouble and advertising on the amunet. And yes, that includes me personally. Have you ever met her in the game to be able to formulate an opinion on the issue? All she does is ask for trouble, and when it comes her way she cries about it either to the GMs or posts a log crying about it.

Enough's enough, it's time to call her on it.

<< While normally I would revel in applause, in this case I must first ask...........

Huh? >>

He means he can't understand what you're trying to say.
Use easy to understand words, 2 syllables maximum.

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Kranar]

[imported_Kranar]

<< Secondly, Kranar, you've lost a hell of a lot of respect from me lately. Crystaltears too. >>

Glad to hear it. A desperate plea for sympathy and guilt is lame.

"Oh I used to think you were so cool man, what happened to you? Oh I'm not your friend anymore because you disagree with me. I'm gonna go cry now."

Make your point or step aside.

[Kyle]

It looks like you're just looking for something to bitch about, Kranar. You've made complicated scripts, tell me you can't figure out a blackout highlight or a squelch? It seems to me that you want her to offend you so that you have a reason to increase your postcount.

I really don't give a fuck what you think that statement means. For me, I used to respect you, because you would have an open mind about situations like these. Now, you're just as much of an ignorant hard-ass as most southern Baptists, and it pisses me off that you had to turn that route.

[imported_Kranar]

<< It looks like you're just looking for something to bitch about, Kranar. You've made complicated scripts, tell me you can't figure out a blackout highlight or a squelch? It seems to me that you want her to offend you so that you have a reason to increase your postcount. >>

I can increase or decrease my post count by approximately 2^31 with the click of a button.

<< I really don't give a fuck what you think that statement means. >>

Then why respond to it? If you don't care then step aside.

<< For me, I used to respect you, because you would have an open mind about situations like these. >>

Never in my life have I ever had an open mind about public whoring in Gemstone or elsewhere. Don't pretend like you know me or ever knew me and quit the whole "I thought you were cool man." argument. It may work with your buddies on the playground, but it doesn't work here.

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Kranar]

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Ilvane
Just let her have her (Fun?) heh.

-A
I am normally a peaceful sort; however,
for the record, I do not think it is the matter of whether or not Lisu is having fun that is at issue here. Lisu does not exist in a vacuum, and her fun is not the only thing of importance.

Lisu published to the web a log that involved not only her, but someone else. She published that log without the permission of the other person involved, and has admitted she realized the log would embarrass that person.

When the log was brought to light here, Lisu posted in her own defense, and asked for suggestions of how the matter might have been handled in-game. By doing that, she opened the door for criticism and she received same.

Now, comes Kyle to the rescue with a post that was outright rude. I believe there is an old adage extant: "If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen."

HarmNone says "nuff said"

[Kyle]

I could say something about compensation, but really, I won't. By my statement, I meant that your stance and reasons for that stance is unclear, as are your responses on this thread.

Secondly, I was explaining what the statement meant to me. And that I don't care what it meant to you, because I wasn't saying it you.

Finally, how immature of you. Did you get abducted by some God-loving cult recently? It sure seems that way. "Dear no, someone's paying for a game and playing it the way they want to, and I could do something to blink out her existance or ignore her, but I refuse to, because I want something to bitch about."

Really now.

[Kyle]

Originally posted by Lisu
I adhere strictly to my confidentiality agreement with all clients. When Huka refused to pay, he was no longer considered a 'client' and I was able to gain quite a bit of publicity through publishing the log.

That sounds very reasonable to me. In fact, I think that he deserves it. If he would have payed, then nothing would have happened. He did not, and he does not deserve any of the rights of privacy that come along with paying customers.

[Kyle]

Originally posted by HarmNoneWhen the log was brought to light here, Lisu posted in her own defense, and asked for suggestions of how the matter might have been handled in-game. By doing that, she opened the door for criticism and she received same.


She was criticized several times on the first three pages, before she was most likely even registered. Please, take these steps.

1. Read
2. Comprehend
3. Reply

Thanks!

[Back]

When the log was brought to light here, Lisu posted in her own defense, and asked for suggestions of how the matter might have been handled in-game. By doing that, she opened the door for criticism and she received same.

She also received praise. Now, I realize the content of her roleplay may be offensive, disgusting, or immoral to some, but beyond the content, her technique is outstanding, you have to admit. I consider myself a darn good roleplayer, but I rarely have the energy to put as much into what I do as she displayed.

She has every right to play the way she wants. You as a player may disapprove, and you have that right, but obviously, there are people who approve as much as disapprove. You like it or you don't. You roleplay with her or you don't. Pretty simple concept.

A couple of points have been brought up that I do agree with. One, she should make sure she knows the age of the person she is dealing with. Two, posting the log was kind of an OOC solution to an IC problem. While I consider myself a decent roleplayer, I have come to learn that while complete immersion is ultimately the goal, one must still take many OOC things into consideration while playing and realize it is just a game. And, honestly, I don't see the log being posted as near hurtful as losing 3 million silver.

He scammed her in the first place. I guess no one thinks lying, cheating and stealing from someone who works a hard honest living is a bad thing?

Only suggestion I have Lisu is either try to kill him, have him killed, or threaten to have him killed and kill him until the money is paid. And do this entirely IC, not through AIM.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Kyle
She was criticized several times on the first three pages, before she was most likely even registered. Please, take these steps.

1. Read
2. Comprehend
3. Reply

Thanks!

Gotcha. I have read. Have you? Nowhere prior to Lisu's posting will you see a post from ME commenting pro or con on this issue. She asked. She received. Rather than ride in on that great white horse and condemn us all, take your own advice. Read, comprehend, reply. Oh, and be sure you're replying to the proper poster. :D

Originally posted by Kyle
I believe that Lisu has a great deal of courage to have posted her 'work' on a public forum, not a lack of taste.

Oh, I would most heartily agree that it took courage to post that particular piece of work on a public forum :D. However, I feel safe in assuming that your reasons for seeing the act of posting as courageous are distinctly different than mine. I still maintain it was in incredibly poor taste to do so.

HarmNone, trying not to

[imported_Kranar]

<< I guess no one thinks lying, cheating and stealing from someone who works a hard honest living is a bad thing? >>

No, but what some us do think is that whoring oneself isn't a hard, honest, living.

Is prostitution in Elanthia even legal? Someone should ask a GM for a clear answer, but I'm sure they'll say no.

Even if, let's say, prostitutes did somehow have respect as courtesans, I highly doubt the woman herself had any choice in the matter. Whether one is a "courtesan" or just some plain ol dirty "whore" is entirely up to the population and to customers to decide, not to the individual who chooses to sell themselves for sex.

Therefore if Lisu is treated like a cheap dirty whore, and it's not what she wants... it may be time to find another profession.

[Scott]

She has every right to play the way she wants. You as a player may disapprove, and you have that right, but obviously, there are people who approve as much as disapprove. You like it or you don't. You roleplay with her or you don't. Pretty simple concept.

No, you do not have the right to roleplay whoever you want. There are guidelines to how to you can roleplay your character, not to mention this game is for children as well and not for sluts and hoes to infest the game.


He scammed her in the first place. I guess no one thinks lying, cheating and stealing from someone who works a hard honest living is a bad thing?

As bad as a slut? No.


That sounds very reasonable to me. In fact, I think that he deserves it. If he would have payed, then nothing would have happened. He did not, and he does not deserve any of the rights of privacy that come along with paying customers.

Learn how to roleplay a conflict. Taking it out of game is sad.


It looks like you're just looking for something to bitch about, Kranar. You've made complicated scripts, tell me you can't figure out a blackout highlight or a squelch? It seems to me that you want her to offend you so that you have a reason to increase your postcount.

It's not that Kranar doesn't just like it. It's not appropriate for Gemstone. Playing a slut (poorly by the way) is something that isn't fit for gemstone or it's player base. I'm sorry but she need's to realize the other person on the end of that computer is somtimes 12 or 13.... it's wrong.

[imported_Kranar]

<< I'm sorry but she need's to realize the other person on the end of that computer is somtimes 12 or 13.... it's wrong. >>

It's also pretty perverted.

And one final note... I would be all for prostitutes in Gemstone The Fallen, and I'd be all for drug dealers and whatever other scum professions exist.

I just dissaprove of them publically in Gemstone Prime since it's suppose to maintain some type of standard and decency with respect to its players. Wheras The Fallen has no standard of anything and everyone is assumed to be 18 or older.

[Back]

::whistle:: Dang. We must be in Salem.

Kidding aside... I agree the content is pretty mature, and I agree she should definately make every attempt at finding out someone's age before hand.


I'm sorry but she need's to realize the other person on the end of that computer is somtimes 12 or 13.... it's wrong.

And killing people is? Again, I'll restate that I think we have some pretty messed up values. Why violence is more acceptable than sex... I'll never understand.


No, but what some us do think is that whoring oneself isn't a hard, honest, living.

As if she really wanted to do all that for some pay-for-sex schmuck because she liked him. I realize I can't conivice people to think like I do, but I see it as work. Not work I'd do, but still a grueling service industry job. Not to mention the risks invovled.


No, you do not have the right to roleplay whoever you want. There are guidelines to how to you can roleplay your character, not to mention this game is for children as well and not for sluts and hoes to infest the game.

I do stand corrected here. Yes, you cannot be an alien from outter space. You cannot play a rolton. You cannot play the Queen of the Empire. A prostitue however does fit the genre. As for kids, well, their parents need to watch them. And Lisu is just one person who is at least honest about what she does. The internet is very large and full of things that parent may not want their children to see or do. The parents have an obligation to monitor this and act accordingly.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by HarmNone


Lisu published to the web a log that involved not only her, but someone else. She published that log without the permission of the other person involved, and has admitted she realized the log would embarrass that person.



I've posted 3 or 4 logs here from people I didn't ask permission to post. Whoopie.

I think the problem many people have with Lisu is with the morals of what she is doing. I've yet to interact with her in game, but from the log, I would welcome the opportunity as she does possess the ability to roleplay in this game.

I would MUCH rather deal with a whore character than some dumbass idiot who is in the park saying "Hey Dude, how r u? How's your AS, because mine Roxors!"

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Parkbandit]

[Kyle]

I'd like to point out one of the game's Arkati, Ivas, Goddess of pleasure.

Yes, sluts and whores aren't allowed. They're illegal, if you play one, the FBI will come to your house and own you.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Backlash

When the log was brought to light here, Lisu posted in her own defense, and asked for suggestions of how the matter might have been handled in-game. By doing that, she opened the door for criticism and she received same.

She also received praise. Now, I realize the content of her roleplay may be offensive, disgusting, or immoral to some, but beyond the content, her technique is outstanding, you have to admit. I consider myself a darn good roleplayer, but I rarely have the energy to put as much into what I do as she displayed.

We must agree to disagree. I do not recognize this outstanding technique of which you speak. To me, great roleplay in a text-based RPG does not require energy, it requires strong writing skills and the ability to think on one's feet, so to speak. I saw evidence of neither in the log that was posted.

Lisu is not the worst roleplayer I have encountered, but if this log is to be considered as evidence, she is most definitely not an outstanding roleplayer, either. Mediocre, at best.

Erotic roleplay is not offensive or disgusting to me, personally. However, there are other games where it is much more suitable, and much, much better done. :D

As a moral issue, my concern is with this pattern of behavior in a family-oriented game. Whether we like it or not, children play GemStone3.


Originally posted by Backlash
And, honestly, I don't see the log being posted as near hurtful as losing 3 million silver.

Err, nobody lost any silver. Lisu hoped to get the silver, but did not. She lost nothing. She simply received nothing.

From an in-character standpoint, this happens quite often to those who ply her chosen trade. Taking her retribution outside the game was a cheap shot.

HarmNone, on a roll

[Scott]

And killing people is? Again, I'll restate that I think we have some pretty messed up values. Why violence is more acceptable than sex... I'll never understand.

There is a big difference when it comes to games. Killing someone in a game is something that every little kid does. You know playing cops and robbers and you shoot eachother or something like that. It's not violent really, it's part of the game. Not to mention when a mother signs their 12 year old up to play Gemstone, they KNOW that the game involves you killing a critter. A parent doesn't know that their kid could end up having sex with a slut......



I do stand corrected here. Yes, you cannot be an alien from outter space. You cannot play a rolton. You cannot play the Queen of the Empire. A prostitue however does fit the genre. As for kids, well, their parents need to watch them. And Lisu is just one person who is at least honest about what she does. The internet is very large and full of things that parent may not want their children to see or do. The parents have an obligation to monitor this and act accordingly.

A prostitute is in genre, however it isn't really acceptable for Gemstone. The internet is full of preditors out there, which is why I'm glad my nephew play Gemstone and not sits around in chat rooms talking to god know's who. I let my him play Gemstone (with my brothers consent.) I do watch him when he's on the computer, I peak in on him occasionly just to see what's going on. I'm much happier he plays Gemstone then Doom or something like that. I think he gets things out of Gemstone. Gemstone is a fantasy game, when I signed him up about 6 months ago, I knew he was going to be killing critters and possibly people (if he took after me.) I didn't know that I might have to explain to him that Lisu is a slut and she fucks people in a game.

[Scott]

Originally posted by Kyle
I'd like to point out one of the game's Arkati, Ivas, Goddess of pleasure.

Yes, sluts and whores aren't allowed. They're illegal, if you play one, the FBI will come to your house and own you.

I'm glad some people can have an adult conversation IE Backlash, who is able to point out facts and such without crying and making stupid comments. I'm sorry that your 12 year old hormones have got the best of you and you are flipping out at people because you don't like what they say about someone you had sex with in gemstone.

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Gemstone101]

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by HarmNone
Lisu published to the web a log that involved not only her, but someone else. She published that log without the permission of the other person involved, and has admitted she realized the log would embarrass that person.

Logs are posted here all the time with the intent to embarrass. Her log has no differing qualities than those of specific characters getting "owned", cleaned out, so on and so forth.

I do not see a problem with Lisu the character at all. Most of the disagreements with her role-play I have read do seem like the morally defunct jumping on the puritan bandwagon.

I do wholly agree with HarmNone's concern about Lisu's clientele. There is a huge amount of indiscretion on Lisu's end. Were we entirely sure every one of her customers were adults, or at the very least of legal consenting age, then most of the disagreements with her choice in role-play would be simply classified as personal issues. Gemstone however is not an adult only atmosphere.

To translate into an RL setting, drugs and dealers wouldn't be an issue if every person that purchased such substances were without children or children themselves. We wouldn't care much about substance abuse if only the abuser was the only person affected.

So you want to play a prostitute? Fine, but you're playing a prostitute that may be a cyber child molester and that is my biggest concern. Perhaps not everyone participating in this thread holds that concern, or even cares about it. Hell, I'm willing to bet most just want to take shots at something they don't agree with.

I don't care how much Lisu the character makes in a day, week, or month. I don't care that Lisu the character is a prostitute or who seeks her services. Everyone has a boat to float and a pickle to tickle and if they are busted out in a log because they were a jackass, that is fine. Most likely they were a jackass pre-log and everyone knew it. If not, the log just gives a heads up.

Those of under the age of consent though... What, if any precautions are you taking Lisu? Have you thought this out before? Has it crossed your mind? Did you even care?

You can't judge age by writing style if that's the argument you're going to use. My writing style really hasn't changed in 15 years. There are plenty of teens in the game that could easily pass themselves off as "mature" adults. So exactly how are you ensuring that every one of your clients is an adult?

If you can't answer any of these questions, if you've never taken the time to consider the above, then you are no better than a crack dealer on a play ground. Actually you are worse; you're a sexual predator on a playground.

Your role-play doesn't have to be defended. The character Lisu doesn't have to be defended. The player of Lisu and her screening methods have to be defended by you, the player of Lisu.

If you can't, you belong in a prison. Not for being an in game prostitute, but for being a child molester.

[HarmNone]

Very well said, Tsa'ah.

As for the publishing of the log, my point is that by publishing it, Lisu opened herself up for criticism. Anyone who posts a log does so. I have seen logs posted here, the intent of which was to malign one of the subjects, and watched answering posters quickly turn the tables on the original poster, usually rightfully so. If one decides to post a log, one must be prepared for the fallout that posting may bring about. One might find that rather than embarrassing the target, one ends up being the goat.

Lisu's purpose in publishing the log, according to her, was to gain publicity for her services, and to embarrass her recalcitrant client. Perhaps her purpose has been realized. Perhaps not.

HarmNone

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by HarmNone
As for the publishing of the log, my point is that by publishing it, Lisu opened herself up for criticism.

Gotcha. I misinterpreted.

[Back]

If you can't answer any of these questions, if you've never taken the time to consider the above, then you are no better than a crack dealer on a play ground. Actually you are worse; you're a sexual predator on a playground.

I doubt anyone has accused Anne Rice of this and I'm certain she has some underage readers. Which brings me again to the sex/violence issue....


There is a big difference when it comes to games. Killing someone in a game is something that every little kid does. You know playing cops and robbers and you shoot eachother or something like that. It's not violent really, it's part of the game. Not to mention when a mother signs their 12 year old up to play Gemstone, they KNOW that the game involves you killing a critter. A parent doesn't know that their kid could end up having sex with a slut......

Sure, I played those games. I also played doctor.

[Tsa`ah]

Some of these posts about prostitution really astound me.

I'll not delve into the history of it, but how can anyone condemn the profession or the people that participate in it. Come on now.

We have lawyers that get the most despicable kind of person out of any legal responsibilities and consequences.

We have CEOs that walk free with millions, if not billions, of dollars that hard working individuals invested for retirement or their children's education.

We have athletes that lack any moral fiber that are paid boatloads of money to play games.

We have politicians who have the sole purpose of furthering their own financial status by any means they can and screw the people they are supposed to serve.

We could sit here for months, if not years and rattle off names of such scumbags, and you won't find one prostitute on the list.

A prostitute is at the very least honest.

If we can justify spending 10s of thousands of dollars on an automobile that has only the function of getting one or more people from point A to point B, why can't we justify spending 20 - 2,000 dollars on fulfilling a fantasy or relieving some sexual tension?

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Backlash
I doubt anyone has accused Anne Rice of this and I'm certain she has some underage readers.

There is a huge difference between a minor reading an Anne Rice novel and a minor cybering with Anne Rice.

I think it's a safe bet that every male on this forum had some sort of pornography stuffed between his mattress and box springs as a teen. At the very least thought it wouldn't look suspicious carrying the JC Penny spring catalog into the bathroom. Sure, mom had no idea that we were all severely punishing our monkeys to that little bit of areola we could see through the lace bras.

Mom and Dad both would have blistered our asses and chained us up in the attic if they knew we were taking our lunch money to the crack whore on the corner of Main and 5th. I'm pretty sure the crack whore would have been serving time as well.

If you can't see the difference, I don't know what else to tell you.

If Gemstone is going to allow children and teens under the age of consent to play, they need to step up to the plate on this and strongly prohibit this sort of thing.

I would much rather there be a certifiable age requirement and check system in place.

[Back]

Gemstone is a fantasy game, when I signed him up about 6 months ago, I knew he was going to be killing critters and possibly people (if he took after me.) I didn't know that I might have to explain to him that Lisu is a slut and she fucks people in a game.

Are you Tipper Gore? Good grief. Here we go again, kill someone, fine, fuck someone, bad? Death, life. Pain, pleasure. If I were your brother I'd be a little worried about what kind of values you were teaching my kid. Thats just me though... I played doctor at the tender age of 5 or 6 with my babysitter's daughter inspired by some comic books I found one day in my parents house. Good thing they weren't violent. At least I think so.

[imported_Kranar]

So Backlash, because you can kill critters in this game it's alright for 24 year olds to have sex with 12 year olds.

Whether or not you see the problem with that, the bottom line is that most people do, and many people are in jail for it.

[imported_Kranar]

<< We have CEOs that walk free with millions, if not billions, of dollars that hard working individuals invested for retirement or their children's education.

We have athletes that lack any moral fiber that are paid boatloads of money to play games.

We have politicians who have the sole purpose of furthering their own financial status by any means they can and screw the people they are supposed to serve. >>

Geez... when you put it that way, I think I'll go break into my next door neighbour's house.

Afterall, there are FAR worse people who exist than theives, therefore it's okay to be a theif. I mean think of all the dictators out there in the world, the murderers, the rapists, the last thing anyone needs to worry about is a simple theif.

[Adhara]

I'd like to hear Lisu's player on the age issue. I agree that this is the point we must focus on. The quality of the roleplay is just personal opinion. Whether her choice of roleplay is within guidelines is up to Simu. But the age, that I am interested in.

Also, as a canadian, I'd like to know what the federal and state laws say about underage cybersex. I don't know the whole lawyer lingo, just the jist of it, out of curiosity.

Edit: I mean I don't need the lawyer lingo

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Adhara]

[Kyle]

Oh, by the way Kranar, nice of you to edit your posts to change your arguements. It makes you so much more better than me.

[Scott]

<<<Are you Tipper Gore? Good grief. Here we go again, kill someone, fine, fuck someone, bad? Death, life. Pain, pleasure. If I were your brother I'd be a little worried about what kind of values you were teaching my kid. Thats just me though... I played doctor at the tender age of 5 or 6 with my babysitter's daughter inspired by some comic books I found one day in my parents house. Good thing they weren't violent. At least I think so.>>>

This has nothing to do with anything. When a parent signs his son/daughter up to play Gemstone, they KNOW there is going to be combat and violence. They however don't know that prostitution and being a whore is an acceptable thing. My nephew is just an example. I know he knows about sex, but it's not something that I would expect I would have to look at when I signed him up. This so called violence you are talking about, I don't see. I don't see the difference between killing a kobold and killing a deer. He's a hunter, does that make him a violent person?

I'm sorry if you can't see the difference between some little kid typing attack kobold and some little kid who's having cybersex with someone.

[Back]

So Backlash, because you can kill critters in this game it's alright for 24 year olds to have sex with 12 year olds.

Whether or not you see the problem with that, the bottom line is that most people do, and many people are in jail for it.

Huge assumption from such a scientific man. You are starting to sound like Edge. Working backwards from a dumbass conclusion.

I never said that. In fact, I've agreed that Lisu should check. I don't think adults should engage in sexual activity with children. Adults are the ones who have to teach them about it. Adults are the ones who have to act responsibly.

I think I will agree with HarmNone to agree to disagree on certain things. I may just be different from other people. I don't claim to be better or worse. Its just that my view on this is its all being blown out of preportion and that contemporary values on sex and death just seem backwards to me. ::shrug::

Another thing I want to mention is that calling Lisu a sexual predator is incorrect. She is the prey in this particular scenario, both willing, and unwilling.

Anyway, Tsa'ah, HarmNone, Gemstone 101... good discussions. You all made valid points and almost kept cool. ::grin:: None the less, thanks for the fun debate. And that dosen't mean I won't post again.

[Scott]

<<I never said that. In fact, I've agreed that Lisu should check.>>

How do you check how old someone is over the internet? People lie about their age all the time, and you can never be 100% certain that someone is the age they say they age......

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Kranar

Geez... when you put it that way, I think I'll go break into my next door neighbour's house.

Afterall, there are FAR worse people who exist than theives, therefore it's okay to be a theif. I mean think of all the dictators out there in the world, the murderers, the rapists, the last thing anyone needs to worry about is a simple theif.



Down boy down!!!!!

Kranar ... There are plenty of places that exist in this world were prostitution is legal, even in the states. Would you hold the same opinion if prostitution were legal in your region? Chances are yes, you would.

When you solicit the services of a prostitute, you know what you're getting ... most of the time. That's the honesty. They work harder, and take more risks than any of those mentioned in my previous post. The profession is not invalid. It's not immoral; it's not wrong.

We can certainly disagree with it. We can find it distasteful. We cannot dismiss it or condemn it because of personal, philosophical, moral, or theological beliefs.

Sex is as natural as rain. Leave it to humanity to make it a capitalistic venture. Just don't knock the people who meet that demand. Take your shots at the John all you want, the prostitute isn't twisting arms and robbing people blind. Folks willingly fork over the money.

Breaking into a house is illegal and unsolicited. Your neighbor doesn't want you to bust in his window and steal his JC Penny's catalogs. If he did, it wouldn't be an illegal and malicious act.

That's the difference. Prostitution isn't inherently malicious, and the John is the person creating the controversy (if the John is in a supposedly monogamous relationship).

[Betheny]

I wonder if Lisu asked the age of the people she sent the link to...

[Kyle]

Since when is it illegal to read obscene material, even underage?

[imported_Kranar]

<< Kranar ... There are plenty of places that exist in this world were prostitution is legal, even in the states. Would you hold the same opinion if prostitution were legal in your region >>

That's not in any way, shape, or form the arguement you made.

You said prostitution isn't such a bad thing to worry about because there are things far worse to worry about.

It is not a justification that because CEOs do worse things, Hitler did worse things, and athletes do some bad things, that it's okay to let other things fly by, because if that's the case, then I wouldn't mind breaking into my neighbour, and when I get caught I'll just tell him to relax because some dictator out there is doing something 100 times worse.

[imported_Kranar]

<< Working backwards from a dumbass conclusion. >>

Here's the conclusion.

<< And killing people is? Again, I'll restate that I think we have some pretty messed up values. Why violence is more acceptable than sex... I'll never understand. >>

Well here's my response:

It's FAR worse for an adult to have cybersex with someone underage than it is for someone underage to kill a critter. No our morals aren't backwards and if you can't understand that then I don't know what to tell you.

[Edited on 8-23-2003 by Kranar]

[imported_Kranar]

<< Since when is it illegal to read obscene material, even underage? >>

A damn long time. Punishable for 5 years imprisonment here in Canada if someone distributes any form of pornography to someone underage without taking every possible precaution. What is to be noted is that the law doesn't request all reasonable precautions, but all possible precautions, which is a much higher legal standard.

[Betheny]

I don't know the laws, but I always thought it was illegal for underage people to look at pornography.

Maybe that's just to buy it though.

[imported_Kranar]

<< I don't know the laws, but I always thought it was illegal for underage people to look at pornography. >>

It's not illegal for someone underage to look at most pornography, but it is illegal for someone to distribute it to them.

[imported_Kranar]

<< They work harder, and take more risks than any of those mentioned in my previous post. The profession is not invalid. >>

And I believe no prostitute is doing their job because of courage and risk. Courage is saying that your body is worth more than a couple hundred bucks and doing everything you possibly can to clean yourself up.

Prostitutes mostly do what they do out of desperation, not out of courage.

[Back]

<<I never said that. In fact, I've agreed that Lisu should check.>>

How do you check how old someone is over the internet? People lie about their age all the time, and you can never be 100% certain that someone is the age they say they age......

Ok Gemstone101, I've called you out on a lot of your points you have yet to respond to. You want to keep finding things in my posts to argue about. I've agreed that adults should not have sex, cyber or otherwise, with children.


I'm sorry if you can't see the difference between some little kid typing attack kobold and some little kid who's having cybersex with someone.

I see a huge difference. And in a previous post you mentioned killing other players. I'm sorry you're sorry, and I appreciate the pity and the mature posting compliment, but we just disagree on the issue of sex. And thats that.

[Back]

It's FAR worse for an adult to have cybersex with someone underage than it is for someone underage to kill a critter. No our morals aren't backwards and if you can't understand that then I don't know what to tell you.

This isn't about critters. Here's my dumbass conclusion. You think its ok for an Adult to virtually kill a child.

[Scott]

<<<Ok Gemstone101, I've called you out on a lot of your points you have yet to respond to.>>

If I missed anything, please put them again because I will answer anything, whether I am wrong or right.

<<I've agreed that adults should not have sex, cyber or otherwise, with children.>>

That's good. So since Lisu is unable to determine the age of people she's having cybersex with, she should not be having cybersex period since she is unable to be 100% sure whether the person is 11 years old or not. Thank you.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Kranar
That's not in any way, shape, or form the arguement you made.

You said prostitution isn't such a bad thing to worry about because there are things far worse to worry about.

It is not a justification that because CEOs do worse things, Hitler did worse things, and athletes do some bad things, that it's okay to let other things fly by, because if that's the case, then I wouldn't mind breaking into my neighbour, and when I get caught I'll just tell him to relax because some dictator out there is doing something 100 times worse.

That actually is the argument I was making. If you could not decode that, then perhaps I wasn’t clear. It was however my intent.

Laws concerning prostitution are, in my opinion, lame throwbacks from the puritan era. Just because there are laws proclaiming the act illegal, does not mean the law is justified. This is one group of people imposing their will upon another. There isn't, and can't be, any justification for it. Strangely, prohibition comes to mind.

That we have corporate heads pilfering the coffers and wrecking the economy unfettered, yet a college junior is lock up for attempting to make some money that her scholarship and class schedule prevent her from doing simply says volumes about our social structure.

The legal system has no place in our sex lives.

[Scott]

<<I don't know the laws, but I always thought it was illegal for underage people to look at pornography.>>

I believe, but don't quote me on this, that many US states prohibit people from allowing minors to read erotica (which if you didn't know, is stories about sex.)

[imported_Kranar]

<< You think its ok for an Adult to virtually kill a child. >>

That is correct, and like I said my morals and the morals of 99.9 percent of the population not backwards.

I don't ever ask someone I'm dueling "Hey are you underage, if you are I can't kill you?"

But I would expect a whore in GS to ask "Hey are you underage, if you are I can't screw you."

And of course, the person who is underage wouldn't be like:

"Uh... yeah."

Which leads us the fundamental problem with being a whore in Gemstone. Gemstone is a game targetted to children and families and adults alike, and as such being a prostitute is out of the genre for the game.

When Gemstone The Fallen comes out, be a whore in there, be a drug dealer in there, be an alien in there. Leave it out of Gemstone though.

[Back]

<<I've agreed that adults should not have sex, cyber or otherwise, with children.>>

That's good. So since Lisu is unable to determine the age of people she's having cybersex with, she should not be having cybersex period since she is unable to be 100% sure whether the person is 11 years old or not. Thank you.

By your own definition, anyone who has ever had cybersex on the internet is a sexual predator. I don't buy it. Again I will say, Lisu was the prey in this case, which is what we are talking about isn't it? Both willinging and unwillingly. About the posts, I'm too lazy to repost, so go read them.


<< You think its ok for an Adult to virtually kill a child. >>

That is correct, and like I said my morals and the morals of 99.9 percent of the population not backwards.

I don't ever ask someone I'm dueling "Hey are you underage, if you are I can't kill you?"

Dang Kranar, you sound like an American. Sure you aren't displaced?

[Scott]

<<By your own definition, anyone who has ever had cybersex on the internet is a sexual predator.>>

It's not my definition. Someone who is unable to determine the age of someone shouldn't be having cybersex with them. This is something that shouldn't be in gemstone especially.

<<Again I will say, Lisu was the prey in this case, which is what we are talking about isn't it?>>

It's not what I'm talking about. What I'm saying is Lisu's whoring shouldn't be announced over the amulet.

<<<About the posts, I'm too lazy to repost, so go read them.>>>

I'm sorry if I can't pick up every question you have. If I miss an important question, restate it because I'm more then willing to answer it.