Is doing this against the guild?

[GSLeloo]

Teeoncy hurls herself at Jastio and connects!
Teeoncy hammers Jastio to the ground. 22 hits! Teeoncy quickly jumps to her feet.

* Jastio drops dead at your feet!

The silvery luminescence fades from around Jastio.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around Jastio.
Jastio seems a bit less imposing.
The bright luminescence fades from around Jastio.
The glowing specks of energy surrounding Jastio suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.

Someone exclaims, "Murder by Teeoncy! Call the Guard Captain!"

Isn't that an abuse of your guild skills or am I wrong?

[Demonea]

You are not supposed to use guild skills against other PCs, but I think it's still a case-by-case basis.

[Axhinde]

I've personally never thought of tackling someone as abusing guild skills...and when one kills someone, especially with 22 health I'm pretty sure there was more then one person hitting him. Disarming then stealing their weapon would be abuse, but tackling someone in a fight? No. Especially now that is considered a maneuver.

[GSLeloo]

I was sitting there but all I noticed was Jastio try and attack someone else and then Teeoncy tackled him and killed him.

[Hulkein]

If Jastio didn't attack her then yes, technically it is an abuse.

[Parkbandit]

It is no more abuse than if Teeoncy was to garotte them to death.. or cast implosion.. or ambush them.

[Axhinde]

I have no idea why she did it, but if it wasn't her fight I can think of no reason to do it. Either way, to me it is not abuse. Hell, I tackle my sorcerer friends, just because. Sometimes it causes damage, sometimes not. Just that no one has ever said anything to me about it. :shrug:

if you kill someone in the pugilism ring, they recover all their hitpoints, all their wounds are healed, and most importantly, they sprout back to life. It would really make sense to have a "knocked-out" effect instead of instant death when using a guild skill and accidentally killing someone with it within the vicinity of the guild, or maybe right next to the training administrator, I dunno.

[DeV]

I was thinking along those same lines Axhinde. I've had friends/enimies use their guild skills on my characters before. Out of fun, and also to the death. I never considered it abuse, and neither did they I'd assume.

[GSLeloo]

I was just honestly curious because I'm not sure what the rules of the guild are.

[fallenSaint]

I figure if your looking at it from mechanics side of things its concidered abuse but as far as rping it goes I cant say Im going to attack a rogue and expect him not to use shadow mastery to hand it back to me.

[Parkbandit]

I think there was an IC rule that said something about 'don't abuse the skills you learn here or you make get kicked out'...

But the more squares pointed out the hypocracy of a sorcerer claiming guild abuse when they are free to cast whatever the hell spells they like.. the more the guild skills were grouped with any other offensive attack. Now they like more in the PvP area... like any attack.

[Latrinsorm]

"I solemnly vow to uphold and promote the Warrior Guild. I shall not use the skills I learn to harm or steal from others for my own amusement. I shall at all times maintain the Guild's positive image as a group of warriors, first in nobility, best in tactics, foremost in bravery."

There's the oath. Given more information, I can definitively say whether she is being un-Guildly.

[Axhinde]

Even from a mechanics standpoint I don't see the particular skill Tackle being abused in that way. It's a combat maneuver skill now, and using it against another PC in a fight is, along with critters, it's intention.

I think the real question here should be about the choice of her timing, or whether or not she had business doing it.


Originally posted by Lartinstrom"
I solemnly vow to uphold and promote the Warrior Guild. I shall not use the skills I learn to harm or steal from others for my own amusement. I shall at all times maintain the Guild's positive image as a group of warriors, first in nobility, best in tactics, foremost in bravery."

There's the oath. Given more information, I can definitively say whether she is being un-Guildly.

Breaking RP rules of a guild, in my eyes, is not abuse.




[Edited on 7-1-2004 by Axhinde]

[GSLeloo]

Sorcerer spells aren't guild skills. The illusions are guild skills.

And he didnt attack her, he attacked Nodyre (something like that) and she tackled him.

[fallenSaint]

Anyone actually seen people kicked from guild for abuse before?

Ive seen one in the Rogues guild and thats about it, just curious how often if really ever its enforced.

... Same with CoL Ive only seen one Dark Assassin in the years Ive played and I know Ive heard a lot of talk about CoL in the open.

[Jorddyn]

Originally posted by GSLeloo
Isn't that an abuse of your guild skills or am I wrong?

Use of guild skills is not abuse of guild skills.

Disarming someone then stealing his weapon = abuse.

Sweeping someone because she keeps smooching your uber-evil dark elf = use.

Common sense = oh so lacking in GS.

I hate that rogues and warriors get blasted with screams of abuse every time they use their skills. I'm sorry, but it is no different than using a CMAN or a spell. It is a skill. Improper or over-use can be abuse, yes, but use itself is not.

Slap my rogue or go out of your way to annoy her when she was around, and you can bet you'd wind up on your behind if she was able :) Never once did I get in trouble for having her do so.

If someone, anyone, can find someone in a position of authority stating differently in the last 2-3 years, I'd love to see it.

Jorddyn

[Axhinde]

Originally posted by GSLeloo
Sorcerer spells aren't guild skills. The illusions are guild skills.

And he didnt attack her, he attacked Nodyre (something like that) and she tackled him.

So the question of it being abuse isn't what's really being asked. I think she question should be "Why the fuck was Teeoncy tackling?" when it, from what you've said (that's the only info we have, no log), was not her fight.

[Parkbandit]

I :heart: Jorddyn

Well said and I completely agree.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Axhinde
Breaking RP rules of a guild, in my eyes, is not abuse.Mine either. However, the thread is titled "Is doing this against the guild?" and that is the question I am endeavoring to answer.

That being said, the "because I can" argument seems to have been accepted by some of the GS populace, which saddens me and probably helps lead to situations like this (higher trained people butting in with debilitating attacks).

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by GSLeloo
Sorcerer spells aren't guild skills. The illusions are guild skills.



You missed my point. I was merely comparing guild skills to any offensive spell.

If that's guild abuse, then allow me to point to hundreds of logs of mine showing sorcerer / wizard / cleric / empath / etc.. spell abuse.

[Axhinde]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Axhinde
Breaking RP rules of a guild, in my eyes, is not abuse.Mine either. However, the thread is titled "Is doing this against the guild?" and that is the question I am endeavoring to answer.

That being said, the "because I can" argument seems to have been accepted by some of the GS populace, which saddens me and probably helps lead to situations like this (higher trained people butting in with debilitating attacks).

Ahh, ok. I thought you were responding in question to...


Is this abuse of guild skills or am I wrong?

which is what I was answering.

You're right about it being against the guild. And the "because I can" remark, unfortunately, applies to most people who use it due to higher trains. I've only used it against friends who are slighty higher or slightly lower, in a "I can because I'm a warrior and you aren't" kinda way. Most people in GS I hunt with are pures, so they get pissed knowing they no longer have complete dominance of GS anymore. I like to tease em. :D

[Drektor]

I've only seen one person kicked outta the rogue guild. It was done because his character took part in mass murder in which he used his guild skills. This was back in gs3, his expulsion was removed durin the gs4 conversion.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Axhinde
I've only used it against friends who are slighty higher or slightly lower, in a "I can because I'm a warrior and you aren't" kinda way. Most people in GS I hunt with are pures, so they get pissed knowing they no longer have complete dominance of GS anymore. I like to tease em. :D Me too, nothing like a little sbash and mblow to knock a sorc down a few pegs, heh. Being a warrior rulz.

edit: Unless you suck at being a warrior (T), then plz reroll as a sorc.

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by Latrinsorm]

[Axhinde]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Axhinde
I've only used it against friends who are slighty higher or slightly lower, in a "I can because I'm a warrior and you aren't" kinda way. Most people in GS I hunt with are pures, so they get pissed knowing they no longer have complete dominance of GS anymore. I like to tease em. :D Me too, nothing like a little sbash and mblow to knock a sorc down a few pegs, heh. Being a warrior rulz.

edit: Unless you suck at being a warrior (T), then plz reroll as a sorc.

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by Latrinsorm]

:lol:

Being a warrior does rule, as long as we maintain our, as Kadumi would say, "Badassness". If we start rocking any harder they'll nerf us. (Read: Redux)

[Edaarin]

For what it's worth, it takes more than a single isolated incident of abuse to be kicked out of the Guild. I've seen 3 rogues get the boot, and I hadn't heard of any being reinstated since (then again I haven't seen two of them in about two years).

To clarify, abuse doesn't entail using any guild skill against another PC. It would be like disarming someone and stealing their weapon, or stacking warcries so they couldn't move for like 3 minutes, or sweeping/tackling then pulling back up. First you get a warning for bad behavior, then you get kicked out.

It's also really at the discretion of whichever GM witnesses whatever may be called abuse. I've seen Taelrand post on the official boards that he'll kick out any rogue that starts harassing other rogues in public picking spots to get more boxes for lock mastery. I've also seen idiots like Warclaidhm obscenely abuse warcry with no repercussions.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Since tackle can have nothing to do with the guild at all, nope.


Originally posted by GSLeloo
Teeoncy hurls herself at Jastio and connects!
Teeoncy hammers Jastio to the ground. 22 hits! Teeoncy quickly jumps to her feet.

* Jastio drops dead at your feet!

The silvery luminescence fades from around Jastio.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around Jastio.
Jastio seems a bit less imposing.
The bright luminescence fades from around Jastio.
The glowing specks of energy surrounding Jastio suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.

Someone exclaims, "Murder by Teeoncy! Call the Guard Captain!"

Isn't that an abuse of your guild skills or am I wrong?

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Oh, and to add.

If it wasn't Teooncy this thread wouldn't exist. You people need to build a damn bridge and get over it.

Abuse of skills would be things like feinting 30 times to give someone RT, or tackling 30 times to give someone RT. Thats abuse. Mechanics abuse.

[AnticorRifling]

Originally posted by Edaarin

I've seen Taelrand post on the official boards that he'll kick out any rogue that starts harassing other rogues in public picking spots to get more boxes for lock mastery.

He should kick Tsin out for those tactics when it came to promotes and crap. All he wanted was the EXP because he didn't want/or couldn't hunt to cap.

[GSLeloo]

I chose Teeoncy simply for the fact that I sat there and saw her keep tackling and tackling and tackling people. This time she killed someone. So I was wondering if it was wrong or not. Sometimes we aren't blindly attacking someone, sometimes there is an actual reason.

Even I learned that after I had blindly protected Warclaidhm.

[Axhinde]

Originally posted by GSLeloo
I chose Teeoncy simply for the fact that I sat there and saw her keep tackling and tackling and tackling people. This time she killed someone. So I was wondering if it was wrong or not. Sometimes we aren't blindly attacking someone, sometimes there is an actual reason.

Even I learned that after I had blindly protected Warclaidhm.

No one is accusing you of doing anything like that. But no one knows what was happening beyond what you showed us.

[GSLeloo]

Neither do I. I was resting (the other times she was tackling people were yesterday) and suddenly I see her tackle Jastio and kill him. I scrolled up and saw Jastio was in hiding and tried to ambush Nodyre but that was all else I saw. It simply made me curious because people talk about guild abuse and I wasn't really sure what you had to do that was considered it. I was under the impression that using a guild skill to harm another player was abuse.

[Axhinde]

I personally have never seen anyone even be warned for guild abuse. So I can only assume that a simple tackle is not abuse.

[Jonty]

Originally posted by Axhinde
I personally have never seen anyone even be warned for guild abuse. So I can only assume that a simple tackle is not abuse.

Heh, depends if the GM is retarded or not.... My friend Xinsister once got pulled, though not warned, for TRYING disarm someone on the boulder.... Now, this person was WAY over his training, so it would have never worked anway, and the person LET him do it.... The GM was just retarded and bored I guess.

[Kataleena]

I will post one thing on this topic... Jastio attacked Nodyre right after Teeoncy and Nodyre got back from a hunt. Teeoncy immediatly tackled him to make sure he did not hide right away and attack Nodyre again.

Teeoncy will go to any limits to protect her friends. She did not expect him to die so fast however. But Everyone has been killing him today. Heck, five minutes ago Eiderfleur killed him.

Teeoncy paid her 11k which is all Jastio is worth and went on her way. She would do it agian without a thought to protect Nodyre or any other friend.

Lol, not that Nodyre needed protecting. But who knows he could have been asleep or Jastio could have hid before he could do anything.. ehh.


:socool:

[Bobmuhthol]

Teeoncy needs to stfu and stop using her characters in OOC PvP combat.


Oh, and you're still a dumb broad for being dumb. And also lying. Dumbly.

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by Bobmuhthol]

Oh, and you got served.

(18:58:43) Rachel Pwnz: Double pwn!!
(18:58:52) WTFL0LSTFU: lol
(18:59:07) WTFL0LSTFU: referring to Teeoncy?
(18:59:12) Rachel Pwnz: Yes.
(18:59:16) WTFL0LSTFU: Yes.

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by Bobmuhthol]

[Artha]

So basically what you're saying is that Teeoncy is a dumb bitch with power issues?

[Galleazzo]

Originally posted by Parkbandit
It is no more abuse than if Teeoncy was to garotte them to death.. or cast implosion.. or ambush them. Yeah, I never did figure this. WHY aren't you supposed to use guild skills against PCs and who says so? Because they're too powerful? Then weaken them.

Seems to me that what people call "abuse" really is "using their abilities in a way you don't like."

[GSLeloo]

Teeoncy, I myself do not like Jastio. The question had nothing to do with that, it was asking about guild abuse and what people consider it. Your action was an example and nothing more.

[theotherjohn]

Originally posted by GSLeloo

Isn't that an abuse of your guild skills or am I wrong?

No because tackle is on the CML.

[SpunGirl]

Stepping into a conflict that has not harmed you is against policy, KataTeeoBitch. Don't like it? Quit GemStone. Especially quit coming here. Yay.

-K

[Artha]

Seems to me that what people call "abuse" really is "using their abilities in a way you don't like."

Abuse is misusing them. For example, using sweep/tackle/warcries/feint to stack up RT so the person can't move for minutes on end, or disarming purposely to steal the weapon.

[Chadj]

Originally posted by fallenSaint
Anyone actually seen people kicked from guild for abuse before?

Ive seen one in the Rogues guild and thats about it, just curious how often if really ever its enforced.

... Same with CoL Ive only seen one Dark Assassin in the years Ive played and I know Ive heard a lot of talk about CoL in the open.

The Dark Assassin has killed Chadj twice.. although, both times he was still in Voln.

[Chadj]

Originally posted by AnticorRifling

Originally posted by Edaarin

I've seen Taelrand post on the official boards that he'll kick out any rogue that starts harassing other rogues in public picking spots to get more boxes for lock mastery.

He should kick Tsin out for those tactics when it came to promotes and crap. All he wanted was the EXP because he didn't want/or couldn't hunt to cap.

Doesn't he have some shit like heavily damage weighted plate? If so, and he still couldn't hunt to cap, he should be shot.

[Chadj]

Originally posted by GSLeloo
I chose Teeoncy simply for the fact that I sat there and saw her keep tackling and tackling and tackling people. This time she killed someone. So I was wondering if it was wrong or not. Sometimes we aren't blindly attacking someone, sometimes there is an actual reason.

Even I learned that after I had blindly protected Warclaidhm.

Also, you may have chosen Teeoncy, because she does it often, and chances are, if you see one person tackling another for no reason.. it's Teeoncy?

[Chadj]

As far as tackling abuse in general.. I do not find any guild skills abuse if only used once.. but when it comes to older warriors tackling someone, pulling them up, tackling, (and repeat), just to give em 100 RT and piss em off.. That shit annoys me to no end (whether im on the recieving end or not), and no one can deny that's abuse. I've seen it done by several people. (Rorac, Ariond, Teeoncy to name a few)

[Edited on 7-2-2004 by Chadj]

[Scott]

Originally posted by Chadj

Originally posted by AnticorRifling

Originally posted by Edaarin

I've seen Taelrand post on the official boards that he'll kick out any rogue that starts harassing other rogues in public picking spots to get more boxes for lock mastery.

He should kick Tsin out for those tactics when it came to promotes and crap. All he wanted was the EXP because he didn't want/or couldn't hunt to cap.

Doesn't he have some shit like heavily damage weighted plate? If so, and he still couldn't hunt to cap, he should be shot.

It was pretty much impossible to hunt to the cap in GS3, because War Griffins were 150, and the cap was 160. So it's pretty much impossible. Not to mention Tsin was pretty much not allowed near OTF because someone died... and the critter stole the guys 10x (I think) Katana. Tsin found it, and ran to the landing and sold it. So most people wouldn't get him if he died, (which even capped players would in GS3 OTF) and some would have killed him.... That's changed though since he MA's like 6 characters up there and most people don't care anymore.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Galleazzo
Yeah, I never did figure this. WHY aren't you supposed to use guild skills against PCs and who says so?Depends on the situation. If a warrior is using (let's say) tackle for the hell of it and harms someone, then he has clearly broken his oath as a member of the warrior guild. In a duel of some kind, I'd wager all guild skills can be used freely.