Helium

[Drunken Durfin]

Why isn't this all over the news?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/why-the-world-is-running-out-of-helium-2059357.html


Scientists have warned that the world's most commonly used inert gas is being depleted at an astonishing rate because of a law passed in the United States in 1996 which has effectively made helium too cheap to recycle.

The law stipulates that the US National Helium Reserve, which is kept in a disused underground gas field near Amarillo, Texas – by far the biggest store of helium in the world – must all be sold off by 2015, irrespective of the market price.

The experts warn that the world could run out of helium within 25 to 30 years, potentially spelling disaster for hospitals, whose MRI scanners are cooled by the gas in liquid form, and anti-terrorist authorities who rely on helium for their radiation monitors, as well as the millions of children who love to watch their helium-filled balloons float into the sky.

[Tisket]

Not being able to talk like Donald Duck...too horrible to contemplate.

[Drunken Durfin]

Yeah, I know it is not like suddenly running out of coal, but it should be a wake-up call. Natural resources DO run out.

[diethx]

Not being able to talk like Donald Duck...too horrible to contemplate.

I lol'd so fucking hard.

[g++]

Cant we just fly to the sun and get some more? Get fry to do it.

[Delias]

Yeah, I know it is not like suddenly running out of coal, but it should be a wake-up call. Natural resources DO run out.

I have been telling people about this for months. If I say "these balloons are worth hundreds of dollars!" people laugh, but then I explain and shit gets serious.

And then they carry on with their day, not caring. Just like climate change.

[Parkbandit]

Weird.. the US government making a law to do something that has unintended consequences?

Never, ever saw that coming......

[Kitsun]

So a company could make a buttreaming fortune by buying up all the helium and storing it for a few years until the supply source is depleted?

On a side note, humans tend to be extremely resourceful at finding new solutions to problems when something becomes scarce. Not saying that losing a valuable, easy to handle, known substance isn't an issue. It will probably cause some fundamental holyshit explosions but we'll work a way through it.

[g++]

Somehow I feel like it would not be too hard to chemically manufacture helium. I dont know this for a fact but my guess would be the reason its not done now is because it comes out of the ground for free as a byproduct of oil drilling.

[Drunken Durfin]

Somehow I feel like it would not be too hard to chemically manufacture helium. I dont know this for a fact but my guess would be the reason its not done now is because it comes out of the ground for free as a byproduct of oil drilling.

Incorrect.

"Helium is made either by the nuclear fusion process of the Sun, or by the slow and steady radioactive decay of terrestrial rock, which accounts for all of the Earth's store of the gas. There is no way of manufacturing it artificially..."

[g++]

Well there you go. Set off a few thermonuclear weapons and we can have a happy birthday.

[Tisket]

Incorrect.

"Helium is made either by the nuclear fusion process of the Sun, or by the slow and steady radioactive decay of terrestrial rock, which accounts for all of the Earth's store of the gas. There is no way of manufacturing it artificially..."

Wikipedia says: "For large-scale use, helium is extracted by fractional distillation from natural gas, which contains up to 7% helium."

Granted, I just skimmed the article and in a contest of wits between you and Wikipedia, I'd usually bet on you as the winning horse.

[Bhaalizmo]

Pretty sure we could suck up a bunch of Helium from Jupiter or Neptune right? Just go to home depot and buy up a bunch of garden hoses and some duct tape.

[Drunken Durfin]

Wikipedia says: "For large-scale use, helium is extracted by fractional distillation from natural gas, which contains up to 7% helium."

Granted, I just skimmed the article and in a contest of wits between you and Wikipedia, I'd usually bet on you as the winning horse.

We are both right, actually. You can distill helium from natural gas, but you cannot manufacture helium.

[g++]

They do manufacture helium 3 because its profitable to do so. To say its flat out impossible is meh. I would believe its never been done, but I would also believe no one has tried very hard because the shit comes free with natural gas. From the start Ive proclaimed my ignorance on the subject Im just saying if helium was 10,000 dollars a cubic inch I wouldn't be shocked if someone figured it out.

[Androidpk]

The US alone has an abundance of natural gas, I don't see helium going away anytime in the near future.

[Liagala]

Im just saying if helium was 10,000 dollars a cubic inch I wouldn't be shocked if someone figured it out.
^^ Never underestimate the lengths people will go to to figure something out when enough money is on the line.

[Drunken Durfin]

Conspiracy Theory 1:

This was Al Gore's back-up plan should his carbon trading scheme fall through. He has secretly bought up all of the helium reserves and this is how he plans to dominate the world.

Conspiracy Theory 2:

The Lizard Aliens that have infiltrated our government fear helium because it is the equivalent to cyanide gas to them. They have been working to rid the Earth of helium before they expose themselves and move to the next stage of global takeover and enslavement of the human race.

[Drew]

This has been on the radar for over a decade but... no one is doing anything about it. One would think selling it at a market rate would give the US gov't some more income but we're pretty desperate to get rid of these stores of valuable materials because long term foresight doesn't win any 2 year election cycles.

[Latrinsorm]

Inflate, baby, inflate!

[Showal]

They do manufacture helium 3 because its profitable to do so. To say its flat out impossible is meh. I would believe its never been done, but I would also believe no one has tried very hard because the shit comes free with natural gas. From the start Ive proclaimed my ignorance on the subject Im just saying if helium was 10,000 dollars a cubic inch I wouldn't be shocked if someone figured it out.

Helium 3 is an isotope. Helium, as we know it, is an element. For $10,000 a cubic inch, physicists won't try to manufacture elements because they know they can't. When they start being able to manufacture elements, well ... they won't be manufacturing elements in our lifetime, if ever.

[Tgo01]

Maybe I missed it but why is the US in such a hurry to get rid of its helium?

[Stanley Burrell]

Maybe I missed it but why is the US in such a hurry to get rid of its helium?

It's the entire planet. It makes all that He3 on the moon primed for a business boom once we unveil the cloning facilities.

[Drunken Durfin]

Maybe I missed it but why is the US in such a hurry to get rid of its helium?

See my earlier post on the conspiracy theories. I'm leaning towards option two.

[WRoss]

You should read up on how helium is made. Are we overusing it? Likely, but we aren't ever going to run out.

http://www.chemicool.com/elements/helium.html

[Tisket]

So that's how the planets stay up. That's a relief. I've always been worried that the wire might break on one. Or the pulleys might get rusty or something.

[Drunken Durfin]

You should read up on how helium is made. Are we overusing it? Likely, but we aren't ever going to run out.

http://www.chemicool.com/elements/helium.html

You talking about this part?


Current world production of helium is over 30 000 metric tons a year. (Helium has been accumulating for many millions of years in a few natural gas fields, therefore we can currently extract more each year than is being created by uranium and thorium decay.)

[Ceyrin]

or by the slow and steady radioactive decay of terrestrial rock

Step 1: Irradiate some rocks and bury them in your back yard.

Step 2: Wait

Step3: Helium farm in 100 years?

Step 4: ???????????

[Tisket]

I do that sometimes: think of something I believe is funny to say in a thread after it is already dead.

I usually ignore the impulse to post it though.

[Ceyrin]

I do that sometimes: think of something I believe is funny to say in a thread after it is already dead.

I usually ignore the impulse to post it though.

YOU FUCKING LIAR!

Also... I don't consider 5 days dead.

[Showal]

YOU FUCKING LIAR!

Also... I don't consider 5 days dead.

You did think you can make something radioactive by irradiating it though.

[Ceyrin]

You did think you can make something radioactive by irradiating it though.

You can't?!

That doesn't grok at all.

[g++]

Helium 3 is an isotope. Helium, as we know it, is an element. For $10,000 a cubic inch, physicists won't try to manufacture elements because they know they can't. When they start being able to manufacture elements, well ... they won't be manufacturing elements in our lifetime, if ever.


Interesting. Someone should alert CERN to the futility of their efforts. I'm sure your right though, its impossible to find a new source of something. Gotta go my whale oil lamp is low.

[Tisket]

Grok.

Bumping a dead thread: -1 points
Heinlein reference: +10

You came out ahead.

[Showal]

Interesting. Someone should alert CERN to the futility of their efforts. I'm sure your right though, its impossible to find a new source of something. Gotta go my whale oil lamp is low.

Finding a new source of something is vastly different from manufacturing elements. Copper mine in my back yard runs out, I go elsewhere and locate another source of copper, I do not sit in my basement and try to create copper like some sort of idiot.

Colliding things together to study particle physics may at some point lend to a theory where we better understand matter (and all the new infinitely small forms that we're seeing in the LHC) and elements, but the point is not to create elements, and it's certainly not to "manufacture" helium.

[g++]

I'm aware. The fact remains elements are made on a very low scale even today. When I said manufacture helium I obviously was not implying with a fucking wand. People for hundreds of years thought the only way to make a usable lamp was with whale oil until someone figured out how to make kerosine. The point of my post was not to imply I have the magic ability to conjure things it was just to give human ingenuity its due.

[Showal]

I'm aware. The fact remains elements are made on a very low scale even today. When I said manufacture helium I obviously was not implying with a fucking wand. People for hundreds of years thought the only way to make a usable lamp was with whale oil until someone figured out how to make kerosine. The point of my post was not to imply I have the magic ability to conjure things it was just to give human ingenuity its due.

What elements are made by humans today? That's a serious question. If humans are creating elements, in even small quantities, I'm very curious about it. I understand that some elements have been transmuted into other elements, but in very minute quantities, in processes that are not economically viable for any sort of mass production. But we don't just throw quarks and shit at each other and say "I LOVE GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLD".

[Showal]

And we very well could be thinking in different terms. I think of manufacturing, I think of taking a few things and creating an end product. If what you're thinking of is refining, in the way that gold can be extracted from lead ore, then you're right. We can probably think of some new way to extract helium from another source.

[g++]

Basically, I obviously should have chosen my words more carefully but I feel like I am in a straw man argument at this point. I never meant to imply helium would be conjured from scratch. I said chemically manufacture...I assume when people make helium from natural gas they call it "chemical manufacturing" but basically I wanted to say "We will probably be able to solve this problem if it is profitable" and now I am arguing "I know magic". lol

[Ceyrin]

Grok.

Bumping a dead thread: -1 points
Heinlein reference: +10

You came out ahead.

How many more points until you leave me alone!?

[Rolis]

I do not know if manufactured is correct term but in the nuclear plants that produce energy by fission uranium atoms are smashed by neutron. These collisions fracture the uraniumand the results are an array of different elements due to the subatomic fracturing of the uranium. I believe that trace elements of uranium plus and minus 8 or 16 can be found in the reactor vessel. I can't remember id have to look it up. Meaning from just uranium and fission 16 or 32 other elements result as a by product. The resulting elements are predictable for the quantity per reaction as well.

Also, fusion -- the process that takes place in stars basically created all elements up to iron. In the earlier stages of a stars life the fuel is hydro and much helium is created as a by product. During later stages of the stars life the fuel becomes helium.

[Tisket]

How many more points until you leave me alone!?

I have a short attention span. What points are you talking about?

[Tisket]

thefarmer sent me very disturbing photos via PM of various "points". It made my morning a happier place.