Endgame CMANs

[Valyss]

Here's where I'm sitting at Level 88:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Specialization I wspec1 5
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Combat Toughness toughness 3
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 3
Cunning Defense cdefense 5

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 7

I'll accrue 22 more cman points before cap. Where do people suggest spending the remaining 29 points? I've heard that 2-3 ranks in charge helps in Nelemar. To the same end, would training in sweep, bullrush, shield bash, etc keep me off my butt in warcamps? What's the prevailing wisdom here?

[Jeril]

Jeril, your Combat Maneuver training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 5
Shield Bash sbash 1
Twin Hammerfists twinhamm 1
Mighty Blow mblow 1
Sunder Shield sunder 4
Hamstring hamstring 2
Charge charge 2
Subdual Strike sstrike 2
Specialization I wspec1 5
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Bull Rush bullrush 2
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 1
Cunning Defense cdefense 5

That uses all 202 of my cman points. I've got the one rank of twin hammerfists more to help out younger characters then anything. As far as defending against cmans being used on you, I like having 5 ranks cdef(I see you have that) then 2 ranks of the maneuver. In offensive something has got to roll a 71 to get a 101 endroll with the maneuver used. Surprised you don't have combat focus, that extra 10 TD is pretty nice.

[Ardwen]

Shield Bash sbash 5
Precision precision 2
Specialization I wspec1 5
Specialization II wspec2 5
Coup de Grace coupdegrace 3
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Surge of Strength surge 2
Parry Mastery pmastery 2
Block Mastery bmastery 2
Cunning Defense cdefense 3


with 10 unspent points when I hit 100

[RSR]

Combat Focus is an absolute must in my opinion. TD is and always will be the bane of a warrior, getting an extra 10 TD (passive now, doesn't need to be activated) that you can stack with any other TD boosters is a life-saver.

-Richard.

[Ardwen]

see I just dont think 10 makes any real difference its not like anything is hitting me by anything close to 10

[Roblar]

I've heard that 2-3 ranks in charge helps in Nelemar. To the same end, would training in sweep, bullrush, shield bash, etc keep me off my butt in warcamps?

I had 1 rank of charge in Nelemar and it helped, 2 is probably fine. Being a warrior, you can't learn sweep. Bullrush and shield bash will help in warcamps but with 2 ranks of mobility not worth it for bullrush and shield bash will also help against bandits but shield use training also helps with that.

As you don't have block mastery I assume you use two handers (you'd probably have charge already for offensive if a polearm user).

Mine:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 1
Quickstrike qstrike 5
Bearhug bearhug 1
Twin Hammerfists twinhamm 1
Headbutt headbutt 1
Haymaker haymaker 1
Specialization I wspec1 5
Coup de Grace coupdegrace 3
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 1
Combat Toughness toughness 1
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 3
Block Mastery bmastery 3

Most are 1 rankers are just for RP fun and/or to use my brawling training a little more. I'm considering dropping the 5th rank of surge since my giftbox enhancives push me over anyway but I do like having max strength "naturally".

I'd use the savings for shield bash most likely (offensive/defensively). Also, give us cman point review - I want stuff!

[RSR]

see I just dont think 10 makes any real difference its not like anything is hitting me by anything close to 10

You're neglecting that a lot of spells can insta-kill you with a 101 end roll. That extra TD would have made the cast miss you.

-Richard.

[Ardwen]

My point is, I am generally warded by well beyond 10 when and if I get warded, I couldnt tell you the last time something other then a player screwing around hit me with a 101 to 110 outcome, or anything particularly close to it.

[Ibidmb]

Yea, if I get warded I get hit hard.. Truehand is the shit for casting critters.. Make sure I swing first..

[Valyss]

So the consensus is that there is a lack of consensus :)

I'm not sure I can justify spending all of my remaining points on Cfocus. I agree that TD is super important, but I don't think I could spend most of my remaining points for +8TD (I'd only be able to get 4 ranks).

So how I could see the remaining points breaking down:

Option A:
4 x Combat Focus
2 x Charge
(3 points left over)

Option B:
2 x Charge (6)
2 x Bullrush (6)
2 x Subdual Strike (5)
2 x Shield Bash (6)
2 x Shield Charge / Trip (6)

Option C:

Pick up something situationally useful, such as a few ranks in coup, or 5 ranks of headbutt



Thoughts?

[Valyss]

And for context, I'm a half elf swinging a 7x perfect maul. My usual strategy is the feint/open ambush. Any shield related stuff would be for purely maneuver defense

[Sam]

burghal gnome


Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Movement cmovement 2
Combat Focus focus 3
Specialization I wspec1 5
Side by Side sidebyside 5
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Combat Toughness toughness 3
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 3
Cunning Defense cdefense 1


Been thinking about dropping down to 3 ranks of wspec, and maybe drop to 3 or 4 surge, and picking up some coup de grace for a pre-berserk strike. I haven't thought much about cmans since capping.

[Androidpk]

My point is, I am generally warded by well beyond 10 when and if I get warded, I couldnt tell you the last time something other then a player screwing around hit me with a 101 to 110 outcome, or anything particularly close to it.

True, but a free passive +10 TD is still pretty spiffy.

Valyss, you level too damn fast!

[Archigeek]

Kerl, your Combat Maneuver training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 2
Shield Bash sbash 5
Mighty Blow mblow 1
Sunder Shield sunder 5
Specialization I wspec1 5
Coup de Grace coupdegrace 4
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Combat Toughness toughness 1
Surge of Strength surge 1
Parry Mastery pmastery 2
Block Mastery bmastery 3
Cunning Defense cdefense 2

I think focus is worth a small investment, so I take the first 3 points. After that I just don't quite think it's worth the price. Instead, I get coup! Which is awesomely fun. The other thing I only take the first rank in is surge. Under normal circumstances, I use enhancives to max out strength. This frees up a ton of points to spend on other things, like coup!

I still take the first rank because you get the most for the first rank of any ranks in surge, and it's so cheap, and sometimes you want it in emergencies.

[Valyss]

How about?

2 x Charge (6)
3 x Combat Focus (12)
2 x Bullrush (6)
2 x Subdual Strike (5)
(0 points left over)

Couple questions:

* How much coup do you need to be effective? Do the different ranks have different return, or just the ease of getting it off?
* Is charge -really- worth it for Nelemar?
* How many cman points can you move around quickly each 30 day period? (if its <29, I might just try some of these builds out)

[Archigeek]

Coup is one of the few cmans where wspec and bonding really makes a significant difference... especially if you use two weapons. Regardless of one hand or two though, you want to do it with your bonded weapon for the bonus to success. This is especially true with coup because the higher the end roll the bigger the AS bonus for you and your group.

So, get as many ranks as you can fit.

[Loyrl]

mine at 100


Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 4
Charge charge 2
Specialization I wspec1 5
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Combat Toughness toughness 3
Bull Rush bullrush 2
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 3
Cunning Defense cdefense 4

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 3

[Valyss]

mine at 100


Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Focus focus 4
Charge charge 2
Specialization I wspec1 5
Weapon Bonding bonding 5
Combat Mobility mobility 2
Combat Toughness toughness 3
Bull Rush bullrush 2
Surge of Strength surge 5
Parry Mastery pmastery 3
Cunning Defense cdefense 4

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 3

i like it.