Society Debate - GoS vs CoL

[Gizmo]

Ok, so currently I am a master of CoL, however i have been tossing back and forth the idea of instead going GoS for numerous reasons.

The character in question who would convert is a Half Krolvin. Half Krolvins have excellent CON bonus and stamina regen, which is never a bad thing when it comes down to GoS. But, I'm still on the fence and could use some help from outside people, who are both CoL and currently GoS (Murk, Mored, Rolfard, I'm looking at you guys!)

Below, I outlined the PROs and CONs of each society, in my own eyes and for me it's still hard to figure out just wish I should stick with.

GoS PROs:

Hunting Grounds anywhere, based on camps and society tasks.
Loot from Camps
Weighting/Padding Sigils, Stamina to Mana conversion, Few other decent abilities.
Balefire ownage

GoS CONs:

Horrible Durations. Alot of Upkeep for sigils
No large mana return ability compared to wracking


CoL PROs:

Full Mana by use of Wracking.
Excellent durations, little upkeep.

CoL CONs:

Boring as hell.
If you Bolt, AS may take a hit if using wracking due to loss in spirit.

As of now, I would like to lean more towards GoS given my race. But I'm no number cruncher so I specifically have no idea how much Stamina I would have, and at what rate my Stamina regen is.

What I'm curious to know is, as an HK, is it actually faster to use 50 Stamina for 25 Mana in terms of total Mana regen compared to wracking for Full Mana capacity. Or is it still better, mana for mana, to use wracking in terms of mana return.

If I can find out that answer, it may make my GoS decision easier.

Where are you Mark? :P

[Drew]

What kind of PF training do you do?

[Gizmo]

What kind of PF training do you do?

He'd be 1x, of course. I'd be foolish not to as an HK

[Drew]

My guess would be with sorcerers it would really depend on how much you bolt. GOS for a wizard is a no-brainer to me, but for clerics and sorcerers I'm not certain.

[Kitsun]

Unless you're talking about a character with relatively small amounts of mana, GOS mana returns can never really compete with COL. It only gets worse with larger mana pools (2x to 3x HP training). The saving grace is that once you're at 3x HP, who the heck needs to wrack anymore.

[Fallen]

If you put in the work to aquire enough aura enhancives to give you 13 spirit, along with +3 spirit recovery, COL even as a spirit poor race like Dark Elves is dominant. Yes, you CAN get by with less mana, but why would you want to? I absolutely loathed plinking. I prefered to cast 409/415 over 702/705, 435 over 410, etc. There are some neat aspects to GoS, like being able to cast through injuries, but in the end, nothing beats heaps and heaps of mana.

As to your actual question, as a sorcerer not able to 3x Physical Fitness, COL will always come out ahead in terms of mana production. Start adding in enhancives and greater than 1x HP and it only gets more lopsided.

[DaCapn]

If you put in the work to aquire enough aura enhancives to give you 13 spirit, along with +3 spirit recovery, COL even as a spirit poor race like Dark Elves is dominant. Yes, you CAN get by with less mana, but why would you want to? I absolutely loathed plinking. I prefered to cast 409/415 over 702/705, 435 over 410, etc. There are some neat aspects to GoS, like being able to cast through injuries, but in the end, nothing beats heaps and heaps of mana.

As to your actual question, as a sorcerer not able to 3x Physical Fitness, COL will always come out ahead in terms of mana production. Start adding in enhancives and greater than 1x HP and it only gets more lopsided.

I saw an open wound so here I am, salt shaker in hand.


The Growing Pains seminar presented by GM Banthis and myself at SimuCon 2000 focused on potential changes to game mechanics to achieve game integrity across the entire range of player levels.

In addition, changes aimed at improving the gameplay were discussed. The goals of these changes are to 1) reduce the number of instant kills, for both creatures and players, and 2) Ensure that the 'typical' training paths for various professions remain viable. We'd like to move away from the current high level mentality that the player must get the first attack off or the player dies. We also want to ensure that the average player can have fun in the game, while we still present a game that will challenge the hardcore hunter characters.

To meet these goals, we are currently working on (or have planned) multiple short and long term projects. These include (in no particular order):

1. A reduction in creature hit points and crit resistance. The game is currently focused heavily on death by critical hit, especially at high levels, and we'd like to see it shift more to the side of hitpoint attrition (fewer instant kills). Some creatures may experience an uptweak in DS. Many non-AS based spells will see reductions in their critical potential, to compensate for the reduction in creature critical resistance. Some spells will become more damage oriented rather than critical oriented. This project is currently underway.

...

[Fallen]

Heh, yeah. Some sorcerers got around plinking by turning to bolts. Others by making their CS as high as absolutely possible. I got around the problem by spending something like 1000+ mana per hunt.

[Gizmo]

If you put in the work to aquire enough aura enhancives to give you 13 spirit, along with +3 spirit recovery, COL even as a spirit poor race like Dark Elves is dominant. Yes, you CAN get by with less mana, but why would you want to? I absolutely loathed plinking. I prefered to cast 409/415 over 702/705, 435 over 410, etc. There are some neat aspects to GoS, like being able to cast through injuries, but in the end, nothing beats heaps and heaps of mana.

As to your actual question, as a sorcerer not able to 3x Physical Fitness, COL will always come out ahead in terms of mana production. Start adding in enhancives and greater than 1x HP and it only gets more lopsided.

Yeah, it's a tough call to say the least. And as Kitsun, and yourself stated E, nothing still beats wracking for mana return compared to the 50 stam/25 mana you get for using a sigil.

I was just unsure as to how often I could pull off that sigil, compared to using wracking for example. I mean, if I could in one hunt use the sigil 10 times, that still is only 250 mana returned, for 500 stamina.

[Fallen]

Remember too that if you are constantly using your stamina for mana you wont have anything left to power the other sigils. You can maintain the mana using signs for col indefinitely at higher levels.