Dhe'nar

[Makkah]

Just ran upon this krakii entry...

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Noi%27sho%27rah

Who the fuck did Celtic/Snuffer, etc think they were getting this shit approved with (fellow) GMs. Fucking ridiculous. Sorry, Evarin.

[thefarmer]

Didn't you stop playing awhile ago?

[Fallen]

lol.

[Tolwynn]

A group of elves that has poison sperm and somehow thrives after murdering the vast majority of their young, and you call out Noi'sho'rah as the ridiculous bit?

Heh.

[Eoghain]

A group of elves that has poison sperm and somehow thrives after murdering the vast majority of their young, and you call out Noi'sho'rah as the ridiculous bit?

Heh.

That. Dhe'nar are awesome because they make NO SENSE. Like Muslims! We're how IW SHOULD be!

[Warriorbird]

Just ran upon this krakii entry...

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Noi%27sho%27rah

Who the fuck did Celtic/Snuffer, etc think they were getting this shit approved with (fellow) GMs. Fucking ridiculous. Sorry, Evarin.

I dunno. Seems like a pretty solid Left Hand Path Gosaena follower. Tolwynn called the really problematic bits.

[Makkah]

Didn't you stop playing awhile ago?

Oh shit. You're correct. I forgot that meant I couldn't talk about GS anymore.

And yea, Tolwynn is correct. The part I linked to was where Krakii random sent me. I didn't bother reading any further into that nonsense.

[packrat]

the teachings/preachings of the tower are far from accepted among the general populace of Dhe'nar or dark elves that dont claim a culture.wouldnt take long or much effort to make an arguement for many not claiming a culture because of that silliness.
generalizing Dhe'nar as poison sperm having,child killing,halfling eating,slave owning peoples would be on par with generalizing all muslims as car-bombing/suicide bombing,lunatic terrorists.
i dont know where starsnuffer was raised but i wouldnt suggest drinking the water there.

[Cephalopod]

http://gsguide.net/images/thumb/2/2a/Dhenarfap.jpg/400px-Dhenarfap.jpg

[RichardCranium]

I thought all sperm was poisonous?

-rojo

[Alrisaren]

the teachings/preachings of the tower are far from accepted among the general populace of Dhe'nar or dark elves that dont claim a culture.wouldnt take long or much effort to make an arguement for many not claiming a culture because of that silliness.
generalizing Dhe'nar as poison sperm having,child killing,halfling eating,slave owning peoples would be on par with generalizing all muslims as car-bombing/suicide bombing,lunatic terrorists.
i dont know where starsnuffer was raised but i wouldnt suggest drinking the water there.

Exactly. It was that stuff that made me lose complete interest in having my Dhe'nar character get involved with the Obsidian Tower. I don't play her that way and that entire vision of Dhe'nar culture/history just doesn't resonate. My char doesn't want to eat halflings. Their feet are too hairy, for one.

[4a6c1]

I thought all sperm was poisonous?

-rojo

Obsidian Towers mmmm. So large and dark and rigid. My fav!

-RC

[RichardCranium]

She knows me so well.

[Fallen]

What the Tower teaches, and what people believe the Tower teaches are two different things entirely. The poison sperm thing was all Snuffy, who has been gone for a decade or so.

[Fallen]

For example, this is from our message boards. Note the lack of Poison Sperm and halfling eating 101.




Please bear in mind that these are the MINIMUM requirements expected of q'halae.* As children, no one dreams of being mediocre, so while the bare minimum is acceptable, it is of course simply that – the bare minimum.* Additional training in other areas may, and probably should be, expected.* Please feel free to contact me directly with questions or concerns.

Much of this will be updated on the website or be held in a formal lecture.

This list is subject to updating and is current as of May 21.

BASIC REQUIREMENTS FOR ALL REGARDLESS OF PROFESSION:
1.***Be at a minimum of "Lord" or "Lady" status.
2.***Be a Master of their chosen society (if any).
3. ***Have a solid and demonstrated understanding of their profession.
3.***Have a solid and demonstrated understanding of their chosen combat equipment (armor, as well as chosen sword/shield or runestaff).
4.***Know how to properly care for their chosen combat equipment.
5.***Have a basic understanding of herbs and their usage.
6.***Undergo one month's q'halaeish.
7.***Successfully plan and lead one House event.
8.***Successfully complete a Great Hunt.
9.***Successfully complete the ritual blood testing.
10.***Submit a personal history (to be published at the q'halae's discretion).
11.***Understand some simple Dhe'nar-si phrases, to include proper pronunciation and usage.
12.***Have a demonstrated knowledge of the important names and key events of Dhe'nar history.
13.***Have knowledge and understanding of the Dhe'nari castes.
14.***Have a demonstrated knowledge Dhe'nari customs, to include clothing, tattoos and braids.
15. ***Have a demonstrated knowledge of The Way.
16.***Have a demonstrated knowledge of the traditional Dhe'nar views of the other races.
17.***Have an understanding and demonstrated knowledge of the Arkati and the various pantheons.
18.***Have a demonstrated knowledge and understanding of the Obsidian Council positions.
19.***Have a demonstrated knowledge of the past Highlords.
20.***Have a demonstrated knowledge of the proper Dhe'nar greetings.
21.***Have knowledge of the various thrones used by the Obsidian Council.

REQUIREMENTS FOR WARRIORS
1.***Have an active Warrior Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Warrior Guild of their city of calling.
3.***Possess Skill Master status of at least one Warrior Guild skill.
4.***Possess at least 5 ranks in all other Warrior Guild skills.
5.***Have an understanding of GUARD and PROTECT, their usage, benefits and penalties.
6.***Have an understanding of simple combat tactics (For example: deciding when to use flares, what type, open aiming, maneuver usage, etc.).
7.***Have an understanding of assessing weapons and armor and comprehending the information gleaned thereof.
8.***Have an understanding of all shield classes (size, benefits, penalties, etc.).
9.***Have an understanding of all armor groups and subgroups (to include armor training).
10.***Have an understanding of all weapons of their chosen weapon class (to include advantages, disadvantages, modified variants, the differences between the modified and the original).
11.***Have an understanding of commonly available magic items.

REQUIREMENTS FOR ROGUES
1.***Have an active Rogue Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Rogue Guild of their city of calling and the entry procedure.
3.***Possess Mastery of at least one Rogue Guild skill.
4.***Possess at least 5 ranks in all other Rogue Guild skills.
5.***Have an understanding of trap detection and disarmament for their level of ability (if any).
6.***Have an understanding of lock picking for their level of ability (if any).
7.***Have an understanding of the various types of lock picks (for locksmith types only).
8.***Have an understanding of urban stealth and survival skills.
9.***Have an understanding of all shield classes (size, benefits, penalties, etc.).
10.***Have an understanding of all armor groups and subgroups (to include armor training).
11.***Have an understanding of all weapons of their chosen weapon class (to include advantages, disadvantages, modified variants, the differences between the modified and the original).

REQUIREMENTS FOR BARDS
1.***Know the location and layout of the Bard Guild in their city of calling.
2.***Have an understanding of loresinging and comprehending the information gleaned thereof.
3.***Have at least one simple generalized loresong memorized.
4.***Possess the knowledge of the gem purification process and the various states of the gem.
5.***Have an understanding of the Bard spell circle (to include sonic weaponry, sonic armor, sonic shields and animated weaponry).*
6.***Have an understanding of the Minor Elemental spell circle.*
7.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
8.***Have an understanding of all shield classes (size, benefits, penalties, etc.).
9.***Have an understanding of all armor groups and subgroups (to include armor training).
10.***Have an understanding of all weapons of their chosen weapon class (to include advantages, disadvantages, modified variants, the differences between the modified and the original).
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR WIZARDS
1.***Have an active Wizard Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Wizard Guild of their city of calling.
3.***Know how to access the workshop of the Wizard Guild of their city of calling.
4.***Possess, at the minimum, the ability to create minor mana regeneration potions via Alchemy.
5.***Have an understanding of the methodology of familiar bonding.
6.***Have knowledge of the most commonly found wands and familiarity with their spells.
7.***Have an understanding of the workings of magic item invocation to determine duration.
8.***Have an understanding of scroll invocation to determine duration.
9.***Have an understanding of the process of enchanting (to include the aspects that penalize or reward a Wizard attempting an enchantment and the assorted potions).
10.***Have an understanding of the use of the Charge Item process.
11.***Have an understanding of the Imbedding process.
12.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Elemental spell circle. *
13.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Major Elemental spell circle.*
14.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Wizard base spell circle.*
15.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR SORCERORS
1.***Have an active Sorcerer Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Sorcerer Guild near their city of calling and the entry procedure.
3.***Possess, at the minimum, the ability to create minor mana regeneration potions via Alchemy.
4.***Possess, at the minimum, the ability to successfully create essence roses consistently.
5.***Have an understanding of the Imbedding process.
6.***Have knowledge of the most commonly found wands and familiarity with their spells.
7.***Have an understanding of the workings of magic item invocation to determine duration.
8.***Have an understanding of scroll invocation to determine duration.
9.***Have an understanding of the Scroll Infusion process.
10.***Have an understanding of the Animate Dead process.
11.***Have an understanding of the Minor Summoning process.
12.***Have an understanding of the Illusions process and its usage.
13.***Have knowledge of the Sacrifice process and benefits gleaned from.
14.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Sorcerer base spell circle.*
15.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Elemental spell circle.*
16.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Major Elemental spell circle.*
17.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR CLERICS
1.***Have an active Cleric Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Cleric Guild in their city of calling.
3.***Possess, at the minimum, the ability to create minor mana regeneration potions via Alchemy.
4.***Have knowledge of the process of and requirements for Raise Dead.
5.***Possess the ability to successfully Raise Dead.
6.***Have knowledge of the usage and requirements for Well of Life.
7.***Have knowledge of the various Arkati and their respective pantheons.
8.***Have an understanding of how to bless gems.
9.***Have knowledge of the tiers related to Holy Receptacle.
10.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Cleric base spell circle.*
11.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Spiritual spell circle.*
12.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Major Spiritual spell circle.*
13.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR PALADINS
1.***Have knowledge of the various Arkati and their pantheons.
2.***Have knowledge of all known temples dedicated to their deity of choice.
3.***Have an understanding of all shield classes (size, benefits, penalties, etc.).
4.***Have an understanding of all armor groups and subgroups (to include armor training).
5.***Have an understanding of all weapons of their chosen weapon class (to include advantages, disadvantages, modified variants, the differences between the modified and the original).
6.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Paladin base spell circle.*
7.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Spiritual spell circle.*
8.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR EMPATHS
1.***Have an active Empath Guild membership and understand the inner workings thereof.
2.***Know the location and layout of the Empath Guild for their city of calling.
3.***Have knowledge of herb lore, including herbs only found through foraging.
4.***Possess the ability to create all healing tinctures via Alchemy.
5.***Possess the ability to create minor mana regeneration potions via Alchemy.
6.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Spiritual spell circle.*
7.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Major Spiritual spell circle.*
8.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Empath base spell circle.*
9.***Have an understanding of the pertinent professional lores and their effects on the aforementioned spell circles.
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

REQUIREMENTS FOR RANGERS
1.***Know the location and layout of the Ranger Guild near their city of calling.
2.***Know the process behind the taming and care of an Animal Companion.
3.***Have an understanding of how to sense for a chosen animal companion.
4.***Have knowledge of how to sense a terrain to determine the flora and fauna available.
5.***Have knowledge of at least one location for each forgeable herb within the boundaries of their city of calling.
6.***Have an understanding of wilderness stealth, survival and tracking.
7.***Have an understanding of the process skinning (penalties, benefits, etc.).
8.***Have knowledge of the location of suitable materials for the Imbue process.
9.***Have an understanding of the Resist Nature process and all required components.
10.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Ranger base spell circle.*
11.***Have an understanding of the spells in the Minor Spiritual spell circle.*
* Should a q’hala for any reason be unable to cast a particular spell or spells from their spell circles, they are still required to demonstrate knowledge of the workings of the spell.

[Danical]

Poison sperm? Tha fuck?

[Drakefang]

That's a lot of work.

[thefarmer]

Oh shit. You're correct. I forgot that meant I couldn't talk about GS anymore.

Haven't I seen you mock other ex-players for commenting on GS stuff?

[Fallen]

That's a lot of work.


Agreed.

[Makkah]

Haven't I seen you mock other ex-players for commenting on GS stuff?

Would love to see these posts. (in a nutshell, no, you haven't)

[Drew]

5.***Have knowledge of at least one location for each forgeable herb within the boundaries of their city of calling.


I hate when people get too profession specific like this. Being a ranger means you know a certain number of spells and skills but to me that is all. Certainly these will influence you but I dislike when people try to make your character something stereotypical. I didn't look but I'll assume one of the rogue requirements was knowing the best areas to pickpocket because that's something all rogues do.

[Drew]

Also I've always been curious as to how Starsnuffer got his player fantasies codified in-game.

[Back]

You are a brilliant star.


I hate when people get too profession specific like this. Being a ranger means you know a certain number of spells and skills but to me that is all. Certainly these will influence you but I dislike when people try to make your character something stereotypical. I didn't look but I'll assume one of the rogue requirements was knowing the best areas to pickpocket because that's something all rogues do.

[Warriorbird]

Also I've always been curious as to how Starsnuffer got his player fantasies codified in-game.

A bunch of them got left out. Mnar's player (who still posts here sometimes) is 50x a better writer than Starsnuffer or Celtic/Mahegh. A bunch still got in.

[4a6c1]

Evarin should write some new stuff.

/bait

[Ltlprprincess]

Evarin's too busy to do that.

[DCSL]

Evarin's too busy to do that.


I admit to looking for some kind of IN MY PANTS portion of this post.

[packrat]

What the Tower teaches, and what people believe the Tower teaches are two different things entirely. The poison sperm thing was all Snuffy, who has been gone for a decade or so.



obsidiantower.com is no longer relevant to your thinking?

[kookiegod]

Well, Billy, Roberta, and company did this as they wanted.

There was never any plan to codify the Dhe'Nar prior to GS4. It simply wasn't possible.

When it happened and new races and Melissa allowed them in, it was under the strict understanding that Simu owned it, and did what they wanted with the history which tossed out a lot of what was previously written which led to several of them leaving in protest.

How it goes.

Great culture, but sheesh Billy jumped the shark with 'poison sperm'.

[4a6c1]

I admit to looking for some kind of IN MY PANTS portion of this post.

Necromancers anonymous in those pants?!

[Stry]

I admit to knowing very little of the Dhe'nari culture aside from reading the current 'official' history once a few months ago.

But... weren't they somewhat based off of D&D Drow and their language?

[Warriorbird]

Shadow World dyari or some such.

[thefarmer]

Would love to see these posts. (in a nutshell, no, you haven't)

My fault then. I had you confused with someone else.

[Fallen]

obsidiantower.com is no longer relevant to your thinking?

We've had this discussion before. It is easy to criticize when you won't state clearly and in detail what you believe. If you're not willing to stand for anything, or place any boundries on roleplay, what is the point?

Revising the documentation has been a distant goal for some time. We've also generated some new documentation and lore which isn't quite so out there. I've simply been too busy to actively play of late. Between school and angling for a big pay raise, I had to put priority on real life.

[packrat]

wasnt a criticism,it was a question?i believe that a persons beliefs are up to them to decide, not be defined by a minority on age old spoutings,dont know how i can say it any clearer.even if i didnt i should be forced to join your idea of roleplaying?

good luck with the raise.

[Fallen]

wasnt a criticism,it was a question?i believe that a persons beliefs are up to them to decide, not be defined by a minority on age old spoutings,dont know how i can say it any clearer.even if i didnt i should be forced to join your idea of roleplaying?

good luck with the raise.

The restrictions we place on those that join the Tower are the same as what the DE Guru said he believed are appropriate for the culture. Yes, we ask that those seeking to join the Obsidian Tower are knowledgeable in the Tower's history. I don't see that changing. Why join the organization if you don't care about it?

Also, as we've discussed, The Tower no longer supports the position that if you aren't a member, you aren't a Dhe'nar. In my eyes, that changed the second the culture became official Cannon. I believe that Khshathra's plans for the culture are excellent, and look forward to what he puts forth in his documentation. We've had discussions both at his meetings and through other avenues to ensure that the Tower documentation doesn't come in direct conflict with the official documentation.

As for the ObsidianTower.com documentation, yes I stand by it. There are aspects of it I do not like, for instance, the high mortality rates of the young. As others pointed out, that is stupid. I believe the documents should reflect that those that fail in their vocational training are assigned to the Worker Caste, not euthanized. The clothing part of our documentation is subject to change when Khshathra's document(s) comes out, as he said that will impact clothing as well. Like I said, we've plans to make the documentation stronger, but we will not abandon it. If I wanted to Free-form RP I would go to a chat room.

[packrat]

does the tower define the Dhe'nar culture in your opinion?

and what is RP if it is scripted?

[Fallen]

does the tower define the Dhe'nar culture in your opinion?

and what is RP if it is scripted?

I believe the Tower offers supplimental documentation, not definitive documentation. The Tower USED to define what a Dhe'nar was and was not, as it was created by those that proposed the culture. This has changed, as I have stated many times. The goal now has become to provide a place where the culture can be explored further both through documentation and roleplay opportunity. For instance, I have collected pretty much every piece of Khanshael and Dhe'nar H4H items that were released. I mean to place them all on display in the Tower, along with a readable tome containing their loresongs. Is it wrong to ask that those joining the Tower be familiar with the stories they tell?

What is the point of calling yourself a Dhe'nar if you (in a general sense of the word) don't follow any of the documentation, official or otherwise? A Dhe'nar who doesn't believe Noi'sho'rah ever existed. A Dhe'nar who doesn't have a viewpoint of The Way. A Dhe'nar who doesn't have an opinion on Ascension, either on a personal level, or a cultural one. A Dhe'nar who doesn't recognize the Caste System.

You (Specific) state that by defining things, or asking for a Dhe'nar to "conform" to these ideas we are scripting and restricting roleplay. I counter that by saying we only ask that you HAVE an opinion on these issues. You have a set beliefs which adhere to the cultural standards set forth by Kshshathra, Galene, and the other GMs which came before them. Your (general) version of The Way can be WILDLY different from mine, just as your ideas can differ on how one should seek to Ascend, or even the meaning of the term itself. However, I will not agree that it is perfectly ok NOT to include those aspects of the culture in your character's mindset and still seek to join the Tower. As I said before, what then is the point of calling your character Dhe'nar?

[Sylvan Dreams]

The Tower defineD the Dhe'nar culture in that it is where the culture originated from. If the origin of a culture doesn't define it, then I don't know what does.

Would the Tower shit on players who tried to make their OWN, SEPERATE Dhe'nar group? No, of course not. Does the Tower shit on people who RP Dhe'nar and don't join the Tower? No, of course not.

If you (general you) hate the Tower and want nothing to do with it, you can still RP a perfectly good Dhe'nar without joining the Tower. Not everyone is going to accept your character, however, regardless of their Tower knowledge or affiliation. Just because you believe your RP is good and solid, doesn't mean that other people's RP agrees with you. If you feel like the Tower is holding your Dhe'nar back, I assure you, that's not the case. Whatever grudges a person holds against the Tower is against a label to a CHE, and that's all. The people whom caused those grudges are long gone.

If you want to RP a Dhe'nar using your own ideas, that's fine. How is sticking to Tower, or even official documentation "scripting" your character? Culture in the real world have their own general beliefs, general language, etc. Is it "scripting" for Mexican to speak Spanish? Should he avoid doing so because otherwise he can't possibly be original in any way if he adheres to cultural standards? By that same token, if you claim to be a Catholic, but don't believe in Jesus, how can you claim to be a Catholic when one (being Catholic) is defined by the other (the belief in Jesus)? Dhe'nar was always RP'd to be a combination of bloodlines and culture.

[Archigeek]

Buildings built on difficult terrain are often the most extraordinary. Those built in a wide open space, frequently have little to offer.

[packrat]

If I wanted to Free-form RP I would go to a chat room.


i thought it to be a fair question after that.

[Fallen]

If I wanted to Free-form RP I would go to a chat room.


i thought it to be a fair question after that.

I think I have thoroughly answered your question. I know you still have reservations about the Tower, but I do also believe that you unfairly label us as stereotyping all Dhe'nar to have cookie-cutter beliefs. Except for rangers. They all better fucking forage or they can just piss off.

[packrat]

what you do in the tower is your business,as i have said before,doing it behind a Dhe'nar veil creates the stereotypes/cookie-cutter beliefs you are speaking of without consideration for those who choose to disagree.


i saw the thread and the references to the tower and chose to add my two cents with my original post.thanks for your time?

[BriarFox]

You're being ridiculous, Packrat. Obviously a group will have a group identity. You might as well castigate Americans for being American or doctors for writing prescriptions.

[Fallen]

what you do in the tower is your business,as i have said before,doing it behind a Dhe'nar veil creates the stereotypes/cookie-cutter beliefs you are speaking of without consideration for those who choose to disagree.


i saw the thread and the references to the tower and chose to add my two cents with my original post.thanks for your time?

You are quite welcome. I am always open to thoughtful discussion on the culture, even if it must be adversarial. I know we don't see eye-to-eye on Dhe'nar roleplay, but I believe that is largely because I still don't understand what you think comprises it, if anything.

[packrat]

You're being ridiculous, Packrat. Obviously a group will have a group identity. You might as well castigate Americans for being American or doctors for writing prescriptions.



i dont see how it is considered ridiculous?as has been said more than a few times the tower was built on defining a race.the thoughts of a minority dont define the majority,thankfully.

[packrat]

You are quite welcome. I am always open to thoughtful discussion on the culture, even if it must be adversarial. I know we don't see eye-to-eye on Dhe'nar roleplay, but I believe that is largely because I still don't understand what you think comprises it, if anything.

why the need for it to be defined,or better yet,just because it was written it is true?

[BriarFox]

i dont see how it is considered ridiculous?as has been said more than a few times the tower was built on defining a race.the thoughts of a minority dont define the majority,thankfully.

I think you're confusing the chain of causation. The Tower was a dark elven minority, defining the Dhe'nar, which were later recognized as an official race based in large part on their ideas. You're somehow accusing them of being a contrarian Dhe'nar minority attempting to define a majority before the majority even existed.

[packrat]

no,no confusion here,the tower was founded by those that defined the culture before the official cultures were released.accusing?everything that has been referenced by me is documented by the same.

[Drunken Durfin]

Fuck elves.

[m444w]

no,no confusion here,the tower was founded by those that defined the culture before the official cultures were released.accusing?everything that has been referenced by me is documented by the same.

What are you smoking?

[packrat]

What are you smoking?



pardon me?

[Sylvan Dreams]

why the need for it to be defined,or better yet,just because it was written it is true?

So you're saying that beyond a name, no further definition or explanation of a race is required and should instead just all be figured out in free form roleplay that the player wants to do.

[BriarFox]

So you're saying that beyond a name, no further definition or explanation of a race is required and should instead just all be figured out in free form roleplay that the player wants to do.

Hey, let's start the "Hearts" club. Sally wants to make Valentines for everyone, Oglunu likes to eat hearts raw, and Manal would really like to help you find love.

[diethx]

What is up with packrat's inability to use the space bar after any type of punctuation? Is this some sort of stand against something or did they hit their head?

[packrat]

So you're saying that beyond a name, no further definition or explanation of a race is required

isnt that what was done with the creation of the tower?



and should instead just all be figured out in free form roleplay that the player wants to do.

isnt that how the poisonous sperm,child killing,halfling eating,slave owning was decided?

[packrat]

What is up with packrat's inability to use the space bar after any type of punctuation? Is this some sort of stand against something or did they hit their head?

nah as you can see by my post count i dont spend much time with it,i will leave that to the pros.

[diethx]

nah as you can see by my post count i dont spend much time with it,i will leave that to the pros.

Uh, what? Because you have a low post count you can't understand simple grammar? I'm so confused right now.

[BriarFox]

Wow. You're quite the paradox. Critical yet nonsensical, verbose yet avowedly laconic, insulting yet sensitive, talkative yet incomprehensible. I award you a mobius strip fail:

http://www-vrl.umich.edu/project2/moebius/UmbilicTorus.jpg

[packrat]

didnt know that grades were to be given,or that the boards were that technical for that matter

[BriarFox]

didnt know that grades were to be given,or that the boards were that technical for that matter

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/50316_43372670955_5454094_n.jpg

[Fallen]

I mean to ask Kshsathra for definite confirmation, but slave ownership is canon, not a Tower construct...for lack of a better term. We have in our new Enclave, approved and built by Alyias, a slave hold filled with Krolvin. Remember also that in the Heraldry official documentation it mentions the Tower Heraldry was branded on the flesh of it's slaves.

[diethx]

Maybe it's ESL.

[Warriorbird]

Maybe it's ESL.

ESL... or Hevinsbane! You be the judge.

For all that I bag on the Dhe'nar, I'm not seeing where the slave portion of things is not supported by the docs, the Noi'sho'rah ascendancy stuff either (it's actually much more supported with some of the GSS events and the revelations about Amas Faendryl/Amasalen).

The infertility, the poison sperm, yet wiping out most of your own populace? Those are far worse.

[diethx]

ESL... or Hevinsbane! You be the judge.

I would, but I'm pretty far removed from the GS community these days and don't remember who Hevinsbane is. :/

[Makkah]

He was a dude that posted on the official boards for a while. The posts were so absolutely atrocious in grammar and typing it was humorous. So much so I thought the dude had serious learning issues and/or English was his 4th language.

[Fallen]

ESL... or Hevinsbane! You be the judge.

For all that I bag on the Dhe'nar, I'm not seeing where the slave portion of things is not supported by the docs, the Noi'sho'rah ascendancy stuff either (it's actually much more supported with some of the GSS events and the revelations about Amas Faendryl/Amasalen).

The infertility, the poison sperm, yet wiping out most of your own populace? Those are far worse.

I'm not familiar with that part of the GSS. Other than Alisair's involvement, I wasn't aware Noi'sho'rah was involved. Did Geishon cover that in one of his summaries?

[diethx]

He was a dude that posted on the official boards for a while. The posts were so absolutely atrocious in grammar and typing it was humorous. So much so I thought the dude had serious learning issues and/or English was his 4th language.

Ohhhhhhhhhh I think I know who you're talking about.

[Warriorbird]

I'm not familiar with that part of the GSS. Other than Alisair's involvement, I wasn't aware Noi'sho'rah was involved. Did Geishon cover that in one of his summaries?

It became clear that people have been attempting to walk a path towards ascendancy through the Left Hand of Gosaena for a long time. Some have been successful, some have not been. The land has usually been devastated as a result. Bandur Etrevion, Noi'sho'rah, and Amas Faendryl could all be easily considered examples (Amas being successful as Amasalen).

Lots of stuff never made it into summaries.

[Fallen]

Awesome. I'd be interested in hearing more if you have the time, IG or out.

[Sylvan Dreams]

Here's the deal with the "poison sperm".

Dhe'nar do not have poison sperm that renders non-Dhe'nar females sterile. They do not have poison sperm at all, actually. Dhe'nar females do not have teeth in their vaginas that consume the penis of non-Dhe'nar, either. It was more of a "Haha" thing than a serious part of the culture. Back in the day, Dhe'nar were SO contraversial that whatever someone said - sarcastic or not - was accepted as canon and spread as truth.

Anyone who roleplayed it did so ignorantly.

Dhe'nar are actually sterile and cannot breed without magical intervention from third party. Part of the whole poison sperm seed was in part to ICly disguise this and offer an additional explanation as to why a Dhe'nar didn't just run away from the homelands and impregnate the first slut that caught his eye and thus breed "half-Dhe'nar. As I've said before, being Dhe'nar has always been more than just bloodlines - it is also culture.

This is one of the many myths that I correct when I instruct Dhe'nar who join the Tower. It is people's general hatred for the origins of the culture and for some of the players that caused myths to be spread around and accepted as truth.

[Fallen]

Good stuff. Won't put a dent in the poison sperm jokes, but good post.

[Alrisaren]

I mean to ask Kshsathra for definite confirmation, but slave ownership is canon, not a Tower construct...for lack of a better term.

This is true. That piece of it is on the play.net website. All throughout it actually. Not only on the Dhen'ar histories, but also in the Khanshael histories and the history of that one Giantman clan that is dedicated to eliminating slavery (I can't remember its name right now).

So I've got no beef with the Dhe'nar being slave owners. I'm glad the halfling-eating child-killing poison-sperm thing though isn't getting much play. And I agree that there needs to be some sort of agreed upon cultural context within which you create your character. Part of the fun of creating one, actually.

[B4Hand]

I really believe that the current members and leaders of the OT, are working very hard and have come a long way to negate some of the negativity associated with the Tower, all are great role-players who have invested much time and effort in building the culture back up. I think unless you've spent time in their company, or listened to a story of two (do you guys still have story-tellings?) you(I mean you in a very general sense) should possibly not jump to a quick conclusion about what is going on. My character hasn't been involved really with the Tower for years now, but even back then they were making quick work of changing how a lot of things were done.

Anyway.. yah, Kudos to the current group of the OT, good work guys.

[Asha]

I like how the OT and Dhe'nar have terrible rumours floating around about them. It's something to add to the mystery to the minds of the ignorant (I mean that in the nicest way possible) and typical of people on the outside of such a culture to formulate.
RP that shit.

[Elvenlady]

I really believe that the current members and leaders of the OT, are working very hard and have come a long way to negate some of the negativity associated with the Tower, all are great role-players who have invested much time and effort in building the culture back up.

I'm definitely experiencing this as the player of a dhe'nar who was not comfortable with the alleged ideologies of the OT years back e.g. the whole poison sperm thing. Now I'm certainly considering membership if only Evarin or Eoghain were around to follow that up!

[Alrisaren]

If someone were interested in learning more about the Obsidian Tower with the eye to possibly joining, how would they go about doing that? Do they have forums that are open to guests? I don't have any Dhe'nar character who's level 20 yet, but I am interested in learning more before then.

Thanks! :)

[Gelston]

Eoghain is the only Dhe'nar OT I know of, try an speak with him. I don't know anyone else that is OT other than my Khanshael Dwarf, and he'd probably tell you to fuck off. (I don't play him much anymore either anyways)

[Asha]

Eoghain is definitely the guy you need to speak to.

[ViridianAsp]

It became clear that people have been attempting to walk a path towards ascendancy through the Left Hand of Gosaena for a long time. Some have been successful, some have not been. The land has usually been devastated as a result. Bandur Etrevion, Noi'sho'rah, and Amas Faendryl could all be easily considered examples (Amas being successful as Amasalen).

Lots of stuff never made it into summaries.


From what I have heard Amasalen is tied to Luukos, not Gosaena. Is there documentation on this? I know you said it never made it into summaries, but are there logs or something? I would like to see them.

[Alrisaren]

Eoghain is definitely the guy you need to speak to.


Thanks. I'll keep an eye out for him.

[Warriorbird]

From what I have heard Amasalen is tied to Luukos, not Gosaena. Is there documentation on this? I know you said it never made it into summaries, but are there logs or something? I would like to see them.

Of course he is. It's part of what all the Four were fighting for during the GSS though, ascendancy. It doesn't mean he was a Gosaenan, just went along that blazed path.

[Makkah]

http://harryallen.info/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/just-blaze-the-collection.jpg

[Asha]

That guy be blazin.

[Warriorbird]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_OzGc1SV3I