Tactical

[Middian]

Tactical.

The other day I used the term “tactical’ to describe some armor that I was trying to get altered. Seems Sadie thought the idea was completely absurd. “How could armor be tactical? Sounds like you are playing war games or something.” (Sadie)

Being in the military myself, I know that “tactical’ can be used to describe a piece of equipment. A piece of equipment could be considered “tactical” when it’s created not to make noise when patrolling or it doesn’t give you away because of the color. For an example we’ll tape all metal clips and latches on a rucksack so it doesn’t make noise on patrol.

In addition, I have been issued tactical vests and tactical holsters. I believe the term is used because the item has been designed for battle situations to help aid you more than normal clothing or standard issue equipment.
With this premise in mind, I figured plate could be tactical, if it was not shinny or it could be padded down so it doesn’t make noise while walking or hunting.

I just wanted to hear the community’s thoughts.

[Gelston]

Describe how it is tactical in the alter. When you look at something, what makes you consider it "tactical" as compared to regular run of the mill stuff.

It is also the reason why they general won't let you alter something to be a Wizard's cloak or a Warrior's Pack.

And yes, I know stuff like the currently exists, but it ain't right I tell you! It ain't right!

[Fallen]

I had trouble getting Silenced in an alteration. Good luck with tactical.

[Jayvn]

OH the old Alter my full plate into a ghillie suit.....

[inso]

I had a GM the other day who said veniom was not a suitable material for making items, and that she couldn't make my cufflinks out of veniom because it wasn't a strong enough. This was for a FWI transporter... they have veniom cufflinks off the shelf for transporters.

I've given up on Sadie scrolls too. Last time I tried one, it took several days to get a 8-line wall of text rejection for a simple "long" description. I expected a "You must be stupid, stupid, stupid" at the end of it. That morning there was a merchant who did the alteration for me without even a question.

Ranting aside, if you really want to use that word I'd recommend posting on the "Elanthian fashion" section of the officials. It's under the roleplaying header. Usually Itzel or someone will clear up any rules and allow you to refer a merchant/Sadie to a post allowing or disallowing it. Might be faster than spending multiple days arguing via scroll.

[No Gnomes Is Good News]

Tactical.

The other day I used the term “tactical’ to describe some armor that I was trying to get altered. Seems Sadie thought the idea was completely absurd. “How could armor be tactical? Sounds like you are playing war games or something.” (Sadie)

Being in the military myself, I know that “tactical’ can be used to describe a piece of equipment. A piece of equipment could be considered “tactical” when it’s created not to make noise when patrolling or it doesn’t give you away because of the color. For an example we’ll tape all metal clips and latches on a rucksack so it doesn’t make noise on patrol.

In addition, I have been issued tactical vests and tactical holsters. I believe the term is used because the item has been designed for battle situations to help aid you more than normal clothing or standard issue equipment.
With this premise in mind, I figured plate could be tactical, if it was not shinny or it could be padded down so it doesn’t make noise while walking or hunting.

I just wanted to hear the community’s thoughts.

Being a military man myself, I'll try to help you with this Mid.

The term "tactical" is likely not working for you, because of the above mentioned reasons. Another thing may be because the GM simply feels as if "tactical" armor may not have existed back then in a sense.

Instead of trying to use the term tactical, think of other approaches. How would you make a set of full plate tactical, back in those old days, if you were to do so.

IE: Some terms that you could likely use are matte, flat, cushioned, reinforced, and so on. The term tactical in itself is rather broad which is why they wouldn't let you use it.

In the days, I actually did get a suit of armor "tactically" altered in a sense. But instead of making it simply tactical, I described it more with a short desc and show. I think it was a set of brig something along the lines of "mud splattered" and what not, with the show incorporating mud, twigs, and foliage into it, to I hate to admit it, resemble a ghillie suit but in the older times.

Tactical suits of armor can easily exist though, it's just all about your approach and phrasing used for it. Just keep in mind, that full plate back in the day wasn't quite atctical, since well, it was full plate. So try to think of ways people would make a heavy, metal clonking suit, tactical as best as they could...Such as incorporate wool padding stitched into a leather underlay from the metal to help soften the noise etc

[No Gnomes Is Good News]

I had a GM the other day who said veniom was not a suitable material for making items, and that she couldn't make my cufflinks out of veniom because it wasn't a strong enough. This was for a FWI transporter... they have veniom cufflinks off the shelf for transporters.

I've given up on Sadie scrolls too. Last time I tried one, it took several days to get a 8-line wall of text rejection for a simple "long" description. I expected a "You must be stupid, stupid, stupid" at the end of it. That morning there was a merchant who did the alteration for me without even a question.

Ranting aside, if you really want to use that word I'd recommend posting on the "Elanthian fashion" section of the officials. It's under the roleplaying header. Usually Itzel or someone will clear up any rules and allow you to refer a merchant/Sadie to a post allowing or disallowing it. Might be faster than spending multiple days arguing via scroll.


And the above reinforces my point that it can also vary greatly from Merchant to Merchant.

The same merchant that denied inso his alter on his FWI device, allowed my alter on mine.

Which is "A bleached bessho lizard spur"....Keep in mind, Bessho lizards are extinct in lore/documents, even though an actual spur was released years ago at an auction. So that just goes to show how wishy washy things can all be.

[Asha]

A special veriety of modified plated armour could exist where people have come to refer to it as tactical armour.
I don't see how it implies any more or less than say, a suit of field plate.
But Gemstone is of course renowned for its constency so..

[Middian]

I will have to post the exact phrase she used when i get home. She didn’t say no....but she implied it to be absurd to even think it could be used to describe a piece of armor. I assume i have to give up or write a long dissertation on how I think it is applicable.

[Asha]

Just attack her.

[Fallen]

I would suggest the word dampened in place of tactical.

2. To deaden, restrain, or depress: "trade moves . . . aimed at dampening protectionist pressures in Congress" (Christian Science Monitor).
3. To soundproof.

[Middian]

I appreciate the input from everyone, we ll see where this leads!

[Androidpk]

Just keep in mind, that full plate back in the day wasn't quite tactical, since well, it was full plate.

Back in the day? Please don't confuse real history with Elanthia, cause as far as I know we didn't have magic spells and demons back in the day either.

[No Gnomes Is Good News]

Back in the day? Please don't confuse real history with Elanthia, cause as far as I know we didn't have magic spells and demons back in the day either.

Sure, but I meant that purely as a basis of what genre etc gemstone is loosely based off of, in most cases or at least in my head, that genre is fantasy/medieval settings.

Face it, this isn't based off of star wars/space balls, even if Tsin had a schwartz ring....

[Murkshev]

Middian, my two cents. There are some words and ideas that cannot be applied the way you want them to be. For example I been working on an item to display alchemy symbols. Just the general idea cannot be applied. So I took the time to describe what I wanted to see in an alter. If you cannot get the word you are looking for, describe it in the alter. It will not look the way you want but it will have a better chance of showing what you are working towards.

[Middian]

All good advice thank you.



"Also, I'm not sure how a piece of armor can be "tactical," it makes it sound like the armor is playing war games or something." Sadie

That is the exact quote Sadie used in my alter scroll. In my mind, reading this, it is not that she does not think the word fits with the game, its that she believes that the word cannot be used to describe armor, which seems silly to me. As we discussed earlier, the word tactical absoultely can descriBe a piece of armor.

So if the word doesnt fit in the game, I get that, but her saying it cannot be used to describe a piece of armor, I would say she is wrong. I wear tactical armor all of the time...literly.

Middian

[NoOnesShowMonkey]

The 'tactical' nature of contemporary body armor, versus in the high-medieval that Gemstone is based on, are hardly the same animal.

Our bodies have not changed - all our guts are still in our chests, the insides of our joints still carriage the arteries and veins, our brain meats are still in our skulls - but the intent behind armor design certainly has. Modern body armor is designed along doctrinal principles of modern warfare - maneuver, stealth, modularity - that simply were not valued in the same ways when plate armor was around.

A warrior of the plate-wearing class was a nobleman, who sported his coat of arms on his armor to let everyone know who is. This had a two-fold effect of helping identify him in combat (IFF) and clearly stating his social status and wealth. His armor was 'tactical' in that it was an active, 'loud' form of protection, letting everyone know that he is a professional warrior and not to be messed with by anyone but another professional.

Tactical in the sense of being designed not to make noise was not really a consideration for plate armor. Tactical in terms of 'sleek, without waste, high-speed, low-drag' was a concern, certainly, but one that was often given over in favor of pageantry of a kind.

Most of the comments thus far defending 'tactical' as an alter have to do with stealth and simplicity. Like most other commentators, I'd suggest describing what efforts make the armor more simple or quiet, rather than using a non-sequitor to bluntly and inaccurately describe the armor.

[Fallen]

Are you telling me soldiers did not fight in plate-class armor unless they were noble? I would disagree with that assessment.

[NoOnesShowMonkey]

By the late 15th century, plate was all over the place. You can see it in tons of art pieces about the period.

But the origin of the armor was a horse of a different color.

[Asile]

Most of the comments thus far defending 'tactical' as an alter have to do with stealth and simplicity. Like most other commentators, I'd suggest describing what efforts make the armor more simple or quiet, rather than using a non-sequitor to bluntly and inaccurately describe the armor.

This is along my thoughts as well. But when it comes to describing something, I'm mostly in the "SHOW me, don't TELL me" school: You have a Wizard's cloak? What do I see that makes it so specifically different from, say, an Empath's cloak?

I'm not military, so I'll have a better vision of your armor if you describe all the "tactical" features, rather than just guessing at what "some tactical armor" is.

I've also learned how to choose my battles with merchants, and have references, resources, and back-up ideas at the ready if it's something I really want.

[Asha]

Are we talking about real world history here? I'm pretty sure that's not what the OP is.

[dott]

In modern terms, I know exactly what tactical armor is. I have no idea what it would mean in relation to armor in GS, or medieval armor in general. There's no such thing as MOLLE, mag pouches, night vision goggle mounts, or digicam in GS.

That said, anything's possible if you describe it. My ranger's skin is tattooed with Vietnam-era tiger stripe camo, for example, and I'm halfway done with a Solid Snake costume for one of my rogues.

-mark

[Middian]

I am still on the quest to getting my armor changed! (rolls eyes) I tried the word dampened to sugest some sound proofing of the armor. Here is the latest response.

"Last thing, "dampened" is an odd choice. I get what you're trying to do, but I'm not sure if it works because when the item is motionless on the ground, the joint-wraps wouldn't be dampening it at all. Perhaps just "accented with" or "adorned with" would work instead. ~Sadie"

Going on 4 weeks and 5 tries! (rant off) =)

[Ryvicke]

The word tactical is only used in modern equipment because the letter T is in high demand for the acronym.

[Middian]

hehe I should have realized that! (slaps himself in the forehead)

But seriously, if I used joint wraps in the description to signify a dampening of the armor, what on gods earth is she talking about puting the item on the ground and it no longer is dampening?

I dont want to adorn the wraps, they are there to describe "sound proofing" they are not there to make me look like the ultimate warrior! =)