Back from the Dead (New Ranged Rogue)

[DrZaius]

Hey everybody,

I doubt any of you remember me, but I'm the type of player who is "on again, off again", and it looks like I may be "on again" sometime soon. I'm considering a Ranged Rogue Picker, and I just wanted to see what people thought of my plan, along with a few questions. I shameless stole this stat block from someone else on the forum, but am working out the rest.

Race: Human

Stats:
STR: 70
CON: 70
DEX: 75
AGL: 72
DIS: 80
AUR: 70
LOG: 66
INT: 65
WIS: 68
INF: 24

Skills:

1x Armor til 80
2x Ranged
1x CM
2x Ambush
1x PT
2x Dodge
0.3x Climb (these I know aren't a priority; just getting them out of the way)
0.3x Swim (these I know aren't a priority; just getting them out of the way)
2x Disarm
2x Picking
2x Stalking & Hiding
2x Perception
0.5x Arcane Symbols (to 20)
0.1x Harness Power (How many ranks here? I was thinking of trying Sunfist.)
Spell Training: 404 by 16.



So that's the basic plan. Once I get 404, that should free up a fair amount of TPs for other stuff, the question is, where should I put it? The concept behind this guy is basically the standard "sniping from hiding"; I'd like to be able to pick my own boxes (hence the spells), and maybe a little bit above.

Questions:


Once I get 404, does it make sense to dump my points in more picking & disarm to get them up to 2.5x? Would those points be better spent on Hiding? Basically, once I get my spells, where do people recommend I put the extra TPs into?
Magic Item Use: I don't have it in this plan, but after reading a bit on Spellburst, is this something I should look into getting a few ranks of? How many?
Society: Do people like Sunfist? 90% of my characters in the past rolled CoL, because I loathed being tied to hunting undead. I already hate trolls and orcs, so Sunfist seems like it'd be a good fit, so long as the benefits aren't terrible compared to the other society.
Does the statblock look decent? Honestly, I'm pretty bad at eyeballing these things; I don't want to have a guy with a terrible AS, or whose mind fills up after killing 3 rats.
Would it make sense to start OHE until my 30 days are up for rat-hunting, or is it pretty easy to start off with this type of training plan out of the gate?
Finally, other than the Sunfist are there any new big mechanical changes since the last time I played (late 2007)?


Thanks everyone ahead of time.

-DrZaius

[Caetul]

Hey everybody,

I doubt any of you remember me, but I'm the type of player who is "on again, off again", and it looks like I may be "on again" sometime soon. I'm considering a Ranged Rogue Picker, and I just wanted to see what people thought of my plan, along with a few questions. I shameless stole this stat block from someone else on the forum, but am working out the rest.

Race: Human

Stats:
STR: 70
CON: 70
DEX: 75
AGL: 72
DIS: 80
AUR: 70
LOG: 66
INT: 65
WIS: 68
INF: 24

Skills:

1x Armor til 80
2x Ranged
1x CM
2x Ambush
1x PT
2x Dodge
0.3x Climb (these I know aren't a priority; just getting them out of the way)
0.3x Swim (these I know aren't a priority; just getting them out of the way)
2x Disarm
2x Picking
2x Stalking & Hiding
2x Perception
0.5x Arcane Symbols (to 20)
0.1x Harness Power (How many ranks here? I was thinking of trying Sunfist.)
Spell Training: 404 by 16.



So that's the basic plan. Once I get 404, that should free up a fair amount of TPs for other stuff, the question is, where should I put it? The concept behind this guy is basically the standard "sniping from hiding"; I'd like to be able to pick my own boxes (hence the spells), and maybe a little bit above.

Questions:


Once I get 404, does it make sense to dump my points in more picking & disarm to get them up to 2.5x? Would those points be better spent on Hiding? Basically, once I get my spells, where do people recommend I put the extra TPs into?
Magic Item Use: I don't have it in this plan, but after reading a bit on Spellburst, is this something I should look into getting a few ranks of? How many?
Society: Do people like Sunfist? 90% of my characters in the past rolled CoL, because I loathed being tied to hunting undead. I already hate trolls and orcs, so Sunfist seems like it'd be a good fit, so long as the benefits aren't terrible compared to the other society.
Does the statblock look decent? Honestly, I'm pretty bad at eyeballing these things; I don't want to have a guy with a terrible AS, or whose mind fills up after killing 3 rats.
Would it make sense to start OHE until my 30 days are up for rat-hunting, or is it pretty easy to start off with this type of training plan out of the gate?
Finally, other than the Sunfist are there any new big mechanical changes since the last time I played (late 2007)?


Thanks everyone ahead of time.

-DrZaius

Plans look solid for the most part I think. Once you get 404, you could put more points into CM, Hiding, or stuff for locksmithing as you see fit. Reason for CM would be for the extra points to spend on more CMANS which can be of a huge help.

Society wise. GoS is great for Archers, since there is a Sigil that ignores 2nd Rank Wounds which will still allow you to fire your bow, when otherwise you normally wouldn't be able to. CoL is still good also as well, but GoS has a few nice tools for Archery types that CoL doesn't.

If you had access to Mage spells, or other defensive spells very easy at creation, I'd just go THW for the first 30 days and max your stats for Physical strength. Before your 30 days is up, change your training to what you want, along with your stats sinec you get 4 or 5 times to change them as well during that 30 day period.

I wouldn't even worry about lockpicking anyhow until level 15+, so that's another reason to just go all out Beat Down Mode.

[awol0509]

Welcome back! :)

[DrZaius]

Welcome back! :)

Thanks.

I think I may just go sword/board the first 30 days, but not bother doing the stat adjustment (just because it's not really necessary).

2x OHE, Shield, Armor Use, Ambush, Dodge, Hiding
1.5x CM, PT
1x Perception

Until my 30 days are up, then I'll switch to the plan above.

[Asha]

Are you going plate? If I was archery, I would.
I don't think there's a hiding penalty in plate either which is utterly fucking hilarious but definitely take advantage of that.

[DrZaius]

I was planning on training to Metal Breastplate; but if I had the points for plate, why not? If I make it to 100 I'll get back to you ;)

[Gibreficul]

Key to doing ranged/locksmith build is choosing open archer or stealth sniper. Either way, you want about 2.5x in either dodge or hiding, depending on which you choose. GoS build should have more PF ranks for the larger stamina pool. As an archer, CM ranks aren't important outside of learning skills from the cman list. I personally stopped at 45 CM ranks, 2 ranks mobility, 5 surge on my open archer build. If I was doing stealth, I'd continue CM training to get 5 ranks shadow mastery. OH, and the advice about level 15 to pick.. is pretty accurate. Exp isn't even given in any significant amount until you have 30 ranks in picking.

[Asha]

Gib can you say wether or not a sniper can get away with plate or is it simply a tp cost that stops it?

[DrZaius]

Key to doing ranged/locksmith build is choosing open archer or stealth sniper. Either way, you want about 2.5x in either dodge or hiding, depending on which you choose. GoS build should have more PF ranks for the larger stamina pool. As an archer, CM ranks aren't important outside of learning skills from the cman list. I personally stopped at 45 CM ranks, 2 ranks mobility, 5 surge on my open archer build. If I was doing stealth, I'd continue CM training to get 5 ranks shadow mastery. OH, and the advice about level 15 to pick.. is pretty accurate. Exp isn't even given in any significant amount until you have 30 ranks in picking.

Sounds good. I was looking into stealth sniping, so that answers my question where to put my extra TPs (into Hiding). That's interesting about CM & PT, I'll try to work more PT and fewer CM into the build. It will probably change depending on what level I get to by the time my 30 days are up. Does CM not factor into ranged ambush AS at all? Also (on picking), if I get to 2.5x, with 2x perception and 404, I presume that's going to handle about 99% of like-level boxes I'm going to run across.

[Gibreficul]

Gib can you say wether or not a sniper can get away with plate or is it simply a tp cost that stops it?

There's no direct penalty to hiding in plate. The "penalty" is in not getting any bonus if you go the armored stealth route instead of armored evasion.


********************************
Cloth Class
[grguild]>go toolbench
Rank 1, 8 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 2, 16 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 3, 24 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 4, 32 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 5, 40 bonus to stealth rolls.
********************************
Light Leather Class
Rank 1, 6 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 2, 12 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 3, 18 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 4, 24 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 5, 30 bonus to stealth rolls.
********************************
Scaled Leather Class
Rank 1, 4 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 2, 8 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 3, 12 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 4, 16 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 5, 20 bonus to stealth rolls.
********************************
Chain Class
Rank 1, 2 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 2, 4 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 3, 6 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 4, 8 bonus to stealth rolls.
Rank 5, 10 bonus to stealth rolls.
********************************
Plate Class
NO BONUS TO PLATE ARMOR ROLLS
********************************
(for the record, that's output from specialization.lic, available on the repo.)

As a stealth archer, the main reason for heavier armor is the CvA, because if you're getting hit a lot, you're doing the stealth archer thing wrong.


Sounds good. I was looking into stealth sniping, so that answers my question where to put my extra TPs (into Hiding). That's interesting about CM & PT, I'll try to work more PT and fewer CM into the build. It will probably change depending on what level I get to by the time my 30 days are up. Does CM not factor into ranged ambush AS at all? Also (on picking), if I get to 2.5x, with 2x perception and 404, I presume that's going to handle about 99% of like-level boxes I'm going to run across.

CM has no direct effect on the mechanics or ability to use ranged weapons.

On picking... 2x + selfcast lores will let you get the vast majority of your boxes. If you pursue the guild (grguild.lic, FTW, Shameless plug.) and do lockmastery, you can wedge any lock at about rank 14. That sait, if you have extra TPs to dump into going over 2x in the pick/disarm skills, I'd put most to all of them into disarm ranks to push your trap limit up. I currently have 14 more disarming ranks on my shattered rogue than I do picking ranks... for a reason. It's always the traps that getcha. Oh yea, and make sure you have some Arcane Symbols ranks in there, so you *scritch scritch* the scarabs. :club:

[Asha]

:) thanks!

[Fallen]

This is the only bit of useful information I have for you, Dr. Z.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMnG3gOqigE&feature=related

[DrZaius]

This is the only bit of useful information I have for you, Dr. Z.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMnG3gOqigE&feature=related

The origin of my username has been discovered! I'm not sure to panic or embrace it.

[Rhovan]

I'd recommend going to 90 on armor use as well. The cost isn't that much more past 80 to get that third armor adjustment rank.

[Gibreficul]

>;special eva
--- Lich: specialization active.

********************************
Cloth Class
Rank 1, 3 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 2, 6 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 3, 9 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 4, 12 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 5, 15 reduction to action penalty.
********************************
Light Leather Class
Rank 1, 2 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 2, 5 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 3, 7 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 4, 10 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 5, 12 reduction to action penalty.
********************************
Scaled Leather Class
Rank 1, 2 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 2, 4 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 3, 6 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 4, 8 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 5, 10 reduction to action penalty.
********************************
Chain Class
Rank 1, 1 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 2, 3 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 3, 4 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 4, 6 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 5, 7 reduction to action penalty.
********************************
Plate Class
Rank 1, 1 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 2, 2 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 3, 3 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 4, 4 reduction to action penalty.
Rank 5, 5 reduction to action penalty.
********************************
--- Lich: specialization has exited.

-1 Action Penalty isn't a big deal, IMHO. I've been wrong before. Continuing to 1x armor and stumbling on that 90 ranks, 3rd evasion rank... well that's all well and good. (In a locksmith's world, those ranks/levels toward cap are way better spent on maxing picking/disarming than extra armor ranks. Once again, I've been wrong before, and opinions are like assholes.)

[DrZaius]

Ok, so after playing this guy for a while, I'm considering a restat (since I still have 5 free ones) to optimize for level 50. The reasons for this are twofold. One, this guy is getting killed a lot, a problem that could be solved by better physical stats, and shorter round time (which his mediocre strength plays a factor in). Two, if I make it to cap, I should be able to afford a fixstat potion from bounty points, meaning statting for cap at the start is just making the game less fun for me. I'm posting my new potential stat block to get critiques, and to make sure I'm not messing anything major up.

Original Statblock:
Stats:
STR: 70
CON: 70
DEX: 75
AGL: 72
DIS: 80
AUR: 70
LOG: 66
INT: 65
WIS: 68
INF: 24

Proposed Statblock:
STR: 84 (Need a high strength to lower my bow's RT)
CON: 78 (Stamina points help with GoS)
DEX: 84 (Bow Aiming, Lockpicking, the works)
AGL: 80 (Slightly better at manuevers)
DIS: 88 (Double TPs, Big Mind for Hunting)
AUR: 50 (I'm only going to 404, and can get ranks of HP as needed for GoS)
LOG: 66 (Same as before)
INT: 70 (Spotting Traps)
WIS: 40 (Only Mana and MTP)
INF: 20 (Clear Dump Stat)

What do you guys think? This will push 404 back to 17, but other than that I think he'll be a much more effective hunter/picker. How would you change it/modify it? Thanks again in advance.

-DrZaius

[SpiffyJr]

Ok, so after playing this guy for a while, I'm considering a restat (since I still have 5 free ones) to optimize for level 50. The reasons for this are twofold. One, this guy is getting killed a lot, a problem that could be solved by better physical stats, and shorter round time (which his mediocre strength plays a factor in). Two, if I make it to cap, I should be able to afford a fixstat potion from bounty points, meaning statting for cap at the start is just making the game less fun for me. I'm posting my new potential stat block to get critiques, and to make sure I'm not messing anything major up.

Original Statblock:
Stats:
STR: 70
CON: 70
DEX: 75
AGL: 72
DIS: 80
AUR: 70
LOG: 66
INT: 65
WIS: 68
INF: 24

Proposed Statblock:
STR: 84 (Need a high strength to lower my bow's RT)
CON: 78 (Stamina points help with GoS)
DEX: 84 (Bow Aiming, Lockpicking, the works)
AGL: 80 (Slightly better at manuevers)
DIS: 88 (Double TPs, Big Mind for Hunting)
AUR: 50 (I'm only going to 404, and can get ranks of HP as needed for GoS)
LOG: 66 (Same as before)
INT: 70 (Spotting Traps)
WIS: 40 (Only Mana and MTP)
INF: 20 (Clear Dump Stat)

What do you guys think? This will push 404 back to 17, but other than that I think he'll be a much more effective hunter/picker. How would you change it/modify it? Thanks again in advance.

-DrZaius

Or, you could deal with the "optimal" stats and sell the fixstat for 40,000,000 silvers. That's roughly $275 depending on the market at the time.

[DrZaius]

/shrug. I just need to know if this new statblock is insane or not, really. I've died 5 times recently, all caught in hard RT when a new monster ambled in and murmaidered me.

I think I may have my Aura and Wisdom too low (Does Aura still count for both physical and mental TPs?)

-DrZaius

EDIT: I'll also add the caveat that if I cap this character, it will be my first time in the 15 years I've been playing, so that factors into my thinking for stating him for a lower optimal level.

[DrZaius]

It's been a while!
This character got me back into Gemstone, but he has been on the shelf for a few months. After a lot of soul-searching, I'm considering taking him back to ranged. This time I want to experiment with an open setup, and am interested in some feedback.

The current plan is as follows:
1x Armor
2x Ranged
1x CM (to 40-45? Mobility + Surge 5?)
2x Ambush (Do I need this past 40 ranks?)
1x PT (I'd like more since he's GoS, but points are tight. Suggestions on where to make room are welcome).
3x Dodge
2x Disarm
2x Picking
2x Perception
5 ranks climb (more climb and swim to come as needed)
6 ranks AS (might stop there, or take it to around 10 eventually)
4 ranks HP (more as needed)
404 (410 eventually?)


What are everyone's thoughts? Thank you ahead of time.
-DrZ

[waywardgs]

Archer spellrogue ftw.

[BriarFox]

If you drop your dodge to 2x and boost you MIU slightly, and use imbeds for DS, you'll free up a lot of points. You might see where that gets you.

[Gibreficul]

It's been a while!
This character got me back into Gemstone, but he has been on the shelf for a few months. After a lot of soul-searching, I'm considering taking him back to ranged. This time I want to experiment with an open setup, and am interested in some feedback.

The current plan is as follows:
1x Armor
2x Ranged
1x CM (to 40-45? Mobility + Surge 5?)
2x Ambush (Do I need this past 40 ranks?)
1x PT (I'd like more since he's GoS, but points are tight. Suggestions on where to make room are welcome).
3x Dodge
2x Disarm
2x Picking
2x Perception
5 ranks climb (more climb and swim to come as needed)
6 ranks AS (might stop there, or take it to around 10 eventually)
4 ranks HP (more as needed)
404 (410 eventually?)


What are everyone's thoughts? Thank you ahead of time.
-DrZ


Armor Use..........................| 155 55
Combat Maneuvers...................| 145 45
Ranged Weapons.....................| 208 108
Ambush.............................| 208 108
Physical Fitness...................| 181 81
Dodging............................| 226 126
Arcane Symbols.....................| 90 20
Harness Power......................| 74 16
Elemental Mana Control.............| 90 20
Disarming Traps....................| 251 151
Picking Locks......................| 220 120
Stalking and Hiding................| 155 55
Perception.........................| 210 110
Climbing...........................| 70 15
Swimming...........................| 50 10

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 4

That's my Shattered GOS locksmith open-archer rogue. Level 52. That's what I think. :club:

[Middian]

Gib,

What is the 55 ranks of stalking hiding give?

[Gibreficul]

Gib,

What is the 55 ranks of stalking hiding give?

I needed a little hiding to master subdue. 1x isn't expensive, and can come in handy. It most certainly isn't considered one of my hunting tactics on that character.