View Full Version : Violence Outside a debate in Kentucky
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-26-2010, 11:28 AM
I'm looking for more details since it seems only blogs and smaller news groups have reported on this. A moveon.org member was held down while a Rand supporter stomped on her head and neck. A Conway supporter stomped on a Rand Paul supporter's foot that was booted after a surgery and tore open her stitches.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1323919/Lauren-Valle-wrestled-ground-stomped-Rand-Paul-supporters.html
http://wtvq.com/news/5524-last-debate
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/10/25/913588/-Woman-Assaulted-and-Stomped-By-Rand-Paul-Supporters
Sad and ridiculous, all around.
ClydeR
10-26-2010, 11:52 AM
If she was there for a legitimate reason, then why was she wearing a blond wig?
ClydeR
10-27-2010, 11:09 AM
As for Profitt, he remains defiant. "I don't think it's that big of a deal," Profitt said.
And when asked if he would apologize to Valle. "I would like for her to apologize to me to be honest with you," Profitt said.
A spokesperson for MoveOn.org says Lauren Valle has been released from the hospital and is recovering from injuries including a concussion and a sprained shoulder and arm.
More... (http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/Paul_supporters_who_clashed_with_liberal_activist_ speak_out_105833648.html)
She needs to apologize. That would bring this whole matter to a close. But liberals never apologize.
Paradii
10-27-2010, 11:14 AM
I'm looking for more details since it seems only blogs and smaller news groups have reported on this. A moveon.org member was held down while a Rand supporter stomped on her head and neck. A Conway supporter stomped on a Rand Paul supporter's foot that was booted after a surgery and tore open her stitches.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1323919/Lauren-Valle-wrestled-ground-stomped-Rand-Paul-supporters.html
http://wtvq.com/news/5524-last-debate
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/10/25/913588/-Woman-Assaulted-and-Stomped-By-Rand-Paul-Supporters
Sad and ridiculous, all around.
CNN is talking about the stomping situation right now.
It looked like she was going to get curb stomped. A group of people doing that to a woman is some serious fucked up shit.
Clove
10-27-2010, 11:34 AM
CNN is talking about the stomping situation right now.
It looked like she was going to get curb stomped. A group of people doing that to a woman is some serious fucked up shit.Some women need curb stomping.
Androidpk
10-27-2010, 01:21 PM
"She's a professional at what she does," Profitt said, "and I think when all the facts come out, I think people will see that she was the one that initiated the whole thing."
He then blamed the forceful downward motion of his foot on the head of Valle as a function of chronic back pain, a claim he has made before:
"I put my foot on her, and I did push her down at the very end, and I told her to stay down. I actually put my foot on her to -- I couldn't bend over because I have issues with my back," Profitt said.
It was just back pain guys, nothing malicious here.
Cephalopod
10-27-2010, 01:22 PM
It was just back pain guys, nothing malicious here.
That clears it up. I had to shoot a bitch in the face the other day because I couldn't lift my axe above my head to get a good swing, so I know where this guy is coming from.
Clove
10-27-2010, 01:25 PM
Hey. He told her to stay down...
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 01:30 PM
I love how he's like well I couldn't bend over so I had to use my foot... Because, you know, he had every right to touch her in the first place!
This guy is a tool.
Clove
10-27-2010, 01:37 PM
The bitch wouldn't stay down. And he told her to.
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 01:39 PM
The bitch wouldn't stay down. And he told her to.
We get it already, hurrrrr, she's a woman and had it coming!1. We got it the first few times, too.
Clove
10-27-2010, 01:45 PM
We get it already, hurrrrr, she's a woman and had it coming!1. We got it the first few times, too.She should have shut up and done what she was told.
Androidpk
10-27-2010, 01:53 PM
That clears it up. I had to shoot a bitch in the face the other day because I couldn't lift my axe above my head to get a good swing, so I know where this guy is coming from.
Haha. Makes me think of Patrick Bateman and his nail gun.
Gelston
10-27-2010, 01:56 PM
We get it already, hurrrrr, she's a woman and had it coming!1. We got it the first few times, too.
http://www.stacken.kth.se/lists/best-forestry/2001-05/jpg00000.jpg
Therefore, completely justified.
Celephais
10-27-2010, 01:59 PM
Haha. Makes me think of Patrick Bateman and his nail gun.
http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af213/GuinnessKMF2/UglyBitch.gif
Cephalopod
10-27-2010, 02:15 PM
If post is even numbered, OP has big tits:
http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3660/doublesgetlong.jpg
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 02:21 PM
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/1341/mybubbles.jpg
Also:
She should have shut up and done what she was told.
You should definitely keep making slight variations of the same joke over and over again. Jokes are always more funny the tenth time than the first time, after all.
Clove
10-27-2010, 02:40 PM
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/1341/mybubbles.jpg
Also:
You should definitely keep making slight variations of the same joke over and over again. Jokes are always more funny the tenth time than the first time, after all.I can totally do that because I'm immune to sarcasm. The bitch shouldn't have worn a wig if she wasn't about to start some shit.
I wonder. How big would this story be if the violence were simply between men. The police charged a misdemeanor assault, and judging from the video that's all it looks like.
Atlanteax
10-27-2010, 03:02 PM
I can totally do that because I'm immune to sarcasm. The bitch shouldn't have worn a wig if she wasn't about to start some shit.
I wonder. How big would this story be if the violence were simply between men. The police charged a misdemeanor assault, and judging from the video that's all it looks like.
She looked like one of those man-women too. if anything, those videos should be pulled down due to public health considerations.
Definitely an overly dramatized incident.
Clove
10-27-2010, 03:06 PM
She looked like one of those man-women too. if anything, those videos should be pulled down due to public health considerations.
Definitely an overly dramatized incident.How do we know she even was a woman? It was wearing a wig after all. That could have been part of its plan in the first place...
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 03:23 PM
Definitely an overly dramatized incident.
I think it's pretty important that we don't sweep violence that happens during political events under the rug, no matter which side the victim or the aggressor is on... which is why I included that there are investigations about a Paul supporter who was also hurt in a separate incident the same evening.
Clove
10-27-2010, 03:46 PM
I think it's pretty important that we don't sweep violence that happens during political events under the rug, no matter which side the victim or the aggressor is on... which is why I included that there are investigations about a Paul supporter who was also hurt in a separate incident the same evening.I'm just saying the bitch probably deserved it.
It's interesting that the Paul supporter that was attacked isn't getting nearly as much press, though you did reference it.
Tgo01
10-27-2010, 04:02 PM
Would you two just make out already?
Cephalopod
10-27-2010, 04:04 PM
I'm just saying the bitch probably deserved it.
It's interesting that the Paul supporter that was attacked isn't getting nearly as much press, though you did reference it.
MRC has some commentary on the 'lack of coverage (http://www.mrc.org/biasalert/2010/20101026084238.aspx)':
[the Lexington, KY police department] confirmed that a second assault report was filed Monday night by a woman who said her foot was stepped on in a crowd outside the debate venue before the event. In that case, Roberts said, the victim "was unsure if it was purposeful or accidental."
Local media reports said the woman who filed the second assault report was a Paul supporter, but Roberts was unable to confirm that information. Roberts said that the woman had her foot in a cast from recent surgery and that her foot was re-injured in the incident.
You could take this to mean that the Paul supporter is not a fame whore, or more likely it wasn't a Conway supporter that stepped on her foot. I imagine if there was more to this story, Fox News would have found it.
TheEschaton
10-27-2010, 04:04 PM
What does the wig have to do with anything? Dressing up at rallies/debates/what have you happens all the time, both from supporters and critics.
Latrinsorm
10-27-2010, 04:06 PM
It's interesting that the Paul supporter that was attacked isn't getting nearly as much press, though you did reference it.This reminds me of a quote from an NFL defensive tackle recently, saying that the NFL should be just as concerned about crackback blocks as hits to the head, because they're just as dangerous. It turns out that no: someone screwing up your leg (or foot) is not as dangerous as head trauma.
Cephalopod
10-27-2010, 04:09 PM
I'm just saying the bitch probably deserved it.
It's interesting that the Paul supporter that was attacked isn't getting nearly as much press, though you did reference it.
On a second re-reading, I'm trying to figure out what point you're trying to make here.
The woman who had her head 'stomped' deserved it, so... it shouldn't be news?
The woman who had her head 'stomped' is ugly / not ladylike / wearing a wig, so... it shouldn't be news?
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 04:11 PM
Also, the foot related incident is still being investigated. The Paul supporter even said themself that they aren't sure if it was malicious or a mistake.
waywardgs
10-27-2010, 04:25 PM
Looks like assault to me. The signs and political rally and wig are irrelevant. Dude stomped her head as she was curled up and on the ground.
Clove
10-27-2010, 05:49 PM
On a second re-reading, I'm trying to figure out what point you're trying to make here.
The woman who had her head 'stomped' deserved it, so... it shouldn't be news?
The woman who had her head 'stomped' is ugly / not ladylike / wearing a wig, so... it shouldn't be news?On second re-reading you forgot how to interpret two separate paragraphs?
Oh and the bitch probably deserved it (if in fact she's a bitch).
This reminds me of a quote from an NFL defensive tackle recently, saying that the NFL should be just as concerned about crackback blocks as hits to the head, because they're just as dangerous. It turns out that no: someone screwing up your leg (or foot) is not as dangerous as head trauma.I'm pretty sure violence is equally violent (regardless of sex, race or creed).
Paradii
10-27-2010, 08:37 PM
I like blaming women just as much as the next guy, don't get me wrong, but...
what kind of behavior warranted a throwdown and stomping?
Mighty Nikkisaurus
10-27-2010, 08:42 PM
I'm pretty sure violence is equally violent (regardless of sex, race or creed).
I'm pretty sure Latrin is referring to the fact that blows to the head, neck, and back (and resulting trauma) are typically more dangerous and severe than a blow to the foot.
RichardCranium
10-27-2010, 09:05 PM
Misquote. The actual (http://bible.cc/1_timothy/6-10.htm) line is "for the love of money is the root of all evil." The love of money.. not money itself. Throws off all the intented-to-be-humorous pseudo-math. That picture has always annoyed me.
This one is much more accurate:
http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r258/bimmer318is/Shes_A_Woman.jpg
Archigeek
10-28-2010, 12:21 AM
Rather than sweeping such incidents under the rug, they should if anything get more severe punishment, as not only is it assault, it's an assault intended to shunt a right expressly guaranteed by the US constitution.
4a6c1
10-28-2010, 12:45 AM
look boobs omg WUT U SAY?! CANT HEAR YOU MY COCK IS HARD calls back later and dont speak vagina when you call so i cans listen
No but seriously. You are an irrational number. Perhaps maybe the square root of eleventy eleven.
Rather than sweeping such incidents under the rug, they should if anything get more severe punishment, as not only is it assault, it's an assault intended to shunt a right expressly guaranteed by the US constitution.
/end debate
Clove
10-28-2010, 07:29 AM
Rather than sweeping such incidents under the rug, they should if anything get more severe punishment, as not only is it assault, it's an assault intended to shunt a right expressly guaranteed by the US constitution.I disagree and I think the response was completely appropriate. Misdemeanor assault charges, fired from the campaign and banned from all future political functions of the candidate.
It was a retarded overreaction to someone who was intent on using their free speech to be as disruptive and provocative as possible in hopes of generating exactly this sort of attention. And it's the par for the course if you ask me. Plenty of missiles have been thrown at school board meetings, plenty of brawls have ensued at city council meetings, picket lines, strikes.
Archigeek
10-28-2010, 06:59 PM
I disagree and I think the response was completely appropriate. Misdemeanor assault charges, fired from the campaign and banned from all future political functions of the candidate.
It was a retarded overreaction to someone who was intent on using their free speech to be as disruptive and provocative as possible in hopes of generating exactly this sort of attention. And it's the par for the course if you ask me. Plenty of missiles have been thrown at school board meetings, plenty of brawls have ensued at city council meetings, picket lines, strikes.
I'm confused. What did I say that you disagree with? Do you think the response: stepping on her head, was appropriate or the response, "fired from the campaign and banned from all future political functions of the candidate" is the appropriate response? Or are you just disagreeing because I didn't refer to her as "the bitch"?
Honestly I have no idea what her intent was, but I doubt her plans were illegal or involved physically harming anyone. You step on someone's head in an attempt to shut down their political speech and you should be the one punished to the fullest extent of the law, regardless of which party you're associated with. I'm not a big fan of disruptive speech, but the head stomper went way to far.
Tgo01
10-28-2010, 07:34 PM
I'm confused. What did I say that you disagree with?
Probably your notion that he should receive more severe punishment because it was "an assault intended to shunt a right expressly guaranteed by the US constitution."
Mmm even MoveOn did not claim she was stomped. She had a slight headache if someone stomped her she would be in a coma. Someone put their foot on her neck to hold her down and obviously its illegal and wrong but I think its a bit blown out of proportion. There wasnt a massive violent brawl..it was a single incident of assault without injury.
Clove
10-29-2010, 03:14 PM
I'm confused. What did I say that you disagree with? Do you think the response: stepping on her head, was appropriate or the response, "fired from the campaign and banned from all future political functions of the candidate" is the appropriate response? Or are you just disagreeing because I didn't refer to her as "the bitch"?
Honestly I have no idea what her intent was, but I doubt her plans were illegal or involved physically harming anyone. You step on someone's head in an attempt to shut down their political speech and you should be the one punished to the fullest extent of the law, regardless of which party you're associated with. I'm not a big fan of disruptive speech, but the head stomper went way to far.I disagree that the we should make consequences for a misdemeanor assualt more severe because it involved free speech at a political function. Your post seemed to convey that you were dissatisfied with his punishment and believed that we ought to devise more harsher consequences.
I think the police and organization's response was appropriate; if you feel the same way then I apologize for misunderstanding you.
Archigeek
10-29-2010, 03:26 PM
I disagree that the we should make consequences for a misdemeanor assualt more severe because it involved free speech at a political function. Your post seemed to convey that you were dissatisfied with his punishment and believed that we ought to devise more harsher consequences.
I think the police and organization's response was appropriate; if you feel the same way then I apologize for misunderstanding you.
Honestly I wasn't aware that he had been punished, but I do think that the circumstances of the crime should weigh on the punishment, and it's not at all unusual in the American justice system. I get where you're coming from now though. I hadn't seen that there was any police response other than an ongoing investigation.
pabstblueribbon
10-29-2010, 03:38 PM
This reminds me of a quote from an NFL defensive tackle recently, saying that the NFL should be just as concerned about crackback blocks as hits to the head, because they're just as dangerous. It turns out that no: someone screwing up your leg (or foot) is not as dangerous as head trauma.
Knee/Leg injuries are probably less dangerous to the person, but more dangerous to their career.
TheEschaton
10-29-2010, 04:00 PM
I disagree that the we should make consequences for a misdemeanor assualt more severe because it involved free speech at a political function. Your post seemed to convey that you were dissatisfied with his punishment and believed that we ought to devise more harsher consequences.
I think the police and organization's response was appropriate; if you feel the same way then I apologize for misunderstanding you.
You realize a "shod foot" is often considered a deadly weapon, right? If this were two black kids in the ghetto, it'd A&B with a deadly weapon, 10-25.
If this were an actual stomping...which it wasnt. And it would more likely be attempted murder for kicking someone in the head repeatedly. Ive seen people with timberland spelled out backward on their face. Thats not exactly what happened here is it?
TheEschaton
10-29-2010, 04:45 PM
He pushed down on her head with his foot. Maybe you think stomping requires some sort of leg lifting, but it was reckless behavior which could have caused deadly bodily harm. I even disagree that it's misdemeanor battery, it could be easily found to be reckless and willful, and thus aggravated a&b.
Warriorbird
10-29-2010, 04:48 PM
If it was a steel toe? I could definitely see agg a&b. There was contact.
Good plan. I mean it obviously wasnt aggravated assault and battery..but hey dont let the actual law slow you down.
Latrinsorm
10-29-2010, 04:50 PM
She had a slight headache if someone stomped her she would be in a coma.Sounds like a really unpleasant episode of Mythbusters is in order!
Heh. Id watch.
Seriously though....she was not injured. I think this is a pretty big abuse of the word "stomped" there is the dictionary definition of beating someone and theres the popular culture definition of 10 people killing someone with their shoes neither really apply to this. Women gets knocked down and stepped on at Rally just isnt a great headline. I and many other people wouldn't have bothered reading the story or cared If I knew what I was about to read.
Warriorbird
10-29-2010, 05:16 PM
Good plan. I mean it obviously wasnt aggravated assault and battery..but hey dont let the actual law slow you down.
To grotesquely generalize assault is a threat with an ability to carry it out, battery is a contact.
There's quite potentially aggravating factors.
It mostly likely wouldn't be charged as that, but it is not out of the realm of the possible.
To grotesquely generalize assault is a threat with an ability to carry it out, battery is a contact.
There's quite potentially aggravating factors.
It mostly likely wouldn't be charged as that, but it is not out of the realm of the possible.
Lets state a few simple facts
1. agg assault is basic assault with the intent to cause grave bodily injury.
2. This assault occurred
3. This assault was not substantially hindered while it was being carried out.
4. The victim did not seek medical attention and claimed to be uninjured.
Now are two lawyers actually going to look at those 4 facts from a non-partisan point of view and tell me there is a realistic chance in hell that the perpetrator would face 10 years in prison for aggravated assault? Theres not even a medical report for christ sake.
Archigeek
10-29-2010, 07:07 PM
Lets state a few simple facts
1. agg assault is basic assault with the intent to cause grave bodily injury.
2. This assault occurred
3. This assault was not substantially hindered while it was being carried out.
4. The victim did not seek medical attention and claimed to be uninjured.
Now are two lawyers actually going to look at those 4 facts from a non-partisan point of view and tell me there is a realistic chance in hell that the perpetrator would face 10 years in prison for aggravated assault? Theres not even a medical report for christ sake.
Just to add, she was later taken to a hospital and found to have a minor concusion. So there's your medical report. I agree though that no one is, or should get 10 years for this. It was wrong yeah, but not anywhere close to that level of wrong.
Its still not aggravated assault. I mean have you guys watched the video? Some old dude with keds on put his shoe in her back. If thats aggravated assaulted Ive been the victim of several attempted murders in my life.
I think what he did is wrong. I just think its getting blown out of proportion.
Archigeek
10-29-2010, 07:25 PM
Its still not aggravated assault. I mean have you guys watched the video? Some old dude with keds on put his shoe in her back. If thats aggravated assaulted Ive been the victim of several attempted murders in my life.
I watched the video, and it's worse than your describing it. She's basically shoved/dragged to the ground by a number of people, and the one guy then puts his foot on the side of her head, not her back. And apparently it, or some other blow she received was enough to give her a minor concussion.
Again though, I don't think this is anything deserving of some sort of long prison term, or probably any prison term; but still, you're watering it down when you describe it. At least that's my view of it, having watched the video.
I watched the video, and it's worse than your describing it. She's basically shoved/dragged to the ground by a number of people, and the one guy then puts his foot on the side of her head, not her back. And apparently it, or some other blow she received was enough to give her a minor concussion.
Again though, I don't think this is anything deserving of some sort of long prison term, or probably any prison term; but still, you're watering it down when you describe it. At least that's my view of it, having watched the video.
His foot is clearly not on her head.
Archigeek
10-29-2010, 07:58 PM
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/10/woman-stomped-outside-rand-pau.html
On second viewing, and this time with sound, it's pretty clear that yeah, her head is stepped on. It's quite clear that his heal presses down on the side of her head while the toe of his foot is on her shoulder, and that he puts pressure down with the intent to cause harm. Fortunately he's stopped by others who are there.
Tgo01
10-29-2010, 08:07 PM
It looks like he meant to push down on her shoulder but did indeed end up stepping on her head, he then immediately places his foot back on her shoulder. Either way though that makes me sick. What it takes three grown men to pin her to the floor and you still feel the need to put your foot anywhere on her body?
4a6c1
10-29-2010, 09:01 PM
They were trying to put her in her place they just all seem to be confused about where that place may be. I can only assume by the downward motion of his foot that he thought there may actually be a kitchen under the concrete. He was just trying to break through to that and help her find it. Her head got in the way. She should probably apologize for 1)Not telling them where she kept her kitchen. 2)Putting her fetal position in the way of his well-meaning foot.
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