Basic knowledge...

[Ribbons]

Hello, hello, Ribbons here. I don't expect anyone here to know me since I've yet to make my character in-game. This particular game was recommended to me via a retired friend. He said it was interesting so I'm about to give it a shot in a while here.

Anyways, I would like to know if there's anything that can help me out here. I plan on being a Human, haven't decided on the class but I'm leaning towards Rogue.

Any tips, pointers, finger waggling would be gratefully accepted and appreciated.

(P.S. I wasn't sure where this belonged so I figured General would be alright. If not, please place the topic in an appropriate place and warn me.)

Sincerely,
~Ribbons

[Tordane]

Lots of information can be found here.

http://www.krakiipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page

Just browse around and you'll stumble upon loads of information.

[Ribbons]

Ah, thank you very much.

[Asrial]

Don't be afraid to let GemStone auto-generate your skills/stats in the beginning. You have a somewhat lengthy period of time in the beginning to re-arrange them at will.

Focus more on the experience and less on the math, for now.

[4a6c1]

I finger waggled you but you probably didnt see it. I HOPE THAT HELPED.

(welcome to pc btw)

[radamanthys]

Go fuck yourself, eat shit, and die in a fire, you grabastic fuckwad.

Or, in other words, welcome to the PC. We love each other here. Like napalm loves viet-cong children.

[RichardCranium]

I finger waggled you but you probably didnt see it. I HOPE THAT HELPED.

(welcome to pc btw)

I never see it when you finger waggle me, but I always feel it.

[AnticorRifling]

I never see it when you finger waggle me, but I always feel it.

That's because you don't have eyes in the back of your head.

[RichardCranium]

That's because you don't have eyes in the back of your head.

Oh yeah. Carry on. WAIT, not like that.

[ElvenFury]

Don't forget to check your user cp (http://forum.gsplayers.com/usercp.php) from time to time. I'm sure it will be worth your while.

[AnticorRifling]

And that wasn't even a hidden link to Lemonparty. EF you're getting soft in your old age (yes I mean your penis).

[ElvenFury]

And that wasn't even a hidden link to Lemonparty. EF you're getting soft in your old age (yes I mean your penis).
Don't worry, I put meatspin in his rep comment.

Ok, not really.


...


Shit.

http://lastpostofsanity.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/fuck_you.jpg

[Caiylania]

Don't be afraid to let GemStone auto-generate your skills/stats in the beginning. You have a somewhat lengthy period of time in the beginning to re-arrange them at will.

Focus more on the experience and less on the math, for now.

I agree. They give you a 30 day period to figure it out and that lets you dive in while you do more research if you want. Have fun and welcome to GS and PC!

[Ribbons]

Ah...meat spun...

That suuuucks.

Anyways, thank you all for greeting/helping me.

[Ribbons]

Oh, I truly don't mind. Can't go through life as a stick in the mud. Someone might fall on you and end up pretty pissed off.

Now then, don't muck with the stats till after my 30 days. Any advice on a human rogue? I did some research on Krakii, as well as here, and found the 'build' for a Two weapon combat would be rather effective. True?

[radamanthys]

Just have fun and in this group, have a sense of humor. I had to learn that one the hard way but in the end the majority are good guys that will help you out when you need it.

You spin me right 'round, baby, right 'round.

Like a record, baby.

Right 'round,

right round.

[RichardCranium]

Oh, I truly don't mind. Can't go through life as a stick in the mud. Someone might fall on you and end up pretty pissed off.

Now then, don't muck with the stats till after my 30 days. Any advice on a human rogue? I did some research on Krakii, as well as here, and found the 'build' for a Two weapon combat would be rather effective. True?

Two weapon combat, sword and shield, and archery are all viable builds. I'd recommend one of the first two for the first thirty days for the added defense.

[Caiylania]

Oh, I truly don't mind. Can't go through life as a stick in the mud. Someone might fall on you and end up pretty pissed off.

Now then, don't muck with the stats till after my 30 days. Any advice on a human rogue? I did some research on Krakii, as well as here, and found the 'build' for a Two weapon combat would be rather effective. True?

Just to be clear, you can change them 5 times IN your first 30 days. After 30 you can't touch them.

So what we are saying is enjoy the first couple weeks then start messing with the numbers. If you are good at it at all, I sucked and which I could redo mine some but I have fun :)

[Marl]

also even though you only get 5 stat changes at the inn, you get an unlimited amount of skill changes the first 30 days ;)

[Ribbons]

Ah, good to know. Thanks.

[Caiylania]

Just have fun and in this group, have a sense of humor. I had to learn that one the hard way but in the end the majority are good guys that will help you out when you need it.

Since I had to delete the original.

[Ribbons]

So um...aside from not messing with my stats (in the beginning), check the 'pedia for basic knowledge, and don't break character, is there anything else vital to know?

[Fallen]

So um...aside from not messing with my stats (in the beginning), check the 'pedia for basic knowledge, and don't break character, is there anything else vital to know?

Find the Raging Thrak(k?) in the landing, and listen carefully to what he says. You get an exp award, and some valuable advice. Make sure you complete the Sprite quest first, though. That will show you a bit more of the ropes. I think for newbies, The Order of Voln is a great society to have you continue to have goals to keep new people interested. Ask around for someone to help you get started down that path once you finish up the Sprite quest and speak with Thrak.

Use the DIR command to find things around town. Don't be afraid to ask questions here. People are always willing to help out. The Pawnshop is a great place to find a lot of good equipment when starting out.

Some basic stuff:

You can't hold mithril equipment (sword, shield, armor) until you're level 3, Ora until you're 5, Imflass until you're 7, glaes 8, and Vultite 10.

Wehnimer's Landing has the most people in it, and is probably still the best place to start out for any character. I would start there, and if you don't, try to get there as soon as you are able.

The Order of the Lorekeepers, or Mentors, are an in character group of people who are available to help out those with questions. Dir MENTOR (I believe), will direct you to their location. You ring a doorbell if one isn't around, and they will try to help you.

[Ribbons]

Ah, thank you very much Fallen.

[hectomaner]

You spin me right 'round, baby, right 'round.

Like a record, baby.

Right 'round,

right round.

sounds like you've been meatspinning lately

[Drew]

If you do decide to go to the landing, hunt rats in the catacombs, they are definitely the easiest level 1 creature and you can hunt them effectively till about level 7-8. If you don't have Lich installed you can view maps of various areas at http://gsguide.net/index.php?title=Maps_of_Elanthia

[Ribbons]

What's Lich?

[Drew]

It's an add-on that makes life easier when you play Gem. It has a point and click map, a seperate chat function, and you can do a lot of nifty things with the scripts you can download for it.

If you are interested in installing it, go here: http://lichproject.org/

[Ribbons]

Ah....I see. Thank you very much.

[Caiylania]

It's an add-on that makes life easier when you play Gem. It has a point and click map, a seperate chat function, and you can do a lot of nifty things with the scripts you can download for it.

If you are interested in installing it, go here: http://lichproject.org/

Enabler!!

~ Says the person who <3 <3 <3 Lich <3 <3 <3 ~

[Ribbons]

Is there a way to create groups? I'd like to say 'Houses' but I'm not sure if that's the correct terminology.

[Asrial]

What size group are you wanting to create?

A small group of a couple of people (for hunting)? A massive group of 20-30 people (for socializing)?

[Ribbons]

Mmm...I wanted to create sort of an RP group. Something similar to a guild, maybe?

[Methais]

Mmm...I wanted to create sort of an RP group. Something similar to a guild, maybe?

They have player run Houses in Prime. Not sure about Plat, but they're not in Shattered.

Most people just join them for the extra locker space though, and you'll rarely walk into the house and see people actually there unless they're afk.

[Ribbons]

Ah, well, that stinks. I'm sticking with the standard subscription.

Edit: Don't suppose they'd be sore at you if you made an unofficial 'House', would they?

[Fallen]

Ah, well, that stinks. I'm sticking with the standard subscription.

Edit: Don't suppose they'd be sore at you if you made an unofficial 'House', would they?

Not in the slightest. Your best bet would simply look to make friends/associates in game, and if you decide that it would enhance your roleplay, you can apply to become an MHO. It isn't hard to do, and you would receive mechanical support for your roleplay efforts in exchange for holding events that are open to the public.

This isn't a requirement by any means. You can RP any sort of group you want as long as it doesn't violate TOS (no griefing, no OOC behavior, etc).

Here is the link for more info on MHOs: https://www.play.net/gs4/pro/player_groups.asp

[Ribbons]

Ah, perfect. Thank you all for helping me so much.

If I got anymore questions I'll be sure to post them.

[Ribbons]

Is leveling your standard kill X amount of creature Y? I read the wiki and that's what it appears to be.

I know this could be answered by actually logging in but I'm settling into a new apartment and still paying off various expenses of doing so. Apologize for the simple questions.

[Some Rogue]

That's the main way to gain experience. There are others. Picking boxes, empaths can heal for it, clerics can raise, etc.

[Ribbons]

Ah. I see.

Thank you.

[Celephais]

Is leveling your standard kill X amount of creature Y? I read the wiki and that's what it appears to be.

I know this could be answered by actually logging in but I'm settling into a new apartment and still paying off various expenses of doing so. Apologize for the simple questions.

Oh boy... no it's not that simple. You kill X amount of creature Y to "fill your head" (equal level creatures = 100 exp, one level higher = 110, etc up to 150, one level lower = 90 etc until 10 levels below you gives 0 exp). Your "head" holds about 800-1000 exp, so 10 like level kills will fill your head (when you type exp it'll say stuff like 'your mind is fresh and clear' = 0 exp in head to "You can't take much more of this you must rest" (paraphrased) = full head.

Then once every minute or so (actually quasi-random 46 seconds to 76 seconds) you will "absorb" some of the exp in your head into real exp. Expect about 30 exp if you're on a node and have a full head. What this really means is that after you kill a bunch of stuff, there is forced downtime to absorb the exp (you don't have to, but for best leveling rate).

TLDR: leveling involves killing things till your head is full, then resting on a node (like a table) till your head is almost empty (various schools of thought on the best time to head back out to hunting again) and then rinse repeat.

[Ribbons]

Intriguing. I don't believe I've ever encountered a game that (almost) forces you to take time off from leveling to level better. (If I did read that properly)

I'm assuming this is to 'develop' your character not only level-wise but role play wise as well, correct?

Cheeky developers.

[Methais]

Oh boy... no it's not that simple. You kill X amount of creature Y to "fill your head" (equal level creatures = 100 exp, one level higher = 110, etc up to 150, one level lower = 90 etc until 10 levels below you gives 0 exp). Your "head" holds about 800-1000 exp, so 10 like level kills will fill your head (when you type exp it'll say stuff like 'your mind is fresh and clear' = 0 exp in head to "You can't take much more of this you must rest" (paraphrased) = full head.

Then once every minute or so (actually quasi-random 46 seconds to 76 seconds) you will "absorb" some of the exp in your head into real exp. Expect about 30 exp if you're on a node and have a full head. What this really means is that after you kill a bunch of stuff, there is forced downtime to absorb the exp (you don't have to, but for best leveling rate).

TLDR: leveling involves killing things till your head is full, then resting on a node (like a table) till your head is almost empty (various schools of thought on the best time to head back out to hunting again) and then rinse repeat.

In short, GS encourages going afk in between hunts due to its original pay-per-hour structure that was meant to keep people racking up hours on their bill, which ended in 1995 I think it was, when AOL went unlimited. Now it's just there to keep the leveling grind as slow and excruciating as possible.

The adventurer's guild is another good way to gain experience, which usually ties into your hunting routine. Think WoW type quests, i.e. kill X amount of Y creature, find X item on Y creature that you usually have to kill 34827042 of before it drops, etc.

[Celephais]

Intriguing. I don't believe I've ever encountered a game that (almost) forces you to take time off from leveling to level better. (If I did read that properly)

I'm assuming this is to 'develop' your character not only level-wise but role play wise as well, correct?

Cheeky developers.
Yes, the original excuse they used was that it forced you to stop hunting, so you could role play ... but it's a bit more like what Methais is saying.


The adventurer's guild is another good way to gain experience, which usually ties into your hunting routine. Think WoW type quests, i.e. kill X amount of Y creature, find X item on Y creature that you usually have to kill 34827042 of before it drops, etc.
Absolutely, you should always be getting adventurer guild quests, these actually let you fill your head up past the full 1000 (or whatever) amount. Basically you get your quest, do the quest, make sure your head is just below full and then turn in the quest to have 2000 exp in your head... meaning you go afk for even longer.

[Ribbons]

Ah, well, a game where everyone caps in the first 30 days is too easy (in my opinion anyways). None the less, that's a first in my gaming experience.

[Methais]

Ah, well, a game where everyone caps in the first 30 days is garbage (in my opinion anyways). None the less, that's a first in my gaming experience.

That really depends on what there is to do after you reach cap. In WoW, all the good stuff opens up after you cap. In GS, you just keep hunting the same things over and over x998477364747 forever in order to max out the other skills available to you that you don't need to begin with, since you should have most of your core skills maxed or close to it by cap, with some exceptions like being fully 3x in spells for casters, etc. Though since you were able to reach cap anyway, it's somewhat pointless. But we do it anyway because it's serious business.

[Ribbons]

Heh. I take it the game is more inclined towards the role playing crowd then the standard gamer crowd of 'lol owned your face'.

I never played WoW much since nobody I knew at the time played it. I've played Ragnarok since...closed Beta. The cap opens up a small choice of what you want to do but unless your stats were near that of Jesus Christ (over 9000) you'd be screwed into groups and guilds (Houses). I never liked that to be honest. I'd hope it's not like that in GS, is it?

[Celephais]

Heh. I take it the game is more inclined towards the role playing crowd then the standard gamer crowd of 'lol owned your face'.
... there's an odd mix, there are people who role play, never getting over level 30, and then there are people whose only goal is to get a full head of exp, and back to a node. The game itself (non-shattered) is extremely EXTREMELY anti-pvp, to the point where you can get a talking to for killing other players (even justified killings can be scrutinized), it's so bad/carebearish they might as well just not let people attack each other. So the gamer crowd is really just trying to get bigger numbers, and it's just a clock grind, difficulty plateaus to the point where if you are the right class/training you'll effectively immune to death.


I never played WoW much since nobody I knew at the time played it. I've played Ragnarok since...closed Beta. The cap opens up a small choice of what you want to do but unless your stats were near that of Jesus Christ (over 9000) you'd be screwed into groups and guilds (Houses). I never liked that to be honest. I'd hope it's not like that in GS, is it?
Cap just becomes an infinite grind of exactly the same thing over and over (there's effectively 3 hunting grounds for capped characters, if you count grimswarm camps).

[Ribbons]

Judging on what Methais said, it sounds like you have the ability to gain skills/points to add to skills. Am I correct in assuming so? If so, that seems to add a bit of...hm...diversity(that the correct word?) during that infinite capped grind.

My mistake if I'm assuming incorrectly.

To be honest I'm not much of a PvP guy, never really liked having to fight back and forth endlessly so I feel that the carebear factor won't bother me much. Plus it's kinda realistic, murder (justified or not) is looked down upon. Would be funny if the skies opened up and a big bearded man took you to a place, sat you down and started talking about how bad it was to kill someone.

[Inspire]

Heh. I take it the game is more inclined towards the role playing crowd then the standard gamer crowd of 'lol owned your face'.

I never played WoW much since nobody I knew at the time played it. I've played Ragnarok since...closed Beta. The cap opens up a small choice of what you want to do but unless your stats were near that of Jesus Christ (over 9000) you'd be screwed into groups and guilds (Houses). I never liked that to be honest. I'd hope it's not like that in GS, is it?


Why do you remind me of WIDGETS.

[RichardCranium]

Judging on what Methais said, it sounds like you have the ability to gain skills/points to add to skills. Am I correct in assuming so? If so, that seems to add a bit of...hm...diversity(that the correct word?) during that infinite capped grind.

My mistake if I'm assuming incorrectly.

This is correct. However, I think you're underestimating the grind.

[Ribbons]

I might be, I was just thinking that. Often times I get ahead of myself and begin assuming how easy something will be. Luckily my conscious drags me back to reason.

Edit: Widgets?

[Methais]

I might be, I was just thinking that. Often times I get ahead of myself and begin assuming how easy something will be. Luckily my conscious drags me back to reason.

Edit: Widgets?

Everything in GS is easy, just time consuming.

As for post cap skills, yes and no.

Yes because you can keep gaining xp and skill points post cap. No because skills max out at a certain point, i.e Wizards can train 2x per level in spell aiming, which at 100 would max them out at 202 ranks (the extra 2 ranks are from level 0 since you start at 0 instead of 1). Therefore l the xp in the universe won't allow you to train in anymore spell ranks.

The "good" part is that since few if any characters have the points do something like to triple in spells (you actually could do it but you'd be gimped from blowing off other core skills), you can eventually max it out post cap, but as I said earlier, if you were able to reach cap without that, it just becomes overkill for the most part other than your e-boner being even bigger due to your bigger numbers.

GS used to not have a level cap at all. Was good times.

And stuff.

[Ribbons]

The max rank for every skill is 200 (excluding bonuses), interesting.

I can already tell I'm gonna be addicted. The end of the month really can't seem to come fast enough.

I'll post later with any more questions I have. Thank you gentleman for all the explanations and advice.

[Celephais]

The max rank for every skill is 200 (excluding bonuses), interesting.

I can already tell I'm gonna be addicted. The end of the month really can't seem to come fast enough.

I'll post later with any more questions I have. Thank you gentleman for all the explanations and advice.

The max skill rank for any skill is based on the profession. Wizards can only 2x spell aiming. So 202 ranks is the max cap. Wizards can only single train physical training, so 101 ranks is the max cap for them. Rogues can triple train pick locks, so 303 ranks is the max for them.

Everyone can at least 1x every skill (so 101 ranks) the most any physical combat skill (AS skill) is 2x (so spell aiming, edged weapons, etc). Some skills with some professions can go to 3x, but that's the highest.

[Drew]

The max rank for every skill is 200 (excluding bonuses), interesting.


You can train in some skills 3x (mostly pures and squares). So 303 ranks with a bonus of 403.

[Ribbons]

Ah, my mistake.

Thank you for correcting me.

[Jayvn]

Yeah..plan to put in 1500 to 2000ish hours to cap? depending on gift..fried state etc...

[Swami71]

Cap just becomes an infinite grind of exactly the same thing over and over (there's effectively 3 hunting grounds for capped characters, if you count grimswarm camps).

4 hunting grounds: Nelemar, OTF, Scattered, Grimswarm. The addition of bandit tasks is a nice variety too.

[Celephais]

4 hunting grounds: Nelemar, OTF, Scattered, Grimswarm. The addition of bandit tasks is a nice variety too.

I forgot about scattered. It certainly is looking better lately, but postcap is still pretty dull considering the buildup to reach it.

[Fallen]

I forgot about scattered. It certainly is looking better lately, but postcap is still pretty dull considering the buildup to reach it.

One can only imagine dev will increasingly turn towards high end projects as people slowly accumulate high level characters.

[Celephais]

One can only imagine dev will increasingly turn towards high end projects as people slowly accumulate high level characters.

Which is just awful for the game as a whole. It's a weird state of "too much dev" in the form of people being too spread out, and too little for the sake of variety.

What they need to do is clean up the QA loop to the point where they can have a hunting ground that's dynamic to the hunters, Grimswarm are brilliant, but as far as I'm aware there is a single camp... every time. It'd be nice if GMs could introduce hunting grounds on a whim on a regular basis, with the knowledge that they are temporary (imagine if there were 20 capped hunting grounds, but at any given time only 3 were open, and it just cycled regularly, it'd keep people on their toes, and working together as needed).

[Fallen]

Which is just awful for the game as a whole. It's a weird state of "too much dev" in the form of people being too spread out, and too little for the sake of variety.

What they need to do is clean up the QA loop to the point where they can have a hunting ground that's dynamic to the hunters, Grimswarm are brilliant, but as far as I'm aware there is a single camp... every time. It'd be nice if GMs could introduce hunting grounds on a whim on a regular basis, with the knowledge that they are temporary (imagine if there were 20 capped hunting grounds, but at any given time only 3 were open, and it just cycled regularly, it'd keep people on their toes, and working together as needed).

Honestly, i've never been a proponent of making everyone gather in one place. I never really cared for the landing. I always ventured to the least populated, but functional towns. If they introduced portals, I would still likely avoid the crowd.

20 capped hunting grounds, all balanced across most professions (I suppose some being unhuntable by some is acceptable at that point), sounds like a QAer's nightmare. Talk about spread out. You would almost never be rescued if you hunted in the far flung ones. It would be nice in some ways, but no so nice in others.

I would rather they focus Dev on being able to do NEW things at cap. Things you cannot learn until you're capped. Allowing access to train in the Arcane Spell circle, for instance, would be nice. New combat maneuvers for capped characters. RP verbs and titles for capped people, etc. I think this would be the better use of development time, rather than another 7 hunting grounds.

[Celephais]

Er... I said only 3 were open at a time.

So if "Dev moves towards the high end" eventually you will see something like 20 hunting grounds, my solution was to only have 3 open at a given time (some sort of excuse like lunar cycles or whatever keeping the openings blocked off, and kicking people out when the grounds get closed). This would keep things interesting for capped players, since they wouldn't be stuck in the same rut constantly.

I know what you mean about wanting to be isolated, I like that too, I aim to isolate myself, but really when I was playing I needed to be forced into playing with others... it was a lot more fun when I did too.

[Fallen]

Er... I said only 3 were open at a time.

So if "Dev moves towards the high end" eventually you will see something like 20 hunting grounds, my solution was to only have 3 open at a given time (some sort of excuse like lunar cycles or whatever keeping the openings blocked off, and kicking people out when the grounds get closed). This would keep things interesting for capped players, since they wouldn't be stuck in the same rut constantly.

I know what you mean about wanting to be isolated, I like that too, I aim to isolate myself, but really when I was playing I needed to be forced into playing with others... it was a lot more fun when I did too.

So you're saying they would at some times close OTF, Nelemar, and the Rift? I imagine they can't close war camps or bandits. I don't think I would like that. If they had what they had open NOW, plus 3 that cycled I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm just not sure it's worth the Dev.

[Celephais]

So you're saying they would at some times close OTF, Nelemar, and the Rift? I imagine they can't close war camps or bandits. I don't think I would like that. If they had what they had open NOW, plus 3 that cycled I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm just not sure it's worth the Dev.

I was suggesting to close them, but the specifics don't matter to me. My idea was more to keep it so that capped characters can't just grind away at the same exact thing, force them out of their comfort zone. They've already capped, letting them grind comfortably is kinda dumb. I agree it's too late, people don't like their precious grind upset.

The bigger point of what I was making was to shore up the QA gap. They're always saying it's QA holding things up, and QA doesn't exactly do a great job as it is. I don't see why someone couldn't create a hunting area in a weeks time, there are plenty of creative ideas floating around they could take player suggestions, and just build a quick area and some creatures and call it done.

The game itself is a massive grind of repetitiveness, I was just trying to think of a way to make that not the case at cap, unfortunately unless they're forced too, most people would happily continue grinding away OTF if it were left open.

[Fallen]

I was suggesting to close them, but the specifics don't matter to me. My idea was more to keep it so that capped characters can't just grind away at the same exact thing, force them out of their comfort zone. They've already capped, letting them grind comfortably is kinda dumb. I agree it's too late, people don't like their precious grind upset.

The bigger point of what I was making was to shore up the QA gap. They're always saying it's QA holding things up, and QA doesn't exactly do a great job as it is. I don't see why someone couldn't create a hunting area in a weeks time, there are plenty of creative ideas floating around they could take player suggestions, and just build a quick area and some creatures and call it done.

The game itself is a massive grind of repetitiveness, I was just trying to think of a way to make that not the case at cap, unfortunately unless they're forced too, most people would happily continue grinding away OTF if it were left open.

If I could design a hunting ground, it would take a page out of the V'reen quest's book, and contain copies of all the near/capped characters in the game. Perhaps everyone that enters it for a start, then everyone that caps gets added to the list of possible spawns. The critters would have all the stats/skillsm and to some extent, gear of their RL counterparts. Just a LITTLE bit smarter than the original Vreens, and you would have one tough hunting ground. I certainly wouldn't want to run into a Sabreon or Gob clone.

The nice thing is the area would be fairly balanced. As it is often said, anyone can kill anyone at cap. It's all about who gets off the first (good) hit.

[Ribbons]

If I could design a hunting ground, it would take a page out of the V'reen quest's book, and contain copies of all the near/capped characters in the game. Perhaps everyone that enters it for a start, then everyone that caps gets added to the list of possible spawns. The critters would have all the stats/skillsm and to some extent, gear of their RL counterparts. Just a LITTLE bit smarter than the original Vreens, and you would have one tough hunting ground. I certainly wouldn't want to run into a Sabreon or Gob clone.

The nice thing is the area would be fairly balanced. As it is often said, anyone can kill anyone at cap. It's all about who gets off the first (good) hit.

That sounds like what they did in Ragnarok. When they came out with Lighthalzen they introduced a place called Biolabs. On the first floor they had simple monsters that weren't very intimidating or even hard to handle. On the second floor they introduced high level first job classes (Effectively newb characters that hit hard as hell) that gave some pretty good experience but also kept high level un-transcended classes on their toes. On the third floor they had transcended classes that varied from wizards, priests, blacksmiths, assassins, knights, and rangers. These were damned near impossible to kill solo and forced people to group up in order to grind there.

It was a perfect spot if you and your group knew what to do, not to mention the drops were pretty decent.

Worked great there, not sure here. I'd actually have to get in and see what the combat would be like before weighing in.

(I know, fairly empty and useless post.)

[Celephais]

(I know, fairly empty and useless post.)

Welcome to the PC...

[Ribbons]

Ha, I know, I know.

Well, the idea could be broken down. One the first floor (couple of floors) of a tower or dungeon or basement (etc etc) would house creatures that don't necessarily pose a life threatening fight but do pose a challenge. One the second floor (or whatever) could house 'incomplete' adventurer look a likes that are just malformed and moderately equipped. They could pose a threat to groupless fighters and such. On the last floor (or whatever) it could house the 'complete' adventurer look a likes that will whip your ass six ways to Sunday if you misstep.

Would be neat to see a town (if they don't already have one or more) that's hollow on the street level but expands into a catacombs type of dungeon that keeps these monsters there.

Just my input on the matter. Heh.

[Ribbons]

Just a race question. Are Half-Elves allowed to be in the Crimson Legion or is that for the full-blooded elves?

[Drew]

Just a race question. Are Half-Elves allowed to be in the Crimson Legion or is that for the full-blooded elves?

Is that the Vaalorian thing? If so you have to be a Vaalor full elf.

[Ribbons]

Ah, thanks Drew.

[HouseofElves]

Hello and welcome. =)

[Drew]

Ah, thanks Drew.

You don't see it much from players but half elves are actually supposed to be hated by humans and elves according to the docs. Half krolvins fill that role these days.

[Ribbons]

Ah. Interesting...

[Taluric]

Hated is a bit of a strong term with certain exceptions. Vaalor is one of those places that comes closer then most but they're like that to everyone, my pure elven bard isn't eligible for full citizenship there because his culture isn't set to Vaalor directly.

If your interested in racial relations as a half-elf...
https://www.play.net/gs4/info/tomes/halfelf_history/halfelf_races.asp

[Asha]

Wow. Still made more sense than X did.