Retrain My Empath

[StrayRogue]

So the rogue's free month is over, so I thought I'd de-moth ball the empath.

Current stats and skills are (at level 60):
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 53 (6) ... 61 (10)
Constitution (CON): 78 (14) ... 78 (14)
Dexterity (DEX): 83 (16) ... 83 (16)
Agility (AGI): 83 (16) ... 83 (16)
Discipline (DIS): 68 (9) ... 68 (9)
Aura (AUR): 92 (21) ... 92 (21)
Logic (LOG): 100 (30) ... 105 (32)
Intuition (INT): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Wisdom (WIS): 100 (25) ... 105 (27)
Influence (INF): 100 (25) ... 105 (27)
Mana: 228


Armor Use: 8
Shield Use: 62
Brawling: 68
Physical Fitness: 24
Arcane Symbols: 25
Magic Item Us: 25
Harness Power: 124
Spirit Mana Control: 24
Mental Lore - Manipulation: 5
Mental Lore - Transformation: 50
Survival: 62
Perception: 62
Climbing: 30
Swimming: 25
First Aid: 124

Spell Lists
Major Spirit: 25
Minor Spirit: 31
Empath: 81

Currently trained as a mule skinner. Solo-wise I'm plinking things to death with BS and wither. Without going with the runestaff, how can I modify my training (most likely by dumping some first aid/survival) to make myself a better hunter?

[deadly]

This is my empath at 96 heavy on the PF for GOS goodieness.

if I were to re-do yours I would ditch the shield and brawling and put more into runestaff DS and more into major spirit. when I fixskill i will have 100+major spirit 40 minor and 100+ empath. being able to knock down critters TD is really helpful. take what you can from my skills.

Armor Use..........................| 40 8
Physical Fitness...................| 397 297
Arcane Symbols.....................| 120 30
Magic Item Use.....................| 120 30
Spell Aiming.......................| 298 198
Harness Power......................| 198 98
Elemental Mana Control.............| 90 20
Mental Mana Control................| 160 60
Spirit Mana Control................| 90 20
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 165 65
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 160 60
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 50 10
Mental Lore - Telepathy............| 140 40
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 160 60
Perception.........................| 102 24
Climbing...........................| 70 15
Swimming...........................| 150 50
First Aid..........................| 397 297
Trading............................| 25 5

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 52

Spell Lists
Minor Spirit.......................| 40

Spell Lists
Empath.............................| 122

[Kithor]

For starters, FA and Survival count equally for skinning, so it's cheaper on TPs to 3x FA before getting any survival, the only reason to get survival before you're at 3x FA is if you want it for other things like foraging and weather effects.

Your training looks pretty solid, the only things I can suggest if you wanted to focus on hunting more would be drop the lores, drop brawling down to 40 ranks, drop perception to .5x, and put all the extra points into spells.

Personally I'm a fan of utility more than power, so I went a much different route. My CS is only 469 at cap which I can hunt OTF with fine, but I doubt I'd be able to do well in Nelemar or the new Rift areas.

Kithor (at level 100), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 40 8
Physical Fitness...................| 302 202
Arcane Symbols.....................| 201 101
Magic Item Use.....................| 201 101
Spell Aiming.......................| 302 202
Harness Power......................| 201 101
Elemental Mana Control.............| 102 24
Mental Mana Control................| 201 101
Spirit Mana Control................| 201 101
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 271 171
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 155 55
Mental Lore - Telepathy............| 140 40
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 30 6
Survival...........................| 150 50
Perception.........................| 150 50
Climbing...........................| 140 40
Swimming...........................| 140 40
First Aid..........................| 403 303
Trading............................| 25 5

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 40
Minor Spirit.......................| 40
Empath.............................| 121
Training Points: 197 Phy 0 Mnt (2180 Phy converted to Mnt)

[WRoss]

Strength (STR): 53 (6) ... 61 (10)
Constitution (CON): 78 (14) ... 78 (14)

This is going to be a problem...But, Kithor has some good advice. Pretty solid base package and all-around casting abilities there. That will leave you with lots of room to play with things at cap. Also, with how heavy you emphasized mental training points, you should have a bit more MTP than he does, so you'll likely be able to add on a few extra spells here and there. Might want to shoot for 2.5x if you are going to cast or use 1110.

[Buckwheet]

Could also use some advice as I have a fixskill I haven't used and with the new one coming up would be interested to hear some thoughts.

Already like the one about dropping survival for more FA.



Armor Use..........................| 40 8
Shield Use.........................| 201 101
Brawling...........................| 201 101
Physical Fitness...................| 403 303
Arcane Symbols.....................| 120 30
Magic Item Use.....................| 120 30
Harness Power......................| 201 101
Mental Mana Control................| 201 101
Spirit Mana Control................| 102 24
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 136 38
Mental Lore - Telepathy............| 25 5
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 160 60
Survival...........................| 201 101
Perception.........................| 120 30
Climbing...........................| 120 30
Swimming...........................| 150 50
First Aid..........................| 302 202

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 66

Spell Lists
Minor Spirit.......................| 67

Spell Lists
Empath.............................| 140

[Kithor]

you seem to know what you want to do and are already doing it. I'd consider dropping the Manipulation lore, the instant-kill chance with 1106/1115 isn't great and with no spell aiming I doubt you use 1110 (and even if you did, it doesn't look like you'd need the TD pushdown for it). Speaking of which, why the telepathy lore if you have no spell aiming? Generally the only reason I see Empaths with Telepathy Lore is for 1110.

If you're going for more offense more spells or some summoning lore for that extra damage cycle on Wither (it takes 150 ranks to guarantee it, so probably not worth getting a few ranks if you're not going for a lot).

If you're going for more survivability get that perception up to 1x, it helps reduce the DS pushdown from getting ambushed by things like Ithzir Scouts (and other players?) and I'm told it also helps against the charge ability of creatures in Nelemar and elsewhere.

Lastly, at cap you have no RT from healing wounds without any lore. Having no RT healing scars is nice, but if you're going to 303 ranks FA you'll have 3 second RTs to heal minor scars with herbs, 5 seconds to heal major scars (I think?) with herbs, and 10 seconds to regrow a limb with Sovyn Clove. If you don't heal a lot, using the TPs elsewhere might be worth it. I *do* heal a lot and I still go the herbs/no transformation lore route. My summoning lore lets me summon what I need if it can be grown. For me the extra points is well worth the minimal wait time.

[Buckwheet]

So your opinion is that I could drop all the lores as the benefit I am seeing is marginal to non-existent, and that more spells or summon lore would be better?

The reason perception is a bit low is because I hunt in a group with a paladin/cleric so that I get very nice group spells and DS pushdown is not a major problem. So I am able to fudge this a bit.

At one time I was going to go for spell aiming which is why I picked up the 5 ranks early on, but then they announced how PT affects maneuver attacks and I went 3x in that instead.

[StrayRogue]

Fiddled with my training. Lost SMC, gained MMC (for BS), dropped FA down to 1x, pushed Pt to 1x.

Armor Use..........................| 40 8
Shield Use.........................| 163 63
Brawling...........................| 169 69
Physical Fitness...................| 163 63
Arcane Symbols.....................| 105 25
Magic Item Use.....................| 105 25
Harness Power......................| 226 126
Mental Mana Control................| 163 63
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 25 5
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 145 45
Survival...........................| 163 63
Perception.........................| 163 63
Climbing...........................| 120 30
Swimming...........................| 105 25
First Aid..........................| 163 63

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 25

Spell Lists
Minor Spirit.......................| 31

Spell Lists
Empath.............................| 82


I'm probably going to go Warpuff once I've earned enough for a fixstat. Is it GoS all the way for Warpuff? And do they just swing away? No prep?

[Orp]

well if you are looking to go warpuff I would suggest dropping lores and first aid unless you are dead set on skinning....but thats me, my build is deadly with Voln, You do not see Orp die alot
Orpius (at level 100), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 40 8
Shield Use.........................| 201 101
Combat Maneuvers...................| 195 95
Edged Weapons......................| 201 101
Brawling...........................| 201 101
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 5 1
Physical Fitness...................| 300 200
Arcane Symbols.....................| 102 24
Magic Item Use.....................| 102 24
Harness Power......................| 201 101
Mental Mana Control................| 201 101
Spirit Mana Control................| 201 101
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 90 20
Perception.........................| 302 202
Climbing...........................| 105 25
Swimming...........................| 145 45

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 67

Spell Lists
Minor Spirit.......................| 67

Spell Lists
Empath.............................| 166

[StrayRogue]

Well I can't go warpuff with my current stats. I figure I'll be close to capping by time I've ground a mil bounty points, so I'll retrain then.

[Kithor]

So your opinion is that I could drop all the lores as the benefit I am seeing is marginal to non-existent, and that more spells or summon lore would be better?

Correct, I use 1110 a LOT (web bolt works really well with it, keeps things ensnared long enough to go through 3 CS cycles usually) which is the main reason I've kept my manipulation lore and the only reason I have 40 ranks in Telepathy.

Summon Lore has a lot of really useful benefits, but IMO it's only really worth it if you plan to reach the 100-150 ranks range... web bolt, area web, area silence, summon specific herbs with 1118, locate cross-realm, web bolt, increase TD pushdown with 212/216/217, increased DF and burst effect for 111, increased effectiveness from 240, extra damage cycle on Wither, better landing spots from 130, increased chance to sanct.. oh and did I mention web bolt? I would train in summoning lore solely for web bolt, even if you removed the benefits to every other spell that I know. I mostly solo hunt so it's more useful for keeping things occupied while I kill them or other things in the room, but even when I do group hunt web bolt is my spell of choice. (very low chance of one-shot kill, high knockdown rate, potential for a guaranteed web and only costs 9 mana for the bolt version.)

[Orp]

I use 1106 almost exclusivly most of my kills are one shot with no lores 6 mana I can stay and hunt for 45 min not run out of mana, I brawl as well so even if I run out of mana I can kick it to death lores 1110 web imo all mana intensive, I also can swing if I run out of mana, however that happens so rarely I can count it on my fingers.

[Kithor]

It can be a bit mana intensive, but I don't use that on everything.. as a general rule if a creature can be stunned I solely use 1106, if not I use either 1115 or 118+1110 depending on DS. Here's my general hunting strategy for OTF:

1106 for adepts and seers (1115 for seers sometimes since they don't stun and I hate their mass spirit dispel)
118 + 1110 for war griffins (usually followed up with 2-3 casts of 1101 to finish it off, if I didn't skin all my griffins I'd finish with 1106)

I generally just ignore janisarries, initiates, scouts and heralds but I'll throw a bone shatter at a scout, initiate or herald that I just want to keep stunned for a while, and I'll throw 118+1110 at a janisarry that I don't want to give the chance to disarm me (my CS cycles will kill it without any followup)

For bandits I need to keep them under control 'cause CMANs rape me so it's: web bolt everything, empathic assault everything, fire spirit to burn up all the webs and stun everything. Open with a Sympathy for groups of four or if I get into some trouble.