Returning, I think -- Stat and Training Thoughts

[Cacklewack]

So I'm thinking of returning with my level 36 Rogue, Frozz. I created him 13 years ago I believe when I was about 14 years old. I'm guessing I either auto assigned them or looked at a guide. Now I'm curious as to what my best option will be -- rerolling or sticking with these stats. From looking at other builds they don't look absolutely worthless, but I'd certainly like to see them shifted around a bit.

Level 0 Stats for Frozz, Dwarf Rogue

Strength (STR): 75
Constitution (CON): 65
Dexterity (DEX): 80
Agility (AGI): 80
Discipline (DIS): 70
Aura (AUR): 80
Logic (LOG): 70
Intuition (INT): 65
Wisdom (WIS): 55
Influence (INF): 20


Name: Frozz Stwazz Race: Dwarf Profession: Rogue (shown as: Sapper)
Gender: Male Age: 60 Expr: 1430369 Level: 36
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 92 (31) ... 92 (31)
Constitution (CON): 81 (30) ... 81 (30)
Dexterity (DEX): 91 (20) ... 96 (23)
Agility (AGI): 92 (16) ... 97 (18)
Discipline (DIS): 82 (26) ... 82 (26)
Aura (AUR): 87 (8) ... 87 (8)
Logic (LOG): 82 (21) ... 82 (21)
Intuition (INT): 81 (15) ... 81 (15)
Wisdom (WIS): 64 (7) ... 64 (7)
Influence (INF): 41 (-14) ... 41 (-14)

Skills:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 130 35
Shield Use.........................| 136 38
Combat Maneuvers...................| 152 52
Edged Weapons......................| 176 76
Ambush.............................| 175 75
Physical Fitness...................| 150 50
Dodging............................| 174 74
Arcane Symbols.....................| 66 14
Harness Power......................| 20 4
Disarming Traps....................| 182 82
Picking Locks......................| 182 82
Stalking and Hiding................| 177 77
Perception.........................| 152 52
Climbing...........................| 50 10
Swimming...........................| 20 4
Pickpocketing......................| 175 75

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 4
Training Points: 4 Phy 36 Mnt
(Use SKILLS BASE to display unmodified ranks and goals)

I'll likely be going TWC in the near future as I figure out how to train. I've got a fixskills available, obviously. I'd basically like to focus on hunting and picking, dropping shield and pickpocketing.

Thoughts?

Thanks,
Frozz

[BriarFox]

Those stats look pretty nice, actually. For TWC, your important stats are STR and DEX, and for Picking, DIS. You're good on all of them, and your AGI, CON, LOG and so forth, which are important for various other things, are all on par, too.

[Bobmuhthol]

Wouldn't you still have a FIXSTAT available too, or did those expire?

[Cacklewack]

Those stats look pretty nice, actually. For TWC, your important stats are STR and DEX, and for Picking, DIS. You're good on all of them, and your AGI, CON, LOG and so forth, which are important for various other things, are all on par, too.

Glad to hear it. I was dreading the possibility of rerolling or forking out 30 million for a potion...

What are your thoughts on re-training for TWC when I use fixskill? I am totally out of the loop when it comes to new mechanics, skills, etc. Are there any guides or brief summaries of stats as they relate to skills nowadays? I've scoured the forum a bit and found some information.

Thanks,
Frozz

[Cacklewack]

Wouldn't you still have a FIXSTAT available too, or did those expire?

Don't seem to have a fixstat available. When were they available?

Frozz

[BriarFox]

Glad to hear it. I was dreading the possibility of rerolling or forking out 30 million for a potion...

What are your thoughts on re-training for TWC when I use fixskill? I am totally out of the loop when it comes to new mechanics, skills, etc. Are there any guides or brief summaries of stats as they relate to skills nowadays? I've scoured the forum a bit and found some information.

Thanks,
Frozz

You're a rogue, so something like:

2x edged (or blunt)
1.5x-2x TWC
1x Ambush
1x-2x CM
2x-3x Hiding
As much MOC as you can manage


If you're going hardcore lockpicking, you're going to have to make some sacrifices in combat skills.

[Cacklewack]

Thanks,

Presently I'm using a 6X handaxe and a shield. As I switch to TWC I'll need to get another weapon. If I'm planning to stick with this boring axe, it sounds like I'll need to get something at a similar or lower weight and speed, correct? I quite like axes, but I'd certainly ponder blunt weapons as well. Any reccomendations on weapon pairings? Do remember that I'm a dwarf, if that has any bearing...

I'll likely be selling some items soon to acquire some new weapons...:)

Cheers,
Frozz

[BriarFox]

You could do double axes, but you'd have a high RT, since your AgiDex score isn't high enough to cancel it out (if I recall without looking up the math). Check out dual longswords, or axe and dagger or axe and shortsword or such.

[Endlin]

Shize would have some good advice for you too... If you happen to encounter him. He's a TWC rogue and does it quite well. He also posts here so maybe he'll chime in.

[TyrilPraedus]

go bow

[DoctorUnne]

Shize would have some good advice for you too... If you happen to encounter him. He's a TWC rogue and does it quite well. He also posts here so maybe he'll chime in.

I've done TWC with two axes from 0 to 84 and always found myself able to hunt like level easily. The base RT is 8 seconds, which you can reduce to 5 with a combined AGI/DEX bonus of +38. However, the bigger benefit to using two heavy weapons like axes is in mstriking, since the mstrike RT is capped. For two axes it's 11 seconds which I've reduced to 8 with my +38 AGI/DEX bonus. MOC is incredibly expensive for a rogue, so you probably can't train in it as much as I did unless you forgo locksmithing (which I did). But I can kill any single monster in one shot with a focused mstrike after feinting it to get it in offensive. If I need speed I can hide and ambush, but mstrike makes me a lot more viable in the open than a traditional rogue. Some other recommendations which I think provide good synergies with this build if you are interested in it:

- MOC, as much as you can afford. 4x focused / 6x unfocused with two weapons is the same as 8x/12x
- 2x dodge at a minimum. Since you have no shield there is no penalty to the dodge bonus and you get the most DS out of your dodge ranks
- Plate-class armor, since you will be in the open a lot and you will take hits. I recommend MBP since it has the protection and CvA of plate with a much lower action penalty than full plate
- Flaring weapons, with every mstrike I get a minimum of one flare, sometimes two. More swings = more flare damage and stuns. You don't need weighted weapons since ambushing crit weighting dwarfs any weighting you could get on a weapon
- Flaring armor. Again, you will get hit but you will have great redux, which is why I don't recommend crit padding. It won't even activate on the vast majority of hits you take. So many times I've been put into a shitload of RT by bandits but survived because my armor stuns them all
- A high AS. TWC is an offensive mentality, not a defensive mentality. I have +31 AS in enhancives, rank 5 wspec, rank 5 surge and swing at 479 in the rift which allows no outside spells. With strength and a pure potion that's 509, and I'm not even close to 2x CM (because MOC is so expensive). Your goal is to kill the thing before it has a chance to attack.

That's all I can think of for now. When I was lower level, everyone told me that two axes wouldn't work because it's too slow and gives no defense. In my opinion the changes to mstrike negate the speed disadvantage and the defense is rarely an issue because the population is low enough that I'm usually the only one in a hunting area. If the monster is by itself I kill it and 95% of the time won't be caught in the open in offensive. If it's not I patiently wait until it is. And if I do get caught in the open, that's what plate armor and warrior-quality redux are for.

You may ask why didn't I just roll a warrior? Two reasons: 3x dodge provides ridiculous defense and the crit weighting from ambush is amazing. With handaxes you can one-shot anything, from WoF-carrying pures to things in plate. And when ambushing is ineffective (like with non-corporeal undead) you can bust out feint, focused mstrike, and still one-shot it.

Shize

[AnticorRifling]

But if you focus mstrike something is it still a one-shot?!

[DoctorUnne]

Ha, yeah I guess I meant you can six-shot it, which only sucks if the thing's wearing cloak of shadows. The other nice thing about focused mstrike is you stun or prone it with an early swing and then all subsequent swings get the stunned/prone DS reduction, which makes heavy hits and crits more likely. Good against stuff that shakes stuns.