Blindness

[Revalos]

OK, so since I got pwned with my lack of David Paterson "always talkin' 'bout his blindness" knowledge over in the politics topic maybe I am not grasping something about it that makes it so overpowering to me...

How do the blind work out? Are there special machines? Do they even care what they look like since they have no idea?

How do they choose something to eat if they've never tried it before?

If they travel somewhere new, like a foreign country, do they enjoy it or is it really frustrating?

I was thinking that a blind astronaut would be the perfect candidate for a Mars mission. No sensory deprivation problems for the 6 month trip whatsoever. They wouldn't need to install lights in the craft and could save on weight and power.

I really want to just talk to someone who is blind about this, but it seems like it would be really awkward to ask these kinds of questions.

[Androidpk]

Ask Tucker Max.

[Celephais]

Someone here has a sister whose blind ... I even think they played a MUD of some sort, because I remember them mentioning screen readers and how it's not unheard of for the blind to play MUDs because of them.

[waywardgs]

Someone here has a sister whose blind ... I even think they played a MUD of some sort, because I remember them mentioning screen readers and how it's not unheard of for the blind to play MUDs because of them.

There are (or have been) a few people who play GS this way.

[AnticorRifling]

OK, so since I got pwned with my lack of David Paterson "always talkin' 'bout his blindness" knowledge over in the politics topic maybe I am not grasping something about it that makes it so overpowering to me...

How do the blind work out? Are there special machines? Do they even care what they look like since they have no idea?



I don't think it would be that difficult. Working out isn't serious hand eye coordination. It's lift the heavy shit properly.

[Liagala]

How do the blind work out? Are there special machines? Do they even care what they look like since they have no idea?
Why do you care what you look like? Is it that you work out to stay in shape, be healthy, and to look good for others (as well as yourself)? Blind people would have those same desires. Blind people can also feel their own bodies, just like sighted people. If you are overweight and close your eyes, does that make you feel any different when you're taking a shower?


How do they choose something to eat if they've never tried it before?
How do you choose something to eat that you've never tried before? Blind people miss out on the visual, but they're still more than capable of smelling the food, or having a friend suggest it - just like you. I try new things on recommendation more than visual appeal, personally. Many people do.


If they travel somewhere new, like a foreign country, do they enjoy it or is it really frustrating?
Yes, traveling in a foreign country would be incredibly frustrating for a blind person. One of the major rules of life for the blind is to know exactly where things are - you need to know how many steps from your couch to the doorway, in which direction, and how many steps from there to the kitchen sink, etc. Navigation is very precise, when you can't see. There's no possible way to know that sort of thing about a foreign country (or even a foreign neighborhood). A seeing-eye dog or even a cane can help, and is usually enough close to home, but for trips anywhere far away, extra help would be needed. A LOT of extra help would be necessary if you went somewhere you don't even speak the language.


I was thinking that a blind astronaut would be the perfect candidate for a Mars mission. No sensory deprivation problems for the 6 month trip whatsoever. They wouldn't need to install lights in the craft and could save on weight and power.
The biggest problem with a trip to Mars is the same 5 (ish) people seeing nothing but each other, day in and day out. They speak to no one else, they hear from no one else, they can't go anywhere or do anything, and they eventually end up at each other's throats. The Russians tried an experiment with this, and it failed miserably. This would be a problem no matter who's in the mission, blind or not.

As far as saving money on lights - are they going to build the ship in the dark too? It would be foolish to completely revamp the building plans, drawing up brand new ones, just to take out some track lighting. It wouldn't be worth the weight/power savings, IMO. I could be wrong on that part though, since I don't build spaceships for a living.


I really want to just talk to someone who is blind about this, but it seems like it would be really awkward to ask these kinds of questions.
I'm not blind, but my father was. Ask away... but I think if you pondered a couple of the above for a few minutes, you wouldn't have had to ask them. There's a lot more to life than seeing, even for non-blind people.

[AnticorRifling]

Do deaf people think that people with large hands are yelling?

[Celephais]

The Russians tried an experiment with this, and it failed miserably.
The result, real world moscow.

[Revalos]

Why do you care what you look like? Is it that you work out to stay in shape, be healthy, and to look good for others (as well as yourself)? Blind people would have those same desires. Blind people can also feel their own bodies, just like sighted people. If you are overweight and close your eyes, does that make you feel any different when you're taking a shower?

Working out to stay healthy, sure, but would they go to a gym? Maybe I'm biased here, but I feel like I have to have a definition of "unhealthy" to go by as a standard. Do the blind have a standard like this?



How do you choose something to eat that you've never tried before? Blind people miss out on the visual, but they're still more than capable of smelling the food, or having a friend suggest it - just like you. I try new things on recommendation more than visual appeal, personally. Many people do.

I guess I'm just visually focused, and I'd surely take a friend's recommendation, but I'd want that other source of knowledge about what it looks like. Take gumbo for example. How do you explain that to someone who can't see it? I am jealous that the blind likely have really really sensitive taste buds though.



The biggest problem with a trip to Mars is the same 5 (ish) people seeing nothing but each other, day in and day out. They speak to no one else, they hear from no one else, they can't go anywhere or do anything, and they eventually end up at each other's throats. The Russians tried an experiment with this, and it failed miserably. This would be a problem no matter who's in the mission, blind or not.

As far as saving money on lights - are they going to build the ship in the dark too? It would be foolish to completely revamp the building plans, drawing up brand new ones, just to take out some track lighting. It wouldn't be worth the weight/power savings, IMO. I could be wrong on that part though, since I don't build spaceships for a living.


I was thinking more like a single blind astronaut, or maybe two. And it isn't a question of saving money, it is weight and fuel consumption saved without the added electricity I was thinking about. Sure LEDs use hardly any power, but there usually are a ton of them. And the ship could be built with temporary lights while they were working on it. Maybe Mars is too well understood of a journey with stuff already planned and someone could eventually get enough training...but what about further travel? Something that might take years and every ounce of fuel saved would be valuable.



I'm not blind, but my father was. Ask away... but I think if you pondered a couple of the above for a few minutes, you wouldn't have had to ask them. There's a lot more to life than seeing, even for non-blind people.

I actually did think of a lot more that I already answered myself. This was really spur of the moment stuff I started thinking about when I was reading the Paterson thread. Since it was your dad who was blind I don't know if you can help with the other question of how stupid it would be to ask these kinds of questions to a blind person. Do they care if I am curious or does it seem like I am singling them out? If they mess something up, should I try to help or would that be demeaning?

[Kuyuk]

Blind people dont mind having yellow plates though.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Just because someone is blind doesn't mean they'd do well going multiple years without any human interaction. There are more senses than just sight and spending years alone in a little box without anyone for company, or just one other person, would be extremely mentally taxing.

I'm legally blind without contacts in- I can hardly see my hand in front of my face without corrective lens, the world is basically a wash of blended colors.. I hate taking my contacts out even to sleep because I hate the idea of something happening and me not being able to see immediately.

As far as choosing stuff without being able to see it- you would describe something like gumbo by describing the ingredients. The blind person knows what everything is, it's just that when you say each thing instead of stimulating a visual memory of something you'll be stimulating a taste memory instead. It's not just blind people though- there are a lot of people out there who have fine vision and yet smell is their strongest memory mechanism.

[thefarmer]

Take gumbo for example. How do you explain that to someone who can't see it?

Who cares if they can't see it? The whole point of gumbo is what it tastes like.

[Celephais]

Just because someone is blind doesn't mean they'd do well going multiple years without any human interaction. There are more senses than just sight and spending years alone in a little box without anyone for company, or just one other person, would be extremely mentally taxing.
No no no, you missed the whole point, they're blind, so they can't see, so you just don't tell them they're going to mars, you put them on a rocket and you can have a microphone and speakers, when they ask what that gigantic explosion and sudden massive g-force was, you tell them you had beans last night. They can still talk to people, and you pretend you're right there next to them, so they can hear you ... and you can put something like a dead dog next to them, then they can think they're actually touching and smelling a human too. Don't worry about the fact that the reason they send manned missions is because they need someone able to react and adapt to any situation and properly assess issues in real time, it'll be like Mr. Magoo, they'll just use their blind luck to have things work out.

Can you imagine how much electricity that would save? I don't think blind people use as much oxygen either, so you can probably cut out a few CO2 scrubbers, and a blind person wouldn't need to clean up after themselves cause they wouldn't be able to tell, so no need for toilet paper.

Blind people are ideal space explorers.

[Celephais]

http://fast1.onesite.com/capcom-unity.com/user/inkblotgod/980016a0177c8420c97d3a2cf2017bf4.jpg

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

No no no, you missed the whole point, they're blind, so they can't see, so you just don't tell them they're going to mars, you put them on a rocket and you can have a microphone and speakers, when they ask what that gigantic explosion and sudden massive g-force was, you tell them you had beans last night. They can still talk to people, and you pretend you're right there next to them, so they can hear you ... and you can put something like a dead dog next to them, then they can think they're actually touching and smelling a human too. Don't worry about the fact that the reason they send manned missions is because they need someone able to react and adapt to any situation and properly assess issues in real time, it'll be like Mr. Magoo, they'll just use their blind luck to have things work out.

Can you imagine how much electricity that would save? I don't think blind people use as much oxygen either, so you can probably cut out a few CO2 scrubbers, and a blind person wouldn't need to clean up after themselves cause they wouldn't be able to tell, so no need for toilet paper.

Blind people are ideal space explorers.

:rofl:

You forgot to mention that blind people won't eat much because they can't see how much they're eating and won't know they were sent with minimal rations!

[Celephais]

No need for space exercise equipment, let them get fat as fuck, who cares.

Take the moon landing for example, the biggest problem w/ the lunar lander wasn't having it leave the module and land on the moon, it was actually lifting back off the moon and re-engaging with the module. If we sent a Blind "person" (it's cute when they think they're 'people'), we could have just left them on the moon, because blind people don't have loved ones, so no one would complain.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

But you save more money if you cut down to starvation rations. They won't see their wasting bodies so they won't realize what's going on. Leaving them behind also means no return rations! More savings!

We should totally go to work for NASA.

[Revalos]

Yes, yes I deserve all of this.

[Liagala]

Working out to stay healthy, sure, but would they go to a gym? Maybe I'm biased here, but I feel like I have to have a definition of "unhealthy" to go by as a standard. Do the blind have a standard like this?
They have the same standard you do. Their doctors give them just as much crap if they put on a few pounds, and their husbands/wives are just as appreciative when they look great. Next time you're in the shower, close your eyes and actually notice what your body feels like while you're cleaning up. Yes, I know someone's going to make an assortment of sexual jokes here, but that's okay. Do you feel soft and squishy? Toned? All muscle-bound? Congratulations, you've just stood naked in front of a mirror, blind guy style.


I guess I'm just visually focused, and I'd surely take a friend's recommendation, but I'd want that other source of knowledge about what it looks like. Take gumbo for example. How do you explain that to someone who can't see it? I am jealous that the blind likely have really really sensitive taste buds though.
They're not guaranteed to have very sensitive taste buds, you know. Their other senses do tend to sharpen to compensate for lack of vision, but it's hearing and touch that they rely on most. And like Nikki said, when someone describes the ingredients, they'll know just as well whether they like it or not as you would looking at it. Try closing your eyes and "picturing" the taste of stuff. You do it with conscious effort, they do it without thought. It's the same thing though.


the other question of how stupid it would be to ask these kinds of questions to a blind person. Do they care if I am curious or does it seem like I am singling them out? If they mess something up, should I try to help or would that be demeaning?
For asking questions, it's not something you should just go up and accost a random blind dude about, but if you find yourself in a friendly situation, it probably wouldn't bother them much if you asked. Go with your judgement of the person, the same way you'd go with your judgement when you want to buy a girl a drink at a bar. If she's looking at her watch and edging away from you, you're not going to continue the conversation. If she seems interested, you will. Same deal. Start with something innocent, and if they seem okay talking about it, ask questions. A lot of people with disabilities are pretty open to talking about them, if you avoid a) making fun, and b) being condescending or making them feel useless.

For helping... do the same you'd do with anyone else. If it looks like they need help, offer. If they accept, great. If they don't, let them do it themselves (even if you think they can't. Pride is tough to come by when you're disabled). Offering is never a bad thing.

Seriously though... think about stuff. If you could conceivably do it with your eyes closed, they can do it. If there's a situation (like being alone for years on a mission to Mars or weighing 500 pounds) that you wouldn't like with your eyes open, chances are you're not going to like it any better with your eyes closed.

[Celephais]

If there's a situation that you wouldn't like with your eyes open, chances are you're not going to like it any better with your eyes closed.
I bet going to the goatse website is just as traumatic for them as it is for real people.

[Revalos]

Thanks Liagala. I think cabin fever is getting to me and that's making me incapable of thinking about things rationally.

[Cephalopod]

I bet going to the goatse website is just as traumatic for them as it is for real people.

You should see that site in braille.

[Liagala]

You should see that site in braille.

QFT

Edit: Also, quite appropriate with my sig quote.

[Asile]

I can't answer the other questions, but I know there's at least one blind person that works out at the gym where I work. She gets one of the fitness staff to start the treadmill for her, since the buttons aren't raised, and then goes on about her exercising. So yes, some do go to the gym.

A few years ago, our Red Cross chapter did a series of swim lessons at the Virginia Rehabilitation Center for the Blind and Visually Impaired, and I really wish I'd been able to help with that. All the instructors who helped with those classes said they had a great time. As it is, the segment on Adaptive Aquatics (simulating various disabilities and impairments such as being blind, deaf, having Autism, etc) is one of my favorite parts when I teach the Water Safety Instructor class.

[Celephais]

I bet it's really easy to get blind people to do an atomic situp.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I bet it's really easy to get blind people to do an atomic situp.

I didn't know you were ever on a swim team!

[LMingrone]

My sister is 100% blind. She doesn't use a cane or a dog. She has traveled all over the world, by herself in most cases. I have no clue how she does it. She used to be on a baseball team and regularly rode her bike by herself. She also figured out some way to navigate the T in Boston on a daily basis. Crazy shit.

"If they travel somewhere new, like a foreign country, do they enjoy it or is it really frustrating?"

She actually got to touch some of the most famous statues and paintings all over Europe. They don't let us normals do that. Pretty fucking cool. And I'm the one whose sister plays MUDs with a talking computer.

[Celephais]

Is she hot? Cause I'm pretty sure I could tell her I'm Brad Pitt and she wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

On a more serious note I was always interested in the Fox Trot comics where Peter is dating Denise (the blind girl). It always kind of struck me as the type of relationship where all that superfluous bullshit goes out the window (the comic plays it pretty cool usually, I didn't even realize she was blind until after I read the first few anthologies ... I was pretty young and oblivious, I didn't get half of the C&Hs I read at that age).

http://i46.tinypic.com/viec7p.gif
(I don't have all the Fox Trots ingrained in my brain, like Calvin & Hobbes, so finding a relevant one is a bit more difficult).

[ElvenFury]

A few years ago, our Red Cross chapter did a series of swim lessons at the Virginia Rehabilitation Center for the Blind and Visually Impaired, and I really wish I'd been able to help with that.

I hear you. I mean, you could stare at those blind chick's tits all you want and they wouldn't know a thing, AMIRITE?!

[AnticorRifling]

Maybe hand them a piece of 20 grit sandpaper and say "Memorize these safety steps they can save your life if you ever fall out of a boat".

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v72/PsiElement/blindpeople.jpg