PDA

View Full Version : Nelemar Newbie questions



Lumi
10-16-2009, 09:02 PM
Having reached the mournful level of 95, I have been banned from the fun quests in the Landing, and so I hopped the boat for Teras Isle to finally check out that Nelemar place.

Hoo boy.

I'm actually doing better than I expected so far, but there are a few things that I know I'm not versed well enough in. So!

1) Which creatures do I NEED TO WATCH OUT FOR RIGHT NOW OMG IT'S GONNA GETCHA!?

- I know dissemblers are sorcs and implode
- I think sentries also implode?
- GWEs are too tough for me to kill with their monster TD, so I just ignore/avoid them.
- Combatants and executioners are cake. They ambush, but so far the pushdown I'm seeing from them still gives them a 0% chance to hit me. They've got about 50 1013'able mana each. So far, they're my favorites.
- What is a radical? I know it's base 100 so I just kill them immediately, haven't seen what they can do yet, but I imagine they have tricks.
- Sentries and defenders, being NCU, can't be critted, so I'm sorta room dancing with them or avoiding them outright. Besides sentries imploding, what do I need to watch out for?
- Something in here has a monster mstrike (hexstrike, I think?!). What is it, and should I care?
- Which types do the drowning maneuver, and how do I avoid/neutralize it?
- Is there any rhyme or reason to sanctuaries being dispelled? I have a SEARCHable heirloom task now, and having seen my sanct get dispelled in there (without even any room messaging!)...I am a very sad panda :(
- Is there a trick to getting into the place, or just hope like hell that there's nothing waiting in the room by the stairs when I swim up?

2) Speaking of swimming in...

- What affects swimming, besides swimming ranks? Is it better to be unencumbered? Two open hands? Stance offensive?
- Why the FUCK don't haste effects work while swimming? It doesn't even strip the spell! It's still in effect when I get out on the other side!!! But for some reason, the swim actions IGNORE it and I get no RT reduction :( WHISKEY TANGO FOXTROT?

3) Once I'm actually in there...

- Are ALL the rooms there "underwater"? Will they all react poorly to lightning? I got double-fried by DC once already, I'd like to know if there's a way to see it coming.
- Do ALL the creature types down there co-mingle EVERYWHERE? Or is there some kind of division (higher levels on the west side, lower to the east, etc.)?

Looks like a fun place, but I really need to get a handle on how it works before I lull myself into a false sense of security ;)

Thanks, all.

OH! One other thing. A siren tried to sing at me, her song "had no effect on you", without even showing a warding check. What did that wannabe bard-bitch try to do to me? Lullaby?

TheLastShamurai
10-16-2009, 09:28 PM
- What is a radical? I know it's base 100 so I just kill them immediately, haven't seen what they can do yet, but I imagine they have tricks.

Basically a Paladin. They cast Divine Strike {1615}, CMAN Charge, MSTIRKE and use Spirit Guide quite frequently. If you get caught by one of their MSTRIKEs you're probably going to die.


- Is there a trick to getting into the place, or just hope like hell that there's nothing waiting in the room by the stairs when I swim up?

PEER. If you don't like what you see, swim to the other entrance.


- Are ALL the rooms there "underwater"? Will they all react poorly to lightning? I got double-fried by DC once already, I'd like to know if there's a way to see it coming.

Not all of them are underwater.


- Do ALL the creature types down there co-mingle EVERYWHERE? Or is there some kind of division (higher levels on the west side, lower to the east, etc.)?

Sentries, Dissemblers, Magus' and GWEs tend to stick to the first floor. The Sentries, GWEs and Magus' become highly concentrated in the north hall and the nexus.

Lumi
10-16-2009, 09:42 PM
Basically a Paladin. They cast Divine Strike {1615}, CMAN Charge, MSTIRKE and use Spirit Guide quite frequently. If you get caught by one of their MSTRIKEs you're probably going to die.

Bah, there's no escape from paladins. From jarls to radicals! Thanks for the confirmation of type.



PEER. If you don't like what you see, swim to the other entrance.


I PEER EVERYWHERE! It's awesome! However, for swimming in, I have enough trouble just getting to the surface without suffocating...I doubt I have the lung capacity to turn around and check the other one (which might be worse!). I guess I'm just going to have to suck it up.



Not all of them are underwater.


Is there an easy way to tell which rooms are and which are not?



Sentries, Dissemblers, Magus' and GWEs tend to stick to the first floor. They become highly concentrated in the north hall and the nexus.


The entrance is on the first floor, and moving north eventually leads to the second floor, ja?

droit
10-16-2009, 09:46 PM
Is there an easy way to tell which rooms are and which are not?

Yes. The entire second floor is inundated and the third floor is dry.


The entrance is on the first floor, and moving north eventually leads to the second floor, ja?

No, the "first" floor is actually called the second floor, whereas the floor above it is the third. The entrance area where dissemblers and sirens spawn is a part of the second floor, as is the area farther back with sentries, GWEs and magus. They are two separate spawning areas though.

TheLastShamurai
10-16-2009, 09:48 PM
The entrance is on the first floor, and moving north eventually leads to the second floor, ja?

I guess technically entrance and the north hall is considered the second floor, and the top is considered the third floor. For some reason I've always thought of the entrance as the first floor.

So, with my brain working right...

The GWEs, Dissemblers, Magus' and Sentries stick to the second, with higher concentrations of Magus', Sentries and GWEs in the north section.


Is there an easy way to tell which rooms are and which are not?

It's probably in the room description, but I've never really need to know. They can only try the drowning manuever in an watery room though.

Methais
10-16-2009, 09:48 PM
Stick to the 3rd floor. Water elementals and sentries rarely go up there. Magus and dissemblers too but they're easy.

3rd floor is not underwater so you can pwn with lightning all you want.

Swimming ranks > all for the swim. I have 101 ranks and I can swim in and out as encumbered as can be with no failures. Having your hands free doesn't matter. It used to be required but they changed it.

Combatants and defenders will disarm and have maneuver attacks. Radicals have maneuver attacks too.

Keep some aloeas stem with you too for when you get your throat cut by executioners.

You can ring out but not in. Furthers you can ring in to is the incline in sand devils.

Think that's pretty much it. Pretty easy place overall, especially if you stick to the 3rd floor.

Lumi
10-16-2009, 09:52 PM
Awesome. Thanks, guys!

inso
10-16-2009, 09:59 PM
For third floor lightning hunting, might want to highlight "muck" to be extra safe. If a (G)WE wanders up there and someone kills it, the leftover muck can reflect as well. Just avoid it or use 906/111 get rid of it.

Methais
10-16-2009, 10:00 PM
For third floor lightning hunting, might want to highlight "muck" to be extra safe. If a (G)WE wanders up there and someone kills it, the leftover muck can reflect as well. Just avoid it or use 906/111 get rid of it.

They leave puddles, not muck.

Speaking of muck, you can SEARCH the muck on the 2nd floor and occasionally pull a box out of there.

droit
10-16-2009, 10:05 PM
They leave puddles, not muck.

Speaking of muck, you can SEARCH the muck on the 2nd floor and occasionally pull a box out of there.

That's because muck is dead peoples' disks.

The Ponzzz
10-16-2009, 10:07 PM
As a rogue, I say avoid the second floor unless you can tangle with sentries. I don't even touch sentries of GWE. 3rd floor is a cakewalk.

BigWorm
10-16-2009, 10:15 PM
As a rogue, I say avoid the second floor unless you can tangle with sentries. I don't even touch sentries of GWE. 3rd floor is a cakewalk.

Agreed, with the exception of the occasional charge death or really bad luck with another cman like disarm.

Methais
10-16-2009, 10:26 PM
That's because muck is dead peoples' disks.

The muck on the 2nd floor is there all the time.

droit
10-16-2009, 10:28 PM
The muck on the 2nd floor is there all the time.

That's because it never degens.

Methais
10-16-2009, 10:47 PM
Either way I'm happy to relieve dead people of their loot.

Lumi
10-17-2009, 07:18 AM
Having your hands free doesn't matter. It used to be required but they changed it.


Okay, after further experimentation, I'll buy this, but I still can't imagine that stance doesn't matter. I tried swimming back in with my shield out and in defensive, and I couldn't even get through the whirlpool at all.

Tried it in offensive with the shield out and got through the whirlpool on the third try. Once I did that, it was easy enough to get into the temple, but still a tad nerve-wracking.

Sucks that we can't stance while underwater :(

ETA: Just tried a moment ago with shield in hand in offensive...absolutely amazed I didn't die. I was one message away from suffocating. :(

Lumi
10-17-2009, 08:42 AM
New question: Does Symbol of Need work from the temple?

If not, are there any other places on Teras that it doesn't work from? Or if someone sees a muted SoN, they know it has to be coming from the temple?

Smythe
10-17-2009, 10:19 AM
Need works, get water walkin an more PF if yer maxed on swim.

- Smythe

Lumi
10-17-2009, 10:35 AM
Yah, Fleurs told me about Water Walking this morning, which I thought PREVENTED you from swimming in. Heh. Oops!

PF helps, I'm assuming, by increasing the amount of time you can be underwater, but doesn't actually make you swim any better? Maybe I'll try that, I've only got 24 ranks of PF.

I was going to push Swimming up to 50, sitting at 44 right now and spending the TPs for more as they come in.

Smythe
10-17-2009, 10:42 AM
Yep. 50 to 60 swim, an go after PF I'ld say.

- Smythe

Methais
10-17-2009, 11:28 AM
I was going to push Swimming up to 50, sitting at 44 right now.

That's the problem right there. I had I think 60 ranks when Nelemar first opened and I still got failures all over the place even while not encumbered.

Ever since I maxed out swimming ranks, I've yet to have a failure regardless of how encumbered I am.

SolitareConfinement
10-17-2009, 11:43 AM
- Which types do the drowning maneuver, and how do I avoid/neutralize it?

combatants and executioners. seems PF and swimming ranks are the biggest factors that i've noticed. it only happens though on floor 2 with water...floor 3 avoids it altogether


- Combatants and executioners are cake. They ambush, but so far the pushdown I'm seeing from them still gives them a 0% chance to hit me.

from what i've seen over time, executioner ambush doesn't push down for some reason. even when i first started hunting Nelemar at level 85 the level 96 executioner ambush DS was the same as a combatant/radical open strike DS


- I think sentries also implode?

yes and very often. they gen with 719 already prepped. and usually have a decent CS in the mid to (rarely) high 400s. and after that its about a 50/50 shot that you're dead in the next 3 seconds because the next spell prepped is usually either pain or implode

edit: sentries also tease you with mind jolt just to piss you off before they 720 you into bits

Lumi
10-17-2009, 11:58 AM
Stupid swimming skill. It's eating my TPs!

At least now I know. I successfully swam out with a child for a bounty, so I can't complain too much.

Lumi
10-18-2009, 01:19 AM
Okay, I just had what I would call a near perfect hunt. I think I like this place.

What are spectral triton defenders? They're free loot and experience so far that occasionally tries to mstrike me...I feel like I must be missing something. What do I need to look out for with those guys?

Someone (hey, maybe it was a defender...) did some kind of shoulder check maneuver. What is that, and what does it do?

The drop rate for pristine siren hair blows :(

(ETA: Okay, apparently I need SPRITE hair, not SIREN hair, so I guess it doesn't matter...wonder if I can grind fire sprites for that?)

Went in empty handed, left with 8 boxes and 12k in coins on me :D

ETA: Also, 112 is freaking awesome. No trouble whatsoever anymore.

TheLastShamurai
10-18-2009, 01:21 AM
Someone (hey, maybe it was a defender...) did some kind of shoulder check maneuver. What is that, and what does it do?

CMAN Bullrush.


Attempt to rush your opponent and knock them to the ground. On slight successes, your opponent will be knocked off balance (a Roundtime penalty). On more substantial successes, your opponent will be knocked down with Roundtime and may suffer HP damage.

Lumi
10-18-2009, 02:51 AM
CMAN Bullrush.

Aha! Forgot that one existed. Danke.

BriarFox
10-18-2009, 02:58 AM
On a related note, what do people think of my ranger's likely swimming ability in Nelemar? 60 swimming ranks, water walking, 2x PF. +5 swimming enhancive ring. Enough?

Lumi
10-18-2009, 03:07 AM
water walking

Enough :)

In all seriousness, with 50 ranks of swimming, 24 ranks of PF, and no swimming enhancives at all, I've had zero problems swimming at all after putting up Water Walking.

TheLastShamurai
10-18-2009, 03:13 AM
On a related note, what do people think of my ranger's likely swimming ability in Nelemar? 60 swimming ranks, water walking, 2x PF. +5 swimming enhancive ring. Enough?

If you're only swimming in healthy you should be fine.

In the event you get injured and for some reason have to swim out, 101 swimming is your friend.

droit
10-18-2009, 03:15 AM
On a related note, what do people think of my ranger's likely swimming ability in Nelemar? 60 swimming ranks, water walking, 2x PF. +5 swimming enhancive ring. Enough?

That's plenty for getting in. Though be aware that swimming ranks also greatly help resist the tritons' drowning maneuver. I had 60 ranks for a long time in the temple and I rarely failed multiple drowning checks in a row, but I'd still get caught in the first place with some regularity.

BriarFox
10-18-2009, 03:30 AM
That's plenty for getting in. Though be aware that swimming ranks also greatly help resist the tritons' drowning maneuver. I had 60 ranks for a long time in the temple and I rarely failed multiple drowning checks in a row, but I'd still get caught in the first place with some regularity.

Hrm.. I'll see if I can't bump it up to at least 80 or so after I get another 10 armor ranks for a reduction on hauberk's maneuver penalty.

Widgets
10-18-2009, 10:10 AM
Hrm.. I'll see if I can't bump it up to at least 80 or so after I get another 10 armor ranks for a reduction on hauberk's maneuver penalty.

Sigil of Resolve comes in handy too, if you fancy yourself a GoS Master.

What I did was just incorporate the sigil in before my SWIM script to Nelemar.

However now, with 101 swim ranks I don't bother anymore.

And welcome to the world of Nelemar Lumi, the place is a cakewalk. The only main problems really lie on the second floor over the steps. Third floor is a cinch, as the main concern there is Charge, Disarm, Feint, Bullrush and Cutthroat.

Lumi
10-18-2009, 10:52 AM
The only main problems really lie on the second floor over the steps. Third floor is a cinch, as the main concern there is Charge, Disarm, Feint, Bullrush and Cutthroat.

And getting disconnected from the game mid-combat >_<

Do the executioners and/or combatants use Sneaking? I noticed today that I was in a room, seemingly alone, and two executioners jumped out of hiding and attacked me. I immediately LOOKed, and there were three of them in the room. I checked the log repeatedly, there was never any sign of a third one walking in or jumping out from hiding.

Widgets
10-18-2009, 11:03 AM
And getting disconnected from the game mid-combat >_<

Do the executioners and/or combatants use Sneaking? I noticed today that I was in a room, seemingly alone, and two executioners jumped out of hiding and attacked me. I immediately LOOKed, and there were three of them in the room. I checked the log repeatedly, there was never any sign of a third one walking in or jumping out from hiding.

The Executioners tend to be in hiding and can sneak while hidden, the combatants never hide nor sneak.

The magus use Sneak, but they are on the second floor with the Sentries and GWEs.

Belnia
10-18-2009, 11:23 AM
Executioners also have crossbows they like to grab for single shots. I remember one week they were doing nothing but crossbows and killed people like crazy, good times! Magii are also strict ranged users for weaponry, but they can cast unpleasant spells like Spikethorn and Nature's Fury.

Water elementals and greater water elementals have the nastiest maneuvers in the temple. Basically they turn themselves into a wave and smack you which can result in a bad impact critical and 20 seconds of roundtime. Worst part? They seem to have no problem with doing this multiple times in a row until you're in over a minute of roundtime and screwed. They also have a very unpleasant whirlpool maneuver.

Radicals, defenders and combatants can all use Charge, and for this reason I'll avoid a room with more than 2 of them at a time.

Smythe
10-18-2009, 12:16 PM
Defenders can charge. Gotta watch fer it.

Sentry gens pain or disrupt first. It jes feels like they gen wit' implosion.

Swimmin' at 60 or above fer reasons stated. Yer gonna drown, Lumi, if ya stay at 50 ranks an' 24 PF. Executioners an combatants.

Siren and nymph hair interchange, right?

- Smythe

Drunken Durfin
10-18-2009, 12:22 PM
The only good thing about the Sentries' and their insta-cast WTFPWNVOIDMEINTOOBLIVION crap is that you get a free trip to town.

SolitareConfinement
10-18-2009, 01:45 PM
Sentry gens pain or disrupt first. It jes feels like they gen wit' implosion.


they gen with 719....


those 2 are possibilities after that 719 is lost in the mind of the sentry or its casted

Widgets
10-18-2009, 03:49 PM
The only good thing about the Sentries' and their insta-cast WTFPWNVOIDMEINTOOBLIVION crap is that you get a free trip to town.

Exactly. And I always found the best thing for me that worked against them, was Macro CMAN FEINT, then as soon as I saw one, feint it once, swing at it, feint it again, swing...Rinse and Repeat until Dead...But usually after the 2nd swing they are dead.

But regardless, mother fuckers pain in the ass

Stunseed
10-18-2009, 04:32 PM
Radicals, defenders and combatants can all use Charge, and for this reason I'll avoid a room with more than 2 of them at a time.

Get some dux and learn to take a hit. :)

BriarFox
10-18-2009, 04:38 PM
Get some dux and learn to take a hit. :)

^. Join the chainmail club.

Fleurs
10-19-2009, 03:59 PM
Get pierce protection on your armor from Durfin!