Armor Resistance & Partial Armors

[crb]

Anyone know how partial armor and resistance works... perse... its so fucking complicated.

So you have double leather you're wearing, and you put arm greaves on top of that.

Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your leathers but not your greaves, do you have it at full strength on the arms?

Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your greaves but not your armor, do you have it at full strength on your arms?

Suppose you have puncture resistance added to both greaves and armor, do you have it at full strength or double strength?

I know, or I think, different resistances are cumulative. If you have fire resistance on full coverage armor, and cold resistance on some arm greaves, you end up with fire and cold on your arms are full strength, and fire everywhere else, at full strength. But what about the same resistance?

Of course, if you're we're padded armor, and you put an accessory that is unpadded or has different padding over it, the padding on that area is halved. But that is the padding system, not the resistance system.

Then, CAN squares add the new armor resistances to greaves and helms and whatnot?

[Fallen]

So you have double leather you're wearing, and you put arm greaves on top of that. Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your leathers but not your greaves, do you have it at full strength on the arms?


Dunno on that one. You would THINK that because the armor is covered it would not work, or atleast be halved.



Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your greaves but not your armor, do you have it at full strength on your arms?


If your armor has nothing special about it, you will get full puncture protection. If you get padding everything is averaged.



Suppose you have puncture resistance added to both greaves and armor, do you have it at full strength or double strength?


The greater one takes effect. They don't stack.



I know, or I think, different resistances are cumulative. If you have fire resistance on full coverage armor, and cold resistance on some arm greaves, you end up with fire and cold on your arms are full strength, and fire everywhere else, at full strength. But what about the same resistance?


Different resistances on the same armor accessory will mesh, but the effects aren't cumulative. I know that for sure. You can add 10% +30% and get 40.



Of course, if you're we're padded armor, and you put an accessory that is unpadded or has different padding over it, the padding on that area is halved. But that is the padding system, not the resistance system.


I BELIEVE the resistance is diminished as well, but I don't know. Hopefully Vivaldi will step up and get this straightened out.



Then, CAN squares add the new armor resistances to greaves and helms and whatnot?


Correct, as long as you're willing to eat the loss in padding, or the loss in flares if you cover flaring armor with non-flaring accessories.

The question remains, If you cover your RESISTANT armor with accessories, be they resistant of a differing type or not, what happens?

[BriarFox]

So you have double leather you're wearing, and you put arm greaves on top of that. Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your leathers but not your greaves, do you have it at full strength on the arms?

If the greaves have no effect of their own, I believe you'd get the resistance. If they have a resistance or padding, each type would be halved. Greaves do prevent some things, though, like flares from your armor.


Suppose you have puncture resistance added to your greaves but not your armor, do you have it at full strength on your arms?

Yes, but only if your armor has no other benefits that would interfere.


Suppose you have puncture resistance added to both greaves and armor, do you have it at full strength or double strength?

You have it at the strongest strength, if it's the same type. If your greaves were vhcp and your armor were hcp, you'd have vhcp on your arms. Same goes for resistances.


I know, or I think, different resistances are cumulative. If you have fire resistance on full coverage armor, and cold resistance on some arm greaves, you end up with fire and cold on your arms are full strength, and fire everywhere else, at full strength. But what about the same resistance?

Actually, the cold and fire resistances would each be at half-strength on your arms, but you would have both. If you have a more powerful fire resistance on your greaves, then you'd have that level of protection on your arms and your armor's general protection elsewhere.


Of course, if you're we're padded armor, and you put an accessory that is unpadded or has different padding over it, the padding on that area is halved. But that is the padding system, not the resistance system.

They work the same, more or less.


Then, CAN squares add the new armor resistances to greaves and helms and whatnot?

I don't know. I would think so, but it wouldn't be worth it in most cases, since you get a higher benefit from just doing it to the armor.

That's my best answer.

[BriarFox]

Dude, that's just disturbing. We even used the same format.

[GSIVMerchant21]

I Found this out.

I put slash resistence on my torso armor, and put puncture resistent arm greaves on top of my armor.

If I got a slashing attack to the arm, I would get slashing resistence.

if I got a puncture attack to the arm, I would get puncture resist.

[BriarFox]

I Found this out.

I put slash resistence on my torso armor, and put puncture resistent arm greaves on top of my armor.

If I got a slashing attack to the arm, I would get slashing resistence.

if I got a puncture attack to the arm, I would get puncture resist.

They should each be halved, though.

[Fallen]

But atleast we know both are present.

[thefarmer]

Resistances aren't halved when overlapped. (20 slash over 20 puncture= same).

Resistances aren't stacked when overlapped (10 slash+10 slash=20 slash for arms). The greater of the resistances is used.

[Fallen]

Thanks Vivaldi. That is awesome for people with non-padded armor.

[thefarmer]

Agreed.

I think that's one of the reasons that the system works like that, to give people a (less uber, sure) mechanical reason to not have padding.

edit: Of course all you people with masterful+ padding could layer a shitton of resistances on and have the padding of normal people (hcp-vhcp) PLUS full resistances. Which would be pretty sick.

[Fallen]

You know which sets rock? The FUCKING set I sold that had 2 different types of perm resistance and no weakness. Put Fire resistance in that, and different resistances on the head, arms, and legs and you would be resistant in some way to nearly everything.

I would do Fire in the legs for boil, Nature in the body for spike and everything, pierce in the torso for everything, and on the head Crush. Not sure what you would put on the arms.

[BriarFox]

Thanks for the clarification, Vivaldi. That's cool.

[BriarFox]

You know which sets rock? The FUCKING set I sold that had 2 different types of perm resistance and no weakness. Put Fire resistance in that, and different resistances on the head, arms, and legs and you would be resistant in some way to nearly everything.

I would do Fire in the legs for boil, Nature in the body for spike and everything, pierce in the torso for everything, and on the head Crush. Not sure what you would put on the arms.

Actually, if you're going up against spike thorn, your best bet is to put pierce resistance on your legs and head, with nature resistance in your torso armor. That should do you the most good. 616 goes for the legs first, and only goes for the body/eye/neck shots after it gets a knockdown (usually with a rank 2 puncture on the legs).

Edit: Of course, that assumes you're preparing for a specific attack, not everything in general.

[thefarmer]

Outside of the standard weapon slash/crush/puncture, I still say impact has the most all around uses from spells and attacks.

If I could add impact resistance to my slash/crush/puncture plate I'd pee in my pants.

[crb]

Resistances aren't halved when overlapped. (20 slash over 20 puncture= same).

Resistances aren't stacked when overlapped (10 slash+10 slash=20 slash for arms). The greater of the resistances is used.
Thats what I thought as I was remembering talking with regyy about it awhile back.

So, technically, one could get say puncture resistance done to their armor, and then slash to greaves/helm, and have protection from both. Assuming they don't mind losing the flares or halving the padding of their base armor if any.

What happens if you wear an accessory that is padded or more heavily padded over armor that is not? For instance, if I'm wearing HCP doubles and put on a MCP helm, does my helm override it since it is more, or is it still averaged, leaving me with I guess VHCP on the head and HCP everywhere else.

Then, with the new warrior resistances, is it only permanent padding they get the penalty with, or temporary padding as well.

Story Problem.

Virilneus has 7x hcp doubles with 90% fire resistance, 20% puncture resistance (permanent), and 10% slash vulnerability (permanent). He also wears unpadded leg greaves with 95% nature resistance, and can optionally wear a temporarily MCP helmet.

Does it make sense to put puncture resistance from a warrior on the armor and the leg greaves, is it even possible to do it on the helmet?

[thefarmer]

So, technically, one could get say puncture resistance done to their armor, and then slash to greaves/helm, and have protection from both. Assuming they don't mind losing the flares or halving the padding of their base armor if any.

Possibly. Depends on tier 5 fittings.


What happens if you wear an accessory that is padded or more heavily padded over armor that is not? For instance, if I'm wearing HCP doubles and put on a MCP helm, does my helm override it since it is more, or is it still averaged, leaving me with I guess VHCP on the head and HCP everywhere else.

The helm overrides the torso head padding, so you'd have MCP for head (possibly neck).


Then, with the new warrior resistances, is it only permanent padding they get the penalty with, or temporary padding as well.

Warrior padding seems to work the same as perm or ranger padding, so I would think all the same rules apply as for as averaging padding. The only thing I can tell that's different is the decrease in resistance level when placed on already padded armor.

Story Problem.


Virilneus has 7x hcp doubles with 90% fire resistance, 20% puncture resistance (permanent), and 10% slash vulnerability (permanent). He also wears unpadded leg greaves with 95% nature resistance, and can optionally wear a temporarily MCP helmet.

Does it make sense to put puncture resistance from a warrior on the armor and the leg greaves, is it even possible to do it on the helmet?


You'd need a 5 tier fitting (unconfirmed), since a 4 tier warrior resistance fitting didn't work on already padded armor. with HCP, warrior resistance would drop down to like 10%? 20%? It wouldn't be greater than your natural 20% puncture anyway, so I don't see it worth it.

If you wanted to get slash, though, you could cancel out the permanent 10% on your legs. The padding wouldn't be halved AGAIN, since it's on the same piece your nature resistance is on.

The same thing with the helmet. I would figure that the MCP would NOT be averaged if you put slash on it, since the armor piece is 1)greater than the torso, 2) on the actual stacked piece that would cause the averaging.

[crb]

You'd need a 5 tier fitting (unconfirmed), since a 4 tier warrior resistance fitting didn't work on already padded armor. with HCP, warrior resistance would drop down to like 10%? 20%? It wouldn't be greater than your natural 20% puncture anyway, so I don't see it worth it.

Doesn't warrior resistance stack with preexisting resistance? So I could go 20+20 = 40 on my torso.

[thefarmer]

Doesn't warrior resistance stack with preexisting resistance? So I could go 20+20 = 40 on my torso.

I couldn't get warrior slash or crush resistance with a tier 4 fitting. I haven't found a warrior for a tier 5 fitting, so I don't know.

Also, it's not 20+20=40. It's 20+20=20.

edit:Looking back, my earlier post might have been confusing, so I'll redo it.

R
esistances aren't halved when overlapped. (20 slash over 20 puncture= same).

Resistances aren't stacked when overlapped (10 slash+10 slash/=20 slash for arms). The greater of the resistances is used(10 slash+20slash =20 slash).

[droit]

Doesn't warrior resistance stack with preexisting resistance? So I could go 20+20 = 40 on my torso.

No. Mikoguchi and I tested a puncture resistant shield in conjunction with puncture resisted armor and found that, despite both the shield and armor messaging being activated, only the greater resistance was applied. They didn't stack.

Shield = 10%
Armor = 20%
Shield + Armor = 20%

[thefarmer]

Shield resistance shouldn't exist (though it should). That shield is buggy, so I don't think that's a proper comparison.

[droit]

Your mom doesn't exist.

[Fallen]

Your mom doesn't exist.

OOH sick burn.

[droit]

In any case, I think resistances act like stacked padding accessories. If you are wearing HCP armor and you don some SWCP greaves, your arms still just have HCP.

[thefarmer]

If you are wearing HCP armor and you don some SWCP greaves, your arms still just have HCP.

Correct.

[crb]

No. Mikoguchi and I tested a puncture resistant shield in conjunction with puncture resisted armor and found that, despite both the shield and armor messaging being activated, only the greater resistance was applied. They didn't stack.

Shield = 10%
Armor = 20%
Shield + Armor = 20%
You misunderstand.

You have a puncture resistant breastplate with permanent 20% puncture resistance.

You have a warrior add 50% more resistance to it.

You now have 70% resistance.

I don't mean using a shield and armor, or greaves and armor. I mean, having both permanent AND temporary resistance on the same item, does it stack. It does doesn't it?

[Fallen]

You misunderstand.

You have a puncture resistant breastplate with permanent 20% puncture resistance.

You have a warrior add 50% more resistance to it.

You now have 70% resistance.

I don't mean using a shield and armor, or greaves and armor. I mean, having both permanent AND temporary resistance on the same item, does it stack. It does doesn't it?

No. Like resistances do not stack. I will state that with all surety, and go so far that should it ever be proven that it DOES stack, don't mention it on the boards.

[droit]

I highly doubt it.

[Stanley Burrell]

No. Like resistances do not stack. I will state that with all surety, and go so far that should it ever be proven that it DOES stack, don't mention it on the boards.

Even if they don't stack, if you get hit, and only get somewhat on your randomized perm' padding, and then have (e.g.) very heavy crush padding on your helmut, and it randomizes to heavy, wouldn't that register over the earlier roll (or however the ghost mechanics go?)

[GSIVMerchant21]

So I've been hearing it actually takes 303 ranks to get rank 5 of puncture resist. How is this so?

You get 1 armor point per armor rank. So you can get rank 4 resistance with 140 ranks. 60 more ranks for rank 5. So that's 200 ranks to get rank of resistance, not 303..

[BriarFox]

So I've been hearing it actually takes 303 ranks to get rank 5 of puncture resist. How is this so?

You get 1 armor point per armor rank. So you can get rank 4 resistance with 140 ranks. 60 more ranks for rank 5. So that's 200 ranks to get rank of resistance, not 303..

Yep.