Gemstone Revenues

[danielsh]

I'm curious to know how Gemstone stacks up to the top money making MMOs of 2008 (http://gigaom.com/2009/02/01/top-10-money-making-mmos-2008/).

Anyone care to speculate on what Simu's revenues from GS were from last year?

- Cloakhe

[NocturnalRob]

$1337

[Fallen]

I initially thought that link to be about which MMO games can you make the most RL $'s playing. Still, an interesting read.

[Kuyuk]

it had 5 million in sales in 1999


That's probably right around it's high point..


K.

[danielsh]

After reading that article again, it occurred to me that one of the most obvious ways Simu could grow its revenues is to offer the game in Chinese.

Heh.

- Cloakhe

[Fallen]

"You want buy silver? KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKE."

/Racism

[NocturnalRob]

hahahaha...nicely done

[waywardgs]

It's interesting, because although the silver/item market is crap right now, I've noticed more people playing... when I started back up last year, peak times would be around 400, and now it seems that every night cracks 500. I'm guessing it's because GS is a cheaper form of entertainment during downtimes- 15 bucks a month is a lot cheaper than going to a bar on the weekends, and cheaper than a new video game.

[NocturnalRob]

cheaper than a hooker too

[waywardgs]

cheaper than a hooker too

Excellent point.

[Kuyuk]

it's down to 500 during peak times now?

Sad.

[War Drums]

I would say that there are about 1000 total accounts for GS, about 1500 accounts for DR. The other games are so small in number they really don't count.

Now lets say that the vast majority of these accounts are basic and that 20%? Are premium. Lets say platinum numbers/DR fallen etc. add up to 100.

Revenue:

100x 50 bucks = (5000$ per month) + (2500 (.80) x 15 bucks = 30000) + (2500(.20) x 40 bucks = 20000) = 55,000 dollars per month.

Costs:

Building Rent: ??? Who knows? but lets tentatively put it at 3000 dollars including electric bills etc.

Equipment upkeep (servers, desks etc.) and purchase: Who knows? Lets call it another 1000 dollars.

Pay the phone lady and Warden and friends + DragonRealms staff (which I think is bigger then GS's staff) + other games staff + General Admin staff: I would imagine Warden and Sirina each make about 50k a year plus you got all the other on-site GMs for DR etc. The other on-site GMs might make a bit less + the off-site GMs all have a pool which to draw from (not much, probably all make 3-4k each a year - and thats the high side). So then lets put it at 500,000 dollars for the ENTIRE staff of Simu on-site and off-site(thats probably on the low end).

So then the grand total per month: 55,000 - (42,000 + 4000 = 46000) = 9000 $.

So Whatley makes around 100,000 dollars for himself at the end of the day with the situation currently as is.

I would say during GS's heyday company profits were probably closer to 500,000 a year. Over the long 20 year stretch, I would put annual profits at 300,000 $ a year. 300,000 dollars x 20 years = 6 millions dollars for Whatley.

Whatley probably invested much of his money during this time ( probably is worth about 10 million). I think he poured a hefty 5 mil into the Hero Engine. Currently, he's worth liquid 5 million. Hero Engine license sales and the HJ game might boost that into the several 10's of millions. He's one rich guy.

[diethx]

"You want buy silver? KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKE."

/Racism

LOL

Also War Drums, you left out all the pay events. And i'm willing to bet more than 20% of accounts are premium. I can't say how much, I just bet more. :)

[Some Rogue]

And all the coke purchased.

[Allereli]

I think there are way more than 1000 total accounts. Not everyone plays regularly or at all. I would guess 5000

[War Drums]

5000 accounts for just GS is way out of proportion imo. I think it's around 1000, I mean even in the pay events like EG it doesn't get much higher then 700 on during peak times (includes EG goers + the regulars) so... probably 1000 should be accurate.

[Khariz]

5000 accounts for just GS is way out of proportion imo. I think it's around 1000, I mean even in the pay events like EG it doesn't get much higher then 700 on during peak times (includes EG goers + the regulars) so... probably 1000 should be accurate.

Erm you do realize that (total number of paid accounts) != (max number of simultanous accounts per night), right? I mean, like...not even in the same universe.

[Allereli]

5000 accounts for just GS is way out of proportion imo. I think it's around 1000, I mean even in the pay events like EG it doesn't get much higher then 700 on during peak times (includes EG goers + the regulars) so... probably 1000 should be accurate.

you really think that much of the population plays so often? If the percentage follows my house roster, maybe 20% of active members within the past year will log on within a 24 hour period. While a WHO will tell you current accounts logged in, you don't know unique users within 24 hours. I'll bet it's a lot more than 400-500.

[War Drums]

So why don't these people just cancel their accounts? Do they like 15-50 dollars just leaving every month?

It's 400-500 during peak hours of GS. But these die down to 100's to 200's during off hours, how do you know it's just the hardcore players that are on during these times and that the other 200-300 players gets on during the peak hours?

[Allereli]

So why don't these people just cancel their accounts? Do they like 15-50 dollars just leaving every month?

It's 400-500 during peak hours of GS. But these die down to 100's to 200's during off hours, how do you know it's just the hardcore players that are on during these times and that the other 200-300 players gets on during the peak hours?

you do realize there is more than one time zone right? and that there is a continuous stream of people logging on and off?

[CrystalTears]

So why don't these people just cancel their accounts? Do they like 15-50 dollars just leaving every month?

It's 400-500 during peak hours of GS. But these die down to 100's to 200's during off hours, how do you know it's just the hardcore players that are on during these times and that the other 200-300 players gets on during the peak hours?
I believe the point that's being made here is that you can't assume that the 400-500 people logged in are the same people everyday, or even that the 100-200 afterward are the same that were on before.

I tend to play (when and if I do) during the weekends, usually the morning or afternoon. Or when I'm being sneaky at work during lunch and log in to say hi or check on something. I'm rarely on during these "peak" hours.

[diethx]

I know of three accounts between two people that are never used unless I use them (none of them are mine). I'm quite sure there are a lot more people who keep their accounts open without regularly playing (or playing at all) in order to keep accruing premium points (like crazy Fallen), or keep their shops, or so their friends can use them, or for whatever reason.

[Khariz]

I know of three accounts between two people that are never used unless I use them (none of them are mine). I'm quite sure there are a lot more people who keep their accounts open without regularly playing (or playing at all) in order to keep accruing premium points (like crazy Fallen), or keep their shops, or so their friends can use them, or for whatever reason.

And also people like me who have multiple accounts, but I'm only "playing" one account logged in at a time. My others are utilities, not for MAing but for temp logging in and doing things and quickly logging back out.

[GS4_HappyTimez]

There are no less than 7500 active accounts. People don't just give up on an amazing game like Gemstone. I'd say active accounts are more in the area of 12,000. That's a LOT of revenue.

[Mtenda]

There are no less than 7500 active accounts. People don't just give up on an amazing game like Gemstone. I'd say active accounts are more in the area of 12,000. That's a LOT of revenue.

Nice plug there. But seriously, 1000 is an absurd estimation. Hate to say it but happytimez is probably right. 7500 is probably around what is active at one time and 12,000 is probably around how many accounts are active at some point during a year.

[AestheticDeath]

I know I have 4 open still and I don't even play. $140 for no reason, except I have not gotten around to canceling them yet.

:( Someone do it for me? I am lazy.

And 2-4 more accounts that are closed with characters on them, that I need to sell. Someone buy them?

[Celephais]

cheaper than a hooker too
Shit... you're paying too much for your hookers.

[NocturnalRob]

Shit... you're paying too much for your hookers.
probably. any suggestions?

[Liagala]

probably. any suggestions?

I hear Sean2's looking for a job :lol:

[NocturnalRob]

goo...

[diethx]

I hear Sean2's looking for a job :lol:

pwnt

[Daniel]

DR has more accounts than GS?

Really?

[AestheticDeath]

Has for a long time as far as I knew.

[War Drums]

DR in many ways is a better game. Its more detailed and designed to be more RP intensive. It's sorta semi-classless based skill training is more realistic and flexible plus they have like a bajillion more skills each with some RP aspect to it.

Anyhow, it's an unfair comparison since GS was like a decade old when DR came out so it's naturally a bit more advanced.

[Carnivale]

I would say during GS's heyday company profits were probably closer to 500,000 a year. Over the long 20 year stretch, I would put annual profits at 300,000 $ a year. 300,000 dollars x 20 years = 6 millions dollars for Whatley.


According to Designing Virtual Worlds by Richard Bartle, there was a two-year period when the profit margin for Simutronics as a whole was $1 million per month. 95-97 or 97-99, I forget which.

Good book, real interesting MMO/MUD history lesson.

[Moist Happenings]

cheaper than a hooker too

Obviously you are finding the wrong hookers. Pssht.

[Rocktar]

I know I have 4 open still and I don't even play. $140 for no reason, except I have not gotten around to canceling them yet.

:( Someone do it for me? I am lazy.

And 2-4 more accounts that are closed with characters on them, that I need to sell. Someone buy them?

Gimme your shit, I will take care of it for you. ~evil grin~