Best Profession as of 2009

[Pelor]

So, since I recieved word that Coase (the main dude on monk creation) has left, probably due to creative differences with Simu... he wanted real cool revolutionary monk stuff, Simu told him that they are lowkey uncreative generic MMO.

So, which profession is best at the 1.) killing AND 2.) not dying.

My pick from best to worst.

1.) Sorcerer
2.) Warrior
3.) Bard (possibly tied with warrior)
4.) Rogue
5.) Wizard
6.) Ranger
7.) Paladin
8.) Cleric

[Sweets]

What? No empath?

[Ignot]

So, since I recieved word that Coase (the main dude on monk creation) has left, probably due to creative differences with Simu... he wanted real cool revolutionary monk stuff, Simu told him that they are lowkey uncreative generic MMO.


....and now you arrive on the PC.

[Drevihyin]

I'm the best at killing until I die!

[Fallen]

Depends on level range. Capped Empath in GoS or a bard with post cap exp to spare. Though who really cares about levels 1-99?

[Methais]

So, since I recieved word that Coase (the main dude on monk creation) has left, probably due to creative differences with Simu... he wanted real cool revolutionary monk stuff, Simu told him that they are lowkey uncreative generic MMO.

So, which profession is best at the 1.) killing AND 2.) not dying.

My pick from best to worst.

1.) Sorcerer
2.) Warrior
3.) Bard (possibly tied with warrior)
4.) Rogue
5.) Wizard
6.) Ranger
7.) Paladin
8.) Cleric

Lol @ warriors being ranked higher than wizards.

[Tea & Strumpets]

The correct answer is Ranger, but only because Simu wouldn't allow Coase to make monks into ninjas.

[RichardCranium]

Prostitute.

[SolitareConfinement]

Lol @ warriors being ranked higher than wizards.

this gave me a giggle as well

[Methais]

Anybody else feel like a little...giggle, when I mention my fwiend....Bigus...DICKUS?!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPGb4STRfKw

[Pelor]

Actually, I think warriors are better at staying alive and maybe even killing when properly trained and using a some nice equipment. (talking MoC berserked maxed and using a decent claid or lance etc w/crit padded plate.)

[Fallen]

Paladin > Warrior for staying alive at later levels. Beseech > Berserk

[nub]

Actually, I think warriors are better at staying alive and maybe even killing when properly trained and using a some nice equipment. (talking MoC berserked maxed and using a decent claid or lance etc w/crit padded plate.)

Better than who?

[CrystalTears]

Everyone except sorcerers apparently.

[Methais]

Actually, I think warriors are better at staying alive and maybe even killing when properly trained and using a some nice equipment. (talking MoC berserked maxed and using a decent claid or lance etc w/crit padded plate.)

That's not the warrior staying alive, that's his gear keeping him alive.

Wizards are pretty good at staying alive, because dead things can't hit you. Except fire mages. Fuck them they're annoying. And mein golems and skayls if you're an idiot. And glacei, also if you're an idiot.

BUT OTHER THAN THAT WE'RE SOLID!

[Fallen]

Wizards are squishy. Haste and Reversion help, but they can still be CMANed into infinity.

[Methais]

Dead things won't kill you no matter how squishy you are.

[Fallen]

In some instances creatures will get the first strike. War Griffins, Grimswarm camp environments, invasions, triton/ithzir ambushes, etc. It is true that not much will make it through an all out offensive wizard's build (or sorcerer), but i've always been of the mindset that it is better to build for that instance than to keep piling on the offensive and hope it never comes up.

[Methais]

In some instances creatures will get the first strike. War Griffins, Grimswarm camp environments, invasions, triton/ithzir ambushes, etc. It is true that not much will make it through an all out offensive wizard's build (or sorcerer), but i've always been of the mindset that it is better to build for that instance than to keep piling on the offensive and hope it never comes up.

Just be awesome like me and you can have both, with a 5x runestaff and plain 5x full leather even.

I think me immolating myself due to a macro fart has killed me more than anything else over the past couple years.

[Fallen]

Have you played with Grimswarm yet? Especially solo they will chew up and spit out pures due to the inibility to just keep e-waving. Even with maxed out haste they can CMAN RT lock you into oblivion...or atleast until one of them keys up focused implode.

[Methais]

Have you played with Grimswarm yet? Especially solo they will chew up and spit out pures due to the inibility to just keep e-waving. Even with maxed out haste they can CMAN RT lock you into oblivion...or atleast until one of them keys up focused implode.

<--- Sunfist master.

Tremors + 908 + 202 fire lore ranks is my ace in there when I'm on the verge of aoe backlash but need to keep them down or at least keep them wasting rounds standing back up instead of attacking me. Since Tremors knocks them down multiple times each cast, it's a good workaround to the aoe backlash mechanic. This will probably be nerfed next week now.

Moving 2 rooms over, waiting for them to swarm in after me, then pwning them all with aoe is my other ace in that situation.

Other than that it's just immolate -> loot.

[Fallen]

Fair enough, M. How much exp does your main have?

Edited to add: Immo wizard build is probably the best "build" in the game, even if wizards aren't the all around champs of GS4.

[Methais]

Not really all that much, considering.

Experience: 9808608

And in case you're also wondering:

Armor Use..........................| 20 4
Physical Fitness...................| 163 63
Arcane Symbols.....................| 302 202
Magic Item Use.....................| 302 202
Spell Aiming.......................| 302 202
Harness Power......................| 257 157
Elemental Mana Control.............| 201 101
Spirit Mana Control................| 70 15
Elemental Lore - Fire..............| 302 202
Perception.........................| 147 47
Climbing...........................| 105 25
Swimming...........................| 201 101

Spell Lists
Major Elemental....................| 117

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 75

Spell Lists
Wizard.............................| 60

[Izzy]

Out of all my characters, my ranger is the most efficient hunter. Fast (faster than my casters even, esp with haste, since 30%+ of my shots are crit kills, and when I'm firing a shot a second it tears shit up) but still extremely durable. Not limited by mana, or encumbrance. DS is huge, though I do have a pocket wizard that helps in that department, and nice equipment. Easily my favorite to hunt with, at any rate.

[droit]

Man, Gnimble explained his build to me the other day and I have to say, a post-cap bard trained entirely for 1030 is sick. Can you believe that shit only costs 10 mana per cast? Just from hunting with him from time to time, I'd say the kill rate is greater than 50% on the first cast.

[Drew]

Bards can really be built up better than rangers. I'd prefer a ranger 1-75 at least but bards accelerate especially post cap.


Overall considering ease of experience getting + insanely powered with too many skills I'd say empaths are the best class.

[Fallen]

Yep. Empaths and Bards, as I said. Post cap it just keeps getting sicker and sicker. Paladins are the only ones of the physical side of the house that come close without a ton of toys and outside help.

[Stunseed]

Man, Gnimble explained his build to me the other day and I have to say, a post-cap bard trained entirely for 1030 is sick. Can you believe that shit only costs 10 mana per cast? Just from hunting with him from time to time, I'd say the kill rate is greater than 50% on the first cast.

Heh, I hunted with Inaara who's practically the same build and she was wrecking things pretty hardcore.

That being said, the Nature's Fury / Cone of Lightning combo has efficiently outdone OTF.

[Fallen]

Hell, I even love Cone of Lightning off scrolls and imbeds. It is a fantastic spell. Too bad it will be nerfed. People post cap will be fine, though. Throwing enough TPs at it should make it be pretty close to what it is now, barring hitting 435908349058304958034 targets at once during invasions.

[Stunseed]

It's just TP's man. You of all people should realize that by now. I've been busting my ass with the mage to get him close to being 3x in spells at cap.

XXXXXXXX (at level 84), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Shield Use.........................| 150 50
Edged Weapons......................| 150 50
Physical Fitness...................| 102 24
Arcane Symbols.....................| 210 110
Magic Item Use.....................| 185 85
Spell Aiming.......................| 275 175
Harness Power......................| 189 89
Elemental Mana Control.............| 163 63
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 90 20
Perception.........................| 185 85
Climbing...........................| 120 30
Swimming...........................| 120 30

Spell Lists
Major Elemental....................| 92

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 75

Spell Lists
Wizard.............................| 64

I'm just 21 spells down :)

[Rimalon]

Immo wizard build is probably the best "build" in the game, even if wizards aren't the all around champs of GS4.

This.

And I have more XP than Methais, mwahahaha.

Best thing about immo isn't the 25% instant kill rate or the 200+ damage on a cast. It's the disabling of whatever it hits for 20-30 seconds.

Dead things can't attack you, true, but neither can things on fire. I've hunted warcamps for the last week at overloaded encumbrance (thanks alchemy), and have only been hit like once.

But yeah, Bards win at life, even if singing at things to kill them is the lamest thing ever.

[thefarmer]

Monks are the best.

[Pelor]

I still say a fully trained MoC/Berserking lance/dual wielding warrior will own most grimswarm camps and any groups with heavy CMAN attacks over ANY pure ANYDAY.

[Rimalon]

I still say a fully trained MoC/Berserking lance/dual wielding warrior will own most grimswarm camps and any groups with heavy CMAN attacks over ANY pure ANYDAY.

I think we're being punked, oh noez.

[Pelor]

Seriously though, why does everyone think warriors suck?

[Tea & Strumpets]

Seriously though, why does everyone think warriors suck?

Every spell circle in the game automatically wards them if they don't wear outside spells. They are pretty tough if they are wearing a lot of outside spells.

[thefarmer]

I still say a fully trained MoC/Berserking lance/dual wielding warrior will own most grimswarm camps and any groups with heavy CMAN attacks over ANY pure ANYDAY.

You can't dual wield lances.

r u a gm?

[Kitsun]

Seriously though, why does everyone think warriors suck?

The best examples, that I've seen, of a warrior PWNing crap out of stuff have also included them with gear in excess of hundreds of millions of silvers. My cleric runs around open handed with only some 7x leathers and can't be hit(melee, ranged, bolts, CS) without needing to sink a billion coins into being able to be a blast-cannon. My RT for my room disablers are 3 seconds soft RT, my hard RT is 3 seconds for channeling. Warriors with a lance/claid/maul need how long to swing for one kill?

[Danical]

I still say a fully trained MoC/Berserking lance/dual wielding warrior will own most grimswarm camps and any groups with heavy CMAN attacks over ANY pure ANYDAY.

How can you be so obtuse? Is it deliberate?

You do not shop S-Mart.

The only time I die in Grimswarm, or really anything, is when I "fall asleep at the wheel," caused by a cataclysmic Vinh-esque bowel movement (http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=31459).

[Danical]

I would say Empaths are the best prof. Until they force an empath to be a good healer OR hunter, they will remain the best prof.

Fuck Empaths.

[Methais]

Hell, I even love Cone of Lightning off scrolls and imbeds. It is a fantastic spell. Too bad it will be nerfed. People post cap will be fine, though. Throwing enough TPs at it should make it be pretty close to what it is now, barring hitting 435908349058304958034 targets at once during invasions.

Has there been any official word on this? Cone's been on the rumored nerf list for years, but nothing ever happens.


Seriously though, why does everyone think warriors suck?

Because you think they're awesome.


How can you be so obtuse? Is it deliberate?

You do not shop S-Mart.

The only time I die in Grimswarm, or really anything, is when I "fall asleep at the wheel," caused by a cataclysmic Vinh-esque bowel movement (http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=31459).

How are you able to fall asleep when your intestines are being assaulted by an urgent dump of such epic proportions?

[Sean of the Thread]

My favorites were Sorc and ranged empath.

My wiz was fun. Actually my rogue was fun as well.

[Twitch]

There can be no clear best class unless you specify certain hunting areas. All around I would have to say a properly trained semi bard is equipped with so much variety that all around he stands the best chance of survival in any area. I haven't found an area yet that my bard couldn't adapt to and excel at. I also think that while very powerful, a pure bard would bore me to tears. Incant 1030...YAWN!

[Stanley Burrell]

Actually, I think warriors are better at staying alive during an invasion of more than one critter in the same room by typing HIDE at the local inn's tables.

True.

Everyone else bump this thread because the OP has his or her own dumbass prerogative.

[Fallen]

Has there been any official word on this? Cone's been on the rumored nerf list for years, but nothing ever happens.

Naos has said that he is going to be tweaking the spell, but Naos says a lot of things.

[RichardCranium]

bump

[Stanley Burrell]

You can't dual wield lances.

I think the OP meant you had to have your gear altered to look like something it totally isn't so that the totally l33t zomg!!!1111111111onetwothreehighfive roleplaying skillz with a "z", son, throws off the NPCs and lets you cast open implosion with the Claidhmore that inspects as being mainly made out of Jesus wafers. Tsin owns it.

[LOL BRIELUS]

i think warriors are a little underrated now, considering the MoC/berserk changes - with these changes, 5 second repeated mstrikes w/ a claid/lance may be one of the deadliest weapons in the game.

[Stanley Burrell]

i think warriors are a little underrated now, considering the MoC/berserk changes - with these changes, 5 second repeated mstrikes w/ a claid/lance may be one of the deadliest weapons in the game.

Srsly.

Also, if you know anything about Warriors, you know that if you properly triple in armor and quadruple in MoC, hold a claidhmore in one hand, a lance in the other and get a ladder piercing made out of either miniature morning stars, one handed flails, or spiked maces, you instantly ward off all CS spells in teh GemStonez. It's in the history documents.

wpqeoierupwqeuwpioeupoqwueqpoieuoprutoprutgl,fmddl ewkjelktjrmngfosk;FruppleMcTarts

[Fallen]

Warriors are fantastic...with millions in gear and a pocket sorcerer/wizard for scrolls/spells. Paladins are still better with all that crap, though.

[droit]

Rangers are cool too!!!

[Stanley Burrell]

Rangers are cool too!!!

Yeah, I secretly hax0red GemStone and my Ranger can actually train in THWs and use claidhmores.

(Please refer to my post about the mystical Jesus Wafer claidhmore. It explains everything.)

[Amaron]

polearm/airlore/MOC bard.... The best build I have played.

She is my most efficient hunter.

[Belnia]

I vote rangers, 'cause the ranger base spell list is totally complete. Unlike sorcerers. lolololololol

[Fallen]

Rangers are a fun class, but nothing about them is all that spectacular. Very, very well rounded. Like Rogues, but less boring.

[m444w]

monksss

[Pelor]

I just don't think people here have played warriors throughly especially post berserk changes.

I would say currently warriors are tied with sorcerers in terms of sheer deadliness and survivability. Let me tell you why.

If a warriors is spelled to the gills (which requires a pocket titled wizzie or sorc... which is easy enough to get imho). Then they become pretty much ward proof. On top of that CMAN attacks rarely hit me.

I can clean out a room with my 7 attacks in 5 seconds and biggest AS in the game short of a maxed bard or paladin, which Im slightly inferior to in terms of sheer AS. But I'm pretty much unstoppable, ignoring stuns and other effects. The only downside is the lack of treasure.

[CrystalTears]

If a profession can't survive on their own merit without outside help, then I don't consider them the best profession. They may be great to play and hit like trucks, but it doesn't make them the best, imo.

[Swami71]

I would choose a bard way past cap. They're on par with everyone before cap being limited with TP. But after cap they can get good AS, Cmans, and CS easier than any other profession not to mention Dodge and MoC.

[Pelor]

I would like to see a Bard way past cap VS. a Warrior way past cap with a ton of his own spells with decent equipment (plus I count spells from scrolls and wands "self cast" also).
... I think the warrior will be at LEAST comparable.

[Stunseed]

It's not.

[TheLastShamurai]

for PvP, this is just not the game for squares because, in my opinion, of their lack of TD. now if gemstone had a system for warriors like dragonrealms' "inner fire," then yes, warriors would be the shit.

you can run around with all the spells on you want, but it still isn't going to boost their TD enough to matter in most cases. which sucks, but hey, thats gemstone for ya.

[Twitch]

I would like to see a Bard way past cap VS. a Warrior way past cap with a ton of his own spells with decent equipment (plus I count spells from scrolls and wands "self cast" also).
... I think the warrior will be at LEAST comparable.

pfft
1005 warrior - dead
1016 warrior - helpless, dead
1030 warrior - head flies off, dead
409 warrior - stunned, dead
415 warrior - stunned, dead

Now we can get into the multitude of sonic weaponry and different training paths available to the bard.

Mstrike w/handaxe - warrior - dead
Polearm - warrior - dead
Dagger and Tonis - warrior - dead

Im just gonna stop right there, there's NO comparison.

[nub]

Well it's more of, who can type faster, and who doesn't get unlucky with a fumble, any character can kill another character, whoever gets the first hit in, wins.

[m444w]

hah, bard would destroy the warrior. Take a look at some of those sonic disruption clips. And they can have a higher AS, and a decent enough amount of MoC, and they can use that whatever spell to break stuns.


And they purify, and they can drain wands to have nearly unlimited mana, their bard haste, and they can use their sonic weapon to assist (I know they aren't amazing... but, if you're talking post cap...) and they can get dual flares and don't have to worry about getting disarmed or whatever, and their armor has natural elemental resistance and postcap is going to be 7x

And they can sing their own treasure, only thing the warrior has on them is the assessing.

[nub]

hah, bard would destroy the warrior. Tand their armor has natural elemental resistance and postcap is going to be 7x

And they can sing their own treasure, only thing the warrior has on them is the assessing.

How will this help a bard destroy a warrior?

[Stanley Burrell]

words

You are about as close to being Warclaidhm as one can be. I don't want to collectively analyze your six posts so far to draw that conclusion, but you are, without a doubt, slightly ridiculous.

[m444w]

I guess I missed when this conversation turned into CvC... I meant in general combat

[nub]

I guess I missed when this conversation turned into CvC... I meant in general combat

Ah, then in that case, I would agree with you.

I remember in AOL days, I hated the warriors because I thought they were taking the easy way out with having a high AS, while me as a rogue or ranger had less.

I've never played a warrior because of that bad taste it left in my mouth.

[Danical]

I just don't think people here have played warriors throughly especially post berserk changes.

I would say currently warriors are tied with sorcerers in terms of sheer deadliness and survivability. Let me tell you why.

If a warriors is spelled to the gills (which requires a pocket titled wizzie or sorc... which is easy enough to get imho). Then they become pretty much ward proof. On top of that CMAN attacks rarely hit me.

I can clean out a room with my 7 attacks in 5 seconds and biggest AS in the game short of a maxed bard or paladin, which Im slightly inferior to in terms of sheer AS. But I'm pretty much unstoppable, ignoring stuns and other effects. The only downside is the lack of treasure.

You fucking child (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HURJNd0J4U).


I would like to see a Bard way past cap VS. a Warrior way past cap with a ton of his own spells with decent equipment (plus I count spells from scrolls and wands "self cast" also).
... I think the warrior will be at LEAST comparable.

Not even close and all the equipment I have is a sonic shield and sonic armor.

Use the following except cast it against 30 grimswarm.



[armageddon]>prep 1030
You change your tune slightly, adding the element for Song of Sonic Disruption to your song...
Your spellsong is ready.
>
[armageddon]>cast
You weave another verse into your harmony.
CS: +522 - TD: +358 + CvA: +8 + d100: +81 == +253
Warding failed!
A Grimswarm orc sniper reels under the force of the sonic vibrations!
Sound waves disrupt for 127 damage!
... 115 points of damage!
Heart explodes rupturing the orc sniper's chest.
[You have earned 50 prestige points.]
The orc sniper falls to the ground and dies.

The dull golden nimbus surrounding a Grimswarm orc guard suddenly begins to glow brightly.
CS: +522 - TD: +330 + CvA: +11 + d100: +64 == +267
Warding failed!
A Grimswarm orc guard reels under the force of the sonic vibrations!
Sound waves disrupt for 136 damage!
... 120 points of damage!
The orc guard's midsection swells painfully then bursts, sending the orc guard everywhere.
[You have earned 40 prestige points.]
The orc guard falls to the ground and dies.
The opalescent aura fades from around a Grimswarm orc guard.
The guiding force leaves a Grimswarm orc guard.
The dull golden nimbus fades from around a Grimswarm orc guard.
The brilliant aura fades away from a Grimswarm orc guard.
A subtle light fades from a Grimswarm orc guard's eyes.
A Grimswarm orc guard seems hesitant.
A white glow rushes away from a Grimswarm orc guard.
The wall of force disappears from around a Grimswarm orc guard.

CS: +522 - TD: +362 + CvA: +8 + d100: +8 == +176
Warding failed!
A Grimswarm orc guard reels under the force of the sonic vibrations!
Sound waves disrupt for 81 damage!
... 70 points of damage!
Spine ripped from the orc guard's body and thrown to the ground.
[You have earned 55 prestige points.]
The orc guard falls to the ground and dies.

Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.

There's a reason Drizzsdt isn't happy with the state of warriors.

[Stretch]

I just don't think people here have played warriors throughly especially post berserk changes.

I would say currently warriors are tied with sorcerers in terms of sheer deadliness and survivability. Let me tell you why.

If a warriors is spelled to the gills (which requires a pocket titled wizzie or sorc... which is easy enough to get imho). Then they become pretty much ward proof. On top of that CMAN attacks rarely hit me.

I can clean out a room with my 7 attacks in 5 seconds and biggest AS in the game short of a maxed bard or paladin, which Im slightly inferior to in terms of sheer AS. But I'm pretty much unstoppable, ignoring stuns and other effects. The only downside is the lack of treasure.

I'm going to assume the OP is just another Lysander spawn and is just trying to waste people's time with yet another nonsensical thread.

[Stunseed]

Ding ding ding.

[Pelor]

Sigh... I guess since there is such a HUGE overwhelming agreement that warriors suck I guess they do... I really think Gemstone's "balance" really runs on what GMs like which professions and whatnot and from the tastes of GMs and supposedly players alike over the years magic using classes are heavily favored. God this game sucks.

[Soulpieced]

Speaking from experience... post cap bard is without a doubt the most powerful. CS on par with pures, able to wear chain, highest DS (sonic shield paired with air lore = buckler dodge and tower shield block = greater than 10x shield, 2x dodge, 2x shield use, +50 from 430 and massive bonus to 1010 and 1019 with 120+ spellsongs). Possibility for very high AS (only paladin would be higher, but useless considering effectiveness of 1030).

Below are some numbers that will make any warrior cry. Note, all self-cast, and I have a self-mana Thurfel's, so that is included.

You currently have the following active spells:
Thurfel's Ward
Sign of Deflection
Sign of Striking
Elemental Defense II
Sign of Smiting
Sign of Swords
Sign of Dissipation
Sign of Shields
Elemental Targeting
Elemental Barrier
Sign of Warding
Sign of Defending
Song of Mirrors
Song of Valor
Song of Luck
Fortitude Song
Elemental Defense III
Elemental Defense I

You are now in an offensive stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +610 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +34 = -575
A clean miss.
>fall
You fall over. Clumsy oaf!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +560 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +49 = -510
A clean miss.
>
>incant 1035
You change your tune slightly, adding the element for Song of Tonis to your song...
Your spellsong is ready.
You weave another verse into your harmony.
As you sing, an invigorating squall of wind swirls around you and you hear a barely audible burst of laughter. You feel yourself moving a bit more smoothly and quickly than before!
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
>stand
You stand back up.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You barely dodge the attack!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
With no room to spare, you block the attack with your tower shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
With no room to spare, you block the attack with your tower shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You dodge just in the nick of time!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You barely manage to block the attack with your shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +632 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +43 = -588
A clean miss.
You are now in a defensive stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +948 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +91 = -856
A clean miss.
You are now in a guarded stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +884 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +99 = -784
A clean miss.

[Pelor]

Speaking from experience... post cap bard is without a doubt the most powerful. CS on par with pures, able to wear chain, highest DS (sonic shield paired with air lore = buckler dodge and tower shield block = greater than 10x shield, 2x dodge, 2x shield use, +50 from 430 and massive bonus to 1010 and 1019 with 120+ spellsongs). Possibility for very high AS (only paladin would be higher, but useless considering effectiveness of 1030).

Below are some numbers that will make any warrior cry. Note, all self-cast, and I have a self-mana Thurfel's, so that is included.

You currently have the following active spells:
Thurfel's Ward
Sign of Deflection
Sign of Striking
Elemental Defense II
Sign of Smiting
Sign of Swords
Sign of Dissipation
Sign of Shields
Elemental Targeting
Elemental Barrier
Sign of Warding
Sign of Defending
Song of Mirrors
Song of Valor
Song of Luck
Fortitude Song
Elemental Defense III
Elemental Defense I

You are now in an offensive stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +610 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +34 = -575
A clean miss.
>fall
You fall over. Clumsy oaf!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +560 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +49 = -510
A clean miss.
>
>incant 1035
You change your tune slightly, adding the element for Song of Tonis to your song...
Your spellsong is ready.
You weave another verse into your harmony.
As you sing, an invigorating squall of wind swirls around you and you hear a barely audible burst of laughter. You feel yourself moving a bit more smoothly and quickly than before!
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
>stand
You stand back up.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You barely dodge the attack!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
With no room to spare, you block the attack with your tower shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
With no room to spare, you block the attack with your tower shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You dodge just in the nick of time!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
You barely manage to block the attack with your shield!
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +632 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +43 = -588
A clean miss.
You are now in a defensive stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +948 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +91 = -856
A clean miss.
You are now in a guarded stance.
>
Some peon swings a closed fist at you!
AS: -4 vs DS: +884 with AvD: +5 + d100 roll: +99 = -784
A clean miss.

You see I think you guys are way too much into the whole AS/DS thing. Like 90% of a warrior's power comes from his CMAN skills/list especially on "special" mobs like Grimswarm or other player characters.

I would like to see how you would fare against a similarily trained warrior using a bull rush/charge/shield bash/bearhug or some other nasty CMA
N.

[Gelston]

Its all first strike anyways, I think its all irrelevant what could/can be done if all it is is you hitting enter faster.

[Durgrimst]

Its all first strike anyways, I think its all irrelevant what could/can be done if all it is is you hitting enter faster.

It would be very hard for a warrior to hit any pure or semi casting from guarded. And bards with post cap exp such as Gnimble have CMans to fight off the warriors crazy CMans skills.
Also IMO any semi that is post cap would be better than any pure or square post cap. They can become good at both the magical side and physical side with a ton less EXP. I play a cleric so I do love my pures, and my favorite character I have played is my little warrior. But pure killing power and chance to survive goes to the semi's with proper training and TPs.

[Makkah]

I wanna hear more about this Coase/monk shit. :(

[Stanley Burrell]

You see I think you guys are way too much into the whole AS/DS thing. Like 90% of a warrior's power comes from his CMAN skills/list especially on "special" mobs like Grimswarm or other player characters.

I would like to see how you would fare against a similarily trained warrior using a bull rush/charge/shield bash/bearhug or some other nasty CMA
N.

All hail Candor?

[Gelston]

It would be very hard for a warrior to hit any pure or semi casting from guarded. And bards with post cap exp such as Gnimble have CMans to fight off the warriors crazy CMans skills.
Also IMO any semi that is post cap would be better than any pure or square post cap. They can become good at both the magical side and physical side with a ton less EXP. I play a cleric so I do love my pures, and my favorite character I have played is my little warrior. But pure killing power and chance to survive goes to the semi's with proper training and TPs.

Yeah, thats why Warriors have to use CMans on the casters that stay in guarded to put them in RT and/or put their stance in offense. Given equal XP(Not always necessary either, if they are both capped and depending on professions), and people who aren't trained like a retard, it doesnt matter what profession you are.

Its still all about who hits enter first.

Oh, and I like immolation on my fire lored wizard better. It kills nice.

[Rimalon]

I'd like to see what kind of punishment a Wizard could take at 1x shield, 1x brawl, 1x dodge, and 1x CM, along with all of their core magical skills maxed. 540 really is a kickass spell.

Vrannar probably has enough XP, if he'd cut down Harness Power.

Otherwise, see me in about 5 years.

[Stunseed]

540 is awesome. My mage is nearly 1x'd in it, as well as .5x shield and edged.

[Fallen]

I'd like to see what kind of punishment a Wizard could take at 1x shield, 1x brawl, 1x dodge, and 1x CM, along with all of their core magical skills maxed. 540 really is a kickass spell.

Vrannar probably has enough XP, if he'd cut down Harness Power.

Otherwise, see me in about 5 years. >>

CMANs by Grimswarm would still hit them hard, as well as in the temple. They may also have trouble with high level spiritual casters, but that problem could be solved with outside spells (219, etc)

[Methais]

I'm curious how this list is gonna turn out when the rift expansion opens up.

[Fallen]

No outside spells in the rift, so if there are high level spiritualist casters, Wizards may have difficulty. Same thing with Clerics and Elementalists. Fighters have a massive advantage there, especially rogues and warriors as they can wear 100's and 400's with impunity.

Which is, in a word, Gay.

[Danical]

Except the expansion isn't a plane therefore it may or may not be subjected to outside spell exceptions.

If you can't wear outside spells and there is high level undead, it's going to suck massive balls for those unable to boost their fear defense.

[Methais]

If you can't wear outside spells and there is high level undead, it's going to suck massive balls for those unable to boost their fear defense.

BUT IT'LL PROMOTE GROUP HUNTING SO THAT WHEN YOUR WHOLE PARTY DROPS TO THEIR KNEES, YOU'LL HAVE A BETTER CHANCE ONE OF THEM WILL GET SMACKED INSTEAD OF YOU!!!!!1

[Renian]

Warriors should just get 4 TD per level instead of 3.

They're meant to be the best defenders in the game, so yeah. Problem is, if this affected NPC warriors, it'd be kinda sucky...